UPDATE:
Based on feedback from visitors, here is our response and with the suggested course of action:
- Our main reservation with ads and donations is that we want some kind of guaranteed revenue to cover the operational costs. This means that we CAN’T afford to worry on 20th of every month for funds to pay salaries and bills.
Ads:
- Since many users believe that ads is the workable option, we request our visitors to contribute their marketing skills and bring us clients willing to put ads on PkPolitics. The site is currently run by three engineers who have very poor marketing skills.
- We need firm commitment of minimum 6 upcoming months from the advertisers before we will use this option.
- Any surplus revenue from ads can be shared between us and anyone who brings the advertiser.
Donations:
We believe donations is normally “one time” thing and people don’t donate on regular basis. However if most users believe that donations would work, then we want to choose this track only if we have enough revenue collected from donations to cover operational costs for the next 6 months. We cannot invest in infrastructure or choose this path based on verbal commitment of donations every month.
Target:
- Our anticipated initial investment in infrastructure is $4,000 and we expect our running expenses to be $2,000 per month. This would cover salaries, office space, bandwidth and other utility bills.
- Ideally we would want to cover the initial infrastructure cost with donations and running operations cost with ad revenue. We can accept the donations in monetary and/or equipment format.
- We will make the top 3 donators as the auditors of our financial activity to assure everyone that we stay as a non-profit making entity. In case donations or ad revenue does not work, we will let our auditors decide the variable subscription rates based on the operations expenses and the number of subscribers.
What Next?
- Everyone who is willing to donate, please email us and let us know the amount via email. Anyone who can bring committed advertisers also let us know via email.
- We will collect all responses by 15th April 2008, after which we will decide if we can go through ads/donation path or we move towards subscription or media group model.
- We will update the total amount committed by people on the front page of the site on daily basis.
Thanks!
—————
Dear Visitors,
Straight to the point, we have some important decisions to make in regards to the future of PkPolitics.
Due to the extensive growth in number of daily visitors, video playbacks, requests for more videos and above all, the time required in doing all of this, it is not possible for us to sustain videos at same capacity for longer period. We have also put our video providers under stress with huge amount of bandwidth, as well as storage that has reached the “Terabyte” mark.
In order to continue and expand our operations, we need to build a small dedicated video team so that we can utilize our own quality time in doing political productions and other creative work. We have also reached a point where we need to invest in our own infrastructure for storing, hosting and streaming videos.
To achieve that, we currently have two options and we are also open for anymore options from anyone:
Option 1- We launch a “Premium Members” service, where we will provide some extra services, as well allow all the new videos only available to these Premium members for the first 24 hours. The monthly charges for this subscription would be anywhere between $5 – $20 per month, depending on the number of Premium users we have. (more members, lesser charges)
Option 2- We have an offer from a large media group in Pakistan who are willing to invest in PkPolitics. The technical operations will remain with us, however they will have influence on the content of the site.
Please let us know your views on this and leave a comment if you intend to become a Premium Member, so that we can make decision according to the number of responses.
Please note that we don’t intend to make any profit out of PkPolitics and we have to introduce this option to purely cover the operational costs.
Thanks,
Admin Pakistan Politics
Well, I would pay for it if the videos are going to be more regular and you guys can recoup some expenses which are considerable given the effort you put in for all us mufta khores…
I think this is better value because these are political programs only and no wastage like what you get if you buy desi pack through cable or something.. any who.. it is the discussion that makes half of it go.. so dunno what that means…
Re: the media group offer, as long as it is not MQM influenced, because then we’ll be seeing Kamran Khan 2 times a day.. which will make this site tank like musharraf’s popularity on Nov 4th.
might be worthwhile to put these options in a poll?
This is such an excellent website I’d hate to see this closed down ..I’ll be more than happy to become a Premium member at a reasonable cost…I realise how much hard work and time must go into keeping us up to date with the current affairs and downloading programmes. My sincere thanks for all the pleasure and enjoyment it has provided.
i am ok with a media group taking over as long as everyone has complete freedom of speech like we enjoy right now.
I think talking frankly people would better consider the option where some big multimedia group can bear the cost. But I think they could be allowed to recoup the cost with advertisement. WE should not let them control the content. In that sense the site has a huge number of clicks, and you could directly allow advertisements which would generate revenue.
1) Start taking old videos down after a certain time , may be after 3 weeks or a month.
2) Start making money by putting advertisements from Direct companies like Toyota Pakistan, Nestle Pakistan, Pepsi Pakistan and the list goes on.
3) I am not sure how many people will be willing to subscribe to this site by paying $5 / month. I am up for that though. May be do a poll for this.
4) Sell it to PMLN media group. Ahsan Iqbal is a UPEN graduate and I am sure he will get the investment. Dont think this as a joke. There is nothing wrong in making a Pro Site as we all understand that every company takes care of its investor’s interest. There is no such thing as INDEPENDENT MEDIA any more in this world. Its hard to find the True PBS any more. All TV channels, Radio Stations and other digital and print media is owned by some company and takes care of its interests weahther its Pakistani or Indian or American media.
And last but not least, I thank you for your sincere collaboration with us as you used your precious time and brought these videos/discussions/news to us. Though I was blocked many times on this site but its OK as you have the right and I understand.
I salute you for ALL this.
Dear @admin:
You have been providing an excellent service to the community and I applaud your efforts. One of the reasons for your tremendous growth and popularity is your neutrality ( even with a slight NS tilt at times). As your traffic and numbers have shown we have accepted that and pkpolitics has continued its growth.
Therefore I would sincerely request that you make every effort to continue to maintain your independence and not be financially obligated to any media or business group. Because I can guarantee you that eventually they will start dictating their own viewpoint and interests on the site.
I know this is a tough decision and I wish you well. On my part I am willing to subscribe to a Premium service and will pay up tp $20-25 per month.
Thank You
i have got some strong reservations on Option 2 noted below;
1. After acquisition by media it may restrcit the neutrla postion of the site and may commercialise it.
2. The prospective Buyer may also restrict the sources of the Videos / articles and blogs.
Suggestion for the Admin
Could not you reach to a trade deal with the media Group keeping the 51% plus the operations remains with you.
Do you know the story of Google and Craigelist they were developed in the same manner and Gone big beyond horizon. so you better think thousand times before accepting any such offer at this stage.
This is your place you own it. it is going to be big every day so i would suggest to hold take some other measures rather than selling off.
I would suggest people to voluntarily click on google adverts on the sides. This will help the admin earn revenue and in turn ensure the provision of political content from our favourite TV channels.
Well having a premium members will kills its popularity. May be it might make sense if you also post a ballpark figure per month you want o achieve for operation cost. I am sure regular visitors can pledge that amount.
I don’t know if People in Pakistan (majority visitors?) would be up for paying Rs. 300 to Rs1200 per month.
1) Best would be to model it after “The Real News”
http://therealnews.com/web/index.php
http://www.youtube.com/user/TheRealNews
2) If you take money form any media group then the discussion and content here will be subject to laws like PEMRA. It would not be good for the kind of community we have here.
3) A subscription may look good on paper when you the math but infact you will loose your viewer ship. Situations in PK change tremendously in 24 hours. People would rather prefer to pay for services like JumpTV.
4) Ask for Donations. Do not underestimate the potential of donations entire Wikipedia works on them. Many people like myself, journalists, expatriates and members of the civil society
very much appreciate your efforts. Use this service: http://www.chipin.com/
5) Big multinationals, telcos and banks might be be interested in sponsoring you if you can resonate with their corporate citizenship like Pepsi: “Dil managay more democracy”
Asslamo-Alakium Admin, I have two suggestions:
1. Start taking down old videos (1-2 weeks max).
2. Get advertisement from sponsor (abroad and Pakistan).
I would stress second point, must get sponsorship.
you wish to set up a subscription fee for content which you are not generating yourself …and in any country other then pakistan would end up in a lawsuit…
if the suscription fee you are setting up is for the time and work that goes into uploading and streaming these videos, you should look into investing in a TiVo and using one of the gazillion free streaming websites on the net instead of one that makes you pay for it…still the website bandwidth costs and the time you spend on it should be covered by ads on the website and make a little profit as well
I am not here to rant… my sincere advice would be to look at the sponsorship offer from the tv network if you are looking to make some money out of this to sell the name of your website…
If you choose to setup a subscription fee something close to what you mention here I dont see myself signing up because firstly there are free vid resources available on the net and secondly i can just call dish network and get pakistani channels for the same amount of money which I can then upload and make advertising money off to pay my dish network bill…lol
the future of business if free, a fee would be a step backwards
I guess if option 2 is adopted then eventually that media group being a commercial enterprise will eventually force us for subscription i.e. pehlay 100 jotay khao aur phir 100 piyaz bhee (no offense to adm!n
) so why not go for option 1 in the first place. Anyway I am ready to accept option 1 for a reasonable price because I want to keep the independence of this website intact.
what is the monthly cost you’re currently incurring of keeping this site operational ? share the actual figure,maybe then we can think of some thing
Admin
I am against the option 2 as it will directly effect independence of this site. I dont know about who you are and what you do for living but as long you own and run the site, there is a comfort level in visitors like me that this is not a commercial site and we all are part of it and we share the similar views and concerns for Pakistan.
I am willing to contribute to a monthly premium fee. This can be an adjustable amount depending upon the expenditure estimate each month. With this option, we should also request all visitors to click on advertisements so that a part of expenses can be covered through advertisements.
If you need human resources, then a team of volunteers can be setup to share responsibility of recording and uploading videos.
Thanks
Option 2: I am sure most media outlets will remain largely neutral.
Very few people would pay for it.
They can watch most of the channels online for free anyways.
And, a lot of the programs are also uploaded on Youtube/Google Video etc
Option 1 would not work and the no. of users would go down substantially
Just make sure the media outlet doesn’t restrict the content to that of their own channels or programmes. Get this in the contract.
I guess option 1 is good.
Option 2 may imply selective censorship, and hence induce bias.
Regards,
Adil Raja
I would be willing to pay a monthly fee in the order of about $10 for this site. In that I prefer option 1. Option 2 may induce content control and censorship.
I would not pay for the service. We should try to get ads instead.
There is really no point in charging for these videos as you really have not produced any of them. Sooner or later the media groups will figure out that this is copyrighted stuff that they can easily prevent you from showing as Viacom did to Youtube. Charging money to store content that others have produced? whats the point.
Therefore if I were you, I would sign a deal with some media group(s) to show their original content only on your site and offer your internet marketing and technical expertise. Pakistan Media groups are severely lacking in this regard and need someone like you to help them out.
Lots of Luck. Love your site and hope it becomes more original and unique.
Dallas, Texas
Assalam o allaikum Admin,
First of all I would like to thank and appreciate your efforts and the lengths you had to go to get us the updated latest news and analysis “without adverts”. I am glued to this site ever since its inception.
I understand that the site requires maintenance and time and this requires finances. I have seen in some other websites where they keep a target for a monthly fund raising and people pledge and come up with the requirement. In this manner, those who can offer more will pitch more towards the requirement and those whose hands are tied, will pitch in less but everybody gets to enjoy the content of the site. I have seen this work. I suggest that if you are planning to go for the premium memberships, first give this method a try, maybe you are able to raise the money without having to bind people for purchasing membership.
If in the case, you still have to choose between the given option, you can count me in for the premium membership option.
Thanks
Another thing:
Perhaps with the backing and funds of a media group, you will be able to add tons of content and get it updated much faster.
on second thought, i do not want this site to be taken over by any media group. i think you are doing a wonderful job and we all feel like it is our own site. however when a corporate entity takes over, they have their own interests, and i dont think that is good for us. please try to get some revenue from advertisements from corporate multinational companies in pakistan, as i think this site is becoming more and more popular and they wouldnt mind investing in it. and if that doesnt work you can remove the videos after 3-4 weeks. if even that doesnt work, then i guess having a monthly subscription fee isnt a bad idea.
@Admin pkpolitics. I admire your website and your team’s never tiring efforts. Like some members have already said, there is much danger in sponsorship which seeks to influence your service sir.
Please create a donation tab where credit cards, dbit cards are accepted and also where checks and money order can be sent.
No power like the private citizenry, there is.
@ Admin,
In my opinion, you should go for both options simultaneously. I hereby mean that you can charge less amount form the viewers and ask different media groups to support this website. This is an important initiative and should flourish more. Furthermore, no one stops you to earn any profits from this website as these profits can used for future investment of this website.
Admin,
I’ve got few mates wroking in media and marketing here in London. And I can hook you up with them if you wish, I’m sure they can help you out free of charge & will give you some ideas and contacts to stream line your revenues from your most lucrative brand name i.e. Pkpolitics, plus start working on Magazine as well, could be an option.
well, i would take option 1 but having said that it will definitely effect the popularity of this site. i am sure most of the users would not be able to pay. my suggestion is that if you put a figure of amount per month you have to achieve and ask for donations, it could be helpful. otherwise option 1 is the only way. i am willing to spend $10/month. Also share the monthly charges you are paying right now for this site so users have some idea.
one thing i want to tell you and i am sure i am speaking behalf of everyone here that we will do everything and anything to keep this site running.
I have no problem with the monthly fees but as somebody said the traffic of the site would go down and site will be limited to few people.
The best thing is to have adds on the site and use it for the expenses or ask donations from the members.
There is no way this site should be close down because of the expense issues!!
I don’t even want to discuss option 2.
Personally I am willing to contribute as a premium member. I think there are many who would not and number of visitor to this site would drop.
Maybe you should ‘force’ us to watch an advertisement before every video or every time we visit this website. Once cannot fast forward them. These videos are found on many websites of UK newspapers, such as guardian and Telegraph.
monthly fee will be much better option than intervention from a media group which will influence liberty of this site
But 15-20$ will be too much to pay in one month….fee should be nominal so that maximum people can become members
I don’t mind to pay coz it will help you but. Chanel like geo and ary the have some copywrits so wat u go do about that
i think option 1 is wrong as u are not producing your own talk shows you are getting from pvt.channels,and 2nd thing if you are going to pay per view website ,your viewership will go down.
2nd thing viewer ship will go down after all these government formations and judges issue. so make sure you will keep these things in mind.
try to get some sponsors.
clear videos after 1 week
Would it be acceptable to the content providers (Geo, AAJ, ARY etc.), if you start charging for their content? I would prefer to pay rather than see this site closed down.
If you were to sell this site to a media group in Pakistan, say the Jang group for example, would they be willing to have content from their competitors on this site?
in my view, most of these videos are time related (and lose their value with the passage of time) hence can be taken off from the site after one month,
We should also try to contact the new Pakistani government and try to get some financial help from it. Your site is very similar to PTV in its objective, and the government should be happy to provide the required funding for this non-profit, public-education enterprise.
If the above two suggestions donot work, try option #1 first, and then option #2 as the last resort. I wish I had the money to support you guys in this noble cause. May God help you all, and shower His choicest blessings. Amen!
My suggestion:
DOs:
1) Donations
2) Selective Ads
DONTs:
1) Monthly charges
both options 1 and 2 r not very right. maybe u should put more ads i have been donating on other news sites so can i do here.
pkpolitics book store wont be bad idea aswell. u can sell political books like army inc, or/and other books written by politicians.
if more ads donations pkpoliticsbooks(political books) doesnt work then i would prefer option1.
My suggestion is that the only way this site is going to work is by donations, i have few refrences before i got sky digital i used to watch Live footy.com. the owner of that site set up a fixed amount of money to be donated every month and it worked.
Option1. You cant expect someone paying 35pound per month to sky tv to suscribe for a website.
In my opnion stop uploadng geo programes cause there are 100 of site which are airing geo news so no need of those programmes.
But OPNION2 IS ALSO not that bad remember one thing admin u cant keep every user happy here, they shud be thankfull to u by wht u are provindin them.
JUST TO A DEAL WID THAT COMPANY.
Asslama-o-Alaikum
Dear pkpolitics staff,
I beg you not to consider both of these options. Firstly, pkpolitics is mainly visited because of its easy, but if you will make it a premium site, it will not be visited by many users. Secondly, pkpolitics is a private forum, where we can speak our hearts, so please do not hand it over to any media group.
Why don’t you consider donations. I promise to make my share on time. could you please disclose the financial requirement to run pkpolitics.
Great Work Bro…..
Ready to get Premium Membership.
Better to close off than selling it to some group if no personal interest involved otherwise its your baby anyways.
why not uploading videos on youtube? wouldn’t that be a better way?
$20 dollars per month are too much!
I think $20 per year would be fine.
Trust me $20 a month will sink this website.
After going through the comments of all visitors to this site, I am of the considered opinion, that nearly all visitors desire your site to stay, as-it-is. Most of us feel, as if we own this site; & that’s good, because they want to be HEARD, & know that they can spill the ‘ venom ‘ from their hearts, MAYBE, like in London’s Hyde Park ( where I have never been; ) & still they can ‘ get-away with-it. ‘
Nearly all feel that the site should stay with you, ‘ aur jo bolne ki azadi oon ki mili hae, oou se, wo hath na dho batehain. ‘ The ‘ modalities ‘ of how to go about it, is all for you to decide, keeping your interest in view, & as per many viable suggestions forwarded by worthy visitors, as above.
Wish you GOOD LUCK, & in a NUTSHELL, nearly everybody wants the site, to stay, as-it -is.
The future of information is free.
So you need some strategic direction than tackling this problem in short term.
to be honest i would rather switch to other websites than paying monthly. Option 1 will be disaster as it had been done by chaltatv dot com last month. so they had to take the free route again.
if you want to position the website to nieche market. than it can be fine.
media group taking over can be better. but there will definately copyright issues in future,
first of all
HAPPY Pakistan day to all
Dear admin
It is better not to charge any money and opt media groups.
other wise pkpolitcs will loose many of its viewers.
good luck
There is no point of uploading every single video ( if this is costing too much money). Why dont just use only limited videos which has some good material to discuss on the forum?
I would focus mostly on the forum for public discussion ( with limited videos) where users can create their own topics to discuss and participate in the discussion. There should be more moderators involve in the site, who can moderate the discussions and people should have choice to edit and make changes in their posts.
I read someone’s message above, why not deleting old videos? and also I repeat what I posted before, why not uploading videos on youtube or dailymotion? Because if I would have to pay for this website, I will no longer visit that’s for sure…sorry but that’s the truth.
I found this site when the media in Pakistan was shutdown.
I truly admire the hard work and selfless dedication by the side Admin.
Also, I appreciate the independent nature of this site.
If the site is take-over by some media group I think it is quite obvious the very fluid and free environment of the site may be compromised.
I would recommend:
1. Focus on gaining sponsors/advertisement such as:
- Personal donations
- Corporate advertisements
- Classifieds section
2. I do not believe that user subscription will be successful. Even though the site has a high number of hits; the reason is that it has been a ‘free’ source of info. For many it is a convenience, ie. they may have missed their weekly episode of Capital Talk and they watch it on this site.
Once again I respect and admire the tremendous efforts by the Admin and all people who have put in so much time and dedication into this site.
If possible, I would also suggest that the Admin research methods by which the site may be maintained in a way so as less time and effort is required by Admin.
Also I beleive there are sites offering free storage of videos; perhaps Admin can utilize these sites rather than host all the videos here?
@admin.
thanks a lot for your efforts. I am strictly against option 2. and option 1 will also decrease the popularity. What I would suggest is to post the money you have to earn in a month, at the start of the month and also post the amount you have earned so far and ask the visitors to click on different adds. I myself click on the ads on your website, not because I want to but just to generate traffic. If you ask, others will do the same.
move the videos to youtube after 2 weeks and just post the youtube link at your website.
oh and another suggestion, Why not ONLY uploading talk shows such as Bolta Pakistan, Capital Talk, and Kashif Abbasi, maybe Talat and 4manshow (if its funny)….and if there is a good show worth watching, upload that! And deleting them within a week!!!
And IGNORING useless shows like Javed Malik, Asma sherazi, faeza dawood, maybe hum sab umeed,…and others! Or why not charging us to pay for useless shows, I know some people would pay for those shows.
Option 2, if pkpolitics remain independent.
Option 1, I would subscribe.
Other avenues (not necessarily mutually exclusive):
* allow one-off donation
* diversify input of efforts (including financial) e.g. time, old pc, bandwidth, people signing up with particular ISP
* generate revenues from Adds
* diversify video providers including YouTube, GoogleVideo
* seek time from students at Universities
* Consider cutting down content or videos
Suggest to create a poll to seek people’s opinion.
@Everyone,
Thanks for giving your inputs. Here are some of our answers:
- We want to create a complete video archive of political history of Pakistan that we can watch instantly from anywhere even after 50 years!
- The main idea of this site is NOT to make any profit. Therefore it does not matter if the site has 1,000 or 1 million daily visitors, since we don’t intend to make money from ads.
- The subscription model will not change anything for FREE users, except that they will have to wait for 24 hours before the video becomes available for them. They can pay the subscription to TV channels directly and feel free to share comments on pkpolitics and use it as their “Hyde Park”.
- The highest bandwidth cost is in the first 24 hours of the video. With subscription model, we will have lower number of visitors in first 24 hours, therefore it will keep our bandwidth bill down.
- We personally favor complete ad free site in interest of cleaner looks of the site. The current ad generate revenue is only enough to have nice dinner with family every week and we may remove it completely if it the operation cost is sustainable through other means.
- The FREE model did not work since the site was started 9 months ago and it will not work with the current rate of increase of visitors.
- The TV channels are happy to have their content here. All the hosts and even some producers come to the site daily to get feedback of their talk shows. In Western countries, TV channels have to spend lots of money on surveys to get ratings of their channels and programs.
- The TV hosts recommend this site to anyone who misses any episode on TV due to personal engagements or absence of electricity in Pakistan.
- The total viewership of any program on pkpolitics is less than 0.001% of what is viewed by millions of people on TV. Many visitors come to pkpolitics just to share their comments on a talk show after watching that on their own TV.
- People in Pakistan would NOT need to become Premium Members as they can watch everything for free on their TV. In case someone misses an episode, they can see it anyway on pkpolitics as we will make it free after 24 hours.
- We prefer the subscription model in order to share our pain with users. The main admin of the site has increased 8 kilos weight, developed back pain, facing sleep shortages and his personal life is a mess.
Please continue to share your comments and we will keep this thread running for 2 days.
Thanks,
Admin
Hey Admin,
We PAKISTANIs Want Everything BUT for FREE. I got this impression from all of the above comments.
You better make a poll on this issue with multiple choices like
1. Monthly Donation ($1-$5)
2. Monthly Donation ($6-10)
3. Media Giant involvement
4. Get Donations on an amount you put forward
5. Small subscription fee along with Donations
We won’t like pkPolitics in midst of any lawsuits/Copyright issues because of such monetary activity.
Offer a Download option for videos.
I believe that most visitors on this site would be expatriates so I’ll appeal all Pakistani’s to help this site up and running as usual by sharing the burden on Admins.
Good Luck.
I would go with option 1 and I liked the donation idea a lot. It will be possible for us to chip-in some money to keep the services running. For the first time a sensible project has become successful and is for the betterment of the society (or call it CIVIL Society) and would hate to see it CONTROLLED or worse, Shut Down.
I can understand what you guys must be going through. Even I tried once to record a TV program, tried a lot of things and in the end nothing happened except useless head-banging so I gave it up and continued watching what was available for me on pkpolitics !!
@admin
So people can still post the comment and wont be able to see the videos during first 24 hours?
If the above statement is true, then a subscription model will work ,but you still will loose the audience.
I still think $20 will be too steep, as most of the people outside Pakistan still has Satellite subscription.
You should also take in to account of us being super honest society of with nobody using “shared” accounts
Thanks Admin.
Your concerns (and needs) are genuine.
The PRIME feature of this site is the INDEPENDENCE. Your main job is (was) to put latest news (especially videos) without much partiality. We all need this!
For expenses:
1. try to free space by taking off the old videos
2. try to establish (or out source) the marketing, and getting adds…there is plenty space on the pages which can earn good revenue. There is great potential!
3. and if necessary, sell memberships…but could be possible to offer different rates to different types of members e.g. students, and non-students (students maybe required to register with a valid student email e.g. student@ox.ac.uk etc in order not to abuse the service!).
4. try avoiding collaborating with some media group. Or atleast first try option 2 (or 3) above before considering this.
cheers
Google for Non-Profits:
* Accept online donations without hassle and with no transaction fees until 2009 with Google Checkout.
* Apply for free online advertising through our Google Grants program to raise awareness and drive traffic to your website.
Google for Non-Profits: http://googleblog.blogspot.com/2008/03/google-for-non-profits.html
Some more answers:
- We don’t want to run on unreliable donations or volunteers. We need to run it professionally by paying regular salaries on time, supporting running costs and expenses and with proper investment in infrastructure.
- If the subscription model does not work due to the reason that a very little paid subscribers join, and we have large reduction in regular visitors, pkpolitics will still become sustainable with lower running cost due to lower traffic.
- The video hosting on YouTube and Google etc are not an option since we need to have a proper framework in place from the beginning that is scalable and still workable after 10 or 20 years.
- The paid subscribers can be provided with Download or Podcast options so that they can sync videos on their iPods or watch offline on their computers.
Admin
good luck guys hope it works
I agree with option-1. Option-2 means losing all the independence of this site and turning it to another biased channel like ptv or now geo…
Very good suggestions BUT we should be realistic as well. First of all how much revenue is needed is “the” question. If for example $4000/PM is required then all this site need is 400 members @ $10 memberships, which is not difficult.
But if it is more than that, then we need to look at different solutions. I have no doubts that PKPolicts might get some Premium Members in the beginning but they will start disappearing for different reasons.
Free model did not and cannot work for this kind of service, so one should be looking for long term model. Since the main idea of this site is NOT to make any profit, so I have few suggestions:
• Make Premium Members of the website as the share holders and in charge for the sustainable revenue generation. My suggestion would be to run this website a nonprofit company for which members/shareholders will be responsible for the revenue generation. For polices and material these members can share their opinion. In case of more viewers and revenue increase membership.
• If this is not workable, whether one likes it or not, for revenue generation Ads is the option. Ads need to be included with defined format. In the beginning there will be few Ads, therefore to get a desired level marketing strategy need to be formulated. When desired revenue point is reached no more Ads policy can be introduced.
@admin pk politics
We, all Pakistanis, whether in Pakistan or abroad, have developed a great liking ( if not, LOVE, as yet) for your website, since the time that you have introduced your site.
Plz allow me to repeat , that it is so, because of the feeling that we are being heard & that we can share our views with our Pakistani brothers & sisters, where ever they be in this, wide-wide world.
We also feel that our views will not be blocked from print, as it happens within Pakistan,& also that we will not be harassed by govt’s intelligence agencies, political & ethnic goons & thugs.
We also understand that by expressing our views on your web-site, Pakistanis will not fear of being handed-over to the yankees, for a ‘ treatment ‘ at their hands at Guantanamo Bay,etc; like a great number our countrymen, from all walks of life, were handed-over to the yankees, including the serving envoy of another country, i.e; Afghanistan.
That expression one’s views with all one’s sincerity & in the interest of the nation, is a great feeling of independence; which we, all Pakistanis feel, that
Pk politics,will honour our trust & confidence,that we have reposed in your website, & that you will NOT LET US DOWN, by exposing the daily visitors to this site, to the ‘ hounds ‘ of the govt, & that you will continue to keep the antecedents of your visitors, ‘ strictly confidential. ‘
Thanks admin for starting this discussion as it must be on many regular visitors’ mind as it was on mine. Having read most if not all the posts above, the impression that I have is that you are inclined towards subscription model.
I have a suggestion but first need to admit that we are all discussing here regarding a business decision without enough data to base the decision on. ( I tried to find on this site the location & team information running this site but could not find any, although it is not a must to know information just to give opinion on this topic but is an example of my point of lack of information while I do appreciate that it is your teams’ right to disclose or otherwise any information that you wish)
I believe that you don’t go for either options you mentioned. Option 1 is OK for short term but not what you are looking for: sustainable and predictable source of income. Option 2 will sure kill the main ideology behind the effort sooner or later.
I think you need to seriously think about “floating your stock”. Offer the stock of the company to visitors. Run like a publicly traded company where no media group can control the contents but those who read, care and share the principles in general. This way you will get the initial capital for the infrastructure and depending upon the success some degree of cash flow & running capital. Now for ongoing costs you have one main and then some secondary options. Main option there is that since the stock is not traded on a stock exchange & hence can’t be traded using stock brokers so your site, or a separate site for this matter off course, will trade the stock and charge the trading fee which will generate income to be used for ongoing expenses.
Now since, hopefully, considerable amounts will be involved so the initial frame work need to be thoroughly designed with the help of relevant and renowned professionals, including lawyers, management consultants, bankers (looking also as how to secure bank warranties for the share holders), the insurance companies etc.
I should leave for now at this point for other caring people who have given valued feedback so far to consider this seriously and provide their feedback.
Thanks,
@admin
why not decrease archives’ volume .
We are interested in latest videos.
In regards to the archives, we intend to keep archive of every video for reference and research purpose for people of Pakistan. Secondly, the storage cost is much less than the bandwidth cost. This means that inactive videos will not cost as much as active videos.
Here are the Amazon S3 rates that we intend to use:
Storage
$0.15 per GB-Month of storage used
Data Transfer
$0.10 per GB – all data transfer in
$0.18 per GB – first 10 TB / month data transfer out
$0.16 per GB – next 40 TB / month data transfer out
$0.13 per GB – data transfer out / month over 50 TB
We have approximately 1TB (1000GB) videos that will cost us $150 a month for storage. The current bandwidth used is around 50GB per day (1.5TB per month) that will cost us $270 per month approximately.
on a personal note, I would have sold the site to make a return for all the efforts put in before the political climate calms and hits to this site reduce. This site is at the peak of its value right now, sell it before its too late!!
@SnrCtz,
We understand our responsibility in this regards and we assure you that nothing like that will happen from our side.
Admin
@Hammad
What a coincidence, I was writing the same suggestion of issuance of shares of PKPolitics to the visitors in the beginning when you gave the same suggestion. Here goes the start with two share holders already there.
Also, I agree with sherisha and others who suggested to limit the available archived videos to max 6 months and just keep a directory and/or some preview of the archives to be available as pay-per-view.
@admn pk politcs
Thank you for your assurance, as stated above. It will go a long way in reposing more confidence in your website by all your visitors, new & old.
Those people you did not earlier contribute with their comments ; will do so now,
without any fear what so ever. Thanks, once,again, for your assurance.
Good Luck.
No to Option 2. I am willing to pay the premium.
i also support option 1, totally NO to option 2
If there are expenses for uploading video material then http://www.vidpk.com is best option to watch free videos related to not only politics but each and every thing regarding pakistani tv channels.
you can see all important events, new, talk show, songs….each and everything which pakistan channels shows daily.
Trouble is, right now Pakistan is going through a very sensitive stage. The talk shows and political programs are a guidance for people and after the events of 2007 and current climate even the media is happy with this site since it offers people to go through what had been discussed and analyze the situation themselves. As mentioned by the Admin, the anchors and media personnel also visit to gather response to their programs.
BUT … if the admins start charging for viewing the programs and once the political situation calms down and stabilize, the media might not be that cooperative as it is right now. Copyright issues, as someone mentioned earlier, would creep in and the site would find itself in deep trouble for paying relevant copyright charges to continue program viewing and considering the archive database Admin is planning for, it’s hell lot of money to pay with not so stable number of subscribers. In the end the site would have to diversify itself to programs other than politics just to survive and attract more traffic.
Floating of stocks is a decent idea, though a gamble which would need strong analysis to succeed and also strong marketing. An archive base is useless if no one is there to view it. Since I hate Finance and always get low marks in it, I can’t say if it is the right decision but other experts should shed more light on it for better understanding of how it could be done and site could get benefits.
In the Name of God, The Most Gracious, The Most Merciful
Dear Admin,
This is Hassan, Coordinator for Pakistan Tehreek-e-Insaaf, California and one of the oldest/regular visitor of your website.
Reading ALL the comments, the one that I really liked are from abuhaleema, saint, Hammad and SKamal .
Summarizing on WHAT can be done to prevent this issue:
1) Get the things rolling. At least let us know the monthly needed amount, and enable a paypal donation button so that people who want to donate can give immediately. All the policies etc, can be worked upon in the meantime.
1) Monthly subscription sounds fascinating only for a short term. It’s better to give all options to people, either to buy one time share, or any paypal donation or to go for monthly subscription. (Personally, I want to have some share, part, contribution in Pkpolitics as it will certainly be an honor for me).
2) A little “Money Needed vs Money Collected” indicator should be on the front page that will update the visitors about current financial situation of the website.
3) 24 Hour Idea is pretty decent, but rather than PUNISHING people for not becoming a subscribed member, we can provide Youtube/Veoh/Viddler links to non-subscribed members for the first 24 hours. I would urge (not for myself but because I dont want to see people leaving this site) that dont punish people for 24 hrs, just because they cannot pay.
4) We can talk with advertisement-groups and develop some policy of showing advertisement to viewers who are not premium-member. This means the non-members in first 24-hours will have to see a couple of minute of advertisements before they can see the Youtube etc link for the program. However, this will not mean that the advertisement-group will enforce their policies.
5) Videos *SHOULD NOT* be taken down as I completely agree to the long term database for research. However, access to 6 month old videos on pay-per-view or to premium members of the website will kill the research factor, as since only serious students of politics want to get access to 6 month old stuff and it will be unfair to charge them for a noble cause. Walking them through a serious of ads (as in CNET or RapidShare) might help us in recovering the cost.
6) Just a good news, I will make sure that from now on a *FREE* advertisement of PKPOLITICS.COM will appear in the monthly newsletter of Pakistan Tehreek-e-Insaaf, California.
Best of Luck and Thank You !
Hassan Khan
Monthly fee of even $5 is not a good idea. Start with a membership fee first and see public response first. Also for most ppl living in the US, UK and other west, its affordable. but to be honest, lots of ppl might not trust giving out their credit card number. I think its better to delete old programs and also seek sponsors. Also its visitors duty to click on the ads. I would go for different experiences and see what benefits the most. Thanks
Your financial constraints are understandable. However, I would like to point out the following.
1. Premium service will likely to negatively impact your viewership, a free service is what many would want; it is also important to note that people tend to visit the website when there is some sort of political turmoil or a hot issue is witnessed on macro level; therefore, with current political scene seem settling down in few months time then automatically you will have fewer visitors – at that time premium membership may not work.
2. My suggestion is that you keep all videos for a maximum of two weeks only and then remove them from the website
3. You may put your archive on youtube and just provide a link on this website to view an archive
4. You may pass on the cost to advertisers, as your viewership is simply very compelling for advertisers
5. if still need be, tie up with the media Group and try and agree with them that contents will not be controlled
Thanks
I do *NOT* like both of above mention option. Hence I like my following option.
- Delete a video after a month or so. So that you can fit more video in less space.
- Try to get Advertisements and try to generate money from them.
- Ask for volunteers from users. Make some of them moderators/admins etc. You could have around 10 such moderators. Give some responsibilities to them so that you burden could be shared.
- Asking for donation is okay. Hence if someone feel like he can donate to pkpolitics (like people do to wikipedia). Hence if someday I am happy with pkpolitics, then I give a 100$ donation but I HAVE to pay every month.
*Note that you will lose many users (many of them who does not even comment here) if you go for any of the options you have mentioned in your original post. Hence please avoid them both.*
My experience tells me to advise you of not opting for monthly subscription even if it is 1$ per month. Selling it to media group will be a compromise on the orignal concept of launching this site. I can say with confidence that the number of premium user will be decreased eventually even if it is high initially.
This site is gaining its popularity and you should find some alternate ways like some monthly fixed donations from TV channels like Geo, AAJ, ARY etc. You can also talk to Newspapers like The NEWS and Express etc and add their links on front page.
Political parties can also make donations for their media adds. Although people can criticise this suggestion but my view is that as long as the add is well marked and clear there is no harm. After all govt, NGOs and Political parties spend a lot of money to create awareness and political sense in masses. this site has played a good role in recent past and a potential for more so parties can invest for thier own cause and democracy.
Donations links can also help for users. Try to solve through adds etc.
This is a wonderful sight and must continue.
I agree with everything you stated. Maybe you could start a poll for monthly subscription fees rate. It should not be less then $10 per month. As most of your viewrs are out of Pak and can easily afford such nominal charges. In Sydney one pack of cigs alone cost $11. So viewrs should be considerate to spend some monthly charges.
Somebody was saying for a Pakisani its 300 to 1200 rupees. I’m sure in Pak 99% ppl dont have any broadband and cant and dont view videos from here.
Hats off to you and your effort. I’ve been watching all of your efforts very closely for many months. I have full confidence and trust in this site’s team that whateva they’ll decide for the future of pkpolitics, will surely be right course to do Inshallah.
One lil suggestion that whteva you decide but you must allow viewers to donate as well, as many of them want to help.
thank you very much for everything. I wish you guys would’ve been in Australia and I could personally put some effort with you.
Wassalaam
i second yaqub2005 comments.
I think, you should consider approaching this matter is steps…
first, old content can be archived and its access can be made available through subscription. Thus, only the content of the last one manoth can be online. Anyone interested in older material can be a subscriber.
If this arrangement does not help, donation scheme should be introduced. Hopefully, there wll be enough people wanting to donate on regular basis to solve the problem.
If this too does not work, then a general subscription should be introduced.
muqqafa
@ admin
If it is between Option 1 and 2, then certainly option 1. No compromise on the independence of the sight.
As far as subscription option is cocerned, I don’t think it would work because there are already commercial sites e.g. paktv.net etc that offer that facility for about rthat cost. one of the following solution may work. the 3rd one has not been discussed on this form.
1- ads
2- donations
3- distribute the workload so that diferent progs be assigned to different persons, each maintaining its own webpage and links given on the cental page.
First of all thanks for your service and support. I think 2nd option is also good if the media company in Pakistan is good one (No Geo).
270 per month…lets assume it to be 300 per month, accounting for growth. That means 3600 dollars…or about 1800 pounds per year.
This means that if you ask for donation and if only 1% of your visitors (18,000) donate one pound a year, you will have nothing to worry about. On top you can create a subscription – or per use fee – for accessing archives.
I suggest giving a trial to donations for a month or two would be a great idea. I personally think that it would be the best option where people who really appreciate your work would have no problems donating and no one would feel forced to subscribe. I have no problems paying some money to be a part of such great enterprise but that would decrease the readership/viewship of this site.
My humble opnion.
@admin
I think with this pkpolitics you have already made huge success and I see the potential of turning it into a socio-political awareness platform as you mention achieving and research features. It can be much like the famous “Pak Tea House” of our decade.
Getting 300$ from advertisement is absolutely not a problem. In the blogosphere people are charging 300$ for a single square ad, depending on their generated traffic.
try googling for “how to monetize your blog”.
@dmin
I think Muqaffa’s idea is good and is worth a thought. I would advice you to have free access to (most) articles and videos on this site. Muqaffa’s idea about donations combined with some big players advertisement (as @Riddle has proposed: March 22nd, 2008 11:29 pm) could be the best option. By doing that you will keep on having more and more users and hence increase popularity for your website. By introducing payment will somehow make this site more inaccessible.
We must remember that people in Pakistan are not fully awakened about how to fight for true democracy. Pkpolitics is already doing a fine job in this regard and need to keep on doing that without any limitation for the users. That will benefit the democratization process (on Internet) which must be the ultimate goal.
/Saqib
I agree to Riddle 792 ‘s first three points -
@admin
You have been doing a wonderful job on this website, and I commend your efforts.
I have been regularly visiting pkpolitics since November, though I don’t comment much.
I like many of the options given above, such as getting big companies to sponsor pkpolitics or to give them ad space. (I usually use Firefox’s adblock extension, but I have it turned off for this and a couple of other sites, and users could be asked to allow ads on pkpolitics so that there is revenue made from the ads).
My suggestion would be that for the videos, rather than using a streaming website and the loads of bandwidth that goes with it, you could implement a torrent system. That way the bandwidth load is shared by the visitors. It depends on the user’s upload and download speed, and it won’t be as fast as streaming, but it will help alot in controlling the current bandwidth issues.
Contact me if that seems like something you might be interested in, I am willing to help if I can. I wouldn’t mind writing up a howto (even though there are plenty out there already) for users who don’t have experience with bittorrent.
I don’t think it is a good idea to let ANY company invest in pkpolitics, however, taking their money for ads is always good!
AOA all
i think start the donations part of the website, like someone said to run it on trial basis, let it run for a month while you do your homework of the exact costs with a breakdown so that you can map the first months donations to the costs. but do consider that people tend to be inconsistent donors.
do consider the effects of any decision on the SLEEPING visitors who just watch the videos and dont even register or post a comment, like myself being a very regular viewer of the videos but i just registered to post this comment here.
if you get some funding from any political party i am sure they’ll try to enforce their agenda and the neutrality of the site will be compromised which i think no one would want.
if you decline would any of the media group take up copyrights issue with u as u are not
producing the videos urself. i am sure they wud be looking at this option as well. the media groups have offices in london as well where u r based. so look at it from this point as well, as it would impact the operations in the long run.
everyone is saying that u shud find some direct sponsrships from companies like pepsi etc. the point is, they would not see any benefit in advertising on this website as most of the visitors are not in pakistan, whereas they are targetting customers in pakistan. i think it wont be that easy to convince some company to advertise on this website. the only companies willing to advertise on this website would be like travel agents or calling cards who are based abroad but have their businesses depending on expats.
i wud pay for the premium membership but,sorry to say, considering the mentality of the general public, alot of them would want to see the videos after 24 hourrs rather than paying for it.
i think there is always a win win situation and u can actually contact more than one media groups and i am sure u’ll have more flexible options and u can do sort of a collaboration with media groups for overseas pakistanis platform and comments, rather than being bought out or any direct investments. considering the importance of data statistics for big organizations, u can simply sell the monthly or weekly reports to the media groups. i currently work for an automotive reporting giant who produces reports for diff OEM’s like VW , Mercedez,audi BMW etc. for this u’ll need a well designed database and polls to sell the comments, statistics and opinions to the media groups. try to build some products out of the site that would generate revenues.
i think the best solution would be to build pkpolitics into a company specializing in providing reports/services to media giants. this must be discussed with the media group, as to what they would want in terms of their foreign viewership statistics.
in the end, i am based in north west london. being from IT background i would also offer any help u may need in order to streamline the operations of the website.
storage $ 150
bandwidth $ 270
other charges $ ?
to make it sustainable in long term you’ll eventually have to partner with some one who can share the load,plus users would be more then willing to help, enable donation option,
Most of people including me visit pkpolitics.com because its free. On the other hand you must be aware of any corporation ready to eat up this wonderful site.
My suggestion:
Make an agreement with a corporation but not for life. You should make this agreement for five years maximum and then ask them to renew this agreement.
Dear Admin:
I really feel that if you plan to offer the latest videos within 24 hours anyway – you will not gain interest of members.
If you are proposing a budget of around $300 per month, I think all you need is a few commited members that should immediately donate the amount needed to keep the site going for a 1 year period.
This will be our way of pitching in towards the great job you have done.
I am ready to make a certain commitment towards this plan and I’m sure many other members will also be willing.
Also, any advertisments, sponsorships etc. will be a bonus to the site?
Option # 01 is highly recommended. It is safe and does not allow some other organization to have control of your hard work and vision, besides outside investor may have hidden agendas of their own. I know several families and friends who only log on to PkPolitics to get an update on the Pakistan’s current situation. PkPolitics has earned this trustworthy status by their relentless hard work, and extraordinary professional presentation. I see no harm why we should not participate in providing financial assistance to such a great & most comprehensive news provider. Please let us know your modus operandi for contribution. Wish you all the best always.
Premium membership will destroy this website, as on internet people look for free stuff only. With in a month a new website will popup providing people free videos taken mainly from this website.
Go for second option
I would certainly support first option to retain the hallmark of this website that is “free and fair expression of opinions and information”. By giving control to some one else you will be giving up control on contents as well. Paying a reasonable amount ($5-10) as monthly subscription should not hurt majority of “true” lovers of this site that offers so much.
Dear brother ADMIN A.A
I would certainly support the first option as I said last year in the march you have to charge a minnimum AMOUNT until you get yourself stable options .BUT never give this site away to any body for even billions of dollar .
Make sure it is under 10.00 dollars for every body per month not for premium club only but for every person who try to access this site for the 10th or 15th time . You can can make a column on the top where it always should be posted that after a certain time of use, we are asking you to please help or donate a be a member. BUT AGAIN PLEASE DON’T GIVE TO THE INVESTORS, . JAZAKALLAH.
1. If video uploads and downloads is the only issue, then why don’t you remove all videos older than a month or a forthnight or even a week? If that is the case then you can maintain a lower number of active videos at any point of time.
2. In case somebody requires that video they can request you and you can provide the video to them for a cost.
3. If the investor allows you to maintain videos from all channels then it would be a good deal, otherwise not very feasible.
4. Membership is an option, but viewership would decrease and hence advertising revenue would decrease as well and eventually you would have to increase the cost of membership.
I support “hasskhan on March 23rd, 2008 8:38 am”.
This site is fast becoming the only source of viewing political talk shows. Rate of increase in viewership of this site shows that in near future this site would determine the landscape of Pakistani politics.
I agree with the idea of premier membership but would not like to put any restrictions on non-members. This site has a very loyal community. The only worrisome thing is that once PkPolitics reaches that point, how to guarantee that it would remain free of bias and would not be subjugated by the agents of the political criminals with their carrot and stick policy.
Some of the most popular sites in the world are based on donations. I assure you there are people willing to donate for a “GOOD CAUSE”. All you have to do is to let pemier members have say in PkPolitics affairs.
You know better, that people of Pakistan are capable to share the burdon of a good cause. Just give them the chance to prove their convictions. Thanks.
You should not assume that only expat Pakistanis visit this site. You should consider that many pakistanis also visit and will increase in number as number of internet connections and general awareness will increase tremendously in coming days.
This site can also work for sharing of views between pakistanis living in the country and abroad. the people living in pakistan can correct many misunderstanding of expat people. the events happening inside pakistan can be easily informed by these people to all over the world. e.g. Lawers movement, rigging by MQM in NA-250, JI manhandling of IK, agitation by LUMS students etc.
This site should target both the categories of Pakistanis i.e. in and out of Pakistan. the money factor can be crucial for people inside pakistan. a cable connections costs 200-300 rupees p.m. (3-5$) in pakistan as compared to 30-35 pounds (60-70$) p.m. in UK. The relative scale of comparson is different for different people. You should assume that this is a sociopolitical welfare work for pakistanis and user should be encouraged to take part in this free of cost.
If no other solutions works then option-2 with a veto power lying with you can be helpful. In this case the user don’t have to pay anything and they can also act as auditors of that group. If majority of users are not happy with the content and policies of the media giant then you can cancel your contract with them. I will sugges to have an initial 6-month contract. However this will only be a undesired choice keeping in view financial situation. Ideally speaking none of the above two options is suitable for the actual motive of political awareness and education.
Admin
1)Talk to Yahoo folks. I know their model can rescue you.
2)Try to get advertisement
3) think $20 dollars per year fee is NOT bad for the service you are providing us.
For many people this website provide a free entertainment. We get the liberty of getting to watch our favorite political shows here whenever we feel like so….
i think raise your own finances through advert sponsorship. the funds should be enough to run the site.
I agree with both proposals. As to the monthly fee system, I will wait for your final decision, and subscribe according to affordability. I intend to cooperate.
I have a suggestion to implement option1. Instead of charging per month e.g $5/mth, you should charge annually i.e. $60/yr. That way, it will be easy for the subscribers too because they will have a one time charge per year and they need not to think about it for at least a year. In that way you also have a good idea of how much money you can raise and also help you plan ahead of time.
hi
salam to all memebers and admin
I think membership idea is better because if some political party invest in this site , then they will use it for their own benefits.
I am raedy to be a member.
shakeel Adelaide
well i think 2nd option is much better…
make a poll to know exactly what the visitors of this site want, so you’ll have a better idea, bcuz if you just begin charging for these videos, im sure u’ll lose much traffic…
The reason is not just money, many visitors wouldn’t be even having a credit card, and if you can collect money from door to door, its fine.
and is that large media group GEO? bcuz I guess they are the only ones willing to try new things..
and google adwords is also a nice way to make money from a website, I hope u’ll be able to make enough money to run the site…
Delete Archives
hi
hope u guys figure something out
Please DO NOT remove old videos as this site is a valuable source of information old and new.
However, you can keep a click count and as it drops a lot, take them down: however, still leave the links to them, should someone request them. In that case the video can be uploaded (perhaps auto uploaded – normal measures against spamming requests can be taken)
Take ads to generate revenue.
If ads do not generate enough revenue go for option 1 because option 2 will make this a biased site.
@admin,
i want to voice my strong reservations regarding option 2. As it would cast a shadow of doubt regarding the independent integrity of the content being posted on the website. I think the reason for the success of PkP has been that we have very openly enjoyed thorough and transparent discussion, analyzing all angles of pakistani politics. I would HATE to see such a marvel go away to the whims of a biased political editor.
I would suggest opting for choice 1, we can definitely pay an amount on a monthly basis, which i am sure will also provide further leverage to your own team to venture into other dimensions as far as making PkP more in-depth and analytical. Thanks, I have been an ardent patron of PkP since last july, when i remember there were only a few faces here. I would want to continue this relationship further as it has definitely contributed to my own political education not to mention the often entertaining comments posted by the other members.
So Yes, I vote for option 1.
Dear Admin
The thing I didn’t really understand is that you are putting videos taken from different channels, do you have the rights for these videos. Charging for the videos which are the production of another media group is a bit unfair.
The reason why they can not challenge you is that they know it’s almost impossible to stop the internet spread of the their programmes and that’s probably why they want to invest and get in rather then stay out of this scene.
Having said all, I think your website is great and serving a great purpose, sometimes it breaches the neutrality which is not ideal but good enough for us. There is absolutely no reason why you don’t make money as after all you are giving your time to all the operation and time in precious in west.
The main audience that you have got is the Pakistanis living abroad and sponsors from Pakistan as some of the members suggested will not serve the purpose.
I honestly think the way forward is to find more volunteers from all around the world who are willing to put their time in recording and putting the videos on the website. Going under a media group means that you will have to give them some control and they will then try to get more and more control. They will probably ask you to show their videos more then any other media group and probably influence the website more then anything else.
I would say keep it clean and keep it away from cooperate control. Get more advertising and marketing and get more hits. Get more volunteers and if you want to charge then go ahead.
Thanks
After reviewing all comments above, my conclusions are
1. Going forward pkpolitics will have to lay out strategy for acquiring copyrights from different channels. So far due to ban on media liberties in Pakistan, channel owners might have granted leeway to pkpolitics to host their programs without permission.
2. once a subscription is set for users, it might convey message across different channels that pkpolitics is making profit from hosting their programs, simply this situation would not be acceptable for them. ( I know pkpolitics administrator has no such intentions but how can we assure channel owners that we are not making profit out of it).
3. donations, they are not reliable and consistent source of revenue (please do not take revenue as word in absolute business terms)
4. archives (programs older more than 1 month) must be deleted straight away and if somebody needs them, pkpolitics admin shall provide them on CDs after charging necessary postage
now financing for future, a business plan must be prepared if the strategy is to operate this site for foreseeable future. This business plan will include following assumptions but not limited to
1. copyright and licensing costs ( I am very much concerned about this as it can create immense problems in future)
2. daily no. of users
3. most watched programs
4. no. of regular users
5. other category of users
6. fixed and variable costs
7. etc
based on above a subscription amount can be decided
If administrator of pkpolitics is committed to pursue this project for future then some plan has to be developed which would include channels program hosting plus self prepared programs and analysis as I believe pkpolitics has come out of embryonic stage (I believe it happened much earlier than expected) and administrator must decide the future strategy.
I think this is now serious business rather than just launching a website.
(@admin
being a business “student” if I can be of any help, feel free to contact me)
Atif
Lets be practical and go with Option 2. Try to protect independence of content through terms of contract.
Option 1 is likely to generate little, if any, revenue. Option 2 is the only option.
Decide whatever option but DO NOT delete Merey Mutabiq videos till Dr. Shahid Masood returns…!
Option 1 is ok.
Admin,
You are doing an excellent job to keep Pakistanis overseas informed. I always believe best things in the world are free but I do not mind paying for this site as long as it is a reasonable amount. One suggestion is to have semi-annually fund raising drive just like NPR (National Public Radio), determine your collection goals and people will pay as long as they see value.
Arif
My 2 Cents!
1. Use your marketing skills and get some banners on this website, get some local ads, and use other 3rd party options to get some visibility of pkpolitics.com. I just learned this from word of mouth, no ads or banners on any known pakistani website.
2. Keep the Premium Member option out of the table. Whether its $1 or $20, you will probably loose 75% of your customers that way. Think Pakistani! Although there is no concept of “free lunch”, but people are more interested in “mufta news.com”
3. If you work wisely, you will be able to cover your expenses in a few months and then sit, relax and enjoy the show! You have anough visibitly to make this happen.
Just stick around for a few more months and host this on your own.
Just dont get ‘aquired’ but some other media company and lose your freedom!
Option 1 is more suitable and good. if we think deeply 5 to 10 dollors is the cost of one day lunch. and getting all this quality videos in $10 is not bad deal at all.
My suggestion is keep the monthly fee as less as possible that every one can become a member.
ok…my humble suggestion would be for all of us(that includes the existing core team who has been running it very well) buying this web site !, i mean all the visitors who are willing to pay premium subscription, can put together an offer to buy the website. In this way, we can make it a commercial project, earning some money for every share holder and also keeping it “people’s” web site….instead of going into the hands of a media group. We have to be realistic, it wil become very very difficult as time passes to run it purely on volunteeer basis. You all know what it means when it goes to the hands of a media group, that is, all the people who have so far worked hard for this web site to it keep going will bcome operators of that group and will upload what they want them to upload. If this web site bcomes public property, i am sure we can come up with some kind of editorial policy where masses of the share holders will have influance on what is shown on the web site.
I am open to all of the thoughts…
thanks
I am ready to contribute but reading the comments I think there are not many members who are willing to contribute.
My suggestion is to make the payment a voluntry option and try to get the reveneu by advertisements.
There are lot of organisations who are serving the community like that as Peace TV and JOOX.net etc….
As I said I am more than happy to contribute … My best wishes foe PKPOLITICS
Salaam Admin,
I am a student at Cambridge University. We all use this website all over Uk & europe.
I had thought tht Pakistanies outside PAk mainly use this website, as brand band is not that common in Pak yet. But the comments have made me think odawise.
Keep in mind tht most of these videos are available on Feddler and youtube as well. We all also have links for live Geo transmissions.
Regards
Still I wouldn’t mind becomming a premium member. In case you need volunteers, anysort of other support or representation; I am available.
Donations! Donations! Donations!
and
Advertisements…
No way you should submit to any media group…………..NO! NO! NO!
Look at GOOGLE…they generate their money from ADVERTISEMENTS and are one of the big guns of Internet!!!!
Look at WIKIPEDIA………they are running a big encyclopedia website with DONATIONS!!!
I am sure, visitors of this site will help it stay stay online and free from financial worries …..
and one big question!!!!!!!!!!!
WHY DONT THAT MEDIA GROUP GIVE YOU DONATIONS FOR KEEPING THIS SITE UP AND RUNNING?
and
WHY ARE THEY INSTEAD INTERESTED IN OWNING AND THEN INVESTING ????
Regards, and best wishes for pkpolitics.com
Sulman Sarwar
I for one would be happy to become a premium subscriber of course I am being presumptuous in prejudging the influence of a media group – but I am happy with the way you’ve handled the site thus far & that gives me faith in the current management.
You started this site with an objective, do whatever is needed as long as it won’t hurt your objective.
Dear Pk Politics Team,
I will like to tell you that I am from a small company which is IT & Telecom related. whta I learn from then is
1) Never sell out your business or allow to invest anyone in your business. you will lost your ideas and identity.
Please consider the following
1) Get the premium membership with download option before deleting a video
2) retrict the vedio for one week only after one week memeber is allowed to download that vedio if he likes.
3) Get advertisement from google and other giants like microsoft etc. from iT field because your site realise the user’s computer hardware and software problem including his internet connection e.g. DSL MAN etc.
PLease think a lot before losing your control.
May Allah give you the right choice.
Dear Pk Politics Team,
I will like to tell you that I am from a small company which is IT &
Telecom related. whta I learn from then is
1) Never sell out your business or allow to invest anyone in your
business. you will lost your ideas and identity.
Please consider the following
1) Get the premium membership with download option before deleting a video
2) retrict the vedio for one week only after one week memeber is allowed to
download that vedio if he likes.
3) Get advertisement from google and other giants like microsoft etc. from
iT field because your site realise the user’s computer hardware and
software problem including his internet connection e.g. DSL MAN etc.
PLEASE MAKE ADONATION CALL IF YOU ARE FINANCIAL PRESSURE, WE WILL HELP YOU
BECAUSE WE LOVE YOU.
PLease think a lot before losing your control.
May Allah give you the right choice.
1- If the purpose is to keep your control over the content then option 2 will not make sense. However if you can let that control of content go then selling out the site will be good option.
2- If the idea is to have partners/investors (ordinary people or political junkies instead of media groups) without compromising the content discretion entirely then I would like to discuss that option with you. Should you like to explore this option, please contact me. I assume, you have my email address.
Assalam o allaikum,
Admin, Use some numbers now. How much is the target for 6 months? Once we know that amount then we can see if going the donations route is worth it or not.
I like ahmed’s idea of investment into pkpolitics by the members. sort of like buying the shares.
Please give some number for the estimate for 6 months and inshallah we can see who pledges what…
Wassalam
@Everyone,
Based on your feedback, here is our updated feedback:
http://pkpolitics.com/2008/03/22/pkpolitics-future/
Admin
@admin
what is the email address for admin to tell him about the donation. Please put me down for 100$.
Email is “admin at pkpolitics dot com”.
Thanks
https://www.google.com/adsense/login/en_GB/?hl=en_GB
check this out
@Admin,
i am ready to pay u monthly fee …and fine with option # 1…
tell me ,how can i send u this fee …
i dont think ,u ppl shud sacrifice the independence of the site for financial pressure ….
we are here to share it with u ppl ….
thanks
Beena
@norcotics
They’re already using Adsense. People who are interested in Reading News or Articles never click on Adsense Ads. They’re just involved in Comments and watching Videos and they close the window down as soon as they are over with it.
I’ve been contributing a lot by Adsense, I’ve been clicking the ads (of course ads of my interest)
@Admin
I am a Software Architect myself and we’re planning to launch our upcoming website in next 3 4 months and we’re planning to strike a deal with you & we’ll pay you 100% in advance for 1 year of our Ad placement. Inshallah.
But then again, it’s too early and we need 3 months atleast to launch our website. The best part is that it’s not your competitor
…And dear Admin, don’t forget to take some sleep and proper time to relax. There should be some time slots where you leave totally stress of pkpolitics:-), no more politics at that time (just a light remark).
In addition to that do some jogging or other exercise/sport regularly. We don’t want to see you as old man with bent back or as Somo Pehlwan:-), if sometime we happen to meet you in street.
At the end, your sincere and volunteer contribution in context of this website is really a great service to Pakistan and Pakistanis (even to the World i feel). You have definitely opened a new horizon and way for people to think, share and act. I am ready for every possible contribution in any possible way.
Keep your spirits high. May Allah accept your dedications and contributions. Aamin.
@Zaheer
I agree with you.
Bohat hogaya Politics, dimagh ki lassi ban gai hai har waqt GEO NEWS, har waqt news news news.
Now that Gillani sahab has become PM as we all wanted, it’s time for him to work and for us to relax a bit.
Yaar abhi koi ya nahi bolna k “Relax kar k barbaad hogaye hum etc etc etc” I am saying it in a light mood.
Cheers.
Assalam-0-Alaikum,
First of all i salute the whole pkpolitics team for the efforts they have put in this thought provoking website..
I think letting someone else control you freedom would be a political suicide.. We never know how these media people are influenced by major political giants. It won’t be much difficult for a feudal lord of urban mafia to influence the freedom of expression that is expressed here in any way they please..
Having said that, I think the first option of ‘Premium Membership’ might work here. Some people have suggested that Pakistani viewers might NOT be able to put in the money for the sake of videos and stuff. since the websie requires alot of bandwidth (1mbps on an average to run in smoothly) and considering the fact that there is a very low percentage of internet users in Pk (including me) who are honored to be having such high speed internet.. The chances of public from Pakistan putting in the money are slim..
Your main audience should be the Pakis living abroad, who would hopefully be willing to pay
Thankyou!
Umair Bilal Ansari
There is one more thing that can be done. I am living in Karachi and study in Bahria University. There is simply no way that I could have took a progressive part in the condemnation of government attorcities since past year.
But in Lahore and Islamabad we have seen how things have changed from political perspective. If some of the people from LUMS, FAST and other institutes could be shown the way pkpolitics has contributed to political scenario and what advantages it provides to us all, I am sure they’ll be willing to host a collection drive and there is even a possibility that the institutions might also be willing to contribute in this regard since the efforts of students from LUMS were also highlighted here on pkpolitics if I recall correctly and having an archive would be the best one could ask for.
In other words, all those who have been active in the past one year if they could be shown how their efforts have been collected and stored for generations of Pakistanis to come, view and learn … I am sure a lot of people will be willing to help out one way or the other.
Off course, this would surely need a good marketing effort and I am an MIS student stranded in the City of Chaos (Karachi) so not of much help.
You should do the following:
- SELECT TV talk shows (for example just feature Bolta Pakistan and Talat) which you or your public thinks are the best. There is no point in showing everything. This will significantly reduce your time and storage required.
-Spin it as an entreprenuerial venture. Get some funding.
-Keep fee low or by program. for example 5 bucks if u just want to see bolta pakistan.
Export your Traffic Reports with all the Graphs and Heat Maps with all the stats like:
1. Unique visitors,
2. Average Time on site by a Visitor
3. Pages Viewed / Visit
4. Visitor Loyalty (Recency of Visits, Length of Visit, Depth of Visit)
5. Traffic Sources (Websites, Blogs etc)
6. Most Accessed Content
7. Number of Comments on the Most Commented Article or Story
8. Number of Views on the Most viewed Article or story.
Take the Print Screen of your desired Ad Places and prepare a nice PowerPoint Presentation, Find some nice attractive Powerpoint Templates, Visit Veer.com for some nice Professional Stock Images.
Now you have a Document to show the worth of your site.
PLAN ‘A’
Email this Presentation to:
1. Pakistan Tehreek-e-Insaaf
2. PPPP
3. PML-N
And please don’t forget to place the REAL ads on the desired ad places just for the sake of presentation.
Tell your story and ask them to support you. Let’s see if they come up with some assistance.
PLAN ‘B’
Email the same Presentation to the Marketing Managers of Telenor, Warid, Mobilink and all those Multinationals who are willing to show their message to Masses, we can easily make a list of 50 to 100 companies filling in this category.
You can get a few people who have the belief of Marketing & Promotion on Internet from Rozee.pk, visit this site and see all the banners and companies who happily placing Ads for 2 to 3 lakh rupees for only 15 days on Rozee.pk
I think it’ll pretty much help you get going.
And please,,, Never ever ask anyone for Donation,,, Please. You have a Diamond of a site and it can earn you great numbers, you just need to be lucky once.
Will conclude with:
tundiyye baad-e-mukhalif sey na ghabra aye aukaab
Yeh to chalti hai tujhey ooncha uraaney keliyye
1 More Idea, now the Ideas are coming….. Lolz…
Embed Telenor or a Warid Ad before between a Video and show it to the Warid or Telenor guys.
Ask them to have a six months contract with you and you’ll only show their Ad in the Videos with whatever cost you may want to charge.
I guess they’ll easily pay you half a Million Rupees for 6 months & a Million Rupees for a whole year contract.
Cheers….
Can you setup paypal donations (https://www.paypal.com/us/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_donate-intro-outside).
It would be easiest to donate using paypal from outside pakistan. This would encourage small donors who would rather not email you about a 5 or 10$ they want to give.
I can arrange the initial cost of $4,000 & rest of $2,000 per month.
Admin. Please contact me.
We need to discuss the details.
@junaidharoon,
We will go with donations path only if we get commitments to cover the expenses for the 6 months. It will be a big hassle to return the donations if we choose to go with Subscription or Media Group option.
Thanks for the paypal idea, we will definitely use this path if we get commitments for donations.
Admin
@Ali Rizvi,
We only have small percentage of people accessing the site and videos from Pakistan, therefore Pakistani mobile ads won’t be effective.
Traffic Souces
Thanks, Admin
You are wasting your time and effort with this. Your site is popular because people have heightened interest due to the current situation in Pakistan. As the the situation stabilizes, people will lose interest and neither will you have contributors, nor donors.
My suggestion: be smart and take the offer you have and find a way to maintain some independent.
Ooops!
“My suggestion: be smart and take the offer you have and find a way to maintain some independent.”
Some independence!
@ad min
1- why dont @ad min and us (whoever has contacts with any political parties/leaders) ask for their party’s advertisements in the following forms
- party advertisement eg party manifesto’s, agendas etc
- party programmes arranged in various cities/countries to attract audience
- party news
- collection of their party donations through this site
2- what about contacting advertisers which advertise during fav programmes to advertise on this site as well?
3- what about running the programmes with adverts during breaks and then ask the advertisers for contribution?
@Malek,
As mentioned above, we don’t have any marketing skills and the admins run this website as part time after our full time day jobs.
We give you full authority on behalf of pkpolitics to contact the advertisers and bring any interested parties.
Admin
@admin
I have sent an email about the initial pledge. Update, if you got any pledges. It can be increased based on response you are getting.
A-O-A
Dear Pakistan Politics,
I will make my first donation of $25.00 next month. Let me know if its enough or not, and also how many times you want me to donate in a year. Please also let me know of your account number and bank in USA. Thanks.
Please do not accept any funds from Pakistani public, let us all overseas Pakistanis cover the cost. This forum is much more important for Pakistanis in Pakistan than for us. Please reply as soon as possible. Also let me know of any other ways I could be of any help to this forum.
Long live Pakistan and long live pkpolitics. Amen
Hello,
What is your bandwidth consumption?
Storage requirements?
Monthly revenue?
Monthly expenses?
Why do you need office space?
I run about 6 websites, plus many more under dev… one person.
Please contact me, lets see how we can help each other.
Thank you
Haroon
Invision Tech LLC
I would be happy to pay $5 / mon for a Premium Subscription. I can also probably donate on a monthly basis if you go for that option.
– Kamran.
@Invasion Tech,
We cannot disclose all technical details, but you are right, the web site does not require any office space or man hours to run.
It is the videos, that need 2 full time persons to work in shifts from 10am till midnight to record 5-6 programs as well as any news that deserves to be preserved for future reference. We 3 guys are running the site and each day we spent around 8-10 hours in total to keep our eyes on TV and preserve anything important.
Our main requirement is to offload this boring video stuff and do something more creative in that time. The current 3 admins live in US/UK where we could share our residence space for this stuff, but human resources are extremely expensive here.
We are planning to open a small office in Islamabad where we can hire 2 cheap IT guys who can spend majority of their time in video recording and editing, and also expand more channels including “Express” and “Dawn”. We have been offered by some TV channels in Islamabad to have their programs on CDs, which will also save lots of recording time.
Admin
@admin
Don’t get me wrong, but not a good choice of words.
“where we can hire 2 cheap IT guys”
We are also looking for the final out come your call for assistance?
@admin
Can u write a page describing price of ads space. (wrt position and size).
i have few websites that needs continuous advertising and i know u got real traffic (my sites don;t have any adult content)
Viddler was down today and it came back online without our account. We are trying to investigate what went wrong.
We had been told by viddler a few months ago that up to a thousand users watch video simultaneously and we were creating bandwidth issues for them. We are setting up our own video hosting solution that should be up during the weekend.
For now, please use jumptv.com, satellite or cable to watch AAJ TV videos.
Thanks,
Admin
Hello Admin, first of all thanks very much for your relentless and painstaking efforts to educate us throgh PKPOLITICS now atleast we can talks something other CRICKET. I would only ask you if you could please consider students when and if you intend to launch your premium service, as it could be bit burden for them.
Anway, I would still say the services you providing is indeed PRICELESS.
Thanks Very Much Once Again
Allah Pakistan
@admin
any update on this? what are you going to do?
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