Javed Hashmi of PMLN and Naveed Qamar of PPP with Kashif Abbasi in fresh episode of Off the Record.URL derived from title. Original in blip/mar08/offtherecord_27_mar_08.flv (Video_Normalized)
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PLM-N has certainly some nice leadership in their upper quadrant. I was just reading Hashmi Sahab’s book “takhta-dar kay saye taley” , and undoubtedly it’s one of the best political cum social books out there in the market, next to Qudrat-Ullah “Shahab-Nama”
Don’t know how PPPP will come out in next 5 years, as by looking at Qamar, Fauzia, Gilani, Ashraf, Amin, Mukhtar and Shah Mehmood it is evident that they are been forcibly bound not to express their views and ideas. Only Babar and Anwar speak their heart out, but in a very caring manner.
On the other hand, PTI and PLMN are outspoken where the members enjoy expression of freedom, yet with utmost care and concern. In future, I feels that PLMN, JI, PTI, ANP will work in more closer collaboration.
But whatever the future is, may Allah bless all His blessings on our beloved country.
KA is requested to please leave the issue of conflict /clash between President Office and Parliament. The issue has to be ended with the passage of time. So we all should wait. Don’t move in circles and avoid discussing an issue repeatedly. It creates monotonous. We have a lot issues which have to be addressed or discussed.
I cannot recall A SINGLE ppp guest which has given a straight answer. Maybe it is just being part of a ruling party? WTF is wrong with these people? This guy is just wasting everyone’s time with fluff..
annoying as hell.
They are going to squander the frikking mandate.
this is very true not a single PPP guy gives a straight answer….and thats after being elected as a majority party …and on top of that (somewhat) unreserved support from the second largest party PMLN.
i am still not sure if PPP is true with the ’causes’
Great Debate, but one thing i wanted to add here that please save our country no matter what we have to do
I think we all should wait for first 100 days to see what they do?
even PPP donot wanna take a clear stand they are forced to stay with pmln. Might they wanna take down mush with surprise.
Lets pray for them and see.
Admin no video is available same as yesterday ?
if these parties wanna go ahead they have to remove mush, but it interesting the mush himself feeling like a dead person, its like sand droping. he knows nothing will happen with him good.
PMLN is going good till now and hope so will be good insha Allah. and we should pray that they all do togather for the betterment of Pakistan. May Allah bless Pakistan
PPP’s stance regarding Musharraf is clear. But unline PMLN, PPP politicians use a more diplomatic language and avoid using confrontational rhetoric.
The reat fight is against the stablishment that is calling shots in Pakistan. Musharraf is a part of establishment, HE IS NOT ESTABLISHMENT. First these political parties should consolidate their hold on power before they go after Musharraf, remove 58-2b, free judiciary and reinstate Judges through a legal procedure.
why PPP dont give clear and straight answers???? i am worried they going to play same role like Qatil league were playing
Despite PPP answers; their steps taken so far are very much aligned with people’s wishes. So why should we doubt them and be cynical? I think they are just doing the job so far and not bragging or confronting in public. They are being cautious becuase that’s what is required in such critcial times. They have more sacrifices by giving their lives than any other party not even PML N? Remember explosion in PPP camp in pindi in cheif justice rally? 12 May Karachi Killing? Karachi explosion? BB assisnation? Can any other party claim such sacrifices ? So we need to give them some time becuase they are honour bound by the blood of their own workers and leaders..
Good program.
Both NQ and JH said Inshallah in 6 months the munhoos dict. will be gone.
AMEEN.
there is not a single person in the PPP who can give a straight answer to anything. the only thing they know is how to harp on about their so-called “shaheeds”. i am sick of these people, i wish PML-N had gotten the majority mandate instead, atleast we would see their promises being fulfilled instead of this crap that the PPP is coming up with. PPP is no different than JUI-F, they talk big but screw up the whole country when the nation is looking towards them.
@Traffic, hasskhan, inam and all
Unfortunately, your wish has not been granted…so move on…with regards to your comments regarding so-called “shaheeds” i feel it is far better to support a leadership that has given sacrifices rather than which was crafted by establishment. You may have forgotten but let me refresh your memory regarding well known role of ISI in creating IJI and building NS image..it is on record..hope you don’t deny it….
you have criticized ppp for not giving straight answer. I believe, for you a straight answer is only what you want to listen OR the one which is a sweeping statement. Expecting both is unrealistic and immature…I think the anwers given by the resposible people should show some maturity and responsibility. That is what PPP leadership is trying to do i.e. move cautiously but surely on issues…..It is sad that you don’t like responsible and mature answers…..It is very difficult time for Pakistan and we should show some maturity in our approach…
There was some comparison made b/w PTI and PPP…come on…PTI is not even born in politics….it not even a Taanga party because it has no Swaaris….
Why don’t Mr Naveed Qamar says clearly that
” If Boucher and Pontay have some security risk ,they should stay in America and not to come to Pakistan.”
Asfand yar wali did a good job.
After all Kuch to haya chayey.
@ Paf123
see you started talking about “shaheeds” again. what has the PPP ever done for the country except loot and plunder billions off the poor people of Pakistan and given them false promises of roti kapra makaan. BB only came back to Pakistan on assurances from Mush and America that all corruption cases are dropped and she comes into govt again to loot more. you might say that PPP was never powerful when in govt, but now they have the ideal conditions, and still they are fooling around. please talk about issues instead of “shaheeds”. i admit that ZAB was a brave man who gave his life rather than compromise on principles. after that PPP has gone down a slippery slope, what with surrey palaces and Mr. 10%, not to mention the disgusting leadership of the party which includes people like naheed khan, jahangir badr, rahman malik, pervez ashraf, latif khosa, shah mehmood qureshi etc. the list is too long, all useless people. BB made a deal with a dictator who stabbed her in the back. she knew very well that the bomb blasts in karachi on her arrival were the work of mush and the agencies, but still she kept putting the blame on poor tribal people (hinting at agencies’ involvement only when politically beneficial). if she had spoken out against Mush openly instead of targeting the tribal people and “extremists”, then Mush wouldnt have been able to kill her and blame “terrorists” for it. i kow you are a jiyala and these things will fly over your head but these are the facts, get over your “shahadats”.
@ Traffic
A party with “shaheeds and useless” leaders is the single largest party of Pakistan and has obtained more votes than any other party..so all your sad comments RIP by virtue of the love shown by the poeple of Pakistan for these “Shaheeds and useless leaders”. Therefore, my friend why don’t you GET OVER your bias against PPP and make good USE of your time…..
Re cases against PPP leaders…check your facts..or ask NS about apologising for all the cases…
@ Paf123
oh come on we all know what the vote-bank of PPP is. they fool the poor and uneducated rural people of Pakistan every time by their fake slogans of roti kapra makaan. the minute cable TV is available in those areas, PPP will be history. for the last 30 years they kept people alive on slogans of bhutto’s death, now they will keep fooling those poor people thru benazirs death for the ext 30 years. the educated urban middle class knows this party too well, and thats why they dont have any major support in that section.not to mention how the PPP was wiped out in the 1997 elections because of all the corruption that it did, but i guess you can fool some people all the time. its also interesting how you still didnt mention any major achievement of PPP in the last two times that it was in power.
@
Paf123
you are very good jiayala of PPP…anyway NS and all other made in pakistan parties will win again next time with 2/3….this time due to sindh card and assisanation of BB by hardliners anti american tribal people gave sympathy vote to PPP in sindh…
if asif zardari, latif khosa, baber awan and farooq khal naik tried to play with restoration of judiciary and shah mahmood etc. tried to include mqm in Govt. it will be a last nail in PPP coffin…….so be careful before making any big statements……and where is another Jiayla who offer $ to people …lol
Pakistan’s two biggest political parties have decided to work together to achieve their mutual goals-and a significant headway have been made of forming a coalition government. Pakistan’s future is at stake and much is depended on this coalition-neither the people of Pakistan nor these political parties can afford another round of confrontation, a la the last decade. I’m sure that unlike some of their supporters the politicos of these two political parties have learnt from their past mistakes and would not resort to demeaning and badmouthing the members of the opponent party.
PPP deliberately avoid cashing the public sentiments by rhetoring and sloganeering. Be it PML N, we would have never had taken part in elections. Be it PML N, we would have never seen their own leader coming back to Pakisan in at least 10 years. Be it PML N judges would still have been detained along with their families in their houses.
Musharaf and Co. is isolated and weakest now only because PPP guided the nation and PML N to take part in elections. NS is here in Pak because of Mohtarma paved the ways for his return. The judges are released (soon InshALLAH they will be restored) on the orders of a man Called Yousuf Raza Gilani who is from PPP! The forerunners and leaders of Lawyers movement, Aitzaz Ahsan, Zamrud Khan, Athar Minullah, Latif Khosa and Babar awan along with many others are from PPP.
PML N is more of a typical puniabi mola jutt style! except the guys like Javed Hashmi and Ahsan Iqbal who talk straight but with descency!
While, PPP is more of a Pakistani Urdu cinema style (Waheed murad, nadeem, M, Ali etc).
@Traffic
Just comprehend the situation, if NS is prime minister and Shahbaz sharif is murdered in fake encounter and blame goes to NS! What would be the outcome of that election? In 1997, just few months before the election, the sitting PMs brother was assassinated near his house.
PPP has the representation in ALL FOUR provinces of Pakistan including Azad Kashmir! PML N is non-existant in the provinces other than Punjab.
@crazyrz
I can’t remember anyone from PML N (except Javed Hashmi and Kh. Asif) who has sacrificed in anyway! Not even Jail, which is the institution for Politician.
NS could only withstand abt 1 year of imprisonment and fled to the palaces of KSA along with his whole family leaving all his party behind! Mushahid Hussain was slapped once by some major in 1999 and he crapped in his pants. Ch. Nisar’s brother who is a general saved his brothers arse from going to prison.
PML N can not even imagine what party workers are! PPP is in Masses.
I don’t understand why PML N supporters wants to ruin the National Coalition on this critical Juncture in the history of Pakistan. If anyone who is sincere with Pakistan must strengthen the PPP/PML N/ANP coalition!
@
fahim 23
just to get the facts right…look at 1990 elections , 1993 elections and 1997 elections.. PML (N) challengend PPP head to head and in 1990 and 1997 out classed PPP…Musharraf and co took 8 years to weaken PML (N) and it was your clever BB who with the help of USA made a deal with Mush and got sufficient time for election preparation ..
NS was allowed to enter in the pakistan when there was last day for the nomination of paper..papres of NS and SS were rejected on the will of MUSH..even then PML (N) performed very well in election and got seats from Punjab and NWFP…
PPP took full advatage of assisiantion of “azeem quaid” by the hands of anti american hard liner, fanatic tribals…it was sympathy vote in sindh which gave advatage to PPP…
as i said in my above post that PPP will not come out of NRO and people like baber awan, farooq khal naik and khosa are trojan and always tried to weaken lawyers movement…so i hope PPP will not repeat previous mistakes otherwise it will be last time when PPP won seats…
lawyers are quite aware from Khosa, baber awan and farooq khal naik and ali ahmed kurd said that he will raise the issue in the meeting as these three traitors were in oath taking ceremoney of YRG…
@ sleepingnation
All the dictators and politcians created by dictators have tried their best to put “last nail in PPP’s coffin” since it was formed. They have failed misreably, so will anyone who thinks that political parties die…..Last but not the least..pls. do not wish for 2/3 majority for sharifs again…remember what they did with last time…bhola is good for talking and eating not working….
Anyhow, I agree with asfand1, it is a new begining..let’s move on….no more party bashing….wish you mutwals and piyalas good luck….
@
paf123
i wish you best of luck and best of luck to zardari to make some more money and may be you will get some share…do not think it is 80s now..people are quite aware of the facts and 1997 history will be repeated (17 PPP seats) if zardari and co repeated same mistakes
@ nation
pls. do no “come on” me..there is no weight in “come on”…it has been and will be the largest political party of Pakistan…so suck it up…and plsss…mutwals and piyalas….pls. stop mentioning 1997….again I say..everybody know what sharifs did with that “Bahari Mendate”…..they fled in the dark…started a new life in a palace..while the people and their workers were left “high and dry”…using your words…”I am sure you can fool some people all the time” right @ nation…..
Again, mutwalas and piyalas…no more party bashing…we are going to have coalition cabinet tomorrow…let’s work together on this forum and stop party bashing…peace
typo — the above comment is for @ Traffic…read @ nation AS @ Traffic..enjoy
@
paf 123
yes stop party basing ,but as you try to defend PPP and “azeem shaheed quaid” , we have every right to show other side of reality…its not easy to forget Swiss bank accounts, surrey palace all that money laundring and statements of azeem quaid to handover dr, qadir, about lal masjid and american intervention in pakistan..but will of God is always done..i will not say anything more
@TK
Raza Rabbani is from PPP and you should listen to his answers. On that note Aitezaz is also from PPP
@all PPP bashers
You have to wait, so far party has chose the right candidate and doing the right things. You guys are trying to break an alliance by blaming each other. If PPP and PML-N part ways today, the beneficiary will be Musharraf and PML-Q.
As @traffic, you have no right to tell the poor people are stupid and they vote for PPP. They vote for PPP for a dream given to them by ZAB. ZAB has given their life. I personally don’t like people who consider themselves “educated” and consider every body else less than human being. Your thinking is same as Musharraf who says we are not ready for democracy.
@ econfused
i didnt say that poor people are stupid, i said they are not informed. if you read my post again, i said PPP will be finished once these people get access to cable TV, not access to education. those poor people probably dont even know about the swiss accounts, palaces, necklaces, stables and horses etc. PPP would never want these people to be aware or get educated, they know that once this happens, they are finished.
@ paf123
you said imagine if shahbaz is killed and blame goes to nawaz. why would the blame go to nawaz, nobody would think of that. but why did people think that benazir killed her brother (whether she did or not thats another story), its because everyone knew about the corrupt couple’s lust for power and money, they would goto any extent for it. secondly you keep mentioning how nawaz flew off to saudi. mate he was jailed on absolutely ridiculous charges of hijacking a plane, when musharraf was the criminal who broke the law and should have been jailed. imagine the criminal jailing the victim, and expecting the victim to accept that punishment. however your dear BB had run away from the country from all the corruption cases against her, instead of facing the courts, and stayed in luxury in the UAE and London for 12 years and didnt return until she had made a deal with the dictator that all the cases against her be dropped and in return she would support a dictator.
and on top of that she made mighty claims of letting the americans bomb our country, hand over AQ Khan to IAEA, not to mention cheering Musharraf on when he was killing innocent little girls and bombing a masjid. she must be burning in hell right now, and you call her shaheed. Allah will ask her why she supported the murder of innocent little girls and destruction of mosques, bombing of Muslims, looting all that money from poor people of Pakistan.
@traffic
I just want to know where r u from? I mean wat part of pakistan?
@Traffic
NS was senteced for life imprisonment because He was not allowing the PIA plane carrying the Army cheif of Pakistan to land in the boundaries of Pakistan. Despite the pilot’s warning that, they are short of fuel, NS risked the life of not only musharf but other innocent passengers on board!
At least PPP has sacrifices on its track record what PML N has done. The Father of NS was a Lohar and he built an empire and you so naively believe that Halal ki kamayee! You conviniently forget what NS has been doing in the 80′s in the Zia’s lap and how he used to literally buy with loaded brief cases not only politicians but also Journalists to write in his favor.
In 1997, out of more thn 90% seats won by PML N was from Punjab and it is proved record that they were one of the highly rigged elections of Pakistan. At least PPP won 17 seats at that time, PML N could not even hold to 10 seats in 2002 when the number of seats were considerably increased!
If PPP would have tried to cash the public sentiment on judiciary issue, the fate of PML N would have been exactly as it was in 2002. The vote bank is another thing but there is not even any leadership of PML N in any province other than Punjab. PML N should start worrying about their day by day concentration of vote bank in the central punjab. You cannot even name a single leader of PML N from Sindh! The so called “Educated and literate” class defined by you either choose MQM or PML N! The rest for you are stupid and ignorant. If thats what education is then you be happy with that education we are happy to remain illiterate!
Keep on dreaming that PPP will be vanished just coz of your constant propagandist bashing! The day anything happens to PPP that will be the last day for Pakistan!
@Sleeping nation
In 1988 and 1990….PPP was on one side and on the other side there was IJI (Nine Party alliance) with full backing of ISI and Establishment. Still PPP won in 1988 and lost in 1990 (International observers CONFIRM the heavy rigging in these elections).
In 1993 PPP Won Again with the lead of 64 Seats.
Yet again in 1997, with horse trading, establishment backing and heavy rigging PPP was reduced to come up with only 18 seats. The statistics itself prove that the elections were not fair. A party cannot possibly fluctuate from 137 seats to 18 seats and thn back to 81 and 121 seats.
Even in this elections, the PML N has won on the judiciary issue and due to the boycott of JI and PTI, they have benefited but still couldn’t beat PPP in 2008.
You should wake up from your sleep and realize that PPP now has won and it will keep winning InshALLAH.
@ Fahim
There is no harm being a Jieyla like U , but dont behave like ignorant slave.
your knowledge about political history is pathetic and u r always distorting facts (in fact, u didnt know actually)
Pleasse do some research before utting up baseless propaganda here that u have heard verbally from some one and u beleive in that like a Haari or slave.
U have acess to internet and if u have brain, then google the facts first.
1 U said PPP was leading in 1993 by 64 seats. Thats totally Bullsh!t. in 1993, despite PPP being the PRO ESTABLISHMENT party( can u deny that??) could not get more votes than PMLN. PMLN votes were mroe than what PPP got in 1993. In number of seats also, based on late night changed results, PPP was ahead by only a few seats. Where r u living by the way?? Haari on MARS??? i never knew that MARS also have a feudal system.
My dear, please come out of this haari mentality. Its good for Yourself as well.
Then u said, that in 2002, PMLN got 10 seats that is wrong, Please go to website of election commission and see ur self mr Haari . dont just blindly follow what ur WADIRA SAEIN feeds u.
@
fahim 23
PPP got sympathy vote from sindh as they marketed murder of BB in a nice way…ican predict next electio PPP will be again to those 18 seats wadeyra sindhi party and will be eliminatd from punjab and nwfp…just wait and see…and as in above post, it was righly said that even in 1993 PML (N) singl handedly given PPP very tough time evn tough all establihment and biggest LOTAS watto, chatta etc were on PPP side . in 1997PPP lost miserably ….so get the facts right before spreading propoganda agaisnt otrher parties and Gd has saved Pakistan from bad intention of your cuning BB as PML (N) ´has so much seat that they cannot allow PPP to continue Mush policies…and PML (N) will play its role to keep a cloe eye on zardai and co and BB zionist agaenda to sell pakistan..
its a typing error “God save Paistan from bad intentions ofyour cunning BB”
PPP is the only party that enjoys support by the people of all the four provinces and as well as by the people of AK. Every military dictaor and his controlled agencies did their utmost to destry it, but fortunately to no avail.
Although my family has always supported PPP, we’ve never been a blind supporter. We always critcized its policies whenever we were not agree, and we will keep critcizing just to make it a better politcal party and a true voice of the masses of Pakistan.
I would advise my friends here that instead of badmouthing their opponents they should work towards the betterment of their own party. We should be happy that a two party system is evolving in Pakistan which is very healthy for our democracy and country. PPP and PMLN are the two biggest political parties of Pakistan and both of these parties have their loyal vote bank and we should respect that.
We may not always agree with each other but we should learn to disagree without being disrespectful and we should not forget that Pakistan comes before PPP or PML.
@People
In 1993 PPP won again with the lead of 89 to 73 Seats** ie., 16 seats(apologies for mistake)
And I don’t understand, when Zia groomed NS and Hameed Gul formed IJI but the pro-Establishment is PPP according to you. PPP has always been against Establishment. If it was pro-establishment then it would have never needed to cut a deal with establishment for democracy.
In 2002 PML N has won 19 seats when the seats are increased to 207 to 342. It is equivalent to 10 seats if we compare it with 1997!
I don’t mind if you guys be Pro-PML N, that is your right. But when NS takes strong strance for judiciary we as nation should be courageous enough to support it. Similarly, when PPP leads the nation to elections, or release the judiciary, and form a national consensus and isolate Musharaf and Co. or when PPP workers die for Judiciary in islamabad and karachi or for democracy in Sindh, Punjab and NWFP we as a nation should be bold enough to recognize and acknowledge that. Dear I too urge you to come out of paindoo mentality!
@Sleeping nation
Remember there won’t be even judiciary issue in next election for NS to cash upon. Because the judiciary is already released but also will be restored within 30 days.
In 2008 elections, PPP has won 105 seats on Punjab’s provincial assembly. Yes PPP has been weakining in central Punjab but the lahore once used to be the fort of PPP and soon InshALLAH PPP will strengthen itself in central Punjab. We have a leadership present such as Aitzaz Ahsan, Shafqat Mehmood (he is back in PPP), Fakhar Zaman etc in central punjab which was absent this time but they won’t be in next elections. PML N don’t even have leadership in Sindh, NWFP and Balochistan. So, if you just cool your mind you will realize that Situation is grim for PML N, not for PPP.
@asfand
I totally agree with you. As I said earlier in one of my post that, at this time is to support the national consensus government and PPP/ANP/PML N Coalition.
Whoever is blind supporter of any party is not a supporter at all! S/He is the worst enemy of that party. I can pin point number of flaws in PPP’s policy. But I don’t doubt their intentions.
lol despite everything all PPP jiyalas can talk about is their so-called shahadats, its amazing how they cant even come up with a single achievement of PPP govts other than “shahadats”, corruption and tall claims of letting the americans bomb our country. jiyalas are blind to the fact that BB came to Pakistan only after she kissed the americans ass by giving statements like letting them bomb Pakistan, hand over AQ Khan and supporting massacre of innocent little girls in a masjid just to prove how “moderate” she is and to show them to what low depths she will fall for power. i dont think i need to say anymore, i just hope PPP has learned a lesson and acts differently this time, specifically i hope it doesnt sell our country off to America again like Mush has been doing for the last 8 years. lets see how serious they are about the issues of getting rid of Musharraf, restoration of judiciary, stopping killing of Muslims, economy etc.
Traffic said:ts amazing how they cant even come up with a single achievement of PPP govts other than “shahadats”,
——————–
PPP gave Pakistan its constitution that is the biggest thorn in the eyes of all no-democratic forces in Pakistan.
And it was non other than Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto who initiated Pakistan’s nuclear program in 1972:
@ asfand1
read all my posts again and you will see that im talking about PPP after ZAB. i admit that he was a great leader, but what has PPP done after him?
http://www.pppuk.org/1988.htm
http://www.pppuk.org/1993.htm
These things were achieved during the two short tenures of PPP. Much more could have been achieved if the establishment had been involved in countless conspiracies to topple its government.
“had been involved” should read “hadn’t been involved”.
@Traffic and sleepingnation
I will not answer your badmouthing about PPP. As I have said in my previous post let’s move on, NS is part of the coalition. If NS and PPP can patch up then I believe we can also. We will get this opportunity in the next election. I am ready to have this discussion with any mutwala and piyala during the next election…..
I hope you have heard YRG’s speech….that will give you some idea…
@
paf123
there is a difference b/w PPP Jiyalas and normal persons. If PML (N) change its stance on restoration of Judiciary, about Mush , about role of army in politics, about MQM terrorists etc. i will be first to criticize and speak against them…
its the matter of issues not the personalities…and yes if people like latif Khosa, naik etc . try to undermine lawyer movement by minus one formula and people like mahmood quershi with very cunning artificial smile try to save Musharraf and try to inject MQM terrorist in the Govt. .then they should be ready for criticizm as well…its very simple to understand but if you just open your mind and look beyond PPP jiaylaism
Thanks
@ sleepingnation
exactly mate. i would be the first to go against PML-N if they go back on their words or start dealing with Musharraf, or start supporting the so-called “war on terror”. however jiyalas will continue supporting their morally and financially corrupt leadership no matter what.
@traffic,
i agree with you, ppp is bringing mqm in govt and there is no hint of critcism from ppp jayalaas. They are just blind followers and PPP knows that very well, that is why BB decided to go ahead with NRO. It would be sucidal for any other party but for PPP they have the Blind supporters
@sleepingnation
@Traffic
Great, this exactly what is the need of the hour. We should start thinking about issues instead of being jiyalas, blind followers etc.
We should show greatness by accepting good steps taken by other parties and be bold enough to critisize faults within ourselves and the party we normally support. This is the way forward!
GREAT….Thanks a lot
/Saqib
@sleepingnation and Traffic
very good principal set up by you –you will be the First Ones to criticize NS if NS deals with MQM or Mush and changes his stance on judiciary and army….very good…Just couple of questions:
1. Will it be applicable to the future acts only or it include past acts as well?
2. Will it be conditional to the listed issues only Or you will criticize on any thing you don’t agree?
Pls. answer so that the forum is clear on an appreciable statement made by you.
With regards to our blind support….it is not BLIND…in fact we support the stance of PPP against your BLIND, unstopping, wishful and biased criticism…nothing wrong with it..my friends….
connected to the previous post….
There is lot of PPP and BB bashing on AQkhan issue by the mutwalas and piyalas…just would like to say one thing…pls. check the recent statements by PML(N) senior leadership i.e. Raja Zafarul Haq….in fact his statement was –. AQ Khan needs to be in protective custody because there is some security threat to him……none of the PML(N) leaders are giving straight answers….(quoted by Kamran Khan in his recent program)
People who claim to be very fair and balanced in their posts above…pls. come out and explain…or may beeee criticise….
@ Paf123
ok firstly quoting kamran khan on anything is a bummer to start with. that idiot has no credibility. secondly while PMLN made no promises on AQ Khan before elections as far as i know (please correct me if i am wrong). however i strongly feel that AQ Khan should not be under “protective custody”, and if PMLN has said that he should remain under detention, i condemn them for it. he is a national hero and should be treated as such. i want him to be freed and made to address the nation again with the real facts. but why are you even talking about AQ Khan? your dear leader BB wanted to hand him over to foreigners. heck she even wanted the Americans to bomb our country.
@
paf123
we have enough morl courage and have open mind to criticize all wrong decision and appreciate good stances on issues
i ask you
1) Shery rehmn wasdoig press conference on 12 th may, and it was so terrible how PPP workers were killed by MQM goons…now your co-chairperon is bowing in the majesty of king of terror hazrat altaf hussain.. if you have oral courage and have some sympaty with your own party workers who were murdered by MQM qatils then come forward and admit that zardari is doing wrong…….
2) if trojan horses in laywyers like latif khosa and party tried to change murree accord with mnus 1 formula..will you accept that? give your clear stance on that.so that we can also know PPP standng on this issue which is highly doubtful
3) if americans are allowed to operate freely in pakistan (as committed by your azeem quaid) will you criticize that or accept that in” wasi tar qaumi mufaad”
i want your answers…..
and now coming back to your question.. PML (N) is opposing MUsharraf policies from last 8 years so future can be judged from past and yes if PML N)ill change its stance on the issues as stated above , i will be first to criticize them..as there is a difference b/w norma person and PPP jiayala….
2) NS is not our peer, so i am free to give my opinion about ML (N)) ..at the moment they have a good stance on many important issues as compared to PPP… so i sport them
NS never said that A.Q.Khan wil be handed over to USA for investigation..this credit goes to your “azeem quaid”..so be brave and condem this sance of your party…..
waiting for your reply
@
paf123
and yes PM Gillani took notice for Justice raday incident and ask for an inquiry…so i apprecaite his decision…if PPP will make right decision they will get plause from everybody but if they will follow comitments from”azeem shaheed quaid” then we cannot support them blindly..only Jiayla like you can do that
anyway show some guts and come up with clear answers or explaination about the issues which i raised in above post
sleepingnation
My question were simple yes or no question…..you are not giving a straight answer….so much for your preaching for straight answers….
well my answers are as follows:
1. From day 1 AZ has clearly said that PPP is ready to talk to any political power….MQM has won seats from Karachi and PPP is ready to talk to any political power..with respect to May 12..talking to a political power is best way to make them answerable for their acts….democracy is the best revenge….
regarding death of PPP workers will never be forgotten but the best revenge will be to win the hearts of Karachi people…rather than pushing MQM to a wall.
2. Doubt is in your mind….PPP will stand by Muree declaration…either you say there is something wrong with the content of the declaration…or you wait for its implementation…actually you want to eat your cake and have it too…i.e. Muree declaration is good…but PPP is bad as it not not committed. makes no logical sense..
BTW pls. see a recent capital talk (participants: SM zafar, Kurd, ahsan iqbal, shami etc.) where ahsan iqbal clearly disagreed with kurd and said that the credit of the lawyers movement does not go to lawyers only and lawyers should not try to put pressure on the parliament…
3. It is an “IF” statement…which has not happened..so cannot accuse PPP of doing something which has not happened. don’t need to answer “IF” statement
Although, I think my question were simple yes and no questions, in any case I will take your answers on the face of it and my comments are as follows:
You said”future can be judged from the past”…so my friend past is as follows (hope you do not deny the following)
1. PML has closely collaborated in the past with MQM and changed PPP majority in sindh…how would you judge the future???
1.2. NS made a deal with Mush twice…once when he left (which he shamelessly denied 1000 of times unless he said in his famous press conference that there was a deal) and second his second attempt to come back was also part of the deal brokered by saudis….
so my friend…..don’t put too much faith in the past…not for NS….
2. you are saying you will criticize NS on any issue where you disagree. correct?
@
paf 123
yes i know that PPP is ready to talk with any “Political power and even outside powers like USA to get power…your BB already done that and everybody knows that..it was richard boucher and negroponte who broke the deal between PPP and Mush…so its correct that PPP is such a poser hungry party that it can compromise on all principles for power
NS never made a deal with Mush.. he was expelled from the country and Mush never allowed him to come back becuase he was not ready to compromise on principles neither he was willing to bow in the majesty of USA as your “azeem quiad ” done…so make the record correct…as far as that agreement which Mush and PPP used to make as propoganda tool against PML (N) was rejected by SC , its commonsense that there are no agreements between kings and prisoners..prisoners are forced to follow the orders…
“If question” so you do not have any courage to even say that “i will condemn any attack on pakistan”..this show your affiliation with country but i appreciate that you are such a loyal to your “BB” and waiting for US attack on pakistan, which was a part of notorious BB america mush deal..
NS kick MQM out of Govt. in 1998 when they were part of coalation, since then PML (N) has very clear stance on MQM.. but PPP can sell every principle just for power…
yes i m free to criticize NS on any issue..i am not a deaf and blind jiayla.. a jiayla to whom PPP and BB are important that pakistan’s existence
1971 ZA Bhutto break the country to get the power…so its PPP old tradition that make a deal even with devil, if devil help them to occupy the power
@ Traffic
This is good..wherever there is a statement by a PML (N) leader on record you dismiss it by saying Kamran Khan has no credibility…..just read the above statement by mutwals and piyalas above..how many times PPP has been criticized or bashed for “IF” events and unsubtantiated statements…good and easy strategy…I like it — take no responsibilty for any thing bad.just attack the credibility of a responsible reporter…..
re PML (N) stance on AQ Khan…Kulsoon Nawaz is on record just before the election that PML (n) will make AQ khan the president of Pakistan…it was widely reported in national newspapers with no denials…..plss… do not say Kulsoom has no credibility or standing in the party..she ran the party in NS absence…..
@parf123
So Kulsoom Nawaz is making policy statement
Dude you should start doing Stand up comedy. I am sure you will be very successful.
@ Traffic…
you should respond to sleepingnation….he is doing what you were accusing Kamran Khan for……spreading rumors without credibility…
@sleepingnation
you are certainly not a “deaf or blind jiyalla” you are just a biased PPP basher…who has not answered any of the question raised by me rather tried your best to expand the debate by adding new baseless accusation…BUT at least you acknowleged that MQM and PML(N) were in Coalition…pls. tell me what has changed between MQM of 1998 and MQM of 2007…it was an opportunistic establishment party at that time as it is now…why a coalition when NS did not need it 1997….let me tell you my friend…to change PPP’s majority in sindh to minority..not to mention coalition of 1990…do not portray NS as a frishta…..or you mutwalas and piyalas are frishtas…NS and SS has lots of baggage…….
@ Paf123
lol now you make me laugh. first you call that MQM/establishment stooge Kamran Khan a “responsible reporter”, and then you quote Kulsoom Nawaz and present it as PML-N statement. what a joke, since when did Kulsoom Nawaz become the party spokesperson or the policy-maker? has she ever stood for elections? is she a party member? and i told you not to talk about AQ Khan, your azeem shaheed quaid wanted to hand over our national hero to foreigners and she wanted Americans to bomb our country. what kind of a traitor would want America to bomb Pakistan? and then she rubbed salt on the nation’s wounds by expressing her joy and satisfaction over the massacre of innocent little girls in Lal Masjid. shame on you and your azeem shaheed quaid.
@ Paf123
if you dislike NS’s alliance with PML-N in the past so much, why is your power-hungry party making alliances with it now? why dont you condemn your party joining hands with those terrorists?
@ econfused
she was at one point running the party when your AAzim NS was having siri pawas in saroor palace….jeddeh…nothing funny about the statement….check the facts….regarding stand up comedy… thanks I have a job
btw–what is this expression — Dude….sounds very psudo western…
@
paf123
you do not have any answer to my questions and now you are beating the drums of “rumors”..you do not have any courage to accept BB`s anti Pakistan statements..i am not making NS as frishta..i think you consider BB as devi , thats why you cannot condemn her statements regarding US intervention in Pakistan etc..i also think he was devi and very near to Phoolan Devi
@ Traffic
you are getting personal…this shows how “blind” you are in your hatred for PPP…so my friend….I have nothing else to say to you…your strategy is clear…when it is time to take responsiblity…either deny it or attack credibility of a reporter…no point in getting into discussion with you……
anyhow, anyone knows if the names of PML (N) ministers has been finalized who are going to join cabinet. How would you feel them taking oath from Mush?? pls. do not take it personally just asking a legitimate question how PML (N) supporters feel about it…haven’t seen anything on this issue on this forum..just curious…..
for once…i would appreciate if your answer is PPP bashing free…just for change….:-)
@sleepingnation
my last answer…because you are getting mad and furious….just want to say one thing….say whatever you want to say….BUT
the majority of Pakistanis who voted in the recent elections do not agree with you..ALAS!!
@ Paf123
lol mate you keep asking me how i feel about stands which the PPP itself espouses. you ask me about AQ Khan, joining hands with MQM and now about taking oath from Mush. how about you tell me your views about these issues? i would like to hear them.
i think ppp is more interested in working with musharaf. naveed qamer answers were more goal moal than clear cuts.
@Traffic
PPP considered lal masjid clerics the remanents of Zia who chose voilence and arms to express their views. The gazi brothers were using underage students (girls and women) for their purposes. They were condemned not only by BB, but whole pakistani nation through media including the Religious scholars of Pakistan.
PPP was questioning the sitting government’s direct involvement (in shape of Aijaz ul haq) in this drama which was then believed to be deliberately created by government to overshadow the judiciary issue. But the government was dead silent in first 5 months and whole media was demanding that if government is so quick to establish its writ in tribal areas or in dera bugti why it is so reluctant to operate against 2 gazi brothers right in the capital of Pakistan.
The Mohtarma Shaheed BB (aling with all other opposition leaders like IK etc) condemned the government for not taking the actions against gazi brothers in earlier stages and allowed them to pile up weapons in the Mosque and madarsah and demanded the immediate action. But the dictator then started rocketing the mosque and army’s commando group was not even to retreat when Gazi brothers were just asking safe passage and were retreating from all of their demands. Now let me come to my point NO ONE …INCLUDING BB….NO ONE SUPPORTED THIS BLIND ROCKETING OF LAL MASJID ESPECIALLY WHEN THERE WERE POOR FEMALE STUDENTS WHO WERE BRAINWASHED BY GAZI BROTHERS.
The first person to demand the operation against lal masjid clerics was IK as far as I remember! I can smell your hatered against PPP but it was not just her who demanded the operation against lal masjid which was turned into MASSACRE by imcompetent and corrupt government of PML Q.
@k3
Since the elections more then 100 killings in the streets of karachi have taken place, and if you see their policy statement these days it is “hamara mandate qion nahin accept kia ja raha”. In other words they are threatening the Govt to take them in government otherwise they will continue doing what they basically do, i.e., start killing people.
I am not sure u r frm PML N camp or not but if you are thn I hope u wud understand that as N has found taking oath from musharaf a hard pill to swallow, similarly talking with MQM for the larger intrest and peace of Sindh is the hard pill for MQM. MQM in opposition means compromising the peace of karachi. But still PPP has not included MQM in coalition, MQM is sitting in opposition benches.
If you happen to read the sindhi newspapers you would have find loads of criticism on PPP over having talks of possible coalition with MQM.
@sleeping nation
Do you honestly think you can be in such an authority to render such a sweeping statement that no PPP jiyala can criticise PPP? Does it occur you for a single moment that you let your tongue flow in the hatered and typical mind set? Do you assess your behavior of naming with your narrow knowledge those as abnormal (illiterate, fool, stupid etc) who have different views then yours?
PPP has Alhamdulilah unprecedented jiyalas, who has not only shed their blood for the party but also has Left or resigned from the party in sheer act of criticism (the few examples being Shafqat Mahmood, mairaj Khalid, etc). It is mostly muslim leagees, who are famous for their lotaism.
How many times you have criticised NS to lie about his signed documents to beg pardon, or when he stabbed ARD and formed APDM, or when he so quickly ditched IK, Qazi or Achakzai (though I congratulated NS that he has soon realized on the advise of PPP what blunder he is going to make).
This is not what we need guys, this is exactly what Pakistan does NOT need and sadly, even though i keep getting told here not to be too pessimistic, it seems glaringly obvious that the cracks are already beginning to show in this “coalition” of the two most powerful parties of the country, and the work hasn’t even begun! Yes, truly historical times….
Politics, whether you like it or not, is a “dirty” business more often than not, and “deals” are struck all so often that it comes as no surprise that a “deal” is probably being done right now.( too many delays).
What will come out of this”deal” will have huge impact on the whole “coalition” together to free judiciary, ousting of Musharraf, and kicking USA into touch etc.
The PPPP and PML-N need to stand firm and work together if they really want to repay faith put in their hands by the voters on Feb 18, let’s hope they do for the country’s sake. But the signs are ominous…….
@Fahim23
i take your words that ppp has resentment about coalition with mqm but i still believe they dont need to do it. they have enough strength in sindh assembly and they are very strong in center. I am pmln voter but i also have lot of respect for ppp and i would like ppp not to shake hands with mqm and take some bold steps.
@k3
It is not this issue that PPP needs MQM to form the government in Sindh, but still they are talking with MQM is solely because if MQM is in opposition they will start ruining the peace of Sindh. As I wrote earlier just in about 50 days more than 100 ppl mostly from opponent parties of MQM have been murdered in the streets of karachi. At this point of time PPP cannot afford to start a crack down in karachi and this will mean MQM will have enough time to halt the economic hub of the country and eventually will further deteriorate the already worst situation of economy of our country.
Having all said that, PPP still has not formed any coalition with MQM neither at provincial nor at national level. PPP is having talks with MQM. If we have no problem in talking with India, or terrorists of tribal areas, then we should not have any problem talking with MQM. Especially when MQM is also a political reality which gets genuine ethnic support of urdu speaking community of sindh.
@ Traffic
again not a straight answer….well you have blasted ppp for deal with mush and god knows what…you have said that NS fought against mush for the last eight years (I am ready, for the sake of keeping this discussion to the point, to forget his previous deal with mush) but just really wanted to find out NS supporters’ views on His party members taking oath from Mush…just trying to get a straight answer on a recent decision….
Re mush PPP considers him a remanant of dictatorship and always has taken a rational path of talking and bringing nation on the road to democarcy..and PPP’s struggle has paid dividends too..mush is now cornered…..with no power…slowly but surely he is going to go…now please give your side of story..especially NS has catagorically said that he is not ready to work with Mush…how do you feel about this decision…
@fahim23
way to go….
@ Paf 123
@ Traffic
Why you guys are wasting your energies in point scoring, when your leaders AZ NS are enjoying the partnership.
PPP and PMLN are 2 different parties with different agends, but they have some common agenda aswell.
Musharaf cannot be friend with either party.
IF either party fails in coalation then it will be aloss of democracy.
Give parliament 1-3 months , then you can have a better opinion.
NS and AZ
are not angels .
We should support democratic forces.
@ppp and pmln supporter
i dont know why ppp and pmln supporter are arguing among themselves. I think the enemy is common which is mqm, musharraf and establishment and we haven’t beaten them so we should save our energy and fight with them.
I was enjoying the bad cop good cop game that was being played by ppp and pmln with establishment but you guys started arguing with each other for no reason
i hates when ppls says that mqm is political reality. they r terrors and kill ppls in karachi if they not in gov. simply to fail the gov. if AZ s talking to mqm because 100 ppls are been killed in karachi in last few weeks then i am sorry but AZ is being black maled. i think instead to talk to mqm AZ shoul expose them so nation know the truth.
i only want to say to peoples who are raising the point about pmln taking oath from mush is that there is no harm in doing that because they r doing this to restore the judges. it is kind a agreement between ppp and pmln, pmln will support ppp and ppp will support pmln to restore judges, so they have to take oath from mush. BTW by giving oath to pmln or ppp the loser is mush…………
@fahim23
get you facts straight about lal masjid. IK was among other leaders who opposed the massacre in Apc. i think ppp, mqm was the only party who supported that mass murder of their own citizens. i do remember when BB said that it was all for good; although why people consider BB as shaheed? ( dont you think that america wont like it) about ghazi brother used someone, don’t you remember when he said and allowed that those who wants to leave can leave. by the way,
why dont govt. writ gets challenge at karachi, i dont have to repeat the story, 75 people got dead in this month only.
there are not more than 3-4 people amongst this website users who support PPP`s all wrong polices and defend all stances of PPP…..
There are two news from daily express
” Ch.Nisar said that “MQM nay karaci mein pichlay 7 saal say qatal o gharat ka bazar gharam kar rakha hay aur agar MQM ko govt mein shamil kiya gaya to hum apna lahya aamal khud tah karein gein” he further added that mqm Mush kay Jaraim mein braber ki shareek hay”
second news is about rstoratin of judiciary
Expresss reported without quoting the name of PML (N) leader that
“Agar 30 din mein aadlia ko bahal na kiya gaya to PML (N) wazarton say alag ho jaye gi”
both of these statements are very welcoming and i pary and i wish that PML (N) continue their pressure on PPP and do not let them free…..otherwise PPP as per their traditions will make some money , transfer in foriegn countries and country will remain as lawless american colony
I think this what we are going to see in future in Pakistan. Truth and Reconcilation Commisssion would setup where Gen Mush would tell all the truth about the thing he has done (Scripted) and PMLN and PPP would forgive him and would continue with the Presidency for next five year. Some with see great Hala Bola from politician and Gen and Inteligent officer who would telling all the bad thing that did every one would be give pardon with promise from agencies and politician and Army that they will behave and now let build (Loot) the Pakistan.
So I think next two year talat Bhai and Gang (Hamid Mir) would very busy bring us this stories. Good Luck Pakistan.
@sleepingnation, As I am very naive would please let us know how one man squad Z.Bhutto was able to break a country like Pakistan.
@ Fahim23
i remember imran khan only asked the govt to cut the supply of electricity etc. to the masjid so that everyone would come out. however everyone condemned the massacre of innocent little girls except BB and Altaf. these two pseudo-secular leaders were trying to please their foreign masters by praising the bombing of masjid and killing Muslim girls. BB openly praised the action afterwards and said it was need of country. shame on her. and if ghazi brothers had kidnapped or brainwashed the girls, why didnt a single girl come out and sya so? why do all still support them? shame on you and your “azeem shaheed quaid”.
MQM is an ethnocentric fascist party, its past is full of terrorist activities. They want the biggest possible share in the pie and when they don’t get what they want they become anti-state and terrorize its citizens. Either you give us what we want or our leader would go to India and spew venom against Pakistan. I don’t know what does AZ have in his mind but PPP will betray its workers if it forms a coalition government with MQM in Sindh. The hands of MQM terrorists are red with the blood of 50 innocent citizens of Pakistan. Farooq Sattar said in Hamid Mir’s Capital Talk that 14 workers of MQM were killed on the 12th of May that was a clear lie, but unfortunately both Ishaq Dar and Naweed Qamar didn’t take notice of his lies. MQM should be kept out of any future government and if they resort to terrorism then do another Naseerullah to them.
Sooner or later we will have to deal with MQM. In my opinion the time is maube not right just now. We must wait, but in between I hope someone is building a database containing all MQM gangsters with pictures, names, addresses, proofs etc. At an appropiate time a prescision operation should be launched, where every gangster is caught in a short span of time. Let them have a fair trial afterwards………a fair trial will definetly lead to some broken necks in the loop.
/Saqib
@Traffic
Every one supported the operation against lal masjid but no one could possibly support the Massacre! Not even AH has balls to support the massacre.
APC was held way beyond, initially when government was doing nothing and Gazi brothers were kidnapping police men or other ppl and burning the CDs the most vocal person was IK who was putting his case arguing government should establish its writ and this is just drama created by Government to over shadow the Judiciary issue. Every body was saying “Do something, do something” and at the end what the government did,,,killing innocent students along with insane Gazi brothers. It was only in final week when special group commandos surrounded lal masjid and heavt armoured was put in place and all media was banned then Every body got sympathetic with lal masjid because of 1000s of underage girl students.
@Saqib
MQM must be brought to an end, and it must pay the prices of her unpredented crime in the history of Pakistan. One way is to start a crack down, which will end up further increasing sympathies for MQM and other way is to engage them for some time and then try them when substantial evidence is gathered in teh court of law.
This will open the eyes of even those who genuinely think MQM is their savoir and is fighting for their suppressed rights.
@ Fahim23
who is this “everybody” who supported the Lal masjid massacre? please give me one statement of Imran Khan or Nawaz Sharif or Qazi Hussain or Asfandyar Wali or any other political leader who praised the Lal Masjid massacre. maybe imran khan had called for shutting down electricity supply but he condemned the massacre afterwards. however your azeem shaheed quaid openly praised the massacre of innocent girls after the sad event. i was watching capital talk yesterday and sherry rehman was sitting with Q-league’s faisal saleh hayat and MQM guy and she was praising the last govts action on Lal Masjid along with those two, while PML-N’s Saad Rafique said we will build jamia hafsa again and carry out enquiry into the massacre. these three parties belong together because all represent power-hungry people who will sell their souls to the devil for power. shame on your quaid and your party.
@Traffic
I said Everybody supported the lal masjid operation but no body supported the Massacre!
The whole media of Pakistan, civil society of pakistan and opposition parties including IK was demanding to take some actions against lal masjid clerics.
You have been repeatedly accusing not only BB but even to me by quoting me as saying “Everybody supported the Massacre”. If you have to just oppose PPP or its supported just because you don’t like PPP, then nothing can be done, and in this case any arguments will too be useless. Just quote me one single statement of BB afterwards in which she praised the government for their massacre in lal masjid.
I have watched too that program. And it is so unfortunate just to prove your point you start twisting the statements and lying. Sherry rehman agrred to set up indepent judicial enquiry of that issue by adding that the enquiry should be carried out from both sides. Especially, we need to address how come there were stocks of weapons in the Madrassah and Mosque. (and I would wish to find out why Aijaz ul haq released one of the gazi brothers when he was caught red handed carrying AK 47′s into the mosques in 2004). She corrected one of the guests by saying that both the initial loose of lal masjid clerics and final crackdown or operation turned into massacre of innocent kids were WRONG!
No sane person can possible support the massacre of anybody!
@Traffic
Shame on you too!
@dmin
Can you please verify the IP of :
People on March 29th, 2008 10:43 am
I bet this is someone I know, a definite case of fake ID. LOL
@admin, can you start topic about corruption specially selling of Police Stations.
infact you know him well also
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