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April 5, 2008
Zardari Issues Charge-Sheet against Deposed Judges
Pakistan People`s Party (PPP) Co-chairman Asif Ali Zardari has issued a long charge-sheet against the deposed superior court judges, saying they never came to his rescue and were responsible for his eight years in jail.
In the clearest indication that the PPP may not stand by the Murree Declaration to restore the judges, the PPP leader told his central executive committee in Naudero that he was not interested in the restoration of personalities but wanted a judicial reforms package.
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It is really a shocking news. But at least PPP is making itself clear in its intentions. I cosider PPPs actions as back stabbing in the people of Pakistan. This includes visisting terrorist Altaf Hussain as well.
But what can you expect from criminals.
Simply i can describe my frustration by saying ” shame on you PPP”
Damn ypu Zardari :@
Very dissapointing and worrying. At last AZ came out clear on what he wants. If politicians keep on using excuses from the past, then we will keep on having the “doctrine of necessity” and keep the status quo on the mess we are witnessing in Pakistan. PPPP better ready themselves for the wrath of the lawyers, judges, APDM and the awaaam……..about 20 days to go before a possible showdown with PPPP.
/Saqib
aakhir billi thalay say bahar aa gaye……very well done zardari…….show your eveil face to everybody….Munafiks are really dangerous and i think zardari is doing right so that people see realy evil face of PPP
Admin,
The name of Zardari in the heading is misspelled.
/Saqib
this is just shocking…but not surprising coming from Zardari,…but a bit frightening…alllah khair kare mulk mein….I knew he had something up his sleeve.
PPP has been victim of biased judiciary in the past e.g. Bhutto’s judicial murder etc.
Now if they stand against the judicary this will show that they deserved what they got and should be ready to get more in future.
There can be two possibilites for Zardari’s stand against judges. One is that he was to get benfir from NRO and therefore save its orignator i.e. Mush. The second could be that he is deceving MUSH and Lawers and at the end restore judicary and claim that he has single handedly shown the courage to restore judges and claim the credit for it. Currently this credit lies with lawers, APDM and PML-N.
yaqub2005
PML-N is with APDM or PPP, they would have to decide right now. And right now they are more tilted towards their new buddy PPP, right from taking part in elections, be a part of cabinet, acceptance of MQM be a part of government in centre.
I would just request to PMLN be clear atleast once throughout their career.
why are all bhatta-khore supporters fanning the flames? didn’t he just declare himself to be bhai=bhai with you guys?
Why are you so excited??/ tch tch thc.. zardari bhai nay bahut buraa kiya..
Just wait, zardari will put a pole up yer tuchases
P.S. Kamran Khan claimed that “TannooN manooN phoolooN ki pattiyaaN nichawar ki gaieeN”
W7F? there were two faat ladies with naali cleaning buckets throw 10 patti’s each.. kanjoos makhi choos.. lekin Kamran “Khan” thinks all the flower sellers ran out of flowers in Karachi.. hahaha
frikkin A**-**** …. I always mistrusted zardari but thought his initial statements after BB assasination was commendable. But he has proven that my GUT feeling about this stupid, greedy SOB was correct…. GAWD… this is the worst possible thing that he could do.. I am so friggin dissapointed. May Allah help us from such crazy mf
@TK
what else we can expect from Mr 10%. I must say he is really a genius, an evil genius, the way he plays his cards is very impressive. Zardari can claim that founding a commission was according to Charter of Democracy and that would be true too.
and i know that whatever Zardari and Co do, PPP supporter will still support their party and beside Zardari never made any promises about judiciary during campaign.
lol, I’d seen people on this site PRAISING this person and now he’s showing his true colors. Now what’s your opinion about him?
@taimurdar
means we don’t have prejudice and if he does good we support him and if bad then we don’t.
after all we are the educated internet using ppl
@engineer
I think AZ has made miscalculation this time. I think many will leave PPPP and join other parties especially PTI and PML-N (if they are steadfast).
/Saqib
@Saqib
dude you don’t understand PPP voter, they will not vote for PPP if they are really unhappy with it but they don’t go and support other parties.
and don’t underestimate Zardari, these political parties know how to do things, remember what nawaz sharif did with sajjad ali shah.
@engineer
I think you right about Sindh. We won’t see any change from that corner since they are “worshipping” the Bhutto dynasty, but I still believe that this is a new era for most parts of Pakistan. Now you find a more conscious voters than ever before, and that will bring a change, inshallah!
I refuse to be a pessimist;-)
/Saqib
@ Asif
PML-N has taken right decisions until now. They participated in elections and won significat seats to play a role for judiciary and principled democracy. They were forced to join cabinet on a single point to restore judges. They have accepted hard ministries like Finance, Railway and Educaion. Railway minister (Mehtab) has traveled in economy class to see the problems faced by ordinary people and he has given target to Railway officers to reduce the deficit to zero by end of 2008 with out increasinf fare. PPP has chosen easy and power ministries like Wapda, Foreign Affair and Interior. In Punjba they have already started appointing honest people like Chief Secretary Javed Mehmood.
PML-N has opposed MQM inclusion with a strong voice as comapred to any other party. But problem is that PPP has no respect for their Sindh workers. They are worried that KHI peace will be destroyed by MQM. My opinion is that MQM should not be included in Sindh as if they destroy the peace in KHI then Sindh govt and media will be able to show their true face and enable people of KHI to finish their political role.
PML-N has a tilt towards APDM but problem is that JI can not be trusted very easily due to their suspected links with establishment. PML-N’s current power sharing with PPP is based on the single goal of sending establishment out of politics. If PPP joins hands with establishment then PML-N will be the biggest benficiary as they can clain that they had cooperated with PPP but PPP has broken its promises. Once this is achieved then PML-N and PPP will face each other in next election.
@saqib
yeah lets not be a pessimist and hope PPP will restore the judges
@admn
when r u going to post videos?
@yaqub2005
My friend, if I was in PML-N shoes I wouldn’t be complaining about difficult ministries. I would look at the task ahead to explore opportunities. Difficult ministries are equal to big opportunities to excel in the political field. You get a chance to show which stuff you are made of.
If your assessment about easy ministries is true then PPPP has the dull job. What are they going to prove? BTW I don’t think they have all the easy ministries. Do you think the power ministry is easy? Not in my view.
/Saqib
yaqub2005
So PML-N is getting the credit for all good & blaming PPP for all the bad in this coalition.
Then the Job is well done.
@Asif
man what u got aganist PMLN, just because your imran khan is not part of this assembly, you guys are playing spoil and propagating all the bad things about PPP and PMLN. if this coalition succeeds then this would be the end of Imran khan politics and you guys know that too.
well you dont need to blame PMLN that imran khan is not in assembly, Imran has himself to blame for this. The stupid guy teared his nomination papers like this will solve country all problems
PPP got the highest number of seats and highest number of votes. In its election menifesto, and campaign PPP never made any promise of restoration of judges. Also PPP and PML-N agreed in charter of democracy about independence of judges and removal of PCO judges.
Other main political forces including ANP and MQM also have similar stance on judges befoe and after elections.
NS also knows about the worth of deposed judges. The same judges did nothing when NS, Javed Hashmi, SS and many more were rotting in jails. NS and Javed Hashmi even did not bother to appeal in front of these ‘great angel judges. These judges did nothng when SS and NS were deported twice.
The current judiacial crisis is an internal ‘civil war’ within oppressive establishment. This internal rift had made the establishent very weak. Now establishment wants to create a rift between the political forces. I hope NS will not get into the trap set by establishment agents like losers Qazi and IK. These people failed to lure NS into boycotting the elections (thanks to Shaheed BB). Now they are out again. NS knows how sincere BB and PPP are in the matter of democracy.
The charge sheet attributed to Zardari is not issued by him. Nor Ansar Abbasi was present in any internal meetings of Zardari. He included some true facts from past to make his story credible. People like Judge Wajihuddin (now posing as an angel) were stooges of Mush when they were treating PPP leadership inhumanly.
I believe Zardari wlll follow the Muree declaration in letter and spirit. Let parliament decide how to handle the ‘restoration’ issue. They should not let losers dictate the elected parliament.
@engineer
“The stupid guy teared his nomination papers like this will solve country all problems”
Inappropriate language…..Please refrain from that! What if somebody uses the same kind of words about people you hold in high esteem?
/Saqib
sure go ahead. I am interested in being correct not about being politically correct
engineer
could you speak about the topic & discuss what I have said or you to wanna bash me. Then go ahead.
So you guys are here to end IKs politics no problem man go ahead. I would wish that justice would reach to the door of masses.
Hey engineer
You are saying IK is stupid just because you don’t like my comments. Good you are an engineer like the other great one over here.
@Asif
yes I had to involved IK bcos you PTI supporters are spreading germs of disappointments all over the forums.
In your opinion all the judges (in oppostion to the Dogar court) and the lawyers are all stupids? The initial stand of PML-N was also stupidity?
Is this true?
They lawyers advocated a boycott of the elections. The present situation shows that the stand maybe was right.
/Saqiib
engineer
What about AZ who issued the charge sheet? oh he is spreadng love & peace.
And the guys who are commenting on his actions are spreading disaapointment.
Well you are the winner, I surrender to your logic
@Saqib
tariq mahmood
aitzaz ahsan
hamid khan
even kurd
all the prominent leaders in lawyer movement said boycott was a mistake so why don’t u accept it.
The issues are still their as it is, so to say boycott was a mistake is a bit too early, especially with these new developments.
You are an engineer don’t get away with the wind.
What ever happened to ‘forget the past focus on future’
whatever happened to Peoples wishes!!
Why did he say at Nine Zero : Maafi maangi bhi maafi di bhi ”
Sameless Hypocrite Politician — Ulloo ke patthay !
Very disturbing and dangerous development. If this is true then Mr Zardari is a big hypocrit. He is trying to betray millions of Pakistanis who want change in the country. I hope, the other high level leaders of PPP, who are sensible and smart, will revolt and force AZ to live upto his promises made to the people of Pakistan.
At the end of the day, PML-N shall be the winner.
The greatest benefit PPP has is they can disown Asif Zardari any time they wish to. Since he has no value amongst the PPP leaders. One day or the other, PPP will get rid of him. Then we will ask PPP supporters about Asif Zardari and I am sure they will say he got what he deserved.
@engineer
I am talking about lawyers (common) stand on the issue and not any individual stand. Those you are referring to also complied to the common stand. Didn’t they?
Normally I would say that it is not a good idea to boycott elections, but since the circumstances were special in these elections (the lawyers would be isolated) then PTI did support a boycott.
/Saqib
@asif
the reason Imran khan didnt participate was because he said the he does not expect free and fair election from Musharraf. That was the center idea behind his boycott. Elections were relatively fair ( the kind of fair one can expect in pk).
and there is no denying in the fact if IK was part of this assembly then he could have a louder voice on judiciary then it is now.
I must say that I am guilty of praising Zardari and his statesmanship but he has proved to be otherwise and I am very very disappointed by it. He is his own worst enemy. If he does not restore the judiciary in a years time Musharraf would dissolve this assembly by 52 B and there would be no one to listen to PPP woes. He is making a very very mistake of his life.
He is turning the whole of Punjab and Sindh against him because after all Sindhis dont like Mohajirs because of what they are doing in Karachi. PPP is also going to be split in two and if Aitazaz Ahsan is thrown out the party would be split in two. It was one thing about Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto and BB and about Zardari if he prefers Karachi over Punjab he would lose both.
Has he forgotten how Farooq Sattar and Khushbakth Shujjat won by rigging against his candidates in Karachi. His biggest sin would be handing over Karachi to these ghundas and he would be never forgiven for that.
In another development American Ambassador has met with Altaf Hussain in London. Isnt this open intereference in the independence and sovereignity of Pakistan.
@engineer
“yes I had to involved IK bcos you PTI supporters are spreading germs of disappointments all over the forums.”
Do you bother to clarify this gem of a statement?
What do you mean?
Is this a site for PML-N supporters only? Or should we develop a culture where we have the ability to debate politics and learn to respect other viewpoints? You know….real democratic mind set
If you think it is a PML-N website, where people from other political parties (PPPP, PTI etc.) are not allowed to spread their “germs”, then please ask @dmin to show it clearly on the website. In that case I assure you that you will be left in peace and not see me again on this website.
/Saqib
@engineer
“and there is no denying in the fact if IK was part of this assembly then he could have a louder voice on judiciary then it is now.”
Here you show that you are a real engineer:-) Logical conclusion.
I agree with you, but please remember that Musharraf had planned otherwise. BB was assassinated and then the scenario changed totally.
/Saqib
engineer
I respect IK not for that how much manipulative he is in politics BUT how much hes there to change the traditional politics of CULT & hatered to issue based, from pragmatic to principled one, & so on.
Educating the civil society he has a big & undeniable role to participate in active politics. Hes bringing the people to active politics than anyone else. Hes on the streets with them even they are very few in numbers. Even most of the guys on net talking about politics is not due to the same old traditional politicians but IK , you can just rewind this forum too for a real proof.
@c hussain
I think it is not interference. For the good of Pakistan, she would be suggesting her to stay in UK.
@c hussain
The Yankees are once again showing their (well known) double standards by meeting Altaf the king of terrorists
Our politicians are still eager to accommodate them in every possible way
/Saqib
@Asif
what you just said was fiction from your mind, i think if it is up to you, you will give 9 March ‘NO’ credit to IK. but dream on man, life is easy that way
If judges are not angels. Zardari is not an angel too. From where did he get these accounts in Switzerland? From where he got that sirray palace in UK. He has officially recognized in legal documents he purchased it. His lawyer admits he had an oil company. Which we can easily understand it was a front for U.N oil for food fraud which was related to Iraq. You can continue forever and list won’t end on Zardari. Same goes for Shaheed Benezeer.
We also know ZAB was not an angel too. He imposed emergency with in hours of approval of 1973 constitution. He was not that fond of Mujeeb becoming all power prime minister in 1970 he wanted to share power. Although I believe main blame goes to army for 1971 Bangladesh creation.
Point is nobody is angel, Nawaz Sharif, Imran Khan, Nawaz Sharif. I am not an angel so it’s not my right to expect others to be angels.
But I trust Ch. Iftekhar that he will do justice now. I trust Nawaz Sharif that he will make right decisions now. I also trust Imran Khan. Although they all made blunders in Past. If they won’t do what “I WANT” I’ll vote them out by my vote.
With zardari issue is that although I trusted him after elections, he is slowly loosing the trust.
@engineer
9.th March “NO”: The credit goes to CJP (IMO). It was him, who withstood the immense pressure from the Zaalim GHQ.
/Saqib
Why don’t we wait for 28 more days? We don’t care about AZ or NS. We will deal with them if they don’t fulfil their promise. If we can fight with Mad Kutta Mush, we can give a hard time to those who need our votes.
After all this was a report by a kid called Rauf Clasara. This doesn’t mean I am a Zardari fan. I am just pointing to many factual errors in Clasara’s articles.
Well let me tell you people one thing, if the restoration does not happen then it would be the people who boycotted laughing at morons who participated in these mush operated elections!
@saqib
that is exactly why he didnt need to tear off his papers. if he would have submitted papers he could have boycotted election any time before election but by tearing it he could not participated in it even if the gound realities were changed. and that was stupid about this action. it was more symbolism then an astute move. JI boycotted elections but even then they have submitted the papers. politics is not about closing doors, that is army style of doing politics.
“please remember that Musharraf had planned otherwise. BB was assassinated and then the scenario changed totally”
that is why you got to leave the doors open. he should participate in by election and he is not doing it just because that makes his previous decision wrong.
@Saqib
I am not complaining about difficult ministires. I am only saying that they have accepted the challenges in a good faith. PPP has opted for power and projection.
I remember that in 1945 govt, the Congress gave Finance ministry to PML’s Rana Liaqat Ali with the intention that he will fail and the balim will go to PML. But Rana Liaqat Ali ran the minitry so well that Congress was surprised. So again Ishaq Dar has a chance to prove that PML-N has the right people in the party for challenging jobs. My only worry is that PPP will try to pull the legs.
Wapda is a powerful ministry. With the intention already clear that Kala Bagh Dam to be bulit by PPP then no difficult decision to be taken. Only IPPs will be set up as done previously in 90’s by PPP. IPPs run on oil and the import bill will increase and also the IPPS owners blackmail the govt. WAPDA has two roles to play, one is for Electricity and other for Irrigation as Water and Power Devp Authrity stands for. Let us see what Raja Pervez Ashraf does on this front as he is first time minister.
@engineer
Let’s not put too much in tearing off the papers. It is only a symbolic act.
Let’s instead get the real facts straight. It was PPPP who spoiled the game. Had they Accepted an election boycott then PML-N would also have done that since they had already made a commitment on that. Where is the difference between PTI and PML-N? The difference is that PPPP (BB) was able to convince PML-N to participate, and PTI stood firm and stranded with it’s stand. PTI is a party of principles. A party which wants to bring a change in Pakistan politics not necessarily by being in power. That IK has already proven by his single seat. Look at the awareness about a free and independent judiciary. Which other party can show such a record?
/Saqib
@yaqub2005
I don’t think it is that easy with the power ministry. There is a huge shortage of power and the problem is felt amongst the public. PPPP had created a lot of problems with IPP last time they had power. Do you remember the price for electricity compared to the normal price? As far as i know it was significantly different:-(
/Saqib
Two important news of the day!!!
1) American Amb in Pakistan has met with Altaf Kalia in London today. Why?
2) Arbab Rahim got beaten up in Karachi today… hahah…
@saqib
“PTI is a party of principles. A party which wants to bring a change in Pakistan politics not necessarily by being in power. That IK has already proven by his single seat. Look at the awareness about a free and independent judiciary. Which other party can show such a record?”
dude IK was not responsible for awareness about a free and independent judiciary. i dont know how do u guys got that idea? Practically other then appearing in political shows he did not have any contribution.
if 9 march was the turning point then CJ said in one of his interview he learnt to say NO by reading Javed hashmi books
Is PML-N changing stance on judges too????
Read this!!!
However, they noted that the leadership had also discussed the option of talks with Iftikhar Chaudhry after his restoration on his politicised role during the lawyers’ movement. They said that several PML-N leaders had said that it was only natural that the CJ would develop a “soft corner” for all the lawyers who had been at the forefront of the lawyers’ movement. The leadership said that the chief justice’s modus operandi would have to be re-examined if such a situation arose.
http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=200845\story_5-4-2008_pg1_4
@engineer
Then we have two different opinions. It is a fact that IK has voiced his opinion about a free and independent judiciary for a decade. If you don’t recognize that then it’s up to you. In a free and democratic world you are entitled to have your own opinion- right or wrong.
About CJP getting his inspiration from Javed Hashmi…I don’t know, but I would say that to me Javed Hashmi seems like a decent man.
/Saqib
@aahmad
Don’t believe ur source; after all the source is Najam sethi’s Daily Times.
@all
Funny thing was people start to comment on this news only when it was posted a separate thread. While it was posted last night in 3 other threads. Its just some people get it the second day.
I am still of the opinion that PML-N and PPP are playing Good Cop, Bad Cop game. We still have 25 more days, and in he end People of Pakistan wil lbe victorious.
Agencies and Mushy lovers are building sand castles, and those will be blown away.
@pejamistri has written a better analysis in his blog. I know @pejamistri some time goes to extremes of conspiracies and wishful thinking. I have to agree that in the end Judges wil be restored MINUS the few. Iftikhar Ch. will be back at the CJ seat. Dogar wil be gone.
http://pejamistri.wordpress.com/2008/04/05/why-should-i-trust-ppp/
@saqib
cool, good that u realized that there is difference of opinion on that, PPP claims that they sacrifice more for the cause of judiciary and there are claims form musharraf that he is responsible for free and independent media and even i remember after CJ case decision, pmlq minister gave the credit to govt about the independent judiciary(which was a big joke) and list goes on.
the point it is you said that thing as a fact not as an opinion. please when you say things about IK and the “great” changes he made, don’t put it like a fact put it as opinion and try to make your case with your arguments. after all you are not on PTI forums, it is pkpolitics
@engineer, would please ask IK to fulfill his promise to bring Altaf Hussain to the Royal Courts of UK.
@all
Ch. Ahmed Mukhtar has clearified his statement, which was misquoted like 100s of times.
Source: http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=200845\story_5-4-2008_pg1_4
http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2008/04/05/story_5-4-2008_pg1_4
I bet that’s why as muslims we are strictly forbidden to spread rumours.
Apologies for question marks…. I pasted his statement which was in urdu from BBC website!
@engineer
What’s all the fuss about? This is getting a little bit weird:-(
You are trying to twist the words. It is still a FACT in my opinion that IK has voiced his opinion about a free and independent judiciary for a decade! Is that difficult to understand?
/Saqib
@engineer
o man you have no idea what a politicaly astute move it was by Imran to not to participate in these elections and be part of this assembly. Imran needs no assembly to be heard. I wish I could take the trouble of making my point by historical references, examples, political theories and other means, but too lazy and lack inspiration for such an effort. But one thing should suffice for right now. How many seats did ANP carry in 2002 and how many now, though they are mostly restricted to a single province, while PTI is not. You just watch how Imran and his party will come out on the national scene with a bang. And that day, my friend, is not very far.
@Fahim23
Your link doesn’t work.
/Saqib
@saqib
kinnare on April 5th, 2008 10:04 pm
@engineer, would please ask IK to fulfill his promise to bring Altaf Hussain to the Royal Courts of UK.
could you please respond? we don’t hear any thing on that case?
death of BB brought sympathy vote for PPP otherwise, their petty stance plus deal with Mushraff would have resulted in humiliating defeat in elections.
In messed up law and order situation, terrorism, suicide bombings, etc etc, people of pakistan came out to vote AGAINST MUSHRAFF on 18th feb and PPP crooks and swindlers are trying to sabotage peoples’ mendate, proving once again the traiters point of view that, politicians can be nothing but curroupt and pakistan needs military rulers like mush. Shame on PPP.
PPP thinks that people will swallow anything if they tell them that the act is for empowering parliament and that if parliamentary committee decides against CJ, people will accept the step because this time it will be by their own selected parliament and not by single dictator who was already very unpopular at the time when he deposed superior court judges.
One thing being forgotten by pathatic and curroupt PPP leadership is media and lawyers movement and one prominent party (PMLN) standing firmly against mush. as correctly pointed out by MM in Bolta Pakistan. Sher Jaye ga tu sub ko sath le ke jaye ga aur wapis phir akela he aaye ga.
btw, some PPP supporters point out that its AZ’s policies and not PPP’s in general. well my guess is, if BB were alive, she would have done the same thing. Her methodology would have been much better than AZ as she was better devil in disguise.
@engineer
http://www.thenews.com.pk/top_story_detail.asp?Id=13946
Let’s see how the governement (PML-N is a part of it) behaves. Will they give access to the British police?
/Saqib
@engineer
http://www.thenews.com.pk/daily_detail.asp?id=104721
“Cheema said that it was very important for his leader to visit the port city at a time when reconciliation was the buzzword. “Ours is a principled stand and we will not move an inch from it,” he remarked when asked if it was possible for Imran to set aside his plan to pursue the case against MQM leader.”
/Saqib
@saint “one prominent party (PMLN) standing firmly against mush…”
don’t be so hopeful, read between the lines…
“However, they noted that the leadership had also discussed the option of talks with Iftikhar Chaudhry after his restoration on his politicised role during the lawyers’ movement. They said that several PML-N leaders had said that it was only natural that the CJ would develop a “soft corner” for all the lawyers who had been at the forefront of the lawyers’ movement. The leadership said that the chief justice’s modus operandi would have to be re-examined if such a situation arose.”
@Saqib
That’s the link:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/urdu/pakistan/story/2008/04/080405_ppp_pmln_sen.shtml
I messed up in my last posts, sorry for that.
@saqib
“Let’s see how the governement (PML-N is a part of it) behaves. Will they give access to the British police?”
what access are you talking about???
Imran made the promise when mush was in power and fully supporting Mqm, I beleive that Imran said in 2 months, Altaf will be behind bars, he never said anything about getting proofs from govt. He said he has all the evidence. I can point you to the videos if you like. Now Imran is putting that thing on govt so now again he can blame PPP and PMLN
Lesson: easy to make claims but when things has to be done practially it is all together a different ball game
it is very easy to make statements about judiciary even fazal-ur-rehman is doing that but because they know that there is no responsibility on them, they can make as much as statements and they will not have the burden of them
@ baig_lahori
Till 1991 majority of Pakistanis thought MQM was representative of the poor and they were a good model. Altaf’s speech was good in that. In fact, NS wanted to bring him to National level and we all thought that this is the right way.
They turned out to be Bhatta Khore and criminals. They were exposed. I don’t need to say more. We all know that.
They are such a big Munafiq. Some of them pretend here to be ‘Sindhi’ (forgotten one) and some pretend to be ‘lahori’ with a twist of Baig while they are just don’t have the courage to admit their love of Altaf.
And MQM truly represent 98% people (i.e Army and Feudal Q league) in the same way Hitler represented Jew.
@engineer
Take it easy….I am not blaming PML-N or PPPP for not providing access to the British police. We need not to discuss this yet. When time comes the British police will ask for cooperation from the Pakistani government and I suppose they will give access to what is required by the British police. I suppose it is a formality. Then we will see who is right and who is wrong.
And don’t forget that Altaf has powerful friends in Pakistan and abroad. In Pakistan the Musharraf government has protected him and abroad the enemies of Pakistan (USA and UK).
/Saqib
Finally he is coming out of his artificial skin: An eye opener for civil society. He is exposing himself rather quicly and wil continue doing so if kept “ronconciling” wid pro Mush forces.
100% fair to God Allmighty: Initially people wer possitively surprised the way Z moved forward intelligently and posed himself as anti-esteb froce. Since he joined hands wid MQM, (and lately the suport from Q league) the same persons hav started really doubting his integrity and the impression of him being the extension of pro-esteblishment is getting stronger. Another nail came form our defence minister who came to kno suddenly that Mush was an esset and so shod b preserved. Better he keeps this immortal asset in his “service Industries” forever.
People are watching every move very very closely: Another Feb 18 will not b far away.
engineer
Being engineer I love dreaming & fulfilling the dreams of rest of the world. Only dreams change the world not your pathetic status quo pragmatic approach.
You dno’t dream so you are happy with this CULT. And I don’t mind that either.
But keep in mind only dreams has changed the world not the pragmatic ess-owls.
@maninarfi, PPP never siad the they want to restored Judicary we alway said we want independ Judicary but because PMLN wanted it PPP agreed to it.
According to the logic that many people on this board has CJ Iftakar a corrupt person. So it is hard for PPP to understand why should corrupt CJ Iftakar should be restored.
MQM is realty in Sindh and to govern Pakistan and Sind we need Karachi to govern. If Karachi is closed down Pakistan is closed down and MQM controll Karachi. So PPP need MQM and MQM need PPP.
BB and PPP alway maintain that we are ready to work with Gen Mush if takes down his uniform so what Mian Mukthar said nothing new. If PPP can use Gen Mush why not after all that is politics.
Do you rember when Gen Mush over throw NS people in Lahore distributed sweets.
@Asif
hahaha dude, so at least you acknowledge that PTI supporters are dreamers, unfortunately some of us has to live and deal with real world.
the worst kind of politician is the one who raises ppl hope and then let them down. but then your defend would be that was dream why you took it something we meant
and you criticize other parties because they have to deal with these issues in reality and not in dreams so sometimes they don’t have the ideal situation like the ones you have in your dreams.
kinnare
CJ Iftakar a corrupt person, is he convicted?
engineer
You guys were against “the docterine of Necessity” when Mush was around with his stick.
And now you are back to support the doctrine of necessity since you hold the office now.
Its a way beyond the fuzzy logic.
@Asif, I never said most of commentor on this board say when they try use their logic.
@ optimist
LOL man. Chill out. Just because I don’t like NS doesn’t mean that I love Altaf. I am not a big fan of any of the politicians. Also I thought it was ironic that same arguments but different roles.
Aitizaz Ahson hurting lawyers movemet? read it all here…
I think Aitizaz has done a blunder by taking CJ to Zardari’s house and his visit gave way to statements that CJ is politicised…
http://www.ummatpublication.com/story1.php
aahmad
who will buy this argument as it will hurt the feelings of majority of us. Just hope will work as the recent developments can’t be welcomed.
Believe it or NOT Asif Zardari has acted in a Pakistani film…. hhaha…
REad about his role: http://www.pakspectator.com/hidden-truths-about-asif-zardari/
hmmmmm… I don’t trust this cartoon Farooq Naik, who is totally against lawyer movement!
Another source requesting anonymity told TheNation that Federal Minister for Law Farooq H Naik met Chief Justice of Pakistan Justice Abdul Hameed Dogor and Justice Faqir Muhammad Khokhar here on Saturday. The Minister discussed judicial crisis in detail with the Chief Justice and the efforts being made by the People’s Democratic Alliance (PDA) to resolve the issue, source revealed adding, the Law Minister took the CJ Abdul Hameed Dogor and Justice Faqir Muhammad Khokhar into confidence on some issue……………………
http://www.nation.com.pk/daily/Apr-2008/6/index4.php
@engineer
How pathetic your answer is. This world is not perfect, but people who work according to a vision also make compromises. Surely IK will also make some compromises and had also being doing that in the past. f.ex.
- He was silent on MQM until 12th May. Everybody including IK knew MQM terrorist activities….A compromise. By confronting MQM he was honoring his words towards his party workers in Karachi. I know PML-N are “pragmatic” in that sense too i.e. run away from a promise……hmmmm to please you we can call it “pragmatism”.
- PTI was sitting in APC/APDM with former rulers, who obviously had mismanaged the country in a degree that could disgust any justice loving Pakistani. He made the compromise in spite of being in an alliance with a party which has produced most lota politicians in the history of Pakistan.
- PTI also made another BIG sacrifice to sit with people who has been in appointing people who they knew were corrupt - only to grasp power.
Just a few examples to you. Maybe you could concentrate on getting order in your own house first or at least don’t throw stones…………..You are living in glass house. Anyhow PML-N also has very competent people like Javed Hashmi, Khawaja Asif and Iqbal Ahsen. Obviously you are of the old school. In your eyes the world is only black and white.
/Saqib
Before Musharraf was blamed for manhandling lawyers and politicians on the restoration of judiciary issue, but now it will be good to see that Khosa, Zardari, Gellani and Farooq Naik will be doing the same thing.
Pakistani politicians including Nawaz teli are the worst breed ever produced by any nation. Be steadfast, rest will follow soon………..
IK (an emotional) politician was, is and will be a flop…… Ask him about Altaf extradition from UK, How soon he will be doing it.. I just need to know. He tried to build his stature on mobilising the emotions of rest of Pakistan against MQM, and what he got? seems like he’s burried in the rubbels…..
Atleast restoration of judiciary is not possible from this breed of politicians even Nawaz, Zardari or Asfandyar. They are all mean….
So at last - people now are getting some sense here when i was telling this that all parties are same and they only go for money and i never ever vote for them i was blamed that that i am an MQM or Altaf lover. I am still on my words that all dictatators , political parties and CJ are same and now the lawyer community also saying CJ should not went to zardari house. These people only play with the emotions of layman of pakistan.
PML(N) somehow still somewhat behind but they will be gradually moving towards.
Pray for Pakistan.
Allah HAfiz
@Scorpion
You are entitled to have your opinion about IK, but it seems like you are not aware of the complications in the Altaf case.
1. Why would the West want to destroy a tool, which they can use against Pakistan.
2. Why would Musharraf want to destroy a tool, which supports him?
3. The British police has not received permission from the Pakistani authorities to make their investigation. After all the crime scene is in Pakistan….witnesses etc.
/Saqib
so all PPP lovers
this is your chairperson
this is your ’saeein’?
Bhutto was a great guy, but now PPP sucks!
@saqib, In UK you can private case and also mockup trial. And if I remeber correctly IK promised that he would go for private case. But that OK what can you say about a person who stole the tiles and the case is still pending in Lahore Court. After all he better than cow theif
@Kinnare
Thanks a lot for your “advice”. It is nice to have “sincere” people like you who aren’t afraid of speaking the “truth” just like Ahmad Raza Kasoori.
/Saqib
Political games ? Eh ?
I for one, have never, ever understood either politics or political ‘ games. ‘ Could it be that to ‘ be-throne ‘ the dictator called Mush, Zardari MAY BE playing political games?
No doubt Mush is cunning down to his bones. But I have started to feel that Zardari may be perfect match, & and may be having an antidote against the poison of Mush. You can never know.
I am sure Zardari will give Mush a tough time in coming days; & before Mush thinks what evil has befelled him, Zardari would have thrown Mush off his guard with a violent jerk, by pulling a ‘ chair , from under Mush , in this game of ‘ musical chairs. ‘
Mush should know better, that he is up against a formidable ‘ enemy. ‘ Mush should also be knowing that Zardari will throw him down with a ‘ thud.’
Zardari, may be cunning, but not as cunning as Mush, & Zardari may be having many political tricks up his sleep. Finally, luck for Mush will run out soon as he is now up against a political wizard called Zardari.
dats what we pakistani expected from a low life politician like zardari
mufad parast
@ jany khan, “dats what we pakistani expected from a low life politician like zardari mufad parast”
May you are blessed with the faculty to think !
@Kinnare
It is a miracle… really it is. The problem of global renewable energy has been solved.
There is sunlight coming out of your a**!!!
“But that OK what can you say about a person who stole the tiles and the case is still pending in Lahore Court. After all he better than cow theif”
I mean seriously, do you really have no sense of shame??? I mean, as an absolute blind supporter of PPP led by the great, incomparable, Zardari and his henchmen like Salman Farooqi…
do you feel nothing when you come up with a statement as ridiculous as this? Sheeesh man…
Let me speak on behalf of our AWAM:
WE HAVE BEEN PHOODO AND WE WILL STAY PHOODO.
All these parties are the same. All these parties are playing the same game. None of them are thinking about PAKISTAN. They are all thinking about how can I pull a chair under other party leader.
I think we were better with Mush because there was one person to blame.
aoa
i will take democracy over dictatorship any day. no matter how bad the politicians because the people know that they can vote them out in next elections.
@aftab
Spot on…..We don’t want dictators!
/Saqib
zardari is giving charge sheet to Judges ok well and good then
why he is shaking hands with nawaz sharif who was once responsible of his NAB cases against him and his beloved wife?
why he is desparate to share power sharing forrmula with worst dictator who never allowed him to enter in Pakistan untill his wife died in suspucious murder surely planned by mussarf supportin group?
why he is forgiving the mass murders of his poor workers on 12 may,OCT and then dec .All knows that agencies and MQM terror group were involved in such killings and even ppp leadership had many time proved those charges on TV talk show.But he is forgiving all such cheap blood of poor workers for Bilwal, Afza and his daughters who have already opted to grow up in safest and luxurious atmosphere like their parents.
So mr zardari you have already proved yours foxy wisdom but really we cant do to help out the poor workers who have spilled their blood for their selfish and power hungry leaders.
Judicary always has become pressurised by power of gun , hooliginasim of ruling mafia and money but if they make courage of standing against wrong doings of ruling mafia ,lets give them chance and support for betterment of system.
@all Imran bashers on altaf case
dear fellows, criminal cases are not black or white when accused are political personalities who can always claim political motivation behind accusations. One of our relatives, a young vibrant out spoken highly respected and very courageous retd. major was up against a provincial minister of nawaz’s first government. He was killed by the minister just before elections because it was evident he was going to win. We followed the case in BB’s government to no avail. And ofcourse there was further repression in nawaz’s second tenure.
We got our revenge when musharraf came to power. Some faujis who were angry with the murder, helped us to get the convictions of all involved except the man at the top, the former minister himself. Although they hold the strings but proof is hard to come by when convicting political figures. As luck would have it, he had a falling out with his former protectors, the chauderies of gujrat who had him assasinated and nobody felt sorry for him.
In this case we are talking about altaf who is much bigger then that minister and who is a darling of the west should they need him to bring chaos in Pakistan should any Pak government refuses to tow western line. So nothing will happen to him now. But politics is cruel. Who knows what holds tomorrow. Remember when murder case was registered against ZAB and when he was convicted. So have patience.
Khuda kay ghar deir hey, andheir nahin
As far as I am concerned, Imran has done what he set out to do. He has exposed altaf and his gang and that is all what’s needed right now.
@SnrCtzn
There are times for politics as usual and there are crunch times. Right now only a corrupt would wanna play politics as usual. First BB made the misake of ditching popular sentiment by dealing with mush and paying with her lfe, and now this moron, who’s shrewdness might be good enough to capture a girl but not run a country, is going to pay with the death of his party.
Musharraf will go. No doubt about it. Establishment will get steriled for all times. But who is going to take the credit for it. When jacobines and girondists and other revolutionaries have a falling out and are at each others throat, it wont bring back Monarchs whos time has passed. It will only lead to higher and higher revolution. This stupid guy is only going to hurt himself and his party.
@ all
all people are saying different things to Zardari , even though i am not a fan of him but i firmly believe if NS also will do the same if he on his place. Zardari not doing this himself its the pressure from outside which makes him to do this. we always see west and other countries when anything going bad in our country , if we talking about lawyers movement it will die if government here not respond to it and as we already ask usa to to be backside so in which authority the main person of these lawyers ask the outside help. If you know the Zardari and NS was set to go Saudia after election but that also not get possible why because NS is opposing MUSH and the Saudi’s not like it IF we want to fight dictatorship and stop looking outside the pakistan for help we can build our own soverignty for that we need to be true to this country and help build this country.
I was reading a story in a newspaper that a jewish son ask his father why are we here in usa and enjoying and our country( he means Israel) is fighthing there against enemies we should go there and fight with them the father reply son we are fighthing . fighting is not all taking weapons and killing people we can defeat them by having strong economy making there economy fails . make out country people literate so they can protect our country in good way.
Pakistan can become a great economic developed country if we stop fighting each other here , stop supporting the persons rather than policies. we should not be supporting MUSH,Zardari,NS or CJ cuz they do one thing good or bad we should be supporting that policy which brings good to this country. I will be the first to have my voice raise in favor of CJ if he was right might be his is right but i dont think so he is also the part of the corrupt pakistan system. His first visited Zardari after his release and said he only visited to condole BB deaths than what about the people died in his favor on 12th may he should visited them on first place ? they died due to him in protecting him in favor of him and he met that person who shake hands who we believe are responsible for those deaths.
we all should now open the eyes - these all political parties are same from inside.
ALLAH NIGHAYBAAN PAKISTAN KA
If Zardari is not serious in restoring judges then this is the last time PPP is in power. I know PPP have got deep roots and its loyal jiyalas bla bla but people are now much more aware of things than ever. they have actually started thinking and differentiating between good and bad, thanks to media.
I am actually surprised that Zardari has not made a single mistake after 18 Feb. But he may do now and that wud be the end of him.
Another recently discovered Worst of Worst Pakistanis:
- PPP ’s Babar Awan
Here is link to his 2nd April insulting column to judiciary.
http://www.jang.net/jm/4-2-2008/images/05_09.gif
- Here is link to Haroon Rasheed column tells about where from Babar Awan comes from:
http://express.com.pk/images/NP_LHE/20080406/Sub_Images/1100382528-2.gif
Why we always have to have heroes and villains in our talks. We are all humans with imperfections. This is a new start for Pakistan, lets make it pure. Lets put all energies in positive directions. When we talk about negotiating with Talibans, why not with MQM even if they were terrorist in past. If we keep going in the past then NS and his party had attacked Supreme court. Imran Khan had welcomed military dictatorship. Jamaat-e-Islami was an accomplice in the Judicial murder of Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto. I salute AZ for creating forgive and forget past mistakes attitude and look for the future. He had forgiven those who were responsible for cutting his tongue in the jail. Mian Saif ul Rehman was going to liquidate whole Bhutto properties in 1999. I am pretty sure similar things happened from PPP sides too. Lets build the future togethere where nobody is left behind
zardari is sindhi dacoit who has looted a lot of money from pakistan…i have no trust in him..he will expose himself very soon …i am 100 % sure that it is the last time people made a mistake by voting ppp due to sympathy and future of ppp is to represent sindh as regional party …
@ Poola
Good article from Haroon Rasheed. Indications are that PML -N are also some how backing 3 year term for CJ Chaudhary. New is that Justice Javaid Iqbal will be made new CJ instead of Doogar to hush critics.
Sharif Bros are power hundry as much as Zardari so one shouldn’t expect wonders from them….
http://www.express.com.pk/images/NP_LHE/20080406/Sub_Images/1100382498-1.gif
PML-N is no angle either. Remember Nawaz Sharif will do anything to achieve 3rd term in the center - I think that is the ‘lalach’ Zardari has offered PML-N and that is why PML-N is helpless when Zardari joined hands with MQM.
@sleepingnation
“zardari is sindhi dacoit”
I beg to disagree. Zardari is a dacoit. It doesn’t matter if he is sindhi or not. Terrorist, dacoits, corrupts and liers have not affiliation.
@
dot
agree with you..
i think zardari is corrupt and corrupt people are everywhere including punjab or other provinces…my intention was not to attack any ethníc group……
If this is true then why would PPP support CJ Chaudhary? Only viable solution for Zardari is to make a committee and kick all respectable judges out to appease Mush. That is why now it is bein reported that Justice Javaid Iqbal is being tipped to be a new CJ. Doogar will only go back to his positon and CJ Choudhary will be shown the door.
SHAIQ HUSSAIN
ISLAMABAD - Irrespective of President Pervez Musharraf’s growing isolation in the face of a strong parliament full of dictator’s political foes, the Bush administration is indulged in hectic ‘behind the scene’ efforts to ensure that its major ally, now a retired general, continues to secure his incumbent slot.
http://www.nation.com.pk/daily/Apr-2008/7/index4.php
PPP doesnt Belive that CJP Ch Iftikhar is a free and Fair Judge.
But its supports its reinstatement because the way he was sacked was illegal.
its simple if you could understand.
Baber Awan, Farooq Naik and Jehangir Badar (Jahil) are three most corrupt faces ever seen by Pakistani Nation.
IK behaved in a very stupid manner on Altak Chooran Wali Sarkar
IK didnt even understand the diff between criminal and civil case. he started claiming he will file a case in courts against Chooran Wali Sarkar but in fact that was a criminal (terrorism) case and should have been Scotland Yard/Police case
IK obtained lots of evidence from Gen Rted Babar and wasted those as Chooran Wali Sarkar got copies of those through IK’s solicitor (as in civil cases all evidence has to be disclosed to either party) and covered his tracks. It was a lost opportunity and IK did the blunder to beconme hero
IK’s brief political carrier is full of immaturish attitudes, loud claims and no concrete contribution in the political field
IK behaved in a very st@pid manner on Altak Chooran Wali Sarkar matter
IK didnt even understand the diff between crimin@l and civil preceedings. he started claiming he will file a case in UK civil court against Chooran Wali Sarkar but in fact that was a crimin@l (terr@rism) act and should have been made a Scotland Yard/Police case
IK obtained lots of evidence from Gen Retd F Babar and wasted those as Chooran Wali Sarkar got copies of those through IK’s solicitor (as in civil cases all evidence has to be disclosed to either party) and covered his tracks. It was a lost opportunity and IK did the blunder only to gain fame
IK’s brief political carrier is full of immaturish attitudes, loud claims, mistakes and no concrete contribution in the political field.
IK was no doubt a very good cricketer and is a loyal Pakistani. But i think he should quit politics and concentrate on welfare work ….. and thus form a pressure group to ensure politicians are kept on check
I dont understand why every body wants to restore Justice Ifthikhar Chaudhry? No body is talking about independent judiciry. Ifthikhar Chaudhry has nothing to do with independence judiciry, because he himself became Chief Justice of pakistan with PCO under Musharaf.
at first we must understand, Mush is illegal and who ever take oath under Mush are also illegal.
The game is on because of the personal clashes, nothing for the good of Pakistan,NS does want Mush, Mush does wants Chaudhry,Mush saved Zardari from all the acountability, Zardari is favoring Mush.
What the hell is going on.?????????
This is absurd.
no body, no body is sincere with pakistan. Only God knows what will be the future of Pakistan.
God do mercy on Pakistan and pakistanis. Amen.
correction of my mistake.
NS does not wants Mush and Mush does not wants NS.
Thanks
Arbab Zaleel Rahim threatens martial law
after he was pelted with ‘littars and chittars’ ……in his own words
does he remember slapping a journalist and then hurling worst ‘abuse’ at him? - posted on youtube many times??
i dont encourage such incidents but …. suppose what goes round comes round
link to above post in The News
http://www.thenews.com.pk/updates.asp?id=42858
@ Malek
Zalil Rahim? despite your anger for the guy, you should be very thoughtful before abusing anyone.
@Malek
Since PPPP are not stupid they should go forward and take the bull by the horns. You are the leaders of this nation now. Why don’t you demand accountability reg. MQM leaders IN Pakistan. Instead of that you are making “peace” with MQM in spite of they killed your people. Maybe poor people don’t count in such statistics.
/Saqib
@saqib
anyone who is against IK …..you claim he is MQM or is making peace with MQM !!
thats wrong with you IK supporters….no justice …despite this u claim to be PTI!!!
If it was just their past crimes, then an agreement could be reached with MQM. But these leeches cant help themselves from sucking blood. It’s in their genetic make up. Reconciliators will be very sorry one day.
@Malek
“anyone who is against IK …..you claim he is MQM or is making peace with MQM !! ”
Really? How did you come to this conclusion?
/Saqib
@Malek
I see your impeccable credentials in the field of law has provided you with the gravitas to rubbish IK’s approach to tackling the menace of Altaf Hussain.
Obviously, you are the genius and IK’s legal team comprising the most pre-eminent civil liberty lawyer in U.K. - also called Imran Khan (google him if you haven’ heard of him) are stupid.
You are so clever that you don’t even know that IK has actually filed a criminal report with Scotland Yard as the first step, Scotland Yard has asked and been refused access to Pakistan (let’s see what your darling PPP will do about it, considering that PPP is dying to give U.N. the authorisation to investigate BB’s murder) and only if Scotland Yard refuses to take action, can and will IK go the British courts.
Lesson: Know your facts before spouting out garbage!!!
@Muhd15
many thanks for your kind remarks. it seems your nick represents your age 15 or perhaps mental age!
Ik filed a criminal charge against Chooran Wali Sarkar only after he had (failed in an attempt to) file a civil case. This resulted in loss of all evidence provided to him
IK’s UK lawyer is not that big a lawyer. He has a small practice in Holborn. he only got fame from Laurence murder case, whose family later sacked him as their lawyer.
but again you are an IK supporter…typical no logic in discussion….always ready to protect IK’s blunders…… establishment supporter…..and most importantly anti justice…yet you call yourself PTInsaf
Thats what every prudent politician would do. Good going, Mr. Zardari. A free judiciary is far more important than a “Iftikhar” Judiciary.
AZ have some complains rom judiciary but he doesnot know that at that time IFTK CH.(CJP) was not CJP so he couldn’t do any thing and we must not see what happened in past but we must be proud on all those juges, those who atleast dear to say no to a GEN. its really appriciatable