Our Brave Army

http://www.fascistarmy.org/

and more…

http://www4.webng.com/democracy/index.htm

@geog47
DIctatorshipWatch is back up. fascistarmy site is hardly ever updated…

A comment on “The Establishment” Vs. “The Pakistani People”

http://www.mattiasadolfsson.se/sketchbook/four/page35.html

Pakistani ppl have a “Big Surprise” for our ‘faujistanic kleptocracy’ aka ‘establishment’

hehehehe

Zardari’s “address” is very amusing today.. then it was Imtiaz Alam and Nusrat Javed at the SAFMA..

“Don’t try to tell us HOW TO RUN POLITICS!!!”
Several invocations of “Shaeeds”, “5 Bhuttos” (one of whom he was incidentally accused of killing… I’m just saying)

the more things change … the more they stay the same..

@geog47 !!! Thanx for sharing!! Mush in a picture looks like that someone stick the gun barrel and he is trying to cover up the pain.

I agree that there are few corrupt general and others who put the whole army in this situation. But still we should not paint the whole army as a bad instituition likewise we have other different instituitions in which there are few corrupt people.

Hi guys,

Can anyone please tell, Dr. Safdar Mehmood is talking about which minister in the column below?

http://www.jang.com.pk/jang/may2008-daily/23-05-2008/col2.htm

Zardari being a TOTAL A$$ in his SAFMA address:

to the lawyers:

“We know what democracy”

“Don’t teach us politics!”

“The Lawyers were fighting My wars but I was their general”

Seriously, WTF is this guy smoking?

And @dmin, it would be nice to have his interview and the Imtiaz alam and Nusrath Javed address after that.. I think Mr. Zardari needs a little more ‘education’.

@ ALL !! Another Pakistani Mohammad Afzal Passed Away in Indian custody due to Indian brutality.

DO U KNOW!!!!!!!
Pakistan’s senate has 3 non-tribal senators who have been elected independently from NWFP. They r closely related (fathe & his too sons) and every time they got their seat by buying it. in the last three instances it were maulvis who sell their vote. What a joke.

watch this !!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LYWjeUW17Ug&NR=1

Also watch this !!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sokfYsK0Jfw&NR=1

Breaking News: MQM has killed PMLN Sindh Vice President Tariq Khan in Karachi on Shaeed-i-milat road. He was riding in his car.

Negropotty coming to Pakistan next week to talk to AZ and Mush.

@Riddle792,
You are right it is a warning to PMLN. I also think it is a threat to Iftikhar Chuadhry who’ll come to Karachi in a few days.

Mush and his company mqm is out. This is a start to keep mush in power.

@Riddle & BABU :

I think this is a threat to Zardari to “wise up” .. it’s payback for his anti-mush statements.

There is only ONE way to deal with MQM because MQM is like a REPTILE.. you can feed it milk all your life, but it will kill you the first chance it gets ..

They are only concerned with their own interest, which is the creation of a separate state for the benefit of US/UK…

I think US/UK want a “Kuwait” like state, which they will then protect and attack Pakistan like they attacked Iraq “to protect poor old kuwait” … Zardari doesn’t know what the hell he’s doing… MQM will go after him full force if he touches MOSHE…

It’s hard NOT to see this conflict in ethnic terms.. Moshe and MQM are both playing the muhajir card (cynical, but that seems to be the case..).. All of mosh’es major protectors just HAPPEN to be Muhajir (in the racist/chauvanistic sense that MQM means it)

@Tk !! you are right. but there is a problem if this time they try to kill zardari then I think there will be a bloodshed in Pakistan and especially in sindh. Coz Governor is from mqm and CM is from PPP.
The main thing is which way army will side and in my own opinion mush is not as powerfull as he was in uniform. Also I am not sure if army will side with mush and go against majority of people.
In history whenever there was a marshal law the army cheif had at least more or less 50 % peoples backing.
Last year there was a rumor that mush was under arrest by his own men for few hours and Kiyani bailed him out. I think this happened after mush declared emergency on Nov,03,2007.Thats why Kiyani himself distant himself from mush and also army from politics at this stage.
Might army will support superficially mush for sometime in order to gain time till US will be busy in elections soon and Bush Zalil will be out of office soon.
So right now it is very tough to determine which way the camel will sit.

@ TK !! Also it is not only mush or mqm but there are more international hidden hands behind the whole situation. But we should not worry about anything and the leaders should take a right stand for the people of Pakistan.

@khizarkyz
“senators… they got their seat by buying it”

But that is how you usually become a senator.

@ TK I also think it is not the whole mqm that will support mush. Might there are few within mqm who will try to do anything for mush and Altaf.
There was a time when mush was anti Altaf and at one point mush wanted to assasinate Altaf. So in this power game it is very hard to predict who is a friend and who is an enemy coz with time friends and enemies change positions.

@Kruman
“Negropotty coming to Pakistan next week to talk to AZ and Mush.”

Probably coming over to force home some points discussed in Egypt…

Negroponte sets out

@ ALL aahmed has just shared the news at off record @7:09pm comments that mush is planing to move to presidency and leave army house in two months.

Bohat begharat ha mush
mush tum ko tu chulloo bhar paani bhi nahi chahiya doob marnay ka liya.

@TK
I can bet that MQM is a vital card in the hands of establishment, MQM is ready to play havoc in Karachi at any time, over the last 8 years they have collected a lot money and huge arms (perhaps many of them highly lethal) , I consider 12th May 2007 and and recent incident as just a trailor of what they can do , the target killings happening in Karachi are all part of this exercise. I can tell you this is very dangerous game. My optimism insist in believing capable Shoaib Suddle however I am absolutely worried as this time MQM is not of 1993 or 1996. An operation of higest percision will be needed. It s also important to get the Don out of London or have him arrested in London I don’t know who is going to bell the cat.

Updated at: 2145 PST, Friday, May 23, 2008

KARACHI: PML-N provincial vice president Tariq Khan has been killed in a firing incident near Shaheed-e-Millat road in Karachi.

According to CCPO Karachi, two unidentified motorcyclists opened fire on Tariq Khan

@Babu from USA
“Also watch this !!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sokfYsK0Jfw&NR=1

Looks like Indian technology.

Ayaz Amir’s latest editorial
http://thenews.jang.com.pk/daily_detail.asp?id=114149

Sometimes back there was a very strange news about dissolution of the assemblies by prime minister, I remember there was some discussion by pkpolitics stalwarts on this , however I could not understand the logic of this possible action by YRG. Everybody knew that if the assemblies are dissolved PPP would definitely loose the majority and PML-N will get more seats than PPP , moreover if APDM and IK decide to go in those elections there may be a position in which PMLN IK APDM have huge majority. So why would YRG dissolve the assemblies.
Today I got the answer and very strange one. So AZ actually wants that , disturbing news is that he actually is thinking about saying goodbye to politics and live with his family in Dubai. Good news for AZ haters , I know they would
Khushi say mar na jaatay agar aitbar hoota

This is how it is reported in The News by Shaheen Sahbai.

In my last session with him, with Dr Shahid Masood of Geo TV also present, about two weeks back in Islamabad, he had gone even one step further.

@Peja,
—
… Good news for AZ haters , I know they would … Khushi say mar na jaatay agar aitbar hoota…
—

Do you consider yourself a Zardari lover? (not in that sense though). This could also turn to be a hypothesis, like the others. I would not be surprised if that happens, especially now that Zardari has sabotaged the clear advantage that the political forces had after Feb 18 due to his cowardness.

@Amir Hameed
Strange you never guessed I actually love AZ , he is one of the major political leaders in Pakistan , and I believe he is in the right shoes at the moment , leading the troops from the front against the mighty establishment, who can be the best person to do this job except AZ who spent 11 years in jail at the hands of establishment , most hated person of establishment for 15 years on the trot and who faced the worst torture at the hands of establishment goons.
I am worried though , how could AZ think of such a thing , he should remember on whose sholders he is standing , BB the bravest lady ever produced by South Asia , ZAB the bravest leader in South Asia and thousand and thousands of brave jaan nisaars (parwanay) who laid thier lives for this cause.

Yaar @peja.. are you just spreading disinformation or what? If I wasn’t a Zardari hater before, this bone-headed step by him would totally make me hate him.

This “leak” confirms my suspicions. Not only is he weak in character, he would also prove himself to be feeble in mind were he to take such a step.. IT IS ABSOLUTELY BONEHEADED.. I can’t believe someone is even proposing this.

So let me guess the genius strategy:

!) Zardari says he’s cooperating with mush cuz he doesn’t want to destabilize the democratic govt. (ie dissolution of govt)
2) to achieve 1, he wants to go along with the Usurper because moshe (u) will dissolve the assemblies if he doesn’t comply (per his own claim and ‘analysis’)
3) But if the people and lawyers push him to confront Moshe, he would do EXACTLY what he says he’s trying to avoid being done by moshe…

What kind of logic is that?

If he’s ready to dissolve the assemblies, why not try to get rid of moshe? WTF?

@peja:

BB the bravest lady ever produced by South Asia , ZAB the bravest leader in South Asia and thousand and thousands of brave jaan nisaars (parwanay) who laid thier lives for this cause.

OMG! After reading this Qaseeda Burdah Shareef.. I just vomited uncontrollably on myself!!!

I know at least one woman much more brave than BB. Her name was Jhansi Ki Raani.

That’s real fight against ‘the establishment’… not making deal with foreigners and then calling it “fighting the establishment” hehehe

@Peja,
I really do not care if Zardari was hated by the establishment; what I know is that he was also not too popular in the masses, including some within the PPP. I also know that his past is tainted with corruption and please do not tell me that it was never proven in the courts here because the Rockwell property was a living proof of his corruption. I know that the the Piplias will come running defending him on this fact which they term as mere allegations.

Those who did not like him was willing to give him a chance and this was the best chance he had to redeem himself but the problem is that you can not change someone’s nature. A snake will not change its nature, period…

The problem that I see with your theories is that they are not based on the facts and sometimes appears as disinformation.

@amir hameed
You don’t even know what I think of “corrupt politicians” , I love them in fact I say that corruption by the politician should be made legal and it should be reported as a merit , they have suffered too much that they should be compensated for that.
And don’t believe in my “disinformation” it is upto you. You can keep hating AZ nobody is forcing you to love him …. there are several people who like him including myself.

@Peja,
—
… what I think of

And BTW, this also goes for those politicians who stood up factories with loan-money and then later got those loans forgiven.

“Each time a man stands up for an ideal, or acts to improve the lot of others, or strikes out against injustice, he sends forth a tiny ripple of hope” - RFK

Just a salute to Iftikhar M Ch.

Who is Zardari
Who is Nawaz Sharif
What are the portfolio of all generals and beurocracy

Go and find the details of above three questions……..search on the politiicians,generals and beurocracy people…there upswing,there prosperity is bc of this lawless and corrupt system….they are the beneficiaries of illetracy and powerty…………

Question ::::why the hell you BACHCHA log expect zardaris or NSs or generals etc to change the system……..why would they commit suicide.
the are the benefeciaries of this system they wouldnt change it ,they would rather change the faces (for time being ,until next turn) but not the system…………………………………………………..

Bottom line:::::::::::::::::::::10% of our countrymen that includes generals ,there families ,big politicians (Feudals and industrialists),beaurocrates and there families are looting this country and they have a strong nexus………..together they are called establishment.

@imalik5525:
–
why would they commit suicide.
the are the benefeciaries of this system they wouldnt change it
–

Except this time around, we’re not asking them.

We’re telling them.

“Nawaz

“Nawaz not to appear before PCO judges”
http://www.nation.com.pk/pakistan-news-newspaper-daily-english-online/Politics/24-May-2008/Nawaz-not-to-appear-before-PCO-judges

@Amir Hameed
Well you can extract whatever meanings you like to get from my remarks I have sveral times explained why corruption of a politician in Pakistan is just misnomer and why I fully ignore the corruption charges (true or false) against any political leader.
You have right to hate/love any political leader , I have always said that most of the time people are bound to refuse on priniciple,

It is being said that Army has assured Zardari that they would not support Musharraf if he would use 52 B against the assembly and therefore Zardari decided to come in open.

In another move there are speculations that Musharraf would like to replace the present Chief of Army Staff Gen Kiyani by his relative ISI chief Nadeem Taj as he has power to do so. This is reported in Ikram Sehgal article and he is considered close to the Presidency.

The Chaudries have assured the President that they would side with him and that is why they said that they would sit in opposition.

But will Musharraf be able to dismiss the present goverment - very hard to say.

Baitullal Mehsud has clearly said that he did not kill BB and also that kidnapping of the Pakistani ambassador to Afghanistan was not his doing.

So what is Musharraf upto and what game is he playing. I believe he is playing a very dangerous game and in this process he can be even killed should there be a misunderstanding between him and army chief and others. He is rapidly losing all the support and also closing himself any doors of honourable exit. On other hand November in America is fast approaching and Bush exit is on horizon.

There is a great misconception about the “corruption” by a politician. “Corruption” has become a catch all word to condemn any politician. Below is my take on corruption by politician, this is also an attempt to differentiate between myth and reality. Each point below is independant and self-suffiecient.
1.We take the politician in Pakistan as granted, in commercialized western demcratic world , politics is a career and just like any other profession it has its work ethics, a politician works x number of hours , enjoys holidays and leads a regular life. Just see how many annual holidays George Bush takes every year .
In Pakistan politician are usually groomed on the ideology of “working for the people (awaam kee khidmat)” a very noble thing indeed. However on the darker side , it is assumed that a politician is bound to be prosecuted by his/her opponents , s/he is bound to go to jail, s/he is bound to be tortured by the opponents and his/her family may also have to suffer because of this politician. Our society expects this to be absolutely normal. They say
“Jab awaam kee khidmat karni hai tu yeh sab kuch tu sehna hooga”.
Look at how many people are jailed by establishment , they spent years and years away from their family , I’ll take the example of Javaid Hashmi because that will suit for most people. You will find people saying that he was given A class , others will say you see he was put in C class by mad dictator (as if A class was not bad). Tell me what compensation these politicians get for their illegal confinement and prosecution.

2. During 90’s establishment realized that the common allegations (secular, anti-pakistan, etc. etc. ) against the political leaders are not yielding the proper results. The “Corruption” became the buzzword in those days , you will find print media full of corruption allegations against EVERY leader, they will accuse NS to have built an empire from corruption money , they will accuse IK to have looted the people’s Zakat money , of course no need to mention corruption of Mr. 10%. If you read between those allegation you will find that they were based on the assumption that the politician are angels and the people who tried to defend those allegation fell into this trap. Corruption became the biggest demerit of any political leader. I quote an example of Nawabzada Nasrullah Khan who sold all his property for the sake of politics and finally he got one of his appointed as minister in one cabinet (perhaps provincial) , people did not even spare him and alleged corruption (again note when you try to defend corruption you basically assuming that defendant is an angel - a trap).
3. There is another aspect of the corruption, it is true that power corrupts , and there have been several corrupt leaders in the history. A remarkable thing I noticed about the “real corrupt” persons is that they consider their position to do the corruption as a one time oppurtunity. You will find corrupt people who achieved a certain position (for example became PM/President . Chief of some department etc..) where they can do the corruption , they will find this as once in a lifetime oppurtunity, they will do as much corruption as possible , however once they are caught their first objective will be to save as much looted wealth as possible and get away with any sort of punishment. Most of the corrupt leaders in the world will leave thier country forever and will never return , a corrupt person will try to his best to avoid any sentence in jail as what is the use of the looted money if he can not enjoy it. The glaring example in this regard is of Admiral Mansoor ul Haq , those who don’t know he committed the higest corruption (700 million dollars for himself only , it was perhaps few billion dollars in total) , and he was the first to get the deal with NAB and currently living a happy life in Texas on his ranch. It is mind boggling to see the “Corrupt” politicians of Pakistan who build Suarray Mahals in UK but like to spend thier prime life in Adiala Jail
4. And finally I believe I wrote somewhere else that politicians in Pakistan actually never get a chance to do the corruption, I attended the SC hearing in which AA was defending BB and told the court how much money was usually left for the politicians in Pakistan to do the corruption, it was so meagre that he could buy only a toyota from the corruption of 18 months. And he was really envious of corrupt army generals who and 30 times more money to do the corruption than politicians. That is why I say the way politician have been accused and maligned for thier committed and uncommitted corruption they should be given legal cover to do x% of the total budget corruption just like army has x% of the total budget.

Again people will complain about disinformation and fiction in this however let me say that I feel good when people accuse the politicians only of “Corruption” , it is heartening to see that biggest demerit of AZ is only corruption in the eyes of AZ haters, Which I believe is a good thing as it shows that they have come out of the fiction about ideological borders of Pakistan.

Pakistan May Turn Over U.S. ‘Spies’ to Iran
Iran Claims Jundullah Militants, Led by Abdel Malik Regi, Are ‘Spies’ for the CIA
By RICHARD ESPOSITO and BRIAN ROSS

May 23, 2008

Breaking News: Bomb blasts kill three in Peshawar: police

Musharaf Family asking Musharaff to step down BUT he is not listening.
http://www.jang.com.pk/jang/may2008-daily/24-05-2008/main3.htm

I wish some patriotic officers from Pakistan Army can force him to leave the Army House. Another Mujeeb ur Rehman in the making.

BREAKING NEWS: Musharraf goes mad after watching TV coverage of IMC’s caravan enroute to Faisalabad. He put on his commando fatigues and locked himself in the toilet. Sehba and Zareen Musharraf are begging him to come out of the toilet but he refuses.

What’s Behind AZ’s Tirade Against Musharraf
===================================
If AZ’s tirade against Mush isn’t a facade (many observers believe it is) then what’s behind his tirade against Musharraf?

AZ thought he was too smart, in his desire to please everyone he thought that he would grant Musharraf indemnity in return for clipping of his powers. Much to AZ’s chagrin Mush refused. The commando general believes that AZ is his slave, now that he has absolved AZ of all charges of corruption. This took AZ by surprise as AZ thought Mush would be happy to get indemnity for his Nov 3 acts.

It appears that in his bid to please everyone AZ will end up with eggs on his face hurled from all direction. Mush treats PPP and AZ as toilet paper. PMLN will not support the package as it does not restore IMC unconditionally. Q-league will not support it either the god of the Chaudhries and Q-league does not approve of the amendment package.

Does the heart good by hearing (some) Geo anchors and reporters refer to IMC as Chief Justice of Pakistan.

Zardari the bit$h telling belonies on the TV now!!!

CJP tenure to be fixed three years. DUH!!!!! Truly ugly face of the new kings party of Pakistan. Pakistan President Party with mir Jaffar of democratic forces heading it.

Constitutional package… hahahahaha

Kamran Khan breached the soul of constititional package , right away.

what a shame , this Farooq Naik is.

@pejamystry:

quote:

>> It is mind boggling to see the

NWFP to Pakhtoon Khaw ……………. To get ANP only.(ANP’s single demand)

All other point are drama bazi.

aoa

can someone please confirm has the cj tenure been fixed to 3 years.

Just an observation, but I have found MOST of the pakistani’s who were born in the mid to late forties to be be the cause of destruction of pakistan.. they always treated pakistan as if it was not real and therefore they could do whatever to it and it was like a toy..

maybe because this generation got this country for free and NEVER saw the struggles of the older generations, they have always ripped Pakistan Off… In today’s group of people looting Pakistan, you will see many many people born in the 40’s.

P.S. I know this will twist a lot of people’s 7!77!35 around here because most of the people here are in a demographic whose parents or grand parents fit this description to a tee.

–XPOSTED.

aoa

@admin

the video on the homepage what is that about, i cant listen to it because i am at work.

SPIN DOICTRINE IN ACTION.

Any one with common sense can guess how this package will pass with out the support of President People (Q leauge).AZ S statements regarding MUSH are just to show ,he is not folowing MUSHARAF and his masters Agenda, while every thing being proposed serves this agenda .IT is a NOORA kushti with mush .Even if MUSH is not there can any person can imagine living in DOGAR judiciary era.

How a Jieyala columnist explains Zardari’s recent statements against musharraf

http://nawaiwaqt.com.pk/urdu/daily/may-2008/24/columns2.php

@Chimpy
Since you seem to be new , let me quote famous or is it infamous quote by no other than Dr. Pejamistri

As a software engineer I sometimes envy God, as it is only God who can make two humans with such vast difference intellect between them. A human can never make two intelligent machines which are poles apart in their intellect.

Friend we are poles apart in our intellect , therefore it is no use to argue

President should quit or face impeachment: Zardari

ISLAMABAD: Co-chairman Pakistan People

Just heard on geo- many PML-N supporters are irked at the central leadership of PML-N for not attending Tariq Khan’s funeral. They should have gone there. Here , I think they are making a huge mistake by limiting themselves only to punjab.

AA says that limiting the tenure of the CJP to 3 years IS THE MINUS ONE FORMULA. He has rejected it.

As I said before, AZ had been trying to act oversmart, trying to please (and con) everyone from PMLN to lawyers to Mush. In the end, he’ll end up with egg all over his face.

In AZ’s mind Mush should be grateful to him for granting indemnity to the PCO. But to his utter dismay Mush does not want to yield an inch. Mush treats AZ and PPP as toilet paper, and quite frankly that is where PPP stands today.

Negropotty visit Pakistan next week, he’ll salvage the Mush-PPP allaince, just as he has done twice in the past. First when he visited during BB’s life after BB had visited IMC house sayiing IMC is my CJP. BB went silent on judiciary after Negro Potty’s visit.

Second time he visited after Feb 18 and AZ back-tracked on the Muree declaration.

@Admin please start a section on IMC’s visit to Faisalabad, posting videos clips of the trip.

PPP jiyalas should support IMC by turning up at his rallies. This will make AZ wake up to reality.

While a few jiyalas may do so, I am afraid most will not……. jiyala-pun is a mental disorder after all.

I met one PPP activisst, a female MPA from Punjab in the previous assembly, who said that for us the country comes first and then the party. This lady had braved beatings during the Zia era, was a Bhutto loyalist but she put Pakistan first, before Bhutto, BB or PPP. She even said that IMC has a bigger public following than BHutto had.

Asif Zardari and Nalaik on press conference 24 may on the pkg.

Pukhtunkhwa to be the new name of NWFP !!! FOKK YEAH!
the rest remains to be discussed.

I also saw the following clause as part of the pkg:
“restriction on becoming President more than two times”

Once the president’s role is reduced to ceremonial, it becommes irrelavent whether one can become a President twice or more than that.

There is a slight change in course.. seems to be permanent.. because Negro Panty is arriving next week.

two people asked some pointed questions.. one ppp worker.

Zardari is being shameless… he needs spine. He needs to be decisive.. or the PPP should bring in new leadership?

@TK,
Fully agree. AZ is a rotten character, no point in pinning hopes on him.

@Kruman

Only those people’s sickened mind out of hatered against PPP presumingly imply that PPP worker/jiyala puts Bhutto and the party before Pakistan.

Fahim23,
Instead of giving hypebole statements like every pipliya can you give examples.

Today PPP’s slogan is:
Zar, Zan aur Zameen
Sab say pehlay NRO
Us kay baad AZ
Phir Pervez Musharraf
Pakistan???? What Pakistan

With AZ’s politics since Feb 18, can you argue to the contrary.

If jiyalas put Pakistan before the party they would show up at IMC’s rallies.

They did so last year, I am hoping they’d do the same this year.

Geo reported Lt. general Abdul Qayum’s statement , former chairman of pakistan steels mills, on Meray Mutabiq( to be telecasted today) about the actual cause of feud between Mush and CJ. He said CJ acted constitutionally and in the interest of pakistan. Hope @dmin posts Today mutabiq quickly.

IF PPP followers really put Pakistan first they should be standing and waving PPP flags when receiving CJP, IMC. By that PPP followers will at least take three positive steps. First they will show loyalty towards the judiciary case just like another honorable and genuine jiyala like AA and secondly they will put weight behind the statement that PPP followers put Pakistan first and third they will force AZ and his gang to take the right decisions in FAVOR of PAKISTAN!

/Saqib

@Kruman

Neither Bhutto’s was only PPP nor AZ is PPP. But PPP-hatered too is the reflection of pissed off minds who try to satisfy themselves by coming up different names, abuses and theories that vainly attempt to prove that PPP worker is anti Pakistan or Kafir.

Well said Saqib!

Fahim23, you exemplify the fact that jiyala-pun is a mental disorder. We were having a political discussion, how the heck did you bring in kufr? Frankly, you jiyayals have nothing substantive to answer the PPP critics with, when they say that AZ has betrayed the nation on judiciary.

@Fahim23
No more Kafir , it is now out of fashion these days

@Saqib

The PPP worker is already putting a lots of pressure on AZ (the fact which he himself stated) to restore IMC and other judges honorably. Nothing gives right to anyone to question the sincerity of any one.

Why PPP worker (even after list of unprecedented sacrifices) in this country has to prove that he is loyal to Pakistan?

Fahim23
“But PPP-hatered too is the reflection of pissed off minds who try to satisfy themselves by coming up different names, abuses and theories that vainly attempt to prove that PPP worker is anti Pakistan or Kafir.”

PPP’s dubious statements and constantly changing stance reflect this. Dont forget many people appreciated how PPP stood by CJ and lawyers and promised to support laywers, but when back tracking happens, criticism should be there.

@Peja,
—
…Well you can extract whatever meanings you like to get from my remarks I have …
—

I simply extracted (from your comments) what you had put on the table. It is this flawed rationale and reasoning that encourages these politicians to do corruption. The way you are defending it, who knows, this may be one of the clauses of the PPP constitution.

@Fahim23

I think you are using a too strong word, when you and @Pejamistry declare certain people as PPP “HATERS”. I don’t believe it is the case. What people are doing is that the air the grievances i.e. which part of the PPP actions/policies they don’t like, and that is not the same as HATING PPP. Remember that we on the other hand LOVE the actions of a PPP jiyala like the honorable AA.

/Saqib

@zenith

Criticism is one thing and declaring some one anti-pakistan and in old days kafir is just another!

@Fahim23

“Why PPP worker (even after list of unprecedented sacrifices) in this country has to prove that he is loyal to Pakistan?”

No, monsieur. Nobody can rest on the laurels. Sacrifices and hard work is a running and never ending process. Not only PPP supporters, but everybody has to prove loyalty to Pakistan by their (positive) actions. These are very testing times and anybody who is passive will not be proving nothing.

/Saqib

@Amir Hameed
I think I have quite thoroughly explained myself on this issue.

@Saqib

I think you are using a too strong word, when you and @Pejamistry declare certain people as PPP

@Fahim23,
Take a cue form Peja, he is a jiyala ( or so I think), but he puts Pakistan first, supporting IMC, they lawyers in their movement for an independent judiciary.

Even when he defends PPP, he puts a spin saying they’ll reinstate judges in the end.

@Saqib
I consider myself establishment hater , I am such a stubborn in this regard that if somebody proves in front of my eyes that establishment is the greatest virtue in Pakistan and they have always done everything for Pakistan and thier people and they really are angels and have saved the nation etc. etc. etc… I am like that athiest who would refuse the existence of god even he sees him with his own eyes…..
This is what I mean by adjective “Hater” , I have not used PPP hater instead I have used AZ haters. There is no doubt their are people who are AZ haters , there are NS haters , there are IK haters and I myself am an establishment hater.
I hope that clears.

@Kruman

What made you think that I don’t support IMC??

@Saqib

Not only PPP supporters, but everybody has to prove loyalty to Pakistan by their (positive) actions

I don’t think we should or we can play god by judging who is pakistani and who is not. But even if hardships and sacrifices are counted to declare someone true pakistani then I don’t see any other political party’s worker except PPP a true pakistani.

I would really appreciate if some one can tell me the sacrifices made from PML (A to Z) worker, JI and MMA worker, PTI worker or MQM worker!

@Fahim23

And how does PPP care about the sacrifices of PPP workers on 12.th May 2007? Have PPP forgot that massacre since they are having MQM in their lap?

Btw I am not playing god, but giving straight forward opinion about what we should do as Pakistanis. No spin, but straight talk!

PML-N made sacrifices in the elections when attacked by Mush/PML-Q anti Pakistan forces and PTI also was in the forefront on 12.th May

What matters is how you care about those who are insulted/injured/killed. On that front PPP has failed miserably by stating that we should “forget” 12.th May. I think it was the AA, who said that.

/Saqib

@Fahim23

You must know that I don’t doubt your good intentions. I think you are a bit frustrated by the (in)action of AZ and his gang members. They are destroying PPP from inside. Personally I wish to see a strong and reliable PPP, who works for the betterment of poor Pakistanis.

/Saqib

@Saqib

The 40% of lawyers running the lawyer movement belong to PPP. Mr. AA leader of lawyer’s movement belong to PPP and it will be the pressure of PPP voter on AZ which will force him to InshALLAH restore the honorable judges including IMC.

No PPP supporter can forget 12th May, 19th July, or 18th Oct. You probably don’t know that the Sindh government has already commanded IG Sindh to initiate fresh investigations of 12th May 07 and 10th april 08.

Yes I was disappointed from AZ when he after taking off sensibly suddenly back tracked from his committment of Muree accord but I am Not even near to be frustrated or disappointed from PPP.

PML-N made sacrifices in the elections when attacked by Mush/PML-Q anti Pakistan forces ….Indeed great sacrifice

PML-N issues charge sheet against the mad dictator. This is a very significant development. If the impeachment of mad dictator becomes a reality than this charge sheet is going to become very important. The charge sheet includes among others
1. Assisnation of BB
2. Kargil blunder
3. Corruption of 4.5 billion dollars
4. Rigging in elections

Please note that once a persident is impeached and is dismissed by the parliament as president , the charges in charge sheet may than be used to file formal criminal cases against the president. As I see the current harsh tone of PML-N and soft tone of PPP against the mad dictator is going to be dangerous for establishment. Regular reference to article 6 of constitution on the media by everybody is not a good sign for the establishment, until even 2006 the reference to article 6 was a big taboo among the mediamen.
I would like to predict that invocation of article 6 may not be a distant reality if honorable judges are restored.

@Fahim23
“PML-N made sacrifices in the elections when attacked by Mush/PML-Q anti Pakistan forces

gallup
http://daily.urdupoint.com/Live-News.php?news_id=66066&featured=1&cat_id=2

@Fahim23

“The 40% of lawyers running the lawyer movement belong to PPP. ”

If true then GREAT! BUT what about the ordinary jiyalas? Will they only be on the streets if AZ and team mates will ask them to come out of their hibernation or can they take independent decisions on local level?

/Saqib

@Fahim23,
Show a big heart by admitting that Saqib has made the better arguments.

He put it succinctly when he said that don’t rely on past laurels by citing the deaths of ZAB, BB and the rest. The future of Pakistan is now, in supporting the brave non-PCO judges led by IMC.

@Kruman

Let me tell you that almost every PPP worker including me support restoration of CJ IMC!

@Kruman
@Saqib
Totally agree with both of you on everything stated above.

@Kruman
“If jiyalas put Pakistan before the party they would show up at IMC

@Fahim23, you said:
“Let me tell you that almost every PPP worker including me support restoration of CJ IMC!”

That is BS, if they supported IMC they would kick AZ out of PPP along with the Rahman Malik, Nalaik and Sherrry Rahman.

But you can

Hamid Khan blasting PPP in Faisalabad convention….

Go Zardari Go…………………

PPP certainly have people like AA, Raza Rabbani, etc., that have credibility but they have been sidelined by Zardari and oneone has dared ask why. I have not seen anyone from PPP ever raising the question that why did Zardari appoint non-elected people like Rehman Malik, Hussain Haqqani, Naik or Na-laik, on important posts? Why was Rehman Malik not around BB when she was assassinated? These are all important questions that everyone but Piplias have raised. Anytime someone raises this type of question, they are immediately branded as PPP-haters.

@amir Hameed, you are absolutely right. but news for you eleven million including me would still vote for PPP.

@kinnare
Are you really capable of saying something other than “there are only two parties… blah blah blah … and these many people voted for …. and …. yatti yatti yatta”? Come up with some solid arguments if you really want to defend policies of your beloved leader Zardari.

Ansar Abbasi on the CEC meeting:”PPP CEC split on judges issue”
http://www.thenews.com.pk/top_story_detail.asp?Id=14915

Here is what I find funny:
—
… A source close to Zardari said the PPP co-chairperson may agree to five-year tenure for the CJP as the final compromise but he was firm on the enhanced age….
—

Things are being decided on critical issues based on “his highness’s” wishes.

Request for Info: The beard guy behind Nawaz Sharif, 3rd from left, I have been seeing this guy with Nawaz Sharif since the 90

@Amir Hameed
“PPP certainly have people like AA, Raza Rabbani, etc., ”

Let’s not include Rabbani in the list. Though I don’t know much about him but as I had commented some time back, “seeing him sitting shoulder-to-shoulder next to AZ every where, I say …had he any decency or self respect or principles he would not be caught dead in that position. (Is he there to provide some sort of

“President should quit or face impeachment: Zardari
ISLAMABAD: Co-chairman Pakistan People

Very interesting question raised by Wasatullah Khan
http://www.bbc.co.uk/urdu/miscellaneous/story/2008/05/080525_baat_baat.shtml

@kruman

Fahim23, you said:

So it seems there is some truth in the rumors that mad dictator may fire COAS , Rashid Quraishi denies this but look at his statement that “COAS SHOULD complete the tenure.
http://www.jang.com.pk/jang/may2008-daily/25-05-2008/update.htm#60