What concerns me is the security of IK and other sincere/honest/capable politicians like f. ex. Saad Rafique, Javed Hashmio etc.
When the Trojan Horses gets the nod from their foreign masters they will not be reluctant to eliminate IK. I’m afraid he will only be allowed to be a part of the political “game” as long as he doesn’t have a significant number of seats in the parliament. The day the Yankees consider him as a threat they will not hesitate to assassinate him just as they have done with numerous other non-cooperative leaders like ZAB (indirectly by Zia d0g), BB (by Moshe d0g and maybe AZ) etc. or maybe something like the overthrowing of a truly democratically elected government could happen like in Iran in 1953, where a democratic government led by Mohammad Mossadegh was overthrown by CIA.
My appeal to all Pakistan loving people is that they should ensure that no sincere/honest politician gets hurt regardless of their political affiliation. It is perfectly all right to have a different political view, but it is NOT acceptable that anyone collaborates with foreign powers (enemies of Pakistan).
You are the “Leader” IK i specially like quotations and facts u quote from history to prove ur points which shows ur knowledge and interest to solve problems, you r not a “jahil” like other Politicians.
Any body can tell that u wanna be a true”Leader”,u r not after “kursi” like nawaz,Mr.10%,fazlu,altaf,asfandyar and BB so called “shaheed” who know nothing about politics,who even dream about “kursi”.
We know u ve pain for this nation,IK may Allah(swt)protect u.Prayers of millions of muslims are with u.God bless u.
Excellent program! Somehow this seems to be the most informative show on Aaj’s line-up …
I wish Nadim Malik had put Imran Khan on the spot when he was going on about the “destruction of institutions” and asked why exactly there is no internal democracy in the PTI itself?
Other than that, Imran Khan raised good points. I wish he would really organize his party on democratic lines and not become a clone of every other party in Pakistan organization wise.
That and he should cut down on the right-leaning-tilt …. At times he sounds like Qazi Imran Khan when he starts chanting “Pakistan = Islam kay naam par” … Oy Vey!
I am 100% agree with Imran Khan. If not all majority of the elected politicians are not playing positive role in the present democrative system of Pakistan.
People of Pakistan need revolutionary change and that is only possible if the voters of Pakistan elect new leadership from the class like Imran Khan.
Thousands of political minded people living abroad can come back and run for election who are highly educated, hardworking, intelligent, cincere and devoted but who is going to vote them … for the change.
Pakistan as a nation lost many talented individuals in last 30 years, who left the motherland in extreme pressure due to political victimisations, dictatorships, religious and secterian problems converted this region a battle ground and a experimental lab for long period of time.
I was a strong supporter of PPP but after assasination of Mohtarma Benazir Bhutto Sahiba, poor performance of the new leadership take over PPP change my view point to support them when they are not following the Benazir Bhutto Sahiba’s last will and political advices.
I am really shifting from PPP to PTI because of Imran Khan’s political direction
he is carrying from last few years constantly to provide strong new leadership to Pakistan.
We need Imran Khan as a Prime Minister. But the important thing is… can he stay on his words, or he will also change like other politicians,if he got power.
Shaukat Khanum Trust is working as an organisation & I hope his efforts do bear fruit in politics too by making PTI a successful political organisation of same kinna as Shaukat Khanum Trust. God bless you for your fearless sincerety & honesty.
“We need Imran Khan as a Prime Minister. But the important thing is… can he stay on his words, or he will also change like other politicians,if he got power.”
Check and balance….Let everyone work according to the limits given in the law of the land. Imran Khan should NOT be an exemption. If anything like that happens then the whole idea about PTI i.e. insaaf will b lost. It is my conviction that it will not happen, inshallah.
Btw: This land was created in the name of Islam and for Muslims, and we should stick to this cause. To make it clear; I am not advocating a theocratic state, God forbid. The Mullahs of today can make it eve worse.
what IK always stress upon is that there should be an independent and strong judcial system which can check the performance of the government from top to bottom and which can keep a check on all the institutions.when ur judges will be independent then
1) no 1 will dare to become Mr 10%.
2) no 1 will sign NRO.
3) no 1 will dare to impose marshal law.
4) there will be law and order in the country.
5) investors will invest in ur country.
6) overseas pakis will keep their money in pakistani banks.
7) rich and poor will enjoy equal freedom and rights.
8)institutions like police will not dare to take bribe.
9) no 1 will dare to hide his assets and save the tax.
Nations stand on justice and where there is no justice there is law of the jungle.
In the west politicians and other heads of institutions doesn t came from heaven,its their system which don t allow them to misuse their power.they know they are answerable to the court.
In Pakistan we need to get rid of this system where might is right.
I strongly feel that now two politicians should be given chance…. Imran Khan and Qazi Hussain. Before any one reminds me that Qazi Hussain has already been tried under the banner of MMA—–then you are totally wrong. It was Maulana Diesel who betrayed Qazi Saheb and behind scenes He(Diesel Wala) was collaborating with Gen Musharraff. So please be realistic if there is any hope then it is ONLY AND ONLY Qazi Hussain and Imran Khan.
Regarding security of Imran Khan, I would say equally important is the security of Qazi Hussain. I am not bothered about the security of Maulana Diesel, Asfandyar Wali, (AYW) Zardari and MQM ‘Bhatta Collector’.
But here I would like to say one thing with full knowledge and awareness and that is— IF GOD FORBID GOD FORBID GOD FORBID any thing happens to Imran Khan our stupid,illeterate and Jahil AWAM will not take any notice at all. In reality our Jahil AWAM wants Zardari, yes they want Zardari, yes Awam wants PPP, they don’t want anything, our Stupid Awam just want Zardari, they don’t want Gas. Electricity, Oil, Water. And if Zardari remains in power and there are mid-term elections, except few seats in Karachi for MQM, believe me PPP will WIN on all seats. Why I am saying this……and before anyone comments….please watch these protests which are going on these days against Gas and Electric Load shedding. Watch carefully these protests are only for the non-availability of Gas and Electricity and they are not aimed at Zardari. The protestors are NOT demanding construction of Kala Bagh Dam project. Because PPP’s Raja Parvaiz Ashraf has already said that the construction of Kala Bagh Dam project has been halted completely. If Zardari decides to contruct Kala Bagh Dam, then He will lose support of ANP in Senate elections and also if there is no-confidence motion then again He will need support of ANP. Also the ‘puttar’ of Wali Khan and ‘pota’ of Ghaffar Khan knows that the contstrucion of Kala Bagh Dam means political death for ANP. As part of NRO deal it was agreed by Shaheeeeeeeeed Benazir that she will not insist on the construction of Kala Bagh Dam. It is our great misfortune that even MQM and ANP fully supported PPP and Benazir was vey canny in realizing that in order to keep support of MQM, ANP and Maulana Diesel she has to oppose Kala Bagh Dam. Yes it is our basic right that we should have Gas, Oil and Electricity. But who brought us to this situation, it was that idiot Benazir.
Even in his both tenures Nawaz Sharif did try to start Kala Bagh Dam project and he did offer some lucrative posts and benefits to Wali Khan but when Nawaz Sharif asked for Kala Bagh Dam project, he refused to cooperate. Then with all his bad habits even Musharraff tried to get the public opinion in favour of Kala Bagh but it was Benazir who got sudden support from MQM and ANP. Believe me the general public wants contruction of Kala Bagh Dam and other Nuclear projects but it is the politicians and particularly Benazir who is directly responsible for this catastrophic situation.
I am surprised that why people don’t talk about Kala Bagh project and even if someone says to start small Dam projects, then don’t be fooled even a small project takes several years to built. There should also be long term planning in the shape of Kala Bagh Dam. I got the feeling that some of these protests are actually organized by Zardari, because I do not hear chants like……GO ZARDARI GO, WHO KILLED BENAZIR, GIVE US THE NAME OF KILLER OF BENAZIR, CONSTRUCT KALA BAGH DAM. There is something fishy in these protests.
—–
I make this humble appeal to our Sindhi Brothers and Sisters for God sake DON’T BLINDLY VOTE PPP. Althouth track record of Nawaz Sharif is not good either but Bhutto family has ruined our country.
Only 10 days ago nearly one million people attended Benazir’s anniversary. What for, why did you people go there? Was there a need for national holiday? When you people got time to go to Larkana for anniversary then why are you people now crying for Gas and Electricity. And again I beg to our Sindhi Brothers and Sisters that if you people do not want to vote for Qazi Hussain then our only choice is Imran Khan, Yes Imran Khan.
Remember, Benazir and Zardari gave us NRO and PPP has never given us anything and they are going to do NOTHING. Their team is full of duffers and idiots.
Come on Pakistanis—-forget the past of Imran Khan….we all make mistakes….give Imaran Khan a chance. He is the only hope. Otherwise don’t cry about shortage of Gas
and Electricity and good luck with baqiat of Benazir……..Mr Madari.
Those who believe there is no democracy in PTI, PTI is holding election in april 2009, so lets get the facts straight before talking. The process for the elections has already started.
[...] January 3, 2009 — nadeemmalik ISLAMABAD TONIGHT: Islamabad Tonight – 2 January 2009 Category Islamabad Tonight | Posted on January 2, 2009 | 11 Comments Read More Imran Khan in this [...]
You have just concluded one thing without giving any reason for your conclusion.
Are you trying to say that IK is not reaching out to people? & if so then what you think that he should do.
And its WE who make someone hero or zero in politics thru OUR vote. And its OUR responsibilty to ask OURSELVES to vote for honest people & spread the same message to the others too.
Not the other way round that HONEST people should beg to us for our vote & if they are doing so its simply their greatness that we can never never understand.
@Ghost of TK
I can only smile on your illogical comments i know you can not see the people praising Imran Khan and cursing your favourite so-called leaders Zardari and Altaf bhai.
dont worry God will protect Imran Khan. and one more thing, if you have not read the history then read it before giving comments and find out the reason why Pakistan came into existence. If we all were hindu then there was no point having seperate country.
@Asif,
you are right Asif, HONEST people should not beg for votes and if they are doing so its their greatness…..AND….we can never understand. And thats why Asif, I call our AWAM stupid,Jahil and illeterate. Once again I appeal our beloved Brothers and Sisters of Sind, don’t blindly vote for PPP,
ask Baaaaaaaaaaaaaji Naheed Khan—who is the killer of Benazir? who is killer of Murtaza Bhutto, Why Zardari is not giving out name of Benazir’s killer. Why Zardari is not restoring Ch Iftikhar?
Come-on my Sindhi Sain Lok…..wake up !!!!!
Stop giving certificate of patriotism.
Convince people with logic.
There may be some Indians on this forum trying to be pakistanis, try to convince them with logic and show them the truth.
By the way people gave verdict like KAFIR E AZAM to Jinnah sahib
@ Mohammad Usman
do u think jiyalas like u understand logics? nop i don t think so.so its better to appriciate ur efforts for ppp by presenting ur NRO memorial award.
another achievement by ur Mr.10%
Mumtaz Bhutto arrested on an FIR of newspaper editor. what u gonna say about this achievement?
I like IK but like Ghost, I am not convinced that PTI has a proper democratic structure.
When the democrats and republicans held their elections for choosing their presidential candidates, the whole world saw it. There were long debates between the candidates and the entire process was transparent.
When the PTI holds proper elections with debates between candidates, and those debates are put on-line on PTI’s website or youtube, noone will be able to say that PTI is not a democratic party. Untill then, your claims aren’t going to convince many people.
i feel sorry to post this but this is the truth we can t ignore. this governor of ppp has made governor house a “bar” for drinking.
how openly a muslim governor is drinking and his son enjoying with females.
sharam bhi nahi aati in kamino ko. http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=B-fXtS8xT48&feature=related
Some body needs to explain Imran Khan that after Benazir there is a political vaccum in Pakistan but its on the left and center left. Nawaz Sharif is still very popular on right and center right. All his rehotric on political issues is targeted to right wing. But unfortunately religious right has Nawaz Sharif and they are very satisfied with him. After Zardari everyone can see Nawaz Sharif will be next PM. For Imran to succeed he needs to target PPP’s vote bank. To do that he needs to come from the left. If he keeps speaking like Qazi and Nawaz Sharif I don’t know how he will develop roots in masses.
Somebody raised here a concern about IK’s security. My friend he is a spokesman of religious right who can possibly target him, may be MQM and that too when they think he is viable political threat. At this point he doesn’t need to waste money on security guards.
@ali4asat
It will be my privelege to give this award to Mr Awais.
But, Ali Sahib, could you please be careful when you give these awards……because these are really ‘hard earned’ awards. You really have to be very staunch supporter of Bhutto Shaheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeed family.
So may I suggest that in the first instance you please send Mr Awais a Rs10 coin, with the picture of BB Shaheeeeeeeed.
Listen if you will appreciate people with Rs10 coin……our Jahil Awam will say Wah kia baat hai, Mr 10% ne Rs10 coin banaia hai. Now you see the Maths become very easy and the equation is like this
Mr10% = Rs10
@ Mohd Usman
Let me tell you, I am not an Indian posing as a Pakistani. I am 100% Pakistani and I even attended the public meetings of ZABhutto in 1970 and saw and judged that Man closely. Bhutto was a truly wicked and a cunning person, who really knew how to play with the sentiments of the poor public. I was even in that meeting in Feb 1971 in Nishtar Park, Karachi when Bhutto asked the crowd to raise their hands
for the release of Sheikh Mujib urRehman. My instant reaction was, Oh no this big decision should only be done by the Parliament.
yes, only free Judiciary and Parliament can make big decisions.
@shafi
right! i will take care be4 nominating next time.
as our awards are are just political awards they are not a hadith so we don t ve to worry. take the award back and give him 10 rs coin on behalf of mr. 10 % . jayals should be treated in the same manner as they are treating us !
@resident eveil
just beacuse we ve a tattu army general MR. pervez kayani which is busy obeying orders from USA.
yeh sare “pervez” tattu aur besharam he hote hain kya?
aik tha”pervez”musharraf aur aik hai “pervez” kiyani.
aik aur hai “haqani”aur aik hai yusuf raza “gillani”.
yeh sare k sare salay “imported tattu hain Japani”.
“Let us just hope Imran Khan doesn’t get hit by a Bedford Truck (GOD FORBID!) because that will be THE END of Pakistan Tehreek-e Insaf.”
I think the above maybe was directed at my comments. You know that “Bedford Truck” is the Israeli/Yankee/Hindu nexus….The true”axis of evil” (IMO). You must have noticed that I mentioned a few other non-PTI names too. I fear for every honest and competent leader. Any of these will be a thorn in the eyes of the above gang. Why was BB assassinated? Did it have something to do with deviating from the original “axis of evil” plan. She maybe initially agreed on the plan and later realized or had planned to not to act as a Trojan Horse?
Apart from that, I think you are right about PTI and IK. Right now IK is the undisputed face of PTI. I hope others will join, but fail to see where those known persons would come from, because a major part of these people ARE corrupt. We need to see totally new faces and you are going to see the faces after an election (if they are elected). Nobody wants unknown faces in their programs – regardless of capability. A good example is that you see numerous incompetent people from PPP just because they are famous…Fauzia Wahab….Incompetent and sorry to say DUMB!
“I don’t mean to troll, but this is exactly how I feel and it is a genuine fear of mine.”
I don’t know why you are being sarcastic. Maybe you are not realizing that we have been infiltrated to an extent that it is very hard to find a way out. Do you find any comfort in MQM, PML-Q, JUI-F, ANP or PPP? I am sorry to say that each and every of these parties are either fully or partially, directly or indirectly working for foreign masters.
This is why a leader is called leader,likewise a brother left a comment that he can not disagree even with onle singli point.
A leader is one whose vision is higher than the others.And Imran have got all and everything.Vision+Knowlede+sincerety+and most of all Hoensty.
Lets all of we change the Paksitan.If People of Paksitan are suffering today,I belive this is what we seeded.We get once in 5 year time that Whose is good and bad for the this country,According to Dr Safdar Mehmood after voting when you go for sleep just be honest with yourself by making witness Allaha say to youself if you voted for a person who is good for this nation or to landlord who could be notrous in the world by Mr 10% or another one whose spuouse is not a Prime minister of PAk may be Mr 1%.
But in the 2007 election the answer in most case shall be no I bet.night Before election every paksitani is Chief justice iftikhar,Make a good dicission.Or make a bad dicission and expect no more than what we are having today.
Pakistani youth go ahead Help imran to help this country,You ,ll make a difference Inshallaha
@Shirkuh: “You know that “Bedford Truck” is the Israeli/Yankee/Hindu nexus…”
No, I really meant the actual truck.. as in a traffic accident.
Also, I disagree with the line of reasoning that “there aren’t enough ‘famous’ people in the party” … I really don’t know what that’s supposed to mean.
Because it is not ‘famous’ people but a dedicated organization consisting of sincere and dedicated workers/leaders that runs a party.
And why is it that PTI can’t just elect those who actually believe in the party rather than waiting around for some ‘famous’ or “the right kind” of people?
Bhutto made the exact same mistake. People still are gaga over People’s Party of 1970 and not the party of 1976 when he sold out and basically reverted back to his aristocratic roots and gave tickets to ‘big names’ …
It is the memory of common people getting party tickets which made the People’s Party of 1970 legend (still IMO) in people’s minds.
So, if the party is about ‘insaaf’ and there is a dedicated group of people (I have no doubt this group exists in PTI because I see them defending on various forums) then ‘haath kangan ko aarsi…” … and get on with it.
It’s been ten years, why the elections now? I still have a bad taste in my mouth since the last years UK fiasco when IK just appointed some chick (I’m sure she’s very talented but she should have been elected) … and at that time I was seriously considering donating to PTI and taking part… but that was a turn off for me.
anyways… I think the party is in danger because even something not so evil like a traffic accident (god forbid!!!) could make the party go into serious political/identity/leadership crisis.
And guess who will be the vultres descending on the party apparatus then to take control of this dedicated group of people to USE for some of their nefarious purposes? THE AGENCIES! Yup… they’ll be in like flynn.
A democratic culture and a system of checks and balances is the biggest defense against hostile actors like ISI-Political-Wing or whatever. ANC did it, AIC did it, Sinn-Fein did it, why can’t PPP, PML-N and PTI do it?????
I don’t disagree with you on the issue about democracy within the party. If we really want to develop true democratic culture, then we need to start from the root level – otherwise we will fail – not only the political parties, but also as a nation. The root level doesn’t only start from democratic parties, but it also starts from various kinds of clubs, unions etc.
“And why is it that PTI can’t just elect those who actually believe in the party rather than waiting around for some ‘famous’ or “the right kind” of people?”
Maybe I didn’t make myself clear. PTI should NOT wait for the famous people, because (as I have already mentioned in my previous post) they are mostly corrupt and incompetent. On contrary I have stated that we need new people with new ideas/visions, who don’t have BAD habits. The back side of this strategy is that these people will not be invited to talk shows and be written about in newspapers, because their name doesn’t sell the program/newspaper, but once they are elected they will automatically attract both TV and newspaper.
“I still have a bad taste in my mouth since the last years UK fiasco when IK just appointed some chick (I’m sure she’s very talented but she should have been elected) … and at that time I was seriously considering donating to PTI and taking part… but that was a turn off for me.”
I agree that she (do you mean Rabia Zia?) should be elected. As far as I know an election was planned. I don’t have any knowledge about the outcome the election. Maybe an insider in PTI can throw some light on this issue.
@shirkuh: well, yeah, I agree in principle about other orgs but if this excuse is used too much it sounds more like evasiveness than anything elese. Also things like author unions are not in a political struggle to bring about democracy and justice to the people of pakistan. If the authors union doesn’t believe in ‘authorship’ or ‘writing books’ then I’d have a problem with them.
I still don’t get the talk-show thingy. You elect your officials, you outreach to people, you do your thing. When someone calls to find out what position PTI has, the Information secretary or PR person gives their response, if a TV station calls for a participant, then you already have people available who go to represent you. After all PTI is the better judge of who should represent the party on which issue.
Frankly I don’t buy the “presentable” thing. Fauzia Wahab and this idiot Jatoi are not on TV because “they are famous” but because the are the onces designated by the party in question.
And yeah the party should elect the people you specified (meritorius and not fakers) and get on with the work. What are they waiting for?
I’ve heard this … “oh ji election honay thay.. .ho rahay hai… ho jaiN gay..” BS from a LOT of Pakistani organizations.
It ain’t gonna happen. You can rub my nose in it when it does happen. And I’d be happy when they do take place. I’m not holding my breath though. Not for PTI, not for PML-N and definitely NOT for PPP.
“I still don’t get the talk-show thingy. You elect your officials, you outreach to people, you do your thing. When someone calls to find out what position PTI has, the Information secretary or PR person gives their response, if a TV station calls for a participant, then you already have people available who go to represent you. After all PTI is the better judge of who should represent the party on which issue.”
Yes, ideally it should be like that i.e. the party sends a representative on a particular issue.
The chairman should be able to speak on most issues, but if there is a TV show on a specific issue the TV channels should not ask for a certain person in the party, but a representative on that particular issue. What I have understood from different interviews is that TV wants specific a person, maybe that is why we only see known faces regardless of the issue. I have seen strange people uttering their opinion about issues, which they don’t have any say on (at least they shouldn’t), f.ex. Qamar Z. Qaira speaking on the judiciary issue, when it should be Naik.
I m becoming fan of IK, he has really got something, he can talk, he have solutions of all problems, he is best at the moments, and i want to see a gov in future of TIP AND PMLN, and i believe they will make a change in pakistan and only they are capable of everything. IK’s party is growing rapidly and in next elections it will perform well…
salam-u-alakum
the only solution to deal with crisess is, Hang every single politition in every corner of pakistan,there is will be no slave slavery.
“there is more horiable things then bloodshed slavery is one of them”.
Imran Khan MUST target PPP vote bank in Sind. I think this is the only meaningful way forward.
But the bitter reality is that our Sindhi Brothers and Sisters are so much stuck in Bhutto phobia that PPP is going to win in Sind for the next Hundred years.
Because after Shaheeeeeeeeeeeeeeed Zardari we will have Bilawal Zardari, and after him we will have Bakhtawar Zardari, and after her we will have Asifa Zardari. The list is endless.
Or take it this way that after Indira Gandhi (it would have been) Sanjay Gandhi, and then Rajiv Gandhi, and very soon it will be Rahul Gandhi. Because in India and Pakistan people go after ‘NAME’.
I think PTI Forum should set up a Think Tank and some really sharp Analysts should work out the strategy how to tackle the PPP vote bank in Sind, including Karachi. And the research must start now.
PTI should first try to start from urban and semi-urban areas in Sindh. Places like Hyderabad and Sukhar where there is some middle class. Develop local party branches along democratic lines there. That will give them a foothold in the province and allow them to spread further.
I have no ideas on Karachi – it seems to be a very hard one to crack due to the MQM’s terror tactics.
But other cities like Isb/Rawalpindi, Peshawar, Gujranwalla, Faisalabad, Sargodha, Hyderabad, Sukhar, and perhaps also Quetta should certainly be well within the party’s grasp if it organizes properly. Its first target should be to win 15-20 seats in an election which will allow it to be a strong pressure group in the parliament. Once it reaches this landmark, more people will start taking it seriously and that could attract more votes in other constituencies as well.
The PTI’s first hurdle is to convince enough people that here is a party that not only represents a break from the status quo, but also has a realistic chance of winning. Presently, a lot of potential PTI voters vote for PML-N so that the PPP does not win. If these people could be convinced that PTI has a reasonable chance of success, then they would vote for PTI. Similarly, with a lot of PPP supporters disillusioned with the way things are going, PTI can have a chance of winning some of them over too.
To my all fellow Pakistani Brothers & sister.
It is my belief that power lies with people and when we have hunger to bring change then ALLAH will come our assistance.
at this moment we are all guilty of silence.
our history is full of divine leaders and teachers from our beloved messenger Mohammed(pbuh) to countless writers ,poets who tried to show us the way to lead life .
to start we all traitors because we did not heed the message.otherwise how could we be in a situation such as this ?
If we don’t get up and do what is require from us in the holy book then worse is yet to come.we have seen the Gaza on tv? it is only a trailer of horror film yet.
For Pakistan : lets all give vote to IMRAN Khan then he may cure all the cancerous symptoms of our country with best team around him FREE of charge.
As i have mentioned several times, the problem with Pakistan is image. When the image is poor, people become hopeless and so on.
Imran was a great captain and will be a great leader as well. I feel sorry for the people of Pakistan who have failed to elect such great and capable leaders. You have everything but still you do not know how to standup in front of other nations.
Everybody likes to kick Muslim nations and Pakistan is top in the list. Pepople of Pakistan have failed to elect right leaders and they have to pay this price for their own failure.
Why people should wait untill the next election?. The house is on fire and they need to standup.
I can even suggest that President Zardari should appoint Imran as the PM and allow him to lead the nation. Otherwise, it will be too late for Pakistan.
R.Alamsha Karnan Says:
I can even suggest that President Zardari should appoint Imran as the PM and allow him to lead the nation. Otherwise, it will be too late for Pakistan.
this man is not in his senses !!!!!
goto some indian forum pal, y r u wasting ur brain and time ?
u ve even wasted my 2 mins.
Why did Imran not answer the question asked by that caller from Swat ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
He does not want to answer the question or he does not know the answer to that question. Because while his rehtorical logic does not have answers to these straight forward questions.
He wants dialogue with whom ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? First he should determine whom to talk with ……… are they legitimate residents of the area or imran wants to talk with Hindus fighting in guise of talibans ? ? ? How many are they and how many they want to have their wells imposed upon ? ? ? ? ? What do you say all the conspiracy theorists ? any PTI official who understands Imran have to answer these questions.
He is comparing Northern Ireland with Swat ? ? ? what a logic ? ? ? ?
What problem does imran has with drones when they killing some fu…g al-libi or al-misri in South Waziristan ……… he definitely does not bother when the same al-libi or al-misri is slaughtering the locals here ………….
The interview was a volleyball match in which the host was throwing the ball just above the net to be smashed by Imran.
“Pakistan needs instituition building and we should not follow Shakhseeat”, but then he comes and stucks at Iftikhar chaudhery……. not a single hard word for talibans ……..a morally corrupt like imran should not talk about corruption at least ………… zardari’s trusted are running the country but then he talks of something about his father being the head of the board of governors of SKH ……..why is that ? ? ?
shafi,
Once the judicial system becomes independent, we will trial the whole of JI for sending the inncoents across the borders for jihads ……… pray for dictatorships and anarchy otherwise you will see your Qazi handged in public …………..all the teenagers exploding the bombs have their blood as well as the blood of those they kill on hands of Qazi …………. the biggest criminal of humanity.
and by the way why does not your blood boil when you watch a Bad Kerdaar like Imran talking on TV …………
I am really sorry for personality attacks on Imran but his Criminal Stance on the situation in Pukhtunkhwa boils our blood and I promise I will try to make his life miserable ………. say the truth you fu..g bastard ………..
Once he clarifies his stance on talibans/Islamic militancy, on KB dam, on provincial rights only then will he find where he stands ……………
I consider him as the Best allrounder the cricket world has ever seen, and i think the nation should be grateful to him for SKH. Not long ago i considered him a principled politician but his stance on the militancy in Pukhtunkhwa and FATA is purely criminal ……….. we cannot forgive him for this ……….
I agree with everything IK stands for. The only thing I want to hear from him is that “institutions are more important than any leader” and that “TI will elect its party leaders from the basic grass root membership and from there on up”. “There shall be no personality and/family hegemony”. “Only DEMOCRACY will rule”.
Hazrat Ali said “aazmaaey huey ko aazmaana baywaqufi hey”
We haven’t tried imran khan yet, we should try him, rest of the parties, we have tried
them twice or thrice and we saw the result.
After power,if imran khan, doesn’t work on the points he is talking here, we will kick him our, before 5 years.
Nobody does anything for others, if there is poverty and nothing available, it is not the problem for the government elites and for few rich people, so why they would care about common public, it is public’s duties to do for themself, like protest in mass, once every week atleast.
In the light of present situation, if government doesn’t get very serious, I doubt that government will last till March 9th 2009.
i hope you guys would vote for Tahrek Insaf in the same spirit as you have commented on this vid AND propogate the message and vision of Tahrek Insaf to your colleagues, friends, family and who so ever you meet here and there.
Our hero rocks, come on SIR IK, this is time to break all lottas, exposse all traitors including NS.
My dear friend if king khan is taking great risk we should support him, we should join him by donating $10 every month, it is nothing, but we can donate for great cause for pakistan. http://www.insaf.org.
IK is patriotic , sincere, brave, honest. these are qualities in a true leader. All cowards MUFADPARAST, hukamat ke bhokhay, greedy pls dump dump them.
it is a time to support IK, after quaid azam we have IK we is copy of our quaid,
pls pls support him, join his hands and walk with him.
imran khan to khud eik dictator mind hai, iska saboot yeh hai kay inki party mien koi eik admi bhi aisa nhi jo inki party ko represent karay, her program her interview mien yeh khud appear hotay hain, saaf zahir hai kay imran khan mien bhi eik addud “Mien” hai, sirf baatien hi hain inkay pass, koi doosra admi exist hi nhi kerta jo inki party platform mien sey inkay khayalaat beyan ker sakay…i m sorry to all his fans, lekin plz koi doosra naam bata dien jo inka reflection ho or jo inki zeban mien baat kerta ho…
@democrat 2007
To All those who oppose Imran Khan (and Qazi Hussain)
The trend in the previos elections was that even the PML-N voter who wanted to vote for Imran Khan, voted for PML-N to keep out PPP.
The situation is exactly the same now and that is if Imran Khan does not get support of Qazi Hussain-JI then the votes will be split and the net result would be in complete Win for PPP and that means Madari Vadhera Sain for another 5 years.
In your formula Mr Democrat 2007, you have suggested that in the bigger cities if He can win between 20-30 seats fo form an EFFECTIVE pressure Group, and this can only be possible with the support of Jammat e Islami.
Before someone again reminds me that JI has already been tried under the banner of MMA, then the answer is, it was Maulana Diesel who betrayed Qazi Sahib.
And in the election of 2002, the only reason that MMA got more seats was that according to the agreement the voter of JI had to vote for Diesel Wala’s Party. The reason Qazi Sahib agreed to work jointly with Maulvi Diesel was that Qazi Sahib thought that Maulvi Diesel may behave like a ‘Bande ka Puttar’ but instead Maulvi Diesel kept on behaving like ‘Khoti ka puttar’.
Please remember that even in Feb 2007 elections in almost all contituencies where PPP candidate could not win, the PPP candidate was No:2 because of the split vote.
So if there is a mid-term election then there is only one way is that Imran Khan will need support of PML-N and JI.
Also PML-Q can cut his voted dangerously
so He needs support of JI and PMl-N.
And if our Jahil AWAM for any reason wants to oppose Imran Khan then Good Luck with Madari Vadeira Sain.
@ shafi
Qazi voted for JUI because ISI told them to do so.
Imran khan has to come out of Qazi’s influence if he ever wants to establish his political life.Imran Khan is no revolutionary, so he needs to work on his manifesto and team building.If Imran Khan keep his present way of politics he will end up like Asghar Khan who was used by Mullahs and Military time and again.
in which way he looks different from Qazi, except the Beard offcourse, and that too seems to be comming out in a short while. Imran is a MIXTURE of influences, not a single thing is personal about him.
Any official from PTI here would like to explain what are views of Imran on the role of ISI & Qazi in being part of the jihadi drama in Kashmir and Afghanistan ? ? ? anyone from PTI ? ? ?
I am not representing PTI, but I have seen no good arguments from you. Please use the brain and answer my question instead of posing your own distracting questions. As far as PTI – JI “alliance” is concerned I can say that it is less significant than the alliance between PML and JI in the past. The alliance between PTI and JI is a one point agenda and that is the restoring the judiciary. And what about the alliance between the “mother of all terrorists” MQM’s and PPP? Anyone to explain?
Btw: PML-N/NS has also been a part of this alliance, but somehow PML/NS did find a way out and so did PPP. Anyone who can explain this? On top of it PML-N is finding a way to be a part of the alliance again. PML-N has announced that they will support the Long March on 9.th March. Let’s see if they can be steadfast. I hope so
What do you mean by “Jihadi drama” in Kashmir? On this issue I think PML-N and PTI have similar views.
I definitely am not arguing about Imran, let him come out and talk on issues, let him take decisions and let him face the subsequent response from the public.
He will soon know the response of people of NWFP since he has decided to remain mum on the activities of his beloved islamists .
Once he takes some sort of decision regarding the KBD he will know what the people of sindh think about him.
Let him face the people of Balochistan and he will know how difficult is it to decide which language to use when talking to insurgents.
“He will soon know the response of people of NWFP since he has decided to remain mum on the activities of his beloved islamists .”
He is NOT mum on this issue. In fact he has been very clear that we need to take the people of NWFP on board and have negotiations with the traditional leaders. By doing that we will be able have the majority on OUR side and stabilize the area and isolate the few culprits amongst them – including those who are collaborating with foreign powers.
On the other issues: Yes, historically they have been tough, but if you take people on board i.e. they get a say in the solution then the possibility of success is enhanced, but if you bypass different processes then it is doomed to failure. And yes, only time will tell how he performs if/when he gets a chance.
Btw: What is an islamist? Will you please elaborate?
very disappointing interview…I mean the host did not ask any tough questions. Ok so you like Imran Khan, but if you invite him for an interview then ask at least a couple of tough questions, otherwise you just undermine your own credibility as a journalist.
A couple of good points made by Kashif, GoTK and Uthmankhel1. In my view, Kashif is absolutely right–the political vacuum is on the left, not the right, where NS is rather acceptable. But Kashif, IK cannot fill the vaccuum on the left because he is too right himself.
As for internal elections, forget about them…for the longest time, Jemima was head of the PTI women’s wing–how democratic is that??
Also, though I agree with IK on the judiciary and some other things, Uthmankhel1 is absolutely right that he does not offer any insight on complicated matters in the North–Swat being a case in point! It is not so easy and simplistic as he makes it sound.
IK just gets a lot of airtime but in reality his party has made little inroads. After more than a decade of politics, his party still stands at only 3% in the recent IRI poll.
Imran Khan is a true leader. Born leader. God gifted. Check his record. Lead his team to a world cup victory and the ONLY WORLD CUP VICTORY till now 17 years later we replay those same moments of winning the cup. They say Pakistan has a lot of talent, which is true than why cant they win the world cup. forget about winning why cant they even come in the finals or semis? one answer they dont have a leader like Imran Khan who knew how to handle every personality differently.. Look at his Hospital. It is the best hospital in Asia. People have these stupid comments to make against IK but there is no light on them, its just dumb arguments with no proofs.
I CHALLENGE THE OPPOSITION OF IMRAN KHAN AND PTI ON PKPOLITICS. IMRAN KHAN was the FIRST leader 12 years ago to point out that the main problem of this country is judiciary, 12 years later the lawyer movement starts. No leader, nor Benazir, nor Shariff brothers, Qazi( who like), ALtaf terrorist, Zaradari 10 %, CH’s, 12 years ago talked about judicary. Now they taking credit for it. Anyone can prove me wrong??? where are those idiots that just talk against Imran Khan? put ur money where ur mouth is.
There is no need to participate in a yelling competetion. Not much fun in participating when there is no proper environment. Please continue your manners of a playground sandbox
@Shirkuh
Imran Khan has been under Qazi’s influence and that implies under the influence of agencies.
He participated in 2002 elections though they were arranged under establishment’s + agencies (though nothing wrong with that either as long as you oppose dictatorship in Parliament) , but he boycott the 2008 elections when there was even better chances to represent people who wanted a third option.
He directly and indirectly support militants who are active in NWFP and who have imposed laws and system beyond any one’s imagination like No Education for Girls.
He promised to bring Altaf Hussain back ( though it was a joke) with in three months but nothing doing?
He was captured and handed over by Jamtis after humiliation ( i condemn personally) to Musharaf regime, still he is very close to Jamat. He got that opportunity to remain in jail till Nov02 orders were reversed, but he went on hunger strike for his own release( yet another joke).
If Imran Khan was a savior or some one against the status quo he would have been jailed for long time like Zeadari or i must mention Benazir who remained under arrest from 1977 to 1983 in different jails and in her house.
It is very easy to talk against civilian Govts but real commitment show up when people / leaders stand against tyrants like Ayub , Yahya, Zia and Musharf on their peaks.
What guarantee BB had when she struggled against Zia? what happened to Nawaz when Musharaf came into power? though Nawaz was lucky and he compromised on Musharf’s terms to get second life.
Imran Khan has not faced any hostile establishment as yet, and I am sure when ever he will decide to become a true Awami/ people oriented leader the establishment will come out to teach him a lesson.
@ all sick opponents of Ik
we are not IK’s spokesmen on his policies. but as we ve got brain and we listen his point of we can tell that what ever he says he says in the favour of pakistan and he will do every thing to save this country.
he will pull this country out of USA phobia.
o u jiyalas and nawaz lovers listen to me
IK is a leader , he is not like nawaz and Mr 10% who pooh (in pants )when Bush says Booh !!!!!!!
@ ali4asat
You need to have courage to come out and lead to save a country, it is zardari and ppp who are at front line and facing it all, If Imran khan had courage he would have participated in the elections to engage people of Pakistan.
Imran couldn’t tolerate two days in jail how could he face international pressure.
Mr. Zardari and team should get full marks for pulling us out of two big challenges,
1. Economics, as they were able to get us some money to run this country otherwise from USA to Saudia and from China to Europe has said ‘NO”.
2. After Mumbai crises they did very well to avoid war of any scale so far.
What Imran Khan has as alternative for economic system? Does he has will to balance current fascist capital system’? if yes then i will support him. Those who talk against USA very loud, tell us how?
1-”they were able to get us some money to run this country otherwise from USA to Saudia and from China to Europe has said ‘NO”. ”
Why all the countries are refusing to give us money, because they know that the money will never be returend because of zardari historical record corruption and the way he keeps his words.. IMF has no blood realtion with us for apporving the loan, thats only because zppp had already promised for continuing the policies of musharraf to kill pakistani people by american drones.
2- “After Mumbai crises they did very well to avoid war of any scale so far”
Avoiding war is not a solution at the cost of banning and killing your own people without any proofs. Instead this is the symbol of a helpless and a coward nation.
Go to your history and read the muslims situation in which Badar battle was fought against kuffar-e-Makkah. Muslims had no economy no food and they had a choice either to follow the Makkah trade convoy or fight against the makkah army. If you dont know , I can tell you . Quran appreciated muslim decisions of fighting against the makkah people.
Nations are built on the basis of principles , bravery and they make their history by sacrification and not by crying before other nations.
@Muhammad Usman Says:
Can you quote any of the event when JeD glorify this “dehshat Gardi” or killed any of the civilian or military personal in pakistan? Even in the present crisis, they didnt go for any violent protests.
Instead we have such record for MQM and some other political parties who kill not only own people but also getting help from our hostile foreign elements..
I am not spokesman of JeD, but if they are involved in terrorist activites, it should be bring to us. We always ban such org when there is external pressure.. In this way actually we give the message that we dont have our own policy but we are here to serve foreign orders.. In that case the people of the our country start law in their hands..
I have seen people often quoting “sulah hadeebiah”… without knowing the whole background behind that..you name is Usman atleast,you should have full details about that, anyhow let me tell you actual facts..
1-After the rumours of Usman(RA) murder, muslims (sahab (RA)) promised before muhammad they they will not go back until take revenge of Osman murder.
2-They were ready for fight even they didnt have any weapons with them.
3-They didnt think about their economy and the families they left behind them.
4- When pagans of Makkah came to know about muslims intentions they got frightened and sent their delegation for negotiations.
5- Muslims didnt request or cry for “peace” instead they were the “kuffar” who requested negotiations.
so conclusion is that muslims never fought on the basis of their economy or worldly powers instead whenever they relied on weapons and quantity, like in battle “Tabook”, they were defeated.
I am not warmonger, but the nations who afraid of being thrown into war and trade their respect and honour with some money and temporary peace. They are always ruled by some other nations.
Musharraf , 9 years ago, did the same thing and assured us that now all our problmes would be solved , but wat happened?
“Economics, as they were able to get us some money to run this country otherwise from USA to Saudia and from China to Europe has said ‘NO”.” i know u r a begger like Mr 10 %. tumhari yeh mangnay ki adat kab jaye gi? sharam nahi aati mangte huay?
“After Mumbai crises they did very well to avoid war of any scale so far.”
A newly born pakistan faught two wars in 65 and 71 when it wasn t even a nuclear power !
If u r so scared of india go an live in india u mouse.
i am not in favour of a war but one should live with dignity and honour.
“to live one day like a lion is better then 100 days of jackal’s life.”
Mr.10% and Ganja Nawaz pooh(in pants) when Bush says Boooh !!!!
@ agrana75
plz don t tell them about “Badar” and “Ohad” these are science and techonolog births and there science and technology is gonna save them from dying one day.
Good luck Bush fobia people !!!!!
Are you really suggesting that IK led the lawyers’ movement? If so, I suggest you brush up on your knowledge. IK tagged along. The lawyers’ movement came about as a result of dedicated top lawyers like Aitzaz Ahsan, Munir Malik, Ali Kurd, and so on—most of whom DO NOT support IK politically. How convenient for you to point out all of IK’s successes but none of his failures. Yes, he was successful in cricket; yes, he is successful with Shaukat Khanam (though it is certainly not the best hospital in Asia–again a bit of honesty would do you good). But politically, he has been a failure. In 1997, even a political novice should have known that if he wanted to win, he should have chosen one constituency, but he contested from nine and lost from all!
His political allies were people like Hamid Gul who have landed Pakistan in this terrorism mess. In 2002, he supported Musharraf. Some even say the military orchestrated his victory (though I personally do not buy that). But his voting record is not good–he voted for Fazlur Rehman as PM; voted against the women protection bill, and so on.
@ ali4asat
This is typical of IK supporters–when they don’t have logical arguments they start attacking the others who are making them. I wonder who really has the brain here. I would love to support someone who really has a commitment to anti-imperialism and who has demonstrated it in his or her personal life. Zardari is not that guy, NS is not that guy, Asfandyar is not that guy, Altaf Hussain is not that guy, and guess what?!? Neither is IK that guy….he says all these things about the US but his own children stand there like stupid ring-bearers for the wedding of Camilla’s nephew and think they have accomplished something in life. He is so happy to be photographed by Hello magazine in UK but shows a different face in Pakistan. Maybe you support him because you only see one side to him. Nusrat Fateh Ali Khan did so many shows for free to raise charity for Shaukat Khanum, but when he died, IK did not have the decency to attend his funeral. On the other hand, Diana went to Shaukat Khanum once, and when she died, he came running to her funeral. So don’t tell me that he doesn’t suffer from an inferiority complex!
Yes, there are people in Pakistan, lawyers like Ali Kurd and Munir Malik (who are denied visas by the UK), social workers, etc. who are the real hope for Pakistan–it is from them and through a true democratic process that a real leader will one day Insha’Allah emerge for Pakistan–and it will be a team of leaders (like in the lawyers’ movement)–not one celebrity with a dedicated fan club. IK is not my hope and he is not Pakistan’s hope. The people of Pakistan are smarter than you—they don’t see a revolutionary in IK because there are too many hypocrisies there–that is why he stands at 3%.
PPP and PML-N do better because they rely on patronage–if people in Pakistan’s villages vote for them, they then rely on the local nazims, etc. to sort out their thana-katcheri issues, and it works that way…but with the other crises taking record proportions, patronage doesn’t cut it–that’s why PML-Q lost. The next election belongs to PML-N because PPP and ANP are rapidly getting discredited. And if PML-N does not deliver (which is likely) then another revolutionary force could emerge, but that force is not IK’s PTI.
The rule ” jis kee lathi us kee bhains” is actually valid in this world. Today america is strong not due to its economy but due to its army and weapon systems . Its economy is built because of the money it is holding from other country and the strong army it has. someone may ask this question , why some other countries in europe with out army are still rich. Answer is very straight forward, those are not separate from america. Europe is a strong ally of USA. My intention is not to criticize west or USA, Every nation do, wat ever is best.I am not in favor of crying or referring our own weaknesses because of some other people. We muslims these days are weak, humiliated and disresprected because we ourselves are forgetting of all the principles to become a strong nation. We cry for economy, in fact not to become a powerful nation but to lead a luxurious life.
Look at muslim arab countries which are very rich ,strong economy but can we say them strong?
@ usman
” What Imran Khan has as alternative for economic system? Does he has will to balance current fascist capital system’? if yes then i will support him. Those who talk against USA very loud, tell us how?”
In terms of welfare state!
who made China? Overseas chines and chines people themself !
who made singapore ? singapore people itself !
who made malayasia ?malaysian people itself !
If they can do it why can t we. when this habbit of begging of urs gonna go?
Ik says and we know its true that our biggest wealth is overseas pakistani but they are not willing to send their money to pak banks just because they don t feel secure.
IK said 1000 times that politicians must declare their assets and pay their taxes and bring their assests to pakistan and after that government should ask the nation to pay their taxes and then if any1 doesn t not pay his tax he must be pulled to the court.
when politicians will put their money into pakistani banks and will declare their assets ,overseas paki s will feel secure and they will support the government.
Now after these facts i gave u if u r not convinced then u need a doctor cuz jayala pan is a disease and u r suffering from it.
I think some people are really getting carried away here. No need to be jealous of IK and his acheivements. just admit and move on!!! Just because he is gaining strength politically now, no body needs to feel pressure on his or her tail. Just accept the obvious and move on.
There is one another reason for the usa to become a strong country, that is because of their internal strong judiciary system. People are treated equally , wats so ever their social status is. Though we people from other nations have complaints about usa that it is not doing justice outside the USA but with in the USA i have seen that no body can think to become mr 10% 0r 80% and then get certificate of innocence through NRO. No person can think to appoint his daughter in an emabassy like makhdoom Faheem daughter. No judge can think to do efforts for increasing his daughter numbers. Here no body can think of killing more than 50 people , like 12 may 2007, and then there is no inquiry.
In fact, if our judiciary system is strong, there would be no extremism, no law & order situation, no corruption etc.
People like Sitaraakhri and Muhammad Usman are the people sucking the blood of this nation for the last sixty one years. They are the very reason Pakistan finds itself where it is now.
Re-enforcing the failures are not going to do anything good whatsoever. PPP is in power fourth times and PML has been twice already. if there was any agenda or any good ever to come out of these white elephants, it would have by now.
At any rate, Pakistan needs to try someone new. And IK is the best of new lot. Period!!!!
Before you start making allegations—I suggest you read the post properly. I have criticized AZ and NS and others–just because I don’t like them, does not mean I have to like IK. What’s the matter? Your brain cells too small to comprehend that??
And ashahid, you should watch the Live With Talat where he questioned IK–now that was a real interview (not like this bullshit by this Mr. Malik)—and talat pinned him real good on many of the things I was talking about in my post–the hypocrisy…
I think M Usman and I are being far more objective–giving credit where it’s due and taking it away where its not–you guys are the ones too blinded by your love for IK to see any flaws in him.
@sitaraahkhri: Your post was well written and well reasoned. Don’t mind the 4 year olds running amok. It seems the admainistrator is on “chuTTi” or something.
@ali4asat and agrana75
please don’t bring Ghazwas in to it , and please when you refer Qurran , give verse no and chapter no.
I read about Badar , auhad and Khandaq, but Islam is not all about wars. there was Shaib i abi Talib too, its about dialogue and treaties too, please refer to Chapter of Al Nasar when Almighty has referred that treaty of hudybia as “Fateh Mubeen”.
My question remains How will you fight and stand against USA?
Don’t you see millions of muslim poor children sleep with empty stomachs daily?
Don’t you know how you live in refugee camps when you have to leave your homes?
What is honor of a nation that has been getting loans for last 61 years and 80 % of it been spent on military.
ISI chief should have been sent long time back to some where as nations don’t need ISI but nationalism and trust.
[...] ISLAMABAD TONIGHT Islamabad Tonight – 2 January 2009 Category Islamabad Tonight | Posted on January 2, 2009 | 104 Comments Read More Imran Khan in this [...]
You don’t have to propogate your party, don’t the people of pakistan see everyday whats going on, why they don’t say to Edhi Mr.10% and say to Zardari Mr.10%??? If government proves that they are Edhi of Pakistan. I guarantee to that each and every Pakistani will be with the government.
People don’t care, whether your name is Zardari or Imran Khan, they want betterment for them and Pakistan, they will be with every zardari, who cares for them and the country,not verbally, but shows by his/their actions. If you can’t do, they will try imran khan and others, because you are disappointing them. There is not
“kamal” of Imran Khan to be sucessful in present situation, because you the present government providing him this chance, because you are not acting in the interest of Pakistan and it’s people.
“Imran Khan has been under Qazi’s influence and that implies under the influence of agencies.”
I don not agree. I am convinced that they are together on a one point agenda. I trust Ik through his speech and the following actions and off course consistency. On the other hand I don’t trust Qazi at all. He is just as unreliable as the other established parties, who one by one has left the colalition and the commitments they made.
“He directly and indirectly support militants who are active in NWFP and who have imposed laws and system beyond any one’s imagination like No Education for Girls.”
This is far too simplistic. The matter is a bit more complicated than indicated by you. In this conflict we have (far to) many participants. Let us try to differentiate between them.
The Allied gang and their share of collaborators: There is no other solution than to cut the supply lines to the Allied gang. It is evident that they have a purpose of destabilizing Pakistan.
The Indians and their share of collaborators: The same goes for the Indians. They are pushed by the The Allied gang to perform a negative role. That is quite stupid action from the Indians. They will stay as our neighbours, but their newly found “friends” will leave, when their goals have been met. In other words they are escalating the existing conflict.
Foreigners: Those elements collaborating with the Indians and the Allied gang should be dealt with. The others should be given a safe passage to elsewhere.
The local tribesman in general: I believe the vast majority of the tribesmen wants peace, but they don’t want anything imposed on them and the least thing is by regular drone attacks accepted by the present and the previous government. We need to reach out the Pakistan loving tribesman and make peaceful deal without disrupting drone attacks from the other side. Each time Pakistan has tried some kind of reconciliation we have seen drone attacks from the side. The traditional tribal leaders have been undermined, killed and sidelined. We cannot afford that. We MUST find a peaceful solution and that is what PTI wants!
“He promised to bring Altaf Hussain back ( though it was a joke) with in three months but nothing doing?”
What can he do since both the present and the former government refuses to let the UK authorities have access to vital information? On top of that foreign powers like UK wants to have such terror elements in their hands to play their cards according to their negative policies towards Pakistan.
“He was captured and handed over by Jamtis after humiliation ( i condemn personally) to Musharaf regime, still he is very close to Jamat. He got that opportunity to remain in jail till Nov02 orders were reversed, but he went on hunger strike for his own release( yet another joke).”
I agree about IJT and JI. I also condemn both IJT and JI for their hypocritical behaviour. I don’t trust any of them.
I think he could do more damage to the government outside the jail than inside. To be locked in jail for a long period is no qualification in itself. It is the policies you stand for that differs!
“Imran Khan has not faced any hostile establishment as yet, and I am sure when ever he will decide to become a true Awami/ people oriented leader the establishment will come out to teach him a lesson.”
My answer will be as theoretical as yours in terms of what he will do or face when he sits in a government, but I have confidence that he is not afraid anybody and will make the decisions necessary to get us on course, inshallah! He is no saint and he will commit mistakes too, but what matters for me is he an able man, honest, has good policies and has a vision for Pakistan. My claim is; he is the best from the present lot of politicians/parties. Hopefully we will have even better leaders in the future, inshallah!
While enlisting various militant groups operating in Swat and FATA, you have missed one major group and has erroneously added some commong folks as militants in the list.
The missing group is the one who were waging pakistani wars of strategic depths afghanistan in the 80s and 90s.More specifically, the pass outs of all those 25000 (unofficial) and 8000 (official) training/recruiting camps (madrassas) of FATA which never existed before the afghan war. All sane humans except you and imran believes every single monster that exists in this region is directly linked to (trained, groomed and brainwashed in) these madrassas.
There is an additional bunch of monsters who some believe were escorted from Afghanistan to Waziristan and settled by Pak Military when the american assault started.
Now come to the group of tribesmen whom you have included in the list of militants. Here Imran becomes criminal and so are you. The tribesmen are not militants but are the VICTIMS of militants as are the ordinary people of Swat. MORE THAN 300 tribal elders were mercilessly killed by the militants in targetted killings. The motive was obvious to create power vaccum and fear. No one dare stand in front of militants be they in hundereds as compared to the hundereds of thousands whom they want to subdue. IMRAN IS CRIMINAL BECOZ HE KNOWS ALL THIS AND INTENTIONALLY TWISTS THE FACTS to call the victims of militants as the militants, an equivalent of rubbing salt over wounds. Majority of the tribesmen have been made hostage by the militants thanks to our military.
Why do you want to cover EITHER
—-imran’s inability to answer simple questions which arise when he being blinded by his rhetorical criticism of any sitting govt for cheap popularity on the issue of operation in FATA and Swat. While he was shouting full throttle when Musharraf decided to lauch a half hearted military operation to please his american masters. He is no different now when the ppp/anp govt is trying to wipe out the militants genuinely but are not supported by the all powerfull military.
—–moves according to a given chalked out plan as he’s allegedly been brought to politics by none other than Hamid Gul the X-DG of ISI which orchestrated this whole self-destructing plan of creating monsters for wars of strategic depths.
Have you ever seen him asking question that if american military can kill al-qaeda’s no.3 in SW and many al-libis and al-misris’s why can’t our military do it when our military is better placed to do it for THIS COUNTRY BELONGS TO THEM.
He is expected to make statements stressing the military to deliver against the militants who are killing innocents …………… not to support them.
Thats what my point is IK needs to move to left in order to succeed. I think he is on right bcaz of people around him. We don’t know much about PTI but I am almost certain most of the people around IK are Jammat Islami followers. Thats why Imran speaks there language.
In politics one go to right or left to get to power. Once you are there you will most likely rule from center or u can switch then. By leaning on right IK is loosing his celeberity advantage. There is nothing wrong with right leaning but its just not working for him. He has wasted 15 iireversible years. He needs to take this opportunity (political vaccum on left) or even that will be gone in few years.
Though I agreed with you in your earlier post, feel differently about your later post. In IK’s case, I don’t agree that he is right because the people who support him are right. I think he is to the right because of his own family background. Anybody who knows him/has met him or his family knows this. His sister was the founder of Al-Huda for women in Lahore. Ironically, some of his supporters are significantly to the left of him and either don’t follow his politics or are just too enamoured by the idea of IK to have it bother them. Incidentally, most of these supporters also live outside the country and rarely vote.
Also, I don’t agree that there is nothing wrong with leaning right–in most cases that is true, but when it comes to women’s rights it is not. Unfortunately, the right in Pakistan has never stood up for women’s rights–not even when they are in the opposition. Recently, when Tasleema Solangi was literally thrown to the dogs, Saad Rafique of pml-n (someone I liked on other issues) refused to criticize the government on it. I was actually shocked. PML-N, JI, PTI, etc all the parties to the right also refused to support the women protection bill. There is the case of the baluch women who were buried alive recently–again no voice of opposition from the right–including mr. imran khan.
And now before i get attacked, the ppp of course was very disappointing by appointing gross violators of women and human rights, the likes of Bajrani and Zehri–but again no opposition from the right/right-leaning parties. Had the pml-n been in power, however, the ppp would have raised its voice against it. So the PPP with all its flaws (and it has way too many) stands up for women’s rights when it is in the opposition at least. Unfortunately the parties on the right don’t even do it then–that is really sad, because it is a huge problem in Pakistan.
@sitaraakhri, @Uthmankhel
IK’s full focus is the urban areas of Pakistan , and it is understandable at the moment , however a “leftist” will always find it hard to “vote” for Imran Khan, just like “rightist” always find it hard to vote for “PPP”. However while in power both left or right parties start tending towards center.
It is very hard to understand the psyche of rural areas of Pakistan , there are so many complex socio-political forces (from their own choice/love to feudalism to biradari system , to the invisible forces on the voting day…. everything just gets mixed up) acting at the same time in rural areas that it is very hard to understand how people vote there.
Apart from obvious PPP , only leader I could see gaining the trust of rural areas is Nawaz Sharif.
Khan need to find a way to approach the rural areas and talk in their language… although it seems he is short of time.
“While enlisting various militant groups operating in Swat and FATA, you have missed one major group and has erroneously added some commong folks as militants in the list.”
Read my post again. I think you read what YOU wanted to read and not what I wrote. I used the term “Participants”. Maybe you should rethink and reply with a more logic answer with NO INTENTIONAL TWISTING next time
Madrassa: I am not in favour of the outdated madrassas. What is sad is that there are no alternatives. Have any of the previous governments made ANY significant gain in that regard – be it PML-N or PPP?
According to you: “the ppp of course was very disappointing by appointing gross violators of women and human rights, the likes of Bajrani and Zehri”
and then:
“So the PPP with all its flaws (and it has way too many) stands up for women’s rights when it is in the opposition at least.”
That’s quite “interesting statement. When PPP is running the affairs they appoint criminals. And still you blame the opposition? Isn’t it the duty of the government to ensure the right people are appointed?
Isn’t it the duty of the government to kick out criminals?
Isn’t it the governments duty to ensure law and order?
Yes i read them quite carefully and i will write them in your words again …….. so now …………………….. we have the SOLE PARTICIPANT ISI and it’s share of collaborators THE MILITANTS …….
how many years ….. ACTUALLY …… how many hours do you think have the political govts ruled the country in general and FATA in specific due to its strategic importance at that time …………………… you are not helping army in your posts definitely …………………………..
and don’t just confuse things ………outdated madrassas ………… they were training and recruiting camps built by Army/ISI for their wars ………
The is the usual BS….ie. we were not allowed to XYZ, we did not have any authority, our hands were tied….modalities.
Then for Gods sake don’t accept half solutions! Make sure you people actually RUN the government, when you form your government. Don’t blame it on others when it is you who are incompetent. Be brave and admit your mistakes! Agitate and ensure you have the people of Pakistan on board and don’t get too excited about power(abuse) and other irregularities.
“We need to reach out the Pakistan loving tribesman and make peaceful deal”
i am replying to it ………. you don’t need to reach to tribesmen but you need to get rid of the militants who are keeping tribesmen hostage
“Each time Pakistan has tried some kind of reconciliation we have seen drone attacks from the side”
what reconciliation ? nothing’s wrong between the tribesmen and pakistan …….. if anything is wrong its between the ordinary tribesmen and the militants ………….
Now it’s another thing if you want to make reconciliation with militants responsible for the slaughtering of tribesmen ………………. which pak army infact is doing ………….
You have still not answered my question. Don’t run in circles. Show some courage and admit you have made a mistake.
yes, I have described the ordinary people of NWFP as tribesmen and NOT “MILITANTS” as claimed by you.
And off course you need to reach out the ordinary tribesmen. They are suffering from the Yankee drone attacks. And off course you need to tackle the few and real MILITANTS/Terrorists. Read my post once more and you will find the same statement!
Is it that difficult to admit a mistake or was it an INTENTIONAL TWIST from YOUR part?
IK was a biggest play boy during his cricketing years. His family might have some right leanings but then 90% of our families have. That doesn’t mean he has to do politics from right. Look at Yousuf Raza Gillani, Amin Fahim, Shah Mahmood Qureshi they all are from religious families but they are doing politics from left. Imran needs to do the same or otherwise start bashing Nawaz Sharif. When Obama and Hillary Clinton were running against each other they both bashed Bush but that wasn’t enough. Obama had to go all out against Clintons to make in-roads within left leaning democrats. Similarly Zardari bashing is not enough for IK. He needs to start attacking next PM of Pakistan, Nawaz Sharif. At this point IK is so scared of Nawaz Sharif politically he doesn’t even try to run from Lahore (where he was brought up) and Islamabad (where he lives now). Unfortunately same is true about Atizaz Ehsan. He can’t win from Lahore without NS’s support. PM’s biggest qualification is not how eloquent he is on issues. Their biggest assett is how deep their roots are in public. If they are making tough decisions that are not popular within fellow parlimentarians he can go directly to public. In Pakistan NS and BB had this luxury. They had the political capital to override any discent within their ranks. If not you will get PMs like Gillani, Aziz, ManMohan Singh. IK with all his eloquence about social justice, institution building, infrastructure development would not like to join this dummy PM’s league. He needs to come out of Jamat and PMLN shadow and offer Pakistani people true alternate leadership.
Should I start with the 70 children killed by a missle strike on school? there is a long list of incidents where PML Q govenment people admits that civilians were killed.
Musharraf promised on TV that he will release the pictures of terrorist in schools, never been published, will never be published. You need to “Grow up and stop lying”.
IK’s views on was against terror represents far right. He argues that troops should be pulled and gov should talk to militants. Does he know militants want nifaz e shariat. Basically in the name of religion they want power and curb all civil liberties as Taliban did. He critise gov for the way they are conducting operation but he never condems extremists who are not only brutually killing our soldiers and civilians alike but are bulldosing schools and other state institutions. He critise west alot (when he is not in west) he also needs to highlight his differences(if any) from Taliban style militants and their philosphies. He critise Americans in our region but he doesn’t critise Arabs there. He says war against terror is American war, may be but who is other party. Arab sheikhs are leading the other side. Since it is being fought in Pakistan, Pakistan has no choice but to pick one side. Imran (thanks to Qazi and co.) has picked extreme right and gov is being forced (bcaz of economic and political compulsions) to support American efforts. At this time it is as much as Pakistan’s war as it is of Americans and Arabs. Even though IK proclaims its not ours (to satisfy his extreme right well wishers) we are paying more price of it than both Arabs and Americans.
It doesn’t matter they are in thousands or hundreds whatever their number is they are leading this effort both financially and politically. Leaders like OBL and Al Zehwari have political ambitions which are tied to their home lands in Arab pinseula and they are using our land to change political status quo in middle east. In the process they ruined Afghanistan and unfortunately Pakistan is under fire now. People like IK critise only one side (Americans) and don’t talk much about other (Arabs). Either they are dishonest or loyal to one side.
We are trapped in sh!t all around. Where do we start the correcting measures? You are right that we can criticize left, right, up and down, but would it be wise to create more enemies/opponents? Don’t we have enough hostile countries?
You are pointing towards lack of criticism of the Arabs. What about we also start criticizing the Chinese for their treatment of the Muslim minority? Where do we stop? We are not a superpower, which can deal with many opponents simultaneously.
In other words: I agree with you in principle, but for the sake of real politics we need to be careful not to create further opponents/enemies. We have enough of them already. That’s why we should concentrate on selected and most critical issues and not start “wars” in all directions.
Are you really suggesting that IK led the lawyers’ movement? If so, I suggest you brush up on your knowledge. IK tagged along. The lawyers’ movement came about as a result of dedicated top lawyers like Aitzaz Ahsan, Munir Malik, Ali Kurd, and so on—most of whom DO NOT support IK politically. How convenient for you to point out all of IK’s successes but none of his failures. Yes, he was successful in cricket; yes, he is successful with Shaukat Khanam (though it is certainly not the best hospital in Asia–again a bit of honesty would do you good). But politically, he has been a failure. In 1997, even a political novice should have known that if he wanted to win, he should have chosen one constituency, but he contested from nine and lost from all!
His political allies were people like Hamid Gul who have landed Pakistan in this terrorism mess. In 2002, he supported Musharraf. Some even say the military orchestrated his victory (though I personally do not buy that). But his voting record is not good–he voted for Fazlur Rehman as PM; voted against the women protection bill, and so on.
I love ur idocracy. U should try and go back to elementary school where they will read u a small story and tell u wat the main idea is because ur very slow on dat. its very hard for ur weak intellectuals to pick up the headline.. No where did i say dat IK started the movement. since u wanna spin around and dont wanna approve my challenge. LEts make it very simple for ur ignorant slow brain. I challenge u to prove to me dat any other politican before 1997(PTI’s Inception) pointed out that the main problem of this company is Judiciary. Imran Khan and PTI was the first leader and party to say Independent Judiciary was the answer to all problems in Pakistan. Put ur money where ur mouth is and stop spinning around the circle and prove me wrong.
I think you misunderstood my point. I am not absolving the PPP of any of its responsibility. You ask: Isn’t it the duty of the government to ensure the right people are appointed? My answer: Of course it is.
You ask: Isn’t it the duty of the government to kick out criminals? My answer: Of course it is.
You ask: Isn’t it the governments duty to ensure law and order? My answer: of course it is again.
The point is not that I think the PPP should be forgiven on any of this. The point is that I think the PPP must be taken to task on it. And who will take it to task? In a democracy, it is the job of the opposition. But the opposition is completely silent on issues of abuse of women’s rights and even on the appointments of Zehri and Bajrani. The only outrage came from women’s and human rights groups. Why is the opposition silent? In my view, because they couldn’t care less about abuse of women’s rights. The Afia Siddiqui case is highlighted by NS and IK (as it should be) but when it comes to the Baluch women or Tasleema Solangi, etc.—not a peep! Why? Just because the perpetrators aren’t American.
I think Kashif is quite right in that Arab sheikhdoms are responsible for a lot of human rights abuses on Pakistanis but nobody brings them up. Is it ok to be weak if the perpetrator is a Muslim and only show outrage when you are victimised by the west?
I will write to Kashif shortly and pejamistri shortly, when I have more time.
I am glad we are on same as far as identifying the problem. There are not many in Pakistan who thinks Arabs as problem at all. They blame Americans for everything and I think by doing this they are ignoring half of the root cause. I am not saying to criticise Arabs for lack of democracies or Indians or chinese for mistreating minorities. We are no one to identify problems accross the globe. But now that our house is on fire we should criticise Arabs for launching their political battles on our soil using their ptero-dollars and our blood. I don’t agree with your remain silent argument for political expediency. We can’t come out of this crisis unless public perception is changed. Our leadership on right and left should identify major players (Americans and Arabs) at their stakes. IK says the only solution is to pull our troops back and talk to militants, I think by doing this he is clearly siding with religious right. First of all it will never happen, if it does we will be in bigger mess like Afghanistan was after Russians. IK says we were not in this mess prior to 911 he is wrong. The mess started when Rusians attacked Afghanistan three decades ago. Americans exploited our religious sentiments against Russians and now Arabs are doing same against Americans. How long we sustain being puppits of external powers?
The first phase of this war (between Russia and America) was fought in main land Afghanistan and look at it now. Unfortuately the second phase (between Americans and Arabs) is being fought in main land Pakistan. I am afraid we won’t be much different by the time it will be over unless we are able to push both Americans and Arabs out to fight their wars else where on the globe.
All that say Imran Khan popularity is going no where. Here are the facts.
15 days campaign in Lahore- 150,000 members joined
15 days in rawalpindi- 58,000 members
8 days in Peshwar- 57,625 Members.
MNA of PPP Syed Manzoor Hussain joins PTI
Analyst Dr. Shireen Mazari joins PTI
Ejaz ul Haq rejected in the party
Tehreek e Insaf is the most popular party website in Pakistan.
17,378 members and counting.
For all those idiots that love PPP and MQM and PML-N if they were great parties they have ruled twice and thrice. Any organized and strong party can fix a country in two terms.
Zardari 2nd richest man in Pakistan. WHy cant he make hospitals and start projects like Sasta Tandoor for poor people like Imran Khan. Nawaz Sharif 4th richest. How much money have he spent for Pakistan.
You are just another brainwashed kid reading ISI sponsored Ahmed Qureshi’s emails mentioning NS and AZ as 2nd and 4th richest persons of Pakistan? Just open your eyes and you will find who are the real richest persons are.
About 2 terms thing, the water you have in taps, the little electricity you have in your house sockets and the gas running in your stove were the projects contributed during little 2 years governments of PPP and PMLN. The world class motorway, the airports of Lahore and Karachi, the port of Gawadar, the Honorable Nuclear state and foundation of modern basic infrastructure of country was laid down by PMLN and PPP. This is something you fan club guys just can’t understand.
Secondly, it is PURE STUPIDITY to think that someone failed within who did not complete even half of his term. Just like your teacher kick you out of class in 3rd month saying you failed the final exams which are 9 months ahead.
Now about the number of registrations, lets do a bet.
Tell me the NA and PA constituencies where PTI will win? Just tell me a few? If PTI win from there, I will give you $500 per constituency.
PMLN and PPP have got more than 150,000 votes each in many constituencies. Lahore has may more than 10 NA seats and even 500,000 combined votes for PTI from Lahore = 0 in opposed to PMLN. Outside urban areas, no one knows PTI.
“There are not many in Pakistan who thinks Arabs as problem at all. They blame Americans for everything and I think by doing this they are ignoring half of the root cause.”
I don’t think we should criticize anyone right now unless it is an urgent issue like f. ex. the genocide against the poor Palestinians. We should get order in our house first and after consolidating Pakistan we can think differently. In other words we have to PRIORITIZE our tasks! We MUST take one step at a time.
Arabs and The West:
We should have cordial relations with as many nations as possible, but we must not forget that our natural allies are Muslim countries (generally speaking). I know the Arabs are even a shadow of former glory, but still we share our values with them.
We should be cautious about to criticism on each and every issue. Arabs fighting in Pakistan are not sent by the governments of the Arab countries. They are even more scared from these Arab fighters than us. You must have noticed what happened in Algeria after the Afghan Jihad. Some of the Arab fighters went home and were engaged in a bloody fight with their own rulers. That is exactly what every Arab government fears. Thus they will never willingly send Arab fighters to Pakistan., so who will you complain to? It will be a India-like-complain (Mumbai attacks).
On the other hand we MUST be cautious regarding especially the western countries (EU+US+Israel). They are our traditional opponents. If you have lived in any of these countries you will now that they feel likewise though they don’t always say it openly. And once again that doesn’t mean that we shouldn’t try to build bridges between them and us. I am for peace, but if somebody wants trouble then we should always be ready to defend ourselves. That’s why we should start rebuilding ourselves!
Your point is well taken regarding the complexity and the necessity of the rural vote. But whether all parties rule from the centre is debatable. I think unfortunately, there is a tendency for every government that comes to power in Pakistan to swing right, regardless of whether it campaigns as a leftist or a rightist party–such is the power of the beardos as TK would say.
I don’t know if you recall, but in NS’s second term there was a Shariat bill awaiting confirmation just before Mush took over in 1999. Bhutto, who drank himself, outlawed alcohol and declared Ahmedis non-Muslim. Unfortunately, all segments left or right try to appease the beardos but the appeasement is a lot more potent when it comes to the parties preaching rightist rhetoric–and this is perhaps the most relevant when it comes to women’s issues. That is why it is so scary to hear the rightist rhetoric in the opposition, because I don’t think governance is from the centre. I think governance swings right in Pakistan in all cases. Both economically (post 1977) and in all other cases (even before 77).
As for NS and the rural vote, I don’t think NS has such a big issue there. In 1997, he got a two-thirds majority–that is impossible without carrying the rural vote. Rural Punjab is already with him. In 97, he was able to take the rural southern punjab out of the ppp fold. He can do this again if elections were held soon. I predict he will also gain in nwfp and baluchistan. In fact, the same IRI poll, that I referred to earlier, had him leading in the frontier ahead of ppp and anp now and just two points behind ppp in baluchistan. The only place where he cannot make inroads is sindh–he will have to rule without sindh, if elected.
@ kashif
I agree with much of what you say. But I don’t know if you have ever had the opportunity to meet IK and talk to him. Having done that, I am convinced that he will never come out on the side of the left, nor will he ever leave the shadow of the Jamaat, etc. I think that is in many ways where his heart is (playboy background notwithstanding). I agree with you that that is what he needs to do to distinguish himself, but that is not how he thinks, so I won’t hold my breath for it. And this is evident also from your very correct analysis on his take on the militant issue–he criticizes America for good reason–I am with him on that–but he will always stop short of criticizing the groups like TTP and the Fazlulahs of the world who want the nifaz of some crazy shariat–even if those groups hurt Pakistan, IK will never speak out against them. And that is where I have a huge issue with them.
@ ImranKhanforPM
I am going to ignore your childish accusations and get straight to the point regarding your “challenge”—I agree that IK always emphasized the judiciary in his early days. IK, in my view, is more of a political analyst than a political activist. When he is on tv, he presents analyses, but had the lawyers not come forth on 9 March and supported CJ Iftikhar, it would not have occurred to IK to chanelize this into a movement the way Aitzaz and co managed to do, and then it dawned on IK to follow them. IK had stopped talking about the judiciary in fact circa 2002–when he entered Parliament. He stressed the judiciary between 97 and 02. After 2002, his main complaint had been siding with the Americans on the war on terror. In that, when asked he also defended jirga decisions and said he thought that was a good enough system of justice. So, he is a very conflicted man. On the one hand, he talks about the importance of the judiciary. On the other hand, if a jirga decides something completely out of tune with the laws of Pakistan or groups in Swat call for doing away with Pakistani laws in favour of some weird concoction of sharia, IK has no problem. That is why he doesn’t have support among the legal intelligentsia–he does not know where he stands on most of these issues, or is too afraid to say. That is what a lot of people have pointed out on this forum already.
I guess by that definition, Abdus Sattar Edhi is also an enemy of Pakistan. FYI, way back when IK started politics, he tried to get Edhi to join him. Edhi kept refusing (not because he is not interested in politics–he has contested elections twice–won once and lost once–but he did not want to be a part of PTI)–Imran got rough with Edhi and Edhi filed a complaint against him–this happened back in the late nineties.
What does a short or long span of time have to do with this?? I have seen your response to Kashif, but I am with Kashif on this one.
And reading more from you, I don’t think anybody is saying that we should fight with other nations, or that we don’t share a religion with the Arabs–we do, but Saudi Arabai, for instance played a notoriously bad role in Pakistan by funding various jihadi groups, who as Kashif says, are using our soil. They have done the same thing in Palestine by supporting Fatah and in other parts of the Islamic world as well. By acknowledging these problems and addressing them intelligently, we are in no danger of losing friends in the arab world, in fact, we may even make some. Our policy of appeasing the rich gulf arabs and not bothering with the culturally rich and far more populous arabs of the levant and north africa is not something to be proud of.
don’t know if you recall, but in NS’s second term there was a Shariat bill awaiting confirmation just before Mush took over in 1999… and Bhutto outlawed alcohol and declared Ahmedi’s non-muslims
To me it is center-right or center-left governance… NS might have got shariat bill approved (I personally think it was pretty difficult), but even if shariat bill had approved in NS era it would have been more a political stunt to appease the right wing voters…
Bhutto banning alcohol was more like an appeasement of voters than in reality anything to do with his religious convictions… once I heard the argument :
When Jinnah talked about Muslims practicing their religion in Pakistan … it was in the context of Pakistan being predominantly a muslim population so they might sometimes frame laws based on religion… Like in Ireland Catholics have resisted changing abortion laws despite pressure from EU.
So in my opinion I don’t think there could ever be complete right wing rule in Pakistan… it will always be center-right or center-left…
2.
As for NS and the rural vote, I don’t think NS has such a big issue there
That’s right , after PPP, it was only NS who could swing rural voters in his favor, from R.Y. Khan , Bhawalpur to Rajunpur I know that there are several rural villagers which know NS more than the feudal lord… NS did manage to win the trust … IK has to do that.
Regarding your comments … “IK stressed the judiciary between 97 and 02″.
Let me remind everyone Kartoot of Imran Khan in 1999 and 2000.
In 1999, IK supported a mad dictator who axed all democratic system and kidnapped hundreds of elected public representatives.
In 2000 during Zafar Ali Shah case, SOB Musharraf sent a junior Army Kutta to house arrest Chief Justice Saeed uzzam Siddiqui and also fired other 17 superior judges including Justice Wajiuddin Ahmed at first PCO. All this was done while Imran Khan, the judicial champion was supporting SOB Musharraf.
@rasheed
Let me tell you, it is quite possible that if Kiyani or any other person again overthrows the current government and sends a colonel to house arrest Justice Sardar Raza (not Hamid DoGar) , IK might again support the new general for sometime…
But do answer me this…
What if IK takes a majority and somehow gets 2/3rd majority in the elections … wouldn’t he stand against the army??
My answer is yes… look at the history.
On the other hand current actions of IK are to go along with the mode of urban population (BTW another dimension has been added to this “urban sentiment” and it is the TV talk shows, naturally these talk shows are more right tilted) … however I am sure he is quite capable of dumping Jamaat-Islami when required.
These tv talk shows being right wing inclined have a new dimension to politics of Pakistan. Remember in the mad dictator’s era these talk show were not capable of helping one party (wing) or the other. As at that time they were solely focused against the dictatorship… however after the mad dictator’s era , the right-tilted talk shows are capable of making a complex impact on the politics of Pakistan… on one hand they may make the leaders (like IK) more rigid in their rightist stance , likewise they may also impact the rural population voters.
Good aspect is that they may perhaps impact the urban population and make them more “enlightened”…. watch for people like Shahid Masood, Mazhar Abbas, Hamid Mir and several others….
When I say Arabs I don’t mean their governments. The Arab militants in NWFP and Afghanistam are those who are against their governments. They have a political mission to over throw pro-west regimes in Arab world. They are working towards this mission by launching a war against west. I don’t judge them they can do what ever they want but why are they doing it from Pakistan? This is because we being a muslim nation don’t stand against Arabs as long as they are fighting against Americans. This is wrong they can do what ever they want as long as they don’t do it from Pakistan. And since they are doing it from Pakistan we are the biggest victim of this war between west and non-state Arabs. It is our war we ought to own it to win it. Right wing leaders like IK should stop right wing propoganda that it is not our war.
I think you are babbling with nothing substantial at all.
When Musharraf came in 1999, everyone supported and welcomed with open arms. All parties supported him including PPP and PML (PML so much so that they half of them dumped Nawaz and created another group), JI, MQM, ANP and you name it. Poeple openly distributed sweets and prayed thankful nafals. Human rights champion Asma Jahangir supported him too. So it should not come as surprise that IK went along too. But he is the only politician who have openly accepted his mistake and moved on.
Regarding PPP and PML governments, God knows they were utterly incompetent, inefficient and corrupt. PPP ruling fourth time and PML ruled twice already, if any good were ever to come out of these parties or if they had any revolutionary agenda whatsoever, dont you think it would have been applied by now? Just how many times you need to be kicked before you wake up.
“What does a short or long span of time have to do with this??”
I think I was pretty clear on this issue. Maybe I need to elaborate further ..
It is strange that you don’t understand that we cannot take on the whole world right now. I have already stated that in principle @Kashif is right, but we have to look at the ground realities right now. We are drowning in sh!t and cannot afford to make more opponents/enemies. That is exactly what will happen if we start criticizing everybody. Right now we need to make as many friends as possible, but at the same time we need to get rid of the most threatening issues like the drones attacks, unrest in NWFP, tensions with India, the energy crisis, the judiciary crisis etc.. Don’t you see we have both hands full of sh!t? And still you ask for more trouble? When we have order in OUR house we can put pressure on others to perform, but we better perform first
“but Saudi Arabai, for instance played a notoriously bad role in Pakistan by funding various jihadi groups, who as Kashif says, are using our soil.”
Yes in that era the Saudis played a significant role, but remember it was all due to our own incompetent leadership. I also think that the Saudis regretted that support, because it backfired in their own country too, but there is no doubt that Pakistan suffered most. We shouldn’t have made our soil as battle ground during the Zia regime like it happened. IMO measures should have been taken to counter the Russian/Indian moves from Afghanistan, but not the way our army managed it. We got weapons and drugs all over Pakistan, because of the short sighted “solutions” of the GHQ and the following leadership or rather leadersh!t. If anybody is to be blamed for the policies of that era then it is foremost the Zia regime including political allies like PML. Wasn’t NS the “child” of Zia?
“They have done the same thing in Palestine by supporting Fatah and in other parts of the Islamic world as well.”
Are you saying that it is the governments of the Arab countries who support the present foreign fighters in Pakistan?
I fully agree with you. But I am not going to take a chance with IK or ABCD who even slightly thinks about supporting any General against civilian for the sake of “Good Democracy” later.
The only way forward I believe is that every political party should educate its followers that all civilians should come out and stay on streets until the general goes back where he belongs. We can sort out all other problems with passage of time.
You are talking about fairy tales and you have no solution. As I said above, just give me list of few National and Provincial constituencies from where PTI will win and I will give you $500 for each seat won.
Talking about previous government, if army had let the civilian government control just the “Budget” of Pakistan, you would see the same governments would have changed the face of Pakistan. Can you tell me if Army is eating 50-60% of resources of country, can IK to stop that budget when he comes with even 2/3rd mandate without getting hanged by an army general? Even today during civilian government, the licenses of TV channels have to be approved by army before civilian government can issue that.
@rasheed
Q. Do you know why do politicians (the real ones) may fall in dictatorships trap?
A. Just like the “urban educated” population falls in the same trap…
Now I am not sure whether leaders should teach the public or public should teach the leaders to come out on street when a general comes…. however what I am sure is that the both (public and leaders) are learning at the same pace…
I agree with your point that until and unless people come out on street as soon as a General comes in our problems are not going to be solved…
Remember 2000, there was a hope in the beginning when people of Lahore started a struggle against the mad dictator in his early era (however unfortunately it vanished into thin air)… but later on for whole 5 years there was “chain hee chain” in his rule … Compare it to any democratic rule in Pakistan … how early unrest starts …
What fairy tales are you referring to? Political parties supported Musharraf initially or the failure of their governments?
The only way to put army to its place is by riding on people support. The only way to cut that budget is to cut the non-development expenses of governments and then asking the army to sacrifice in greater good of the poeple. You cant expect army to cut down if you take 250 of your friends on Umrah and hold cabinet meetings in Dubai. The only way to reduce army influence is to restor Judiciary and let the cheif of army staff appear before IMC to answer for missing people.
My point is start with yourself and Army and other institution will follow suit. It is the very credibility of the civilian leaders which gives Army the courage to stand on its legs.
Let me ask you a hypothetical question, If Iftikhar Chaudhary is restored and he calls Kiyani to appear in court, do you think he will refuse?
” When I say Arabs I don’t mean their governments. The Arab militants in NWFP and Afghanistam are those who are against their governments. They have a political mission to over throw pro-west regimes in Arab world. They are working towards this mission by launching a war against west. I don’t judge them they can do what ever they want but why are they doing it from Pakistan? This is because we being a muslim nation don’t stand against Arabs as long as they are fighting against Americans. This is wrong they can do what ever they want as long as they don’t do it from Pakistan. And since they are doing it from Pakistan we are the biggest victim of this war between west and non-state Arabs. It is our war we ought to own it to win it.”
Thanks for your clarification. We have no differences on the above description
“Right wing leaders like IK should stop right wing propoganda that it is not our war.”
BUT, here we disagree. The case is that PTI’s view is that the way the war is fought right now is NOT OUR war. The drone attacks on arbitrary targets, killing of innocent tribesmen and subsequent suicide bombings etc. All that is NOT OUR war! We need to ensure that the Americans stop attacking anybody inside Pakistan, and we need make peace with the overwhelming majority of the Pakistan loving tribesmen. We need to continue the Jirga system, but this should only be temporary solution. The long term solution should be to implement the law of the land all over Pakistan!
Then what is our war? Our war is against the very few criminals/collaborators/foreign elements creating unrest and trouble for Pakistan. As earlier mentioned we need to make peace with vast majority of the tribesmen and thus isolate and eliminate the threat from the disruptive elements.
Can you tell me if Army is eating 50-60% of resources of country, can IK to stop that budget when he comes with even 2/3rd mandate without getting hanged by an army general?
How true… but let me tell you I had the same ideas about NS in 1999 (Nobody can claim to be in Military’s good book than NS during 90’s) … but you see with a 2/3rd mandate how he was able to snub two army generals one after the other and did not bow to them….. I think IK is quite capable of doing the same.
BTW Tell me this how many parties are going to compete for the right wing vote , NS, IK and religious parties ? or would they be getting together against PPP/ANP?
The only way to put army to its place is by riding on people support. The only way to cut that budget is to cut the non-development expenses of governments and then asking the army to sacrifice in greater good of the poeple. You cant expect army to cut down if you take 250 of your friends on Umrah and hold cabinet meetings in Dubai.
Because army is more corrupt than you and your friends… if you can take 250 of your friends for Umrah , army will buy ranches in Texas and California for 250 general/brigadiers/colonels of the army…. if you throw away your opponents in jail, army will bomb their opponents (Bugti eh?)…
So you want a match between army and politicians … go and bring the most corrupt of your politicians and army will defeat them
I think you guys are just being paranoid, projecting Army in such terms. Yes, there have been few rogue Generals but all in all Pak army is still the most patriot force in the country.
Going by your arguments, one can easily create same logics about USA role in Pakistan i.e. Always supporting dictators, funding them to the teeth, forcing its own ideas about terrorism, Jihad, enlightment on Pakistan, threatening Pakistan whenever necessary. So one can easily ceate questions like what IK or any other leader going to do as USA is too powerful. You cannot claim missing people, you cannot pull out of War on Terror which is basically destruction of Pakistan economically, militarily, politically and eventually geographically. So my friends it is very easy to throw all your problems on a non political force or to an outsider and keep moaning about it.
Failure of Democracy in Pakistan is down to the failure of so called democratic leaders, plain and simple!!!
The fairy tale I am referring to is that people assuming someone like IK can come to power.
Even stupid MQM, JUI, JI, ANP, has deeper roots in constituency politics than IK. There is no PTI party member that anyone knows of other than IK himself, and local voters hardly vote to someone who they have never of. Tell me what can IK do even if miraculously wins 10, 20 or even 30 seats? That will become a prostitute party like MQM and JUI, who join whoever gets more seats. If they stay alone, they have no powers for legislation and will be banging desks for 5 years.
Now calling PPP and PMLN stupid etc etc is not going to change anything as they are not going anywhere, rather time has proven they come back after dictatorship even stronger. The rotten eggs from these big parties will be filtered with passage of time through public accountability in case impatient kids like you let it run and don’t cheer when unconstitutional things happen.
It is a good point you raised about corruption in army, that’s exactly I wanted to bring in discussion next. Can you please answer the following question for me?
1. According to Rasheed and I have read your posts in past as well that 60% of Pakistan budget goes to army and the rest 40% for the other areas. Assuming that’s true, I can list down the improvements in army arsenel from 60 years ago to now and no one can deny we have got nuclear bombs, mesilies, submarines, fighter planes and god knows what else using the above 60 percent. My question is can you point me to any visible improvements in education, health, development etc, bring about using the rest of 40%?????
My point is have politicians made optimal use of their 40% to want to get more share. As far as I am concerned this lion share of the budget just goes down the drain without making any effect on Pakistan or ends up in foreign bank accounts.
Man, how do you want me to tighten my belt if you with your share are making merry, ceating examples of corruption never seen or heard before? When it comes to sacrifice the rule is leader starts with himself.
Lastly, I am no group, I am just a concerned Pakistani.
I think you are writing IK off a little too early. There are enough examples in the history to make this statement, Not least of that is the rise of Muslim League in Pakistan movement. ML won only one seat in 1930s, prompting Gandhi to challenge Jinnah to prove his representation of Muslim community and what a befitting reply he gave in 1940s. Then Butto started off with no party or constituency and proved himself. Mahatir Muhammad took nearly two decades to succeed.
Regarding your point about filtering down of bad people in these two parties, actually the process is exactly the opposite. Look at PPP, can you name even a single good person in the party now? And PMLN is already on the verge of accepting Lotas of PMLQ, just wait and see. They are going from bad to worse.
Sorry for being late though i think not much is needed to reply as thanks to Kashif he has been answering all you queries.
And after all of that discussion i did not think you would again tell us that innocents are being killed by americans.
The only good thing about drone attacks by America is that not a single hit has killed an innocent. Keep going back and you will find militants killed in each and every attack and the attacks are getting better and better in precision. The last few attacks have hit the vehicles carrying militants. Alqaeda’s top militants have been hit by american drones constantly.
Regarding those 70 children killed, yes i don’t know what they had been doing in the past but i have no doubt over what they would have been doing right now. Majority of the suicide blasts are done by teenagers. What do you think were those kids doing in that madrassa ? They were recieving military training in that madrassa and pictures of them training in that madrassa were all over the media immediately after the attack. I am sorry for them and consider our army, the mulvis, and bastards arabs for that.
I don’t think you did not know all this but since you like imran has your head in the sand (intentionally or unintentionally), therefore we have our duty to keep you reminding you the truth which is quite irritating.
What do you think will be the reaction of people of Swat if that drone hits fazlullah tomorrow ? ? ? ? ?
So accoding to you PTI does not oppose war against extremists it is only against mechanism the way it is conducted. PTI and right wingers want two things:
1. Push Americans out of the region
2. Want to talk to militants
Great goals but please tell me how can we achieve them. Americans won’t leave the region until militants agree that they won’t attack Americans and militants won’t commit that until they have the capibility to attack them in other words until they are destroyed. Pakistan doesn’t have political or military resources to convince either side. We have no choice but to fight against militants or Americans. I am sure who ever comes in power will pick the former. We simply don’t have military and economic resources to fight against west and remaining neautral is not an option to begin with.
“So accoding to you PTI does not oppose war against extremists it is only against mechanism the way it is conducted. PTI and right wingers want two things:
1. Push Americans out of the region
2. Want to talk to militants
I don’t care about right or left wing tags Btw: These tags are slowly being diminished in those countries, where they were invented or at least used extensively.
“Great goals but please tell me how can we achieve them. Americans won’t leave the region until militants agree that they won’t attack Americans and militants won’t commit that until they have the capibility to attack them in other words until they are destroyed. Pakistan doesn’t have political or military resources to convince either side. We have no choice but to fight against militants or Americans. I am sure who ever comes in power will pick the former. We simply don’t have military and economic resources to fight against west and remaining neautral is not an option to begin with.”
That is exactly my opinion – as a starting point i.e. we should not fight against the Allied gang, BUT at the same time we cannot continue remaining neutral.
I think I already had me clear. Please also be aware that I am not any office holder in PTI, so I can only speak for myself
- We have to convey a serious message to the Americans and not the usual double talks i.e. one message for the Americans and another for the people of Pakistan.
- If the Americans don’t stop their attacks, we need to stop the supply lines through our country as the first step.
- National as well as international pressure on EU/US. Use all diplomatic means!
- We should strengthen our alliance with all possible friendly nations. We MUST especially improve our ties with China and Iran and maybe also with Russia since the latter is slowly loosing its old ally India to the US.
- If the above steps don’t help, then we should shoot down any drones over Pakistani territory! I don’t think step three would be necessary. When they know our intentions i.e. we mean business then they will not risk opening yet another front after Iraq, Afghanistan.
- We should be more careful about inflicting human loss, but it can be necessary if they step inside our country repeatedly.
I would prefer to go down bravely instead of a slow death like Saddam Hussain and Iraq got. You must remember how the Americans successfully disarmed and weakened Iraq before they went in. The Americans used all the tricks to make their job easier and that is exactly what is going on regarding Pakistan. Maybe they would have done it even if they didn’t weaken and disarmed Iraq, but then they at least would have met a little more resistance. We should NOT think we can hide the head in a ostrich like way to avoid the dangers.
So that does solves the problem. You have got america as your enemy, we have got militants as our enemy in FATA and NWFP. You wan’t to stop drone attacks we want the drone attacks to remove the terror infrastructure that has ruined our society. You have your strategic objectives in which these militants are helping you and that is to throw out america from the region, but we don’t want to burn our houses for YOUR strategic objectives. I think if PTI is sincere enough, then Imran khan should open a Militants Welfare Colony in Islamabad and take away you strategic allies to Islamabad alongwith those thousands of training camps. We don’t want your arab/chechen/uzbek allies alongwith the homegrown militants OUT of our lands. Accept them and have them in your houses.
Lets be realistic if we have extremists in our region who are plotting attacks against west how long can we stop west not to take action against those. Americans have respected our soverignty thats why they didn’t chase militants within our borders. Drone attacks are bad but in the bid picture they are nothing. They basically target some militants that our military is targeting as well. Drone attacks are wrong but so are the militants in tribal region. I think former is lesser of the evil. The guys running our President, PM, COAS na dother important offices are approved by white house and Pentagon. Our war strategies are devised by them. So I don’t know why drone attacks flips you out. Your claim that you ‘d rather die soon than finish gradually is emotional. As a statesman you ‘d never explore extinction route. Look at our economy, unemoployment is on sharp rise, we are in a very serious energy crisis, we are going thru a war against militants. We just simply can not afford to flip the direction of that war against Americans. I know right wing is dying to see that but it is simply not an option. It ‘d be much much bigger chaos and a recipe of total destruction.
Great views by Imran Khan. He understands the problems faced by Pakistan and people. He is a real leader who can provide real leadership to Pakistan.
Hard hitting facts from PTI.
What concerns me is the security of IK and other sincere/honest/capable politicians like f. ex. Saad Rafique, Javed Hashmio etc.
When the Trojan Horses gets the nod from their foreign masters they will not be reluctant to eliminate IK. I’m afraid he will only be allowed to be a part of the political “game” as long as he doesn’t have a significant number of seats in the parliament. The day the Yankees consider him as a threat they will not hesitate to assassinate him just as they have done with numerous other non-cooperative leaders like ZAB (indirectly by Zia d0g), BB (by Moshe d0g and maybe AZ) etc. or maybe something like the overthrowing of a truly democratically elected government could happen like in Iran in 1953, where a democratic government led by Mohammad Mossadegh was overthrown by CIA.
My appeal to all Pakistan loving people is that they should ensure that no sincere/honest politician gets hurt regardless of their political affiliation. It is perfectly all right to have a different political view, but it is NOT acceptable that anyone collaborates with foreign powers (enemies of Pakistan).
Everytime I hear him, I develop a hope for my country.
He is a living legend.
I could not disagree with any argument that he raised during his 48 minutes talk.
You are the “Leader” IK i specially like quotations and facts u quote from history to prove ur points which shows ur knowledge and interest to solve problems, you r not a “jahil” like other Politicians.
Any body can tell that u wanna be a true”Leader”,u r not after “kursi” like nawaz,Mr.10%,fazlu,altaf,asfandyar and BB so called “shaheed” who know nothing about politics,who even dream about “kursi”.
We know u ve pain for this nation,IK may Allah(swt)protect u.Prayers of millions of muslims are with u.God bless u.
Excellent program! Somehow this seems to be the most informative show on Aaj’s line-up …
I wish Nadim Malik had put Imran Khan on the spot when he was going on about the “destruction of institutions” and asked why exactly there is no internal democracy in the PTI itself?
Other than that, Imran Khan raised good points. I wish he would really organize his party on democratic lines and not become a clone of every other party in Pakistan organization wise.
That and he should cut down on the right-leaning-tilt …. At times he sounds like Qazi Imran Khan when he starts chanting “Pakistan = Islam kay naam par” … Oy Vey!
bravo! imran spoke with startling candor, only if he can translate it into reality.
This nation is starving for honest and genuine leadership.
Assalam-o-Alaikum,
I am 100% agree with Imran Khan. If not all majority of the elected politicians are not playing positive role in the present democrative system of Pakistan.
People of Pakistan need revolutionary change and that is only possible if the voters of Pakistan elect new leadership from the class like Imran Khan.
Thousands of political minded people living abroad can come back and run for election who are highly educated, hardworking, intelligent, cincere and devoted but who is going to vote them … for the change.
Pakistan as a nation lost many talented individuals in last 30 years, who left the motherland in extreme pressure due to political victimisations, dictatorships, religious and secterian problems converted this region a battle ground and a experimental lab for long period of time.
I was a strong supporter of PPP but after assasination of Mohtarma Benazir Bhutto Sahiba, poor performance of the new leadership take over PPP change my view point to support them when they are not following the Benazir Bhutto Sahiba’s last will and political advices.
I am really shifting from PPP to PTI because of Imran Khan’s political direction
he is carrying from last few years constantly to provide strong new leadership to Pakistan.
We need Imran Khan as a Prime Minister. But the important thing is… can he stay on his words, or he will also change like other politicians,if he got power.
PAKISTANI VOTERS NEED A GREAT LEADER.
Shaukat Khanum Trust is working as an organisation & I hope his efforts do bear fruit in politics too by making PTI a successful political organisation of same kinna as Shaukat Khanum Trust. God bless you for your fearless sincerety & honesty.
@Hameed Ch.
“We need Imran Khan as a Prime Minister. But the important thing is… can he stay on his words, or he will also change like other politicians,if he got power.”
Check and balance….Let everyone work according to the limits given in the law of the land. Imran Khan should NOT be an exemption. If anything like that happens then the whole idea about PTI i.e. insaaf will b lost. It is my conviction that it will not happen, inshallah.
Btw: This land was created in the name of Islam and for Muslims, and we should stick to this cause. To make it clear; I am not advocating a theocratic state, God forbid. The Mullahs of today can make it eve worse.
SKMH is really a jewel in the company of mud and stones.
IK efforts in sports, health and education are superb.
I wish him success organizing his party on democratic principles, staying away from fundamentalism.
what IK always stress upon is that there should be an independent and strong judcial system which can check the performance of the government from top to bottom and which can keep a check on all the institutions.when ur judges will be independent then
1) no 1 will dare to become Mr 10%.
2) no 1 will sign NRO.
3) no 1 will dare to impose marshal law.
4) there will be law and order in the country.
5) investors will invest in ur country.
6) overseas pakis will keep their money in pakistani banks.
7) rich and poor will enjoy equal freedom and rights.
8)institutions like police will not dare to take bribe.
9) no 1 will dare to hide his assets and save the tax.
Nations stand on justice and where there is no justice there is law of the jungle.
In the west politicians and other heads of institutions doesn t came from heaven,its their system which don t allow them to misuse their power.they know they are answerable to the court.
In Pakistan we need to get rid of this system where might is right.
I strongly feel that now two politicians should be given chance…. Imran Khan and Qazi Hussain. Before any one reminds me that Qazi Hussain has already been tried under the banner of MMA—–then you are totally wrong. It was Maulana Diesel who betrayed Qazi Saheb and behind scenes He(Diesel Wala) was collaborating with Gen Musharraff. So please be realistic if there is any hope then it is ONLY AND ONLY Qazi Hussain and Imran Khan.
Regarding security of Imran Khan, I would say equally important is the security of Qazi Hussain. I am not bothered about the security of Maulana Diesel, Asfandyar Wali, (AYW) Zardari and MQM ‘Bhatta Collector’.
But here I would like to say one thing with full knowledge and awareness and that is— IF GOD FORBID GOD FORBID GOD FORBID any thing happens to Imran Khan our stupid,illeterate and Jahil AWAM will not take any notice at all. In reality our Jahil AWAM wants Zardari, yes they want Zardari, yes Awam wants PPP, they don’t want anything, our Stupid Awam just want Zardari, they don’t want Gas. Electricity, Oil, Water. And if Zardari remains in power and there are mid-term elections, except few seats in Karachi for MQM, believe me PPP will WIN on all seats. Why I am saying this……and before anyone comments….please watch these protests which are going on these days against Gas and Electric Load shedding. Watch carefully these protests are only for the non-availability of Gas and Electricity and they are not aimed at Zardari. The protestors are NOT demanding construction of Kala Bagh Dam project. Because PPP’s Raja Parvaiz Ashraf has already said that the construction of Kala Bagh Dam project has been halted completely. If Zardari decides to contruct Kala Bagh Dam, then He will lose support of ANP in Senate elections and also if there is no-confidence motion then again He will need support of ANP. Also the ‘puttar’ of Wali Khan and ‘pota’ of Ghaffar Khan knows that the contstrucion of Kala Bagh Dam means political death for ANP. As part of NRO deal it was agreed by Shaheeeeeeeeed Benazir that she will not insist on the construction of Kala Bagh Dam. It is our great misfortune that even MQM and ANP fully supported PPP and Benazir was vey canny in realizing that in order to keep support of MQM, ANP and Maulana Diesel she has to oppose Kala Bagh Dam. Yes it is our basic right that we should have Gas, Oil and Electricity. But who brought us to this situation, it was that idiot Benazir.
Even in his both tenures Nawaz Sharif did try to start Kala Bagh Dam project and he did offer some lucrative posts and benefits to Wali Khan but when Nawaz Sharif asked for Kala Bagh Dam project, he refused to cooperate. Then with all his bad habits even Musharraff tried to get the public opinion in favour of Kala Bagh but it was Benazir who got sudden support from MQM and ANP. Believe me the general public wants contruction of Kala Bagh Dam and other Nuclear projects but it is the politicians and particularly Benazir who is directly responsible for this catastrophic situation.
I am surprised that why people don’t talk about Kala Bagh project and even if someone says to start small Dam projects, then don’t be fooled even a small project takes several years to built. There should also be long term planning in the shape of Kala Bagh Dam. I got the feeling that some of these protests are actually organized by Zardari, because I do not hear chants like……GO ZARDARI GO, WHO KILLED BENAZIR, GIVE US THE NAME OF KILLER OF BENAZIR, CONSTRUCT KALA BAGH DAM. There is something fishy in these protests.
—–
I make this humble appeal to our Sindhi Brothers and Sisters for God sake DON’T BLINDLY VOTE PPP. Althouth track record of Nawaz Sharif is not good either but Bhutto family has ruined our country.
Only 10 days ago nearly one million people attended Benazir’s anniversary. What for, why did you people go there? Was there a need for national holiday? When you people got time to go to Larkana for anniversary then why are you people now crying for Gas and Electricity. And again I beg to our Sindhi Brothers and Sisters that if you people do not want to vote for Qazi Hussain then our only choice is Imran Khan, Yes Imran Khan.
Remember, Benazir and Zardari gave us NRO and PPP has never given us anything and they are going to do NOTHING. Their team is full of duffers and idiots.
Come on Pakistanis—-forget the past of Imran Khan….we all make mistakes….give Imaran Khan a chance. He is the only hope. Otherwise don’t cry about shortage of Gas
and Electricity and good luck with baqiat of Benazir……..Mr Madari.
For the sake of our friends in PTI and for the sake of Pakistan…
Let us just hope Imran Khan doesn’t get hit by a Bedford Truck (GOD FORBID!) because that will be THE END of Pakistan Tehreek-e Insaf.
I don’t mean to troll, but this is exactly how I feel and it is a genuine fear of mine.
prayers of millions of muslims will protect him InshahAllah, just like Quaid-e-Azam.
Those who believe there is no democracy in PTI, PTI is holding election in april 2009, so lets get the facts straight before talking. The process for the elections has already started.
[...] January 3, 2009 — nadeemmalik ISLAMABAD TONIGHT: Islamabad Tonight – 2 January 2009 Category Islamabad Tonight | Posted on January 2, 2009 | 11 Comments Read More Imran Khan in this [...]
@Ghost Of TK
You have just concluded one thing without giving any reason for your conclusion.
Are you trying to say that IK is not reaching out to people? & if so then what you think that he should do.
And its WE who make someone hero or zero in politics thru OUR vote. And its OUR responsibilty to ask OURSELVES to vote for honest people & spread the same message to the others too.
Not the other way round that HONEST people should beg to us for our vote & if they are doing so its simply their greatness that we can never never understand.
@Ghost of TK
i know you can not see the people praising Imran Khan and cursing your favourite so-called leaders Zardari and Altaf bhai.
I can only smile on your illogical comments
dont worry God will protect Imran Khan. and one more thing, if you have not read the history then read it before giving comments and find out the reason why Pakistan came into existence. If we all were hindu then there was no point having seperate country.
@Asif,
you are right Asif, HONEST people should not beg for votes and if they are doing so its their greatness…..AND….we can never understand. And thats why Asif, I call our AWAM stupid,Jahil and illeterate. Once again I appeal our beloved Brothers and Sisters of Sind, don’t blindly vote for PPP,
ask Baaaaaaaaaaaaaji Naheed Khan—who is the killer of Benazir? who is killer of Murtaza Bhutto, Why Zardari is not giving out name of Benazir’s killer. Why Zardari is not restoring Ch Iftikhar?
Come-on my Sindhi Sain Lok…..wake up !!!!!
@ shafi
i ve nominated another israieli agent and a true jiyala for 3rd bb shaheed NRO memorial award ,plz go and present the award to Mr Awais @ http://pkpolitics.com/2009/01/02/discuss-energy-crisis/#comments
@ ali4ASAT SHAFI
Stop giving certificate of patriotism.
Convince people with logic.
There may be some Indians on this forum trying to be pakistanis, try to convince them with logic and show them the truth.
By the way people gave verdict like KAFIR E AZAM to Jinnah sahib
Cheers
@ Mohammad Usman
do u think jiyalas like u understand logics? nop i don t think so.so its better to appriciate ur efforts for ppp by presenting ur NRO memorial award.
another achievement by ur Mr.10%
Mumtaz Bhutto arrested on an FIR of newspaper editor. what u gonna say about this achievement?
A tribute to Mr. Zardari:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=szP_C2NaiSw
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=85bGEtXqDlc&feature=related
another one
@ImranKhanforpm:
I like IK but like Ghost, I am not convinced that PTI has a proper democratic structure.
When the democrats and republicans held their elections for choosing their presidential candidates, the whole world saw it. There were long debates between the candidates and the entire process was transparent.
When the PTI holds proper elections with debates between candidates, and those debates are put on-line on PTI’s website or youtube, noone will be able to say that PTI is not a democratic party. Untill then, your claims aren’t going to convince many people.
i feel sorry to post this but this is the truth we can t ignore. this governor of ppp has made governor house a “bar” for drinking.
how openly a muslim governor is drinking and his son enjoying with females.
sharam bhi nahi aati in kamino ko.
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=B-fXtS8xT48&feature=related
Some body needs to explain Imran Khan that after Benazir there is a political vaccum in Pakistan but its on the left and center left. Nawaz Sharif is still very popular on right and center right. All his rehotric on political issues is targeted to right wing. But unfortunately religious right has Nawaz Sharif and they are very satisfied with him. After Zardari everyone can see Nawaz Sharif will be next PM. For Imran to succeed he needs to target PPP’s vote bank. To do that he needs to come from the left. If he keeps speaking like Qazi and Nawaz Sharif I don’t know how he will develop roots in masses.
Somebody raised here a concern about IK’s security. My friend he is a spokesman of religious right who can possibly target him, may be MQM and that too when they think he is viable political threat. At this point he doesn’t need to waste money on security guards.
@ali4asat
It will be my privelege to give this award to Mr Awais.
But, Ali Sahib, could you please be careful when you give these awards……because these are really ‘hard earned’ awards. You really have to be very staunch supporter of Bhutto Shaheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeed family.
So may I suggest that in the first instance you please send Mr Awais a Rs10 coin, with the picture of BB Shaheeeeeeeed.
Listen if you will appreciate people with Rs10 coin……our Jahil Awam will say Wah kia baat hai, Mr 10% ne Rs10 coin banaia hai. Now you see the Maths become very easy and the equation is like this
Mr10% = Rs10
@ Mohd Usman
Let me tell you, I am not an Indian posing as a Pakistani. I am 100% Pakistani and I even attended the public meetings of ZABhutto in 1970 and saw and judged that Man closely. Bhutto was a truly wicked and a cunning person, who really knew how to play with the sentiments of the poor public. I was even in that meeting in Feb 1971 in Nishtar Park, Karachi when Bhutto asked the crowd to raise their hands
for the release of Sheikh Mujib urRehman. My instant reaction was, Oh no this big decision should only be done by the Parliament.
yes, only free Judiciary and Parliament can make big decisions.
@shafi
right! i will take care be4 nominating next time.
as our awards are are just political awards they are not a hadith so we don t ve to worry. take the award back and give him 10 rs coin on behalf of mr. 10 % . jayals should be treated in the same manner as they are treating us !
Why was the desperate plea from Sawat: “Why aren’t the security forces protecting us from the Taliban?” nicely sidelined and never answered?
@resident eveil
just beacuse we ve a tattu army general MR. pervez kayani which is busy obeying orders from USA.
yeh sare “pervez” tattu aur besharam he hote hain kya?
aik tha”pervez”musharraf aur aik hai “pervez” kiyani.
aik aur hai “haqani”aur aik hai yusuf raza “gillani”.
yeh sare k sare salay “imported tattu hain Japani”.
@GoTK
“Let us just hope Imran Khan doesn’t get hit by a Bedford Truck (GOD FORBID!) because that will be THE END of Pakistan Tehreek-e Insaf.”
I think the above maybe was directed at my comments. You know that “Bedford Truck” is the Israeli/Yankee/Hindu nexus….The true”axis of evil” (IMO). You must have noticed that I mentioned a few other non-PTI names too. I fear for every honest and competent leader. Any of these will be a thorn in the eyes of the above gang. Why was BB assassinated? Did it have something to do with deviating from the original “axis of evil” plan. She maybe initially agreed on the plan and later realized or had planned to not to act as a Trojan Horse?
Apart from that, I think you are right about PTI and IK. Right now IK is the undisputed face of PTI. I hope others will join, but fail to see where those known persons would come from, because a major part of these people ARE corrupt. We need to see totally new faces and you are going to see the faces after an election (if they are elected). Nobody wants unknown faces in their programs – regardless of capability. A good example is that you see numerous incompetent people from PPP just because they are famous…Fauzia Wahab….Incompetent and sorry to say DUMB!
“I don’t mean to troll, but this is exactly how I feel and it is a genuine fear of mine.”
I don’t know why you are being sarcastic. Maybe you are not realizing that we have been infiltrated to an extent that it is very hard to find a way out. Do you find any comfort in MQM, PML-Q, JUI-F, ANP or PPP? I am sorry to say that each and every of these parties are either fully or partially, directly or indirectly working for foreign masters.
This is why a leader is called leader,likewise a brother left a comment that he can not disagree even with onle singli point.
A leader is one whose vision is higher than the others.And Imran have got all and everything.Vision+Knowlede+sincerety+and most of all Hoensty.
Lets all of we change the Paksitan.If People of Paksitan are suffering today,I belive this is what we seeded.We get once in 5 year time that Whose is good and bad for the this country,According to Dr Safdar Mehmood after voting when you go for sleep just be honest with yourself by making witness Allaha say to youself if you voted for a person who is good for this nation or to landlord who could be notrous in the world by Mr 10% or another one whose spuouse is not a Prime minister of PAk may be Mr 1%.
But in the 2007 election the answer in most case shall be no I bet.night Before election every paksitani is Chief justice iftikhar,Make a good dicission.Or make a bad dicission and expect no more than what we are having today.
Pakistani youth go ahead Help imran to help this country,You ,ll make a difference Inshallaha
oh my God listen to mr jataoi in
http://pkpolitics.com/2009/01/03/siyasi-log-3-january-2009/
he is saying “hum log bijli khatam kar dein gay”
excellent my great leader we are really proud of you imran . God bless you and INSHALAH we are with you
hi everyone
please watch everyone syasi log today and check how jathi of ppp behave
@Shirkuh: “You know that “Bedford Truck” is the Israeli/Yankee/Hindu nexus…”
No, I really meant the actual truck.. as in a traffic accident.
Also, I disagree with the line of reasoning that “there aren’t enough ‘famous’ people in the party” … I really don’t know what that’s supposed to mean.
Because it is not ‘famous’ people but a dedicated organization consisting of sincere and dedicated workers/leaders that runs a party.
And why is it that PTI can’t just elect those who actually believe in the party rather than waiting around for some ‘famous’ or “the right kind” of people?
Bhutto made the exact same mistake. People still are gaga over People’s Party of 1970 and not the party of 1976 when he sold out and basically reverted back to his aristocratic roots and gave tickets to ‘big names’ …
It is the memory of common people getting party tickets which made the People’s Party of 1970 legend (still IMO) in people’s minds.
So, if the party is about ‘insaaf’ and there is a dedicated group of people (I have no doubt this group exists in PTI because I see them defending on various forums) then ‘haath kangan ko aarsi…” … and get on with it.
It’s been ten years, why the elections now? I still have a bad taste in my mouth since the last years UK fiasco when IK just appointed some chick (I’m sure she’s very talented but she should have been elected) … and at that time I was seriously considering donating to PTI and taking part… but that was a turn off for me.
anyways… I think the party is in danger because even something not so evil like a traffic accident (god forbid!!!) could make the party go into serious political/identity/leadership crisis.
And guess who will be the vultres descending on the party apparatus then to take control of this dedicated group of people to USE for some of their nefarious purposes? THE AGENCIES! Yup… they’ll be in like flynn.
A democratic culture and a system of checks and balances is the biggest defense against hostile actors like ISI-Political-Wing or whatever. ANC did it, AIC did it, Sinn-Fein did it, why can’t PPP, PML-N and PTI do it?????
@GoTK
I don’t disagree with you on the issue about democracy within the party. If we really want to develop true democratic culture, then we need to start from the root level – otherwise we will fail – not only the political parties, but also as a nation. The root level doesn’t only start from democratic parties, but it also starts from various kinds of clubs, unions etc.
“And why is it that PTI can’t just elect those who actually believe in the party rather than waiting around for some ‘famous’ or “the right kind” of people?”
Maybe I didn’t make myself clear. PTI should NOT wait for the famous people, because (as I have already mentioned in my previous post) they are mostly corrupt and incompetent. On contrary I have stated that we need new people with new ideas/visions, who don’t have BAD habits. The back side of this strategy is that these people will not be invited to talk shows and be written about in newspapers, because their name doesn’t sell the program/newspaper, but once they are elected they will automatically attract both TV and newspaper.
“I still have a bad taste in my mouth since the last years UK fiasco when IK just appointed some chick (I’m sure she’s very talented but she should have been elected) … and at that time I was seriously considering donating to PTI and taking part… but that was a turn off for me.”
I agree that she (do you mean Rabia Zia?) should be elected. As far as I know an election was planned. I don’t have any knowledge about the outcome the election. Maybe an insider in PTI can throw some light on this issue.
@shirkuh: well, yeah, I agree in principle about other orgs but if this excuse is used too much it sounds more like evasiveness than anything elese. Also things like author unions are not in a political struggle to bring about democracy and justice to the people of pakistan. If the authors union doesn’t believe in ‘authorship’ or ‘writing books’ then I’d have a problem with them.
I still don’t get the talk-show thingy. You elect your officials, you outreach to people, you do your thing. When someone calls to find out what position PTI has, the Information secretary or PR person gives their response, if a TV station calls for a participant, then you already have people available who go to represent you. After all PTI is the better judge of who should represent the party on which issue.
Frankly I don’t buy the “presentable” thing. Fauzia Wahab and this idiot Jatoi are not on TV because “they are famous” but because the are the onces designated by the party in question.
And yeah the party should elect the people you specified (meritorius and not fakers) and get on with the work. What are they waiting for?
I’ve heard this … “oh ji election honay thay.. .ho rahay hai… ho jaiN gay..” BS from a LOT of Pakistani organizations.
It ain’t gonna happen. You can rub my nose in it when it does happen. And I’d be happy when they do take place. I’m not holding my breath though. Not for PTI, not for PML-N and definitely NOT for PPP.
@GoTK
“I still don’t get the talk-show thingy. You elect your officials, you outreach to people, you do your thing. When someone calls to find out what position PTI has, the Information secretary or PR person gives their response, if a TV station calls for a participant, then you already have people available who go to represent you. After all PTI is the better judge of who should represent the party on which issue.”
Yes, ideally it should be like that i.e. the party sends a representative on a particular issue.
The chairman should be able to speak on most issues, but if there is a TV show on a specific issue the TV channels should not ask for a certain person in the party, but a representative on that particular issue. What I have understood from different interviews is that TV wants specific a person, maybe that is why we only see known faces regardless of the issue. I have seen strange people uttering their opinion about issues, which they don’t have any say on (at least they shouldn’t), f.ex. Qamar Z. Qaira speaking on the judiciary issue, when it should be Naik.
I m becoming fan of IK, he has really got something, he can talk, he have solutions of all problems, he is best at the moments, and i want to see a gov in future of TIP AND PMLN, and i believe they will make a change in pakistan and only they are capable of everything. IK’s party is growing rapidly and in next elections it will perform well…
Politicians being exempted from NAB’s accountability:
http://thenews.jang.com.pk/top_story_detail.asp?Id=19377
salam-u-alakum
the only solution to deal with crisess is, Hang every single politition in every corner of pakistan,there is will be no slave slavery.
“there is more horiable things then bloodshed slavery is one of them”.
Imran Khan MUST target PPP vote bank in Sind. I think this is the only meaningful way forward.
But the bitter reality is that our Sindhi Brothers and Sisters are so much stuck in Bhutto phobia that PPP is going to win in Sind for the next Hundred years.
Because after Shaheeeeeeeeeeeeeeed Zardari we will have Bilawal Zardari, and after him we will have Bakhtawar Zardari, and after her we will have Asifa Zardari. The list is endless.
Or take it this way that after Indira Gandhi (it would have been) Sanjay Gandhi, and then Rajiv Gandhi, and very soon it will be Rahul Gandhi. Because in India and Pakistan people go after ‘NAME’.
I think PTI Forum should set up a Think Tank and some really sharp Analysts should work out the strategy how to tackle the PPP vote bank in Sind, including Karachi. And the research must start now.
@shafi:
PTI should first try to start from urban and semi-urban areas in Sindh. Places like Hyderabad and Sukhar where there is some middle class. Develop local party branches along democratic lines there. That will give them a foothold in the province and allow them to spread further.
@Democrat2007
yes I agree that way, it will be a good start and PTI Forum please make a note of this. Have you got any suggestions for Karachi???
OUR ONLY HOPE IS IMRAN KHAN, DUMP ALL OTHER LOTTAY, JUST VOTE FOR IMRAN KHAN.
MAY ALLAHA PROTECT IMRAN KHAN FROM THESE SHAITAN POLITICIANS.
@shafi:
I have no ideas on Karachi – it seems to be a very hard one to crack due to the MQM’s terror tactics.
But other cities like Isb/Rawalpindi, Peshawar, Gujranwalla, Faisalabad, Sargodha, Hyderabad, Sukhar, and perhaps also Quetta should certainly be well within the party’s grasp if it organizes properly. Its first target should be to win 15-20 seats in an election which will allow it to be a strong pressure group in the parliament. Once it reaches this landmark, more people will start taking it seriously and that could attract more votes in other constituencies as well.
The PTI’s first hurdle is to convince enough people that here is a party that not only represents a break from the status quo, but also has a realistic chance of winning. Presently, a lot of potential PTI voters vote for PML-N so that the PPP does not win. If these people could be convinced that PTI has a reasonable chance of success, then they would vote for PTI. Similarly, with a lot of PPP supporters disillusioned with the way things are going, PTI can have a chance of winning some of them over too.
To my all fellow Pakistani Brothers & sister.
It is my belief that power lies with people and when we have hunger to bring change then ALLAH will come our assistance.
at this moment we are all guilty of silence.
our history is full of divine leaders and teachers from our beloved messenger Mohammed(pbuh) to countless writers ,poets who tried to show us the way to lead life .
to start we all traitors because we did not heed the message.otherwise how could we be in a situation such as this ?
If we don’t get up and do what is require from us in the holy book then worse is yet to come.we have seen the Gaza on tv? it is only a trailer of horror film yet.
For Pakistan : lets all give vote to IMRAN Khan then he may cure all the cancerous symptoms of our country with best team around him FREE of charge.
Are we willing?????????
M.Kiani(Oxford)
As i have mentioned several times, the problem with Pakistan is image. When the image is poor, people become hopeless and so on.
Imran was a great captain and will be a great leader as well. I feel sorry for the people of Pakistan who have failed to elect such great and capable leaders. You have everything but still you do not know how to standup in front of other nations.
Everybody likes to kick Muslim nations and Pakistan is top in the list. Pepople of Pakistan have failed to elect right leaders and they have to pay this price for their own failure.
i love imran khan but i wont let to derail system for sake of imran khan,he should wait for 4 years,i,ll give vote to him.
Why people should wait untill the next election?. The house is on fire and they need to standup.
I can even suggest that President Zardari should appoint Imran as the PM and allow him to lead the nation. Otherwise, it will be too late for Pakistan.
R.Alamsha Karnan Says:
I can even suggest that President Zardari should appoint Imran as the PM and allow him to lead the nation. Otherwise, it will be too late for Pakistan.
this man is not in his senses !!!!!
goto some indian forum pal, y r u wasting ur brain and time ?
u ve even wasted my 2 mins.
Why did Imran not answer the question asked by that caller from Swat ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
He does not want to answer the question or he does not know the answer to that question. Because while his rehtorical logic does not have answers to these straight forward questions.
He wants dialogue with whom ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? First he should determine whom to talk with ……… are they legitimate residents of the area or imran wants to talk with Hindus fighting in guise of talibans ? ? ? How many are they and how many they want to have their wells imposed upon ? ? ? ? ? What do you say all the conspiracy theorists ? any PTI official who understands Imran have to answer these questions.
He is comparing Northern Ireland with Swat ? ? ? what a logic ? ? ? ?
What problem does imran has with drones when they killing some fu…g al-libi or al-misri in South Waziristan ……… he definitely does not bother when the same al-libi or al-misri is slaughtering the locals here ………….
The interview was a volleyball match in which the host was throwing the ball just above the net to be smashed by Imran.
“Pakistan needs instituition building and we should not follow Shakhseeat”, but then he comes and stucks at Iftikhar chaudhery……. not a single hard word for talibans ……..a morally corrupt like imran should not talk about corruption at least ………… zardari’s trusted are running the country but then he talks of something about his father being the head of the board of governors of SKH ……..why is that ? ? ?
shafi,
Once the judicial system becomes independent, we will trial the whole of JI for sending the inncoents across the borders for jihads ……… pray for dictatorships and anarchy otherwise you will see your Qazi handged in public …………..all the teenagers exploding the bombs have their blood as well as the blood of those they kill on hands of Qazi …………. the biggest criminal of humanity.
and by the way why does not your blood boil when you watch a Bad Kerdaar like Imran talking on TV …………
I am really sorry for personality attacks on Imran but his Criminal Stance on the situation in Pukhtunkhwa boils our blood and I promise I will try to make his life miserable ………. say the truth you fu..g bastard ………..
sorry for the language mistakes ……
Once he clarifies his stance on talibans/Islamic militancy, on KB dam, on provincial rights only then will he find where he stands ……………
I consider him as the Best allrounder the cricket world has ever seen, and i think the nation should be grateful to him for SKH. Not long ago i considered him a principled politician but his stance on the militancy in Pukhtunkhwa and FATA is purely criminal ……….. we cannot forgive him for this ……….
I agree with everything IK stands for. The only thing I want to hear from him is that “institutions are more important than any leader” and that “TI will elect its party leaders from the basic grass root membership and from there on up”. “There shall be no personality and/family hegemony”. “Only DEMOCRACY will rule”.
Hazrat Ali said “aazmaaey huey ko aazmaana baywaqufi hey”
We haven’t tried imran khan yet, we should try him, rest of the parties, we have tried
them twice or thrice and we saw the result.
After power,if imran khan, doesn’t work on the points he is talking here, we will kick him our, before 5 years.
Nobody does anything for others, if there is poverty and nothing available, it is not the problem for the government elites and for few rich people, so why they would care about common public, it is public’s duties to do for themself, like protest in mass, once every week atleast.
In the light of present situation, if government doesn’t get very serious, I doubt that government will last till March 9th 2009.
there is no other prominent figure in PTI than IK. Imran should work in this regard..
Imran Khan: You are the BEST.and this is our wish to see to as the next Prime Minister of Pakistan.
i hope you guys would vote for Tahrek Insaf in the same spirit as you have commented on this vid AND propogate the message and vision of Tahrek Insaf to your colleagues, friends, family and who so ever you meet here and there.
Our hero rocks, come on SIR IK, this is time to break all lottas, exposse all traitors including NS.
My dear friend if king khan is taking great risk we should support him, we should join him by donating $10 every month, it is nothing, but we can donate for great cause for pakistan. http://www.insaf.org.
IK is patriotic , sincere, brave, honest. these are qualities in a true leader. All cowards MUFADPARAST, hukamat ke bhokhay, greedy pls dump dump them.
it is a time to support IK, after quaid azam we have IK we is copy of our quaid,
pls pls support him, join his hands and walk with him.
imran khan to khud eik dictator mind hai, iska saboot yeh hai kay inki party mien koi eik admi bhi aisa nhi jo inki party ko represent karay, her program her interview mien yeh khud appear hotay hain, saaf zahir hai kay imran khan mien bhi eik addud “Mien” hai, sirf baatien hi hain inkay pass, koi doosra admi exist hi nhi kerta jo inki party platform mien sey inkay khayalaat beyan ker sakay…i m sorry to all his fans, lekin plz koi doosra naam bata dien jo inka reflection ho or jo inki zeban mien baat kerta ho…
thnx
@democrat 2007
To All those who oppose Imran Khan (and Qazi Hussain)
The trend in the previos elections was that even the PML-N voter who wanted to vote for Imran Khan, voted for PML-N to keep out PPP.
The situation is exactly the same now and that is if Imran Khan does not get support of Qazi Hussain-JI then the votes will be split and the net result would be in complete Win for PPP and that means Madari Vadhera Sain for another 5 years.
In your formula Mr Democrat 2007, you have suggested that in the bigger cities if He can win between 20-30 seats fo form an EFFECTIVE pressure Group, and this can only be possible with the support of Jammat e Islami.
Before someone again reminds me that JI has already been tried under the banner of MMA, then the answer is, it was Maulana Diesel who betrayed Qazi Sahib.
And in the election of 2002, the only reason that MMA got more seats was that according to the agreement the voter of JI had to vote for Diesel Wala’s Party. The reason Qazi Sahib agreed to work jointly with Maulvi Diesel was that Qazi Sahib thought that Maulvi Diesel may behave like a ‘Bande ka Puttar’ but instead Maulvi Diesel kept on behaving like ‘Khoti ka puttar’.
Please remember that even in Feb 2007 elections in almost all contituencies where PPP candidate could not win, the PPP candidate was No:2 because of the split vote.
So if there is a mid-term election then there is only one way is that Imran Khan will need support of PML-N and JI.
Also PML-Q can cut his voted dangerously
so He needs support of JI and PMl-N.
And if our Jahil AWAM for any reason wants to oppose Imran Khan then Good Luck with Madari Vadeira Sain.
@ shafi
Qazi voted for JUI because ISI told them to do so.
Imran khan has to come out of Qazi’s influence if he ever wants to establish his political life.Imran Khan is no revolutionary, so he needs to work on his manifesto and team building.If Imran Khan keep his present way of politics he will end up like Asghar Khan who was used by Mullahs and Military time and again.
@dara
“Imran khan has to come out of Qazi’s influence if he ever wants to establish his political life.”
Can you please throw some light on the above statement? In which ways do you think PTI/IK is under the influence of Qazi?
shiruk,
in which way he looks different from Qazi, except the Beard offcourse, and that too seems to be comming out in a short while. Imran is a MIXTURE of influences, not a single thing is personal about him.
Any official from PTI here would like to explain what are views of Imran on the role of ISI & Qazi in being part of the jihadi drama in Kashmir and Afghanistan ? ? ? anyone from PTI ? ? ?
@UthmanKhilarhi-do-number
I am not representing PTI, but I have seen no good arguments from you. Please use the brain and answer my question instead of posing your own distracting questions. As far as PTI – JI “alliance” is concerned I can say that it is less significant than the alliance between PML and JI in the past. The alliance between PTI and JI is a one point agenda and that is the restoring the judiciary. And what about the alliance between the “mother of all terrorists” MQM’s and PPP? Anyone to explain?
Btw: PML-N/NS has also been a part of this alliance, but somehow PML/NS did find a way out and so did PPP. Anyone who can explain this? On top of it PML-N is finding a way to be a part of the alliance again. PML-N has announced that they will support the Long March on 9.th March. Let’s see if they can be steadfast. I hope so
What do you mean by “Jihadi drama” in Kashmir? On this issue I think PML-N and PTI have similar views.
Shiruk,
I definitely am not arguing about Imran, let him come out and talk on issues, let him take decisions and let him face the subsequent response from the public.
He will soon know the response of people of NWFP since he has decided to remain mum on the activities of his beloved islamists .
Once he takes some sort of decision regarding the KBD he will know what the people of sindh think about him.
Let him face the people of Balochistan and he will know how difficult is it to decide which language to use when talking to insurgents.
Pakistan is not restricted to urban punjab only.
@Uthmanhel1
“He will soon know the response of people of NWFP since he has decided to remain mum on the activities of his beloved islamists .”
He is NOT mum on this issue. In fact he has been very clear that we need to take the people of NWFP on board and have negotiations with the traditional leaders. By doing that we will be able have the majority on OUR side and stabilize the area and isolate the few culprits amongst them – including those who are collaborating with foreign powers.
On the other issues: Yes, historically they have been tough, but if you take people on board i.e. they get a say in the solution then the possibility of success is enhanced, but if you bypass different processes then it is doomed to failure. And yes, only time will tell how he performs if/when he gets a chance.
Btw: What is an islamist? Will you please elaborate?
@faraz
PTI website is http://www.insaf.pk/ not .org
very disappointing interview…I mean the host did not ask any tough questions. Ok so you like Imran Khan, but if you invite him for an interview then ask at least a couple of tough questions, otherwise you just undermine your own credibility as a journalist.
A couple of good points made by Kashif, GoTK and Uthmankhel1. In my view, Kashif is absolutely right–the political vacuum is on the left, not the right, where NS is rather acceptable. But Kashif, IK cannot fill the vaccuum on the left because he is too right himself.
As for internal elections, forget about them…for the longest time, Jemima was head of the PTI women’s wing–how democratic is that??
Also, though I agree with IK on the judiciary and some other things, Uthmankhel1 is absolutely right that he does not offer any insight on complicated matters in the North–Swat being a case in point! It is not so easy and simplistic as he makes it sound.
IK just gets a lot of airtime but in reality his party has made little inroads. After more than a decade of politics, his party still stands at only 3% in the recent IRI poll.
Imran Khan is a true leader. Born leader. God gifted. Check his record. Lead his team to a world cup victory and the ONLY WORLD CUP VICTORY till now 17 years later we replay those same moments of winning the cup. They say Pakistan has a lot of talent, which is true than why cant they win the world cup. forget about winning why cant they even come in the finals or semis? one answer they dont have a leader like Imran Khan who knew how to handle every personality differently.. Look at his Hospital. It is the best hospital in Asia. People have these stupid comments to make against IK but there is no light on them, its just dumb arguments with no proofs.
I CHALLENGE THE OPPOSITION OF IMRAN KHAN AND PTI ON PKPOLITICS. IMRAN KHAN was the FIRST leader 12 years ago to point out that the main problem of this country is judiciary, 12 years later the lawyer movement starts. No leader, nor Benazir, nor Shariff brothers, Qazi( who like), ALtaf terrorist, Zaradari 10 %, CH’s, 12 years ago talked about judicary. Now they taking credit for it. Anyone can prove me wrong??? where are those idiots that just talk against Imran Khan? put ur money where ur mouth is.
IRI SURVEY
IK/ PTI POPULARITY 3%
PERIOD
There is no need to participate in a yelling competetion. Not much fun in participating when there is no proper environment. Please continue your manners of a playground sandbox
Good night!
@Shirkuh
Imran Khan has been under Qazi’s influence and that implies under the influence of agencies.
He participated in 2002 elections though they were arranged under establishment’s + agencies (though nothing wrong with that either as long as you oppose dictatorship in Parliament) , but he boycott the 2008 elections when there was even better chances to represent people who wanted a third option.
He directly and indirectly support militants who are active in NWFP and who have imposed laws and system beyond any one’s imagination like No Education for Girls.
He promised to bring Altaf Hussain back ( though it was a joke) with in three months but nothing doing?
He was captured and handed over by Jamtis after humiliation ( i condemn personally) to Musharaf regime, still he is very close to Jamat. He got that opportunity to remain in jail till Nov02 orders were reversed, but he went on hunger strike for his own release( yet another joke).
If Imran Khan was a savior or some one against the status quo he would have been jailed for long time like Zeadari or i must mention Benazir who remained under arrest from 1977 to 1983 in different jails and in her house.
It is very easy to talk against civilian Govts but real commitment show up when people / leaders stand against tyrants like Ayub , Yahya, Zia and Musharf on their peaks.
What guarantee BB had when she struggled against Zia? what happened to Nawaz when Musharaf came into power? though Nawaz was lucky and he compromised on Musharf’s terms to get second life.
Imran Khan has not faced any hostile establishment as yet, and I am sure when ever he will decide to become a true Awami/ people oriented leader the establishment will come out to teach him a lesson.
No answers on policy issues
FAN CLUB on the run
@ all sick opponents of Ik
we are not IK’s spokesmen on his policies. but as we ve got brain and we listen his point of we can tell that what ever he says he says in the favour of pakistan and he will do every thing to save this country.
he will pull this country out of USA phobia.
o u jiyalas and nawaz lovers listen to me
IK is a leader , he is not like nawaz and Mr 10% who pooh (in pants )when Bush says Booh !!!!!!!
@ ali4asat
You need to have courage to come out and lead to save a country, it is zardari and ppp who are at front line and facing it all, If Imran khan had courage he would have participated in the elections to engage people of Pakistan.
Imran couldn’t tolerate two days in jail how could he face international pressure.
Mr. Zardari and team should get full marks for pulling us out of two big challenges,
1. Economics, as they were able to get us some money to run this country otherwise from USA to Saudia and from China to Europe has said ‘NO”.
2. After Mumbai crises they did very well to avoid war of any scale so far.
What Imran Khan has as alternative for economic system? Does he has will to balance current fascist capital system’? if yes then i will support him. Those who talk against USA very loud, tell us how?
@Dara,
Zardari leading the nation ….. hmmm.
Zardari is standing with his back to the enemies with his pants down. Is that what you call leading by example.
Zardari offered to send DG ISI before Kiyani drilled some sense into him.
@Usman,
You did not post the complete results:
IK popularity 3%
PPP popularity 0.03%
@ Kruman
You are so funny,
@dara:
1-”they were able to get us some money to run this country otherwise from USA to Saudia and from China to Europe has said ‘NO”. ”
Why all the countries are refusing to give us money, because they know that the money will never be returend because of zardari historical record corruption and the way he keeps his words.. IMF has no blood realtion with us for apporving the loan, thats only because zppp had already promised for continuing the policies of musharraf to kill pakistani people by american drones.
2- “After Mumbai crises they did very well to avoid war of any scale so far”
Avoiding war is not a solution at the cost of banning and killing your own people without any proofs. Instead this is the symbol of a helpless and a coward nation.
Go to your history and read the muslims situation in which Badar battle was fought against kuffar-e-Makkah. Muslims had no economy no food and they had a choice either to follow the Makkah trade convoy or fight against the makkah army. If you dont know , I can tell you . Quran appreciated muslim decisions of fighting against the makkah people.
Nations are built on the basis of principles , bravery and they make their history by sacrification and not by crying before other nations.
agrana 75
dont try to live in past.
Jamat dawa IS one othe organization glorifying dehsat gardi, it should have long ago banned.
By the way have you heard of SULHA HUDABAYA.
do you know back ground and history.
By the way at that time there were no hudkush bombars
@Muhammad Usman Says:
Can you quote any of the event when JeD glorify this “dehshat Gardi” or killed any of the civilian or military personal in pakistan? Even in the present crisis, they didnt go for any violent protests.
Instead we have such record for MQM and some other political parties who kill not only own people but also getting help from our hostile foreign elements..
I am not spokesman of JeD, but if they are involved in terrorist activites, it should be bring to us. We always ban such org when there is external pressure.. In this way actually we give the message that we dont have our own policy but we are here to serve foreign orders.. In that case the people of the our country start law in their hands..
I have seen people often quoting “sulah hadeebiah”… without knowing the whole background behind that..you name is Usman atleast,you should have full details about that, anyhow let me tell you actual facts..
1-After the rumours of Usman(RA) murder, muslims (sahab (RA)) promised before muhammad they they will not go back until take revenge of Osman murder.
2-They were ready for fight even they didnt have any weapons with them.
3-They didnt think about their economy and the families they left behind them.
4- When pagans of Makkah came to know about muslims intentions they got frightened and sent their delegation for negotiations.
5- Muslims didnt request or cry for “peace” instead they were the “kuffar” who requested negotiations.
so conclusion is that muslims never fought on the basis of their economy or worldly powers instead whenever they relied on weapons and quantity, like in battle “Tabook”, they were defeated.
I am not warmonger, but the nations who afraid of being thrown into war and trade their respect and honour with some money and temporary peace. They are always ruled by some other nations.
Musharraf , 9 years ago, did the same thing and assured us that now all our problmes would be solved , but wat happened?
“Economics, as they were able to get us some money to run this country otherwise from USA to Saudia and from China to Europe has said ‘NO”.” i know u r a begger like Mr 10 %. tumhari yeh mangnay ki adat kab jaye gi? sharam nahi aati mangte huay?
“After Mumbai crises they did very well to avoid war of any scale so far.”
A newly born pakistan faught two wars in 65 and 71 when it wasn t even a nuclear power !
If u r so scared of india go an live in india u mouse.
i am not in favour of a war but one should live with dignity and honour.
“to live one day like a lion is better then 100 days of jackal’s life.”
Mr.10% and Ganja Nawaz pooh(in pants) when Bush says Boooh !!!!
@ usman
Jayala pan is a disease and u r suffering from it.
Mr.10% and Ganja Nawaz pooh(in pants) when Bush says Boooh !!!!
@ agrana75
plz don t tell them about “Badar” and “Ohad” these are science and techonolog births and there science and technology is gonna save them from dying one day.
Good luck Bush fobia people !!!!!
@ ImranKhanforPM
Are you really suggesting that IK led the lawyers’ movement? If so, I suggest you brush up on your knowledge. IK tagged along. The lawyers’ movement came about as a result of dedicated top lawyers like Aitzaz Ahsan, Munir Malik, Ali Kurd, and so on—most of whom DO NOT support IK politically. How convenient for you to point out all of IK’s successes but none of his failures. Yes, he was successful in cricket; yes, he is successful with Shaukat Khanam (though it is certainly not the best hospital in Asia–again a bit of honesty would do you good). But politically, he has been a failure. In 1997, even a political novice should have known that if he wanted to win, he should have chosen one constituency, but he contested from nine and lost from all!
His political allies were people like Hamid Gul who have landed Pakistan in this terrorism mess. In 2002, he supported Musharraf. Some even say the military orchestrated his victory (though I personally do not buy that). But his voting record is not good–he voted for Fazlur Rehman as PM; voted against the women protection bill, and so on.
@ ali4asat
This is typical of IK supporters–when they don’t have logical arguments they start attacking the others who are making them. I wonder who really has the brain here. I would love to support someone who really has a commitment to anti-imperialism and who has demonstrated it in his or her personal life. Zardari is not that guy, NS is not that guy, Asfandyar is not that guy, Altaf Hussain is not that guy, and guess what?!? Neither is IK that guy….he says all these things about the US but his own children stand there like stupid ring-bearers for the wedding of Camilla’s nephew and think they have accomplished something in life. He is so happy to be photographed by Hello magazine in UK but shows a different face in Pakistan. Maybe you support him because you only see one side to him. Nusrat Fateh Ali Khan did so many shows for free to raise charity for Shaukat Khanum, but when he died, IK did not have the decency to attend his funeral. On the other hand, Diana went to Shaukat Khanum once, and when she died, he came running to her funeral. So don’t tell me that he doesn’t suffer from an inferiority complex!
Yes, there are people in Pakistan, lawyers like Ali Kurd and Munir Malik (who are denied visas by the UK), social workers, etc. who are the real hope for Pakistan–it is from them and through a true democratic process that a real leader will one day Insha’Allah emerge for Pakistan–and it will be a team of leaders (like in the lawyers’ movement)–not one celebrity with a dedicated fan club. IK is not my hope and he is not Pakistan’s hope. The people of Pakistan are smarter than you—they don’t see a revolutionary in IK because there are too many hypocrisies there–that is why he stands at 3%.
PPP and PML-N do better because they rely on patronage–if people in Pakistan’s villages vote for them, they then rely on the local nazims, etc. to sort out their thana-katcheri issues, and it works that way…but with the other crises taking record proportions, patronage doesn’t cut it–that’s why PML-Q lost. The next election belongs to PML-N because PPP and ANP are rapidly getting discredited. And if PML-N does not deliver (which is likely) then another revolutionary force could emerge, but that force is not IK’s PTI.
no mre debate with retards
The rule ” jis kee lathi us kee bhains” is actually valid in this world. Today america is strong not due to its economy but due to its army and weapon systems . Its economy is built because of the money it is holding from other country and the strong army it has. someone may ask this question , why some other countries in europe with out army are still rich. Answer is very straight forward, those are not separate from america. Europe is a strong ally of USA. My intention is not to criticize west or USA, Every nation do, wat ever is best.I am not in favor of crying or referring our own weaknesses because of some other people. We muslims these days are weak, humiliated and disresprected because we ourselves are forgetting of all the principles to become a strong nation. We cry for economy, in fact not to become a powerful nation but to lead a luxurious life.
Look at muslim arab countries which are very rich ,strong economy but can we say them strong?
@ usman
” What Imran Khan has as alternative for economic system? Does he has will to balance current fascist capital system’? if yes then i will support him. Those who talk against USA very loud, tell us how?”
In terms of welfare state!
who made China? Overseas chines and chines people themself !
who made singapore ? singapore people itself !
who made malayasia ?malaysian people itself !
If they can do it why can t we. when this habbit of begging of urs gonna go?
Ik says and we know its true that our biggest wealth is overseas pakistani but they are not willing to send their money to pak banks just because they don t feel secure.
IK said 1000 times that politicians must declare their assets and pay their taxes and bring their assests to pakistan and after that government should ask the nation to pay their taxes and then if any1 doesn t not pay his tax he must be pulled to the court.
when politicians will put their money into pakistani banks and will declare their assets ,overseas paki s will feel secure and they will support the government.
Now after these facts i gave u if u r not convinced then u need a doctor cuz jayala pan is a disease and u r suffering from it.
I think some people are really getting carried away here. No need to be jealous of IK and his acheivements. just admit and move on!!! Just because he is gaining strength politically now, no body needs to feel pressure on his or her tail. Just accept the obvious and move on.
There is one another reason for the usa to become a strong country, that is because of their internal strong judiciary system. People are treated equally , wats so ever their social status is. Though we people from other nations have complaints about usa that it is not doing justice outside the USA but with in the USA i have seen that no body can think to become mr 10% 0r 80% and then get certificate of innocence through NRO. No person can think to appoint his daughter in an emabassy like makhdoom Faheem daughter. No judge can think to do efforts for increasing his daughter numbers. Here no body can think of killing more than 50 people , like 12 may 2007, and then there is no inquiry.
In fact, if our judiciary system is strong, there would be no extremism, no law & order situation, no corruption etc.
@ sitaraakhri
@ Muhammad Usman
Nawaz shareef and zardari are the best ! u people really deserve a ministry in this government. good luck.
Does any body need to fear in the light of recent IRI survey from a fan club.
No body is disputing achievemnt in health and education and sports.( a stupid will do that)
Million dollar question is , how a fan club will come into power.
How present set up will allow that.
By democratic process elections will b eheld in 2013
People like Sitaraakhri and Muhammad Usman are the people sucking the blood of this nation for the last sixty one years. They are the very reason Pakistan finds itself where it is now.
Re-enforcing the failures are not going to do anything good whatsoever. PPP is in power fourth times and PML has been twice already. if there was any agenda or any good ever to come out of these white elephants, it would have by now.
At any rate, Pakistan needs to try someone new. And IK is the best of new lot. Period!!!!
M Usman,
You need to watch Live with Talat of 31st or 1st January, one of these.
You will get the answer whether election should be held in 2013 or immediately.
P.S. just firing away whatever you can muster does not constitute logic.
@ali4asat and ashahid
Before you start making allegations—I suggest you read the post properly. I have criticized AZ and NS and others–just because I don’t like them, does not mean I have to like IK. What’s the matter? Your brain cells too small to comprehend that??
And ashahid, you should watch the Live With Talat where he questioned IK–now that was a real interview (not like this bullshit by this Mr. Malik)—and talat pinned him real good on many of the things I was talking about in my post–the hypocrisy…
I think M Usman and I are being far more objective–giving credit where it’s due and taking it away where its not–you guys are the ones too blinded by your love for IK to see any flaws in him.
who is this jahil muhammad usman
@ muhammad usman, who do u support, I think may be shaitan, shut up
@sitaraahkhri: Your post was well written and well reasoned. Don’t mind the 4 year olds running amok. It seems the admainistrator is on “chuTTi” or something.
@TK,
Admin just got back today and will perform lots of Article 6 tomorrow on Article 11 violators.
Admin
@ali4asat and agrana75
please don’t bring Ghazwas in to it , and please when you refer Qurran , give verse no and chapter no.
I read about Badar , auhad and Khandaq, but Islam is not all about wars. there was Shaib i abi Talib too, its about dialogue and treaties too, please refer to Chapter of Al Nasar when Almighty has referred that treaty of hudybia as “Fateh Mubeen”.
My question remains How will you fight and stand against USA?
Don’t you see millions of muslim poor children sleep with empty stomachs daily?
Don’t you know how you live in refugee camps when you have to leave your homes?
What is honor of a nation that has been getting loans for last 61 years and 80 % of it been spent on military.
ISI chief should have been sent long time back to some where as nations don’t need ISI but nationalism and trust.
[...] ISLAMABAD TONIGHT Islamabad Tonight – 2 January 2009 Category Islamabad Tonight | Posted on January 2, 2009 | 104 Comments Read More Imran Khan in this [...]
@dara
i said i am not in favour of war , do u need glasses to read ?
btw congrats for new achievement by NRO gov.read the last post on first page.
@muhammad Usman
Your are forgeting about IRI survey, when 88% people of Pakistan don’t like your boss’s party???
You don’t have to propogate your party, don’t the people of pakistan see everyday whats going on, why they don’t say to Edhi Mr.10% and say to Zardari Mr.10%??? If government proves that they are Edhi of Pakistan. I guarantee to that each and every Pakistani will be with the government.
People don’t care, whether your name is Zardari or Imran Khan, they want betterment for them and Pakistan, they will be with every zardari, who cares for them and the country,not verbally, but shows by his/their actions. If you can’t do, they will try imran khan and others, because you are disappointing them. There is not
“kamal” of Imran Khan to be sucessful in present situation, because you the present government providing him this chance, because you are not acting in the interest of Pakistan and it’s people.
@dara
“Imran Khan has been under Qazi’s influence and that implies under the influence of agencies.”
I don not agree. I am convinced that they are together on a one point agenda. I trust Ik through his speech and the following actions and off course consistency. On the other hand I don’t trust Qazi at all. He is just as unreliable as the other established parties, who one by one has left the colalition and the commitments they made.
“He directly and indirectly support militants who are active in NWFP and who have imposed laws and system beyond any one’s imagination like No Education for Girls.”
This is far too simplistic. The matter is a bit more complicated than indicated by you. In this conflict we have (far to) many participants. Let us try to differentiate between them.
The Allied gang and their share of collaborators: There is no other solution than to cut the supply lines to the Allied gang. It is evident that they have a purpose of destabilizing Pakistan.
The Indians and their share of collaborators: The same goes for the Indians. They are pushed by the The Allied gang to perform a negative role. That is quite stupid action from the Indians. They will stay as our neighbours, but their newly found “friends” will leave, when their goals have been met. In other words they are escalating the existing conflict.
Foreigners: Those elements collaborating with the Indians and the Allied gang should be dealt with. The others should be given a safe passage to elsewhere.
The local tribesman in general: I believe the vast majority of the tribesmen wants peace, but they don’t want anything imposed on them and the least thing is by regular drone attacks accepted by the present and the previous government. We need to reach out the Pakistan loving tribesman and make peaceful deal without disrupting drone attacks from the other side. Each time Pakistan has tried some kind of reconciliation we have seen drone attacks from the side. The traditional tribal leaders have been undermined, killed and sidelined. We cannot afford that. We MUST find a peaceful solution and that is what PTI wants!
“He promised to bring Altaf Hussain back ( though it was a joke) with in three months but nothing doing?”
What can he do since both the present and the former government refuses to let the UK authorities have access to vital information? On top of that foreign powers like UK wants to have such terror elements in their hands to play their cards according to their negative policies towards Pakistan.
“He was captured and handed over by Jamtis after humiliation ( i condemn personally) to Musharaf regime, still he is very close to Jamat. He got that opportunity to remain in jail till Nov02 orders were reversed, but he went on hunger strike for his own release( yet another joke).”
I agree about IJT and JI. I also condemn both IJT and JI for their hypocritical behaviour. I don’t trust any of them.
I think he could do more damage to the government outside the jail than inside. To be locked in jail for a long period is no qualification in itself. It is the policies you stand for that differs!
“Imran Khan has not faced any hostile establishment as yet, and I am sure when ever he will decide to become a true Awami/ people oriented leader the establishment will come out to teach him a lesson.”
My answer will be as theoretical as yours in terms of what he will do or face when he sits in a government, but I have confidence that he is not afraid anybody and will make the decisions necessary to get us on course, inshallah! He is no saint and he will commit mistakes too, but what matters for me is he an able man, honest, has good policies and has a vision for Pakistan. My claim is; he is the best from the present lot of politicians/parties. Hopefully we will have even better leaders in the future, inshallah!
Shiruk,
While enlisting various militant groups operating in Swat and FATA, you have missed one major group and has erroneously added some commong folks as militants in the list.
The missing group is the one who were waging pakistani wars of strategic depths afghanistan in the 80s and 90s.More specifically, the pass outs of all those 25000 (unofficial) and 8000 (official) training/recruiting camps (madrassas) of FATA which never existed before the afghan war. All sane humans except you and imran believes every single monster that exists in this region is directly linked to (trained, groomed and brainwashed in) these madrassas.
There is an additional bunch of monsters who some believe were escorted from Afghanistan to Waziristan and settled by Pak Military when the american assault started.
Now come to the group of tribesmen whom you have included in the list of militants. Here Imran becomes criminal and so are you. The tribesmen are not militants but are the VICTIMS of militants as are the ordinary people of Swat. MORE THAN 300 tribal elders were mercilessly killed by the militants in targetted killings. The motive was obvious to create power vaccum and fear. No one dare stand in front of militants be they in hundereds as compared to the hundereds of thousands whom they want to subdue. IMRAN IS CRIMINAL BECOZ HE KNOWS ALL THIS AND INTENTIONALLY TWISTS THE FACTS to call the victims of militants as the militants, an equivalent of rubbing salt over wounds. Majority of the tribesmen have been made hostage by the militants thanks to our military.
Why do you want to cover EITHER
—-imran’s inability to answer simple questions which arise when he being blinded by his rhetorical criticism of any sitting govt for cheap popularity on the issue of operation in FATA and Swat. While he was shouting full throttle when Musharraf decided to lauch a half hearted military operation to please his american masters. He is no different now when the ppp/anp govt is trying to wipe out the militants genuinely but are not supported by the all powerfull military.
—–moves according to a given chalked out plan as he’s allegedly been brought to politics by none other than Hamid Gul the X-DG of ISI which orchestrated this whole self-destructing plan of creating monsters for wars of strategic depths.
Have you ever seen him asking question that if american military can kill al-qaeda’s no.3 in SW and many al-libis and al-misris’s why can’t our military do it when our military is better placed to do it for THIS COUNTRY BELONGS TO THEM.
He is expected to make statements stressing the military to deliver against the militants who are killing innocents …………… not to support them.
@sitaraakhri
Thats what my point is IK needs to move to left in order to succeed. I think he is on right bcaz of people around him. We don’t know much about PTI but I am almost certain most of the people around IK are Jammat Islami followers. Thats why Imran speaks there language.
In politics one go to right or left to get to power. Once you are there you will most likely rule from center or u can switch then. By leaning on right IK is loosing his celeberity advantage. There is nothing wrong with right leaning but its just not working for him. He has wasted 15 iireversible years. He needs to take this opportunity (political vaccum on left) or even that will be gone in few years.
Thanks Ghost of Tk.
Well said, Uthmankhel.
@Kashif
Though I agreed with you in your earlier post, feel differently about your later post. In IK’s case, I don’t agree that he is right because the people who support him are right. I think he is to the right because of his own family background. Anybody who knows him/has met him or his family knows this. His sister was the founder of Al-Huda for women in Lahore. Ironically, some of his supporters are significantly to the left of him and either don’t follow his politics or are just too enamoured by the idea of IK to have it bother them. Incidentally, most of these supporters also live outside the country and rarely vote.
Also, I don’t agree that there is nothing wrong with leaning right–in most cases that is true, but when it comes to women’s rights it is not. Unfortunately, the right in Pakistan has never stood up for women’s rights–not even when they are in the opposition. Recently, when Tasleema Solangi was literally thrown to the dogs, Saad Rafique of pml-n (someone I liked on other issues) refused to criticize the government on it. I was actually shocked. PML-N, JI, PTI, etc all the parties to the right also refused to support the women protection bill. There is the case of the baluch women who were buried alive recently–again no voice of opposition from the right–including mr. imran khan.
And now before i get attacked, the ppp of course was very disappointing by appointing gross violators of women and human rights, the likes of Bajrani and Zehri–but again no opposition from the right/right-leaning parties. Had the pml-n been in power, however, the ppp would have raised its voice against it. So the PPP with all its flaws (and it has way too many) stands up for women’s rights when it is in the opposition at least. Unfortunately the parties on the right don’t even do it then–that is really sad, because it is a huge problem in Pakistan.
@sitaraakhri, @Uthmankhel
IK’s full focus is the urban areas of Pakistan , and it is understandable at the moment , however a “leftist” will always find it hard to “vote” for Imran Khan, just like “rightist” always find it hard to vote for “PPP”. However while in power both left or right parties start tending towards center.
It is very hard to understand the psyche of rural areas of Pakistan , there are so many complex socio-political forces (from their own choice/love to feudalism to biradari system , to the invisible forces on the voting day…. everything just gets mixed up) acting at the same time in rural areas that it is very hard to understand how people vote there.
Apart from obvious PPP , only leader I could see gaining the trust of rural areas is Nawaz Sharif.
Khan need to find a way to approach the rural areas and talk in their language… although it seems he is short of time.
@UthmanKhel
“While enlisting various militant groups operating in Swat and FATA, you have missed one major group and has erroneously added some commong folks as militants in the list.”
Read my post again. I think you read what YOU wanted to read and not what I wrote. I used the term “Participants”. Maybe you should rethink and reply with a more logic answer with NO INTENTIONAL TWISTING next time
Madrassa: I am not in favour of the outdated madrassas. What is sad is that there are no alternatives. Have any of the previous governments made ANY significant gain in that regard – be it PML-N or PPP?
@Sitaraakhri
Quite amusing
According to you:
“the ppp of course was very disappointing by appointing gross violators of women and human rights, the likes of Bajrani and Zehri”
and then:
“So the PPP with all its flaws (and it has way too many) stands up for women’s rights when it is in the opposition at least.”
That’s quite “interesting statement. When PPP is running the affairs they appoint criminals. And still you blame the opposition? Isn’t it the duty of the government to ensure the right people are appointed?
Isn’t it the duty of the government to kick out criminals?
Isn’t it the governments duty to ensure law and order?
Yes i read them quite carefully and i will write them in your words again …….. so now …………………….. we have the SOLE PARTICIPANT ISI and it’s share of collaborators THE MILITANTS …….
how many years ….. ACTUALLY …… how many hours do you think have the political govts ruled the country in general and FATA in specific due to its strategic importance at that time …………………… you are not helping army in your posts definitely …………………………..
and don’t just confuse things ………outdated madrassas ………… they were training and recruiting camps built by Army/ISI for their wars ………
@Utmankhel1
Be honest and tell me exactly to which post you replied to, and where I have described the majority tribesmen as MILITANTS in that particular post.
@UthmanKhel1
The is the usual BS….ie. we were not allowed to XYZ, we did not have any authority, our hands were tied….modalities.
Then for Gods sake don’t accept half solutions! Make sure you people actually RUN the government, when you form your government. Don’t blame it on others when it is you who are incompetent. Be brave and admit your mistakes! Agitate and ensure you have the people of Pakistan on board and don’t get too excited about power(abuse) and other irregularities.
Shiruk
“We need to reach out the Pakistan loving tribesman and make peaceful deal”
i am replying to it ………. you don’t need to reach to tribesmen but you need to get rid of the militants who are keeping tribesmen hostage
“Each time Pakistan has tried some kind of reconciliation we have seen drone attacks from the side”
what reconciliation ? nothing’s wrong between the tribesmen and pakistan …….. if anything is wrong its between the ordinary tribesmen and the militants ………….
Now it’s another thing if you want to make reconciliation with militants responsible for the slaughtering of tribesmen ………………. which pak army infact is doing ………….
still don’t know what i mean ? ? ? ?
@Uthmanhe11
You have still not answered my question. Don’t run in circles. Show some courage and admit you have made a mistake.
yes, I have described the ordinary people of NWFP as tribesmen and NOT “MILITANTS” as claimed by you.
And off course you need to reach out the ordinary tribesmen. They are suffering from the Yankee drone attacks. And off course you need to tackle the few and real MILITANTS/Terrorists. Read my post once more and you will find the same statement!
Is it that difficult to admit a mistake or was it an INTENTIONAL TWIST from YOUR part?
@sitaraakhri
IK was a biggest play boy during his cricketing years. His family might have some right leanings but then 90% of our families have. That doesn’t mean he has to do politics from right. Look at Yousuf Raza Gillani, Amin Fahim, Shah Mahmood Qureshi they all are from religious families but they are doing politics from left. Imran needs to do the same or otherwise start bashing Nawaz Sharif. When Obama and Hillary Clinton were running against each other they both bashed Bush but that wasn’t enough. Obama had to go all out against Clintons to make in-roads within left leaning democrats. Similarly Zardari bashing is not enough for IK. He needs to start attacking next PM of Pakistan, Nawaz Sharif. At this point IK is so scared of Nawaz Sharif politically he doesn’t even try to run from Lahore (where he was brought up) and Islamabad (where he lives now). Unfortunately same is true about Atizaz Ehsan. He can’t win from Lahore without NS’s support. PM’s biggest qualification is not how eloquent he is on issues. Their biggest assett is how deep their roots are in public. If they are making tough decisions that are not popular within fellow parlimentarians he can go directly to public. In Pakistan NS and BB had this luxury. They had the political capital to override any discent within their ranks. If not you will get PMs like Gillani, Aziz, ManMohan Singh. IK with all his eloquence about social justice, institution building, infrastructure development would not like to join this dummy PM’s league. He needs to come out of Jamat and PMLN shadow and offer Pakistani people true alternate leadership.
Shiruk,
Militants are suffering from drone attacks and not the ordinary tribesmen.
Thats where i differ from you and thats where you are criminal as well as Imran.
Get a list of those killed in drone attacks and tell me which one was an ordinary tribeseman ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
Now you know what i mean ? ? ? ? ?
@Utmankhel1
Should I start with the 70 children killed by a missle strike on school? there is a long list of incidents where PML Q govenment people admits that civilians were killed.
Musharraf promised on TV that he will release the pictures of terrorist in schools, never been published, will never be published. You need to “Grow up and stop lying”.
IK’s views on was against terror represents far right. He argues that troops should be pulled and gov should talk to militants. Does he know militants want nifaz e shariat. Basically in the name of religion they want power and curb all civil liberties as Taliban did. He critise gov for the way they are conducting operation but he never condems extremists who are not only brutually killing our soldiers and civilians alike but are bulldosing schools and other state institutions. He critise west alot (when he is not in west) he also needs to highlight his differences(if any) from Taliban style militants and their philosphies. He critise Americans in our region but he doesn’t critise Arabs there. He says war against terror is American war, may be but who is other party. Arab sheikhs are leading the other side. Since it is being fought in Pakistan, Pakistan has no choice but to pick one side. Imran (thanks to Qazi and co.) has picked extreme right and gov is being forced (bcaz of economic and political compulsions) to support American efforts. At this time it is as much as Pakistan’s war as it is of Americans and Arabs. Even though IK proclaims its not ours (to satisfy his extreme right well wishers) we are paying more price of it than both Arabs and Americans.
@Kashif
How many thousand Arabs we are hosting in that area? or Militants. Based on the figures I think they all should be killed till now.
If not do you think more are coming from outside? arabs coming from afghanistan? what is going on? shed a light please
It doesn’t matter they are in thousands or hundreds whatever their number is they are leading this effort both financially and politically. Leaders like OBL and Al Zehwari have political ambitions which are tied to their home lands in Arab pinseula and they are using our land to change political status quo in middle east. In the process they ruined Afghanistan and unfortunately Pakistan is under fire now. People like IK critise only one side (Americans) and don’t talk much about other (Arabs). Either they are dishonest or loyal to one side.
@Kashif
We are trapped in sh!t all around. Where do we start the correcting measures? You are right that we can criticize left, right, up and down, but would it be wise to create more enemies/opponents? Don’t we have enough hostile countries?
You are pointing towards lack of criticism of the Arabs. What about we also start criticizing the Chinese for their treatment of the Muslim minority? Where do we stop? We are not a superpower, which can deal with many opponents simultaneously.
In other words: I agree with you in principle, but for the sake of real politics we need to be careful not to create further opponents/enemies. We have enough of them already. That’s why we should concentrate on selected and most critical issues and not start “wars” in all directions.
@sitaraakhri.
Are you really suggesting that IK led the lawyers’ movement? If so, I suggest you brush up on your knowledge. IK tagged along. The lawyers’ movement came about as a result of dedicated top lawyers like Aitzaz Ahsan, Munir Malik, Ali Kurd, and so on—most of whom DO NOT support IK politically. How convenient for you to point out all of IK’s successes but none of his failures. Yes, he was successful in cricket; yes, he is successful with Shaukat Khanam (though it is certainly not the best hospital in Asia–again a bit of honesty would do you good). But politically, he has been a failure. In 1997, even a political novice should have known that if he wanted to win, he should have chosen one constituency, but he contested from nine and lost from all!
His political allies were people like Hamid Gul who have landed Pakistan in this terrorism mess. In 2002, he supported Musharraf. Some even say the military orchestrated his victory (though I personally do not buy that). But his voting record is not good–he voted for Fazlur Rehman as PM; voted against the women protection bill, and so on.
I love ur idocracy. U should try and go back to elementary school where they will read u a small story and tell u wat the main idea is because ur very slow on dat. its very hard for ur weak intellectuals to pick up the headline.. No where did i say dat IK started the movement. since u wanna spin around and dont wanna approve my challenge. LEts make it very simple for ur ignorant slow brain. I challenge u to prove to me dat any other politican before 1997(PTI’s Inception) pointed out that the main problem of this company is Judiciary. Imran Khan and PTI was the first leader and party to say Independent Judiciary was the answer to all problems in Pakistan. Put ur money where ur mouth is and stop spinning around the circle and prove me wrong.
second paragraph is a response. srry.
@ Shirukh
I think you misunderstood my point. I am not absolving the PPP of any of its responsibility. You ask: Isn’t it the duty of the government to ensure the right people are appointed? My answer: Of course it is.
You ask: Isn’t it the duty of the government to kick out criminals? My answer: Of course it is.
You ask: Isn’t it the governments duty to ensure law and order? My answer: of course it is again.
The point is not that I think the PPP should be forgiven on any of this. The point is that I think the PPP must be taken to task on it. And who will take it to task? In a democracy, it is the job of the opposition. But the opposition is completely silent on issues of abuse of women’s rights and even on the appointments of Zehri and Bajrani. The only outrage came from women’s and human rights groups. Why is the opposition silent? In my view, because they couldn’t care less about abuse of women’s rights. The Afia Siddiqui case is highlighted by NS and IK (as it should be) but when it comes to the Baluch women or Tasleema Solangi, etc.—not a peep! Why? Just because the perpetrators aren’t American.
I think Kashif is quite right in that Arab sheikhdoms are responsible for a lot of human rights abuses on Pakistanis but nobody brings them up. Is it ok to be weak if the perpetrator is a Muslim and only show outrage when you are victimised by the west?
I will write to Kashif shortly and pejamistri shortly, when I have more time.
I am glad we are on same as far as identifying the problem. There are not many in Pakistan who thinks Arabs as problem at all. They blame Americans for everything and I think by doing this they are ignoring half of the root cause. I am not saying to criticise Arabs for lack of democracies or Indians or chinese for mistreating minorities. We are no one to identify problems accross the globe. But now that our house is on fire we should criticise Arabs for launching their political battles on our soil using their ptero-dollars and our blood. I don’t agree with your remain silent argument for political expediency. We can’t come out of this crisis unless public perception is changed. Our leadership on right and left should identify major players (Americans and Arabs) at their stakes. IK says the only solution is to pull our troops back and talk to militants, I think by doing this he is clearly siding with religious right. First of all it will never happen, if it does we will be in bigger mess like Afghanistan was after Russians. IK says we were not in this mess prior to 911 he is wrong. The mess started when Rusians attacked Afghanistan three decades ago. Americans exploited our religious sentiments against Russians and now Arabs are doing same against Americans. How long we sustain being puppits of external powers?
The first phase of this war (between Russia and America) was fought in main land Afghanistan and look at it now. Unfortuately the second phase (between Americans and Arabs) is being fought in main land Pakistan. I am afraid we won’t be much different by the time it will be over unless we are able to push both Americans and Arabs out to fight their wars else where on the globe.
All that say Imran Khan popularity is going no where. Here are the facts.
15 days campaign in Lahore- 150,000 members joined
15 days in rawalpindi- 58,000 members
8 days in Peshwar- 57,625 Members.
MNA of PPP Syed Manzoor Hussain joins PTI
Analyst Dr. Shireen Mazari joins PTI
Ejaz ul Haq rejected in the party
Tehreek e Insaf is the most popular party website in Pakistan.
17,378 members and counting.
For all those idiots that love PPP and MQM and PML-N if they were great parties they have ruled twice and thrice. Any organized and strong party can fix a country in two terms.
I have a question for all the IK haters.
Zardari 2nd richest man in Pakistan. WHy cant he make hospitals and start projects like Sasta Tandoor for poor people like Imran Khan. Nawaz Sharif 4th richest. How much money have he spent for Pakistan.
IK haters are enemines of pakistan.
http://daily.urdupoint.com/article-2603.html
@Sitaraakhri
In principle I agree with you, but don’t you think that you are asking for too much in short span of time? Please see my reply to @Kashif.
“I will write to Kashif shortly and pejamistri shortly, when I have more time.”
Eeeehhh…..maybe you should to contact the Mistri Peja. He is just upside down at the moment
@ImranKhanforpm,
You are just another brainwashed kid reading ISI sponsored Ahmed Qureshi’s emails mentioning NS and AZ as 2nd and 4th richest persons of Pakistan? Just open your eyes and you will find who are the real richest persons are.
About 2 terms thing, the water you have in taps, the little electricity you have in your house sockets and the gas running in your stove were the projects contributed during little 2 years governments of PPP and PMLN. The world class motorway, the airports of Lahore and Karachi, the port of Gawadar, the Honorable Nuclear state and foundation of modern basic infrastructure of country was laid down by PMLN and PPP. This is something you fan club guys just can’t understand.
Secondly, it is PURE STUPIDITY to think that someone failed within who did not complete even half of his term. Just like your teacher kick you out of class in 3rd month saying you failed the final exams which are 9 months ahead.
Now about the number of registrations, lets do a bet.
Tell me the NA and PA constituencies where PTI will win? Just tell me a few? If PTI win from there, I will give you $500 per constituency.
PMLN and PPP have got more than 150,000 votes each in many constituencies. Lahore has may more than 10 NA seats and even 500,000 combined votes for PTI from Lahore = 0 in opposed to PMLN. Outside urban areas, no one knows PTI.
@Kashi
“There are not many in Pakistan who thinks Arabs as problem at all. They blame Americans for everything and I think by doing this they are ignoring half of the root cause.”
I don’t think we should criticize anyone right now unless it is an urgent issue like f. ex. the genocide against the poor Palestinians. We should get order in our house first and after consolidating Pakistan we can think differently. In other words we have to PRIORITIZE our tasks! We MUST take one step at a time.
Arabs and The West:
We should have cordial relations with as many nations as possible, but we must not forget that our natural allies are Muslim countries (generally speaking). I know the Arabs are even a shadow of former glory, but still we share our values with them.
We should be cautious about to criticism on each and every issue. Arabs fighting in Pakistan are not sent by the governments of the Arab countries. They are even more scared from these Arab fighters than us. You must have noticed what happened in Algeria after the Afghan Jihad. Some of the Arab fighters went home and were engaged in a bloody fight with their own rulers. That is exactly what every Arab government fears. Thus they will never willingly send Arab fighters to Pakistan., so who will you complain to? It will be a India-like-complain (Mumbai attacks).
On the other hand we MUST be cautious regarding especially the western countries (EU+US+Israel). They are our traditional opponents. If you have lived in any of these countries you will now that they feel likewise though they don’t always say it openly. And once again that doesn’t mean that we shouldn’t try to build bridges between them and us. I am for peace, but if somebody wants trouble then we should always be ready to defend ourselves. That’s why we should start rebuilding ourselves!
Sorry…The above post is for @Kashif
@ pejamistri
Your point is well taken regarding the complexity and the necessity of the rural vote. But whether all parties rule from the centre is debatable. I think unfortunately, there is a tendency for every government that comes to power in Pakistan to swing right, regardless of whether it campaigns as a leftist or a rightist party–such is the power of the beardos as TK would say.
I don’t know if you recall, but in NS’s second term there was a Shariat bill awaiting confirmation just before Mush took over in 1999. Bhutto, who drank himself, outlawed alcohol and declared Ahmedis non-Muslim. Unfortunately, all segments left or right try to appease the beardos but the appeasement is a lot more potent when it comes to the parties preaching rightist rhetoric–and this is perhaps the most relevant when it comes to women’s issues. That is why it is so scary to hear the rightist rhetoric in the opposition, because I don’t think governance is from the centre. I think governance swings right in Pakistan in all cases. Both economically (post 1977) and in all other cases (even before 77).
As for NS and the rural vote, I don’t think NS has such a big issue there. In 1997, he got a two-thirds majority–that is impossible without carrying the rural vote. Rural Punjab is already with him. In 97, he was able to take the rural southern punjab out of the ppp fold. He can do this again if elections were held soon. I predict he will also gain in nwfp and baluchistan. In fact, the same IRI poll, that I referred to earlier, had him leading in the frontier ahead of ppp and anp now and just two points behind ppp in baluchistan. The only place where he cannot make inroads is sindh–he will have to rule without sindh, if elected.
@ kashif
I agree with much of what you say. But I don’t know if you have ever had the opportunity to meet IK and talk to him. Having done that, I am convinced that he will never come out on the side of the left, nor will he ever leave the shadow of the Jamaat, etc. I think that is in many ways where his heart is (playboy background notwithstanding). I agree with you that that is what he needs to do to distinguish himself, but that is not how he thinks, so I won’t hold my breath for it. And this is evident also from your very correct analysis on his take on the militant issue–he criticizes America for good reason–I am with him on that–but he will always stop short of criticizing the groups like TTP and the Fazlulahs of the world who want the nifaz of some crazy shariat–even if those groups hurt Pakistan, IK will never speak out against them. And that is where I have a huge issue with them.
@ ImranKhanforPM
I am going to ignore your childish accusations and get straight to the point regarding your “challenge”—I agree that IK always emphasized the judiciary in his early days. IK, in my view, is more of a political analyst than a political activist. When he is on tv, he presents analyses, but had the lawyers not come forth on 9 March and supported CJ Iftikhar, it would not have occurred to IK to chanelize this into a movement the way Aitzaz and co managed to do, and then it dawned on IK to follow them. IK had stopped talking about the judiciary in fact circa 2002–when he entered Parliament. He stressed the judiciary between 97 and 02. After 2002, his main complaint had been siding with the Americans on the war on terror. In that, when asked he also defended jirga decisions and said he thought that was a good enough system of justice. So, he is a very conflicted man. On the one hand, he talks about the importance of the judiciary. On the other hand, if a jirga decides something completely out of tune with the laws of Pakistan or groups in Swat call for doing away with Pakistani laws in favour of some weird concoction of sharia, IK has no problem. That is why he doesn’t have support among the legal intelligentsia–he does not know where he stands on most of these issues, or is too afraid to say. That is what a lot of people have pointed out on this forum already.
@ ImranKhanforPM
You say: IK haters are enemines of pakistan.
I guess by that definition, Abdus Sattar Edhi is also an enemy of Pakistan. FYI, way back when IK started politics, he tried to get Edhi to join him. Edhi kept refusing (not because he is not interested in politics–he has contested elections twice–won once and lost once–but he did not want to be a part of PTI)–Imran got rough with Edhi and Edhi filed a complaint against him–this happened back in the late nineties.
So get out of your myopia!
@ Shirukh,
What does a short or long span of time have to do with this?? I have seen your response to Kashif, but I am with Kashif on this one.
And reading more from you, I don’t think anybody is saying that we should fight with other nations, or that we don’t share a religion with the Arabs–we do, but Saudi Arabai, for instance played a notoriously bad role in Pakistan by funding various jihadi groups, who as Kashif says, are using our soil. They have done the same thing in Palestine by supporting Fatah and in other parts of the Islamic world as well. By acknowledging these problems and addressing them intelligently, we are in no danger of losing friends in the arab world, in fact, we may even make some. Our policy of appeasing the rich gulf arabs and not bothering with the culturally rich and far more populous arabs of the levant and north africa is not something to be proud of.
@sitaraakhri
Two points ..
1.
To me it is center-right or center-left governance… NS might have got shariat bill approved (I personally think it was pretty difficult), but even if shariat bill had approved in NS era it would have been more a political stunt to appease the right wing voters…
Bhutto banning alcohol was more like an appeasement of voters than in reality anything to do with his religious convictions… once I heard the argument :
So in my opinion I don’t think there could ever be complete right wing rule in Pakistan… it will always be center-right or center-left…
2.
That’s right , after PPP, it was only NS who could swing rural voters in his favor, from R.Y. Khan , Bhawalpur to Rajunpur I know that there are several rural villagers which know NS more than the feudal lord… NS did manage to win the trust … IK has to do that.
@sitaraakhri,
Regarding your comments … “IK stressed the judiciary between 97 and 02″.
Let me remind everyone Kartoot of Imran Khan in 1999 and 2000.
In 1999, IK supported a mad dictator who axed all democratic system and kidnapped hundreds of elected public representatives.
In 2000 during Zafar Ali Shah case, SOB Musharraf sent a junior Army Kutta to house arrest Chief Justice Saeed uzzam Siddiqui and also fired other 17 superior judges including Justice Wajiuddin Ahmed at first PCO. All this was done while Imran Khan, the judicial champion was supporting SOB Musharraf.
@rasheed
Let me tell you, it is quite possible that if Kiyani or any other person again overthrows the current government and sends a colonel to house arrest Justice Sardar Raza (not Hamid DoGar) , IK might again support the new general for sometime…
But do answer me this…
What if IK takes a majority and somehow gets 2/3rd majority in the elections … wouldn’t he stand against the army??
My answer is yes… look at the history.
On the other hand current actions of IK are to go along with the mode of urban population (BTW another dimension has been added to this “urban sentiment” and it is the TV talk shows, naturally these talk shows are more right tilted) … however I am sure he is quite capable of dumping Jamaat-Islami when required.
These tv talk shows being right wing inclined have a new dimension to politics of Pakistan. Remember in the mad dictator’s era these talk show were not capable of helping one party (wing) or the other. As at that time they were solely focused against the dictatorship… however after the mad dictator’s era , the right-tilted talk shows are capable of making a complex impact on the politics of Pakistan… on one hand they may make the leaders (like IK) more rigid in their rightist stance , likewise they may also impact the rural population voters.
Good aspect is that they may perhaps impact the urban population and make them more “enlightened”…. watch for people like Shahid Masood, Mazhar Abbas, Hamid Mir and several others….
@Shirkuh
When I say Arabs I don’t mean their governments. The Arab militants in NWFP and Afghanistam are those who are against their governments. They have a political mission to over throw pro-west regimes in Arab world. They are working towards this mission by launching a war against west. I don’t judge them they can do what ever they want but why are they doing it from Pakistan? This is because we being a muslim nation don’t stand against Arabs as long as they are fighting against Americans. This is wrong they can do what ever they want as long as they don’t do it from Pakistan. And since they are doing it from Pakistan we are the biggest victim of this war between west and non-state Arabs. It is our war we ought to own it to win it. Right wing leaders like IK should stop right wing propoganda that it is not our war.
Rasheed
I think you are babbling with nothing substantial at all.
When Musharraf came in 1999, everyone supported and welcomed with open arms. All parties supported him including PPP and PML (PML so much so that they half of them dumped Nawaz and created another group), JI, MQM, ANP and you name it. Poeple openly distributed sweets and prayed thankful nafals. Human rights champion Asma Jahangir supported him too. So it should not come as surprise that IK went along too. But he is the only politician who have openly accepted his mistake and moved on.
Regarding PPP and PML governments, God knows they were utterly incompetent, inefficient and corrupt. PPP ruling fourth time and PML ruled twice already, if any good were ever to come out of these parties or if they had any revolutionary agenda whatsoever, dont you think it would have been applied by now? Just how many times you need to be kicked before you wake up.
@Sitarakari
“What does a short or long span of time have to do with this??”
I think I was pretty clear on this issue. Maybe I need to elaborate further ..
It is strange that you don’t understand that we cannot take on the whole world right now. I have already stated that in principle @Kashif is right, but we have to look at the ground realities right now. We are drowning in sh!t and cannot afford to make more opponents/enemies. That is exactly what will happen if we start criticizing everybody. Right now we need to make as many friends as possible, but at the same time we need to get rid of the most threatening issues like the drones attacks, unrest in NWFP, tensions with India, the energy crisis, the judiciary crisis etc.. Don’t you see we have both hands full of sh!t? And still you ask for more trouble? When we have order in OUR house we can put pressure on others to perform, but we better perform first
“but Saudi Arabai, for instance played a notoriously bad role in Pakistan by funding various jihadi groups, who as Kashif says, are using our soil.”
Yes in that era the Saudis played a significant role, but remember it was all due to our own incompetent leadership. I also think that the Saudis regretted that support, because it backfired in their own country too, but there is no doubt that Pakistan suffered most. We shouldn’t have made our soil as battle ground during the Zia regime like it happened. IMO measures should have been taken to counter the Russian/Indian moves from Afghanistan, but not the way our army managed it. We got weapons and drugs all over Pakistan, because of the short sighted “solutions” of the GHQ and the following leadership or rather leadersh!t. If anybody is to be blamed for the policies of that era then it is foremost the Zia regime including political allies like PML. Wasn’t NS the “child” of Zia?
“They have done the same thing in Palestine by supporting Fatah and in other parts of the Islamic world as well.”
Are you saying that it is the governments of the Arab countries who support the present foreign fighters in Pakistan?
@pejamistri,
I fully agree with you. But I am not going to take a chance with IK or ABCD who even slightly thinks about supporting any General against civilian for the sake of “Good Democracy” later.
The only way forward I believe is that every political party should educate its followers that all civilians should come out and stay on streets until the general goes back where he belongs. We can sort out all other problems with passage of time.
@ashahid,
You are talking about fairy tales and you have no solution. As I said above, just give me list of few National and Provincial constituencies from where PTI will win and I will give you $500 for each seat won.
Talking about previous government, if army had let the civilian government control just the “Budget” of Pakistan, you would see the same governments would have changed the face of Pakistan. Can you tell me if Army is eating 50-60% of resources of country, can IK to stop that budget when he comes with even 2/3rd mandate without getting hanged by an army general? Even today during civilian government, the licenses of TV channels have to be approved by army before civilian government can issue that.
@rasheed
Q. Do you know why do politicians (the real ones) may fall in dictatorships trap?
A. Just like the “urban educated” population falls in the same trap…
Now I am not sure whether leaders should teach the public or public should teach the leaders to come out on street when a general comes…. however what I am sure is that the both (public and leaders) are learning at the same pace…
I agree with your point that until and unless people come out on street as soon as a General comes in our problems are not going to be solved…
Remember 2000, there was a hope in the beginning when people of Lahore started a struggle against the mad dictator in his early era (however unfortunately it vanished into thin air)… but later on for whole 5 years there was “chain hee chain” in his rule … Compare it to any democratic rule in Pakistan … how early unrest starts …
Rasheed
What fairy tales are you referring to? Political parties supported Musharraf initially or the failure of their governments?
The only way to put army to its place is by riding on people support. The only way to cut that budget is to cut the non-development expenses of governments and then asking the army to sacrifice in greater good of the poeple. You cant expect army to cut down if you take 250 of your friends on Umrah and hold cabinet meetings in Dubai. The only way to reduce army influence is to restor Judiciary and let the cheif of army staff appear before IMC to answer for missing people.
My point is start with yourself and Army and other institution will follow suit. It is the very credibility of the civilian leaders which gives Army the courage to stand on its legs.
Let me ask you a hypothetical question, If Iftikhar Chaudhary is restored and he calls Kiyani to appear in court, do you think he will refuse?
@Kashif
” When I say Arabs I don’t mean their governments. The Arab militants in NWFP and Afghanistam are those who are against their governments. They have a political mission to over throw pro-west regimes in Arab world. They are working towards this mission by launching a war against west. I don’t judge them they can do what ever they want but why are they doing it from Pakistan? This is because we being a muslim nation don’t stand against Arabs as long as they are fighting against Americans. This is wrong they can do what ever they want as long as they don’t do it from Pakistan. And since they are doing it from Pakistan we are the biggest victim of this war between west and non-state Arabs. It is our war we ought to own it to win it.”
Thanks for your clarification. We have no differences on the above description
“Right wing leaders like IK should stop right wing propoganda that it is not our war.”
BUT, here we disagree. The case is that PTI’s view is that the way the war is fought right now is NOT OUR war. The drone attacks on arbitrary targets, killing of innocent tribesmen and subsequent suicide bombings etc. All that is NOT OUR war! We need to ensure that the Americans stop attacking anybody inside Pakistan, and we need make peace with the overwhelming majority of the Pakistan loving tribesmen. We need to continue the Jirga system, but this should only be temporary solution. The long term solution should be to implement the law of the land all over Pakistan!
Then what is our war? Our war is against the very few criminals/collaborators/foreign elements creating unrest and trouble for Pakistan. As earlier mentioned we need to make peace with vast majority of the tribesmen and thus isolate and eliminate the threat from the disruptive elements.
@ashahid
People sometimes have selective memory and thus they remember faults of certain politicians and “forget” that NS was the “child” of dictator
@rasheed
How true… but let me tell you I had the same ideas about NS in 1999 (Nobody can claim to be in Military’s good book than NS during 90’s) … but you see with a 2/3rd mandate how he was able to snub two army generals one after the other and did not bow to them….. I think IK is quite capable of doing the same.
BTW Tell me this how many parties are going to compete for the right wing vote , NS, IK and religious parties ? or would they be getting together against PPP/ANP?
Because army is more corrupt than you and your friends… if you can take 250 of your friends for Umrah , army will buy ranches in Texas and California for 250 general/brigadiers/colonels of the army…. if you throw away your opponents in jail, army will bomb their opponents (Bugti eh?)…
So you want a match between army and politicians … go and bring the most corrupt of your politicians and army will defeat them
@ashahid
… If not then accept my apologies…
Do let me know if you belong to “verbal diarrhea (Zaid Hamid)” camp… I will put you in my ban list
@Rasheed & Peja
I think you guys are just being paranoid, projecting Army in such terms. Yes, there have been few rogue Generals but all in all Pak army is still the most patriot force in the country.
Going by your arguments, one can easily create same logics about USA role in Pakistan i.e. Always supporting dictators, funding them to the teeth, forcing its own ideas about terrorism, Jihad, enlightment on Pakistan, threatening Pakistan whenever necessary. So one can easily ceate questions like what IK or any other leader going to do as USA is too powerful. You cannot claim missing people, you cannot pull out of War on Terror which is basically destruction of Pakistan economically, militarily, politically and eventually geographically. So my friends it is very easy to throw all your problems on a non political force or to an outsider and keep moaning about it.
Failure of Democracy in Pakistan is down to the failure of so called democratic leaders, plain and simple!!!
@ashahid,
The fairy tale I am referring to is that people assuming someone like IK can come to power.
Even stupid MQM, JUI, JI, ANP, has deeper roots in constituency politics than IK. There is no PTI party member that anyone knows of other than IK himself, and local voters hardly vote to someone who they have never of. Tell me what can IK do even if miraculously wins 10, 20 or even 30 seats? That will become a prostitute party like MQM and JUI, who join whoever gets more seats. If they stay alone, they have no powers for legislation and will be banging desks for 5 years.
Now calling PPP and PMLN stupid etc etc is not going to change anything as they are not going anywhere, rather time has proven they come back after dictatorship even stronger. The rotten eggs from these big parties will be filtered with passage of time through public accountability in case impatient kids like you let it run and don’t cheer when unconstitutional things happen.
@pejamistri,
You are right, I wasted time with wrong guy.
@pejamistri,
I don’t know much about right or left thing, as my background is quite weak. Are the right supposed to be more religious and left more secular?
What I know is that last year, Qazi met NS and asked for some seat adjustments. On refusal of NS, Qazi stayed in the boycott camp.
@Peja
It is a good point you raised about corruption in army, that’s exactly I wanted to bring in discussion next. Can you please answer the following question for me?
1. According to Rasheed and I have read your posts in past as well that 60% of Pakistan budget goes to army and the rest 40% for the other areas. Assuming that’s true, I can list down the improvements in army arsenel from 60 years ago to now and no one can deny we have got nuclear bombs, mesilies, submarines, fighter planes and god knows what else using the above 60 percent. My question is can you point me to any visible improvements in education, health, development etc, bring about using the rest of 40%?????
My point is have politicians made optimal use of their 40% to want to get more share. As far as I am concerned this lion share of the budget just goes down the drain without making any effect on Pakistan or ends up in foreign bank accounts.
Man, how do you want me to tighten my belt if you with your share are making merry, ceating examples of corruption never seen or heard before? When it comes to sacrifice the rule is leader starts with himself.
Lastly, I am no group, I am just a concerned Pakistani.
@Rasheed
I think you are writing IK off a little too early. There are enough examples in the history to make this statement, Not least of that is the rise of Muslim League in Pakistan movement. ML won only one seat in 1930s, prompting Gandhi to challenge Jinnah to prove his representation of Muslim community and what a befitting reply he gave in 1940s. Then Butto started off with no party or constituency and proved himself. Mahatir Muhammad took nearly two decades to succeed.
Regarding your point about filtering down of bad people in these two parties, actually the process is exactly the opposite. Look at PPP, can you name even a single good person in the party now? And PMLN is already on the verge of accepting Lotas of PMLQ, just wait and see. They are going from bad to worse.
I think Peja just ran away, without answering.
Shiruk,
Sorry for being late though i think not much is needed to reply as thanks to Kashif he has been answering all you queries.
And after all of that discussion i did not think you would again tell us that innocents are being killed by americans.
The only good thing about drone attacks by America is that not a single hit has killed an innocent. Keep going back and you will find militants killed in each and every attack and the attacks are getting better and better in precision. The last few attacks have hit the vehicles carrying militants. Alqaeda’s top militants have been hit by american drones constantly.
Regarding those 70 children killed, yes i don’t know what they had been doing in the past but i have no doubt over what they would have been doing right now. Majority of the suicide blasts are done by teenagers. What do you think were those kids doing in that madrassa ? They were recieving military training in that madrassa and pictures of them training in that madrassa were all over the media immediately after the attack. I am sorry for them and consider our army, the mulvis, and bastards arabs for that.
I don’t think you did not know all this but since you like imran has your head in the sand (intentionally or unintentionally), therefore we have our duty to keep you reminding you the truth which is quite irritating.
What do you think will be the reaction of people of Swat if that drone hits fazlullah tomorrow ? ? ? ? ?
@Shirkuh
So accoding to you PTI does not oppose war against extremists it is only against mechanism the way it is conducted. PTI and right wingers want two things:
1. Push Americans out of the region
2. Want to talk to militants
Great goals but please tell me how can we achieve them. Americans won’t leave the region until militants agree that they won’t attack Americans and militants won’t commit that until they have the capibility to attack them in other words until they are destroyed. Pakistan doesn’t have political or military resources to convince either side. We have no choice but to fight against militants or Americans. I am sure who ever comes in power will pick the former. We simply don’t have military and economic resources to fight against west and remaining neautral is not an option to begin with.
@ashahid
::smiling:: Did you answer my question?
But I know the answer , you know I am very quick in (mis)judging … so just chill out here…
@rasheed & peja
The onez whos MENTORS are ayub zia & mush won’t give the share to poor people in power.
Which percentage of poor are in parliament? just collect the data from whatever resources & paste over here. much appreciated!!!
@Kashif
“So accoding to you PTI does not oppose war against extremists it is only against mechanism the way it is conducted. PTI and right wingers want two things:
1. Push Americans out of the region
2. Want to talk to militants
I don’t care about right or left wing tags
Btw: These tags are slowly being diminished in those countries, where they were invented or at least used extensively.
“Great goals but please tell me how can we achieve them. Americans won’t leave the region until militants agree that they won’t attack Americans and militants won’t commit that until they have the capibility to attack them in other words until they are destroyed. Pakistan doesn’t have political or military resources to convince either side. We have no choice but to fight against militants or Americans. I am sure who ever comes in power will pick the former. We simply don’t have military and economic resources to fight against west and remaining neautral is not an option to begin with.”
That is exactly my opinion – as a starting point i.e. we should not fight against the Allied gang, BUT at the same time we cannot continue remaining neutral.
I think I already had me clear. Please also be aware that I am not any office holder in PTI, so I can only speak for myself
- We have to convey a serious message to the Americans and not the usual double talks i.e. one message for the Americans and another for the people of Pakistan.
- If the Americans don’t stop their attacks, we need to stop the supply lines through our country as the first step.
- National as well as international pressure on EU/US. Use all diplomatic means!
- We should strengthen our alliance with all possible friendly nations. We MUST especially improve our ties with China and Iran and maybe also with Russia since the latter is slowly loosing its old ally India to the US.
- If the above steps don’t help, then we should shoot down any drones over Pakistani territory! I don’t think step three would be necessary. When they know our intentions i.e. we mean business then they will not risk opening yet another front after Iraq, Afghanistan.
- We should be more careful about inflicting human loss, but it can be necessary if they step inside our country repeatedly.
I would prefer to go down bravely instead of a slow death like Saddam Hussain and Iraq got. You must remember how the Americans successfully disarmed and weakened Iraq before they went in. The Americans used all the tricks to make their job easier and that is exactly what is going on regarding Pakistan. Maybe they would have done it even if they didn’t weaken and disarmed Iraq, but then they at least would have met a little more resistance. We should NOT think we can hide the head in a ostrich like way to avoid the dangers.
So that does solves the problem. You have got america as your enemy, we have got militants as our enemy in FATA and NWFP. You wan’t to stop drone attacks we want the drone attacks to remove the terror infrastructure that has ruined our society. You have your strategic objectives in which these militants are helping you and that is to throw out america from the region, but we don’t want to burn our houses for YOUR strategic objectives. I think if PTI is sincere enough, then Imran khan should open a Militants Welfare Colony in Islamabad and take away you strategic allies to Islamabad alongwith those thousands of training camps. We don’t want your arab/chechen/uzbek allies alongwith the homegrown militants OUT of our lands. Accept them and have them in your houses.
Lets be realistic if we have extremists in our region who are plotting attacks against west how long can we stop west not to take action against those. Americans have respected our soverignty thats why they didn’t chase militants within our borders. Drone attacks are bad but in the bid picture they are nothing. They basically target some militants that our military is targeting as well. Drone attacks are wrong but so are the militants in tribal region. I think former is lesser of the evil. The guys running our President, PM, COAS na dother important offices are approved by white house and Pentagon. Our war strategies are devised by them. So I don’t know why drone attacks flips you out. Your claim that you ‘d rather die soon than finish gradually is emotional. As a statesman you ‘d never explore extinction route. Look at our economy, unemoployment is on sharp rise, we are in a very serious energy crisis, we are going thru a war against militants. We just simply can not afford to flip the direction of that war against Americans. I know right wing is dying to see that but it is simply not an option. It ‘d be much much bigger chaos and a recipe of total destruction.
we them want OUT OF OUR LAND …….mistake
@Utmankhel1
Great timing….not only our thought process are in sync, our clocks too
Utmankhel1 Says:
January 7th, 2009 at 2:21 pm
Kashif Says:
January 7th, 2009 at 2:21 pm
Kashif,
Hmm ….. observation ……….
Thanks for being here …… seesm it’s a long journey …….. won’t work without companions …
What can I say else than you people have a slave mentality
Shiruk,
It’s absolute independence.
Currently people of NWFP FATA are hostages of Talibans whose Control Room is in GHQ and GHQ is run by Dollars.
They don’t want to be ruined in the double games played by GHQ.
It’s like hostages of slaves of slaves ……. very complex ……… why not make it simple ….
From Swat with no love ..
http://thenews.com.pk/daily_detail.asp?id=156098
Can anybody give me the phone number of Imran ………. i want to pay my GRATITUDES to him …………
British made us slaves 200 years ago and Arabs 1400 years ago…
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