Pakistan fighter jets have undertaken flights in the air space of Muzafarabad and its adjoining areas, sources said. It may be mentioned here that earlier Pakistan’s fighter planes had also flown over Islamabad, Rawalpindi and Lahore.
Meanwhile, high alert has been declared at all the air ports across the country.Pakistan Air Force sources have termed these flights as per normal routine and that the planes are safeguarding the country’s air space.
Yeh let them come. We are waiting to roast them. Pak fauj thuje salam!
Let’s hope they don’t accidently drop bombs. If they absolutely need to ‘accidently’ drop bombs, the first one should be on Shoaib Akhtar’s house (i think he lives in ISL/Pindi). I have a list:
1)Shoaib Akhtar
2)Zardari House
3)Zia-ul-Haq’s grave
4)Mushe’s newly built house
we need to get rid of Zardari Baboo and his band of thieves now if we are to survive as a nation.
” Dont wish for a war but when there is a war(imposed on you) is waged , stead fast and remember Allah excessively. Definitely you will overcome if you are believers” :
Al-Quran
Islamabad hospitals are on red alert as well. Feels like there was a huge possiblity of war on Monday, since the PAF started patroling + Lahore airport and others were on red alert + hospitals on Red alert + the flights were cancelled for a while as well. PAF’s interview shows that some thing is going to happen soon…BUT MOLIN’S SUDDEN ARRIVAL IN ISLAMABAD cooled it down.
PAF’s reps interview :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UL69BGBT5PM
May God bless PAKISTAN and people of Pakistan. (aameen).
@ we_are_nuts , i think you forgot about SALMAN TASEER.
India FM: We will act on Mumbai if Pakistan won’t.
——–
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081222/ap_on_re_as/as_india_shooting
———-
Pakistan Cricket and Pakistani Players should boycot all tournaments and leagues of India until Indian Players play Pakistan Cricket Leagues.
@ ghayoor
please do not quote the Quran without reference. and i dont think that it says “dont wish for a war” anywhere in the Quran. mind giving the chapter and verse number?
I think India is not in a position to attack Pakistan. Just consider it as a stray dog barking. Let it bark.
I am hoping for a little dogfight. lets c how that JF 17 does in combat
Our Airforce is the best,not only we say that but others too….Long Live PAF (A Symbol of Pride for the Nation)
Every Man A Tiger
Pakistan has one of the best, most combat ready airforces in the world. They have to; their neighbour to the east is huge, and the two nations, have a long history of hostilities. For Indian war planners, the Pakistan air Force is their worst fear. Pakistani pilots are respected throughout the world, especially the Islamic world, beause they know how to fly and fight.
On one or two occasions, I had the oppertunity to talk with Pakistani instructor pilots, who had served in Iraq. These discussions, didn’t give me great cause to worry. The Russian domination of training prevented the Pakistanis from having any real influence on the Iraqi aircrew training program.
Still, there had to be a few Iraqi pilots, who had observed and listened to their mentors from France and Pakistan and the useless guidence of their inept leaders. It was those few, I was concerned about – the ones with great situational awareness and good eyesight, who had figured out how to effectively use their aircrafts and its weapons to defend their nation.”
(General Chuck Horner (retd) and Tom Clancey. General Chuck commanded the US and allied air assets during Desert shield and desert storm, and was responsible for the design and execution of one of the most devestating air campaigns in the history. He also served as Commander 9th Air Force, Commander US Central Command Air Forces, and Commander in chief, SpaceCom. Book: Every Man A Tiger).
PAF – Quality If Not Quantity
Another way in which the PAF satisfies this requirement is in the pursuit of excellence with regard to its combat echelons. Paradoxically, though, that pursuit is by its very nature an expensive procedure and there is a high wastage rate as pilots progress through the training system, with individuals being weeded out all the way along the line. The end result is felt to be well worth the expense involved, however, and personal observations have certainly convinced the author that the average PAF pilot is almost certainly possessed of superior skills when compared with, say, an average American pilot. As to those , who are rated above average, they compare favourably to the very best in a host of western air arms. Standard of accuracy appear comparable to those of the west and may surpass them, one F-6 pilot of No. 15 Squadron having recently put 20 out of 25 shells through a banner in four successive passes. The author can vouch for this having inspected the banner at Kamra and even more remarkably, the pilot responsible for this impressive shooting was a ‘first tourist’.”
(Lindsay Peacock. Journal: Air International, Vol 41. No 5)
I think its time to act wisely, we must keep up the posture but avoid war at all cost. Must hit hard on indians in Afghanistan first. Indian Air Force might hit from Tajikistan air base as well.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Farkhor_Air_Base
Better watch out on that end as well. I think our worst threat is Zardari and his incompetent team of loosers around him
Dog fight Teaser… December 13 2008
Lahore: 2x Indian Air Force Su-30 (armed) – intercepted and escorted out by 3x Pakistan Air Force F-16s and 3x F-7s
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/ca/Sukhoi3.JPG
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2006/11/11/business/11military.600.jpg
http://www.xairforces.net/images/country/pakistan/f-7pg_pakaf_01_800.jpg
Muzaffarabad: 3x Indian Air Force Mirage 2000 (armed) – intercepted and escorted out by 2x Pakistan Air Force F-16s.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/75/Dassault_Mirage_2000.jpg
http://img80.imageshack.us/img80/8442/84606pm9.jpg
just to let u know JF 17 is not in operational capability its squadron has been put togeather but its still in test bed mode, but who knows we might just try out our shiney new aircraft and get to kick some bhindi ass! LONG LIVE PAKISTAN LONG LIVE PAK AIRFORCE !! IF WE FIGHT with iman inshallah no reason why we will not see sucess! ALLAH O AKBAR let the kafar come we will buture them we will send them to hell on first avialble flight! back to BHINDIA!
Lets hope there is no fighting at all. However, in the event of an Indian incursion, Pakistan needs to take it to the Indian territory and make sure India suffers serious damage to its economy. Otherwise India will be emboldened to repeat its act again and again.
for all the humiliation that bhindis have caused us due to zardari and co. im hoping the Bhindis do attack us, so that we can settle the score with them. war is not won by arms and weapons, but with power of iman. this time round we will inshallah teach the Bhindi kuffars a lesson they will never forget. Allahu Akbar
@ghayoor
what you quoted is not an Ayah rather it is an Hadith in Bukhari.
complete one is as follows(English translation), reference is given at the end.
” Narrated Salim Abu An-Nadr: The freed slave of ‘Umar bin ‘Ubaidullah who was ‘Umar’s clerk: ‘Abdullah bin Abi Aufa wrote him (i.e. ‘Umar) a letter that contained the following:– “Once Allah’s Apostle (during a holy battle), waited till the sun had declined and then he got up among the people and said, “O people! Do not wish to face the enemy (in a battle) and ask Allah to save you (from calamities) but if you should face the enemy, then be patient and let it be known to you that Paradise is under the shades of swords.” He then said,, “O Allah! The Revealer of the (Holy) Book, the Mover of the clouds, and Defeater of Al-Ahzab (i.e. the clans of infidels), defeat them infidels and bestow victory upon us.” (Book #52, Hadith #210)”
http://www.searchtruth.com/searchHadith.php?
keyword=face+the+enemy&translator=1&search=
1&book=&start=0&records_display=10&search_word
=exact
[...] Read the story here [...]
Thank you India for threatening to attack because it reminds our Pak Army their true job otherwise they have nothing to do but to think topple Civil govts, usurping all key civilian top positions, occupying all expensive plot, and look down on the common people of pakistan thinking “these bloody civilians are capable of doing nothing”.
This is a good step by PAF to give a signal to India. I think now India will easily calm down soon. I hope May Allah give our political leaders enough courage to present their case strongly in front of World.
May Allah Bless Pakistan
Long Live PAkistan
@traffic: “war is not won by arms and weapons, but with power of iman.”
Exactly! Just as arguments are not won by brains or logic, but with sheer power of imbecilic idiocy and monumental self-delusion!
BTW, Aren’t you going to follow the orders of your one-eyed HOMO “ameer-ul-momineen” and wear a Jihadi-Jacket to the Eastern Front? Or is being a Drawingroom-Jihadi is the extent of your imaan? lecturing the rest of us on the “fawaa’id-e jihad”??
Maybe they’ll make a VHS tape of your “ghazva” and upload it on “black-flags-to-washington-dc.com” website.
Please! Do us all a favor! JUST DO IT!
They killed our people and we killed their people and now we shall kill and get people killed together….
You know we are the war mongers
@ControlZ: Don’t forget the BVR missile systems on the Sukhoi’s. Someone told me today that Pakistan’s aging f-16 may not have the same kind of BVR capability?
I guess there could still be dog-fighting happening if they escort bombers…
I wonder how is Pak Army gonna locate intruding indian armies when they can,t find 300 militants patroling the roads of Swat in broad day light, then pulling people out of their homes , then killing them in Chowks ……….
How are they gonna counter the indian radars when in the last five years they couldn’t locate Fazlullah’s FM radio station
@Utmankhel1
With the power of Iman
or is there some jewish conspiracy in that ……………….. just a fu….g radio FM radio station ……………………
@Utmankhel1
Credit for above goes to Traffic
Allahu Akbar … Mard-e-mujahi jag zara waqt-e-shahadat hay aaya…
Noor Jahan nahin tu Shahida Mini hee sahi
when will the day come when we will be able to avenge the losses we suffered from the hands of this Army’s sponsored Talibans ? ? ? ? ? ?
Dont worry guyz PAKISTAN AIRFORE is out there to take care of any MAD DOGS.
PAF we are proud of you.
@Traffic: “for all the humiliation that bhindis have caused us due to zardari and co…”
I don’t think Zardari deserves the credit. You’re doing a splendid job of humiliating yourself!
… I’m just saying… now don’t start hatin on me!
BTW, your remaining “mujahid” is singing like a little b!tch that he is now that he’s in custody. I guess it is not just anonymous forums where you “mujahids” beat your chests a lot.
You can talk like canaries when in enemy custody too!
Subhanallah. I wonder how his “Ghazva tape” is going to look like. They probably shelved “that” particular project? eh?
what? did I hurt your feelings again?
@pejamistri
“You know we are the war mongers”
The dog belongs to the master! We cannot absolve the masters here. These guys are mere foot soldiers and they were specifically created for this purpose. I pray that their masters burn in hell. I think the ’strategic depth’ is going to end up being the middle of river indus and if not Shuja Pasha, then his son would be there….
justic4all I did not know Pakistan Airforce is after mad dogs now a days ? ? ? ? hmm so thats why they were flying LOW on the streets of islamabad and lahore today ………….. mad dogs ………..
Hell which world are you living ……. keeping in view their past records and their present occupations …… what are you expecting from them …………. its not invading parliament ….. its defending against an equally armed or more armed army …………… they are not used to these things ………….
If the army and the taliban are going to fight against india together, WHAT THE FUCK ARE THESE FAGGOTS FIGHTING FOR RIGHT NOW? Why the frikking drama for the last 2 years???
Let’s pray this time india brings enough trucks to carry this whole lot of 1 million …………… last time they did not have enough space for the whole of them so they just took away 90,000 of them ……………….. and india will have cater for them this time as we are not gonna send any politician to negotiate their release …………
@Uthmankhel1: I think you’re a hindu agent! Don’t you know that Pakistani Army is in guiness book of world record in the category of “deevar phalaangnaa” ???
Why must you dhoti wearing bhindians take that ‘ezaaz’ away from us? What have we done to you? Did we “stoled” your mujj?
oh yes and when their masters are in indian trucks we will gift india with these talibans as Bonus …….. a new year gift …………….
Anybody know what the hell is PML (N)’s strategy here?
One day Nawaz bhai says ‘we must eliminate terrorism from it’s roots’. I thought the statement was from Mushe but i was amazed to see it was Nawaz Bhai. Next, he goes on a self destructing interview where he not only trashes Pakistan but explicitly implicates her in the Bombay attacks. For Pete’s sake man, you were PM of this country twice! Didn’t you see who Barack Obama first sent to India/Pakistan after winning the eletion (before Kerry)? John Sydney McCain; to show that his message is as good as mine! Learn something from the Americans!!!!
It seems like Nawaz jee really took John McCain’s message to heart. He has been singing the blues since Johnie left. What the hell did he say to him?
I am not in favor of incarcirating anymore leaders after Benazir’s death, but Nawaz Bhai, what the f**k?
Ghost of Tk ……… i want them to improve their record in guness book ………………. last time they were 90,000 in indian trucks …….. this time one milion ………… you short sighted people …………can’t see the bigh prize ……………..
hmmmm ……….. whats the gunisse record for mass surrender of an army in largest numbers in history …………. ? ? ? ?
@Utmankhel1
Uhmm. Why don’t you do something constructive? Go clean your neighbors house and make sure her/his driveway is all spanking clean (i am assuming it’s not clean because if you are in Pakistan, it’s not).
My neighborhood is clean because i live amongst humans. Benzir said in DC one time that “i want to go back and clean the filth from my cities in Pakistan and i am not talking about people but actual garbage and trash….”. I wish she could have done a twofer!
Would that they could take only few hundreds of the officers (in fact they (bhindians) already have so much population. Remember in 1971 India was going to charge only 200 of Pakistan army officers with war crimes however the “politician” brought them back…
BTW apart from the World War II were most of PoW numbers were exaggerated , the highest number of the PoW in a modern war who surrendered in front of the enemy is 90,368 , this record is held by our proud forces , they have all the intentions to improve this record…
Thanks for the info ……………. a much needed one ………… proud nations should not forget their previous standings.
@UtmanKhel
If you are Pakistani you will never talk like this. No matter what is reputation for our army or any other institute. I can bet if you are doing some job your institute will also have some good and bad people, but it does not mean that we will talk like this that our whole army will go to India on Indian trucks. In other sense you are trying to say that Pakistan will be captured by India if there will be no army and no one to fight. Very well done. I dont blame on u that u are indian or watsoever but i want to tell you this will never happen. We are a confident and proud nation of 160 million people and we will never allow indians to invade in our motherland. We have traitors like you but we will sort them out inshAllah.
May Allah Bless Pakistan
Long Live PAkistan
Long Live Pakistanis
Utmankhel1
Can you solve a mathematic question for me.
For 90,000 soldiers to surrender, they required to kill 3 million peoples and to rape fourty thousand woman. How many killing an rapes will take place before one million soldier will surrende.
Indian Media(HT-TV): “India has requested Pentagon for cluster bombs and full inteligence sharing including the space.Pentagon is processing this request.”
10 times …….. roughly ………… i dont think its strict mathematics though………… still …. i think the population of nwfp is about the same , u are right it has started ……… and its getting momentum ………………….
No Pakistani will allow to kill any innocent in NWFP. Dont talk like this. Its very different situation than 1971. In 1971 there was no media, no communication with east pakistan and many more things are different. Now situation is much different and nothing will happened. And people who want to create hatred between Pakistanis will never be sucessful.
Must watch this…..PAF fighters rock in air
Pakistan Air Force Pilots of 1965 War –
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PFHlzP69n9c
@ admin
please please post this video on your site
msg to india>>>back off
I wish PAF fighter plans and Army helicopters stop attacking their own tribal areas people and Pakistan Army should goto Eastern border immediately.
Admin,
we need to block comments with vulgar language. Thx.
Utmankhel1
You got it exactly right i.e., it means whole population of a province. Sounds scary but probably not a big deal for these ALLAH KAY SHER.
theres your reality from the perspectives of a western/british reporter verfying the authenticity of the ”defeat of indian airforce” now I dont smell no indians for a change lol
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PFHlzP69n9c
This air force and coward army will not be able to save pakistan.We have an army which cannot even take care of Swat,how in the world it can fight India.It is preposterous to even think of a meaningful or significant battle.We have to live with this snake/army.
funny side of the bush & shoe story..
http://www.bbc.co.uk/urdu/regional/story/2008/12/081223_shoe_export_ra.shtml
@justice
ok if this army cant save then who will save? Will u fight if war broke up or u will just talk against own people only?? By the way i dont understand the link between the post and most of the comments. This post is about PAF fllights and definately they were related to indian threats but i dont know some of the people has some sickness they always bring debate of fight in tribal areas or swat. And some only start criticizing Pak Army, i think we should critcize but upto some extent, useless criticism doesnt make any sense but raise questions on ur credibility.
Utmankhel1, good posts.
When taliban join hands again with their army buddies on the eastern border, it will be perfect time to kick both out of pakhtunkhwa. I bet we can get more aid directly from NATO by giving them targeting information on ISI/Taliban terrorist camps. Kill two birds with one stone.
Pakistan ka khusi ambassador to America kahan hai? Raw and Mossad ka agent issi din key leay tau washington bhaija gaya tha. Lanut hai mardood ki shakal per. kul bhi haqqani khusi tha aaj bhi haqqani khusi hai.
Purpose of Mullen’s visit? Well, according to General (R) Aslam Baig, it is: “If India attacks, grin and bear it.”
earthzerathz Says:
Pakistan Cricket and Pakistani Players should boycot all tournaments and leagues of India until Indian Players play Pakistan Cricket Leagues.
When the terrorists were killing people in Mumbai and Indians were blaming Pakistan and asking their government to attack Pakistan, the Sialkot Stallions were ready to go and play cricket in Mumbai. Pakis will go even today to play cricket in India only if India allows them to come and play. What else can be accepted from a nation who lacks self-esteem and honour.
Allah bless Pakistan. Insh’Allah it will be fine.
May Allah guide all the Pakistan haters to the right path or at least persih them, aameen.
To all Pakistan bashers in this forum, you dreams will not come true ever. Go and find some other country for your malicious agendas (i.e. Communism, Atheism or whatever).
Pakistani Military will give the Indians a resounding thrashing..despite the quantitative and qualitative odds heavily stacked against them.
Just make them see the commercial advantage of winning this war and trampling the Indian territory under the feet; establishing DHAs at Delhi, Amritsar, Chandigadh, Haryana and Patiala.
Just promise our valiant jawans susbtantial bit of real estate and they are ready to add another glorious chapter to an already ilutsrious history of muslim warfare.
Pakistani forces-both military and civil ones-have shed more Pakistani blood, caused greater damage to the country and scarred our beautiful land with bigger monstrosities than India ever has!
The kind of operation carried out at Balochistan is too harrowing and grizzly, in its details, to be described in words.
The operation at Swat is an unmitigated disaster. Our Army has been utterly helpless, clueless and spineless thus far; in combating an umbrella of rag tag and bob tail militant outfits. What makes you people think that PA would be able to give a fight to the Indian military?
War is a serious, grave and bloody business. Its an affair to be contested by dutiful,fiercely patriotic, apolitical,thoroughly professional and fully devoted military organisations. Its not the forte of uniformed, puffed out, vain and money minded property dealers.
Pakistan Military, Pakistan Airforce or latest army technology, or even atomic bomb cannot save our NATION, unless their is a will to save Pakistan.
We must remove traitor PPP from the government as soon as possible.
Zardari and co are totally incompetent, not sincere at all to do something good for Pakistan.
If zardari says, we will not use Atomic Bomb first, than who will use atomic Bomb first?????????????/
God save Pakistan
” they were related to indian threats but i dont know some of the people has some sickness they always bring debate of fight in tribal areas or swat ”
Patriotic,
you definitely are senseless if you are reading news, it does not hurt you when the sick taliban + army are slaughtering people in Swat, and peshawar now ?
Why, do you think the blood across attock is cheap ? ? ? ? don’t you consider them humans ? ? ?
do you know anybody from swat, just ask him, the militants are picking people from their homes in front of army ……… to throw them beheaded after a few days …………….. are you sick ? ? ?
Fazlullah’s FM radio station has been spreading the hate (and fear now) for the last five years till this very hour, but this army can’t block it, forget about locating fazlullah through the radio station. are you sick ? ? ?
If we raelly want to do tit for tat lets do progress like india did in the last decade, lets increase the standard of our education like india did, lets make our juditial system like india did.
Its time for us to compete with the enemy on thses fronts rather to live in a folls paradise.
sorry for the wrong spelling mistakes
@ peja mantree jee
what would you know about iman? aap jaein apni pooja paat karain, aur thora sa gao-moot piyain, damagh tar-o-taza ho jaega. aur thora aur mood acha karna ho to aik theory paida karain damagh main ke army aapki Sindhi maon behnoon ka baladkar karnay ki tayyari kar rahi hai. rastay main ZAB aur BB ki dargah ka bhi baladkar karti jayegi. wow this must give an orgasm to a self-pitying loser like you. just imagine it. lol you are such a low-life worm.
@ mantree jee
oh and dont stop there. theres gotta be a hero for you in the story against the evil army and establishment bent on destroying Sindh Mata and the Bhuttos. and that knight in shining armour is Atal Sindhi Zardari. will he be able to overcome the forces of evil and save Mata Sindh from Nuclear destruction? only if he gets ashirbaad from the Bhutto “panjatan paak”, ZAB, BB and her two brothers, fifth being Atal Sindhi Zardari. there you go, that should keep you busy for a few days, now get busy with jacking off on that and spare us your wild fantasies.
@Trafic
lolzzz.. nice one
Pak Air Force inducts BVR missiles
18 Dec 2003, 1645 hrs IST, PTI
The Times of India
Pakistan Air Force has inducted H-4 Beyond Visual Range missile which could strike a target from a distance of 120 km without visually citing it, evading enemy radars.
PAF officials said the H-4 missiles which was an infra-red device and comparable to that of the AA11, AA12 and Python 4 missiles of the IAF would be fitted on to the PAF’s Mirage aircraft until the induction of new plane JF-17 Thunder, jointly developed by Pakistan and China, in 2006.
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/367308.cms
@Ghost Of TK
Don’t forget the BVR missile systems on the Sukhoi’s. Someone told me today that Pakistan’s aging f-16 may not have the same kind of BVR capability?
You are absolutely right we have to be realistic…lets hope that they have something in the bag for IAF surprise.
Here are some BVR thoughts.
Advantage SU
-Basic SU-30K vs a no BVR F-16 like PAF
-SU-30MKI ( or any SU with R77 ( AA-12 )) vs any F-16 (for BVR shootin) ( assuming the R77 ( which isnt proven in combat… ) works.
Also consider big SU has lots of gas to preposition ( assuming the SU force has S.I. ( Situational awareness ) like a good AWACs, or GCI that hasn’t been beaten down ) and it has the ability for contempt of engagement if it is on a strike mission. Hard to chase down with an F-16.
Advantage F-16
-AMRAAM F-16 vs a SU-30K ( or any SU that is R-27 ( AA-10 Alamo ) SARH capable only and no R77 (AA-12).
@Utmankhel1
Who said the blood acros Attock is useles…i did not said anything which make u to conclude this. Dont imply things which i never said. I am follower of that religion whose Caliph Omar (RAW) said that even some animal will die he will be responsible for that. So how can you say that i dont worry. I think you didnt read my previous posts where i criticize Pakistan Army several times of killing innocent people. Go and read my posts in Gen Alvi Daughter section and then imply something. I condemn killing of all innocent people whether killed by Pak Army, Taliban, RAW, Mosad, NATO or US forces. Can you condemn ???? I dont think so because you are already calling NATO in our lovely country and people like you are real Traitors who bring foriegn forces in their own homeland. One of such example is of Tipu Sultan who has same traitors like you who want to send PAkistani troops on Indain trucks to indian prison. I have sever reservations about your concepts. if you are an Indian then i dont care.
things are getting interesting. my perspective.
1: India can’t afford war against us; they know that if Pakistanis decided to fight then we are unstoppable.
2: The problem with us that we are ourselves not confident, focused and sincere. On one hand we say that we are Muslims but on other hand our faiths and actions are so weak! If this situation will remain like that, where our behavior is kind of hypocritical, then we would not only be destructed by the enemies but also by the Allah almighty!!! why not???
3: As far as past wars are concerned, no one can claim 100% win. It is true that Pakistan also lost especially in 1971 but it was more because of political weakness and also top ranks of Army. If Army/Political leadership decides to bow down then what soldiers/people can do?
4: They and others are interested in more internal divides and destructions of Pakistan. These American Generals and Politicians come to teach us that don’t cry at our attacks and be like our servants. They give statements like we are diffusing the indo/pak tension but at the same time support Indian point of view and dramas! what does it mean?
5: As far as Taliban and Co. are concerned, they sometimes are really stupid people! They think that they are always right no matter what they do! How is true that one can do all in the name of Jihad? How many of them are scholars, having real picture of Islam? what is their level of understanding of Islam? did someone ever tried to know their knowledge and understanding of Islam? Why is our government not sending the scholars there to have discussion/dialog with Talibans?
6: Fight against Taliban,is not similar to the normal war. War(Guerrilla) is their normal life and that is what they know best. They defeated the Russians and are doing same with USA and Co! how can our army win against them? and so far it is clear that Pk army is losing against them. This reality is very well known to USA and Co. and that is the reasons they want us to fight against Talibans because in this way both will be spoiled and that is one of the best ways to spoil Pakistan. I am not at all supporter of wrongdoings of Talibans but i feel we also need to be realistic and wise in this context. If Talibans are not treated in correct way then they would reach throats of everyone soon!
7: I personally have no doubt that our survival is in sincerity and faith towards Allah almighty and i see all these hardships and tests as warning to us. There is no middle way, either we are Muslims or we are not, and if we are Muslims then it demands all possible sincerity, dedication and efforts.
8: There is simply no use of being disappointed, we have to move forward and need to be brave, faithful and wise. Our opponents are just trying to defeat us psychologically and we must not be defeated at this front. Pakistan will survive as long as long Allah wills, no one can challenge His orders and wills. What we have to do is to do our best leaving the rest to Him.
my views.
and Allah knows best.
@ControlZ
You mightlike to read three comments starting here under a discussion titled ‘BVR capabilities of PAF’
@ we_are_nuts
Just curious, why was shoaib akhtar at top of your list. We have other more important personalities such Babar Awan, Farook Naek, Latif khosa, salman taseer, and rehman malik.
@zaheer
I agree with u
The war is on the diplomatic front. Singh Jee doesn’t want war.
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/No_war_PM_wants_global_pressure_on_Pak/articleshow/3880408.cms
What is Pakistan doing on the diplomatic front? Still working under the radar…
@nota & @controlZ:
That RMAF dude’s 3 part post didn’t leave me with a bubbly feeling like some are feeling on this forum, using the power of iman.
I really agree with this:
This is where learning, knowledge and science (not just technology ie; applied sciences) becomes a life n death option. Times like these I wish we had engineering and scientific research instiutions where students weren’t hobbled and paralyzed by the armed conflicts of various political parites’ student wings.
I think PAF and Pak Army special ops (if they have a special ops) should really look into destroying their fvcking AWACS on the ground before it becomes a threat.
As a lay person, I think a war would be the perfect time to inflitrate special ops troops with specific purposes of destroying that goddamned AWACS (though Israel may loan them another one) and other key assets on which the whole edifice rests.
I don’t know if anyone’s done any research into low-tech counter measures to radar … for example the effect of a flock of birds on the awacs capability.
What about a million helium/hydrogen baloons with reflective chaff attached to each one, all rising out of lahore on a day when the wind is blowing towards Amritsar etc?
can AWACS filter out low-tech flock behaviour like this?
Also, why can’t we just rig one up? I mean.. get a landbased radar system, put it on top of an old ass c-130 or a boeing commercial plane and use that as a “really high up radar” …. You’re not going to get the bells and whistles like total situational awareness and coordinate/networked tracking but at least you can look really far out …
I may sound like an uninformed ignoramus here but that’s mainly because I have no idea about the defense production capabilities of P.A.C … I keep hearing about that bloody “masshaaq” all the time and I cringe everytime I’ve heard about that glorified cessna fitted with a klashnikov…. Our national ordinance factories ought to be able to do better than rag-tag rebels who can whip this sh!t up on the fly (no pun intended).
@justice @mibrahim @Utmankhel1
Cut this shit guys, don’t chew the facts.
Beside the fact that army surrendered in 1971, the main reasons where
1. There were never been any major army share from East Pakistan.
2. Army was fighting against its own people
3. Indian navy cut down the navel route from west to East Pakistan.
4. No Air route for logistic was available.
5. Political injustice by 1971 rulers.
and many other aspects including martial previos laws
Give such situation to India, I bet 10 times bigger Indian Army will also surrender…
The fact is the Indian army played opportunists and they supported separatist movements. Thousand of Rapes rumours were part of Indian hate propaganda machine to up turn east Pakistan against west. Its not that we are clean
Now the same ground situation getting prepared for enemies of to separate Baluchistan, and people like you not helping any thing here instead of playing in the hands of same propaganda machine. Do not let this happen please.
PTV (Panch**d TV) is running a ticker that India has given Pakistan an ultimatum to hand over the suspects till 26 December 2008 otherwise India will take extreme measures to fulfil their duties, quoted by unknown American channel. This provides a perfect distraction to Zardari. These PPP Plonkers will take everyone down with them. ZA is playing a dangerous game. There is not a single news in any other channel in the world claiming, what our govt is playing around. It’s dangerous times to play with public emotions and fears. Pakistan must initiate international campaign both in Media and on diplomatic channels to put forward Pakistan’s point of view. Geo English News must be established on emergency basis with one and only task to mitigate Indian propaganda. Iran English news channel called Press TV, sky 515, then Arab English news channel at sky 514, then French English news channel France 24, Russia today, English news channel of Russia. I must emphasis it’s about time that we establish our own 24hrs Free English news Channel. It’s our first line of defence against build up pressure of international power brokers. And every effort must be made to deescalate the tension on both sides. War brings nothing but death, destruction and ignorance. It’s not wise to have war inside our borders. Afghanistan provides a better play ground to sort out Indian ambitions.
@Londonistan,
I agree with you that it is about time that we start confronting the foreign propaganda by reaching out to the world via our own media. In this age and time, media, if used properly, can be one of the most potent and effective weapons.
After the shoe-throwing incident in Iraq, the very next day, NBC host Matt Lauer was stating on the morning show that “In the Muslim world, throwing a shoe is regarded as the worst gesture of disrespect”. This (gesture) might be regarded as utter disrespect in the Iraqi culture but not all over the Muslim world but Matt simply generalized it. These types of misrepresentation regarding Islam and Pakistan are very common in the Western world where people rely on their media for information and their media does NOT do a good job in conveying the right information.
These is where we need to step in and fill the gap with fact-based information. The government needs to setup debates on foreign issues and broadcast them around the world as much as it can. I would also suggest that the government should make a policy to buy air-time on foreign channels (where it is permitted) and put forward its educated well-spoken people to convey the message. People like IK, who are not only well-spoken but also well recognized in a lot of countries should be engage to spread the message.
To those on this forum, who are bashing the Pakistan army, I would like to say that it is not fair to generalize the entire army for the action of a very few. I saw comments on how the army behaved during the war 1971 war, etc. But I did not see comments on how the army fought in the 1965 war. I saw a comment from @Peja that I am quoting below:
—
… however the “politician” brought them back…
BTW apart from the World War II were most of PoW numbers were exaggerated , the highest number of the PoW in a modern war who surrendered in front of the enemy is 90,368 , this record is held by our proud forces , they have all the intentions to improve this record…
—
It is true that the army surrendered in the 1971 war and this is not something to be proud of. But, we also need to realize that the army has a hierarchal formation and orders are issued from the top and they flow downward. Soldiers are trained to obey the orders and this is part of their day-to-day training and descipline. So, yes, they did surrender, but because the orders came from the top and it remains to be seen that if the orders to surrendar had not come, what would have happened and I would like to give the benefit of the doubt to the army that they would have carried on the fighting.
Now coming back to people like @peja, who on the one hand like to bash and make fun of the army but on the other hand like to worship and unconditionally bow to the satan, the chore-and-supreme-wh0re Zardari. People like these do not like to bring up the topic of ZAB’s role in the division of East Pakistan because he (ZAB) did not want to loose to Mujeeb. It is people like these, who will shout loud and portray that they are for the democracy but will never question the democratic attitude within their own party, nor will they ever raise any concerns/questions on why the non-elected individuals are being kept on all the key positions; becaus these shameless people do not have the courage and the balls to look at the order of their own house.
Dummy planes and missiles are hitting the houses in Waziristan and cities of western provinces while own planes are guarding eastern cities considering India to be able to fight with. The confidense to fight India is very high but the Americans are not tried to be stopped from killing innocent citizens having in mind the state of inferiority.
This comment might not be relevant to the discussion. I have uploaded the Missing Parts of KAL TAK program of 12 DEC, a discussion between Bhart Verma and Zaid Hamid here:
http://fahad-currentaffairs.blogspot.com/
ISI/Army/Taliban are one and the same. It is in the interest of pakhtuns that these 3 evil forces and murdered be defeated. Does not matter who helps us accomplish this.
Getting aid directly from NATO is million times better than waiting for table scraps from generals. Why be a slave of a slave, when we can directly talk to the master?
time will tell that this is all drama by zardari & co to divert attention from domestic issues just like now china said we were told by Pak govt not to vito any move in UN brought by India, time will tell that this is to divert tension from US drone attacks thats all
@fahadafridi
gen. ayub baloch and gen. yahya solangi agree with your new found s’anp voice.
ssssssss
@FahadAfridi
your perception seems too general, i don’t think that real situation is like that!
well, NATO can’t do any magic, they can create more chaos by intervening into affairs of Pakistan. Only Pakistanis can put their house in order. Anyway, keep your mind working!
@amir hameed. How about making peja as spokesman of Zardari Govt. He will just fit in!!
I agree with most of your other points though!
@FahadAfridi
“Why be a slave of a slave, when we can directly talk to the master?”
@ Fahad! man u r a disgrace to pakhtuns. U will always be a slave! Ur master rules you from within your shitty little mind. His name is Bacha Khan, the ugliest human being who ever walked the planet.
Supercreature,
In 1971 there were people like you who were saying its propaganda only. In 2008 you are saying its propaganda only. The problem is that in know the facts, so do you.
What do you expect from somebody who is from Swat, Waziristan, Bajaur or Mohmand who knows Army is doing everything. Army is killing people, providing them with pasaages immmediately before start of shelling and in the case of Swat meeting with Fazlullah regularly. All this info is from different sources. Will you bother to authenticate this propaganda ? ? ?
providing passages to taliban before start of any activity
Tauqeer Ahmad,
Mind your language, else you will find many who will bring down your Gods who were nothing but puppets of the British here.
al-arsalan,
Who said they were inncocents, according to media reports they belonged to Punjab and were travelling in Vehicles laden with heavy arms. What were militants from Punjab doing in Waziristan ? ? ? ? ?
@kafka8: the boi’s got a point though.
Why indeed? any good reasons? (for the sake of argument)
@Utmankhel1: what are you saying? Army is allowing taliban to leave before bombarding the civilians in the area?
What is your source? if you claim to live in the area, can you write a couple of paragraphs of what’s going on instead of writing one liners?
zaheer,
hn …….. gurella war ………. u must be joking …. try to look for some other excuse …….
@Tauqeer Akbar
who knows who that fahad is! anyhow, we should not go for the personal attacks and internal divides!
@Utmankhel1
if it is an excuse, what do you think is reality then?
by the way, media is not saying only one thing, they are claiming many things! what do you really believe and why?
Ghost Of TK,
I do not live in the area specifically but it was narrated to me by a friend who lives there. It happened in Barra, very close to Peshawar, though its happening everwhere.
But its one of those stories that i have heared. Try to hear from someone who belongs to Swat.
I wish someone would do a reportage on the FATA situation .. there is a lot of confusion about what’s happening in Swat and other areas.
One day Military is fighting the taliban, the next day they’re homosexual lovers and will fight together against the indians
WTF???
@Utmankhel1
so what your friend told, you believed as truth! by the way, let us just suppose that what your so called friend told you is so called truth then how can you say with so much confidence that it is happening every where? where are you from yourself?
can anyone tell what kind of action is being taken in Barra these days, if anything is really happening there!
so Ghost, you agree to that person even without confirmation!
zaheer,
come on, the one of Samiullah, where is the confusion ?
Wasn’t he fighting them for some time before he fell, while our army was watching, try to imagine what must have been an alternative interpretation to that.
When he was digged out from his grave and his dead body hanged in a chowk, try to imagine where our army must have been at that time
the whole body hanged there till evening and then they returned to bring the body down, now imagine again and try to find an answer as to what the army was doing that whole day ? ? ?
why not accept the reality ? ? ?
Which newspaper has a different story on this thing ? a single newspaper …………. i m not quoting cnn …..
you are pushing the people of that area to the wall.
tomorrow when a third force will offer assitance to the people of the area, what do you think will be their reponse ?
Zaheer,
you made me laugh.
Tell you what, there was once an operation in Barra, against Mangal Bagh. While the operation continued for a few days, i was searching for some good news about capture of Mangal Bagh, and what i found, you know, there was a statement from Mangal Bagh that i myself am busy in an operation in Kuram Agency against some other militant group ! ! ! ! !
Yes there were operations in Barra, and so far as i remember the Kohat tunnel was captured by some militants for some time but then was released without any casualty.
@Utmankhel1
so what do you want to prove through that Samiullah case?
I don’t think that people of area will ever go for the help of your beloved India against Pak Army!
@Utmankhel1
that whole Mangal bagh story does not prove anything except that there might have been some operations in the area or!
do you think that all Taliban are similar and bad?
zaheer,
there is a task for you. try to find someone from Swat, Mingora or Matta and ask him whats happening ? ? ? ?
or else look in newspapers of the past prvious months, you will see pics of taliban beating people in public in broad day light, and then try to understand as to how is it possible. when you reach at some conclusion then come here and guide us.
zaheer,
taliban are good when they are ruling others, they are bad when they are ruling you …………
@FahadAfridi
ISI/Army/Taliban are one and the same. It is in the interest of pakhtuns that these 3 evil forces and murdered be defeated. Does not matter who helps us accomplish this.
By the way do you know ALL TALIBAN are PAKHTUNS they are not aliens, so dont say in the interest of Pakhtuns, You should use brain and think that this whole conspiracy is evolved to make PAkhtun fight with each other. And Pakistan will never allow anyone to invade our country. I know who is giving you this line, you dont sound like a Pakistani but as a American or Indian. No Pakistani will allow any foriegn troops on their motherland no matter whatsoever is the situation.
@Utmankhel1
i am gonna stay with you as you seem to be quite informative in this regard. I don’t agree to what wrongdoing is done by the Taliban but what do you want to prove or justify? say openly!
You have still not answered my questions except twisting things here and there. be a bit open please.
@Utmankhel1
Not all Taliban have been bad and not all actions of them have been bad!
Bad is bad no matter when and where it is committed and who commits it!
@Utmankhel1
wrongdoings of the Taliban are also unacceptable like anyone else! but to tag someone totally wrong is not fair, i think.
@Utmankhel1
I think Zaheer doesnot need to go anywhere i have some of friends in Swat. So you might be right that taliban are beating and killing but u dont explain to whome they are beating and to whome they are killing. You should also explain this part. But if you dont then i will explain and you can read in Newspaper, They are killing spy’s might be Indian or American spys, they are beating or killing people as a punishment for their wrong doing. Please if you are so brave to talk then give ful description, hidding half truth make you controversial.
zaheer,
filhaal watch live with talat 23 december.
zaheer,
which microscope are u using for looking at actions of talibans that you can find goods in them. criminals of the highest level.
The trouble with Pakistani’s is that they don’t know sh!t but they like to play charades. I would say, if someone has citizen journalism of the area, then tell us what is happening.
Although I find the happenings there bizzarre. @uthmankel is right. Why is it that the taliban are able to congregate in areas where operation is happening, slaughter and behead people and the army is nowhere to be found…
?????
And as soon as india says they’ll attack, Army and Taliban are together. And some genius in ISPR announces that Taliban are “patriots” and that the differences are “minimal” ????? WTF???
Does ANY FUCKWIT DUMB FUCK in ISPR (I’m sure who you are and are probably reading this) FUCKING REALIZE HOW THIS LOOKS AS A TICKER ON CNN??
WHAT THE FUCKING FUCK IS WRONG WITH YOU FUCKING ASSHOLES???? WE SPENT BILLIONS OF DOLLARS OF OUR BLOOD ON YOU (YOU THE FUCKING ARMY) AND THIS IS WHAT WE GET ????
YOU FUCKERS! YOU BETTER FIGHT! OR WE’RE GOING TO HUNT YOU DOWN IN AMERICA AND EUROPE AND WE’LL TAKE REVENGE!
REMEMBER THIS. YOU WILL NOT BE SAFE IN YOUR ILL GOTTEN BUNGALOWS IN ARGENTINA!
PROMISE!
@utmankhel1
do differential between the “original” Talibans and “wanna be RAW and MOSSAD funded” talibans we have in Pakistan under the leadership of Baitullah Masud. The ground reality is more complex than a “Hawai fire” type statement…. “All Taliban are bad”… Anybody can come up any time.. make a small militia and brand themselves as Taliban…
my 2 cents
@GoTK
I personally think (or maybe I want to believe) that Army is not actually fighting against the original Talibans but instead are trying to decieve the Nato forces ( Hence the recent voices of ” Do More” ).
This has been reported more than once that Army has provided info about Baitullah masud more than once to Nato forces. NATO has refused to take any action against his faction which raises the question … “are they on a payroll to “foreign forces” ? … and the answer is Yes. It explains why He has survives for so long and gets so much media attention. He is one of many scapegoats for justification of drone attacks.
My house of cards about army and patriotism came crashing down after “Lal Mosque” incident. On one side I have no hope or expectation from them. But on other hand if they don’t defend the country who will….
Things are never Black and White….
Regards
patriotic pakistani
“They are killing spy’s might be Indian or American spys, they are beating or killing people as a punishment for their wrong doing”.
They are not killing american or indian spys. They are destroying schools, they are destroying institution. They are using the name of Allah and Islam for their evil and inhuman deeds, thus bringing bed name for us. BTW who the hell are they to decide whats the ‘wrong doing’is and to punish people.
When there is no law on the land then such forces emerges to implement law. If Government of Pakistan wont be able to give justice to its cheif justice then who will give justice???? So its their right to do justice by themselves.
@ ADMIN
Please make sure everyone is following the rule of discussion and anybody who is using VULGAR language should be warned…..
I suggest if anyone in any post use VULGAR language that post should be removed immediately.
We are well educated people we should talk while knowing our limits. Anyone can disagree but that does not mean that we should start using VULGAR language. This VULGARITY shows how educated and well mannered person you are.
@digitalmaster: well I wonder about that Mehsud guy too. If he is indeed in the pay of RAW, why does the army high command then says… “Mehsud and Fazlullah are patriots”
I don’t get it… some weird shit is going on over there
@GoTK
the army high command then says… “Mehsud and Fazlullah are patriots”
Can you provide citation for this ?
patriotic,
Be careful you may hurt someone. Dont justify the killings and later disgrace of somebody’s loved one’s body as punishment. They say actions speak louder than words, and though u did not accept it but indirectly you are implicating the blood of people across attock is cheap.
You are talking about the people of Swat who are the better off and better educated in the whole of that province. You can’t give the right to any fucking idiot to decide the life and death of someone’s loved one. Your state of Pakistan has no right there then, are u ready to give up ur rights ? ? ? ?
Will you allow me to behead your brother, father or son, and throw his body later, coz i dont like them ?
digital master,
71s happen when lies are told.
America has so far killed a number of high profile militants inside pakistan, that too being a western country and having comparatively less human intelligence, but tell us how many of the high profile militants have been killed by our army, despite having support of the locals, infrastructure and a comprehensive human intelligence sytem ?
a few months back Pak Army was given the exact location of Fazlullah and they did not act. They even did not deny the claim that they had intelligence of the bastard given by the provincial govt.
digital master,
if you follow my posts i am focusing on Swat which i have know are criminals but our army is still in love with them.
@digitalmaster: go to my blog, link is there. This was in all Pakistani newspapers. I’m surprised you don’t know this since you didn’t seem the clueless type at first.
When we use the term TALIBAN we think that they are group of unanimous people which is not right of course. There are many groups who are fighting for different masters.
Before the famous U-turn of musharraf there were just talibans who were supported by Pak army as well as ISI of course. When musharraf got enlightened by the direct ‘vahee’ from USA via Colin Powell, he decided to disown taliban. Here comes the twist……The army part in general and the civilian part of ISI in paticular were not ready for that. Also there were (even now) some conflicts between ISI and IB. Musharraf also tried to downsize the power of ISI and gave more power to IB. Many officers had sympathies with taliban so they encouraged the local tribal people to resist the army actions against taliban. Those people are called pakistani taliban. Another group got supported by IB and called panjabi taliban(I am not sure about this though). In the meanwhile northern alliance along with Iran and Indian support, Ihl-e-hadees with Saudi support and many more groups got influences. They get mony from their supporters and fight each other. Each group use the name of Taliban. In swat most of the talibans( so-called) have the support from India(Those who burn school etc). Pir Samiullah was from Barailvy group belongs to panjabi taliban. When some of the houses of taliban comanders (in Swat) were raided by army, they found lingeries there(imagine poor people of swat and backward taliban).
Also local people of swat discovered that many of these taliban were not even muslim.
Keeping all this in mind I think that all the world players are fighting their war here and pashtuns being used as (I don’t want to say it but this is true) condoms.
patriotic pakistani “If Government of Pakistan wont be able to give justice to its cheif justice then who will give justice????”
If judicial system is weak, than reponsiblity is to fight against gov. for supremacy of judiciary, not to kill people for one’s own interpretation of crime. Since these mullahs are not fighting for restoration of judiciary and rule of law, rather are fighting for imposition of their own crazy interpretation of riligion. Infact they are biggest distraction. Look at CJ address in Multan Bar on this web site.No one left any comments because every one is busy in commenting here to praise these mullahs.
Unfortunately we have been distracted, and issue of CJ has been burried in the name of same old fashioned ‘ISLAM KO KHATRA’kind of excuse. This same excuse for last six decades has burried number of real issues of national interest.
The entire world knows that pakistan is playing a double game by having one taliban in their pocket and occasionally fighting against others for show and tell. All at that the expense of lives of pashtuns. On both sides, taliban, FC and army, pashtuns are involved and dieing. Yet, the leaders of taliban are free to do as they please due to blessing of ISI. In Quetta, taliban commanders live and run the war freely. In sawat, we already know what is going on.
These are not secrets or mysteries. It’s not hard to realize that pashtuns are the favorite cannon fodder for punjab based army leadership. I don’t care if it’s for greed or pan-islamist wet dreams, but the end result is that our people are slaves in pakistan. For pashtuns, it is simple logic that being slaves of NATO is a better alternative as they can actually provide us money for development and confronting taliban devils. Whatever respect I had for the pakistani state was lost when it sat on the sidelines while hundreds of pashtuns were slaughtered and beheaded by their pet jihadi dogs.
If you guys love jihad so much, have your ISI fight it in lahore. Leave us alone.
And also gen ayub was a hindkowan, yahya was a farsiwan. It doesn’t matter though.
shandana@ “Also local people of swat discovered that many of these taliban were not even muslim”.
Waow
Many commentators of this forum strongly beleive them as true Islami and Jihadis.
Indians are cowards, if not they would have attacked Pakistan a month a go. Paki Generals know them very well and that is why ISI is so busy…
@FahadAfridi
The whole world knows Talibans are created and harbored by ISI. Imagin a 600,0000 strong army with Nuclear weapon and COMMANDOS could not capture 400 Talibans who are slaughtering innocent people in broad day light and burning schools with free hand.
Of course they are on ISI Payroll and of course the corrupt Paki establishment wants so…
Stupid Pathans…Relighous PIGS….
@TK
Does ANY FUCKWIT DUMB FUCK in ISPR (I’m sure who you are and are probably reading this) FUCKING REALIZE HOW THIS LOOKS AS A TICKER ON CNN??
WHAT THE FUCKING FUCK IS WRONG WITH YOU FUCKING ASSHOLES???? WE SPENT BILLIONS OF DOLLARS OF OUR BLOOD ON YOU (YOU THE FUCKING ARMY) AND THIS IS WHAT WE GET ????
YOU FUCKERS! YOU BETTER FIGHT! OR WE’RE GOING TO HUNT YOU DOWN IN AMERICA AND EUROPE AND WE’LL TAKE REVENGE!
REMEMBER THIS. YOU WILL NOT BE SAFE IN YOUR ILL GOTTEN BUNGALOWS IN ARGENTINA!
PROMISE!
Hehheheh…. I agree. Let’s form Pakistan Liberation Front (PLF) and kick these Generals in their balls. Heheh.
@ALL
I know many of you will attack me for saying this but I will say this nonetheless.
When the only patriots are Zardai along with other politcal elite, Kiyani along with Military Inc, Mad Mullah’s along with their violent reactionary forces — You have to question the rai-son detre of the existence of such state ?
I don’t really care If Pak Army gets slaughtered by Indians or Americans. They should. I am never going to help any one perpetuate this system, which is corrupt to the core. These Generals know how to save their “Chamri” but push us into inferno for their “Strategic Interests”. We are at the point of hopelessness — Thanks to all these Generals.
It happened to listen to a program presented by Mr. Sahir on FM103 on 22nd Dec after 10:00 pm where he was begging his motherland INDIA not to wage war on his workingland Pakistan because according to him Pakistanis do not want to go on war. He repeatedly mentioned that we are very good people and we should not fight at all. His program was filled with and started with an indian song ‘Salam Namastay’.
@Utmankhel1
Swat, Waziristan, Bajaur or Mohmand Army is doing operations, well said, who is the rulers now a days in pakistan? Army or PPP, ANP, JUI, MQM ?? what about Fata members, they are part of government, right? they cant even visit their areas, and hiding in Islamabad? all the areas you talked about have choosen people who are bombing on them. My point is why you can’t blame civilian dictatorship along with Army actions? why not politicians from those areas who enjoy powers right now and moan here and there few times?
I do not say army actions are right or the government’s, I merely said that, 1971’s and today has the single common point … that we made our house on fire first and allowed India to come in and do looting and use it against us as propaganda as well,
@supercreature, please don’t try act stupid or think that pakhtuns are fools. We know very well that taliban are supported by jihadi generals, both serving and retired. These generals are the ones who are butchers and need to be terminated by the world community. The politicians have no chance against the evil powers of the jihadi state.
I wait for the day when US drones cut the head of the snake in places like muridke, pindi, isloo etc. The day will come when we will be free from slavery.
@Jamshed Khan,
Who gave you figure of 400 Talibans?? Can you just give a smile on your knowledge
Supercreature,
There is a time when you are analysing the situation as to who is doing what, but then there comes a time when you have made a decision and only wait for a proper time to act.
All the drama started and we kept watching. It was far away in Waziristan and so we did not know much.Then it came close. Now its in every town/village of Pukhtunkhwa and we have had enough time to know who is doing what.
If you read my previous posts you would understand how much the people now know about this toopy drama of army/ISI. I know who is governing and how, so don’t make me repeat all what i have written already.
ISI, JI, ARMY, HAMID GUL, ZAID HAMID, QAZI, IMRAN KHAN, we know who was created when and who takes orders from where and who licks the boots where……… we hope they mend their ways and spare the common man.
Also according to your estimate whats the total number of militants in Swat and tribal areas and how many of them are foreigners ?
Was it a co incidence that on wednesday Nov 26 2008. Mumbai attack started.
Last day of work in USA before thanks giving break.
Remember ThanksGiving in USA is on last thursday of November each year.
Who was the audience of this attack, Americans at home with their families.
Now the Christmas is coming and Pakistan knows Indians have a show to perform. But this time Pak Army knows it and is on high alert and maybe Indians will smart enough Not to do a grave mistake.
@all
Hey guys!I have got a link to the MISSING PARTS OF “KALTAK” Bharat verma VS.Zaid HAmidd!
please do watch it
http://www.pakistankakhudahafiz.wordpress.com
KARACHI: State Bank of Pakistan has introduced Dukhtar-e-Mashriq Mohtarma Benazir Bhutto (Shaheed) Commemorative Coin of Rs 10 denomination on the eve of her first death anniversary.
On the reverse side: In the centre of the reverse side, the coin bears portrait of Mohtarma Benazir Bhutto (Shaheed)
We all know that Paki Army Generals are ruling Pakistan and that they have turned Pakistan into their previliged colony. One Captain raped a doctor in Baluchistan and instead of punishing that crook captain, the whole Baluchistan is burning. Mush played a double game with USA and so is the Army doing for the last 40 years.
1-MQM was created by ISI-Army to divide Sindh and eliminate JM Syed.
2- To keep away ANP from Power ISI and Army kept rigging elections for JI and PML. MMA was created by ISI and so were Talibans.
These Talibans are supported by ISI and Army and the even ANP MNAs and MPAs are slaughtered in braod day light.
Fuck this Napak Army. I hope India will punish these Basters.
Why are they burning schools….now even in peshawar…..
I pray to GOD INDIA attack Pakistan and crush this Napak Fauja….
@Jamshed Khan
Ofcourse either you are follower of ugly bacha khan or northern alliance. Even if we are with the worst of Army, but what you said is unacceptable. If living under Indian rule is so acceptable than move your a$$ out of Pakistan to India and invade Pakistan with your beloved Indian Army.
You think ANP leaders are loyal to the local people, its your illusion.
@Utmankhel1
Why dont you please include PPP, and PML in this long list of what you gave here, and put the MQM on the top of the list please.
@Jamshed Khan,
With reference to your post above, most of that made no sense. You have stated that “Taliban were created by ISI”? You may want to do some research and you will find that they were propped up by Naseerullah Babar in BB’s tenure. So your theory is completely wrong. You said that ISI have rigged elections in the past to keep ANP from coming to power; so now that ANP has been in power for over eight months, what have they been able to deliver? And by the way, this political wing of ISI was brought to life by none other than your beloved ZAB.
Finally, you are praying that India attacks and crushes Pakistan; all I can say is that if God had started accepting parayers of the likes of you, the world would have been destroyed by now. So, keep on praying and like Peja try and spread false information but most people here are not buying that crap anymore.
And BTW, guess who showed up at Bacha Khan’s funeral? It was your beloved Rajeev Gandhi which clearly showed where the ugly Bacha Khan was getting was getting all the support.
@supercreature: I would advise to exercise restraint here. For Jamshed Khan is neither Northern Alliance nor pashtun: he is either an Indian muslim or MQM.
And I believe the same would go for fahadafridi and uthmankhel1.
Infact I would like the @Admin to see if these users are one and same here.
Pakistani awam needs more freedom.
Right to carry weapons for self defence.
Pakistani are being threaned by its neighbours.
We need more social services and zero taxes from friendly countries like China, Iran and Sudan and Russian Federation.
Max duty on Indian imports.
Zero duty on petrol and gas. and electricity.
Pakistan will flourish faster than Dubai.
Pakistan needs to take advice from Iran to tackle foreign pressures.
@Jatt
Who said they are the only patriots ? Who said they are patriots at all ?
Army consists of more people than just generals !
Fine … consider the whole army and political brass corrupt.. fair enough ? what about rest of the 160 million population.
fine… half of them like you don’t care or are part of MQM or other separatist group. That still leaves 80 million who care about a separate state from INDIA ? Feel free to reduce teh number further… but u get the point.
Now as for WHY ? Because we don’t want a Gujrat ? because we want to be independent havea our own identity. In these trying times many question the Two-nation theory but I remain staunch on it and toubles/riots and discrimination in India is my proof !
Regards
@VOX,
You are right, a restraint is needed, but atleast not where we need to clear up such crazy minds who think Indian Army will crush Pakistani Army, in other words Pakistan and people of Pakistan. Such people needed a slap that can help them to come out of their dreams ….
Well than slap on
Do keep in mind though, that in today’s warfare, to win wars it is no longer man behind the sword, It is not even the man behind the gun but the gun itself. They have more and better ones.
India would be destroyed if it tries to occupy Pakistan. For then you’ll see many blessed suicide terrorists and child soldiers ready to become cannon fodder for their motherland. And they’ll be cheered on buy non other than the psuedoliberalislamist fascists. lol
But in conventional warfare not only one needs psychological superiority (which we lack or rather post Busharaf handed over in a silver platter in exchange for a butt plug) but also preparedness (which this proxy regime deliberately sabotages).
ANd btw, the only ones who really would give bharatis a psychological shudder would be none other than the warriors of FATA. They licked a 100,000 strong merc force surrounded by hostile powers.
They are the embodiment for the importance of a well armed citizenry. The only people worthy of respect in Pakistan.
One may add the usual heroes of media, judicial fraternity, Imrankhan and journalists among the.
few things.
1: Not all Taliban are similar and there are both good ones and bad ones like any other group. Not all of their stances are wrong! There are of course different types of Taliban and with possibility that some of them are external agents.
2: It is not justified to kill and punish everyone who is a Taliban! This is actually strategy of USA and Co. that they tag every opposing person as Taliban or terrorist just to justify their invasions and aggressions. They don’t want that people realise that the base of all these invasions and killings are so dubious and unjustified!
3: Media only shows one side of the picture and there is no one who could bring the real opinion of Taliban, so everything against them is justified!
4: No one really knows the identity of those people who are slaughtering people, burning schools etc! and no one really knows why so called Taliban are doing that! In fact everything is just justified by putting it on Taliban.
5: Situation in that region is very complex and no one can do magic there including Pak Army, and as long as USA and Co. are sitting there in Afghanistan then chances of peace are very little. Their track record shows that they are not interested in peace. They would keep on supporting the anti-Pakistan groups.
6: Pakistan really needs to deal with the situation wisely without taking external pressures. This is a very complicated and hidden war against us.
@zaheer
100% agree on the above post
@VOX
Your support really appreciated…
@Zaheer: We can’t blame US/NATO. Sure they’re bullies and idiotic in their illbegotten war and the chaos and destruction it has caused, but vis a vis Pakistan the biggest enemy has been Busharraf, his military apparatus and the continuation of that proxy apparatus after Feb. 18th.
And the way, they have begged, grovelled and licked boots of foreign powers for mere pittance and sold the dignity of the nation, alongside its interests, its moral stands and trampled upon the lives of its citizenry and all that in the name of Islam (their psuedofascistliberal Islam) is unfortunately cause for declaring war upon such a regime by the citizens of that state.
Sooooo….. here we are, humiliated, torn, despised, marauded and divided. the only ray of light giving hope being the resistance from FATA. The last stronghold of at least an idea of fierce independence and courage in face of unbelievable odds and isolation.
DON’T TREAD ON ME!
I pray for their guidance, wisdom.
@supercreature
Benazir Bhutto was toppled by ISI. ISI created Islami Jamahori Ittihad. And who was Naseerullah Babar, he was a fucking Paki General. These Generals will sell their mother for Dollars. Zardari and company are just puppits. The Army rules the country and fucking ISI. Remember ist not Pakistan, it s Punjabistan….
In this land of Pure, only Munafiqs are surviving. If you are a liar and corrupt and wipes Generals Ass, you are patriotic. If you tell the truth and demands justic and wants equal rights and point to WRONGS, then you are a TRAITOR.
MQM, Talibans, Jamiati Islami and JUI are all ISI payeee. Napak fauj and fricking Generals has made Pakistan a Prostitute.
Thse basters are burning Baluchistan and NWFP, for no reason. Paki Army Generals are PIGSSSSSSSSSS
Once again Zia’s children bring in the fantasy of “good” taliban and “bad” taliban. What a pathetic and sorry excuse for the crimes of ISI against humanity.
And nice diversion by trying to play with the egos of pakhtuns. It is because we have been called “warriors of islam” that we are kept away from education and made to live in poverty and jahilat by the state of pakistan so we can be be the “strategic dept” for punjab’s fight with it’s fellow hindustanis. How islam is abused in order to fool simple minded pakhtuns even today to support pakistan. And generals and their supporters have no shame at all. First let your “good” taliban rule over lahore before forcing their brutal ways on innocent pukhtuns.
zaheer,
Please go do some research and then come back and write here. Are you kidding ? Don’t you know Nek Mohammad, Baitullah Mehsud, Fazlullah, Muslim Khan ? ? ? they are known to everybody ….. still have doubts ? visit GHQ then, you may have a chance to meet them there as well.
Supercreature,
Ugly Bacha Khan may not become Ugly Najeeb ………… He has been representing the largest political party of the province and by calling him ugly u are supporting the view ……….. the blood across attock is cheap ……….. keep it up …………. in reply you well deserve a long lecture on your history of thousand years but obviously one cannot bite a d.g if bitten by one ..
VOX
Fighting is the duty of army not civilians whether from tribal areas or your punjab.
What the fu..k is the army for ? ? ? ? ?
The lives of tribals is at the same state as was in 47, whereas the majority province is undergoing continuous development. Are they your slaves ? ? ? ? ? keep them alive in stone age and call them to your fu..g wars of strategic depths when needed.
The tribals need education and development and not your sugar coated vemonous recognitions of their strong characters. Generations after generations they will be serving you ….. what do you think are you ? ? ?
Are you serious in considering Imran Khan a leader worth mentioning here ? ?
@Utmankhel1
Nek Mohammad, Baitullah Mehsud, Fazlullah, Muslim Khan all by mean are not part of Army or from Punjab. They are created by the local land they are living….
“tribals is at the same state as was in 47″ by the way its again not Army or punjab fault, they never accepted foreign influence, they were always self adminstrated? why they didnt push education there?
for sake of the people promote education, see the ground situation how un educated are the people and they are slaves of warlords and landlords of those areas you mentioned, perhaps education and health are one of the basic area of work for local goverment
@FahadAfridi:
Pakhtuns are neither simple minded and to say that just exposes your own complexes. The good Taliban and bad Taliban game was played by the military of a rogue proxy puppet regime only after they got their ass whopped by the rebels and were forced to come to the negotiating table. Every rogue regime plays this game. And as I have said before, it does not matter whether or not any faction of Taliban in FATA is getting help from other elements. Will Pakistan refuse a mervaka if India attacks tomorrow?
And don’t forget, every country has its core interest for its own survival and sustainability, Pakistan has a much much benign record vis a vis its neighbors as far as interference and antagonism goes, do not forget that.
Strategic depth, need not be such a chimera as much as “Akhund Bharat” or “Greater Khorasan” might be. For both are based on faux irredentist nationalism and are much more exploitative of people than a strategic doctrine that recognizes known threats and danger of being sandwiched between two hostile interfering neighbours. Pakistan and Afghanistan share a common destiny after all.
People of Pakistan including pakhtuns are deeply religious…a reality deeply lost on the pseudoliberal fascist elite of the country.
The problem in FATA has never been due to poverty or illitracy, for those may result in certain social vices as intolerance, close mindedness, xenophobia or mysogyny in varying degrees (and these can be found all over Pakisan, south asia, 3rd world, the World) but it is not and never has been the cause of what’s happening right now in FATA.
The founder of Pakistan made a treaty with the citizens of FATA, and they trusted him and he kept his word. For over 60 years FATA had never been a problem for Pakistan, neither is it now. For the true problem lies in Islamabad.
And don’t worry about the Taliban ruling over Lahore, they already are in control of over 70% Afghanistan. This after trillions of dollars pumped into that nation, along with the best conniving minds and military at work. The population is receptive to them.
If and when they step out of FATA, much like the Iranian revolution, the populace of this country may be receptive to them. For sovereignty and of a state is more important to the citizenry than most things.
My hope is that before that happens, the few enlightened heroes Pakistan does have foremost of whom is Imran Khan, can harness the energy, so that instead of a medeival village mindset, we have a republic, as envisioned by the founder of this nation.
@Uthmankhel:
They are not my slaves. I am one of them.
And to educate you a little bit, a well armed militia among the citizenry is not so that may fight foreign armies, though it may come tot hat, but to keep a check on the domestic government so that if it becomes tyrannical, one may use one’s god given right to defend oneself.
This clearly is the situation in Pakistan, where a military apparatus has been revamped by a coward dictator and has left in its wake a conglomerate of the most stupid, incompetent, cowardly bootlickers, that they’ll outdo any malodorous funk from the most rancid banana pancakes.
So, clearly, Taliban are the good guys here. If they do stupid stuff like blow up school girls like the fazlullah action did in Swat or an all out blasting rockferry amid the general populace, they’ll lose the support. Hence my saying, they need to wise up.
Now regarding FATA condition. refer to mypost above. Yeah it’ll be nice to open up the system a little bit, and do some developmental work there But that’s not why we have the present predicament in FATA. Neither is it lack o education.
Disenchanment against federal spending has never been the cause of resentment in FATA tot he extent it has been in say Balochistan or other full federating units.
And I can include other areas of the Punjab in that general discontent as well. That has naught to do with this situation. The pakhtuns in Pakistan have fared much better than any other place. For me Pakistanis my country, my mother country. And I love it, the idea of it, the ideas it embodies, its flag and its historicity. All of FATA is unanimous in this. Lucky for Pakistan, for so far, the people of FATA still view Pakistan as their motherland hijacked by and put in jeopardy by domestic hægtesse and their masters, and a dream still worth fighting for rather than declare rightful secession.
@Admin:
Could you kindly check/trace Uthmankhel/FahadAfridi and Jamshed Khan’s IP and see what you find?
F-16s can carry AMRAAMs which are already BVR capable. Also PAF has inducted 8 JF-17s and they are in service, and i also heard that PAF has procured 4 J-10b’s of 36 ordered from china last month and will get the rest in coming months. The J-10b is an impressive aircraft, its not 5th gen completely but has many features of the 5th gen aircraft. Its got AESA radar, thrust vectoring control (PAF first hover-capable fighter) and supports both chinese and western armaments
Now these Army thugs are killing their own people in the name of terrorism simply to earn a few dollars. Some shameless politicians with the backing of some shameless people even support them. Who can be a bigger terrorist than those who support killing of innocent men, women and children?
If people do not rise against such tortures, GOD will definitely whip the entire country as HE whipped Saddam Hussain at the hand of his own friends and supporters, as HE dismantled USSR without a bullet being fired on that country, as HE whipped the entire family of Bhutto, Mujibur Rehman and Indira Ghandhi at the hand of their own people, as HE whipped the Shah of Iran, and since 1975 is whipping Lebanon for being a brothel of the Arab Sheikhs.
It will definitely be a matter of disgrace for the entire nation, if that whipping of Pakistan comes through the hand of India.
The “good” taliban lie is not only the policy of one dictator, not only the policy of the state, but ingrained in the brainwashed people, especially in the Punjab power centers as can be seen by many posters here. That is the source of this mental illness that has made the taliban murderers as heroes for army generals and mullah populace and allowed the wholesale slaughter of pukhtuns by ISI’s jihadi dogs. Even now mentally unstable pakistanis are not ready to let go of their love for taliban because to them pukhtun lives are cheap.
And VOX, don’t talk to me about faux irredentist nationalism, as pakistan was built on very similar but flawed principal and instead of ethnicity used religion. This nazaria-e-pakistan failed in 71, but ISI blackmail of pukhtuns by using Islamic jihadi slogans continues to this day.
So let me spell it out to you, pakthtuns no longer want to be involved in the conflicts of the indic people. You want your jihad in kashmir and against india, then raise your own punjabi taliban instead of using pukhtuns as cannon fodder.
Our history and destiny lies in khyber, kandahar and kabul, not in karachi, lahore or new delhi. Islam can no longer be used to enslave other people.
Ghost of TK,
Here is a Kamila Hayat, speaking of the same things about Swat and the military’s role as i said earlier.
http://thenews.com.pk/daily_detail.asp?id=153698
@fahadarfraidi
your destiny lies in kandahar and India, not where else … dont disguise please
To all who are in love with ANP, please beaware that ANP government is fully supporting all the Army operations and they clearly and openly says that the operations Army is carrying is against terrorist ….
@Utmankhel1
Kamila Hayat reminds me Pervaiz hoobhoy ..
@FahadAfridi
How can taliban have 70+ % control over Afganistan even in presence of nato and northern alliance, Israel n India against them? do u think without local people at their side? or you think taleban are couple of thousand people?
@fahadafridi
“Once again Zia’s children bring in the fantasy of “good” taliban and “bad” taliban. What a pathetic and sorry excuse for the crimes of ISI against humanity.”
This language is abusive and insulting! There are good and bad people among every nation and group of people including Taliban. Taliban are also human beings with full chance of committing mistakes! I never support their wrongdoings. Who has committed more crimes against the humanity? USA has out numbered anyone else in this regard or! Let me assure you that i never support wrongdoings of ISI or Taliban but i also don’t support any unjustified suppression of them.
“And nice diversion by trying to play with the egos of pakhtuns. It is because we have been called “warriors of islam” that we are kept away from education and made to live in poverty and jahilat by the state of pakistan so we can be be the “strategic dept” for punjab’s fight with it’s fellow hindustanis.”
I am not sure if you really are a Pakhtun or even if you really are pakhtun then who you ideals are. I have noticed from your comments that you take more side of USA and Co. than Pakistan or Pakhtuns. Anyhow, pakhtuns fought because of their own faith and honor; they love Islam, their honor and Pakistan and that is the reason they fought and not for punjabis! As far as injustice is concerned, i don’t think punjabis has been spared of it in Pakistan, it effected everyone. It has been mainly because of the situation, location, history and culture that pakhtuns had to face more wars fights etc. I don’t make distinctions, we are all Muslims, human beings and Pakistanis. Don’t forget that Punjabis were more oriented towards education even before partition of two countries so that difference is old one but know pakhtun brothers are doing good in education too! Don’t forget that in wars people from all provinces enthusiastically participated!
“How islam is abused in order to fool simple minded pakhtuns even today to support pakistan. And generals and their supporters have no shame at all. First let your “good” taliban rule over lahore before forcing their brutal ways on innocent pukhtuns.”
Islam has been misused overall and not in any special case. Pakhtuns are themselves proud Muslims and Pakistanis! they know their priorities. Everyone living in Pakistan is equal citizen of it and Taliban too so if they opt for the political participation they have full right for that.
After mumbai drama, what our baboo brigade said on it. She was in India and speaking what the india want to listen BUT a voice from India is totally different on mumbai drama. - Antulay is asking to probe inquiry on this incident.
These baboooosss of Pakistan are doing a “Great” job for country. I admire from her and entire babooo class of country.
Looks like they were flying right over Kharian Cantt. before anyone could scramble jets etc.
SUkhoi’s have un-matched capabilities and unfortunately our pseudo-Islamist-wannabe-armchair-jihadi’s won’t be able to send the “blessed” suicide bombers to attack these sukhois. As if they have the wherewithal to order these pahstun around for their Islamo-Fantasies.
This is why state is the best instrument for application of lethal force in defense of a nation. But don’t tell this to supporters of RAW inflamed hemorrhoids called the Pakistani Taliban, who are still busy jacking off to Jihad-e-Afghanistan.
And I can’t stop laughing at psuedo arm-chair jihadi’s who on the one hand would gleefully send Pakhtun boys to counterproductive (not to mention UN-Islamic) self-detonation, while on the other hand have NO INTENTION whatsoever of shedding a drop of their OWN blood in this “blessed jihad” of theirs. They are just as hypocritical as the Musharrafite Jurnails who send the 6000/month jawans to die for their billion dollar bungalows in the palatial complex also known as the GHQ.
Well I guess it is more important to play dodgeball with one’s US Marine friends in balmy USA, than to be consistent and put one’s money (or life) where one’s mouth is…
ALLAH pak hum sub ko kaeeem rakhay ameen
i always said sir imran khan is the new n last man for our pakistan so plz just do blind trust on him liku all do when he bulit his hospital so plzzzz thnx allah hafiz
Leave your response!
You must be logged in to post a comment.
Recent Comments
Discuss Topics
Blog Comments
Where are the other comments on this site? Zapped them, did you? Because Jews were mentioned? Just l. […]
Imran Khan Zindabad. Imran ke khilaf bakwas band kro.. zardari ke chamcho!!!
@ataraxis6, I will add MP4 download option on main site by coming weekend. @MARINAKHAN, The login bu. […]
Hello, i was wondering if it will work on my HTC HD2. Thanks
If for some reason, you are not able to fix the issue, you can at least provide a link to download m. […]
Search