Haroon-ur-Rashid sheds his skin, comes out guns a blazin and accuses the Americans of Killing Benazir and Zardari and Rehman Malik being complicit.

http://express.com.pk/images/NP_LHE/20080718/Sub_Images/1100446846-2.gif

I buy his theory. I would like to know more. My theory is that if it was the Americans, than the trigger pullers were provided by MQM, perhaps the orphan child of someone who was killed in the operations started by BB …

I seriously don’t think the guy who was shooting at benazir was some pashtoon.

I do disagree with his support of Zia’s afghan policy though. The russians were baited into Afghanistan. Zia was moved into position just as CIA was doing covert operations to dupe the russians into invading Afghanistan.

The russians are now returning the favor. Both to american and to pakistan.
They might get their access to the warm waters of Gawadar after all (if they play their cards well).

This is my conspiracy theory.

thats interesting from haroon rashid… anyway despite of these all Ifs and buts ..danger is growing and conditions in NWFP are going to be worst and taliban mullas will destroy every sign of a civiliazation in the name of their shariat and justice…

best of luck haroon rashid and others

Winning friends all over…………………………

Two article’s from today’s Dawn:
Kuldip Nayar: The threat (from India) is real
……Spelling out retaliation, the National Security Adviser has mentioned two things: one, India will not let the attack go unpunished and, two, “the ISI needs to be destroyed. We have made this point whenever we have had a chance through interlocutors across the world.” Significant are the words: “There might have been some tactical restraint for some time; obviously that restraint is no longer present.”…..

Ayesha Siddiqa: Red Mosque again
The global forces that include the US, China, Russia and others will not allow Pakistan to retain nuclear weapons if there is a threat of a Taliban takeover or an increase in their influence. If the recipe then is to conduct a direct attack, which seems more likely now than ever before, the risk of greater instability will increase manifold. It is not just a matter of American interests but that of other nations as well, including Pakistan’s “all weather” friend China which is highly nervous about the activities of religious fundamentalist forces in its adjoining regions.

@TK
That, my friend, is no conspiracy theory. And do read the articles links to which I posted above…

http://thenews.com.pk/updates.asp?id=49927

wasn’t he crying before that the decisions of Pakistan’s future must be taken in Pakistan.

Some how I missed this: I did not know Gillani was a minister in Zia’s cabinet……

@nota: Not only him, but I think Javed Hashmi was also if I’m not mistaken.

Seraiki’s have been real favorites of the foreign proxies that we call “our establishment” due to their “miThi tabiat” (read: submissive and obedient nature (percieved)). Though personally I think they are as assertive as the sindhi’s but in a polite but very passive aggressive way.

I find it rather rich coming from GM Khar! Mr. Loser Writ Large himself! He has been trying to see if he can ingratiate himself to power once again… and now I think he’s acting like a surrogate for NS presence in the rallies…. Not to mention that it was this “real” people’s party that sat on their hands as one dictator hanged Bhutto. Now he’s complaining about PPP doing what it does best, quid-pro-quo with the kleptocracy.

and WTF is this “give me power and if I don’t perform, hang me in 3 months”

yeah right! some of us still remember yous “we will not live in the governor house but in tents” BS! pippla’s like him are good at dishing out BS! That’s all.

@nota: ur links are pointing to pkpolitics ??

flag protest: any takers..add zardaro, moshe, etc,,etc

http://www.indybay.org/news/2005/03/1728717.php .

@kafka

hahah……thats very creative. I wana add Dogar and Rehman Malik to it as well.

WAKE UP Pakistan ! It’s time to stop FOOLING around.

DOWNWARDS ‘Progress’ Hurts Pakistan !

Where are $1 Billion per month going?
Rupee devaluationfrom 20% (from 60 to 71.9 per $)

160 Million Pakistanis must pay for the SLEEPY ‘Leaders’ of Pakistan, who are PLAYING politics and the PUBLIC is watching with empty stomachs.

It HURTS Pakistan and it hurts to read in the News:

“The foreign currency reserves stood at $14.08 billion on Feb 15, 2008. The reserves position was much better a few months back as they stood around $16.4 billion during Oct 2007. It showed that the reserves declined by around $6 billion in the last few months.”

- Useless Spending
- Expanding Cabinet
- Flying around,
- Dining in Hotels

EVERY DAY wasted counts !

It counts in terms of National Wealth ($ 45 billion debt, 20% increase). The Economy of Pakistan is DWINDLING at ROCKET SPEED — DOWNWARDS.

Will they RUN to IMF, after Saudi Arabia and UAE begging in the name of the country and the 160 Million poor Pakistanis will have to pay back with their SWEAT and BLOOD?

ONLY ALLAH WILL SAVE PAKISTAN !

What are the PATRIOTIC POLITICIANS doing.
Where are they ?

Have they abodoned the SHIP at the first Blow of the Morning wind?
They seem to have chikened out and left Pakistan already, while the Nation’s PULSE is getting WEAKER, day by day !

I dont understand these hosts. On one hand they say that the leaders should come back. Then they say that the PM / cabinet / parliament should make the decisions.

Isnt it abundantly clear that when the 2 “leaders” are in town they dont let anyone else do the work and such the bandwidth from the media.

Best thing is for them to stay out and let the elected reps figure all the problems out.

http://blogs.reuters.com/pakistan/2008/07/17/guest-contribution-pakistan-should-shudder-afghanistan-should-despair/
good one

@TK
Apologies!
Kuldip Nayar: The threat (from India) is real
Ayesha Siddiqa: Red Mosque again

@TK
and WTF is this “give me power and if I don’t perform, hang me in 3 months”

I think that’s the punch line. I almost laughed out loud reading it…

@TK

“Not only him, but I think Javed Hashmi was also if I’m not mistaken.”

yeah but he was only for very short time. He was( and i think still is) the youngest minister of Pakistan. He resigned from ministry after some time from zia cabinet.

@nota: I think we should skip the “give Khar power” part and just hang him right away! lol!

@psychonaut: yeah, he quit after Zia changed his colors…. not sure about YRG’s tenure though but Khar is such an A$$ he ruins a point even if there is one. He should be shunned by the lawyers. He’s going to f\/ck it up for Amin FAhim. He’s mr. f\/ckup!

According to this interview with Fatima Bhutto: http://www.counterpunch.org/waj05032008.html - He served under the Majlis of Shura council - an islamic council for Zia ul haq’s most trusted people.

It wasn’t until he was replaced as minister and sidelined by the PM until he went to BB. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/7310028.stm
@TK - Zia hung ZAB. What colors do you have left to change after that?

@NKH: well what I meant to say was that Javed Hashmi claims he left after he Zia reportedly didn’t do what he said he would do.

My problem with this whole picture is that WHY THE HELL DID HE JOIN TO BEGIN WITH? WTF?

Everyone rips the flesh off their mother in Pakistan, and then finds a fuqn tasbeeh in the twilight of their miserable lives. FUQN MUNAFIQS!

Law and Order-
In addition to the Talibaan issue and general breaddown of law and order another Law and Order problem-

http://thenews.jang.com.pk/daily_detail.asp?id=125058.

As a special advisor-( If I was one )- I would meet the owner of the company and make him an offer he could not refuse-( a la GODFATHER)- and we will at least solve this law and order problem.

Now you know why people take the law into their own hands.,

@TK: Yeah these epiphanies later on in life are somewhat absurd…at least its better than what Shahid Masood is doing. I think with YRG (and maybe Hashmi also) the situation would be somewhat the same as what Kashmala Tariq is going through now. If she leaves pml-q and joins pml-n and starts ripping Musharraf it would be ridiculous. She would join pml-n because SHE has no where to go after being kicked out and it would be better for HER. The interests of Pakistan have nothing to do with it.

Why do they join in the first place? Probably because the easiest way to get THEIR foot in the door is by joining the establishment.

As you discussing Taliban and Afghanistan, you should also read then Taliban-Friendly Post on Lal-mosque anniversary :
http://www.futurebells.com/blog/democracy/lal-masjid-story-first-anniversary-of-lal-masjid/

Iran, Israel and American on the Brink?

It is not the oil that makes Iran’s enemies think a hundred times before attacking them, it is BA!!S that their leadership seems to posses, and which our ‘leadership’ seem to be equally bereft of.

Just need ba!!s. And then you can use your nukes. You pu$$ies!

A good segment on Concentrating Solar Power which is being used increasingly in Europe, and which they are planning to havest in Africa and import into Europe.

New technology uses solar energy to super-heat water which is used to drive steam turbines producing electricity. These plants are already in use in Spain. Test plants have been built in north Africa and the Middle East. Naomi Fowler reports on progress in other areas of Europe, including Italy where there is a strong political push for nuclear power. In many countries, current legislation assists existing electricity producers over new technologies.

http://www.abc.net.au/rn/scienceshow/stories/2008/2303970.htm (15 min)

We got jillions of megawatts falling all over us in Pakistan and we live like fudqn beggars.

Whose fault is it?

Misconceptions about solar power that most ‘educated’ pakistani’s seem to parrot:

1. We don’t have technology to make PV Solar

WRONG: We don’t have the BRAINS to make PV solar, and also we don’t have the industrial base, which means engineers and a general scientific attituded in the engineering community. The principles of PV solar have been known for at least a hundred years. The thing is, we know about silicone manufacturing about as much as horse do about diesel engines (the ones who know can be found in long lines outside of US/UK/EU embassies)

2. Thermal Solar is a 4 legged animal which has one horn sticking out of its forehead.

WRONG AGAIN: Thermal Solar is the cheapest form which only needs reflectors and pipes, a technology we’ve had since the fuqn days of Moen-jo-DaRo, but which is a big deal to master for current Pakistani’s.

“Soldiers killed in Kashmir blast

At least seven soldiers have been killed in an explosion triggered by suspected separatist militants, police in Indian-administered Kashmir said.

More than 20 others were hurt when a bus carrying the troops was caught in the blast in the Narbal area, close to the provincial capital, Srinagar.”

Source:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/7515458.stm

Expect more woes for Pakistan on it’s borders due to the above situation combined with the Indian casualties in Afghanistan and our inept “leadership”. We are getting an unprecedented mixture of problems:

- The Allied “friends” of GHQabza Group
- The TaliBAN
- The Indian opportunists
- And off course all the local opportunists like Altaf KaTTA Singh’s gang members

@tk

re the link on the triangle/war; there was a similar story a few days back on NYtames…

and it seems an attack on iran is imminent…regardless of what compromises the iranians do make… this will rubbish everything else to the bin..given the hellish consequences that will unfold.

my question is have they/ are they also considering to take out the ‘pakinyuknyuk’ ..u know…two for one!???

The Americans are maybe trying to fool the Iranians by throwing out feelers of some kind of diplomatic links with Iran….The Americans have hinted that lately, but I think the Iranians are too smart to swallow the bait.

@kafka8 & @shirkuh: that prog. is well worth the listen though it’s about 50 or so minutes. They are talking about getting Iran to keep the enrichment capacity to what it is now for some ‘rewards’…

I can’t believe Iran doesn’t have refining capacity despite producing all this oil.

This is how empires are run boys! Not some panzy a$$ sh!t like… oh when the indians come, we’ll run off to kabul to plan our counter-fuggn-attack ! GAWD!!

Pakistani foreign/strategic responses to most threat remind me of this Monty pyhton clip (watch till the end).

Acutally, this is a longer version of just the trojan rabbit scene.

“Who leaps out?” hahahaha!

Now we see the violence inherent in the system! Help! Help! I’m being repressed!

@tk

even if the unisraelized americans are willing to settle with a non-nuclear armed iran..i dont think the non-’moderate’ iran will stop there…and israel knows this…thus all this sabre rattling. ..it can go either way…(keep in mind the sunni arabs are sheeting oil bricks at the thought of the growing influence of iran in the region….forget a rising nuclear iran.

luv the monty python links

@shrikuh, tk, nota

lawyers give 14th august deadline…less then a month away…let the countdown begin!!…(can someone inject some viagra in AA meanwhile)

the ultimate optimist stirs (correction..penultimate) ..wither peja?!!! (hope he didn’t overdose on optimism)

zindah hain wukalah! zindah hain!!

CHIEF teray jan nisar….bay shumar! bay shumar!!

@Kafka8

I hope the lawyers movement can gather enough pace and foremost enough unity within their own ranks to demonstrate their power. Enough sacrifices have been made and nobody wishes to see this great movement to die an unnatural death. To ensure that AA need to concentrate on the task ahead and take the lawyers leadership on board whenever taking important decisions. We need not to see ad hoc solutions like the abrupt ending of the Long March, which in my opinion was a victory for the establishment. AA is a man full of energy and need not Viagra. He just needs to keep away from BAD influence from former PM’s and corrupt party leaders. The all weather and tested friend of the lawyers movement (PTI) has earlier declared 14.th August day of demonstration…..”All weather friend”…sounds like our Chinese friendship

@kafka8: I think the mullah’s have some sense into them and they are not as irrational as the Israeli likudniks make them out to be. The problem is that an “un-destroyed” Iran poses a historical threat to the long term viability of Israel. Which cannot be allowed. And since israelis are bigger cowboys than the americans, they want to solve it using all the weapons they got.

The idea is to obliterate the “middle east” and create Somalia-like situation all over this area (think mid African countries) … Then an ONLY then can two things be achieved, (1) the control on the energy resources and more importantly (2) long term survival of Israel.

Keep in mind, the the Israeli’s/Zionists are not sitting around like little b!tches wondering when the next slap in the face is gonna come, they are actively shaping their future by identifying, engaging and neutralizing tactical and strategic threats to their nation. And the destruction of Iraq was part of this, and now they want to repeat it in Iran.

Pakistan is also on the list.

Pakistan they hope to break from within and then a UN force will come and say, “give us your nukes temporarily” which the MQM influenced bhayya’s will comply with because they just happen to be incharge of the nukes — note Punjab will never get the nukes

There is no getting around it.

@tk

once again ..you have detailed subject and where i agree the iranian mullah is aware, well read and well versed in subjects outside islam, and where i also agree that israelis/umreekis tend to paint them as some sort of mindless mullas (and they do this out of respect for them..and fear for an enemy with intergrity and intellect), i will maintain that the iranians being aware of this over confident ‘empire’, WILL go for the nyuke.

(as someone who despises the concept of such weaponry, in an ideal world i would say , it is stupid to make this weapon..but in the real world..it is stupid not to.)

Still one can argue..it is better to not make the weapon, feign submission and strive for economic and educational progress, till such time that you can mount a successful retaliation should the interests of your nation, your people are threatened unduly.

as for pakistan…i guess you said it all!!

@tk

as for pakistan…i guess you said it all!! BUT the fact is that over 50% of pakistani population were born in the 80s…that they are not tainted like our parent’s generation..(as you rightly point out) and it this fact..this young generation (and thus my great interest in youth movements such as SAC) .which sustains my optimism for this country, HOPE for this country.

@TK
As it regards to Pakistan from your post; “Pakistan they hope to break from within and then…”

Are you saying that it’s “their” fault that Pakistan can be broken from within? Pakistan/China have been trying to leverage the maoist threat against the Indians for the longest time but have not been as successful as according to you some foreign forces have been in Pakistan. I assume that has to do with the fact that Pakistan has always been “fragile”.

To me, if we can’t get our sh** together, then we deserve whatever is comming for us. You can’t blame Tom, Dick and Harry for that; that’s why Tom, Dick and Harry exist. You are ‘explaining’ the Daktur Shahid Masood world view, which is what it is, a view; It can’t be reality.

With regards to Iran, I love the optics they are giving..”we have our fingures on the trigger all the time..” As you said, they have the bal** .

@kafka8: I agree with you on both counts. With these ‘dialogs’ only the West is buying time, Iran would be fooling itself if they fall for ‘promises’ made to them.. Native Americans and the Inca’s made the same mistake (using the “treaties” signed with the Europeans for something other than wiping their a$$es with, because Europe only speaks the language of raw power.)

@WAN: I don’t blame the enemies. It is their job to utilize our weaknesses. We cannot beg for mercy from enemies (something our neutered intellectual class not to mention our “warrior” class has a tendency to do). The point I was trying to make was that it would be too messy to apply “the Iran” model to Pakistan for neutralizing it. They will try to take advantage of the “fragility” inherent in the system.

The entropy in our nation is increasing at a mindboggling rate. That can only be stemmed by a proper education campaign. But we are not paying attention to that aspect of the fight, while our enemies are doing nothing BUT.

YRG urging people to not eat so much oil! Right on!

Can someone explain to me WTF deos EVERY Pakisani recipe start with:

3 kup ghee, ya tail, ya charbi ??? whaaaaaaaaaa????

You’re only cooking 1 cup of daal woman!

what about his trips to meet mr 10% in dubai

the planes that YRG travels don’t use oil

@TK
Alas, the mother of all solutions is the word “proper education”.

sorry the words “proper education”

@nuts: feel free to pitch in with a more realistic approach other than a proper education campaign

@TK & WN

The importance of ”proper education” cannot be exaggerated. Maybe we should have a new thread on what we understand by “proper education”. Our existing outdated RATTA education “system” is certainly NOT a proper education, where we can expect people to develop analytical/logical mindset.

YRG was sounding like Moshe. The only differences were the face, the voice and the references to “shaheed” BB

and did u guys notice…how he kept looking to the left and right
….hilarious…

jinnah said in a speech to the youth…work work work…
he meant “study ! !u dumb a%$SeS.!!

@ all talk show hosts who may read this
Take a full show and debate the following: What should be the salary and how should parlementarians/ ministers/ lifetime presidents of political parties live in order that they best SERVE the people of Pakistan.

Here’s my proposal: Their salary should be that of the average Pakistani, they should live in a house that an average Pakistani would live in, they should eat like that, their children MUST go to public schools, they should have medical care of avg Pakistani, same amt of electricity and water….Plato suggested something similar.

Oh yeah…and when they give that ugly, disgusting, repulsive, shameless laughter of dismissal that they always give when they’ve been thoroughly embarrassed and exposed, continue to hammer the point.

Muchos Gracias.

I’m convinced that the above method would bring change to the people of Pakistan in the quickest manner.

NPR: Getting solar power for less in the US (42 min)

@shirkuh & WN : I said a proper education campaign not “a campaign for proper education” in the orwellian sense which I think WN was trying to imply. Maybe I took it the wrong way.

@shimatoree
“Law and Order-
In addition to the Talibaan issue and general breaddown of law and order another Law and Order problem-
http://thenews.jang.com.pk/daily_detail.asp?id=125058.”

This is nothing new and not an isolated incidence. The situation is a lot worst than you can imagine. Do you know hundreds of CT scanners have been and are being bought by your government for hundreds of millions of dollars that are never going to work? The main company profitting in this case is Philips though Siemens usually always has a hand in such pies. Besides that, I am aware of two earlier scams. I believe one involved buying 300 or so faulty MRI’s on orders of Health Minister (Abdul Wahid?) Soomro (I believe it was Toshiba that made a killing). Another was the case of hundreds of dental setups (sorry I forget the exact term — I mean full set ups for having dental departments in hospitals) which are even today rotting all over the country, most still rapped in their original plastic covering, just gathering dust.

And I am sure we are still paying for those old purchases….

The scam really is they buy these over-invoiced machines and send them to all Tehsil hospitals knowing full well most Tehsils don’t have any technical staff to run the thing, not to mention the lack of electricity. They also make sure they do not budget any monies to hire such staff if miracle of miracles such staff was available. So of course the machines never get used (and no one finds out if they were faulty which is often the case). Of course they are under “warranty” but repairs would only be needed if machines were operational.

YRG: And the 35 or more 2500cc or bigger vehicles that are part of his motorcade run on water….not to include all the police vehicles running all around town dropping and picking up policemen all along his route….

@TK:
I said ‘proper education’, nothing about a campaign. We might not have been on the same page and maybe you were referring to the immediate step in terms of a campaign (to inform the people, as if our not so politically savy taxi driver doesn’t know it all), which as you mentioned is not a realistic solution.

The problems that i see (as an outsider who hasn’t been to Pakistan since 2004; was there for two weeks only), to arrest the ‘entropy’ that you speak of:

1)Inflation - “It’s the economy stupid!”. Needs to be controlled immediately via ‘outside aid’. The begging bowl is already out and has reached Middle East. It will soon be heading to the West (Idiots like Ayaz Amir who hasn’t done anything but put ink to paper needs to run a local Union Council before suggesting crap about not taking foreign aid/loans). Although ‘we’ don’t like the idea and it’s demeaning, but i don’t live in Daktur Shahid Masood’s world. YRG can give all the speaches he wants, we will need foreign aid (and YRG is heading West for the same).

2)Rising extremism and “terrorism” - send the punjabi soldiers to the Northern Areas/Settled Districts/PATA to do the surgical operations as needed. We haven’t seen the end of the Hangu operation yet, but maybe that’s something that might need to emulated in other settled districts. FATA strategy cannot be ‘gotten’ from the Parliament, atleast for the time being, before any “proper education campaign”. We will not get the decision that will help in keeping the federation together at this point. Althought time for strategy is long gone, and it should have been in the stages of implementation now, there is still time to cobble something together.

3)Judiciary: Do whatever pkpolitics.com Admin says in terms of Judiciary. i.e., although you are right, there is a lot of gray area.

4)Educaiton: 4-5% of GDP needs to be allocated (we can go in all sorts of details with the turf wars, Army, waderas, politicians, Ahsan Iqbal Jack A*s); the point is people need to read so they are atleast as educated as a common Iranian, where literacy rate i believe is 80-85%. Then we can use Adobe Photoshop to put in a couple of extra missiles in our missile test photos.

5)K*ll Shoaib Akhtar and Muhammad Asif. Make sure it looks like an accident, maybe they both OD on Pir Pinjar’s hakeemi nuskha.

I know these are very micro and administrative suggestions/issues, but in my view that’s what is needed within the next 6 months. Long term threats and strategy will require another post.

@NKH

but that would mean getting decent faculty..which would mean giving appropriate salary….and oh…the curriculum…no..we cant do any such platonic thing..we are a third world democracy…you see…and we have to FEED the FAUJI jurnail….. and after we recover the money we spent on getting elected, ??? where will the money come from??

(plato didn’t like democracy you see..he was against pakistan too)

I don’t know what everybody thought about YRG’s speech, but what the he*l was that?

Was he using a teleprompter and then switched to paper or was he addressing some gethering in the studio before and then made the real speech, which was on paper? Who is his speech writer? The speech writer jerk needs to be hanged by him….

@w_a_n

I think speech writer is Nazir Naji

If Nazir Naji takes a lifafa from the rulers-du-jour , he takes a bigger lifafa from the foreigners.

Most of our “journalists” take lifafa’s from the foreigners.

I think YRG looking to the left is like a nervous tick.. that he doesn’t even realize.. kinda like when people say ummm… ummm.. “you know”… etc without umm.. youknow… realizing it.

YRG’s first speech reminds me of some retarded kid in school who finally memorizes his “lesson” by heart and delivers it quickly before his brain frogets all of it.

WTF! I have never seen a proper studio speech by a Pakistani head of state (maybe videos of Zulifiqar Ali Bhutto’s studio speeches are an exception). YRG has known for the past, i dunno, two weeks that he is going to give this speech. Then why in the world wouldn’t he prepare for it, especially, when he sees his wife without the makeup in the bedroom! He should have gone to the friking study, and read it upside down. Plus, he is giving the speech in a studio, why would you be nervous there? You are staring in the dark actually most of the time. Plus, why the frik can’t PTV do a complete teleprompter speech. When we spend millions of dollars on vib*ators for the wives of politicians, why can’t PTV get a friking teleprompter that does the whole speech in Urdu? This is amateur hour!!!

OMFG! that speech sucks donkey ba!!S! WTF!

Exactly HOW incompetent ARE the pippliya’s ???

This has left ANY speech done by moshe in the dust! (and thats saying a lot coming from me)

Looks like he was trying to impress the camera man and the micrphone guy (not to mention the gardner who must’ve wandered in the studio)

Sofa King incompetent!

lol what a waste of time, I don’t think anyone in pakistan would’ve been up to hear the PM talking gibberish.

@ TK

not about mushi, Gilani even left behind…..speech of ch shujat as PM.

@kafka8 - lol. Except for the lack of reference to BB’s shahaadat, your answer would make farzana raja proud.

I would add to my list that once a year they go to a poor neighborhood and clean the toilets of every house on the block. You know to remind them that they’re the people’s servants.

Salute to brave American soldiers

http://www.silobreaker.com/DocumentReader.aspx?Item=5_881330951

Original source:
http://www.thepost.com.pk/Arc_IsbNews.aspx?dtlid=172968&catid=17&date=07/18/2008&fcatid=14

@GM on July 19th, 2008 11:01 pm
it is totally hilarious and funny news. Really interesting
US army-equip with sophisticated weapons and “sophisticated” uniform’

Was there any SPEECH from YRG (I think he’s also the PM)???

Great… I missed it.

I’d love to see someone really requesting the adm!n to upload the YRG Speech…. Let’s see

@ all talk show hosts who may read this
Take a full show and debate the following: What should be the salary and how should parlementarians/ ministers/ lifetime presidents of political parties live in order that they best SERVE the people of Pakistan.

Here’s my proposal: Their salary should be that of the average Pakistani, they should live in a house that an average Pakistani would live in, they should eat like that, their children MUST go to public schools, they should have medical care of avg Pakistani, same amt of electricity and water….Plato suggested something similar.

I’d also emphasize on this one.

Can someone please Email this to Bolta Pakistan and some other programs so we can get this point across to Hamid Mir or others and see how our Politicians will react when this question is asked.

Videos for 19th July coming shortly.

Admin

Confused PM; plain blue background shows the decision power that he holds.

raat 11 bajey “mairey hamwatnon” waley taqreer kartey hain ek muntakhib wazir-e-azam nahin.
ek wazir-e-azam ka bilwal zardari(artificial bhutto) ka shukriyya ada karna acha laga(ghulam dar ghulam)

“asi tey tuhadey ghulam aan sain”

Zimbabwe releases 100 Billion Dollar Bill! Yes you heard it right!!

Still not enough to buy a loaf of bread. But you can buy 4 oranges if you like!

Moral of the story: Don’t mess with Whitey!

New Poll Added:

Farzana Raja has Qualified to become a Minister?

Zimbabwe’s inflation rate is 150000%, so that means that the price of bread in morning would be twice in the afternoon.

Why our civil society is weak
…..
The problem with us is the nature of our ruling class. We did not struggle or make any sacrifice for our independence. Therefore, our nascent bourgeoisie, a class-in-the-making, did not evolve into a class-for-itself. It did not acquire the legitimacy necessary for a ruling class. The feudal class, therefore, remained the ruling class in West Pakistan. This class’ relationship with the peasantry is primarily of a political instance i.e. characterised by force and lawlessness, which reflects itself in the feudal class’ politics. Hence, its alliance with the army which facilitates not only the frequent putsches in the country but the almost permanent nature of army rule.

This kind of ruling power equation does not require the kind of political alliances which go into the making of a civil society. Thus our civil society is weak because our capitalist class is weak. It seems to have lost the desire for political power ever since it was mauled by Z. A. Bhutto. It now accepts the feudals’ supremacy and the army rule. And it puts up with the neo-liberal measures whose aim is to keep Pakistan from industrialising itself.

The only hope we have is the rising industrial bourgeoisie, particularly in Panjab, which is not only nationalist but is increasingly perceptive of its contradiction with the ruling feudal class. It may, in time, become strong enough to reach out for power.

Meanwhile, the civil society that we see in embryo, is not weaving a web around the existing ruling class but in anticipation of a ruling class which may yet come into being. This is the measure of its weakness at present. It is still mobilising its constituent elements — our weak industrial bourgeoisie, the professionals, the artisanat, the lower middle class, etc. It can constitute itself in the process of the struggle it is waging now, a struggle that we did not wage for our independence. This striving for democracy and democratic rights will equally strengthen our independence and sovereignty.

Zimbabwe: Where every citizen is a billionaire!!
But seriously…
Cato Institute at Tsvangirai’s Elbow: Vultures Circle Zimbabwe
…Meanwhile, an ominous dance began between Tsvangirai and the forces of imperialism. According to a Reuters report today, the MDC would gain access to US$2 billion per year in ‘aid and development’ ­ which normally is top-heavy with foreign debt and chock-full of conditions. Amongst these, most likely, are dramatic cuts to the civil services, so that the Zimbabwe central bank stops printing so much money, fuelling inflation. But the downside is the potential deepening of the country’s economic crisis in the short term, as effective demand falls while more luxury goods become available thanks to foreign exchange inflows.

The key players are the International Monetary Fund, World Bank, European Union and the United Nations. No doubt Bush’s White House is also involved in negotiations, which, if Tsvangirai persuades Mugabe to depart, may even reach fruition next week at the IMF/Bank spring meetings in Washington.

Given that Tsvangirai has chosen advisors from the International Republican Institute and Cato Institute, such a process was anticipated. It simply means that the left-leaning civil society forces that backed Tsvangirai have a huge regroupment challenge. If after an April 21 victory, many progressive Zimbabwean organizations lose cadres into an expanded state, this may recall the liquidation of South Africa’s Mass Democratic Movement into the African National Congress government….

What the West Doesn’t Want to Know: Zimbabwe’s Fight for Justice
Twenty-five years ago, Zimbabwe’s liberation movement came to power after years of struggle. Hopes soared that independence would bring an end to the legacy of colonial rule and apartheid power and give birth to a more equitable and just social order. But in many ways, those expectations had to be put on hold due to British and U.S. pressure, and for years Zimbabwe was compelled to maintain the inequitable land ownership patterns inherited from apartheid Rhodesia. The process of land reform is at root a struggle for justice and a challenge to the Western neoliberal model. The refusal to serve Western interests is what motivates U.S. and British hostility.

It is impossible to understand the nature of land reform in Zimbabwe without first examining the history of land allocation in Rhodesia….

We who prayed and wept
for liberty from kings
and the yoke of liberty
accept the tyranny of things
we do not need.
In plenitude too free,
we have become adept
beneath the yoke of greed.

First stanza from the poem “We Who Prayed and Wept” by Wendell Berry as quoted in The Selling and Shaping of Our Souls — The Yoke of Greed by Robert Jensen

A passage from Jensen piece mentioned above:
“…There are big moral moments in our lives, times in which we must choose between allegiance to our principles and our fear of power, between our obligations to others and our desire for material comfort. In those moments, we should struggle to make sure we don’t sell our souls for the temporary pleasures of the world. But every day we also recognize that our souls — our sense of what it means to be human beings — are being shaped day-to-day by the same systems of power and privilege.

Let me be clear one more time: My pitch today is not just that all this matters for the sake of justice, but that it also matters for more selfish reasons. In this system, we lose when we allow systems of empire and capital to shape our souls, day after day in ways sometimes to subtle to see. We lose no matter how many toys we accumulate….”

@nota

much obliged for that piece….muchos gracias.

Khawaja Asif once said:

“We respect the army as much as they respect the constitution”.

That was well said and spot on, but what do we need to say about politicians, who don’t respect the public mandate?

“We respect you as much as you respect the public mandate!”

Where is Kh. Asif nowadays and what are his view points on the current situation? I haven’t seen him as vocal as he used to be, and he is not participating much in debates either. Does anyone know?

I haven’t seen jiyalas on Pkpolitics for a while. Where are they?
Are PML-N supporters also having a break?

Or is it calmness before the storm?…..a storm the public is unaware of.

@Shirkuh

Kh Asif was in Saudia for Ummrah. Infact due to some of his (and Ishaq dar) careless statements, PMLN leadership asked them to limit their public appearances for some time and hence they went out for some break.

Recently, when in an event of Pakistani community in Jeddah, some media persons tried to talk to Kh Asif, he refused straightaway to utter a single word.

He is back to Sialkot now and had a meeting in his area regarding local issues.

Sab ko is hi tyme pe “Umrah” “Begum” “Bachey” yaad arahey hain bhai…..

Kia baat hai.

Costliest Vote in History!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/urdu/miscellaneous/story/2008/07/080720_baat_baat.shtml

Shirkuh on July 20th, 2008 12:21 pm

Well said!

The inventor of 29-judge formula is busy in transferring of his assets abroad & has never denied it but went on self-exile.

Would like to suggest a poll on pkpolitics:

Liberal use of slogans such as ShaheedoN Ki Party, Khoon Ki Qurbani and Bibi Ki Shahadat positively affects the core constituencies of PPP.

- Agree
- Disagree
- No effect

This should clear out or reinforce the displeasure of many commentators on this forum.

@GM

Thanks for your clarification.

” Infact due to some of his (and Ishaq dar) careless statements, PMLN leadership asked them to limit their public appearances for some time and hence they went out for some break.”

If the statements were given in good faith, then I understand why they have been sent in ”exile”, but if they are sent in ”exile”, because they and the rest of PML-N couldn’t stand the heat (not the summer heat, but the ”heat” from the media), and if the statements have been uttered according to a plan. I fear the last option i.e. they have acted according to a plan, because of NS’ negative role in the disintegration of The Long March. Because of this act of betrayal the lawyers have lost the momentum and the GHQ and PZP have found some breathing space. Sorry to say, but I blame both AA and NS for this betrayal. The damage may be irreparable….God forbid.

Please don’t get offended. This is not a personal attack on you or anybody else, but a genuine fear (IMO), which I hope is unjustified.

@shrikuh

i agree with that perspective. and for pakistan’s sake i hope we are both wrong…atleast about AA. and the death of the lawyers movement.

@ Shirkuh

I think u can still utter a ‘Bongi’ even though that all might be in good faith.

a bongi..eh…GM is definitely from lahore

@GM

It’s a human characteristic to fail. I don’t expect anyone to be perfect, but we all know that being a leader/politician also means a BIG responsibility, because the actions doesn’t effect the politicians themselves alone, but the whole country – especially the poor Pakistanis.

Maybe I am wrong, but it seems like that you are close to some PML-N leaders. Will it be possible for you to shed some light on the reasons behind PML-N/NS moves?

- Why did he favor disintegration of The Long March?
- Why did PML-N vote in favor of increasing the no. of supreme court judges to 29?
- Why is PML-N not making bold statements on the judiciary issue? Where is the vocal support?
- Why is PML-N not making anti-GHQ statements any longer?

Is it because they have achieved their goal(s) i.e. Punjab supremacy?

I am sure I am not the only one who is confused by PML-N moves. Personally I was excited by the ”new” PML-N, but right now Í am utterly confused and disappointed……….I don’t see a future - let alone a BRIGHT future - for my beloved Pakistan.