now i’ll have to watch these live….no one would wait for 240 hours or 10 days!! by that time I don’t think no one would be interested to watch a show which is based on PAST views.
This is exactly why I have advocated the use of elite civilian (Police force) as the Prime Ministerial guard. We need to have the PM and Parliament guard to be separately funded which comes under the civilian jurisdiction of National Capital Region and which reports directly to the Speaker of the assembly.
I know this has been equated to the FSF but that wasn’t a specific purpose force, Bhutto tried to create an ugly “wajahat force” on govt expense all over the country (Think FBI & ATF combined) and it kinda backfired on him (he forgot to take care of the Triple one brigade.. you know.. because “time wasn’t right” etc.)
This and a group of national democratic Vigilantes who will defend democracy with their lives.. You only need 50 to a 100 armed and dedicated men (women?) who are willing to put their lives on the line once and for all.
Come to think of it… we lose more people in these stupid “Tehreek-e jumhuriats every 5 years anyways.. ” so why suffer and get a 1000 killed in the name of “Democracy” over a period of 10 years of despotism when you can nip that sh!t in the bud by giving Triple One brigade a run for their cowardly money in one night?
I really don’t understand why these two things have not been implemented by civilian govts?
I don’t think it would be possible to enforce 58-2(b). Pakistan has changed since March 9. This time they would have to send a lot more troops, if they want to dismiss the government.
@ataraxis6
Seems a wishful thinking .. but I pray it is true.
On 2nd of November 2007, Aslam Begs of this world were saying on loud speaker that there will not even be an emergency. Army will not support the mad dictator and it will be hard even to dismiss CJ Iftikhar Chaudary. But then world saw that not one but 60 judges were sent home. It was not emergency from President but Martial law from COAS. And then the CJ and with him several judges were under house arrest along with thier children. Pakistan had changed since 9th March then.
Army will not care about how many troops they need to send , and how many people they need to kill for achieving what they want. If you have doubts read history of 1971, killing of hudreds of thousands of bangalis. And if that is too distant a history then read recent baloch massacre.
@TK
“I really don’t understand why these two things have not been implemented by civilian govts?”
Because in essence, there has not been a single civilian government till this day. If there was a single true leader even at district level, no army muscle could effectively take him out if he had the backing of people.
You know why all governments, establishments, armies are afraid of communism? They go to extreme lengths to ward off this danger. Not even democratic forces can afford a true democracy.
What we have here as our representatives of the people are basically sardars, pirs, makhdooms, chaudhries, tiwanas, jamalis, bhuttos, and every other elitist group but no genuine representation by the members of the comon herd. Even so called awami leaders such as sheikhoo or altaf are either working on behalf of elitists or join them at first oppotunity.
In short, like you said, a small band, a deterrence force of fifty hardcore followers can wreak havoc among the ranks of military and all gentry if they are willing to die for their leader. That is why al qaeda, which probably numbers in a few hundered men, is so dangerous for the sole super power oin the world.
Please request Mr. Musharraf to come to your programme and face people.
He has been the single handed ruler for the last eight years…his government has lost, his PM has run away…
He stands, he stands with total disreagrd for everything…
If nothing, at-least he must come out like a MAN – after all he was a military man – and face public in your programme…
Please, on behalf o all of us, through an invitation to him…
What the hell with PPP. They are the biggest Chors in politics thats why they are hesitant to remove Mush. on the other hand NS group was also chore but not bigger than PPP and now PMLN has learned lessons from their past thats why every member of PMLN is brave and outspoken in every current affairs programe. While all others including PPP are doing just Ayeen BAeeen Shaeeen.
All political leaders except IMRAN KHAN(Prince) should be lodged to a big ship and then drown ship in middle of INDIAN OCEAN. F***k and death to MUSH and all PPP MQM AND ANP AND SOME PMLN LEADERS
@fas: right on! I didn’t mean a force like Alqeda though.. I just meant a citizen militia sworn to protect the democratic institutions in case Triple One brigade gets any ideas.
WE need to disband Triple one brigade ASAP …
Even the threat of such a force will make these cowards think twice .. right now they’re used to cakewalks and civiies who are happy to oblige and stand aside..
Makes you pine for a PM like Salvador Allende.. who went down fighting.
Elite force didn’t work for NS in 99. It will never work because no elite force can compete with our mighty military. That’s the down side of a mighty military which turns into a Frankenstein. I think the only solution is that the military and the whole nation has to be somehow educated about the sovereignty of the constitution. Otherwise a bloody revolution is in the making.
The other thing is that ISI and IB should *actually* report to the PM. It has never happened in the past. ISI has always bowed to the COAS.
In short, our army is still a colonial army where the viceroy (COAS) takes some cues from the US and follows suit. If our army doesn’t change its attitude towards the people of Pakistan and their representatives, then it’s only a matter of time that we ‘ll be going through a civil war in which military will be divided. A harsh fact is that sometimes civil wars are good for nations because they define their future course in vivid terms; not that a ping pong is occurring between dictatorship, presidential form of govt. and parliamentary from of govt.
Renaissance, their that people think should be done about army.
Consitutuion guranatee should their that all province should have equall man power in armed.
Second JCSC should be made meaning full. And post should be rotated between all three services.
All the Welfare compay of armed force should be closed down and FF should be allowed to apporate. Idea that Army should take care of it fartanity is nonsense.
I myself is completly against Army as I thin Pakistan should be welfare state and not security state.
@taimurdar, I garuntee that Corrupt Judges would be restorte. Million dollar question is what next? What media and ISI would would find to topple this government?
Another slightly tangential argument is that we need to have a political party whose roots are into the people of Pakistan at every level. The benefit of having such a party is that you give one call and people are on the roads for a cause.
In the past, parties have failed to show a massive turn out of people. PPP which was considered to be a grass roots party failed to show massive strength when Bhutto’s govt was overthrown in 77. For deeper roots into people, political parties need to show that they are subservient to people, not their rulers.
Brig Khalid maqbool going after jonego govt and then he went after ns govt in 2002. This man has been really busy and earned his gov. ship the dalla way. I bet now days he gives speeches on how much he has done for democracy. What a despicable man who earned his food buy selling his soul.
I think everyone should serve two years in the army, reducing need for full-time military (like Israel). We also need to ‘fix’ the soldier criteria, no one with an extra ounce of brain can get in. Half-ounces like mush become generals.
and yes, I am afraid PPP has lost it since death of ZA Bhutto. Now it is a party of people with mouths does more work than the brains. There are exceptions there too I guess. Nawaz League is not as corrupt, but more dictatorial.
I think this Triple one Brigade should be disbanded immediately and its commanders tried for TREASON.
Why it will happen again because there is no accountability for the crimes Armed Forces have committed?
But what do you expect of useless,corrupt and unprincipled Politicians who are standing on the Crutches of NRO. They also have become the main dispensers of Judges Restoration, all the lawyers and journalists and ordinary people who brought about the downfall of the Dictator have to beg for the crumbs of JUSTICE, from this same useless Lot.
two years social service which may have service in the armed forces as an option…but must have education and other welfare activites like building low cost housing for the poor.
we need to stop thinking from a Faujistan perspective….
Whether its a changed Pakistan or not, these WAR DEE waley always act on their own agendas. Because they know that when they retire, any civilian government would accept them and grant them the key positions in power structure.
@TK made an interesting reference to President Salvador Allende of Chile how he went down fighting. I see alot of similarities in then Chile and Pakistan. General Pinochet who arranged the coup d’état against Salvador Allende was arrested in UK on the principle of Universal jurisdiction for the first time in the history. But interestingly, after his release in 2000 when he arrived back in Chile, the parliament passed a constitutional amendment to grant him immunity and other privileges.
In Pakistan, instead of trials of treason and misconduct we treat these retired generals as saviors and intellectuals of the nation.
Tikka Khan, Rao Farman Ali Khan, Niazi, Aslam Baig, Hameed Gul, Asad Durrani, Khalid Maqbool, Ehtesham Zameer have been rewarded and even our beloved Pervaiz Musharraf is a NATIONAL ASSET now.
What a nation!!!!!!
Zardari is buying time to mend ways with MQM so that if PML – N leaves gov’t he can adjust with Q and MQM, MOlana Fazal and ANP.
Zardari will give awam a huge dhoka. It is upto Nawaz Sharif to become hero by ditching PPP or become zero by siding PPP.
Its so easy to remove an entire civilian government. The army is truly a large number of trained hoodlums. The only thing that can neutralize army’s recklessness is a powerful purely civilian intelligence network and I dont mean the IB. This agency can work underhand and keep the civilian government informed of every trick of the jurnails and should be directly answerable to the PM. Keep the army busy with Taliban and other clowns, while do something worthwhile.
We have to remember that Mr. Zardari is the most corrupt person of Pakistan, he just got away from corruption cases through NRO he did not prove himself innocent. Beside all these facts today we are expecting from him that he will restore the Judicary, and bring peace in the country and stop following foreign dictations…the result is written on the wall…..whether he favors the restoration of Judicary or oppose in both cases he (Mr. Zardari) will be in trouble. After the restoration of an independent Judicary under Mr. Iftikar Chaudry all those corrupt politicans and jarnels have to be answerable to their crimes.
The only man who is going to benefit if the judges are restored or if they are not restored would be Mian sahab. Its hard to say if he and his party has really learnt lessons in the past eight years and are now willing to do something for the change, or how much simply they care about people, its hard to figure out their intent but he has played his cards very well.
bhai admin, kiya nasha washa kur kay is site ko handle kur rahay ho??
Mana kay transfer of power ho raha hay, magar aisa kiya kay Meray Mutabiq 27 April ka free version aur 26 April ka still for Premium Members, Bhai jaan hang over utar kur 1 min yahan bhi concetrate kur loo please.
i donot understand this stupidity of the media, when they get popularity and demand, then they became so rude and selfish, why do u delay 240 hours to display the videos., it is just like in pujnabi, GEEDER DE GOON DI LOR PAI TE O PAAR TE CHAR GIA…….i curse upon the media for the stupidness and disloyalty with the wiewrs. usman khan spain.
now i’ll have to watch these live….no one would wait for 240 hours or 10 days!! by that time I don’t think no one would be interested to watch a show which is based on PAST views.
lawyer akram sheikh and mirza aslam baig. Eye opening run down by aslam baig on how 582b was used in the past. Very informative.
Re: Aslam Beg’s comments:
This is exactly why I have advocated the use of elite civilian (Police force) as the Prime Ministerial guard. We need to have the PM and Parliament guard to be separately funded which comes under the civilian jurisdiction of National Capital Region and which reports directly to the Speaker of the assembly.
I know this has been equated to the FSF but that wasn’t a specific purpose force, Bhutto tried to create an ugly “wajahat force” on govt expense all over the country (Think FBI & ATF combined) and it kinda backfired on him (he forgot to take care of the Triple one brigade.. you know.. because “time wasn’t right” etc.)
This and a group of national democratic Vigilantes who will defend democracy with their lives.. You only need 50 to a 100 armed and dedicated men (women?) who are willing to put their lives on the line once and for all.
Come to think of it… we lose more people in these stupid “Tehreek-e jumhuriats every 5 years anyways.. ” so why suffer and get a 1000 killed in the name of “Democracy” over a period of 10 years of despotism when you can nip that sh!t in the bud by giving Triple One brigade a run for their cowardly money in one night?
I really don’t understand why these two things have not been implemented by civilian govts?
I don’t think it would be possible to enforce 58-2(b). Pakistan has changed since March 9. This time they would have to send a lot more troops, if they want to dismiss the government.
As always, another brilliant program by SM.
@ataraxis6
.. but I pray it is true.
Seems a wishful thinking
On 2nd of November 2007, Aslam Begs of this world were saying on loud speaker that there will not even be an emergency. Army will not support the mad dictator and it will be hard even to dismiss CJ Iftikhar Chaudary. But then world saw that not one but 60 judges were sent home. It was not emergency from President but Martial law from COAS. And then the CJ and with him several judges were under house arrest along with thier children. Pakistan had changed since 9th March then.
Army will not care about how many troops they need to send , and how many people they need to kill for achieving what they want. If you have doubts read history of 1971, killing of hudreds of thousands of bangalis. And if that is too distant a history then read recent baloch massacre.
thanks for the program
@TK
“I really don’t understand why these two things have not been implemented by civilian govts?”
Because in essence, there has not been a single civilian government till this day. If there was a single true leader even at district level, no army muscle could effectively take him out if he had the backing of people.
You know why all governments, establishments, armies are afraid of communism? They go to extreme lengths to ward off this danger. Not even democratic forces can afford a true democracy.
What we have here as our representatives of the people are basically sardars, pirs, makhdooms, chaudhries, tiwanas, jamalis, bhuttos, and every other elitist group but no genuine representation by the members of the comon herd. Even so called awami leaders such as sheikhoo or altaf are either working on behalf of elitists or join them at first oppotunity.
In short, like you said, a small band, a deterrence force of fifty hardcore followers can wreak havoc among the ranks of military and all gentry if they are willing to die for their leader. That is why al qaeda, which probably numbers in a few hundered men, is so dangerous for the sole super power oin the world.
Dear Dr. Shahid,
Please request Mr. Musharraf to come to your programme and face people.
He has been the single handed ruler for the last eight years…his government has lost, his PM has run away…
He stands, he stands with total disreagrd for everything…
If nothing, at-least he must come out like a MAN – after all he was a military man – and face public in your programme…
Please, on behalf o all of us, through an invitation to him…
Ibn Razi
What the hell with PPP. They are the biggest Chors in politics thats why they are hesitant to remove Mush. on the other hand NS group was also chore but not bigger than PPP and now PMLN has learned lessons from their past thats why every member of PMLN is brave and outspoken in every current affairs programe. While all others including PPP are doing just Ayeen BAeeen Shaeeen.
All political leaders except IMRAN KHAN(Prince) should be lodged to a big ship and then drown ship in middle of INDIAN OCEAN. F***k and death to MUSH and all PPP MQM AND ANP AND SOME PMLN LEADERS
@fas: right on! I didn’t mean a force like Alqeda though.. I just meant a citizen militia sworn to protect the democratic institutions in case Triple One brigade gets any ideas.
WE need to disband Triple one brigade ASAP …
Even the threat of such a force will make these cowards think twice .. right now they’re used to cakewalks and civiies who are happy to oblige and stand aside..
Makes you pine for a PM like Salvador Allende.. who went down fighting.
we need one Khumeni in PAKISTAN to solve the problems.
Asif Zardari will be on Meray Mutabiq on April 28th Episode……..lets see what happens…
@TK
Elite force didn’t work for NS in 99. It will never work because no elite force can compete with our mighty military. That’s the down side of a mighty military which turns into a Frankenstein. I think the only solution is that the military and the whole nation has to be somehow educated about the sovereignty of the constitution. Otherwise a bloody revolution is in the making.
The other thing is that ISI and IB should *actually* report to the PM. It has never happened in the past. ISI has always bowed to the COAS.
In short, our army is still a colonial army where the viceroy (COAS) takes some cues from the US and follows suit. If our army doesn’t change its attitude towards the people of Pakistan and their representatives, then it’s only a matter of time that we ‘ll be going through a civil war in which military will be divided. A harsh fact is that sometimes civil wars are good for nations because they define their future course in vivid terms; not that a ping pong is occurring between dictatorship, presidential form of govt. and parliamentary from of govt.
The only thing that backfired time & again is the politicians hatered against the human right awareness & education.
And it will backfire again in future too until & unless politicians spread human right awareness & education to the masses.
Renaissance, their that people think should be done about army.
Consitutuion guranatee should their that all province should have equall man power in armed.
Second JCSC should be made meaning full. And post should be rotated between all three services.
All the Welfare compay of armed force should be closed down and FF should be allowed to apporate. Idea that Army should take care of it fartanity is nonsense.
I myself is completly against Army as I thin Pakistan should be welfare state and not security state.
Just an idea for every on to think.
240 hours ..damn is this “marey mutabic” or paris hilton video
@taimurdar, I garuntee that Corrupt Judges would be restorte. Million dollar question is what next? What media and ISI would would find to topple this government?
Another slightly tangential argument is that we need to have a political party whose roots are into the people of Pakistan at every level. The benefit of having such a party is that you give one call and people are on the roads for a cause.
In the past, parties have failed to show a massive turn out of people. PPP which was considered to be a grass roots party failed to show massive strength when Bhutto’s govt was overthrown in 77. For deeper roots into people, political parties need to show that they are subservient to people, not their rulers.
Brig Khalid maqbool going after jonego govt and then he went after ns govt in 2002. This man has been really busy and earned his gov. ship the dalla way. I bet now days he gives speeches on how much he has done for democracy. What a despicable man who earned his food buy selling his soul.
@captain jack
and iran is doing really well? Can you explain the wonders of khomeni? Name one good thing he accomplished?
http://pakistanspace.tripod.com/archives/47jin11.htm
I think everyone should serve two years in the army, reducing need for full-time military (like Israel). We also need to ‘fix’ the soldier criteria, no one with an extra ounce of brain can get in. Half-ounces like mush become generals.
and yes, I am afraid PPP has lost it since death of ZA Bhutto. Now it is a party of people with mouths does more work than the brains. There are exceptions there too I guess. Nawaz League is not as corrupt, but more dictatorial.
I think this Triple one Brigade should be disbanded immediately and its commanders tried for TREASON.
Why it will happen again because there is no accountability for the crimes Armed Forces have committed?
But what do you expect of useless,corrupt and unprincipled Politicians who are standing on the Crutches of NRO. They also have become the main dispensers of Judges Restoration, all the lawyers and journalists and ordinary people who brought about the downfall of the Dictator have to beg for the crumbs of JUSTICE, from this same useless Lot.
Don’t you think 240 hrs wait is too little. How about 2400 hrs.
It will be called then “MAZI Kay mutabik”.
240 hours!
[i]khaak ho jaaeyn gay hum tum ko khabar honay tak[/i]
@aik aur pakistani
two years social service which may have service in the armed forces as an option…but must have education and other welfare activites like building low cost housing for the poor.
we need to stop thinking from a Faujistan perspective….
“Banker ko prime minister bana aessa hi hay jessay Baghar Billay ko doodh kay katoray pay bithana”
(talking abt sahukat aziz)
The Great Hassan Nisar in today’s Meray Mutabiq… a must seeeeeeeeeeeee !
Whether its a changed Pakistan or not, these WAR DEE waley always act on their own agendas. Because they know that when they retire, any civilian government would accept them and grant them the key positions in power structure.
@TK made an interesting reference to President Salvador Allende of Chile how he went down fighting. I see alot of similarities in then Chile and Pakistan. General Pinochet who arranged the coup d’état against Salvador Allende was arrested in UK on the principle of Universal jurisdiction for the first time in the history. But interestingly, after his release in 2000 when he arrived back in Chile, the parliament passed a constitutional amendment to grant him immunity and other privileges.
In Pakistan, instead of trials of treason and misconduct we treat these retired generals as saviors and intellectuals of the nation.
Tikka Khan, Rao Farman Ali Khan, Niazi, Aslam Baig, Hameed Gul, Asad Durrani, Khalid Maqbool, Ehtesham Zameer have been rewarded and even our beloved Pervaiz Musharraf is a NATIONAL ASSET now.
What a nation!!!!!!
Here is the bottom-line:
Zardari is buying time to mend ways with MQM so that if PML – N leaves gov’t he can adjust with Q and MQM, MOlana Fazal and ANP.
Zardari will give awam a huge dhoka. It is upto Nawaz Sharif to become hero by ditching PPP or become zero by siding PPP.
DISBAND TRIPLE ONE BRIGADE NOW!!!!
Its so easy to remove an entire civilian government. The army is truly a large number of trained hoodlums. The only thing that can neutralize army’s recklessness is a powerful purely civilian intelligence network and I dont mean the IB. This agency can work underhand and keep the civilian government informed of every trick of the jurnails and should be directly answerable to the PM. Keep the army busy with Taliban and other clowns, while do something worthwhile.
We have to remember that Mr. Zardari is the most corrupt person of Pakistan, he just got away from corruption cases through NRO he did not prove himself innocent. Beside all these facts today we are expecting from him that he will restore the Judicary, and bring peace in the country and stop following foreign dictations…the result is written on the wall…..whether he favors the restoration of Judicary or oppose in both cases he (Mr. Zardari) will be in trouble. After the restoration of an independent Judicary under Mr. Iftikar Chaudry all those corrupt politicans and jarnels have to be answerable to their crimes.
The only man who is going to benefit if the judges are restored or if they are not restored would be Mian sahab. Its hard to say if he and his party has really learnt lessons in the past eight years and are now willing to do something for the change, or how much simply they care about people, its hard to figure out their intent but he has played his cards very well.
bhai admin, kiya nasha washa kur kay is site ko handle kur rahay ho??
Mana kay transfer of power ho raha hay, magar aisa kiya kay Meray Mutabiq 27 April ka free version aur 26 April ka still for Premium Members, Bhai jaan hang over utar kur 1 min yahan bhi concetrate kur loo please.
i donot understand this stupidity of the media, when they get popularity and demand, then they became so rude and selfish, why do u delay 240 hours to display the videos., it is just like in pujnabi, GEEDER DE GOON DI LOR PAI TE O PAAR TE CHAR GIA…….i curse upon the media for the stupidness and disloyalty with the wiewrs. usman khan spain.
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