Asif Ali Zardari and Nawaz Sharif have reaffirmed the Pakistani Nation that judges will be restored in 30 days as per the Murree Declaration and restoration will not be linked to any constitutional package.
acha kia , agar aisa na kerta to nation is bar jis ne bi pehle ki tara jhoot bola ya lota bazi me hissa lia to nation us ka hal bure ker de gi,, ppp per teesri bar bhrosa kerne ka matlab he ke aakhri chanse he. is bar bi agar ppp ne pehle or hameshi ke tara gaddari or behooda kam kie to soch le k awam ppp ka khatima ker de gi FOREVER.
do whatever u want zardari,,,,,,,,,, but never do one thing only ,, that is,, that never think about make any deal with this stupid, conciosless, mindless and heartless MQM.
please arrange a police operation as early as possible to kill all the dirt of MQM and pleae clean the dirt of mqm from karachi,, these are killers, donot forgive them and kill all of them, even kill thier kids sothat no more stupid mqm,s sign may remain in the karachi,,
kill mqm even their pregnant women untill there is PEACE thoroughly in karachi,,,,,,,,,,,,, please do it and do it, right now,
I hate mqm as an Pakistani can but i dont agree with the suggestions of poilce operations and stuff. I believe killing a human being is the biggest crime a man can commit still course of law should be adopted if we have to get rid of this menace for ever. The other important thing is to keep mqm out of power so that their bhatta lifeline is cut. A bankrupt MQM cant survive and most of the young unemployed recruits will leave this gang. Killing is no solution.
These people are giving too much time to Moshe and his cronies to plan ahead for the D-day. This needs to be done ASAP. Moshe can not use 52-B just because he does not want judiciary to be restored.
I vociferously protest, though I am no MQM supporter or Don Altaf lover, yet I protest LOUDLY. My first instinct was to ignore your comments but I could not. May I ask are you a muslim, a Pakistani? No level headed human being can actually demand ki11ing and you are asking for ki11ing expecting mothers. I have only pity for you.
As far as PPP and Zardari are concerned I know they will try their level best to avoid another blood bath in karachi because that will sure be a recipe for disaster for Sind and Pakistan.
1-Allied parties, the Pakistan People’s Party and the Pakistan Muslim League (N) resolve to form a coalition government for giving a practical shape to the mandate, which was given to the democratic forces by the people of Pakistan on February 18, 2008.
2-This has been decided in today’s summit between the PPP and the PML (N) that the deposed judges would be restored, on the position as they were on November 2, 2007, within 30 days of the formation of the federal government through a parliamentary resolution.
3-The parties agreed that all allied parties would fully support the candidate for the position of the prime minister, nominated by the PPP. The PML (N) suggested that the candidate for prime minister should be such person who can take ahead the common agenda of the allied parties.
4-The parties agreed that the speaker and the deputy speaker of the national assembly would be from the PPP while the speaker and the deputy speaker of the Punjab assembly would be from the PML (N).
5-Both the parties agreed that the PML (N) would be a part of the federal government while the PPP would be a part of the Punjab government.
6-This is the solid opinion of the leaderships of both the parties that the allied parties are ready for forming the governments and the sessions of the national and provincial assemblies be summoned immediately.
MQM (H) is back!!!!
Good move to counter Altaf Kalia group.
ISLAMABAD: The government has decided to take strict measures for maintaining law and order in Karachi and averting the incidents like the ones that occurred on May 12 last year and earlier this month, The News learnt here on Monday.
“The government has decided to allow the Mohajir Qaumi Movement-Haqiqi to resume its political activities,” highly reliable sources in the ruling coalition said on condition of anonymity. “The Haqiqi group had been pushed to the wall under the Musharraf regime,” they said.
The sources said the government has decided to release Afaq Ahmed and Amir Khan of the Haqiqi group. They said the Sindh government has decided to review the cases instituted against the two top Haqiqi leaders and they would be exenorated in the cases where their involvement could not be proved.
“The Haqiqi headquarters Bait-ul-Hamza which was demolished in October 2002, will be reconstructed,” the sources said. The sources said that establishment of lasting peace in Karachi is one of the top priorities of the government and it is a most important and difficult task. They said the government is determined not to yield to any political expediency in the achievement of this objective.
“Three main characters in the security apparatus of the past including Rehman Malik, Dr Shoaib Suddle and Tariq Lodhi have been assigned the extremely important task of establishing peace in Karachi,” the sources added.
According to the sources, the government has decided to adopt the same policy which was implemented by the last government of the Pakistan People’s Party for maintaining peace in Karachi. They said the police officers, who have been involved in maintaining law and order in Karachi, would be re-appointed. It may be added that cases against Haqiqi remained stuck in the courts without decisions while a large number of its workers were either killed or left the country.
@usman
You have violated pk politics commandment #3.
It is unfortunate MQM has ignorant leadership but it does not give you the right to spread hatred.
@Usman Khan and Company
killing children and pregnant women?
come to yyour sences people
MQM is a bif problem for pak and we should get rid of them but this is not a way to do it
its not a very nice thing to even think about , killing women and children
i hope we all keep our minds cool and dont support such suggestions
i m sure there are many muhajirs who are sick of MQM themselves
@ Admin
I have a feeling that all posts meant for this space are moderated by you. If so, then how come posts seeking killing of innocent people are accepted, posted and let stay there despite being pointed up as words of insanity. Please keep a check on what is spewed out here.
@Usman Khan: I’m no fan of MQM leadership either, but please don’t use this kind of violent language for all the followers as they are poor and middle class ppl and hopefully they will see the error of the fascist leadership of MQM-A, but please don’t say these kinds of violent things..
how would u feel if someone said that about ur loved ones? (sorry for sounding melodramatic.)
Although there is some kind of peace keeping necessary now and the main culprit is the violent group incharge of MQM who allow the thugs to operate with impunity and moshe’s govt only strengthened these terrorists. There should be anti terror and anti mafia operation in Karachi but not to target MQM,
we need peace in Karachi, and MQM will have to follow the law, or their members should be arrested and tried in courts. All the terror activities in KHI should be investigated and the leaders of ALL Mafia and Violent groups should be taken to task.
Children and innocents should not be targeted in any circumstances. This would be wrong.
Cha gai Ooo.
Nawaz Sharif must show some relaxation. I dont mean dirty politics here but acceptance for others. Otherwise there are going to be a lot of problems from the united Qs(dirty dozens).
After living through 90s in Karachi. I am just getting scared for my family and friends still there. All developments point to 90s all over again. Worse is that MQM is now equipped with even deadlier arms.
MQM-Haqiqi is no angel. I am sure now the agencies will provide them with the latest arms to counter MQM-A. Same old game all over again. Letting them out to counter MQM-A would result in bloodbath, bori mae band lashen, no-go areas, complete lawlessness and chaos.
It may seem as “Justice Served” for people like Usman Khan, however, it will be a tragedy for millions of people living in Khi. Others will join in all the chaos for their own personal gains…bheti ganga mae hath dho lo…since everything will be blamed on MQM-A and MQM-H , this will be good time to settle scores.
Some comments here show the racism and bias of people. I find a very uncomfortable parallel here with how the US thinks of Al-Q..lets do whatever it takes to finish it off…however large ‘collateral damage’ maybe.
WHAT THE HELL is with GEo,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,they are showing live telephone speech of Altaf Hussain LIVE……….right now…..wtf is this………………this shows GEO is a sell out to MQM.
MQM has got no deadly weapons and Karachi is not going into any kind of chaos. Chaos was what Beirut was back in the 80s and 90s when everyone was fighting everyone ( maronites, shias, sunnis, PLO, Israel, Syria) Karachi can never match what Beirut was despite Karachi having a similar mixture of ethnic identities.
But we will see Karachi burning and a lot of killings. It does not matter if you like it or not but thats what is going to happen. There are going to be gang wars and police encounters.
MQM-Haqiqi vs MQM Altaf
Police vs MQM
I wish I was in Karachi
Actions speak louder than words but I believe Zardari will not be allowed any wriggle room by Nawaz Sharif. I remain cautious but calm and appeal to the nation for calm as we approach the coming tense days, we must not jump the gun, please do your bit to calm the nerves of a nation above all else, please have a read of my post here and pass it on:
“Killing children and pregnant women” killing your own people!!!!! you should be ashamed of yourself. People in this forum bash MQM for their violent attitude, not for their language or ethnicity. I don’t your views are any different than them. Should your children and pregnant women be killed also?
I like PkPolitics for it’s quality not only material but user base also, TK (Taba’n Khamoosh my favorit who talks a lot ), Saqib, mbokhari, aahmad, nota, ninetykman, optimist ( I miss you guy) are its gem. (sorry if I miss someone). Please don’t make it a pedestrian forum with your pedestrian comments.
On other day Gen Mirza Aslam Baig in “Mairey Mutabiq”had already disclosed to Dr. Shahid Masood that 58(2)b would also be abolished in next weeks package.
I have said this before and repeating this again, despite of the fact majority of the establishment and US are against the democracy and democratic forces in Pakistan but there is some strong resistance withing our system who is defying these forces and that is why we have seeing the unexpected results in the election, which has changed the whole game plan.
Next few weeks are the most crucial weeks in the history of Pakistan and if we are able to defeat those forces ( through the restoration of judges, removal of 58-2b or removal of Musharaf), means victory of the people of Pakistan but if we are not able to defeat those forces means, end of the story for our country!!
MM/NJ on BOLTA PAKISTAN even mentioned a few conspiracies by MUSH/KHALID MAQBOOL which could destabalize the govt. They even mentioned that a new RESOLUTION may come this week while the dictator is abroad.
One thing I have noticed that the writing is on MUSH’s face and his body language. He knows that end is near.
I do not trust zardari even a bit. He has his own agenda which is quite similar to mushuruf’s agenda. Mush is Americans horse and won’t go that easily. Let’s see what shock do we have this time from these American slaves.
@ pak.nukes….well do you any other but not to trust AZ…..in the current scenario….this coalition is the best hope….so please stop this “American Slave” bashing……let’s hope for the best…..NS/AZ will accomplish this task…
i can predict one thing very easily..if PPP , PML (N) failed to impeach Mush, restore judges and solve food problem in Pakistan then it will push pakistan to more unrest … i do not believe that agencies are involved in violent incidents like Multan, sher fgan etc. its the reaction of people …when people will not get food and will face 14 hours load shedding and they are forced to see Manhoos face of Musharraf then do not expect them to be calm and cool….
asif zardari doing strange politics but he will soon realize mood of people….its not the pakistan of 1990 its 2008 and now you cannot manipulate with emotions of people
few days ago Javed Ch narrated the sitaution of france in 18th century before revolution and he was quite right that if we compare france of 18th century with current sitaution in pakistan there are many similiar things…people need their rights, they want food, they need electricity. they need independent judiciary and they want Mush out……..if political leadership do not fulfill these then i am afraid conditions will be out of control
Its never end of story in Pakistan. Establishment(Mafia controlling us from all walks of life) do need us(Pakistan) to rule, so they also protect us when we are in to much danger. Don’t worry, have some time off from politics(thinking) when things become too messy.
I don’t understand why the resolution will be tabled after 20th? Why it can no be tabled now? The parliment was so quick on tabling resolution for BB’s investigation by the UN, which could have been delayed by a few weeks as it would not have made any difference. The whole country is looking forward for this issue to be resolved ASAP and it is being delayed for no reason, primarily by the PPP.
As all the friends who read my comments know that I am not an MQM fan. But at the same time I was and still against using indiscrminate force against them. Force is not the solution to the issue. Police operation or military operations only generate further animosity. The only way of getting violence out MQM is to bring them to the court and give them ample opportunity to prove their innocence. I understand that very few people have faith in the current judicial system. But I dont think that we should try to address the failures of justice system through alternative means of authorising the coercive state apparatus to kill the human beings. If we demand justice for ourselves, we should not deny it to the MQM.
Good news. I have a complete confidence that NS-PPP-ANP alliance will stay intact and they will make al decisions in unison.
Some establishment agents and PPP haters want PDA government to fall. They are giving impression that current government is only PPP government and trying to sow the seed of mistrust between NS and PPP. In fact all new governments except Sindh are coalition governments and all parties in coalition are equally responsible for all government actions.
Judges restoration is not a simple issue. It cannot be solved by just emotional slogan mongering. Mush has many cards left in his hand and there are many legal issues and pressures. We all should support YRG government and current parliament and trust their collective wisdom.
@pak.nukes ,farhan,Amir hameed, sleepingnation and all other PPP haters. Let me tell you one thing. Probably you don’t know the news. PPP is a peoples party and derive its strength from streets not from upper class. This party won every fair election since 1970 with the exception of 1996. None of its governents were allowed to complete its tenure and all were finished by illegl or unconstitutional means.
PPP struggled against all dictators from Ayub to Mush and is the main force behind lawyer’s movement. The losers of APDM failed to hijack lawyers movement and Inshallah PPP and its partners will make right decisions. There is no reason to spread rumors and wrong wishful -ve propaganda against PPP and AZ.
I bet you people will continue your hate mongring against elected government after restoration of judges. Learn to respect mandate of people. That is called democracy.
PPPP is ambiguous on the Judiciary. They had secret talks with Shaittan azam, MQM masterminded while the whole nation was united against dictatorship. In other words Mush Kuttta may have gone by now if PPPP had joined wiht PML-N and ANP and other like minded. God knows better but if PPPP played a double role in the coming months, it will be disastrous for every party. This time Army has no place in Pakistan and any move will be considered as Mutiny. I hope Mr 10% give it a thought and quickly restore Chief Justice and impeach Musharraff Kutta, Khtta, Kutta Haram khooor with MQM. Mush has brought Pakistan to a point where it can break and become SOMALIAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA.
Dont readers think that somebody by the name of ‘ Usman Khan ‘ has gone off his rocker, by suggesting strange & weird ‘ solutions ‘ Karachi’s problems.
That’s what was suggested to western Pakistanis in former East Pakistan, & that’s what they partly did, thus creating so much hatred of the locals, that the
Bengalis decided to quit Pakistan & declare their state as ‘ Bangladesh. ‘
And nobody in his correct state mind would deny that what they did as a result, was correct.
I think this ‘ Usman Khan ‘ is an agencies man, operating from Spain ? Or he may be an agent of Musharaf or of Altaf ( Choorian Wala ? ) planted abroad. You never know. His main purpose is to plant such suggestions, to further break up, whatever is left off, of this land of the pure,called Pakistan.
Zardari Sahib ko khatra hai k chief justice sahib ne agar 100% insaf karna shuroon kar dia to mera kia banay ga.
pppp is looking for any kind of guaranty that chief justice will not touch them.Jis tezi k satth zardari sahib k cases ko khatam kia ja raha hai kia yea insaf ho raha hai?
pppp k apnay haath main hai k us ne kaisay survive karna hai.
Waqt ka taqaza to yea hai k sub ko mil kar mulk ki khatir give and take ki policy par amal kar k mulk ko bachana hoga.
Agar sub log mil kar mushraf sahib ko izat k sath janay ka rasta day dain aur izat ka rasta yea hai k un se keh dia jai k sir aik saal k baad aap resign karain gay.
aur is aik saal k under sub kuch behtar karnay ki koshish ki jai.
warna pda apni tawnayan mushraf ko hatanay par laga kar sirf waqt zaya kar dain gay.
shukria
saeed
Holland
What “IZZAT”?
If Moshe had an iota of IZZAT, he would have resigned long ago.
We have given him enough opportunity to Moshe to leave with his “IZZAT” This boogey should have died once MMA claimed that leting him stay untill 2003 as army chief is a way of accomplishing that. See what happened.
Then BB claimed to be doing the same thing. See what happened to her.
This does not work. He should be asked to resign immediately or face impeachment and disgrace.
@saqibtahir
You want everyone to analyze PPP the way you do, which is not how it works. Every credible news analyst (Rauf Klasra, Ansar Abbasi, etc.) and TV anchor (Talat, Kashif, Bolta Pakistan dup, Hamid Mir, etc.) has raised questions on PPP’s not-so-clear stance on the judiciary, and the emphasis here is “every credible”, so, from your definition, they must also hate PPP?
Every PPP participant that I have seen on the TV shows have had vague arguments on this matter. You want people to praise Zardari even if he sneezes? It does not work like this way my friend. He will get a pat on the back if he does something right, if not then he will be criticized and this is the essence of democracy, that is, the right to ones opinion whether you agree with it or not and not “hate mongring” as you have termed it.
If you go back on the past postings on this site, you will see that I had criticized NS a lot but so far I have seen him sticking to his stance and he has earned some of my respect but that does not mean that I will blindly start praising him for everything.
Janabs…
dont be so happy on this news…though its nice to hear this…but the thing still to be worried about is the next move of musshi…we all know he’s been keeping quiet for long now…and we all know how sharp n evil minded he is…and also, we all know that zardari & Co cant be angels…of course they are in pressure right now…but…things can change as well…
we can just wait…and see…
i agree with a brother who posted the comment ‘nothing is done untill its done’….
@saqibtahir
Let me add my voice in your support , just like everybody I do also have my convictions and honestly I would trust PPP more than for example PML-N. It does not mean that I do not trust PML-N but it is just a matter of conviction. In arabic there is word called Raib ( e.g La-raib ba feehai, i.e 3rd verse of 2nd Surah) , this word means a doubt that keeps disturbing your heart, one of the example of such a doubt is if you are in a desert and staying in a tent , and you have doubt that there is some snake inside the tent until and unless you check every nook of the tent you won’t feel comfortable , this sort of doubt is different from normal , until it is removed your heart does not rest in peace.
There are people who have the similar doubt about PPP , until and unless the judges are restored , this doubt will keep bugging them. BTW I have a similar doubt about PML-N , no matter how much Nawz Sharif and Javaid Hashmi say that they are anti-establishment , the thing keeps bugging me that they are not
PPP leadership is responsible for creation of such a doubt . if you analyze their statements, it is not hard to conclude that they are hiding many things from people e.g
every time when TV anchor ask will judges be restored in 30 days
PPP answers: Ji Lekin konsay 30 din abhi yeh faisla nahi hua….lol
Will CJ be allowed to work
PPP answers: Parliament will decide….we have not committed about duration of judges
and now latest
one of PPP guy said Ilan Marri Koi Aasmani Saheefa Nahi jo tabdeel na ho sakay
so PPP should tell very clearly yes or no……i will have no objection if they come straight and say that
“We have votes of people and we will not restore any judges as you stupids voted us and why you are crying for judges , it was not written in our manifesto”
that will be nice….as Munafiks are very very dangerous …..and PPP is doing Munafakat
@sleepingnation
Let me tell you some history. Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto won the majority seats in west Pakistan , however had far less seats as compared to Mujib who won every single seat in east Pakistan. ZAB said that he would be willing to negotiate with Mujib and accepts that he (Mujib) should be the prime minister , but he wanted to have him on the negotiation table for his (Mujib’s) six point agenda. ZAB as leader of political party raised many slogans, he was against Yahya — the military junta , and knew the plans of Mujib who was in communication with india to break the country. If ZAB had not said the things he said after the 1970 elections and pretended that he is with Mujib, many people would agree that even than Yahya would not have transferred power to Mujib and Mujib would have broken the country in any case. People are there who still suspects that ZAB was the party in breaking the country.
Let me give you another example , BB negotiated with Musharraf , forced him to allow her to come to Pakistan, got NRO a bad name for her (just like Bhutto got “Idher hum, Idher Tum” attributed to him). All the people who have similar “Raib- doubt” about PPP will still say that BB had a “deal” with Musharraf. And Musharraf allowed her to come back and contest the election.
Now let’s look at the end result of both examples. Country was broken in 1971 , Bhutto became the Prime Minister , (During 1970 and 1971 war “everbody — with “Raib- doubt” about ZAB) kept screaming that Bhutto was an ally of Yahya and military Junta), but what happens , within 7 years Bhutto is executed by the same military Junta , and he proved once and for all that he was never an ally of the military Junta. This is what is called “La-Raib” that you prove once and for all.
In the second example , “BB did the deal with Musharraf” as they say. Came back to Pakistan. She ensured that the elections are held relatively transparent. I am sure that it was only BB who made it possible (by whatever means including pressure from United States and including her ultimate sacrifice) to force the mad dictator to hold a “free and fair” elections. Note that she did not do it for her party. Musharraf was forced to do the election that allowed NS to win too. And finally BB is murdered by the “Establishment” , even her arch rivals accept that she was murdered by the establishment. So did she do the deal? This is what I call “La-Raib” that is remove the doubt completely.
Moral of the story is that ZAB , BB were not responsible for creation of such doubt , Bhutto perception as military junta ally and BB doing the deal with Musharraf. You would say that yes they were responsible for such doubt , that is where “conviction” comes in. Your conviction will be different from mine.
As for the matter of current PPP stance is concerned. I put it at the same level as the deal of BB with Musharraf. PPP has to get something out of the military junta , they damn care about these perceptions of being Munafiq or Momin. And to tell you the truth they are not being Munafiq , as they are telling the truth when saying they don’t know about 30 days , the battle is on-going , their objective is to restore the judges however they know that chances are that they ay fail to do so. Therefore they are not committing it. It is exactly the way BB never ruled out the possibility of working with Musharraf , and you see at the moment “everybody is working with Musharraf including the NS’s team”. So the truth of the matter is PPP seems more Momin than others
anyway in the mean time there is a news that PPP is considering to reduce the duration of CJ..so one catch comes out …we are waiting for other catches
You started from Bhutto……fact was Mujeeb was in majority and Bhutto in collaboration with Military broke that country just to become PM….
Benezir made a deal with USA and now your leadership is claiming that she was killed by foriegn powers…..such a twist why US will kill one who is going to do those wonders which Mush was not able to do…..all the time PPP make twisting statement and they think we are doing politics..let me tell you it is not 1980s its 2008 ……people are much aware and those old tricks which you explained in your post with great detail will not work…..let us wait and see
fact was Mujeeb was in majority and Bhutto in collaboration with Military broke that country just to become PM
I completely agree with you. Ameerulmomnin General Zia-ul-Haq did the greatest favor to this nation by executing the culprit of breaking the Pak Ser Zamin of Huzrat Maulana Quaid-e-Azam Muhammd Ali Jinnah Rahmatullah Alaih (R.A).
God bless his teeths rest in peace.
“Ameerulmomnin General Zia-ul-Haq did the greatest favor to this nation by executing the culprit of breaking the Pak Ser Zamin of Huzrat Maulana Quaid-e-Azam Muhammd Ali Jinnah Rahmatullah Alaih (R.A).
God bless his teeths rest in peace”
its your opinion not mine …..so now please stick to your opinion
@pejamistri
I do not want to get into the discussion of who was responsible for the breaking of Pakistan. But I would like to mention here that Zia, no matter how strong he was as the COAS, did not have the balls to hang ZAB on his own. It was done with the consensus and backing of the US.
Now as for BB/Moshe/US/uniform, etc.; it was the Bush think tank that came up with the plan that in order to legitimize Moshe, BB should be brought into the equation to support him (Moshe). That plan had the blessing of Dick Chaney. NRO was also the outcome of that plan and I do not know whether BB had demanded it or not; most likely she did. But the way it stands now is, and I am sure you will not deny it, that all those powerful people who have sucked the blood out of this country are enjoying the benefits of this draconian law.
@Amir Hameed
“@saqibtahir
You want everyone to analyze PPP the way you do, ..Every credible news analyst… has raised questions on PPP’s not-so-clear stance on the judiciary”
Might I add that had PPP been clear about the issue, then why would the April 15 decision be needed. And please don’t blame it on “establishment” as I did not hear ONE PPP person — and I heard pleant — giving a clear answer on the subject. In fact what they were saying was the complete opposite and fighting against restoration (see the statements of the three PPP stooges Naik, Awan, and Khosa, e.g.)
@Pejamistri is right when he says “There are people who have the similar doubt about PPP , until and unless the judges are restored.” Why shouldn’t we?
@Amir Hameed
Agreed Zia never had the balls to hang ZAB, just like Musharraf did not have the balls to hang Nawaz Sharif , it was just that ZAB was more at the wrong end of the world than Nawaz Sharif.
As for the return of BB, please don’t give the complete credit to US for this. For whole 8 years the elephant kept supporting whole heartedly the mad dictator , they could have kept him supporting for another 8 years just like they kept supporting Zia until he died even though BB’s return on 10th April 1986 was similar to 18th October 2008. Benazir did a lot of work to get the support of right quarters for whole 8 years , she matured as a politician during her exile along with Nawaz Sharif , certain steps proved the maturity of both politicians which included:
1. Charter of Democracy.
2. Nawaz Sharif and Benazir kept their communication channel opened even after disagreement in the APC.
3. Nawaz Sharif’s agreement to contest the elections even after announcing the bycott.
All of the above along with the unprecedented movement of the lawyers shaped the whole situation in Pakistan, personally I never buy the argument of US think tanks coming up with any novel ideas like this. Specially I think Bush and his team along with their think-tanks are incapable of such things
Finally for NRO you would be little surprised to hear my opinion , I believe that in Pakistan parliament should make a law in which politicians (those who are now in government i.e PPP ANP PML(N)) are declared as sacred cows just like there are laws for Army and Judiciary. No authority in Pakistan should be able to do any accountablity of them only a parliamentary committee should look into their financial scams . Off course this law should be for few years perhaps 10 or so.
So in a way I support NRO , but I do not support all of the clauses of NRO specially those which do not apply to politicians , BTW do you know one of the biggest beneficiary of the NRO is no other than Mansoor-ul-Haq and his associates who did the biggest scam of the Pakistan before the 1999 , after that however there had been much bigger scams.
@nota
I agree you should be suspecious of PPP , I am sure you can not help that. However do pray that PPP come up to the expectations just like I am praying. Let me give you some more consolation , ZAB was not a practising muslim (I believe) , and he was not in favor of using religion for any political gains , however when it came to accepting the people sentiments he used “Islam is our religion” and then banned alcohol. So although he perhaps did not agree with these things he did them. Similarly I hope Asif Zardari and some other big leaders of the PPP may not be in favor of restoring CJ and some other judges in the end they may have to due to the public pressure/sentiments.
With the threat of Article 58(2)(b) hanging over this parliament, I simply cannot understand why a resolution has not been moved in parliament to date to (a) suspend this article effective immediately, thus taking out Musharraf’s ability to dismiss this parliament and (b) to set a time frame to repeal this article altogether. I wish one of our famous journalists – Talat Husain or Mr Mir or Messrs Javed & Minhas or whoever would do a programme on this right away and get the political parties – both for and against – to explain the reason for this delay.
@Amir Hameed,
PPP is vy clear about judiaciary issue. They have obligations as per Charter of Democracy and Muree declaration. PPP is not elected by people on judiaciary issue. PPP has no moral, legal or political obligation to restore judges based on the election mandate. So they should not be blamed even if they refuse to restore judges. They have reasons to dump these judges:
1) CJ and his lawyers have screwed thir case themselves fter their first success in July. They deepened the crisis after picking fight after fight with Mush.
2) C J and his lawyers never took PPP or NS in confidence and didn’t keep PPP of NS’s interest in mind. So why should they bother?
3) These judges are part and parcel of Mush regime and part of all the crimes commited against constitution and political leadership.
4) Did these judges bother when Zardari, YRG, NS, SS, JH and thousands more political workers were languishing in jails. Did they give any relief to a single anti-Mush politician?
So if judges are bruised in the internal fight with their bed fellow generals, why they want their own convicted Hijacker (NS), traitor (JH), nepotist (YRG) and never convicted Zardari to bail them out? Do they think AZ and NS are cleners of their mess?
PPP is more interested in cleaning the consitutional mess created by corrupt unholy alliance of Judges and Generals. They both consider them the holy cows. Restoring them without restoring the original constitution is not going to do any good except seeing another Prime Minister being convicted as hijacker or murderer.
PPP, NS and ANp are committed to Muree declaration and trust each other. There is no need to cast doubts on their intentions. The issue is not as simple. There are many variables, legal issues, and pressures that have to be dealt with. End of the day some compromise solution will emerge. We must wait for the collective wisdom of the parliament and give them their time.
In the end I would say that NAZRIYA-E-ZAROORAT is not proprietry to Judges and Generals. Parliament (that is supreme in theory) has its own needs and obligations to their electorate.
@sleepingnation
Probably you ae sleeping in ssome nook in a cozy bedroom with no wwindows. Pakistani nation is not sleeping. They have given their verdict against Mush as well as APDM and its lawyer’s boycott call. Also probably you have not yet heard that Zardri’s party has been elected to power by this nation through PURCHI.
@straightarrow,
Removalof 58-2B cannot be done without 2/3 majority in senate. YRG is talking about Mush’s impeachment almost every day by saying ‘this matter will be dealt by parliament’. I hope this issue is on cards of YRG government. Cannot you see the face of Mush in front of YRG in pictures. They hardly talk to each other.
@saqibtahir
Regarding restoration you say ‘So why should they bother?” Please DON’T!. Let’s see if PPP leadership has the b@lls to stick to their beliefs.
Later you add: “Pakistani nation is not sleeping. They have given their verdict against Mush as well as APDM and its lawyer’s boycott call.”
Do you seriously believe that? Like I said I challenge you jiyalas to stick to that and we will see what follows.
@Pejamistri
Keeping that ZAB and “Islam is our religion” example in mind, also remember where did it lead ZAB to… Everyone knew ZAB and “Islam is our religion” coming from him was seen for what it was. PPP might restore judges now but any gains they might have had from the act has certainly been lost — jiyalas excepted of course.
Asif Ali Zardari and Nawaz Sharif have reaffirmed the Pakistani Nation that judges will be restored in 30 days as per the Murree Declaration and restoration will not be linked to any constitutional package.
Great
Zardari Chaa gaya.
Nawaz Shareef Zinda-Bad
Yes, this is how it should be done. There is o other way. Let’s see when the D-Day arrives. We are keeping our fingers crossed.
acha kia , agar aisa na kerta to nation is bar jis ne bi pehle ki tara jhoot bola ya lota bazi me hissa lia to nation us ka hal bure ker de gi,, ppp per teesri bar bhrosa kerne ka matlab he ke aakhri chanse he. is bar bi agar ppp ne pehle or hameshi ke tara gaddari or behooda kam kie to soch le k awam ppp ka khatima ker de gi FOREVER.
do whatever u want zardari,,,,,,,,,, but never do one thing only ,, that is,, that never think about make any deal with this stupid, conciosless, mindless and heartless MQM.
please arrange a police operation as early as possible to kill all the dirt of MQM and pleae clean the dirt of mqm from karachi,, these are killers, donot forgive them and kill all of them, even kill thier kids sothat no more stupid mqm,s sign may remain in the karachi,,
kill mqm even their pregnant women untill there is PEACE thoroughly in karachi,,,,,,,,,,,,, please do it and do it, right now,
usman khan spain-0034-634101023
They should keep an eye on Maulan Fazlu.
It aint done till its done! For gods sake get on with it!
Good work Nawaz Laagay rahao
Once the Judges restore then CJ should take action on NRO
I won’t believe until all the judges are restored and they are allowed to work like they were doing before 3rd November 2008.
I m pessimistic because such a judiciary doesn’t suit Zardari and most of his friends.
Let wait and see………..
message cannot be clearer than this. i only see practicalities left within the next 20 days or so!
credit to NS for his persistence and AZ for keeping his side of promise.
also the news are that Sindh Governer (social security benefits cheat) to be replaced!
Kar-e-m’salsal by Haroonurrashed
http://express.com.pk/epaper/Article.aspx?newsID=1100388010&Date=20080415&Issue=NP_LHE
Dear Comrades,
I hate mqm as an Pakistani can but i dont agree with the suggestions of poilce operations and stuff. I believe killing a human being is the biggest crime a man can commit still course of law should be adopted if we have to get rid of this menace for ever. The other important thing is to keep mqm out of power so that their bhatta lifeline is cut. A bankrupt MQM cant survive and most of the young unemployed recruits will leave this gang. Killing is no solution.
Regards,
These people are giving too much time to Moshe and his cronies to plan ahead for the D-day. This needs to be done ASAP. Moshe can not use 52-B just because he does not want judiciary to be restored.
@ usman khan
very well said….
@usman khan on April 15th, 2008 2:28 pm
I vociferously protest, though I am no MQM supporter or Don Altaf lover, yet I protest LOUDLY. My first instinct was to ignore your comments but I could not. May I ask are you a muslim, a Pakistani? No level headed human being can actually demand ki11ing and you are asking for ki11ing expecting mothers. I have only pity for you.
As far as PPP and Zardari are concerned I know they will try their level best to avoid another blood bath in karachi because that will sure be a recipe for disaster for Sind and Pakistan.
Murree Declaration
1-Allied parties, the Pakistan People’s Party and the Pakistan Muslim League (N) resolve to form a coalition government for giving a practical shape to the mandate, which was given to the democratic forces by the people of Pakistan on February 18, 2008.
2-This has been decided in today’s summit between the PPP and the PML (N) that the deposed judges would be restored, on the position as they were on November 2, 2007, within 30 days of the formation of the federal government through a parliamentary resolution.
3-The parties agreed that all allied parties would fully support the candidate for the position of the prime minister, nominated by the PPP. The PML (N) suggested that the candidate for prime minister should be such person who can take ahead the common agenda of the allied parties.
4-The parties agreed that the speaker and the deputy speaker of the national assembly would be from the PPP while the speaker and the deputy speaker of the Punjab assembly would be from the PML (N).
5-Both the parties agreed that the PML (N) would be a part of the federal government while the PPP would be a part of the Punjab government.
6-This is the solid opinion of the leaderships of both the parties that the allied parties are ready for forming the governments and the sessions of the national and provincial assemblies be summoned immediately.
_____________________________________________________________
MQM (H) is back!!!!
Good move to counter Altaf Kalia group.
ISLAMABAD: The government has decided to take strict measures for maintaining law and order in Karachi and averting the incidents like the ones that occurred on May 12 last year and earlier this month, The News learnt here on Monday.
“The government has decided to allow the Mohajir Qaumi Movement-Haqiqi to resume its political activities,” highly reliable sources in the ruling coalition said on condition of anonymity. “The Haqiqi group had been pushed to the wall under the Musharraf regime,” they said.
The sources said the government has decided to release Afaq Ahmed and Amir Khan of the Haqiqi group. They said the Sindh government has decided to review the cases instituted against the two top Haqiqi leaders and they would be exenorated in the cases where their involvement could not be proved.
“The Haqiqi headquarters Bait-ul-Hamza which was demolished in October 2002, will be reconstructed,” the sources said. The sources said that establishment of lasting peace in Karachi is one of the top priorities of the government and it is a most important and difficult task. They said the government is determined not to yield to any political expediency in the achievement of this objective.
“Three main characters in the security apparatus of the past including Rehman Malik, Dr Shoaib Suddle and Tariq Lodhi have been assigned the extremely important task of establishing peace in Karachi,” the sources added.
According to the sources, the government has decided to adopt the same policy which was implemented by the last government of the Pakistan People’s Party for maintaining peace in Karachi. They said the police officers, who have been involved in maintaining law and order in Karachi, would be re-appointed. It may be added that cases against Haqiqi remained stuck in the courts without decisions while a large number of its workers were either killed or left the country.
http://thenews.jang.com.pk/top_story_detail.asp?Id=14107
@usman
You have violated pk politics commandment #3.
It is unfortunate MQM has ignorant leadership but it does not give you the right to spread hatred.
@Usman Khan and Company
killing children and pregnant women?
come to yyour sences people
MQM is a bif problem for pak and we should get rid of them but this is not a way to do it
its not a very nice thing to even think about , killing women and children
i hope we all keep our minds cool and dont support such suggestions
i m sure there are many muhajirs who are sick of MQM themselves
Faisal Saleh Hayat is saying if PPP and PML-N talks to pml Q we might agree to support the restoration of the judiciary. Mushe is screwed.
Can someone explain to me why people put their phone numbers in these comments?
TK 092 333 420 144144
@ Admin
I have a feeling that all posts meant for this space are moderated by you. If so, then how come posts seeking killing of innocent people are accepted, posted and let stay there despite being pointed up as words of insanity. Please keep a check on what is spewed out here.
@Usman Khan: I’m no fan of MQM leadership either, but please don’t use this kind of violent language for all the followers as they are poor and middle class ppl and hopefully they will see the error of the fascist leadership of MQM-A, but please don’t say these kinds of violent things..
how would u feel if someone said that about ur loved ones? (sorry for sounding melodramatic.)
Although there is some kind of peace keeping necessary now and the main culprit is the violent group incharge of MQM who allow the thugs to operate with impunity and moshe’s govt only strengthened these terrorists. There should be anti terror and anti mafia operation in Karachi but not to target MQM,
we need peace in Karachi, and MQM will have to follow the law, or their members should be arrested and tried in courts. All the terror activities in KHI should be investigated and the leaders of ALL Mafia and Violent groups should be taken to task.
Children and innocents should not be targeted in any circumstances. This would be wrong.
@ TK
batane kay liyey kay mere pass bhi Nokia 3310 hai. hahaha!!
Cha gai Ooo.
Nawaz Sharif must show some relaxation. I dont mean dirty politics here but acceptance for others. Otherwise there are going to be a lot of problems from the united Qs(dirty dozens).
After living through 90s in Karachi. I am just getting scared for my family and friends still there. All developments point to 90s all over again. Worse is that MQM is now equipped with even deadlier arms.
MQM-Haqiqi is no angel. I am sure now the agencies will provide them with the latest arms to counter MQM-A. Same old game all over again. Letting them out to counter MQM-A would result in bloodbath, bori mae band lashen, no-go areas, complete lawlessness and chaos.
It may seem as “Justice Served” for people like Usman Khan, however, it will be a tragedy for millions of people living in Khi. Others will join in all the chaos for their own personal gains…bheti ganga mae hath dho lo…since everything will be blamed on MQM-A and MQM-H , this will be good time to settle scores.
Some comments here show the racism and bias of people. I find a very uncomfortable parallel here with how the US thinks of Al-Q..lets do whatever it takes to finish it off…however large ‘collateral damage’ maybe.
off the record today was great today..
WHAT THE HELL is with GEo,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,they are showing live telephone speech of Altaf Hussain LIVE……….right now…..wtf is this………………this shows GEO is a sell out to MQM.
Woh Din Ke Jis Ka Wada Hai
16 Days and counting……….
hi to everyone,
congrats, Pakistan is on right track
just 16 days
Where are we heading as a nation?
We are burning humans alive, we are killing innocent people and we pick guns for small issue….
check this out:
http://www.express.com.pk/epaper/PoPupwindow.aspx?newsID=1100387922&Issue=NP_LHE&Date=20080415
aahmad
Justice for selective people gives way to injustice. Javed chaudhry nailed it very evry well.
[...] Source: PK Politics [...]
MQM has got no deadly weapons and Karachi is not going into any kind of chaos. Chaos was what Beirut was back in the 80s and 90s when everyone was fighting everyone ( maronites, shias, sunnis, PLO, Israel, Syria) Karachi can never match what Beirut was despite Karachi having a similar mixture of ethnic identities.
But we will see Karachi burning and a lot of killings. It does not matter if you like it or not but thats what is going to happen. There are going to be gang wars and police encounters.
MQM-Haqiqi vs MQM Altaf
Police vs MQM
I wish I was in Karachi
PK Politics Friends,
Actions speak louder than words but I believe Zardari will not be allowed any wriggle room by Nawaz Sharif. I remain cautious but calm and appeal to the nation for calm as we approach the coming tense days, we must not jump the gun, please do your bit to calm the nerves of a nation above all else, please have a read of my post here and pass it on:
http://www.otherpakistan.org/an-appeal-for-calm.html
Feimanallah
Wasim
http://www.otherpakistan.org/archive.html
@Usman Khan
“Killing children and pregnant women” killing your own people!!!!! you should be ashamed of yourself. People in this forum bash MQM for their violent attitude, not for their language or ethnicity. I don’t your views are any different than them. Should your children and pregnant women be killed also?
I like PkPolitics for it’s quality not only material but user base also, TK (Taba’n Khamoosh my favorit who talks a lot
), Saqib, mbokhari, aahmad, nota, ninetykman, optimist ( I miss you guy) are its gem. (sorry if I miss someone). Please don’t make it a pedestrian forum with your pedestrian comments.
Guys,
Imp. reports coming out. Both PPP-PML(N) leaders are indicating imp news next week.
Even MM on BOLTA P indicated towards it.
Looks like the nation will hear good news in addition to JUDGES RESTORATION.
@ninetykman
Geo brought it’s best weapon Dr. Shahid to counter Bola Pakistan. Thanks to PkPolitics will not miss any of it. Thanks Admin.
ninetykman
On other day Gen Mirza Aslam Baig in “Mairey Mutabiq”had already disclosed to Dr. Shahid Masood that 58(2)b would also be abolished in next weeks package.
Inshallah with Gods will
I have said this before and repeating this again, despite of the fact majority of the establishment and US are against the democracy and democratic forces in Pakistan but there is some strong resistance withing our system who is defying these forces and that is why we have seeing the unexpected results in the election, which has changed the whole game plan.
Next few weeks are the most crucial weeks in the history of Pakistan and if we are able to defeat those forces ( through the restoration of judges, removal of 58-2b or removal of Musharaf), means victory of the people of Pakistan but if we are not able to defeat those forces means, end of the story for our country!!
@ sic5770
INSHALLAH, we will be successful.
MM/NJ on BOLTA PAKISTAN even mentioned a few conspiracies by MUSH/KHALID MAQBOOL which could destabalize the govt. They even mentioned that a new RESOLUTION may come this week while the dictator is abroad.
One thing I have noticed that the writing is on MUSH’s face and his body language. He knows that end is near.
I do not trust zardari even a bit. He has his own agenda which is quite similar to mushuruf’s agenda. Mush is Americans horse and won’t go that easily. Let’s see what shock do we have this time from these American slaves.
@ pak.nukes….well do you any other but not to trust AZ…..in the current scenario….this coalition is the best hope….so please stop this “American Slave” bashing……let’s hope for the best…..NS/AZ will accomplish this task…
NS / AZ have made “some” agreements with those tobe restored judges .. and will not stop ns / az in minting money from pakistan
i can predict one thing very easily..if PPP , PML (N) failed to impeach Mush, restore judges and solve food problem in Pakistan then it will push pakistan to more unrest … i do not believe that agencies are involved in violent incidents like Multan, sher fgan etc. its the reaction of people …when people will not get food and will face 14 hours load shedding and they are forced to see Manhoos face of Musharraf then do not expect them to be calm and cool….
asif zardari doing strange politics but he will soon realize mood of people….its not the pakistan of 1990 its 2008 and now you cannot manipulate with emotions of people
few days ago Javed Ch narrated the sitaution of france in 18th century before revolution and he was quite right that if we compare france of 18th century with current sitaution in pakistan there are many similiar things…people need their rights, they want food, they need electricity. they need independent judiciary and they want Mush out……..if political leadership do not fulfill these then i am afraid conditions will be out of control
ninetykman
Its never end of story in Pakistan. Establishment(Mafia controlling us from all walks of life) do need us(Pakistan) to rule, so they also protect us when we are in to much danger. Don’t worry, have some time off from politics(thinking) when things become too messy.
@ calyps
what is your source of this story….
how long ppp will carry on playing hide n seek
after every while they meet and decide that judges will be restored but when … for that they are hesitant to answer.
the dubious statements of ppp that they dont even when that 30 days deadline will start.
its all sickening and ppl are tend to get fed up now of ppp’s behaviour.
the resolution will come on 22nd why not in this week,who is stopping them
wt is ppp scared of no body knows
I don’t understand why the resolution will be tabled after 20th? Why it can no be tabled now? The parliment was so quick on tabling resolution for BB’s investigation by the UN, which could have been delayed by a few weeks as it would not have made any difference. The whole country is looking forward for this issue to be resolved ASAP and it is being delayed for no reason, primarily by the PPP.
As all the friends who read my comments know that I am not an MQM fan. But at the same time I was and still against using indiscrminate force against them. Force is not the solution to the issue. Police operation or military operations only generate further animosity. The only way of getting violence out MQM is to bring them to the court and give them ample opportunity to prove their innocence. I understand that very few people have faith in the current judicial system. But I dont think that we should try to address the failures of justice system through alternative means of authorising the coercive state apparatus to kill the human beings. If we demand justice for ourselves, we should not deny it to the MQM.
Good news. I have a complete confidence that NS-PPP-ANP alliance will stay intact and they will make al decisions in unison.
Some establishment agents and PPP haters want PDA government to fall. They are giving impression that current government is only PPP government and trying to sow the seed of mistrust between NS and PPP. In fact all new governments except Sindh are coalition governments and all parties in coalition are equally responsible for all government actions.
Judges restoration is not a simple issue. It cannot be solved by just emotional slogan mongering. Mush has many cards left in his hand and there are many legal issues and pressures. We all should support YRG government and current parliament and trust their collective wisdom.
@pak.nukes ,farhan,Amir hameed, sleepingnation and all other PPP haters. Let me tell you one thing. Probably you don’t know the news. PPP is a peoples party and derive its strength from streets not from upper class. This party won every fair election since 1970 with the exception of 1996. None of its governents were allowed to complete its tenure and all were finished by illegl or unconstitutional means.
PPP struggled against all dictators from Ayub to Mush and is the main force behind lawyer’s movement. The losers of APDM failed to hijack lawyers movement and Inshallah PPP and its partners will make right decisions. There is no reason to spread rumors and wrong wishful -ve propaganda against PPP and AZ.
I bet you people will continue your hate mongring against elected government after restoration of judges. Learn to respect mandate of people. That is called democracy.
PPPP is ambiguous on the Judiciary. They had secret talks with Shaittan azam, MQM masterminded while the whole nation was united against dictatorship. In other words Mush Kuttta may have gone by now if PPPP had joined wiht PML-N and ANP and other like minded. God knows better but if PPPP played a double role in the coming months, it will be disastrous for every party. This time Army has no place in Pakistan and any move will be considered as Mutiny. I hope Mr 10% give it a thought and quickly restore Chief Justice and impeach Musharraff Kutta, Khtta, Kutta Haram khooor with MQM. Mush has brought Pakistan to a point where it can break and become SOMALIAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA.
Dont readers think that somebody by the name of ‘ Usman Khan ‘ has gone off his rocker, by suggesting strange & weird ‘ solutions ‘ Karachi’s problems.
That’s what was suggested to western Pakistanis in former East Pakistan, & that’s what they partly did, thus creating so much hatred of the locals, that the
Bengalis decided to quit Pakistan & declare their state as ‘ Bangladesh. ‘
And nobody in his correct state mind would deny that what they did as a result, was correct.
I think this ‘ Usman Khan ‘ is an agencies man, operating from Spain ? Or he may be an agent of Musharaf or of Altaf ( Choorian Wala ? ) planted abroad. You never know. His main purpose is to plant such suggestions, to further break up, whatever is left off, of this land of the pure,called Pakistan.
saqibtahir
Heres the answer to your question, no one can destroy anyone unless the one wanna itself to be detroyed. How? just read the below.
http://express.com.pk/epaper/Article.aspx?newsID=1100388209&Date=20080415&Issue=NP_LHE
“Justice for selective people” gives way to injustice. And Javed chaudhry nailed it right in the head.
Zardari Sahib ko khatra hai k chief justice sahib ne agar 100% insaf karna shuroon kar dia to mera kia banay ga.
pppp is looking for any kind of guaranty that chief justice will not touch them.Jis tezi k satth zardari sahib k cases ko khatam kia ja raha hai kia yea insaf ho raha hai?
pppp k apnay haath main hai k us ne kaisay survive karna hai.
Waqt ka taqaza to yea hai k sub ko mil kar mulk ki khatir give and take ki policy par amal kar k mulk ko bachana hoga.
Agar sub log mil kar mushraf sahib ko izat k sath janay ka rasta day dain aur izat ka rasta yea hai k un se keh dia jai k sir aik saal k baad aap resign karain gay.
aur is aik saal k under sub kuch behtar karnay ki koshish ki jai.
warna pda apni tawnayan mushraf ko hatanay par laga kar sirf waqt zaya kar dain gay.
shukria
saeed
Holland
@Raja Saeed
What “IZZAT”?
If Moshe had an iota of IZZAT, he would have resigned long ago.
We have given him enough opportunity to Moshe to leave with his “IZZAT” This boogey should have died once MMA claimed that leting him stay untill 2003 as army chief is a way of accomplishing that. See what happened.
Then BB claimed to be doing the same thing. See what happened to her.
This does not work. He should be asked to resign immediately or face impeachment and disgrace.
Despite knowing the facts, Why quite?
Explanation of MQM coverage / representation at GEO the percentage of MQM stakes in the ownership of GEO will serve as most critical reason.
@saqibtahir
You want everyone to analyze PPP the way you do, which is not how it works. Every credible news analyst (Rauf Klasra, Ansar Abbasi, etc.) and TV anchor (Talat, Kashif, Bolta Pakistan dup, Hamid Mir, etc.) has raised questions on PPP’s not-so-clear stance on the judiciary, and the emphasis here is “every credible”, so, from your definition, they must also hate PPP?
Every PPP participant that I have seen on the TV shows have had vague arguments on this matter. You want people to praise Zardari even if he sneezes? It does not work like this way my friend. He will get a pat on the back if he does something right, if not then he will be criticized and this is the essence of democracy, that is, the right to ones opinion whether you agree with it or not and not “hate mongring” as you have termed it.
If you go back on the past postings on this site, you will see that I had criticized NS a lot but so far I have seen him sticking to his stance and he has earned some of my respect but that does not mean that I will blindly start praising him for everything.
Janabs…
dont be so happy on this news…though its nice to hear this…but the thing still to be worried about is the next move of musshi…we all know he’s been keeping quiet for long now…and we all know how sharp n evil minded he is…and also, we all know that zardari & Co cant be angels…of course they are in pressure right now…but…things can change as well…
we can just wait…and see…
i agree with a brother who posted the comment ‘nothing is done untill its done’….
The only thing that Mafias hate from the bottom of their heats is independent judiciary.
http://express.com.pk/epaper/Article.aspx?newsID=1100388648&Date=20080416&Issue=NP_LHE
@saqibtahir
Let me add my voice in your support , just like everybody I do also have my convictions and honestly I would trust PPP more than for example PML-N. It does not mean that I do not trust PML-N but it is just a matter of conviction. In arabic there is word called Raib ( e.g La-raib ba feehai, i.e 3rd verse of 2nd Surah) , this word means a doubt that keeps disturbing your heart, one of the example of such a doubt is if you are in a desert and staying in a tent , and you have doubt that there is some snake inside the tent until and unless you check every nook of the tent you won’t feel comfortable , this sort of doubt is different from normal , until it is removed your heart does not rest in peace.
There are people who have the similar doubt about PPP , until and unless the judges are restored , this doubt will keep bugging them. BTW I have a similar doubt about PML-N , no matter how much Nawz Sharif and Javaid Hashmi say that they are anti-establishment , the thing keeps bugging me that they are not
@
pejamistri
PPP leadership is responsible for creation of such a doubt . if you analyze their statements, it is not hard to conclude that they are hiding many things from people e.g
every time when TV anchor ask will judges be restored in 30 days
PPP answers: Ji Lekin konsay 30 din abhi yeh faisla nahi hua….lol
Will CJ be allowed to work
PPP answers: Parliament will decide….we have not committed about duration of judges
and now latest
one of PPP guy said Ilan Marri Koi Aasmani Saheefa Nahi jo tabdeel na ho sakay
so PPP should tell very clearly yes or no……i will have no objection if they come straight and say that
“We have votes of people and we will not restore any judges as you stupids voted us and why you are crying for judges , it was not written in our manifesto”
that will be nice….as Munafiks are very very dangerous …..and PPP is doing Munafakat
@sleepingnation
Let me tell you some history. Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto won the majority seats in west Pakistan , however had far less seats as compared to Mujib who won every single seat in east Pakistan. ZAB said that he would be willing to negotiate with Mujib and accepts that he (Mujib) should be the prime minister , but he wanted to have him on the negotiation table for his (Mujib’s) six point agenda. ZAB as leader of political party raised many slogans, he was against Yahya — the military junta , and knew the plans of Mujib who was in communication with india to break the country. If ZAB had not said the things he said after the 1970 elections and pretended that he is with Mujib, many people would agree that even than Yahya would not have transferred power to Mujib and Mujib would have broken the country in any case. People are there who still suspects that ZAB was the party in breaking the country.
Let me give you another example , BB negotiated with Musharraf , forced him to allow her to come to Pakistan, got NRO a bad name for her (just like Bhutto got “Idher hum, Idher Tum” attributed to him). All the people who have similar “Raib- doubt” about PPP will still say that BB had a “deal” with Musharraf. And Musharraf allowed her to come back and contest the election.
Now let’s look at the end result of both examples. Country was broken in 1971 , Bhutto became the Prime Minister , (During 1970 and 1971 war “everbody — with “Raib- doubt” about ZAB) kept screaming that Bhutto was an ally of Yahya and military Junta), but what happens , within 7 years Bhutto is executed by the same military Junta , and he proved once and for all that he was never an ally of the military Junta. This is what is called “La-Raib” that you prove once and for all.
In the second example , “BB did the deal with Musharraf” as they say. Came back to Pakistan. She ensured that the elections are held relatively transparent. I am sure that it was only BB who made it possible (by whatever means including pressure from United States and including her ultimate sacrifice) to force the mad dictator to hold a “free and fair” elections. Note that she did not do it for her party. Musharraf was forced to do the election that allowed NS to win too. And finally BB is murdered by the “Establishment” , even her arch rivals accept that she was murdered by the establishment. So did she do the deal? This is what I call “La-Raib” that is remove the doubt completely.
Moral of the story is that ZAB , BB were not responsible for creation of such doubt , Bhutto perception as military junta ally and BB doing the deal with Musharraf. You would say that yes they were responsible for such doubt , that is where “conviction” comes in. Your conviction will be different from mine.
As for the matter of current PPP stance is concerned. I put it at the same level as the deal of BB with Musharraf. PPP has to get something out of the military junta , they damn care about these perceptions of being Munafiq or Momin. And to tell you the truth they are not being Munafiq , as they are telling the truth when saying they don’t know about 30 days , the battle is on-going , their objective is to restore the judges however they know that chances are that they ay fail to do so. Therefore they are not committing it. It is exactly the way BB never ruled out the possibility of working with Musharraf , and you see at the moment “everybody is working with Musharraf including the NS’s team”. So the truth of the matter is PPP seems more Momin than others
@
pejamistri
i completely disgaree with your fake logics
anyway in the mean time there is a news that PPP is considering to reduce the duration of CJ..so one catch comes out …we are waiting for other catches
You started from Bhutto……fact was Mujeeb was in majority and Bhutto in collaboration with Military broke that country just to become PM….
Benezir made a deal with USA and now your leadership is claiming that she was killed by foriegn powers…..such a twist why US will kill one who is going to do those wonders which Mush was not able to do…..all the time PPP make twisting statement and they think we are doing politics..let me tell you it is not 1980s its 2008 ……people are much aware and those old tricks which you explained in your post with great detail will not work…..let us wait and see
I completely agree with you. Ameerulmomnin General Zia-ul-Haq did the greatest favor to this nation by executing the culprit of breaking the Pak Ser Zamin of Huzrat Maulana Quaid-e-Azam Muhammd Ali Jinnah Rahmatullah Alaih (R.A).
God bless his teeths rest in peace.
No more discussion sorry.
You proved my fack logic without doubt.
@
pejamistri
“Ameerulmomnin General Zia-ul-Haq did the greatest favor to this nation by executing the culprit of breaking the Pak Ser Zamin of Huzrat Maulana Quaid-e-Azam Muhammd Ali Jinnah Rahmatullah Alaih (R.A).
God bless his teeths rest in peace”
its your opinion not mine …..so now please stick to your opinion
@sleepingnation
It is time to wake up !
@
zia m
this nation still need time to wake up..when they will wake up you will not see people like zardari . mush and lataf making decision of peoples fate
@pejamistri
I do not want to get into the discussion of who was responsible for the breaking of Pakistan. But I would like to mention here that Zia, no matter how strong he was as the COAS, did not have the balls to hang ZAB on his own. It was done with the consensus and backing of the US.
Now as for BB/Moshe/US/uniform, etc.; it was the Bush think tank that came up with the plan that in order to legitimize Moshe, BB should be brought into the equation to support him (Moshe). That plan had the blessing of Dick Chaney. NRO was also the outcome of that plan and I do not know whether BB had demanded it or not; most likely she did. But the way it stands now is, and I am sure you will not deny it, that all those powerful people who have sucked the blood out of this country are enjoying the benefits of this draconian law.
@Amir Hameed
“@saqibtahir
You want everyone to analyze PPP the way you do, ..Every credible news analyst… has raised questions on PPP’s not-so-clear stance on the judiciary”
Might I add that had PPP been clear about the issue, then why would the April 15 decision be needed. And please don’t blame it on “establishment” as I did not hear ONE PPP person — and I heard pleant — giving a clear answer on the subject. In fact what they were saying was the complete opposite and fighting against restoration (see the statements of the three PPP stooges Naik, Awan, and Khosa, e.g.)
@Pejamistri is right when he says “There are people who have the similar doubt about PPP , until and unless the judges are restored.” Why shouldn’t we?
It will take time (might be several generations) to get rid of the families from national level who owe their STATURE to the Generals.
@Amir Hameed
Agreed Zia never had the balls to hang ZAB, just like Musharraf did not have the balls to hang Nawaz Sharif , it was just that ZAB was more at the wrong end of the world than Nawaz Sharif.
As for the return of BB, please don’t give the complete credit to US for this. For whole 8 years the elephant kept supporting whole heartedly the mad dictator , they could have kept him supporting for another 8 years just like they kept supporting Zia until he died even though BB’s return on 10th April 1986 was similar to 18th October 2008. Benazir did a lot of work to get the support of right quarters for whole 8 years , she matured as a politician during her exile along with Nawaz Sharif , certain steps proved the maturity of both politicians which included:
1. Charter of Democracy.
2. Nawaz Sharif and Benazir kept their communication channel opened even after disagreement in the APC.
3. Nawaz Sharif’s agreement to contest the elections even after announcing the bycott.
All of the above along with the unprecedented movement of the lawyers shaped the whole situation in Pakistan, personally I never buy the argument of US think tanks coming up with any novel ideas like this. Specially I think Bush and his team along with their think-tanks are incapable of such things
Finally for NRO you would be little surprised to hear my opinion
, I believe that in Pakistan parliament should make a law in which politicians (those who are now in government i.e PPP ANP PML(N)) are declared as sacred cows just like there are laws for Army and Judiciary. No authority in Pakistan should be able to do any accountablity of them only a parliamentary committee should look into their financial scams 
. Off course this law should be for few years perhaps 10 or so.
So in a way I support NRO , but I do not support all of the clauses of NRO specially those which do not apply to politicians , BTW do you know one of the biggest beneficiary of the NRO is no other than Mansoor-ul-Haq and his associates who did the biggest scam of the Pakistan before the 1999 , after that however there had been much bigger scams.
@nota
I agree you should be suspecious of PPP , I am sure you can not help that. However do pray that PPP come up to the expectations just like I am praying. Let me give you some more consolation , ZAB was not a practising muslim (I believe) , and he was not in favor of using religion for any political gains , however when it came to accepting the people sentiments he used “Islam is our religion” and then banned alcohol. So although he perhaps did not agree with these things he did them. Similarly I hope Asif Zardari and some other big leaders of the PPP may not be in favor of restoring CJ and some other judges in the end they may have to due to the public pressure/sentiments.
@pejamistri
I agree with you.
With the threat of Article 58(2)(b) hanging over this parliament, I simply cannot understand why a resolution has not been moved in parliament to date to (a) suspend this article effective immediately, thus taking out Musharraf’s ability to dismiss this parliament and (b) to set a time frame to repeal this article altogether. I wish one of our famous journalists – Talat Husain or Mr Mir or Messrs Javed & Minhas or whoever would do a programme on this right away and get the political parties – both for and against – to explain the reason for this delay.
@Amir Hameed,
PPP is vy clear about judiaciary issue. They have obligations as per Charter of Democracy and Muree declaration. PPP is not elected by people on judiaciary issue. PPP has no moral, legal or political obligation to restore judges based on the election mandate. So they should not be blamed even if they refuse to restore judges. They have reasons to dump these judges:
1) CJ and his lawyers have screwed thir case themselves fter their first success in July. They deepened the crisis after picking fight after fight with Mush.
2) C J and his lawyers never took PPP or NS in confidence and didn’t keep PPP of NS’s interest in mind. So why should they bother?
3) These judges are part and parcel of Mush regime and part of all the crimes commited against constitution and political leadership.
4) Did these judges bother when Zardari, YRG, NS, SS, JH and thousands more political workers were languishing in jails. Did they give any relief to a single anti-Mush politician?
So if judges are bruised in the internal fight with their bed fellow generals, why they want their own convicted Hijacker (NS), traitor (JH), nepotist (YRG) and never convicted Zardari to bail them out? Do they think AZ and NS are cleners of their mess?
PPP is more interested in cleaning the consitutional mess created by corrupt unholy alliance of Judges and Generals. They both consider them the holy cows. Restoring them without restoring the original constitution is not going to do any good except seeing another Prime Minister being convicted as hijacker or murderer.
PPP, NS and ANp are committed to Muree declaration and trust each other. There is no need to cast doubts on their intentions. The issue is not as simple. There are many variables, legal issues, and pressures that have to be dealt with. End of the day some compromise solution will emerge. We must wait for the collective wisdom of the parliament and give them their time.
In the end I would say that NAZRIYA-E-ZAROORAT is not proprietry to Judges and Generals. Parliament (that is supreme in theory) has its own needs and obligations to their electorate.
@sleepingnation
Probably you ae sleeping in ssome nook in a cozy bedroom with no wwindows. Pakistani nation is not sleeping. They have given their verdict against Mush as well as APDM and its lawyer’s boycott call. Also probably you have not yet heard that Zardri’s party has been elected to power by this nation through PURCHI.
@straightarrow,
Removalof 58-2B cannot be done without 2/3 majority in senate. YRG is talking about Mush’s impeachment almost every day by saying ‘this matter will be dealt by parliament’. I hope this issue is on cards of YRG government. Cannot you see the face of Mush in front of YRG in pictures. They hardly talk to each other.
@saqibtahir
Regarding restoration you say ‘So why should they bother?” Please DON’T!. Let’s see if PPP leadership has the b@lls to stick to their beliefs.
Later you add: “Pakistani nation is not sleeping. They have given their verdict against Mush as well as APDM and its lawyer’s boycott call.”
Do you seriously believe that? Like I said I challenge you jiyalas to stick to that and we will see what follows.
@Pejamistri
Keeping that ZAB and “Islam is our religion” example in mind, also remember where did it lead ZAB to… Everyone knew ZAB and “Islam is our religion” coming from him was seen for what it was. PPP might restore judges now but any gains they might have had from the act has certainly been lost — jiyalas excepted of course.
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