senator babar awan has got some personal issues with supreme court judges,he and his other 2 famous ppp’s croonies are the ones who are forcing the judges issue out.
I think I found the issue. My video encoder software auto-updated itself and its not encoding files properly. Trying to downgrade and will re-upload all the new videos.
@dmiin: the premium video seems to end after 14 minutes.. though the length is 94 mb. Looks like after 14 minutes.. there is some bogartness.. even mp3 stops at 14 minutes.
Q Lewser doesn’t know the clauses but wants to make it an issue.. and then he runs away… what an IDIOT! and babar awan looks so nice sitting next to PMLQ losers.. (not to mention sounding like them now)
At 23:00 , I am not very sure which Judge he is referring. There is no Judge who is “currently a leader more than a judge” and was ever deputy attorney general in Zia’s era. Iftikhar Chaudary was actually appointed as Judge in 1989 and was never deputy attorney general. The second “leader Judge” is Ramday who comes close to his definition but again he was not the deputy attorney general though he was appointed as judge in Zia’s era and was also additional advocate general in 1984.
Anybody knows who is he referring?
Advocate Wajih was appointed Standing Council for Federal Government in1984 and Advocate General Sindh on 19 November 1986 and elevated to the Bench of the SHC as a Judge in 1988
Raza Hayat is such a nauseating hypocrite who hides behind a cloak of civility but continues to spout irrelevent, nonsensical generalities . When confronted by Ahsan Iqbal to say which section of the 2006 Declaration conflicted with the Burban declaration he had no answer, only meaningless accusations…I have not read that document but I am inclined to believe in the integrity of Ahsan Iqbal when he explains the two instances where the PCO and judges are mentioned. If he is telling the truth …and it seems to me that he is clearly the restriction on judges from taking oath under the PCO relates to the future from the point of the 2006 declaration.So it is irrelevant that a judge may or maynot have taken oath under a PCO prior to the 2006 declaration. Mr. Hayat is a disgrace and is totally ill mannered and must never be invited to any of the talk shows .
For Babar Awan biasness , let me say that Babar Awan is an advocate and has his potential group in People Lawyers forum , the way he is talking and angry it seems to me that he has lost his group from lawyers and currently feeling very isolated. As he is not appointed as minister by Asif Zardari it seems to me that he is quite furstrated. Once Aitzaz Ahsan after running in by-elections comes back to Parliament , Babar Awan will be pushed more to the wall , he is currenly vying for senate chairman or attorney general position however since he lost in first round to Farooq Naik , it seems to me he is these days very furstrated. BTW I have been searching for his background , I am not sure but it seems that he graduation from IIU probably in Sharia and Law. It also seems to me that he was a jamatia before. can anybody confirm.
BTW I think despite his “reported” closeness with Zardari, if he was a jamatia , Zardari is never going to trust him and that is why perhaps he did not get the ministry in first round.
i humbly beg to differ but my hero cjp iftikhar chouhdry was in fact deputy attorney general of balochistan govt in zia’s era and was later on made judge of quetta high court which is also why he is quetta resident and the only other dude was my favourite and yours polay badshah (malik qayyum) who was actually deput attorney general for the govt of zia… cjp iftikhar chouhdry has twice taken oath under pco once when the govt of junejo was dismissed and then when nawaz was dismissed by under atricle 270 clause C which was induced into the constitution by the 17th ammendment all pco judges were understood to have taken oath under the constitution of pakistan.. thus nullyfying stupid claims of mqm dat restroration of judges is against COD
@rawk
I am sorry but it is very hard for me to believe as not only your information seems to be wrong but factually incorrect as well. According to my information mentioned in both wikipedia and BBC profile of Iftikhar Chaudary, he started his career in 1976 and worked as lawyer in balochistan high court till 1985 , then he became supreme court lawyer , 1989 he was appointed as advocate general balochistan and 1990 he was made the judge of balochistan high court.
Secondly you mentioned that he took oath when junejo government was dismissed , there was no judges after the dismissal of Junejo government , his government was not dismissed by a PCO instead it was dismissed by virtue of article 58-2(b) and there no new oath order.
However he did take oath as Judge in 1999/2000 after the dismissal of NS government.
I hope I am correct.
I also have problems with the video for premium user. Not just this one, but generally most of them hang in firefox after running it for a while. The blip version runs fine
Babar Awan used to be a quite logical person when he talks but in this particular program without even asking it seems like he was trying to make a point on all judiciary supporters including PMLN. Look at they way he was referring a judge (CJP may be) “Judge jo aajkal leader baney howey hain”. This was not part of argument and he was showing his dis-pleasure by saying i am bound to party decisions of COD and Murree declaration but……
Raza Hayat Haraj is such a looser to be invited in these programs. I remember a Capital talk for last year in which he was bitching about the lawyers movement justifying Musharraf and now today he is talking about being a lawyer i should support him. Disgusting hypocrite.
Anyone knows which news paper article Babar Awan is referring to while saying that he has sued the paper for 2 crore.
PMLN is clearly the jewel of Pakistani politics, all other parties (PPP, Q, MQM MMA etc.) are all very mediocre parties and a shame for all of us. look at this babar awan, i dont see any difference between him and the Q guy sitting next to him, shame on him.
Hamid Mir is getting back to his good old self, as long as he doesnt invite MQM. lol i dont know what he meant by “sharab ka glass sar pe rakh ke naachtay hain”, anyone know who hes talking about? he has said this line b4 as well, is talking abt Mushi? someone please tell me.
that remark was about the Q league guy.notice how he sinks back into his chair as meer says that . I remember meer has previously used this comment for this guy on the show as well to settle him down
I think having current ministers on board is a bit much.. these Q people (and that almost-Q person – Babar Awan) have nothing better to do.. and they are good at one thing.. infantile, imbecilic, and grovelingly subservient admiration for naked, unjust power. They did not make policies in 5 years. They defended them. They did not think for themselves. They shamelessly defended an FA pass yerkail’s bumblings as the re-incarnation of the acts of the apostles as it were..
These are the despicable characters, having nothing to do, polluting the airwaves with their stupidity and idletalk.. aimed only at collecting crumbs fallen from the tables of power.
@ pejamistri
dude im sorry about that.. somethings i was wrong about.. but here is something for you to check. do you know who an advocate general is. its more like the chief prosecuter you have for every state in the united states. so thats like the governments lawyer (meaning appointed by the current governtment in power) that i believe is what babar is referring too
lol no wonder ijaz was made the religious affairs minister, he lived upto the “enlightened moderate” expectations of Mushni. i havent read the book, can you elaborate on the story please?
Every anchorperson including Hamid Mir is afraid of MQM.Mir is in his true colours when no MQM politician is sitting there.We do not know how much pressure is being exerted on these hosts.MQM is a fascist party and Zia can never be forgiven for introducing this party just to compete Islamic parties in Karachi.
I think Hamid Mir’s remarks “sharab ka glass sar pe rakh ke naachtay hain”, were about Jam Sadiq Ali, if I am not mistaken. Long ago I read those comments in a newspaper. It all happened in Larkana when Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto invited Shah of Iran, Raza Shah Pehalvi at his place and Jam Sadiq Ali did that show to the much amusement of the guests.
lol kia kia namoonay hain hamari politics main bhi. but i think hamid mir was talking about ijazul haq because in an earlier program he made the same comment to ijazulhaq and ijaz replied if you have any proof, then present it.
What a shame that a decent and respectable guy like Ahsan Iqbal had to waste his time with a loser like Haraj. I mean you can see the desperation in these PML-Q guys, they want to create tension b/w PPP and PML-N at any cost but so far they have failed badly.
Babar Awan is also looking frustrated for not becoming Law minister.
Kashmala is good for providing some glamour on the show and thats it.
Though I dont know about the latter record of Babar Awan, but I know him from my days in Government College, Asghar Mall Rawalpindi when he was doing his masters degree. He was not Jamatia on those days though. But interestingly he was not allowed to run for the President of the Students Union because his academic record was bad and I guess his grades were very low. His reputation was very bad to say the least. He did a lot of drama bazi after a scuffle with his opponents and came with lot of bandages to show the students that he was beaten up when actually he actually ran away during the fight.
I think the newspaper Babar Awan is referring is daily Express because famous columnist Haroon Rashid wrote about his record of changing loyalties from one side to other.
@rawk
Yes advocate general is chief prosecuter of the province , but Babar Awan said he was Deputy attorney general who is usually appointed by the federal government, even if he confused DAG with Advocate General , IMC was never appointed by ZIA , he was appointed as Advocate General in 1989 in BB’s first stint.
@all
Any other ideas who Babar Awan is referring to?
the remark is about Mushi….. there was a picture/video of him dancing with a glass of wine on his head!!
i am quite surprised that in such a ‘learned gathering’ at pkpolitics people havnt seen this??? I will try and locate it and post the link….The glass and dance story was also quoted in Bolta Pakistan in an episode within last 2 weeks….and there they made a much clearer reference to Mush
mushi is well known for his love of dancing in army circles…apparently when the music is own he cant help himself niot getting up and start dancing
the way he shut up Hiraj when he was making up false stories and getting aggressive by being loud….H Mir gave him really dirty looks and told him since Hiraj has said that he doesnt want to speak he should not do so now!! LOL
@Malek
I am not sure if you will find the video of Mush dancing with the glass , however there is one video on youtube (again I have not seen it lately) , in which he is dancing on 14th of August or 23rd of March. However I have heard from several sources about this story (i.e. dancing with the wine glass on his head) in private gathering. Even in the video I quoted he apparently looks completely drunk.
Advocate Wajih was appointed Standing Council for Federal Government in1984 ,that is perhaps another way of saying Deputy Attorney General.
I just heard Justice Wajih taunt Babar Awan by saying that he is not only a good legal mind but also a good actor.
Babar is from islamabad, where his brothers/family are running some business in G6 sector. He was an active but unsuccessful student activist in his times.
His formative years carry a lot of impression of Zia era. The link below sheds some light on his personality:
Oh I wonder Raza Hayat is really an attorney. I think he is Jahil Attorney General’s stupid student or might works for Jahil Bay-zameerzada.
He did not even read about C.O>D and just started talking bull shi*.
He is so stupid that he does not even know that when a law is passed or treaty is signed on certain date then that law and treaty will be implemented in future from the day it was singned and not in the past.
Ahsan was right about the example of law about the prohibition of alcohol.
@peja
i have definitely seen the pic of dancing with glass on head, may be not the video
but what i stated about him dancing generally as soon as he hears the sound of music is from a very reliable source…. somenone who served with him as Brig for about 3 years
oh it was very nice to hear that q league 30 members and raza hayat is agree for restoration of judges.baber awan was looking very defenceve and having little strange views any ways musharaf dont have any sport at all which is good for our nation,thanksssssss
Hamid Mir, if you are reading this post, please clarify who you are referring to about dancing with a glass on his head. please eleborate on the story as lots of us want to know.
I think some of you guys are confusing babar awan with another babar awan who was a student leader of MSF Rawalpindi (or rather ghunda leader ). As far as I know this Babar Awan was never a well known student activist. He did his bachelors in Shariah Law from a university in Saudi Arabia, probably Madinah University, not from IIU Islamabad.
But this Babar Awan, presently of PPP, has a pretty colourfull past. Babar Awan has not done any doctorate from anywhere. He just uses Doctor with his name so as to sound more respectable.
He is a very shady character from extremely humble beginnings. He came into politics initially as a worker in muslim league in late 1980s. Then during the second administration of PPP, he joined Chattha’s group of muslim league which was an ally of PPP. There he started developing links with BB and then joined PPP.
He was a very mediocre lawyer in the beginning working mostly as a police tout in Rawalpindi but then in 1990s rose meticulously through the ranks. It was said that he had developed good relations with a couple of corrupt high court judges and started acting as their front man. It was quite well known that if your legal position was weak but you still wanted to win a case, then hire Babar Awan as by doing this, you would also be hiring the judge. This front man role made him a very rich lawyer.
This is exactly why he is so much against honest and independent judges because in the presence of such judges, characters like Babar Awan cannot succeed. It is a tragedy if Zardari is really listening to the advice of some one like him.
Babar Awan on judges regarding “PCO judges”:
”Baat to sach hai
Laikin baat hai rusvai ki”
A unwanted statement from Babar Awan. Why are the judges not allowed to return to their duties when they are showing a clear indication of changed mind? What about his own ranks?
He has already forgotten NRO.
What about:
ZAB was a part of dictatorial regime. Did he not change?
NS was a part of dictatorial regime. Has he not changed?
BB was clearly under the umbrella of the GHQ.
Why Babar Awan is unnecessarily pointing the fingers at judges? If someone changes for the better they should be appreciated. If the judges shall be punished then all wrong doing politicians also should be punished.
That is exactly what Ahsan Iqbal states at 28:30
Thank you Mr. Ahsan Iqbal for being fair!
babar awan was pointing out justice wajih as if u watch the program carefully when babar awan was calling the shots that this judge has became a leader but he was the advocate general in zia’s regime than at that time hamid mir said “is that the judge who luks wajih means luks gud”
so it was justice wajih about whom babar awan was talkin about
babar awan has got some serious issues with lawyers movement and the leaders of lawyers
benazir came to pakistan under the umbrella of NRO so should we start considering her a crook leader or should we take her who gave her life for democracy,
i think babar awan has got some personal matters to sort out as he was the lawyer of the famous “chak shahzad” case in which cj iftikhar took a suo-moto notice by a media report of ‘rauf klasra’ in news
babar awan at that point of time argues in the court with cj iftikhar openly that you are goin out of ur jurisdiction n that news bacame very famous
Actually Babar Awan is kind of person whose mission is always to upload Testes of their Boss to have benefits and this is what is doing.
Once he was worker of Raja Zafar Ul Haq and then one day he appeared at door of Ejaz Ul Haq in joggers to tell him that he is coming on foot after covering 30 Km distance from Gen. Zia ‘s grave.
Now a days he knows how his father Zardari is thinking about judges so he is talking what Zardari would be pleased to hear.
I feel my self closer to Ahsan Iqbal’s point of view of today’s episode. Yet I donot agree with his comparison between Bhutto and N Sharif. Bhutto once he decieded to revolt, created the first and only anti establishment party in Pakistan, the PPP and never looked back. N Sharif however continued to benifit from the likes of Hameed Gul and Asad Durrani. PMLN remained the party of establishment until he picked fights with practically every one around till the day he refused landing permission to the air craft carrying Musharraf back home. Till then every year he continued to visit the annual gathering of the extreme rightist forces at JABRA chowk, islamabad, pronouncing loud and clear his willingness to complete the mission of his political mentor, the marddod e azam Zia. He only started voicing his opposition to establishment when he was no more their blue eyed boy.
bhutto and ns were both created by establishment and they had both went against establishment now this is such a wague arguement ppl tend to give that oh bhutto was the one who went against the establishment during his peak and nawaz sharif dint,
the bottom line should be that who had learnt the lesson its not the argument that who learnt the lesson first or who second.
if we have to blame the judges than we should start blaming the whole pakistan as 70% of the population born in some how during the martial law periods so are we all croonies of martial laws
sick n tired of the arguments about the judges,some one should ask babar awan the judges who is he taking the side right now aren’t they the ones who benefited ppp from NRO n dats the only reason of loving them otherwise there would be new judges all along of all the courts if ppl would go after the idea of babar awan.
I don’t think Ahsan Iqbal’s intention was to make a complete comparison. ZAB and NS are two (very) different personalities……….. ZAB was far more intelligent, but nevertheless a (very) limited comparison (as Ahsan Iqbal did it) is appropriate.
People like Raza Hayat Haraj feel that they can build their political profile by appearing repeatedly on talk shows but they only end up as buffoons thorugh their self-defeating arguments. His trying to prove himself accurate on the Charter of Democracy was as puerile as his consistent poking of fun at Hamid Mir. I don’t know why people like him don’t realise they are on air and being watched and judged by the millions.
Dr Babar Awan was another disappointment. Just see how he tried to sound big by describing his ‘crap’ as ‘Baat tu sach hay magar baat hay ruswai ki’. Hamid Mir’s prompt repartee that there was nothing like that about what he was referring to the deposed judges, was a timely smack to this representative of the ‘loony left’.
I think this is quite obvious even to “poola pala” people.
In 1988, she came by striking a deal. If you don’t believe listen recent interview of Mumtaz Bhutto with Ajj tv who was a part of hardcore PPP at that time.
During Mush times, BB first signed COD with NS and then violated it by striking NRO with Mush.
She was also key to help Mush survive 8 years and even in his re-selection as president.
During APC, she was absent because of Fazlu was there and now Fazlu is their ally.
At Bugti ‘s death, she was reluctant to start a movement.
Babar Awan is putting forward a perverted logic. CJP is not a PCO judge after the 17th Amendment. Although, I think that taking oath under pco in 1999 was equally reprehensible. Ahsan did a wonderful job. Babar looked disgruntled. Kishmala and Haraj are just ordinary.
the example is NRO which was issued by some one who was the head of the GHQ at that time,ppp and his croonies welcome that as that was the only way to got away of all the illegal money of zardari
this is the reason why zardari is so scared of these judges to come back as they might nullified the NRO
imran khan has no right to give away any body’s corruption
if zardari is that clear and believed that he was politically malifide than why dont he bring all his cases infront of this supreme court which 88% ppl of pakistan wanted to come back,
this will clear him but he kant do this as every one knows that where this all the money come from.
I suppose you know in which context my remark came. For clarification purpose I think we agree that both ZAB, NS and BB has worked with or under GHQ/establishment. As far as I remember BB has herself stated that her government was not always at the helm of affairs.
Let’s not start the same old worn out debate. Let’s rise above party politics and have issue based positions. You have yourself shown that you don’t share Babar Awan’s opinion on the judge’s issue. In the long run that will benefit both your and my case. I suppose we both want to bring a change in Pakistan for rule of law, elimination of poverty, better education etc. What do you think?
commoner is acting like a typical pipliya who just using old arguments oh luk how many workers had given their lives away for democracy so in result let ppp be on a spree that they can do whatever they wanted to do and rest of the pakistan should stay shut
ppp dont want judges back
ppp dont want a change in foreign policy
ppp wanted to take musharaf’s stance on kashmir policy
ppp would love to give access to american about nuclear ideas
so one can imagine and ppp can do only if you dont put the pressure on them.
otherwise they would go on a khaba programme if no body stops them
This is what I wrote some time back in another thread regarding Jiyala sacrifices:
—————————
No doubt PPPP workers have time and again laid their lives for their passion for PPPP, but who cares about these lives? Does PPPP high ranking leaders? Yes, they do when they want to shut the mouth of opponents, but what else?
When MQM murdered those poor PPPP workers in broad daylight in Karachi everywhere there was a hue and cry over the damned killings of innocent people. What have PPPP done for them except asking people to “forget” the incident. Even the honourable AA has stated that we should forget the killings. WHY? PPPP is demanding a UN probe on who killed BB. That is fair and a good idea to find out who the culprits were, but why not implement the same standards for the PPPP workers? Why? Because they are poor and don’t have any political influence? Who gave PPPP leadership to use the poor people as canon fodder?
thats exactly what i m tryin to say that these ppp croonies should stop crying over now and deal with the real issues
they are the ones who has got problem with every single issue whether it is the judges issue or musharaf itself and on the other hand they are the ones who are beating the bush out about dictatorship n i realy dont understand that why the hell they dont make a move with pml-n who wanted to get rid off all this.
thats why i m sayin that they are the one who is benefited most so its hard for them to say no
Like a typical PPP hater you have only false allegations.
By saying that Mumtaz Bhutto was a part of hardcore PPP in 1988 shows your dearth of knowledge about the history of politics in Pakistan. He created Sindh, Baloch , Pashtoon front in 1985 and started advocating for confederation of Pakistan instead of Federation. In 1989 he joined Sind National Front so he was in the anti federalist camp and was not “a part of hard core PPP” at that time. Yet establishment has always supported him while the awam have mostly ignored him.
And you are quoting him, what a pity.
Would you please enlighten us by saying how exactly BB helped survive Musharraf for 8 years. Wasnt PPP in opposition in the previous assembly along with PMLN. Werent patriots chipped away from PPP. It was the holy mullahs of Mutihida majlis e hammal who helped Mush prolonge his rule by supporting 18 amendment . PPP and PMLN opposed it. It was Imran Khan who supported Mush’s referundum for a uniformed president.
Shed your blind hatred against the only truly federalist party of Pakistan.
forget about the last 8 years ppp on directions of BB ditch the whole political alliance when they needed ppp most,
to clear your ignorance it was ppp who abstain in national assembly while rest of all the parties had resigned from the national assembly n by doin that ppp n BB had given musharaf a leverage of ligitimising his election .
for that dedication of ppp they had been previliged with NRO
so its better that if we dont go into the past,ppp should now do whatever rest of the political parties are doing,just get rid of dictatorship instead of helping it to get more stronger and get some more acts of multan,karachi n lahore
by the way what is stopping ppp to remove attorney general is it is your beloved party who is leading the co-alition
How long would you like the witch hunting to continue. Isnt it suficient evidence that all the initiators of corruption cases against PPP had to lick the spit , starting from GIK, Leghari, Saif ur Rehman , Mian sb and now Musharraf.
The fact is all the le palaks of establishments cannot take on PPP in the adalat of awam so they resort to false cases and witch hunting. Since they cannot defeat them in elections they want them to be left out on any other pretext.
Still PPP has emerged victorious in the eyes of awam always.
their biggest asset and undoubtedly the biggest leader in current pakistan stature got killed and her party couldn’t even get a simple majority
blessing in disguise was that the area where she got killed ppp only managed to get 1 seat out of 14
so mate i aint witch hinting,if you are a ppp supporter than try to find out the reason of this performance
if you are proud of this performance that after the killing of their beloved leader ppp managed to get just 20 odd seats and u calling it big shots than get ready in next elections ppp will be in factions if they wouldn’t change their politics style and dont take the clear stance
PPP was never a part of your opposition (why dont you call it APDM, is it dead?), so it never left it , it was Mian sb who left you, high and dry. Your frustration is understandable.
And ABSTAINING is not VOTING.
Mush had the required votes any way, even if you and I dont like it.
PPP made Mush shed his ” second skin”, something which APDM couldnot do.
PPP made him hold relatively free and fair election which had one of the highest voters turn out in the recent past.
And now the PPP-PMLN-ANP coalition is set to restore the judiciary.
As far Poopat Ram, there must always be a comedien in every succesful film.
watching a crime and stay quiet and become part of the crime,you will get the punishment from an open court so dont give this childish argument of abstaining n not voting
as far as sheddin off musharaf’s uniform,the process started on 9th march 2007 n it was on record what stern reaction of BB about AA of becomin cj’s lawyer
holdin out the free n fair elections wasn’t ppp’s act,it was a due course after the killin of BB and one crisis after another.
even the whole top leadership of ppp got killed(god forbidden)ppp wont be able to get 2/3 majority as they always hav got some dodgy characters in their party who always waits for some short cuts like babar awan.
its ppp’s ministers who are calling musharaf an asset n the china trip a wonderful experience no body else n dont forget he is the same man whom your leader has held criminal in her last letter to mark seigel.
so mate you got to luk at urself before pointing out at any other party
its not about the political party supporting,its about the issues tht who deals with real issues
i knw that for fact that NS himself is not an ideal character but right now he is takin a right stance whether he is takin it for his personal grudge against musharaf or is he for real no body knows but he is close to what public wants in paksitan but on the other hand zardari seems like he is tryin his best to save musharaf
please check your party’s stance on the matter you mentioned in your post above…..very recently (3-4 days) Khawaja Asif and Ahsan Iqbal on two different Capital Talk shows catagorically stated that “BB was the biggest reason for achieving democarcy in Pakistan and said that we were at this stage because of the BB’s vision….Please watch those shows and then come back to the forum and take back your words..because your beloved leaders don’t agree with you….
i totally agree with you..zardari and co are fulfilling those committements made by late benezir with their foriegn masters..just to hide their position they brought a conspiracy theory that benezir was killed by foriegn powers…..absolutely hypocritic
@TK
Well said, sir! I won’t mind becoming a premier member to get these details. By the way what is your take on Dr Babar Awan? What may have gone wrong with him? Is he trying to do Zardari’s or someone’s else bidding? What good would come out of it when they know the restoration of judges is a foregone conclusion. See how he tried to contradict what Kh Saad Rafiq said in the previous edition of Capital Talk.
I have been told by a very source close to Presidency that in one party Mush got so drunk that he danced with a glass full of sharab on top of his head. Other hot gossip is that Muhammad Ali Durrani ex-information minister used to supply girls to Mush for ‘haram kaam’.
Shame of Raza Harrat for being taking over the role of Sher Afghan.
Kashmala is not only pretty but heading towards right direction by joining hands with NS soon.
Babar Awan is a new Sher Afghan and Wasi Zafar in making. People like him will be remembered with ‘black letters’ in history of Pakistan.
I just heard a GEO news headline stating some foul language was used in assembly against Kashmala Tariq to day and there was a protest of sorts because of it. Can’t find the details yet….
Interesting News: Dissenting PML-Q members approach PML-N ‘Like-minded group’ led by Kashmala Tariq, Riaz Fatiana, Jaffar Leghari and Ghulam Mohiuddin wants to be ‘accommodated’ into the ruling coalition
i don’t think Kashmala tariq has any right of forming a forward or like minded group.
She is not even elected, she is selected. So In my opinion she does not have any right to go against the party policy regardless of the party or its policies.
By the way I am very very against all these quota seats for woman.
First these seats are filled by selection, not by election
Secondly, quota system for such a high office is never justified. One wants best people on these positions.
@engineer
“i don’t think Kashmala tariq has any right of forming a forward or like minded group.
She is not even elected, she is selected. So In my opinion she does not have any right to go against the party policy regardless of the party or its policies.
By the way I am very very against all these quota seats for woman.”
Completely agree. From all these “selections” that I know about, not one belongs there. They seem to always e filled by relatives of politicians or women having relations with politicians (present case not excepted). No one is deserving of the position.
Raza Hayat is a complete tool and fraud who’s trying to act like a simple and honest man. His intent is to create drama about the restoration of the judiciary to gain political points. This is exactly the type of person you don’t want in the opposition because all he’ll do is waste time and create fights.
@engineer and nota: But it’s exactly the quota system that Jinnah wanted for Muslims in India and Hindus used the same arguement you are. The fact of the matter is you have to help people who are in a vulnerable position.
Read yesterday’s Jang….Shahbaz sharif has met the principal officer of American Consulate in Lahore yesterday….and these meetings have beeen going on since Sharif’s have come back…would you be willing to say that Sharif’s policies are also influenced by West……If shaheed BB or Zardari meet americans you guys say that their policies are influenced by west…when Sharifs meet americas some how it vanishes in the thin air….This is a BIG HYPOCRACY….and mutwalas and piyalas committ it every day….
dude, chill out, i thot you are educated persona and I can reason with you.
There is a difference in isolation and independence.
Bhutto was the one who guided Pakistan on the independent foreign Policy and I respect him for this and many more things he did.
He never refused to meet american officials but he never followed their line.
I can quote a very specific example and back it with some credible references but I think it would be waste of time. You already got your mind made up about this issue.
What is there to chill out…I just pointed out a hypocracy….Second….There is big difference in 70s and 90s. Back in 70s it was a bipolar world and in 90s it is unipolar world…..all BB did was that she rationalized the foreign policy according to the needs of time…..she is not the only one who did…all the countries changed and rationalized their policies….foreign policy is not a “Static and rigid” organisim that cannot be changed…I all for BB’s rationalization. She was a smart women….As for NS…read about NS’s rationalization of foreign policy in a book “Engaging India”. It gives details of NS’s visit to the US after Kargil…the depiction is shameful for any Pakistan…
It took them the execution of the first democratically elected PM, 30 precious years, three martial laws and an entire lost generation to realise and grudgingly admit that ZAB was a great leader, it will take them the double the time and effort to appreciate the true stature of BB(because she was a woman).
not exactly bro, the ppl who had grudge with Bhutto, still says he is the worst thing happened to Pakistan and some of the PPP minister say that person is an asset.
Well said. I fully agree…all I am asking them to admit what their leaders admit in public….which is “the democracy we have today is because of the politics of BB only”……
incorrect…….BB was alive when she convinced NS to take part in the election….He admits that he was convinced by her…your stateement is abosolutely incorrect….
I honestly believe that BB served democracy better by her death
She was useless for democracy when she was alive. Her death creates a nice romantic story and we needed that.
When she was alive , she was almost an American agent.
no offence taken….don’t worry…it is just a discussion forum..I don’t get personal…..you have a right to choose your leader…I hope you agree…I have right to make rightful oberservations on political/public figures….
@Amir Hameed: Personally, for me what is more important is that the acts of Nov 3 are explicitly declared Null & Void and moshe is stripped of his veneer of legitimacy and is tried for treason! He has NOT made any effort to have the action indemnified .. even though the Gobar court did say it would have to be indemnified.
I think if that precedent is set, I will take some gymnastics on CJ but we ABSOLUTELY have to make sure that Nov 3 is called and Illegal act and all those (moshe and accomplices) people are brought to their “Kaifar-e Kirdaar” on this. All judges should be restored and then I’ll be able to look the other way on these gymnastics.. otherwise CJ should be restored for the psychological reasons alone.. if nothing else.
I think the govt should move quickly and just do it already.. BP is reporting that some douchbags (I think its that madar-ch-d Qasoori) are making a “charge sheet” for “attacking the symbol of federation” … never mind the 6 lawyers burned to a bloody crisp thanks to this kutta.
Babar Awan was acting like an idiot (any PPP Jyala here, may be SaqibTahir?). Raza Hyat was shamelsss, especially when he mentioned that Oct 1999 was a Martial Law, Nov 3 2007 was a sugar-coated Martial Law, but we support Moshe!!
Anyone having problem with video, please logout and login from pkpolitics.
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Can anyone confirm if the video is playing okay at their end?
The video is not playing perfectly.
Video stuck after 10-15 minutes ?
Video coming on blip in few minutes. Apologies for the trouble.
Admin
dude still not working man.. im a premium member… it aint working.. its not even playing
Video server rebooted, please check now. Video also coming on blip in 5 minutes.
Admin
Video deleted and loaded again on pkpolitics server. Blip version coming shortly.
Admin
Blip version added. I still need help to troubleshoot the issue. Please use premium player and let me know if someone is still having issue.
Admin
senator babar awan has got some personal issues with supreme court judges,he and his other 2 famous ppp’s croonies are the ones who are forcing the judges issue out.
I think I found the issue. My video encoder software auto-updated itself and its not encoding files properly. Trying to downgrade and will re-upload all the new videos.
Thanks for your patience.
Admin
I am starting to dislike Babar Awan.
@dmiin: the premium video seems to end after 14 minutes.. though the length is 94 mb. Looks like after 14 minutes.. there is some bogartness.. even mp3 stops at 14 minutes.
free is fine. I’m already at minute 20
PML-Q CATFIGHT!!! at minnit 12 hahaha.. I’m starting to like Kashmala Tariq (after she started her exercise regimen.. hmmmmmm…. )
I think blip does not read the timestamp information from flash file. Videos encoded yesterday are playing fine.
Admin
Q Lewser doesn’t know the clauses but wants to make it an issue.. and then he runs away… what an IDIOT! and babar awan looks so nice sitting next to PMLQ losers.. (not to mention sounding like them now)
At 23:00 , I am not very sure which Judge he is referring. There is no Judge who is “currently a leader more than a judge” and was ever deputy attorney general in Zia’s era. Iftikhar Chaudary was actually appointed as Judge in 1989 and was never deputy attorney general. The second “leader Judge” is Ramday who comes close to his definition but again he was not the deputy attorney general though he was appointed as judge in Zia’s era and was also additional advocate general in 1984.
Anybody knows who is he referring?
Waji
@pejamistri
I think he was refering to Justice Wajihuddin.
Advocate Wajih was appointed Standing Council for Federal Government in1984 and Advocate General Sindh on 19 November 1986 and elevated to the Bench of the SHC as a Judge in 1988
Raza Hayat is such a nauseating hypocrite who hides behind a cloak of civility but continues to spout irrelevent, nonsensical generalities . When confronted by Ahsan Iqbal to say which section of the 2006 Declaration conflicted with the Burban declaration he had no answer, only meaningless accusations…I have not read that document but I am inclined to believe in the integrity of Ahsan Iqbal when he explains the two instances where the PCO and judges are mentioned. If he is telling the truth …and it seems to me that he is clearly the restriction on judges from taking oath under the PCO relates to the future from the point of the 2006 declaration.So it is irrelevant that a judge may or maynot have taken oath under a PCO prior to the 2006 declaration. Mr. Hayat is a disgrace and is totally ill mannered and must never be invited to any of the talk shows .
kashmala lukin pretty today after losing sum weight. in govt she ate too much haram n grew fat n ugly
For Babar Awan biasness , let me say that Babar Awan is an advocate and has his potential group in People Lawyers forum , the way he is talking and angry it seems to me that he has lost his group from lawyers and currently feeling very isolated. As he is not appointed as minister by Asif Zardari it seems to me that he is quite furstrated. Once Aitzaz Ahsan after running in by-elections comes back to Parliament , Babar Awan will be pushed more to the wall , he is currenly vying for senate chairman or attorney general position however since he lost in first round to Farooq Naik , it seems to me he is these days very furstrated. BTW I have been searching for his background , I am not sure but it seems that he graduation from IIU probably in Sharia and Law. It also seems to me that he was a jamatia before. can anybody confirm.
BTW I think despite his “reported” closeness with Zardari, if he was a jamatia , Zardari is never going to trust him and that is why perhaps he did not get the ministry in first round.
Anybody know about him?
i humbly beg to differ but my hero cjp iftikhar chouhdry was in fact deputy attorney general of balochistan govt in zia’s era and was later on made judge of quetta high court which is also why he is quetta resident and the only other dude was my favourite and yours polay badshah (malik qayyum) who was actually deput attorney general for the govt of zia… cjp iftikhar chouhdry has twice taken oath under pco once when the govt of junejo was dismissed and then when nawaz was dismissed by under atricle 270 clause C which was induced into the constitution by the 17th ammendment all pco judges were understood to have taken oath under the constitution of pakistan.. thus nullyfying stupid claims of mqm dat restroration of judges is against COD
@hasheesh
Bro cut back on whatever you are smoking
@rawk
I am sorry but it is very hard for me to believe as not only your information seems to be wrong but factually incorrect as well. According to my information mentioned in both wikipedia and BBC profile of Iftikhar Chaudary, he started his career in 1976 and worked as lawyer in balochistan high court till 1985 , then he became supreme court lawyer , 1989 he was appointed as advocate general balochistan and 1990 he was made the judge of balochistan high court.
Secondly you mentioned that he took oath when junejo government was dismissed , there was no judges after the dismissal of Junejo government , his government was not dismissed by a PCO instead it was dismissed by virtue of article 58-2(b) and there no new oath order.
However he did take oath as Judge in 1999/2000 after the dismissal of NS government.
I hope I am correct.
@TK and/or anyone else,
Please test the Premium Video and let me know if it stops again. You can skip the first 10-14 minutes of video and then check to save time.
Admin
I checked till 20 minutes, and no problems in playback
@admin
I also have problems with the video for premium user. Not just this one, but generally most of them hang in firefox after running it for a while. The blip version runs fine
Babar Awan will be Governor Punjab soon…
@engineer,
Please let me know your bandwidth through speedtest.net.
Also please fix your email address in profile so I can contact you for troubleshooting.
Thanks,
Admin
@admin
here is the result
http://www.speedtest.net/result/259867888.png
download: 3505 kb/s
upload :2519 kb/s
ping: 179 ms
sorry admin, it is not correct result, let me run this thing again
ok here is the correct result
http://www.speedtest.net/result/259867888.png
sorry again, old link
this is the right one
http://www.speedtest.net/result/260341065.png
@engineer,
Seems like you are living inside the server. You should not have any issue, but let me know if you see anything again.
Admin
i think issue is not with the speed, issue is with the encoder/ decoder(flash player) of the video format you are using.
i dont have any problem with premium videos in firefox
@engineer,
I have uploaded a new video “Focus on Faeza” and will also upload Bolta Pakistan later tonight. Let me know if you see any problem with these two.
Admin
@admin
sure, will let you know
@engineer: man what kind of a BEAST pipe have you got? this is just obscene! (in a good way)
Video worked fine for me (premium one).
Babar Awan used to be a quite logical person when he talks but in this particular program without even asking it seems like he was trying to make a point on all judiciary supporters including PMLN. Look at they way he was referring a judge (CJP may be) “Judge jo aajkal leader baney howey hain”. This was not part of argument and he was showing his dis-pleasure by saying i am bound to party decisions of COD and Murree declaration but……
Raza Hayat Haraj is such a looser to be invited in these programs. I remember a Capital talk for last year in which he was bitching about the lawyers movement justifying Musharraf and now today he is talking about being a lawyer i should support him. Disgusting hypocrite.
Anyone knows which news paper article Babar Awan is referring to while saying that he has sued the paper for 2 crore.
Gentlemen
Following article goes over why the PPP wants to derail judges’ issue.
http://www.asiantribune.com/?q=node/10583
PMLN is clearly the jewel of Pakistani politics, all other parties (PPP, Q, MQM MMA etc.) are all very mediocre parties and a shame for all of us. look at this babar awan, i dont see any difference between him and the Q guy sitting next to him, shame on him.
Hamid Mir is getting back to his good old self, as long as he doesnt invite MQM. lol i dont know what he meant by “sharab ka glass sar pe rakh ke naachtay hain”, anyone know who hes talking about? he has said this line b4 as well, is talking abt Mushi? someone please tell me.
that remark was about the Q league guy.notice how he sinks back into his chair as meer says that . I remember meer has previously used this comment for this guy on the show as well to settle him down
I think having current ministers on board is a bit much.. these Q people (and that almost-Q person – Babar Awan) have nothing better to do.. and they are good at one thing.. infantile, imbecilic, and grovelingly subservient admiration for naked, unjust power. They did not make policies in 5 years. They defended them. They did not think for themselves. They shamelessly defended an FA pass yerkail’s bumblings as the re-incarnation of the acts of the apostles as it were..
These are the despicable characters, having nothing to do, polluting the airwaves with their stupidity and idletalk.. aimed only at collecting crumbs fallen from the tables of power.
Losers!
@ pejamistri
dude im sorry about that.. somethings i was wrong about.. but here is something for you to check. do you know who an advocate general is. its more like the chief prosecuter you have for every state in the united states. so thats like the governments lawyer (meaning appointed by the current governtment in power) that i believe is what babar is referring too
@traffic
Hamid Mir’s remark about sharab was about Ijaz ul Haq.If you go through a book
named ‘parliament se bazaar-e- husn tak’ you can read that incident in detail.
@ kashif
lol no wonder ijaz was made the religious affairs minister, he lived upto the “enlightened moderate” expectations of Mushni. i havent read the book, can you elaborate on the story please?
Every anchorperson including Hamid Mir is afraid of MQM.Mir is in his true colours when no MQM politician is sitting there.We do not know how much pressure is being exerted on these hosts.MQM is a fascist party and Zia can never be forgiven for introducing this party just to compete Islamic parties in Karachi.
@ Traffic
Dude in all seriousness do you really think PML-N is ‘the jewel of pakistani politics’? ….Really??
The PPP is a mediocre party……???
IMC refused to attend a phone call from BB upon reinstatement on July 20th. SInce then Khosas and and other jiyalas have a grudge against him.
@Kruman: So does that make Bilawal the messiah?
@ Traffic
I think Hamid Mir’s remarks “sharab ka glass sar pe rakh ke naachtay hain”, were about Jam Sadiq Ali, if I am not mistaken. Long ago I read those comments in a newspaper. It all happened in Larkana when Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto invited Shah of Iran, Raza Shah Pehalvi at his place and Jam Sadiq Ali did that show to the much amusement of the guests.
If you want to say dirty words about , Musharraf , Choudri Shujaat and co , MQM , you are welcome . but no opposition allow
@ safshan
lol kia kia namoonay hain hamari politics main bhi. but i think hamid mir was talking about ijazul haq because in an earlier program he made the same comment to ijazulhaq and ijaz replied if you have any proof, then present it.
What a shame that a decent and respectable guy like Ahsan Iqbal had to waste his time with a loser like Haraj. I mean you can see the desperation in these PML-Q guys, they want to create tension b/w PPP and PML-N at any cost but so far they have failed badly.
Babar Awan is also looking frustrated for not becoming Law minister.
Kashmala is good for providing some glamour on the show and thats it.
@ Pejamistri
Though I dont know about the latter record of Babar Awan, but I know him from my days in Government College, Asghar Mall Rawalpindi when he was doing his masters degree. He was not Jamatia on those days though. But interestingly he was not allowed to run for the President of the Students Union because his academic record was bad and I guess his grades were very low. His reputation was very bad to say the least. He did a lot of drama bazi after a scuffle with his opponents and came with lot of bandages to show the students that he was beaten up when actually he actually ran away during the fight.
I think the newspaper Babar Awan is referring is daily Express because famous columnist Haroon Rashid wrote about his record of changing loyalties from one side to other.
@rawk
Yes advocate general is chief prosecuter of the province , but Babar Awan said he was Deputy attorney general who is usually appointed by the federal government, even if he confused DAG with Advocate General , IMC was never appointed by ZIA , he was appointed as Advocate General in 1989 in BB’s first stint.
@all
Any other ideas who Babar Awan is referring to?
Raza Hayat pathetic pathetic & only pathetic
media should not invite these kind of negative pathetic’s those criticize 4 nothing just giving wrong opinions to public.
@ Traffic
the remark is about Mushi….. there was a picture/video of him dancing with a glass of wine on his head!!
i am quite surprised that in such a ‘learned gathering’ at pkpolitics people havnt seen this??? I will try and locate it and post the link….The glass and dance story was also quoted in Bolta Pakistan in an episode within last 2 weeks….and there they made a much clearer reference to Mush
mushi is well known for his love of dancing in army circles…apparently when the music is own he cant help himself niot getting up and start dancing
Good to see H Mir back in real action!!
the way he shut up Hiraj when he was making up false stories and getting aggressive by being loud….H Mir gave him really dirty looks and told him since Hiraj has said that he doesnt want to speak he should not do so now!! LOL
Malek, do post if you find that pic/video of dancing =d
great show .hamid mir zindabad
@Malek
I am not sure if you will find the video of Mush dancing with the glass , however there is one video on youtube (again I have not seen it lately) , in which he is dancing on 14th of August or 23rd of March. However I have heard from several sources about this story (i.e. dancing with the wine glass on his head) in private gathering. Even in the video I quoted he apparently looks completely drunk.
@pejamistri
Mush Dancing</a
See “Related Videos’ as well…
@Pejamistri
Advocate Wajih was appointed Standing Council for Federal Government in1984 ,that is perhaps another way of saying Deputy Attorney General.
I just heard Justice Wajih taunt Babar Awan by saying that he is not only a good legal mind but also a good actor.
Babar is from islamabad, where his brothers/family are running some business in G6 sector. He was an active but unsuccessful student activist in his times.
His formative years carry a lot of impression of Zia era. The link below sheds some light on his personality:
http://express.com.pk/images/NP_LHE/20080406/Sub_Images/1100382528-2.gif
Oh I wonder Raza Hayat is really an attorney. I think he is Jahil Attorney General’s stupid student or might works for Jahil Bay-zameerzada.
He did not even read about C.O>D and just started talking bull shi*.
He is so stupid that he does not even know that when a law is passed or treaty is signed on certain date then that law and treaty will be implemented in future from the day it was singned and not in the past.
Ahsan was right about the example of law about the prohibition of alcohol.
@BABU FROM USA on April 17th, 2008 10:17 am
“Oh I wonder Raza Hayat is really an attorney. I think he is Jahil Attorney General’s stupid student ”
Well, remember Wasi Zafar?
I hate Babar Awan since I first saw him.
He is “Jugariya” who has penetrated deep inside PPPP with his God gifted qualities.
Did you see him with Hamid Mir in very first Capital Talk after death of Benazir Bhutto. One could clearly see the way he was acting.
@peja
i have definitely seen the pic of dancing with glass on head, may be not the video
but what i stated about him dancing generally as soon as he hears the sound of music is from a very reliable source…. somenone who served with him as Brig for about 3 years
Who Hamid refers “dancing with glass on head”? He said this many times in quite alot of programmes. Can anybody tell who is referring?
oh it was very nice to hear that q league 30 members and raza hayat is agree for restoration of judges.baber awan was looking very defenceve and having little strange views any ways musharaf dont have any sport at all which is good for our nation,thanksssssss
Hamid Mir, if you are reading this post, please clarify who you are referring to about dancing with a glass on his head. please eleborate on the story as lots of us want to know.
@Traffic
man dancing with glass on head —————–> Mush
its no ordinary glass on mush’s head its ‘sharab ka glass’
resolution for restoration of judges finalised…by no less than Justice Fakhruddin G Ibrahim
http://www.thenews.com.pk/updates.asp?id=43635
I think some of you guys are confusing babar awan with another babar awan who was a student leader of MSF Rawalpindi (or rather ghunda leader ). As far as I know this Babar Awan was never a well known student activist. He did his bachelors in Shariah Law from a university in Saudi Arabia, probably Madinah University, not from IIU Islamabad.
But this Babar Awan, presently of PPP, has a pretty colourfull past. Babar Awan has not done any doctorate from anywhere. He just uses Doctor with his name so as to sound more respectable.
He is a very shady character from extremely humble beginnings. He came into politics initially as a worker in muslim league in late 1980s. Then during the second administration of PPP, he joined Chattha’s group of muslim league which was an ally of PPP. There he started developing links with BB and then joined PPP.
He was a very mediocre lawyer in the beginning working mostly as a police tout in Rawalpindi but then in 1990s rose meticulously through the ranks. It was said that he had developed good relations with a couple of corrupt high court judges and started acting as their front man. It was quite well known that if your legal position was weak but you still wanted to win a case, then hire Babar Awan as by doing this, you would also be hiring the judge. This front man role made him a very rich lawyer.
This is exactly why he is so much against honest and independent judges because in the presence of such judges, characters like Babar Awan cannot succeed. It is a tragedy if Zardari is really listening to the advice of some one like him.
Babar Awan on judges regarding “PCO judges”:
”Baat to sach hai
Laikin baat hai rusvai ki”
A unwanted statement from Babar Awan. Why are the judges not allowed to return to their duties when they are showing a clear indication of changed mind? What about his own ranks?
He has already forgotten NRO.
What about:
ZAB was a part of dictatorial regime. Did he not change?
NS was a part of dictatorial regime. Has he not changed?
BB was clearly under the umbrella of the GHQ.
Why Babar Awan is unnecessarily pointing the fingers at judges? If someone changes for the better they should be appreciated. If the judges shall be punished then all wrong doing politicians also should be punished.
That is exactly what Ahsan Iqbal states at 28:30
Thank you Mr. Ahsan Iqbal for being fair!
/Saqib
babar awan was pointing out justice wajih as if u watch the program carefully when babar awan was calling the shots that this judge has became a leader but he was the advocate general in zia’s regime than at that time hamid mir said “is that the judge who luks wajih means luks gud”
so it was justice wajih about whom babar awan was talkin about
babar awan has got some serious issues with lawyers movement and the leaders of lawyers
Good performance by Hamid Mir.
/Saqib
benazir came to pakistan under the umbrella of NRO so should we start considering her a crook leader or should we take her who gave her life for democracy,
i think babar awan has got some personal matters to sort out as he was the lawyer of the famous “chak shahzad” case in which cj iftikhar took a suo-moto notice by a media report of ‘rauf klasra’ in news
babar awan at that point of time argues in the court with cj iftikhar openly that you are goin out of ur jurisdiction n that news bacame very famous
@farhan
Actually Babar Awan is kind of person whose mission is always to upload Testes of their Boss to have benefits and this is what is doing.
Once he was worker of Raja Zafar Ul Haq and then one day he appeared at door of Ejaz Ul Haq in joggers to tell him that he is coming on foot after covering 30 Km distance from Gen. Zia ‘s grave.
Now a days he knows how his father Zardari is thinking about judges so he is talking what Zardari would be pleased to hear.
He is 100%%%%% pure “Jugaaria” and Munafiq.
I feel my self closer to Ahsan Iqbal’s point of view of today’s episode. Yet I donot agree with his comparison between Bhutto and N Sharif. Bhutto once he decieded to revolt, created the first and only anti establishment party in Pakistan, the PPP and never looked back. N Sharif however continued to benifit from the likes of Hameed Gul and Asad Durrani. PMLN remained the party of establishment until he picked fights with practically every one around till the day he refused landing permission to the air craft carrying Musharraf back home. Till then every year he continued to visit the annual gathering of the extreme rightist forces at JABRA chowk, islamabad, pronouncing loud and clear his willingness to complete the mission of his political mentor, the marddod e azam Zia. He only started voicing his opposition to establishment when he was no more their blue eyed boy.
@saqib
Dude you have issued the statement of the……. what should I say, of the day, by disclosing that “BB was clearly under the umbrella of the GHQ”.
hahaha
@farhan
why are you crying about the NRO when your principled leader Imran Khan had also given an offer of providing his own NRO cover to BB.
Dont say he took back his statement.
@commoner
bhutto and ns were both created by establishment and they had both went against establishment now this is such a wague arguement ppl tend to give that oh bhutto was the one who went against the establishment during his peak and nawaz sharif dint,
the bottom line should be that who had learnt the lesson its not the argument that who learnt the lesson first or who second.
if we have to blame the judges than we should start blaming the whole pakistan as 70% of the population born in some how during the martial law periods so are we all croonies of martial laws
sick n tired of the arguments about the judges,some one should ask babar awan the judges who is he taking the side right now aren’t they the ones who benefited ppp from NRO n dats the only reason of loving them otherwise there would be new judges all along of all the courts if ppl would go after the idea of babar awan.
@commoner
I don’t think Ahsan Iqbal’s intention was to make a complete comparison. ZAB and NS are two (very) different personalities……….. ZAB was far more intelligent, but nevertheless a (very) limited comparison (as Ahsan Iqbal did it) is appropriate.
/Saqib
@commoner
Are you in doubt that she was under the GHQ umbrella in her stint as PM?
/Saqib
Draft of resolution for restoration of deposed Judges prepared
http://www.thenews.com.pk/
People like Raza Hayat Haraj feel that they can build their political profile by appearing repeatedly on talk shows but they only end up as buffoons thorugh their self-defeating arguments. His trying to prove himself accurate on the Charter of Democracy was as puerile as his consistent poking of fun at Hamid Mir. I don’t know why people like him don’t realise they are on air and being watched and judged by the millions.
Dr Babar Awan was another disappointment. Just see how he tried to sound big by describing his ‘crap’ as ‘Baat tu sach hay magar baat hay ruswai ki’. Hamid Mir’s prompt repartee that there was nothing like that about what he was referring to the deposed judges, was a timely smack to this representative of the ‘loony left’.
@saqib
I know you are kidding, you cannot seriously make this allegation.
Yet if you still believe in what you are saying, can you given an example.
@commoner
I think this is quite obvious even to “poola pala” people.
In 1988, she came by striking a deal. If you don’t believe listen recent interview of Mumtaz Bhutto with Ajj tv who was a part of hardcore PPP at that time.
During Mush times, BB first signed COD with NS and then violated it by striking NRO with Mush.
She was also key to help Mush survive 8 years and even in his re-selection as president.
During APC, she was absent because of Fazlu was there and now Fazlu is their ally.
At Bugti ‘s death, she was reluctant to start a movement.
Babar Awan is putting forward a perverted logic. CJP is not a PCO judge after the 17th Amendment. Although, I think that taking oath under pco in 1999 was equally reprehensible. Ahsan did a wonderful job. Babar looked disgruntled. Kishmala and Haraj are just ordinary.
the example is NRO which was issued by some one who was the head of the GHQ at that time,ppp and his croonies welcome that as that was the only way to got away of all the illegal money of zardari
this is the reason why zardari is so scared of these judges to come back as they might nullified the NRO
imran khan has no right to give away any body’s corruption
if zardari is that clear and believed that he was politically malifide than why dont he bring all his cases infront of this supreme court which 88% ppl of pakistan wanted to come back,
this will clear him but he kant do this as every one knows that where this all the money come from.
@Commoner
I suppose you know in which context my remark came. For clarification purpose I think we agree that both ZAB, NS and BB has worked with or under GHQ/establishment. As far as I remember BB has herself stated that her government was not always at the helm of affairs.
Let’s not start the same old worn out debate. Let’s rise above party politics and have issue based positions. You have yourself shown that you don’t share Babar Awan’s opinion on the judge’s issue. In the long run that will benefit both your and my case. I suppose we both want to bring a change in Pakistan for rule of law, elimination of poverty, better education etc. What do you think?
/Saqib
commoner is acting like a typical pipliya who just using old arguments oh luk how many workers had given their lives away for democracy so in result let ppp be on a spree that they can do whatever they wanted to do and rest of the pakistan should stay shut
ppp dont want judges back
ppp dont want a change in foreign policy
ppp wanted to take musharaf’s stance on kashmir policy
ppp would love to give access to american about nuclear ideas
so one can imagine and ppp can do only if you dont put the pressure on them.
otherwise they would go on a khaba programme if no body stops them
@farhan
This is what I wrote some time back in another thread regarding Jiyala sacrifices:
—————————
No doubt PPPP workers have time and again laid their lives for their passion for PPPP, but who cares about these lives? Does PPPP high ranking leaders? Yes, they do when they want to shut the mouth of opponents, but what else?
When MQM murdered those poor PPPP workers in broad daylight in Karachi everywhere there was a hue and cry over the damned killings of innocent people. What have PPPP done for them except asking people to “forget” the incident. Even the honourable AA has stated that we should forget the killings. WHY? PPPP is demanding a UN probe on who killed BB. That is fair and a good idea to find out who the culprits were, but why not implement the same standards for the PPPP workers? Why? Because they are poor and don’t have any political influence? Who gave PPPP leadership to use the poor people as canon fodder?
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/Saqib
thanks saqib
thats exactly what i m tryin to say that these ppp croonies should stop crying over now and deal with the real issues
they are the ones who has got problem with every single issue whether it is the judges issue or musharaf itself and on the other hand they are the ones who are beating the bush out about dictatorship n i realy dont understand that why the hell they dont make a move with pml-n who wanted to get rid off all this.
thats why i m sayin that they are the one who is benefited most so its hard for them to say no
@poola
Like a typical PPP hater you have only false allegations.
By saying that Mumtaz Bhutto was a part of hardcore PPP in 1988 shows your dearth of knowledge about the history of politics in Pakistan. He created Sindh, Baloch , Pashtoon front in 1985 and started advocating for confederation of Pakistan instead of Federation. In 1989 he joined Sind National Front so he was in the anti federalist camp and was not “a part of hard core PPP” at that time. Yet establishment has always supported him while the awam have mostly ignored him.
And you are quoting him, what a pity.
Would you please enlighten us by saying how exactly BB helped survive Musharraf for 8 years. Wasnt PPP in opposition in the previous assembly along with PMLN. Werent patriots chipped away from PPP. It was the holy mullahs of Mutihida majlis e hammal who helped Mush prolonge his rule by supporting 18 amendment . PPP and PMLN opposed it. It was Imran Khan who supported Mush’s referundum for a uniformed president.
Shed your blind hatred against the only truly federalist party of Pakistan.
commoner
forget about the last 8 years ppp on directions of BB ditch the whole political alliance when they needed ppp most,
to clear your ignorance it was ppp who abstain in national assembly while rest of all the parties had resigned from the national assembly n by doin that ppp n BB had given musharaf a leverage of ligitimising his election .
for that dedication of ppp they had been previliged with NRO
so its better that if we dont go into the past,ppp should now do whatever rest of the political parties are doing,just get rid of dictatorship instead of helping it to get more stronger and get some more acts of multan,karachi n lahore
by the way what is stopping ppp to remove attorney general is it is your beloved party who is leading the co-alition
@farhan
How long would you like the witch hunting to continue. Isnt it suficient evidence that all the initiators of corruption cases against PPP had to lick the spit , starting from GIK, Leghari, Saif ur Rehman , Mian sb and now Musharraf.
The fact is all the le palaks of establishments cannot take on PPP in the adalat of awam so they resort to false cases and witch hunting. Since they cannot defeat them in elections they want them to be left out on any other pretext.
Still PPP has emerged victorious in the eyes of awam always.
wow such an argument,
their biggest asset and undoubtedly the biggest leader in current pakistan stature got killed and her party couldn’t even get a simple majority
blessing in disguise was that the area where she got killed ppp only managed to get 1 seat out of 14
so mate i aint witch hinting,if you are a ppp supporter than try to find out the reason of this performance
if you are proud of this performance that after the killing of their beloved leader ppp managed to get just 20 odd seats and u calling it big shots than get ready in next elections ppp will be in factions if they wouldn’t change their politics style and dont take the clear stance
@ farhan
yeah right, or maybe they will have to kill Zardari before next elections, maybe then PPP can come in a position to get atleast 30-35 seats…
@ farhan
PPP was never a part of your opposition (why dont you call it APDM, is it dead?), so it never left it , it was Mian sb who left you, high and dry. Your frustration is understandable.
And ABSTAINING is not VOTING.
Mush had the required votes any way, even if you and I dont like it.
PPP made Mush shed his ” second skin”, something which APDM couldnot do.
PPP made him hold relatively free and fair election which had one of the highest voters turn out in the recent past.
And now the PPP-PMLN-ANP coalition is set to restore the judiciary.
As far Poopat Ram, there must always be a comedien in every succesful film.
@farhan
Do you actually support a political party or you just oppose PPP.
dont just do talk of the talk
watching a crime and stay quiet and become part of the crime,you will get the punishment from an open court so dont give this childish argument of abstaining n not voting
as far as sheddin off musharaf’s uniform,the process started on 9th march 2007 n it was on record what stern reaction of BB about AA of becomin cj’s lawyer
holdin out the free n fair elections wasn’t ppp’s act,it was a due course after the killin of BB and one crisis after another.
even the whole top leadership of ppp got killed(god forbidden)ppp wont be able to get 2/3 majority as they always hav got some dodgy characters in their party who always waits for some short cuts like babar awan.
its ppp’s ministers who are calling musharaf an asset n the china trip a wonderful experience no body else n dont forget he is the same man whom your leader has held criminal in her last letter to mark seigel.
so mate you got to luk at urself before pointing out at any other party
my family has been supportin pml-n since 1988 as my grandfather used to vote for afzal sandhu in bahawalnagar constituency
Babar Awan is similar to Naeem Bukhari of PPP.
He also was guest in a Naeem Bukhari interview before Mar 9 2007 and he was speaking against judges.
@farhan
being still a mufta I am going to watch Bolta Pakistan as @dm in has just posted the free version, so long and take care.
its not about the political party supporting,its about the issues tht who deals with real issues
i knw that for fact that NS himself is not an ideal character but right now he is takin a right stance whether he is takin it for his personal grudge against musharaf or is he for real no body knows but he is close to what public wants in paksitan but on the other hand zardari seems like he is tryin his best to save musharaf
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M-r3dMLgwdM&feature=related
listen at 6:28 min about Babar Awan and Naeem Bukhari mountain walk talk. He ad discussed the open letter issue with him.
Kashmala can join my “mKhloot Hukoomat” anytime.. hehehehehe ;’-)
@ farhan
please check your party’s stance on the matter you mentioned in your post above…..very recently (3-4 days) Khawaja Asif and Ahsan Iqbal on two different Capital Talk shows catagorically stated that “BB was the biggest reason for achieving democarcy in Pakistan and said that we were at this stage because of the BB’s vision….Please watch those shows and then come back to the forum and take back your words..because your beloved leaders don’t agree with you….
@TK
Please show us the structure of this governmnt with who getting what. It would be an intersting read
@
farhan
i totally agree with you..zardari and co are fulfilling those committements made by late benezir with their foriegn masters..just to hide their position they brought a conspiracy theory that benezir was killed by foriegn powers…..absolutely hypocritic
Baber Awan has lost all the respect in my eyes. He is a loose cannon trying to sabotage lawyers’ movement!!!
He is a sell-out lotta.
@25: Mr. Haraj manages to make a COMPLETE FOOL of himself yet once again…
Ahsan Iqbal: ShiQ bataa’en naa!
Haraj: Yeh koi aa’ieen to nahin ke maiN shiQ yaad rakhooN.. jo maiN nay “proof” karna tha.. voh kar diyaa!
Apparently what he was trying to prove was that he is a GIGANTIC JACKASS! Bravo! case proven buddy boy… I feel sorry for the clients of this “lawyer”.
@hamidwattoo: Sorry, you’ll have to be a “premium member” to know more about these details!
hahaha
@TK
Well said, sir! I won’t mind becoming a premier member to get these details. By the way what is your take on Dr Babar Awan? What may have gone wrong with him? Is he trying to do Zardari’s or someone’s else bidding? What good would come out of it when they know the restoration of judges is a foregone conclusion. See how he tried to contradict what Kh Saad Rafiq said in the previous edition of Capital Talk.
dancer with sharab on his head = Mush!
I have been told by a very source close to Presidency that in one party Mush got so drunk that he danced with a glass full of sharab on top of his head. Other hot gossip is that Muhammad Ali Durrani ex-information minister used to supply girls to Mush for ‘haram kaam’.
Shame of Raza Harrat for being taking over the role of Sher Afghan.
Kashmala is not only pretty but heading towards right direction by joining hands with NS soon.
Babar Awan is a new Sher Afghan and Wasi Zafar in making. People like him will be remembered with ‘black letters’ in history of Pakistan.
@aahmad
“Baber Awan has lost all the respect in my eyes. He is a loose cannon trying to sabotage lawyers’ movement!!!”
Let’s not single out Babar Awan. Do keep in mind he is a member of “hum-khiyal” team of PPP lawyers that includes Naek and Latif Khosa.
I just heard a GEO news headline stating some foul language was used in assembly against Kashmala Tariq to day and there was a protest of sorts because of it. Can’t find the details yet….
Interesting News:
Dissenting PML-Q members approach PML-N
‘Like-minded group’ led by Kashmala Tariq, Riaz Fatiana, Jaffar Leghari and Ghulam Mohiuddin wants to be ‘accommodated’ into the ruling coalition
@nota
i don’t think Kashmala tariq has any right of forming a forward or like minded group.
She is not even elected, she is selected. So In my opinion she does not have any right to go against the party policy regardless of the party or its policies.
By the way I am very very against all these quota seats for woman.
First these seats are filled by selection, not by election
Secondly, quota system for such a high office is never justified. One wants best people on these positions.
@engineer
“i don’t think Kashmala tariq has any right of forming a forward or like minded group.
She is not even elected, she is selected. So In my opinion she does not have any right to go against the party policy regardless of the party or its policies.
By the way I am very very against all these quota seats for woman.”
Completely agree. From all these “selections” that I know about, not one belongs there. They seem to always e filled by relatives of politicians or women having relations with politicians (present case not excepted). No one is deserving of the position.
Raza Hayat is a complete tool and fraud who’s trying to act like a simple and honest man. His intent is to create drama about the restoration of the judiciary to gain political points. This is exactly the type of person you don’t want in the opposition because all he’ll do is waste time and create fights.
@ sleepingnation
BB/PPP has NO “foriegn masters” rather NS and family has “foreign masters” who saved them and kept them as their PETS for several years….
@paf123
Richard Boucher or Negro Ponte tuu BB kay cousin thay naa?
@engineer and nota: But it’s exactly the quota system that Jinnah wanted for Muslims in India and Hindus used the same arguement you are. The fact of the matter is you have to help people who are in a vulnerable position.
@ engineer
you and your conspiracy theories…..while what I said is part of the history..and is WELL DOCUMENTED….so stop spreading conspiracy theories….
@Paf123
I did not give any conspiracy theory at all. I just gave the name of the 2 persons
I would not use the word of foreign masters but I must say lately BB politics was heavily influenced by west.
and If you can not accept this simple fact then what I can do about it
@ engineer
Read yesterday’s Jang….Shahbaz sharif has met the principal officer of American Consulate in Lahore yesterday….and these meetings have beeen going on since Sharif’s have come back…would you be willing to say that Sharif’s policies are also influenced by West……If shaheed BB or Zardari meet americans you guys say that their policies are influenced by west…when Sharifs meet americas some how it vanishes in the thin air….This is a BIG HYPOCRACY….and mutwalas and piyalas committ it every day….
@TK
would your “Makhloot Hakoomat” only be in “Khilwat” or it would be one those which Faiz dreamed “Jab raaj karey gi khalq-e-khuda”.
@Paf123
dude, chill out, i thot you are educated persona and I can reason with you.
There is a difference in isolation and independence.
Bhutto was the one who guided Pakistan on the independent foreign Policy and I respect him for this and many more things he did.
He never refused to meet american officials but he never followed their line.
I can quote a very specific example and back it with some credible references but I think it would be waste of time. You already got your mind made up about this issue.
@ engineer
What is there to chill out…I just pointed out a hypocracy….Second….There is big difference in 70s and 90s. Back in 70s it was a bipolar world and in 90s it is unipolar world…..all BB did was that she rationalized the foreign policy according to the needs of time…..she is not the only one who did…all the countries changed and rationalized their policies….foreign policy is not a “Static and rigid” organisim that cannot be changed…I all for BB’s rationalization. She was a smart women….As for NS…read about NS’s rationalization of foreign policy in a book “Engaging India”. It gives details of NS’s visit to the US after Kargil…the depiction is shameful for any Pakistan…
@Paf123
It took them the execution of the first democratically elected PM, 30 precious years, three martial laws and an entire lost generation to realise and grudgingly admit that ZAB was a great leader, it will take them the double the time and effort to appreciate the true stature of BB(because she was a woman).
@commoner
not exactly bro, the ppl who had grudge with Bhutto, still says he is the worst thing happened to Pakistan and some of the PPP minister say that person is an asset.
@ commoner
Well said. I fully agree…all I am asking them to admit what their leaders admit in public….which is “the democracy we have today is because of the politics of BB only”……
@engineer
go play chess or what ever you wanted to…. You are here to just kill time, atleast today.
@ engineer
that satement has been vehemently denied…so this is nothing but a “PHOKA FIRE” from you…..;-)
@Paf123
@commoner
I would say not because of politics of BB but because of death of BB
@ engineer
incorrect…….BB was alive when she convinced NS to take part in the election….He admits that he was convinced by her…your stateement is abosolutely incorrect….
@Paf123
“that satement has been vehemently denied…so this is nothing but a “PHOKA FIRE” from you…..;-)”
this was not meant to be attack, this was friendly advice to bring some order in your house.
second this was ran on tv so what do u mean that this was vehemently denied?
@ paff123
I honestly believe that BB served democracy better by her death
She was useless for democracy when she was alive. Her death creates a nice romantic story and we needed that.
When she was alive , she was almost an American agent.
@ engineer
You can believe that you are are KING of the planet earth…I can’t comment to that…I just pointed out what your leader believe….
@paf123
God curse on you for saying Nawaz Sharif my leader
@Paf123
sorry about the harsh words but it was very offensive to me that you said NS is my leader
@ engineer
why are involving God in it……;-)) let me guess, it is IK…even worse…he hasn’t even passed “pre-school” in politics….
@ engineer
no offence taken….don’t worry…it is just a discussion forum..I don’t get personal…..you have a right to choose your leader…I hope you agree…I have right to make rightful oberservations on political/public figures….
@Paf123
IK is much more stupid then nawaz sharif so please…
Then your leader issss……..OR my observation is correct that you think you are KING OF PLANET EARTH
))
i am just a confused and cynical voter
@Malek, found the pic yet?
Is there a chance that after CJP Iftekhar is reinstated, Justice Falak Sher is then made senior and CJP is demoted? Just curious.
@Amir Hameed: Personally, for me what is more important is that the acts of Nov 3 are explicitly declared Null & Void and moshe is stripped of his veneer of legitimacy and is tried for treason! He has NOT made any effort to have the action indemnified .. even though the Gobar court did say it would have to be indemnified.
I think if that precedent is set, I will take some gymnastics on CJ but we ABSOLUTELY have to make sure that Nov 3 is called and Illegal act and all those (moshe and accomplices) people are brought to their “Kaifar-e Kirdaar” on this. All judges should be restored and then I’ll be able to look the other way on these gymnastics.. otherwise CJ should be restored for the psychological reasons alone.. if nothing else.
I think the govt should move quickly and just do it already.. BP is reporting that some douchbags (I think its that madar-ch-d Qasoori) are making a “charge sheet” for “attacking the symbol of federation” … never mind the 6 lawyers burned to a bloody crisp thanks to this kutta.
Babar Awan was acting like an idiot (any PPP Jyala here, may be SaqibTahir?). Raza Hyat was shamelsss, especially when he mentioned that Oct 1999 was a Martial Law, Nov 3 2007 was a sugar-coated Martial Law, but we support Moshe!!
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