THE WHITE HOUSE
Office of the Press Secretary
(Cairo,Egypt)
________________________________________________
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE June 4, 2009
REMARKS BY THE PRESIDENT
ON A NEW BEGINNING
Cairo University
Cairo, Egypt
1:10 P.M. (Local)
PRESIDENT OBAMA: Thank you very much. Good afternoon. I am honored to be in the timeless city of Cairo, and to be hosted by two remarkable institutions. For over a thousand years, Al-Azhar has stood as a beacon of Islamic learning; and for over a century, Cairo University has been a source of Egypt’s advancement. And together, you represent the harmony between tradition and progress. I’m grateful for your hospitality, and the hospitality of the people of Egypt. And I’m also proud to carry with me the goodwill of the American people, and a greeting of peace from Muslim communities in my country: Assalaamu alaykum. (Applause.)
We meet at a time of great tension between the United States and Muslims around the world — tension rooted in historical forces that go beyond any current policy debate. The relationship between Islam and the West includes centuries of coexistence and cooperation, but also conflict and religious wars. More recently, tension has been fed by colonialism that denied rights and opportunities to many Muslims, and a Cold War in which Muslim-majority countries were too often treated as proxies without regard to their own aspirations. Moreover, the sweeping change brought by modernity and globalization led many Muslims to view the West as hostile to the traditions of Islam.
Violent extremists have exploited these tensions in a small but potent minority of Muslims. The attacks of September 11, 2001 and the continued efforts of these extremists to engage in violence against civilians has led some in my country to view Islam as inevitably hostile not only to America and Western countries, but also to human rights. All this has bred more fear and more mistrust.
So long as our relationship is defined by our differences, we will empower those who sow hatred rather than peace, those who promote conflict rather than the cooperation that can help all of our people achieve justice and prosperity. And this cycle of suspicion and discord must end.
I’ve come here to Cairo to seek a new beginning between the United States and Muslims around the world, one based on mutual interest and mutual respect, and one based upon the truth that America and Islam are not exclusive and need not be in competition. Instead, they overlap, and share common principles — principles of justice and progress; tolerance and the dignity of all human beings.
I do so recognizing that change cannot happen overnight. I know there’s been a lot of publicity about this speech, but no single speech can eradicate years of mistrust, nor can I answer in the time that I have this afternoon all the complex questions that brought us to this point. But I am convinced that in order to move forward, we must say openly to each other the things we hold in our hearts and that too often are said only behind closed doors. There must be a sustained effort to listen to each other; to learn from each other; to respect one another; and to seek common ground. As the Holy Koran tells us, “Be conscious of God and speak always the truth.” (Applause.) That is what I will try to do today — to speak the truth as best I can, humbled by the task before us, and firm in my belief that the interests we share as human beings are far more powerful than the forces that drive us apart.
Now part of this conviction is rooted in my own experience. I’m a Christian, but my father came from a Kenyan family that includes generations of Muslims. As a boy, I spent several years in Indonesia and heard the call of the azaan at the break of dawn and at the fall of dusk. As a young man, I worked in Chicago communities where many found dignity and peace in their Muslim faith.
As a student of history, I also know civilization’s debt to Islam. It was Islam — at places like Al-Azhar — that carried the light of learning through so many centuries, paving the way for Europe’s Renaissance and Enlightenment. It was innovation in Muslim communities — (applause) — it was innovation in Muslim communities that developed the order of algebra; our magnetic compass and tools of navigation; our mastery of pens and printing; our understanding of how disease spreads and how it can be healed. Islamic culture has given us majestic arches and soaring spires; timeless poetry and cherished music; elegant calligraphy and places of peaceful contemplation. And throughout history, Islam has demonstrated through words and deeds the possibilities of religious tolerance and racial equality. (Applause.)
I also know that Islam has always been a part of America’s story. The first nation to recognize my country was Morocco. In signing the Treaty of Tripoli in 1796, our second President, John Adams, wrote, “The United States has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion or tranquility of Muslims.” And since our founding, American Muslims have enriched the United States. They have fought in our wars, they have served in our government, they have stood for civil rights, they have started businesses, they have taught at our universities, they’ve excelled in our sports arenas, they’ve won Nobel Prizes, built our tallest building, and lit the Olympic Torch. And when the first Muslim American was recently elected to Congress, he took the oath to defend our Constitution using the same Holy Koran that one of our Founding Fathers — Thomas Jefferson — kept in his personal library. (Applause.)
So I have known Islam on three continents before coming to the region where it was first revealed. That experience guides my conviction that partnership between America and Islam must be based on what Islam is, not what it isn’t. And I consider it part of my responsibility as President of the United States to fight against negative stereotypes of Islam wherever they appear. (Applause.)
But that same principle must apply to Muslim perceptions of America. (Applause.) Just as Muslims do not fit a crude stereotype, America is not the crude stereotype of a self-interested empire. The United States has been one of the greatest sources of progress that the world has ever known. We were born out of revolution against an empire. We were founded upon the ideal that all are created equal, and we have shed blood and struggled for centuries to give meaning to those words — within our borders, and around the world. We are shaped by every culture, drawn from every end of the Earth, and dedicated to a simple concept: E pluribus unum — “Out of many, one.”
Now, much has been made of the fact that an African American with the name Barack Hussein Obama could be elected President. (Applause.) But my personal story is not so unique. The dream of opportunity for all people has not come true for everyone in America, but its promise exists for all who come to our shores — and that includes nearly 7 million American Muslims in our country today who, by the way, enjoy incomes and educational levels that are higher than the American average. (Applause.)
Moreover, freedom in America is indivisible from the freedom to practice one’s religion. That is why there is a mosque in every state in our union, and over 1,200 mosques within our borders. That’s why the United States government has gone to court to protect the right of women and girls to wear the hijab and to punish those who would deny it. (Applause.)
So let there be no doubt: Islam is a part of America. And I believe that America holds within her the truth that regardless of race, religion, or station in life, all of us share common aspirations — to live in peace and security; to get an education and to work with dignity; to love our families, our communities, and our God. These things we share. This is the hope of all humanity.
Of course, recognizing our common humanity is only the beginning of our task. Words alone cannot meet the needs of our people. These needs will be met only if we act boldly in the years ahead; and if we understand that the challenges we face are shared, and our failure to meet them will hurt us all.
For we have learned from recent experience that when a financial system weakens in one country, prosperity is hurt everywhere. When a new flu infects one human being, all are at risk. When one nation pursues a nuclear weapon, the risk of nuclear attack rises for all nations. When violent extremists operate in one stretch of mountains, people are endangered across an ocean. When innocents in Bosnia and Darfur are slaughtered, that is a stain on our collective conscience. (Applause.) That is what it means to share this world in the 21st century. That is the responsibility we have to one another as human beings.
And this is a difficult responsibility to embrace. For human history has often been a record of nations and tribes — and, yes, religions — subjugating one another in pursuit of their own interests. Yet in this new age, such attitudes are self-defeating. Given our interdependence, any world order that elevates one nation or group of people over another will inevitably fail. So whatever we think of the past, we must not be prisoners to it. Our problems must be dealt with through partnership; our progress must be shared. (Applause.)
Now, that does not mean we should ignore sources of tension. Indeed, it suggests the opposite: We must face these tensions squarely. And so in that spirit, let me speak as clearly and as plainly as I can about some specific issues that I believe we must finally confront together.
The first issue that we have to confront is violent extremism in all of its forms.
In Ankara, I made clear that America is not — and never will be — at war with Islam. (Applause.) We will, however, relentlessly confront violent extremists who pose a grave threat to our security — because we reject the same thing that people of all faiths reject: the killing of innocent men, women, and children. And it is my first duty as President to protect the American people.
The situation in Afghanistan demonstrates America’s goals, and our need to work together. Over seven years ago, the United States pursued al Qaeda and the Taliban with broad international support. We did not go by choice; we went because of necessity. I’m aware that there’s still some who would question or even justify the events of 9/11. But let us be clear: Al Qaeda killed nearly 3,000 people on that day. The victims were innocent men, women and children from America and many other nations who had done nothing to harm anybody. And yet al Qaeda chose to ruthlessly murder these people, claimed credit for the attack, and even now states their determination to kill on a massive scale. They have affiliates in many countries and are trying to expand their reach. These are not opinions to be debated; these are facts to be dealt with.
Now, make no mistake: We do not want to keep our troops in Afghanistan. We see no military — we seek no military bases there. It is agonizing for America to lose our young men and women. It is costly and politically difficult to continue this conflict. We would gladly bring every single one of our troops home if we could be confident that there were not violent extremists in Afghanistan and now Pakistan determined to kill as many Americans as they possibly can. But that is not yet the case.
And that’s why we’re partnering with a coalition of 46 countries. And despite the costs involved, America’s commitment will not weaken. Indeed, none of us should tolerate these extremists. They have killed in many countries. They have killed people of different faiths — but more than any other, they have killed Muslims. Their actions are irreconcilable with the rights of human beings, the progress of nations, and with Islam. The Holy Koran teaches that whoever kills an innocent is as — it is as if he has killed all mankind. (Applause.) And the Holy Koran also says whoever saves a person, it is as if he has saved all mankind. (Applause.) The enduring faith of over a billion people is so much bigger than the narrow hatred of a few. Islam is not part of the problem in combating violent extremism — it is an important part of promoting peace.
Now, we also know that military power alone is not going to solve the problems in Afghanistan and Pakistan. That’s why we plan to invest $1.5 billion each year over the next five years to partner with Pakistanis to build schools and hospitals, roads and businesses, and hundreds of millions to help those who’ve been displaced. That’s why we are providing more than $2.8 billion to help Afghans develop their economy and deliver services that people depend on.
Let me also address the issue of Iraq. Unlike Afghanistan, Iraq was a war of choice that provoked strong differences in my country and around the world. Although I believe that the Iraqi people are ultimately better off without the tyranny of Saddam Hussein, I also believe that events in Iraq have reminded America of the need to use diplomacy and build international consensus to resolve our problems whenever possible. (Applause.) Indeed, we can recall the words of Thomas Jefferson, who said: “I hope that our wisdom will grow with our power, and teach us that the less we use our power the greater it will be.”
Today, America has a dual responsibility: to help Iraq forge a better future — and to leave Iraq to Iraqis. And I have made it clear to the Iraqi people — (applause) — I have made it clear to the Iraqi people that we pursue no bases, and no claim on their territory or resources. Iraq’s sovereignty is its own. And that’s why I ordered the removal of our combat brigades by next August. That is why we will honor our agreement with Iraq’s democratically elected government to remove combat troops from Iraqi cities by July, and to remove all of our troops from Iraq by 2012. (Applause.) We will help Iraq train its security forces and develop its economy. But we will support a secure and united Iraq as a partner, and never as a patron.
And finally, just as America can never tolerate violence by extremists, we must never alter or forget our principles. Nine-eleven was an enormous trauma to our country. The fear and anger that it provoked was understandable, but in some cases, it led us to act contrary to our traditions and our ideals. We are taking concrete actions to change course. I have unequivocally prohibited the use of torture by the United States, and I have ordered the prison at Guantanamo Bay closed by early next year. (Applause.)
So America will defend itself, respectful of the sovereignty of nations and the rule of law. And we will do so in partnership with Muslim communities which are also threatened. The sooner the extremists are isolated and unwelcome in Muslim communities, the sooner we will all be safer.
The second major source of tension that we need to discuss is the situation between Israelis, Palestinians and the Arab world.
America’s strong bonds with Israel are well known. This bond is unbreakable. It is based upon cultural and historical ties, and the recognition that the aspiration for a Jewish homeland is rooted in a tragic history that cannot be denied.
Around the world, the Jewish people were persecuted for centuries, and anti-Semitism in Europe culminated in an unprecedented Holocaust. Tomorrow, I will visit Buchenwald, which was part of a network of camps where Jews were enslaved, tortured, shot and gassed to death by the Third Reich. Six million Jews were killed — more than the entire Jewish population of Israel today. Denying that fact is baseless, it is ignorant, and it is hateful. Threatening Israel with destruction — or repeating vile stereotypes about Jews — is deeply wrong, and only serves to evoke in the minds of Israelis this most painful of memories while preventing the peace that the people of this region deserve.
On the other hand, it is also undeniable that the Palestinian people — Muslims and Christians — have suffered in pursuit of a homeland. For more than 60 years they’ve endured the pain of dislocation. Many wait in refugee camps in the West Bank, Gaza, and neighboring lands for a life of peace and security that they have never been able to lead. They endure the daily humiliations — large and small — that come with occupation. So let there be no doubt: The situation for the Palestinian people is intolerable. And America will not turn our backs on the legitimate Palestinian aspiration for dignity, opportunity, and a state of their own. (Applause.)
For decades then, there has been a stalemate: two peoples with legitimate aspirations, each with a painful history that makes compromise elusive. It’s easy to point fingers — for Palestinians to point to the displacement brought about by Israel’s founding, and for Israelis to point to the constant hostility and attacks throughout its history from within its borders as well as beyond. But if we see this conflict only from one side or the other, then we will be blind to the truth: The only resolution is for the aspirations of both sides to be met through two states, where Israelis and Palestinians each live in peace and security. (Applause.)
That is in Israel’s interest, Palestine’s interest, America’s interest, and the world’s interest. And that is why I intend to personally pursue this outcome with all the patience and dedication that the task requires. (Applause.) The obligations — the obligations that the parties have agreed to under the road map are clear. For peace to come, it is time for them — and all of us — to live up to our responsibilities.
Palestinians must abandon violence. Resistance through violence and killing is wrong and it does not succeed. For centuries, black people in America suffered the lash of the whip as slaves and the humiliation of segregation. But it was not violence that won full and equal rights. It was a peaceful and determined insistence upon the ideals at the center of America’s founding. This same story can be told by people from South Africa to South Asia; from Eastern Europe to Indonesia. It’s a story with a simple truth: that violence is a dead end. It is a sign neither of courage nor power to shoot rockets at sleeping children, or to blow up old women on a bus. That’s not how moral authority is claimed; that’s how it is surrendered.
Now is the time for Palestinians to focus on what they can build. The Palestinian Authority must develop its capacity to govern, with institutions that serve the needs of its people. Hamas does have support among some Palestinians, but they also have to recognize they have responsibilities. To play a role in fulfilling Palestinian aspirations, to unify the Palestinian people, Hamas must put an end to violence, recognize past agreements, recognize Israel’s right to exist.
At the same time, Israelis must acknowledge that just as Israel’s right to exist cannot be denied, neither can Palestine’s. The United States does not accept the legitimacy of continued Israeli settlements. (Applause.) This construction violates previous agreements and undermines efforts to achieve peace. It is time for these settlements to stop. (Applause.)
And Israel must also live up to its obligation to ensure that Palestinians can live and work and develop their society. Just as it devastates Palestinian families, the continuing humanitarian crisis in Gaza does not serve Israel’s security; neither does the continuing lack of opportunity in the West Bank. Progress in the daily lives of the Palestinian people must be a critical part of a road to peace, and Israel must take concrete steps to enable such progress.
And finally, the Arab states must recognize that the Arab Peace Initiative was an important beginning, but not the end of their responsibilities. The Arab-Israeli conflict should no longer be used to distract the people of Arab nations from other problems. Instead, it must be a cause for action to help the Palestinian people develop the institutions that will sustain their state, to recognize Israel’s legitimacy, and to choose progress over a self-defeating focus on the past.
America will align our policies with those who pursue peace, and we will say in public what we say in private to Israelis and Palestinians and Arabs. (Applause.) We cannot impose peace. But privately, many Muslims recognize that Israel will not go away. Likewise, many Israelis recognize the need for a Palestinian state. It is time for us to act on what everyone knows to be true.
Too many tears have been shed. Too much blood has been shed. All of us have a responsibility to work for the day when the mothers of Israelis and Palestinians can see their children grow up without fear; when the Holy Land of the three great faiths is the place of peace that God intended it to be; when Jerusalem is a secure and lasting home for Jews and Christians and Muslims, and a place for all of the children of Abraham to mingle peacefully together as in the story of Isra — (applause) — as in the story of Isra, when Moses, Jesus, and Mohammed, peace be upon them, joined in prayer. (Applause.)
The third source of tension is our shared interest in the rights and responsibilities of nations on nuclear weapons.
This issue has been a source of tension between the United States and the Islamic Republic of Iran. For many years, Iran has defined itself in part by its opposition to my country, and there is in fact a tumultuous history between us. In the middle of the Cold War, the United States played a role in the overthrow of a democratically elected Iranian government. Since the Islamic Revolution, Iran has played a role in acts of hostage-taking and violence against U.S. troops and civilians. This history is well known. Rather than remain trapped in the past, I’ve made it clear to Iran’s leaders and people that my country is prepared to move forward. The question now is not what Iran is against, but rather what future it wants to build.
I recognize it will be hard to overcome decades of mistrust, but we will proceed with courage, rectitude, and resolve. There will be many issues to discuss between our two countries, and we are willing to move forward without preconditions on the basis of mutual respect. But it is clear to all concerned that when it comes to nuclear weapons, we have reached a decisive point. This is not simply about America’s interests. It’s about preventing a nuclear arms race in the Middle East that could lead this region and the world down a hugely dangerous path.
I understand those who protest that some countries have weapons that others do not. No single nation should pick and choose which nation holds nuclear weapons. And that’s why I strongly reaffirmed America’s commitment to seek a world in which no nations hold nuclear weapons. (Applause.) And any nation — including Iran — should have the right to access peaceful nuclear power if it complies with its responsibilities under the nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty. That commitment is at the core of the treaty, and it must be kept for all who fully abide by it. And I’m hopeful that all countries in the region can share in this goal.
The fourth issue that I will address is democracy. (Applause.)
I know — I know there has been controversy about the promotion of democracy in recent years, and much of this controversy is connected to the war in Iraq. So let me be clear: No system of government can or should be imposed by one nation by any other.
That does not lessen my commitment, however, to governments that reflect the will of the people. Each nation gives life to this principle in its own way, grounded in the traditions of its own people. America does not presume to know what is best for everyone, just as we would not presume to pick the outcome of a peaceful election. But I do have an unyielding belief that all people yearn for certain things: the ability to speak your mind and have a say in how you are governed; confidence in the rule of law and the equal administration of justice; government that is transparent and doesn’t steal from the people; the freedom to live as you choose. These are not just American ideas; they are human rights. And that is why we will support them everywhere. (Applause.)
Now, there is no straight line to realize this promise. But this much is clear: Governments that protect these rights are ultimately more stable, successful and secure. Suppressing ideas never succeeds in making them go away. America respects the right of all peaceful and law-abiding voices to be heard around the world, even if we disagree with them. And we will welcome all elected, peaceful governments — provided they govern with respect for all their people.
This last point is important because there are some who advocate for democracy only when they’re out of power; once in power, they are ruthless in suppressing the rights of others. (Applause.) So no matter where it takes hold, government of the people and by the people sets a single standard for all who would hold power: You must maintain your power through consent, not coercion; you must respect the rights of minorities, and participate with a spirit of tolerance and compromise; you must place the interests of your people and the legitimate workings of the political process above your party. Without these ingredients, elections alone do not make true democracy.
AUDIENCE MEMBER: Barack Obama, we love you!
PRESIDENT OBAMA: Thank you. (Applause.) The fifth issue that we must address together is religious freedom.
Islam has a proud tradition of tolerance. We see it in the history of Andalusia and Cordoba during the Inquisition. I saw it firsthand as a child in Indonesia, where devout Christians worshiped freely in an overwhelmingly Muslim country. That is the spirit we need today. People in every country should be free to choose and live their faith based upon the persuasion of the mind and the heart and the soul. This tolerance is essential for religion to thrive, but it’s being challenged in many different ways.
Among some Muslims, there’s a disturbing tendency to measure one’s own faith by the rejection of somebody else’s faith. The richness of religious diversity must be upheld — whether it is for Maronites in Lebanon or the Copts in Egypt. (Applause.) And if we are being honest, fault lines must be closed among Muslims, as well, as the divisions between Sunni and Shia have led to tragic violence, particularly in Iraq.
Freedom of religion is central to the ability of peoples to live together. We must always examine the ways in which we protect it. For instance, in the United States, rules on charitable giving have made it harder for Muslims to fulfill their religious obligation. That’s why I’m committed to working with American Muslims to ensure that they can fulfill zakat.
Likewise, it is important for Western countries to avoid impeding Muslim citizens from practicing religion as they see fit — for instance, by dictating what clothes a Muslim woman should wear. We can’t disguise hostility towards any religion behind the pretence of liberalism.
In fact, faith should bring us together. And that’s why we’re forging service projects in America to bring together Christians, Muslims, and Jews. That’s why we welcome efforts like Saudi Arabian King Abdullah’s interfaith dialogue and Turkey’s leadership in the Alliance of Civilizations. Around the world, we can turn dialogue into interfaith service, so bridges between peoples lead to action — whether it is combating malaria in Africa, or providing relief after a natural disaster.
The sixth issue — the sixth issue that I want to address is women’s rights. (Applause.) I know –- I know — and you can tell from this audience, that there is a healthy debate about this issue. I reject the view of some in the West that a woman who chooses to cover her hair is somehow less equal, but I do believe that a woman who is denied an education is denied equality. (Applause.) And it is no coincidence that countries where women are well educated are far more likely to be prosperous.
Now, let me be clear: Issues of women’s equality are by no means simply an issue for Islam. In Turkey, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Indonesia, we’ve seen Muslim-majority countries elect a woman to lead. Meanwhile, the struggle for women’s equality continues in many aspects of American life, and in countries around the world.
I am convinced that our daughters can contribute just as much to society as our sons. (Applause.) Our common prosperity will be advanced by allowing all humanity — men and women — to reach their full potential. I do not believe that women must make the same choices as men in order to be equal, and I respect those women who choose to live their lives in traditional roles. But it should be their choice. And that is why the United States will partner with any Muslim-majority country to support expanded literacy for girls, and to help young women pursue employment through micro-financing that helps people live their dreams. (Applause.)
Finally, I want to discuss economic development and opportunity.
I know that for many, the face of globalization is contradictory. The Internet and television can bring knowledge and information, but also offensive sexuality and mindless violence into the home. Trade can bring new wealth and opportunities, but also huge disruptions and change in communities. In all nations — including America — this change can bring fear. Fear that because of modernity we lose control over our economic choices, our politics, and most importantly our identities — those things we most cherish about our communities, our families, our traditions, and our faith.
But I also know that human progress cannot be denied. There need not be contradictions between development and tradition. Countries like Japan and South Korea grew their economies enormously while maintaining distinct cultures. The same is true for the astonishing progress within Muslim-majority countries from Kuala Lumpur to Dubai. In ancient times and in our times, Muslim communities have been at the forefront of innovation and education.
And this is important because no development strategy can be based only upon what comes out of the ground, nor can it be sustained while young people are out of work. Many Gulf states have enjoyed great wealth as a consequence of oil, and some are beginning to focus it on broader development. But all of us must recognize that education and innovation will be the currency of the 21st century — (applause) — and in too many Muslim communities, there remains underinvestment in these areas. I’m emphasizing such investment within my own country. And while America in the past has focused on oil and gas when it comes to this part of the world, we now seek a broader engagement.
On education, we will expand exchange programs, and increase scholarships, like the one that brought my father to America. (Applause.) At the same time, we will encourage more Americans to study in Muslim communities. And we will match promising Muslim students with internships in America; invest in online learning for teachers and children around the world; and create a new online network, so a young person in Kansas can communicate instantly with a young person in Cairo.
On economic development, we will create a new corps of business volunteers to partner with counterparts in Muslim-majority countries. And I will host a Summit on Entrepreneurship this year to identify how we can deepen ties between business leaders, foundations and social entrepreneurs in the United States and Muslim communities around the world.
On science and technology, we will launch a new fund to support technological development in Muslim-majority countries, and to help transfer ideas to the marketplace so they can create more jobs. We’ll open centers of scientific excellence in Africa, the Middle East and Southeast Asia, and appoint new science envoys to collaborate on programs that develop new sources of energy, create green jobs, digitize records, clean water, grow new crops. Today I’m announcing a new global effort with the Organization of the Islamic Conference to eradicate polio. And we will also expand partnerships with Muslim communities to promote child and maternal health.
All these things must be done in partnership. Americans are ready to join with citizens and governments; community organizations, religious leaders, and businesses in Muslim communities around the world to help our people pursue a better life.
The issues that I have described will not be easy to address. But we have a responsibility to join together on behalf of the world that we seek — a world where extremists no longer threaten our people, and American troops have come home; a world where Israelis and Palestinians are each secure in a state of their own, and nuclear energy is used for peaceful purposes; a world where governments serve their citizens, and the rights of all God’s children are respected. Those are mutual interests. That is the world we seek. But we can only achieve it together.
I know there are many — Muslim and non-Muslim — who question whether we can forge this new beginning. Some are eager to stoke the flames of division, and to stand in the way of progress. Some suggest that it isn’t worth the effort — that we are fated to disagree, and civilizations are doomed to clash. Many more are simply skeptical that real change can occur. There’s so much fear, so much mistrust that has built up over the years. But if we choose to be bound by the past, we will never move forward. And I want to particularly say this to young people of every faith, in every country — you, more than anyone, have the ability to reimagine the world, to remake this world.
All of us share this world for but a brief moment in time. The question is whether we spend that time focused on what pushes us apart, or whether we commit ourselves to an effort — a sustained effort — to find common ground, to focus on the future we seek for our children, and to respect the dignity of all human beings.
It’s easier to start wars than to end them. It’s easier to blame others than to look inward. It’s easier to see what is different about someone than to find the things we share. But we should choose the right path, not just the easy path. There’s one rule that lies at the heart of every religion — that we do unto others as we would have them do unto us. (Applause.) This truth transcends nations and peoples — a belief that isn’t new; that isn’t black or white or brown; that isn’t Christian or Muslim or Jew. It’s a belief that pulsed in the cradle of civilization, and that still beats in the hearts of billions around the world. It’s a faith in other people, and it’s what brought me here today.
We have the power to make the world we seek, but only if we have the courage to make a new beginning, keeping in mind what has been written.
The Holy Koran tells us: “O mankind! We have created you male and a female; and we have made you into nations and tribes so that you may know one another.”
The Talmud tells us: “The whole of the Torah is for the purpose of promoting peace.”
The Holy Bible tells us: “Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God.” (Applause.)
The people of the world can live together in peace. We know that is God’s vision. Now that must be our work here on Earth.
Thank you. And may God’s peace be upon you. Thank you very much. Thank you. (Applause.)
END
2:05 P.M. (Local)
First of all this is my own observation this was Soft Lecture cum Speech at least I can-not say this was only a speech.
America believes in 2 nation theory in Palestine/Israel Issue but when Obama mentioned South Asia he just mentioned people to people contact but No mentioned IOK.
In other words our people of Pakistan few years more only praise Indian Music, Dance, Films, Cricket Hockey Players Stage & Film Artists & thereafter Israeli & American so called Think Tanks of America will decide on CBMs Basis what should be the next step.
According to my assessment Obama was giving False Impression that the West is not in ===WAR with Islamic World=== rather this War was already started in 1989 when Secy. Gen. of NATO categorically stated: “Now the War with Green instead of Red subsequently the most famous withdrawal of Bush Statement from Crusade to switched over in WAT, however this War is covered with the complexed issue of Clash of Civilization.” Thereafter an Orthodox Jewish Ex-FM of America Henry Kissinger clearly duly stamped on the same Ideology.
Plus Obama said “Holocaust was true” even the figure of Jews Killing was quoted which is even crossed the figure of own Jews, moreover “America Israel relations are unbreakable.
I’ve been typing for several months at this Forum Long Speeches Cum Lectures of AMERICA, the people of Muslim World are not ready to listen seriously rather these addresses have become BORE & Evaluation wise the Worth is touching Zero Level.
This is common sense slowly & gradually basis only ===Practical Possible Actions=== are required but in this Speech cum Lecture there is no any single thing which is with FRESH LOOKING so nothing is going to Change in near future rather things will get arrive at the stage of worse to the WORST.
Again prediction by AAM.
Wonderful speech. Could change world’s dynamics, if followed up with action by all parties mentioned in the speech (including the Arab world).
Obama, said the following to an American report prior to his speech.
from: http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/03/opinion/03friedman.html?em
Hearts and minds must be won – and they will be if everything said in this speech is followed by action.
Wow – a very powerfull speech I must say. Now if he can follow this up action this world will be a better place.
I repeat, this speech as absolutely breathtaking, in the points it raises. And the great thing is, that America does not have to be the driving force behind all these changes.
We can start on our own.
The following points from the speech, I find VERY pertinent to Pakistan:
Suger coated as usual and they will go on killing innocent Afghan’s and Pakistanis and say it was collateral damage, they will carry on supplying deadly weapons to Israel to use against the poor Palestinians.
A characteristic Obama speech optimized for the occasion. Accepting the two-nation theory warrants unconditional acceptance and moral legitimization of “Israel” (the Zionist apartheid regime in the Middle East). Muslims, Christians, and Jews lived peacefully in Palestine for many years. Therefore, this two-nation theory is completely unacceptable.
@Java_Beans
Are you a Palestinian. What is your solution to the problem? Instead of rejecting everything provide an alternative.
A very positive beginning. We muslims of the world must support Obama in this monumental effort. We should ditch conspiracy theories now and work together with all nations of the world for the benefit of mankind.
Americans every now and then tell us why they are world leaders. Look at Richard Halbrook in refugee camp and compare it with pakistani “representatives of people”
@zia8925
A single state named Palestine where Muslims, Christians and Jews can live together in peace and harmony (as they did in the past). Acceptance of the Zionist apartheid regime in any form, is never going to ensure durable peace in the region. This is because the fundamental edifice of Zionist creed and the principles of peace-loving people, are mutually exclusive.
Many Orthodox Jews are against Zionism, and they even attest that Zionism was an integral part of the Holocaust. Search the Internet for more information regarding this issue.
The important thing is to expose Zionism!
@Najam Syed,i totally agree with u.
Great speech by American President. As far as quality and content is concerned I think his race speech in Philly was much better. There was lot of personal touch and stakes were much higher then. He wrote and delievered that speech when his political career was in extreme jeopardy.
This time he had best brains gathering thoughts, themes and picking right words for him. Nevertheless it resonated his compaign tone. Full marks to him and his team for keeping the delicate balance between Muslims, Jews and American voters at large.
As everyone said he and America will be judged not by this speech but by ations that will be followed. Will he be able to build on common grounds that he touched today or will end up polarizing figure like his predessors?
actions not the words matter.His speech is like give slap to somones face and then say sorry “as they r civilzed.”Throwing bombs, making conspirancies thats thier agenda. Words cannot fool us . we r not such idiots that we believe u. americans think tanks r now aware of the fact that muslim youth has much more hater for america than thier fathers thats why they r approaching them try to change thier ideology.they have launched many forums so that people show thier frustations to blogs ,to provide outlet to their emotions .But they dont know about the strenght of “imaan”.
obama,u do what ever u want,we will keep hating america bc we are sick,we cannt see whats good and whats right.we are being taught to hate america day and night.our politicians our media and our religous scholors teach us hate only.how we can stop hating u.we are living on hate,hate is in our blood.
WOW what a hypocritical speech. I mean look at the audacity of this White washed African American ” Al Qaida killed nearly 3,000 people on that day..” with the single sentence he has, in his mind, justified the countless deaths of Muslims in Iraq and Afghanistan. 9/11 is a classical case of deception and lie. Multi faceted plot against whole humanity. I mean for something that whole world is considered a suspect it is highly prejudiced and unjust for US to not only conduct the inquiry by itself but don’t let the people who are blamed to do independent inquiry in to it.
Obama, if he wants to really start dialogs with Muslim world will have to come at the same level as we are. He will have to withdraw his military machinery from Afghanistan and stop justifying and supporting an partied government called Israel. Single bone of contention in this whole middle east region is the existence of that one country, forced upon millions of Muslims who actually welcomed the displaced Jews in their time of need.
It is like accept the blame to an extent and then close the door no more talks about it. No accountability. Nothing. Only reason why he is here is to wax those Saudi Draculas to not let US slide in to her inevitable demise.
He talks about democracy but for some reason the realityevades him that his nation was responsible to a large extent of what has transpired in this region. This is a seed of US covert poisoning and back stabbing that has led us to this demise to a large extant. Had his countrymen left this region to its own, nature would have corrected the faults herself. He conveniently forgets what happened to the nationalist government of Muhammad Mussadeg in Iran, for example, and how CIA openly plotted to bring shah back which ultimately led to the rise of Modern Islam.
I was really disgusted at this speech. How could he muster up courage to talk BS to the Muslim world while standing right at the middle of it.
What a shame
@democrate
You look more than sick, I know you, you write nonsense just to get others attention, so be happy you got it.
@qamar raza,truth is always bitter.
democrate said:obama,u do what ever u want,we will keep hating america bc we are sick. ===A N D===democrate said: obama,u do what ever u want,we will keep hating america bc we are sick,we cannt see whats good and whats right.we are being taught to hate america day and night.our politicians our media and our religous scholors teach us hate only.how we can stop hating u.we are living on hate,hate is in our blood.==========XXXXXXX===========
Under the light of your such above cited STRICT REMARKS covering the Muslim World & Pakistani. I shall be thankful at the end of last breath if you just proof that the afore-mentioned is not historical fact, as I mentioned in very first Article moreover you can type & start always Mansoori you misguide to others IN ADVANCE this is granted MANDATE, it is supposed if the same is true then how will you evaluate your charges on Pakistani Muslims and Call Names to Muslims just like that.
In other words you’re trying to say, we Muslims are not allowed & right to present True Pictures of the Historical Events which are Deadly against Muslim World.
=Just Act Upon the Advises as & when AMERICAN DICTATION receive or sort of Lecture Cum Speech-As Zardari, Few Army Generals & rest of the Islamic World Rulers have been complying for the last 50/55 years.=
Democrate: Be Attentive & listen with all ears:
Every Nation does have its own peculiar NATURE e.g. Buddhist are by nature or by birth Soft Spoken, English are Diplomats . Hindus are Modifiers in quick manner to see keep the abreast of according to the Circumstances & Consequences they change themselves===But as far as MUSLIMs are concerned they are RIGID & ORTHODOX they will Die but never ready to MODIFY (in Majority), so that you may not change them in an abrupt manner from their Believes why the simple answer Muslims do have Sound Footed Bases in form of Quran & Sunnah which are UNDENIABLE if someone goes into Depth what is real purpose of this World-Just take Notice even though they/Muslims are HIGLY QUALIFIED from Universities of HOWARD, CAMBRIDGE, OXFORD, JAMIA AL AZHAR, PUNJAB or Karachi. They are Beliveres of the following saying:
=Darakht/Tree Jitna Samar-Dar Hota hai Utna Hi Allah Kay Agay Jhuka Hoga.=
TWO-FACED WHITE WASHED OBAMA!! In 6 months he has outdone Bush at Bushism – President Obama bears little resemblance to Candidate Obama.
We have already discussed this hypocrite at some length in the thread “Obama’s Magic”. Is there any need to discuss him further?
This thread merely provides an opoortunity for CIA agents like OPPORTUNITY to deceive the gullible Pakistanis among us.
ALL, just ask yourself:
Why did the USA invade Iraq? The ostensible reason the Americans gave was the Weapons of Mass Destruction – a whiter than white lie brazenly told to the world at the UN by the black General Powell. A million Iraqis have died since then.
And how many died in the self-inflicted wound of ‘Twin Towers’? Only 3000, as Obama confirms!
Why did the USA invade Afghanistan? The ostensible reason is that an attack on the Twin Towers was planned in Afghanistan! Not a single shred of evidence has been produced. All the evidence that has been presented in the courts points to planning been carried out in European countries and the USA. The simple minded Muslim youth was exploited by some power-crazed satanic beings in influential positions. Israel-America sacrificed its own citizens – and those of many other nationalities – then working in the Twin Towers to provide a justification for the invasion of Afghanistan.
AND HOW MANY PEOPLE HAVE BEEN KILLED IN AFGHANISTAN TO “AVENGE” THE TRAGIC LOSS OF 3000 DEATHS ON 9/11? MANY. MANY TIMES MORE!
This hypocrite Obama should apologise to the Muslim world before he says anything else.
Hi Admin You have uploaded the speech that has been filtered through the Jewish Lens
Same thing happened to me when I took a print from http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/31102929//
As I have seen the live speech so to me it looked incomplete ; a large chunk was missing as it did not mention :
Palestine right to exist, Issue of Iran with full conviction, having the courage to add PBUH with Prohet Mohammad name , Aspiration of Mairaj in (story of Isra) come true where Moses Jesus and Prohet Mohammad PBUH say prayer together; Quranic qoutes about nations and tribes at the end.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/04/us/politics/04obama.text.html?_r=2&pagewanted=6
please upload the correct version
Original speech has been updated.
Thanks
Admin for quick response
wonderful speech!! A+
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
I’m highly skeptical at best.
I don’t find any reason to believe Obama on his words.
We, the Muslims haven’t invaded their land. THEY, the US/Nato is invading our land. They will achieve nothing by showing hypocrisy, no matter how good their speeches are.
Get your soldiers out of our land, our countries, and stop taking side with Israel, before you expect good from us.
HarisKhan
http://www.vdare.com/roberts/090605_speech.htm
June 05, 2009
Obama’s Speech
By Paul Craig Roberts
What are we to make of Obama’s speech at Cairo University in Egypt?
“I’ve come here to Cairo to seek a new beginning between the United States and Muslims around the world, one based on mutual interest and mutual respect.”
Cairo is the capital of Egypt, an American puppet state whose ruler suppresses the aspirations of Egyptian Muslims and cooperates with Israel in the blockade of Gaza.
In contrast to the Islamic University of Al-Azhar, Cairo University was founded as a civil university. Obama’s Cairo university audience was secular.
Nevertheless, Obama said startling words that many Muslims found hopeful. He said that colonialism and the Cold War had denied rights and opportunities to Muslims and resulted in Muslim countries being treated as proxies without regard to their own aspirations. The resulting blowback from “violent extremists” bred fear and mistrust between the Western and Muslim worlds.
Obama spoke of the Quran, his middle name, and his family connections to Islam.
Obama praised Islam’s contributions to civilization.
Obama declared his “responsibility as president of the United States to fight against negative stereotypes of Islam wherever they appear.”
Obama acknowledged “the responsibility we have to one another as human beings.”
Obama acknowledged Iran’s “right to access peaceful nuclear power.”
Obama declared that “no system of government can or should be imposed by one nation on any other.”
Obama’s most explosive words pertained to Israel and Palestine: “Israelis must acknowledge that just as Israel’s right to exist cannot be denied, neither can Palestine’s. The United States does not accept the legitimacy of continued Israeli settlements.”
Obama declared that “the only resolution [to the conflict] is for the aspirations of both sides to be met through two states, where Israelis and Palestinians each live in peace and security. That is in Israel’s interest, Palestine’s interest, America’s interest, and the world’s interest. That is why I intend to personally pursue this outcome with all the patience that the task requires.” For Obama’s commitment to be fulfilled, Israel would have to give back the stolen West Bank lands, dismantle the wall, accept the right to return, and release 1.5 million Palestinians from the Gaza Ghetto. As this seems an unlikely collection of events, the nature of the “two- state solution” endorsed by Obama remains to be seen.
After the euphoric attention to idealistic rhetoric dies down, Obama will be criticized for extravagant words that create unrealizable expectations. But were the extravagant words other than a premier act of schmoozing Muslims designed to quiet the Muslim Brotherhood in our Egyptian puppet state and to get Muslims to accept US aggression in Iraq, Afghanistan and Pakistan?
Obama decries regime change, but continues to practice it, invoking women’s rights to gain support from secularized Arabs. He admits that Iraq was a war of choice but claims that al Qaeda, the Taliban, and 9/11 make Afghanistan a war of necessity.
Obama said that “the events of 9/11″ and al Qaeda’s responsibility, not America’s desire for military bases and hegemony, are the reasons America’s commitment to combating violent extremism in Afghanistan will not weaken. Will Muslims notice that Obama’s case for America’s violent extremism in Afghanistan and now Pakistan is hypocritical?
Al Qaeda, Obama says, “chose to ruthlessly murder” nearly 3,000 people on 9/11 “and even now states their determination to kill on a massive scale.” These deaths are a mere drop in the buckets of blood that America’s invasions have brought to the Muslim world. Moreover, the overwhelming majority of the Muslims America has slaughtered are civilians, just as are the unarmed Palestinians slaughtered by the American-equipped Israeli military.
Against al Qaeda, whose “actions are irreconcilable with the rights of human beings,” Obama invokes the Koran’s prohibition against killing an innocent. Does Obama not realize that the stricture applies to the US and its “coalition of forty-six countries” in spades?
America’s wars are all wars of choice. The more than one million dead Iraqis are not al Qaeda. Neither are Iraqi’s four million refugees. Yet, Obama says Iraqis are better off now, with their country in ruins and a fifth of their population lost, because they are rid of Saddam Hussein, a secular ruler.
No one has a good tally of the dead and refugees America has produced in Afghanistan. Nevertheless, declared Obama, “The situation in Afghanistan demonstrates America’s goals and our need to work together.”
In his first 100 days, Obama managed to create two million Pakistani refugees. It took Israel 60 years to create 3.5 million Palestinian refugees.
What Obama has really done is his speech is to accept responsibility for the neoconservative agenda of extending Western hegemony by eliminating “Muslim extremists,” that is, Muslims who want to rule themselves in keeping with Islam, not in keeping with some secularized, Westernized faux Islam.
Muslim extremists are the creation of decades of Western colonization and secularization that has created an elite, which is Muslim in name only, to rule over religious people and to suppress Islamic mores. All experts know this, and most of them hail it as bringing progress and development to the Muslim world.
Obama said that “human progress cannot be denied,” but “there need not be contradiction between development and tradition.” However, the West defines development and education. These terms mean what they mean in the West. Muslim extremists understand that these terms mean the extermination of Islam.
In typical American fashion, Obama offered Muslims money, “technological development,” and “centers of scientific excellence.”
All the Muslims have to do is to cooperate with America and be peaceful, and America will “respect the dignity of all human beings.”
Mr. Java Beans,
I agree, that he could have said much more. He could have also cried for the lives lost in Iraq/Afghanistan…
But, I think we should ALSO appreciate however much was said.
@ Oppurtunity
A working relationship based on mutual interest and mutual respect is a good thing and if Obama is sincere in establishing such ties with Pakistan, its a good gesture. The question is, does Pakistan have any self-respect left in the world at the moment? Have Pakistanis unanimously defined what their core national interests are?
My views and posts, understandably, might be viewed as cynicism-oriented, but its healthy to know different viewpoints as well and it should foster a more knowledgeable society.
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
@Opportunity: Even in this speech, he didn’t forget to mention the 3,000 people killed/murdered in World Trade Center. Even in this speech, he didn’t forget to USE them as a cause or evidence for America’s attach on Iraq and Afghanistan. Even in this speech, he didn’t forget to name the resistance to US/Nato forces in Afghanistan as terrorists.
You want us to forget the merciless murder of millions all over the Muslim world, just because of this speech?
Are you out of your GOD gifted brain?!?!!!
Do you think an international law breaking super power, one who has given its president “wide range of powers” to attack any country, anywhere in the world, at anytime which they decide to attack, to have suddenly become loyal to all of you?!?!!!
Are you out of your GOD gifted brain?!?!!!
Here’s what Pepe Escobar, a correspondent from The Real News Network thinks about Obama’s speech. I quote TheRealNewsNetwork, because its not funded by US govt., its not funded by advertisements, its not funded by any jewish lobby, it is funded by donations of ordinary Americans. Its a third party objective assessment or point of view;
Video Title: Peace be upon Barack:
Pepe Escobar: Commentary on Obama’s speech to the Muslim World.
I don’t have time to provide an objective analysis or every statement he made.
I find Obama’s speech full of hypocrisies. He clearly stated that America has an unbreakable relationship with Israel. To me, that is the most important point. That is the summary. To me that shows where his loyalties lie. To me everything he speaks of other than this is an illusion.
His words are mere words. In today’s world, we know from experience that words carry no meaning. They are a tool for deception. I will wait for their intention and actions to become clear. I will base my opinion on that. I am not a fool to accept their speeches as a sign of good will.
If you want to see their intentions, look at the statement that Gen. McCrystal made in US. That is/was available on CNN. Look at what he is saying.
I find no reason to believe Obama’s words. For his actions and his state’s current posture says otherwise. Too much evidence is present for me to think much of this speech.
Let me repeat. I want actions from US/Nato. In today’s world, words from US/Nato .. have NO meaning. Their words are a tool to deceive others. I think someone wise said;
Actions speak louder than words
If Obama wanted to address the Muslim world, he would have called for a session of OIC. He would have addressed Muslim nations from there. His speaking to the Muslim World from Egypt is a very clear signal in itself.
HarisKhan
1) he is an american leader, he will talk about 9/11 – to expect to not bring up the fact that 3000 innocent people from his country died is stupid. just as you would expect the pakistani leadership to bring to light how many pakistanis have died in pakistan.
It’s natural and expected, so get over it.
2) i will correct you here: he did not use 9/11 as a justification for iraq. however, he did use it for his justification on afghanistan – because that’s where the alqaeda leadership was.
3) the resistance is led by terrorists which is why he characterized it as such. the taliban should fight in the afghan elections if they feel the afghanis would welcome them with open arms. but no, eff the system — we want to raise weapons, tyranny is how we’ll do this!
sir, he’s stating the truth. america has a strong relationship with israel. it’s a fact. at least, he doesnt deny it (which would be more of a piss off for you, trust me).
speech is a sign of good will. however, i agree, it must be followed by action.
sir, yes, sir. aur kuch? should he take a shower every morning ?
tsk. stop being so demanding. if you were a girl, you’d be so high maintenance. the gesture, even if he was in the states, means a lot. he went to saudi first, then went to egypt.
All said: I agree, follow up these words with actions, and the world will be a better place for everyone.
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
Let me give you ALL a very recent example of US’s good will to Muslim World;
A man in Iraq kills 4 of his buddy soldiers;
Reference: BBC: US soldier kills comrades in Iraq
This article is dated: Page last updated at 19:38 GMT, Monday, 11 May 2009 20:38 UK
Do you know what happens to him?
That soldier is flown back to US and sentenced to death within 2 days of this incident.
Search the internet, you’ll find enough news articles on it.
Compare the above with the following article;
Article Title: Ex-U.S. soldier gets life sentence for Iraq murders
The soldier mercilessly rapes a young Iraqi girl, mercilessly puts her on fire, mercilessly shoots and commits her murder. Then he mercilessly murders’ her whole family in cold blood.
Do you know what happens to him?
US doesn’t sentence him to death. He lives!
So don’t tell me to believe President of US, when I have evidence that he is a hypocrite.
I would see his words as good omen, if he would have set the time table for fast retraction of US/Nato troops from our land i.e., Muslim World.
I am highly skeptical. Don’t tell me to be hopeful. I have NO reason to have hope
HarisKhan
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
@Opportunity: I reject your assessment as worthless use of hollow words.
@Opportunity: I reject your assessment as worthless use of hollow words.
@Opportunity: I reject your assessment as worthless use of hollow words.
Afghanistan is being occupied. It is in a state of war. Your words are worthless.
@Opportunity: I reject your assessment as worthless use of hollow words.
@Opportunity: I reject your assessment as worthless use of hollow words.
When you have enemy troops standing in your country, on your land, you do not think much of speeches, you give more weight to actions, before talks begin.
@Opportunity: I reject your assessment as worthless use of hollow words.
I am being demanding?!?!!! … I am being demanding?!?!!!
Compared to what US/Nato is doing all over the Muslim world … I am being demanding?!?!!!
Your opinion is as worthless to me as Obama and his speech.
If he was serious, he would prove his intentions through actions, before conducting a speech.
HarisKhan
hahahaha. wow, i really pissed you off this time!
You know what. I reject your assemesment of rejecting my assessment as worthless use of hollow words.
@hariskhan
Well, Here we go again with the same BS. I just want to know, do you like arguing with people? because if this is your hobby, then I can understand. But what I don’t get is where do you get all the time to write comments after comments, which aren’t going to get us anywhere. I just feel that we muslims are obsessed with our current state so much that we don’t want to move forward.
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
@zia8925: w t h are you on about? What pinched you?!?!!
How does one move forward when issues between two parties keep increasing in number?
How does one move forward when there’s no mutual respect?
How does one move forward when one party has their military invading the other party’s land?
Let’s hear YOUR idea of moving forward einstein
HarisKhan
@hariskhan
Like I said, I’ve argued with numerous people on different forums with people from same school of thought, which you probably belong to, But it was a complete waste of time. My answer to all your question is, you don’t, you don’t move forward at all.
Because how can you do that when the other party believe in justifying the killings in the name of religion?
You can’t move forward because they are infidels.
You can’t move forward because we will just blow ourselves up if you don’t agree with us.
Eventhough terrorist just targeted a mosque, but we still hate you.
I have no ideas because there is no point.
@zia8925,hate is our diet.we cannt give it up if we do we,ll die.even america make iraq,pakistan and afghanistan rich and modren countries,still we will hate america.
democrate
we dont hate america we hate its policies.Kafir se nafraat nahi hoti kufr se nafrat hoti ha. we all r human beings and we have the right to live with peace and respect.to take the revenage of 9/11 without any evidence start bombing on innocent peoples.The 700,000 innocent iraqi peoples that r killed what was thier crime.If they kill our innocent muslim brother and sister in afganistan,iraq and now in pakistan how we appreciate them. Supporting dictators,capturing resources what else we will do.give them simle say well done ,go ahead.
@uzmasiddique
Well, they don’t hate Islam either, but they do hate what muslims do. Are palestine, Iraq, Afghanistan our only problem. Out of 50 Islamic countries they have their troops in 5 or 6 of them, what about the rest? We are so much concerned about our muslim brothers and sisters that we often don’t even think about ourselves. Tell me what Pakistan hasn’t done for Afghanistan already. The afghans hate Pakistan. For almost last 30 years, we have worst form of religious extremism, sectarianism, drugs, etc. And just today, a bomb blast in a mosque, and still its about America. You know what just forget what I wrote, it is not worth it. America will once again regain its past glory that it enjoyed under clinton, because they have a very smart president. But we muslims will stay the same.
@ zia8925
i think u r not right.The y hate islam , not the muslims.They know what type of muslims we r . Right now they dont have any danger from us as muslim.the real threat is islam that is challenging thier system.thats why they r putting every effort to keep us away from islam cause if we become real muslim,then noone can stop us to regain our lost glory.we must be concern about our brother and sister,its our responsibilty .Why aghan hates pak its another story.conspirancies through out the muslim woorld .they pick oppotunist from us and then deployed on us.we r confused who is right and who is wrong.
@uzmasiddique
Whatever.
america is in afghanistan to save and to stable the democratic system.now there is peace and america is paying heavy price to mantain peace there.if muslims are so concerned about america staying in afghnistan.muslim countries should come up with some proposlas like we will fill the vacume.we will send islamic forces in afghanistan to mantain the peace.but i know no muslim country will do this.before invasion of iraq,iraq attacked iran and qwait,even killed thousands and thousands of thier own countries people.america is biringing peace in muslim countries paying price for her own blood and money.what muslim countries are doing.muslim countries even could,nt stop iran iraq war.muslim countries did,nt play any role in afghnistan to bring peace there.we are so hopless we cannt do any thing but we are very good at to getting faninacial help fr america and still spreading hate agaisnt america.
democrate said:america is in afghanistan to save and to stable the democratic system………………………..==xxx== IS THIS WAS REPLY against my query: Well Sir, first of all you are not replying para wise & failed try to divert the entire attention: Even though against your counter question the following are being attached:
Israel, America & very specific Rumsfield hidden hand in Iraq Iran War.
http://www.bing.com/search?q=hidden+hand+of+America+%26+Israel+in+Iraq+Iran+War&FORM=MSNH11
http://search.yahoo.com/search?p=Rumsfield%2Bhands%2Bin%2BIraq%2BIran%2BWar%26aq%3Df&fr=yfp-t-501&toggle=1&cop=mss&ei=UTF-8
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_type=&search_query=Rumsfield+hands+in+Iraq+Iran+War&aq=f
Post Script:
Democrate: If there is any further utmost required documentary evidence kindly directly address to me in future pls., being an Orthodox Muslim & Pakistani this is my religious duty to furnish the same in due course of time, thanks.
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
@zia8925: You can’t speak, because you are out of evidence.
I CAN speak, because I have too much evidence.
Prehaps your lack of words or ideas is because of lack of information?
We want mutual respect. We want justice. We do not want to see US/Nato troops on our land. These points are absolutely critical.
You might dismiss Muslims who have been murdered as something insignificant, may..be because you think Muslim population has grown over the limit. I do not dismiss the lives of Muslims as something trivial. I will ask for justice for the last Muslim who was killed or murdered by occupying forces, whoever they might be.
The only way to get mutual respect from an enemy is to force them to adhere to international law. To force them to do justice.
We have learnt from experience of the past decades that US/Nato cannot be trusted on their “speeches”. They say one thing and do the totally opposite.
Do you know that US/Nato has been charging Saudi Arabia and other Muslim nations for their killed/murdered citizens, who either were killed or died in a conflict?
Do you know that US/Nato has been charging Saudi Arabia and perhaps other Muslim nations, for oil? US/Nato has been getting nearly FREE oil from Saudi Arabia for decades!! How do you think their industry revolution came into being? They had cheap oil. VERY cheap oil for decades!!
How or why do you think Saudi Arabia is selling oil in $$$ ?!?!!! Why not in its own currency? or perhaps mutual currency of Muslim World?!?!!!
Do you know US charged Pakistan in millions of $$$ for parking of F-16s in the US. They weren’t giving us the F-16s we bought from them. And on top of that, they were charging millions of $$$ from Pakistan for parking EVERY MONTH. I believe this went on for years! Does that show you the respect US has for Pakistan or the Muslim World?!?!!!
Do you know the respect Muslims all over the world had before Pakistan openly conducted nuclear missile tests?!?!!!
Do you know the respect Muslims all over the world gained when/AFTER Pakistan openly conducted nuclear missile tests?!?!!!
In the international arena, we CAN move forward. IF and only IF US/Nato moves its troops out of Muslim World.
Let me tell you of the articles being published by former CIA officials, former US military officials. Why don’t you look at the videos in which Imran Khan is telling why he is against this military operation?
IN THAT video, he gives evidence of former CIA officials, who worked in Afghanistan for years. It is THEIR words, that Pakistan and Afghanistan will remain unstable and insurgency will increase, untill US/Nato retracts its troops back.
I haven’t even started stating my opinion and the evidence against it, yet. Right now, I’m quoting words of former US officials, who have worked for CIA in Afghanistan for years!
Look at what Gen. McCrystal is saying to US. I guess you missed that video on CNN Video service.
Even in our local arena, we have too much intervention from US/Nato. Mostly from US. Note the elections of the past few decades. Even for this last election in Feb, 2008, US envoys/delegates were deployed. Remember the movements and negotiations of Richard Armitage and Boucher in those days? They tried to enforce their influence on OUR elections.
I don’t need to whine that they succeeded in it. They succeeded because people of Pakistan surrendered their right to choose their representatives. When the people of a nation LET others decide their fates for them, what can one say?!?!!!
In the local arena, we in Pakistan need “honesty”. We in Pakistan need to struggle HARD!!! to de-throne these American agents. We need to choose those politicians who are “trustworthy”. Who are loyal to Pakistan. Who have the “credibility” among the people of Pakistan.
That is the only way our local issues will get a kick-start towards resolution.
We can’t go towards prosperity until we have criminals, the most heinous criminals governing Pakistan. Can we?!?!!!
We need leadership, that has credibility, that has trust of people of Pakistan, that has the ability to carry that trust far beyond their words.
HarisKhan
They don’t hate Islam?!?!!! Where did you get that notion from?
I have proof in shape of videos, which are not months old, years old, but days old. I can point you to vidoes on CNN Video service, in which one man is showing a book published in Saudia Arabia which says, there will be a time when even stones will call Muslims to kill Israelis’ / criminal jews / Neocon jews. Did you have a chance to see that video ?
I have a video lying on my desktop, where in their presidential campaigns, their presidential candidate(s) invited Islam-hating-zealots to address large!! gathering?!?!! Do you want me to publish those video(s) ?!?!!! Perhaps you missed them?!?!!!
Even after ALL of this evidence, we are ready to look past their actions, their intentions, IF and ONLY IF, they show us something positive through their actions.
So far, we have NOTHING to believe them on their words. But we DO have decades of actions and its result to generate enough miss-trust so we are forced to walk the very faint and feeble line of caution.
HarisKhan
Sir, you are wrong.
The Muslim civilization does NOT need to depend on US/Nato and its $$$.
The Muslim civilization has lived on its own for centuries!!
The Muslim civilization has not only lived on its own for centuries, but it has ruled over important parts of the world for centuries as well.
US was not present in those eras’.
We are STRONG. We CAN do it. We need to become “honest” to do it. We can’t do it without “honesty”.
HarisKhan
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
@democrate: If you think US/Nato is fighting for peace in Afghanistan, why don’t you watch videos in video section on the website pbs.org which are publications of Americans themselves.
One video related to us in Pakistan is at -> http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/video/flv/generic.html?s=frol02s40eq5d&continuous=1
Watch those videos and then tell me how can you claim US/Nato is in Afghanistan and Iraq for defending peace?
HarisKhan
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
Do any of you know the details of Lockerbie incident? Does anyone know how much Libyan govt. had to pay for that?!?!!! or how much it is still paying for it?!?!!!
Do you remember the recent incident where Inzimam didn’t take Pakistani cricket team out to play the cricket match? England tried to sue Pakistan govt. for 800,000 pounds penalty for that. Did you forget that?!?!!!
Did you forget the recent terror “drama” in UK?!?!! They are deporting 11 Pakistani students on the basis of “suspicion”. Pakistan govt. doesn’t even have the courage to challenge UK in their own court system to restore the names, the credibility, the careers of those innocent Pakistani students.
Why doesn’t Pakistan govt. persue this matter?
Why doesn’t Pakistan govt. make serious effort to make UK pay for its mischief?
The non-Muslims make us PAY for every wrong that we do.
WHY DO WE FEEL CHICKEN WHEN ITS OUT TIME TO ASK THEM FOR PAYMENT AGAINST WHAT THEY DO TO US?!?!!!!
WHY DO WE BECOME COWARDS AT SUCH A TIME?!?!!!
Are we a nation of cowards?!?!!
HarisKhan
Haris Khan
May I inform you that there are hundreds and thousands of British Pakistanis (MUSLIMS) in Britain who are involved in scams like false claims for social welfare, living in council houses and yet doing jobs, ripping the state as much as they can – and mind you these are those guys who otherwise would be found in mosques praying and giving sermons to people to become steadfast Muslims and defeat the non Muslims. If you hate these non Muslims so much then why do you guys living in Europe or America. Why dont you leave their countries and come back to Pakistan because then you would live in a Muslim state.
The problem is that people like you Haris are the real hypocrites and until and unless you guys dont change yourself Allah would never give you the leadership of this world.
In Pakistan although we are Muslims but in practice we tell lies, we cheat, we dont pay our taxes, we flout the merit and employ safarish and bribe for everything and we dont like to follow the rule of law.
So please leave this muslim non mulism argument and try to concentrate on what we can do for ourselves. On one hand we condemn Jews but on other hand we use their products and even their expertise in every field and there we dont say its Muslim or non Muslim. Tell me that whatever are you wearing or eating how much is produced by a Muslim and how much by a Non Muslim. Right from you toothbrush to your car it is made in China (which doesnt believe in Allah at all but you wont say anything about that) to your drinks and eatables and your computers and phones – everything is made by these non Muslims.
My friend phelay apnay aap ko is qabal to banao phir doosroon ki baat karo.
To those who are condemning Americans and Nato I just want to ask one question. Would you feel your mothers sisters and daughters more safe living in America and Europe or under Taliban rule. Just answer this question and then talk about the American role in Afghanistan. Actually we are hypocrites. First we ourselves called Americans and used their money and ammunition to defeat Soviets and once that was done and Americans left we started to complain that they have left to clean up the aftermath and then when they came in Afghanistan to clean up the mess for you for which you were complaining now you want them out of Afghanistan. Remember one thing – if Americans leave Afghanistan then you would be at mercy of ruthless Taliban, Russains, Northern Alliance Indians etc The problem with our Pakistanis is that we only thing IN PRESENT TIME only BUT NOT IN FUTURE. We should always plan what after – after the Americans have left Afghanistan because they would leave this place one day. Dont worry about that. But what are you going to do after that – that is the real question.
As for rule of law that was finsihed after the fourth Khalifah Hazrat Ali was assassinated. So what are you talking governance and civilization of Muslims. As long as they were involved in learning and education they ruled the world but when they started to fight their downfall started.
In Pakistan we feel proud that we created a state of Pakistan – for Muslims – I infact feel that we should be ashamed because once we ruled the whole of India and now we got only four provinces out of 28 states and we call it an achievement. We even managed to get the honour of being getting the worse defeat in the entire Islamic history 1n 1971 when we surrendered in front of a non Muslim general of Indian army.
For God sake stop complaining about others and see what you can do for yourself first.
Haris Khan
you are only obsessed about one thing – that Muslims ruled over the major portion of the world – thats all – rule others – that is you want. At least first learn to rule yourself and then talk about others. You cannot properly rule Pakistan and you are talking about ruling others. Learn to live with others and learn to tolerate others as that has what Islam has taught us.
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
@c hussain: You are putting words in my mouth.
I can counter all of your arguments. The first is;
US was not invited in Afghan Russian war. US came voluntarily.
HarisKhan
@c hussain
”
Would you feel your mothers sisters and daughters more safe living in America and Europe or under Taliban rule..
”
What makes you think that they are safe under US occupation? Do you think that 30 years of “Economical progress” have enlightened the minds of most ruthless army in the world? After the fiasco in Vietnam do you think there has been a startling jump in the morality of US army? Problem with people like you is that they dont read history Or they simply choose to read it selectively. What US army has done in 60s and 70s is simply horrible. This is a morally degraded nation with no character what so ever. You say that people will be more safer under us occupation but how would you justify the role of Blackwater and other mercenary forces in Iraq. Iraqis are not even allowed to try these animals under their laws. There are countless examples of this army’s brutality.
You have to understand the difference if what life is in side USA and outside. You cannot say that after the occupation US army will behave in similar manner as they do in their OWN country because their they have rules and regulations but in occupied territories they need violence to keep the resistance at bay. There is no difference between this occupation and occupation of France by Nazi army.
”
f Americans leave Afghanistan then you would be at mercy of ruthless Taliban, Russians, Northern Alliance Indians etc …
”
Again another example of complete ignorance of even recent history. If there was ever a force in the recent history of Afghanistan that was successfully in taming the wild nature of Afgan people that was of Taliban. NOT the Taliban fighting in Pakistan because they are mostly people from other side of Oxus river. I am talking about the Talibans who said no to US whey they demanded extradition of Osama Bin Laden without any proof . They DIDNOT say that Taliban will not give Osama to US. They said that US has to provide concrete proof that Osama is the cause of the so called “9/11″ attack. Only reason why there IS any presence of “Russians, Northern Alliance Indians ” is in Afghanistan is because there are no TALIBANS there. Those people who were not afraid to say NO to the only superpower in the world. Russians, Northern Alliance Indians are coward who cannot fight because their objective of fight is for monetary gains NOT to bring peace to the nation. If america leaves Afghanistan these forces of evil, and i mean Russians, Northern Alliance Indians will have no chance to survive. They are there only because US wants them to be there to destabilize Pakistan.
This is simple and clear to even an ordinary Jahil man in Pakistan
US is an Imperial Force with every intention of Colonize the whole world.
US is the in dire need to find new territories to finance and fund the extravagant and unjustified living style of her nation and they will go to what ever extent that want or have to to get what they wanted.
US never had any right and never will have any right to attack or occupy another terretory on any ground according to their OWN constitution but they will do it because they are the only “SUPER POWER” in the world.
It is you who has to come out of your westernized cocoon to look at the matters more realistically. This is just tip of iceberg and I dont even want to discuss Palestine and Israel . If you study the recent unbaised history of world you will easily see who is at fault.
To all the people, who are against the presence of NATO/US troops in Afghanistan, just to let you know your tax money is used in this war. So you are also taking part in this war.
Majority of the muslim world is illiterate, which is a fact. While west has advanced in education, so there can’t be an argument between the two.
c hussain said:To those who are condemning Americans and Nato I just want to ask one question. Would you feel your mothers sisters and daughters more safe living in America and Europe or under Taliban rule……………………………….===xxx===
It is requested do not type too much, your fingers & hands will get tired unnecessary when you will have time kind read the followings all the answers are available of your cynical queries.
Moreover when you will realize right after reading & understand the same kindly do not ever try to DIVERT the Attention from Actual Raised Genuine Questions in future, thanks.
http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/preplanned.html
http://www.usatoday.com/educate/college/polisci/articles/20040328.htm
http://www.nyu.edu/classes/keefer/joe/tokhi10.html
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
Mirpuris’ , eh? Are you nuts? Do you think England’s govt. or justice system spares anyone? o_O
England runs on money that flows in from all over the world. They don’t have any products to sell. They sell services to people/nationals of ALL of the world.
This outcome is logical. Yet, I’m not responsible for Pakistan’s current situation. I have insignificant level of influence over anything, other than my vote. Which I give to Jamaat-e-Islami/MMA, people who struggling hard for Pakistan’s survival.
..and after all that you describe, UK is still one of the richest nations in the world.
Are they worried about a small number of Pakistanis’ with their insignificant, bad lively hoods? Do these Pakistanis’ pose any challenge to them or their system? I don’t think so.
Change myself … how?
I don’t lie. I don’t cheat. I paid taxes when I was on job. I never employed “sifarish” to get a job. I have always worked in private firms. To date, I don’t remember bribing anyone to get away. I have never committed any crimes.
1) ALL products I/we use are made by jews? Prove! it
2) The products I/we use those which one required for basic daily usage. I belong to the middle class. I do not use lavish products, other than a computer, which I use for my job.
Do you understand life? or are you just another hypocrite moron trying to make something out of nothing? That is international trade. You are naming technologies.
We export skilled people all over the world who MAKE these technologies.
I have worked in IT companies who have built software for states in US of A. WE!!! built software for them. We export it to them.
The bedsheets I use are made in Muslim countries. Some products of daily usage are made in Pakistan or are from other Muslim countries.
Yes, toothbrush is one product. I don’t think that is rocket science. I believe they are being manufactured locally, since they have been around for quite some time.
Even the trimmer I use is local made.
I don’t drink any non-local made drinks. I use Qarshi’s “jam-e-sheereen”. I don’t eat much from outside my home. I reject Pepsi or Coke where-ever I can.
Yes, I use cell phone. This is one product. I buy them once in years. None of them were made in west. The technology was transferred to Asian countries a long time ago. They are manufactured in Asian countries.
Yes, I use a computer, I use it for working at home or at my job. I am part of Pakistan’s feeble IT industry.
How is China killing Pakistan? Is China attacking Pakistan?
Is China interfering with Pakistani politics?
Does China have its military in Afghanistan or Pakistan or any other Muslim nation to occupy our territory? Are you nuts?
Do you think I am ruling Pakistan?!?!!!
Do you think I’m influencing Pakistan? I am not in power. I vote for good people of this society i.e., who are educated in both “deen” as well as in “dunya”. I vote for Jamaat-e-Islami.
I am not a supporter of PPP or ANP or PML-N or MQM or parties like these.
“Pehle apne aap ko kis qabil banao?“. Give me something tangible.
Tell me something I’m doing wrong, which affects Pakistan.
HarisKhan
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
I am qualified in every sense. I might export my skills abroad. Pakistan’s economy has little to offer.
I am a trained system/network admin. I am developing my skills as a website developer other than my primary skills.
I am MCS from local chartered University. I have certifications from Cisco. I am working on other certifications from Cisco and Microsoft, RedHat, Sun.
I helped export! software as tangible good(s) from Pakistan at my regular job. In essence I help export more than I import each year. I also have experience of the freelance IT market. I have used my skills in that arena as well.
That is “dunya”. I am also aware of Islam and its teachings. I increase my understanding with each day that passes. I weigh my actions according to my religion. I perform my duties according to already established laws of Islam. I do not follow Pakistan govt.’s path blindly.
I am not a “gora follower”, if you are pointing in that direction. I don’t belong to that group.
HarisKhan
Let me give you a logical answer. You live in a locality. You have many homes around you, where your neighbours live.
Would you have one of your rogue brothers take care of your family or would you call in a neighbour instead?
What would YOU choose?!?!!! I want you to answer this.
Dude!!! … USE!! ALLAH ALMIGHTY’s gift called -> Common Sense. Use some of your time in reading history. I already answered part of this.
We did NOT call US of A to come in and help us fight against Russia. We did NOT need their help. They came in voluntarily. America had a vested interest in that war. They did not want Russia to have control over Afghanistan and Pakistan. Why?!?! Use common sense?
If Russia would have had over-powered Afghanistan and Pakistan, not only would it have had access to warm waters, not only would it have reached our sea ports, it would have taken over a lot of natural resources.
It would have established its bases and would start its hegemony against American presence in Middle East.
America has military bases in over 130 countries. Russia does not.
“Presence” is a BIG factor in international geo-politics. Since America is physically present in Middle East via it has control over THEIR politics. It can act as a “bully” and MAKE them change their policies in its favour.
Now, if America leaves Afghanistan, yes in the short term, there will be a lot of problems. Maybe we will be able to handle them, maybe we won’t.
The good thing is, Afghani Taliban, which is an indigenous force, will take over. The northern alliance is a group of criminals. Those war lords keep fighting among themselves. Taliban established peace in Afghanistan prior to 2001, since they dis-armed ALL the warlords.
Now Taliban did not recognize “democracy”. They think its a non-acceptable alternative to “Islamic” system of governance. This mindset of Taliban could be countered with talks in time of peace.
If Afghani people would have rejected Taliban, that would have been ok, since it would have been the “decision” of Afghani people. Their society would then progress naturally according to their laws, according to their desires. Nobody called in US/Nato. What right did US/Nato have to enforce what THEY think is right for Afghani people?
Taliban can be talked with. They were local people. People make mistakes. They can be shown, that the path they were on was wrong and would cause wide-spread problems in long term.
Qazi sb. from Jamaat-e-Islami was already engaged in such talks with Afghani Taliban when they were in power.
It would take time, but that would be a peaceful way of moving forward with life in Afghanistan.
US/Nato’s presence in Afghanistan is NOT for the benefit of Afghanistan or Pakistan. US/Nato have their own international geo-political “interests”.
America always occupies a country, gives power to the minority of that country and then when the majority rebel against it, they try to control it and call the majority terrorists. They try to sell the whole world the idea that there’s a security problem in that area. That is ludicrous.
You can see one such example in Palestine, where Hamas won elections by popular vote. US/Nato removed that govt. from power using their brutal force. What right did US/Nato have to over-throw a popular govt. which had swept general elections?
Is that the role of a “righteous” super power i.e., to over-throw legitimate, popular govt. ?!?!!!
HarisKhan
Aren’t you forgetting something? Hazrat Muhammad’s (SAW) words?
He said, you (Muslims) can use 4 eras’ to judge if something falls within the bounds of Islam or not. Those eras’ did NOT end when the Khilafah or Hazrat Ali (RAW, RTAA) ended.
Those four eras’ were;
1) Hazrat Muhammad’s (SAW) era
2) Khulafa-e-Rashideen (RAW, RTAA) era
3) TA-bi-EEN
4) Tab-e-TAbe-EEN
Dude, we at JI do not “jashn manate hain” at every event of success. We thank ALLAH by praying.
Who are “mana-ing jashn” in Pakistan?!?!!! Why don’t you point your lecture towards them?!?!!!
The fiasco in 1971 was not because of JI.
Majority of its blame goes to PPP and Pakistan Army Generals of that time.
I don’t blame them because they are a political party or because Pakistan Army is an institution. I blame them because “they” were “in power” at that time. Being in power meant, they had “responsibility” to the people. They failed in carrying out their duty. Their lust for power made us loose east Pakistan.
Secondly, India played a huge part in it, because India supported the “mir jaffar” named Najeeb in eastern Pakistan at that time.
I blame PPP because Bhutto sb. in his infinite wisdom made us loose Kashmir in diplomatic talks between countries when Pakistan Army had won over Kashmir militarily. Remember Kashmir is still a “disputed” area. That means, anyone can come in, fight, win and claim that it is their territory.
That means, if US/Nato does it before Pakistan or India does it, Pakistan would be in big trouble. Why?! Because Kashmir is mountainous area. Mountainous area means, India or US/Nato or India get hold of Kashmir, they’ll have bird’s eye view inside Pakistan. That would create a lot of difficulties for Pakistanis’ people in living their lives.
HarisKhan
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
I am not obssessed with “ruling” anyone.
Me? or us at JI ruling over Pakistan?!?!! JI/MMA has never ruled over the federation i.e., Islamic Republic of Pakistan. The best JI/MMA has gotton to yet, is governing NWFP and part of Balochistan.
You shouldn’t be telling me this. I am educated and qualified person. I understand our history. I understand our current predicament.
I am talking about hegemony of foreign powers, because they are a REAL and significant problem.
How can you negate my comments, think of them as trivial, as something that can be dismissed as insignificant, when CIA officials, who have worked for decades in Afghanistan, are themselves writing the same in their! articles?
Are you aware of what is going on around you?
Yes, I agree, what is going on in Pakistan is equally important.
Who in Pakistan is focusing on stopping the present govt. from disgracing Pakistan in the rest of the world?!?!!! Who in Pakistan is focusing on removing present govt. ?
I have called for it on numerous occasions. Why is the rest of the nation quiet? Why are those people in Pakistan who have influence in the circles of power quiet over this?
HarisKhan
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
Why do people of Pakistan vote for PPP, PML-N, MQM, ANP again and again when they ALREADY know what they have done in the past?
Why do people of Pakistan not come out of the disgusting “roti kaprha makaan” slogan of PPP? A slogan that is based on the idea of an unjust!! system.
When Bhutto sb. came into power, he “injected” many of his party’s loyals into companies in Pakistan. Those people failed at their job, because they were not injected based on merrit. They were injected based on the promises of “roti kaprha makaan”.
That caused Pakistan’s flourishing industry to go for a steep dive towards complete failure. I would call Bhutto sb. the biggest traitor of Pakistan for doing this.
..and for the Kashmir fiasco.
I am ALL for a just system. I will oppose ALL unjust systems of governance, be it by any party, even my own.
HarisKhan
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
I would go as far to say, that US .. today .. is envolved in influencing “general elections” in a lot of Muslim countries. Following are the countries I know of;
1) Afghanistan
Egypt
2) Pakistan
3) Palestine
4) Iran
5) Iraq
6) Saudi Arabia
7) Yemen
9) Sudan
Most of them are major countries, economies of the Muslim world. Each of those countries can play vital role in progress of the Muslim world.
It is BECAUSE of US/Nato’s interference in these Muslim countries, that the minority always get elected.
Remember, you don’t see much confidence in people of these countries in their govt. when they vote?
What is the reason good people never get elected in these countries?
P.S. Granted there are a host of other problems as well. But note the influence of US/Nato in elections in these countries and their outcome.
Look at Pakistan govt. US deployed Boucher and Armitage in Pakistan, just before elections in Feb, 2008.
Why were they scurrying around in Pakistan? What were they doing meeting with every politician? What was their interest
Look at what has been going on since Feb, 2008. Present govt. of PPP has totally ignored “governance”. They are doing nothing. They aren’t even responding to communications from other countries. They aren’t improving our national institutions. They haven’t started any projects. None of their ministers is envolved in “working” at their jobs. There’s total silence.
Why?!?!!!
HarisKhan
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
@c hussain: I agree, our nation has much to do, to repair the damage.
It has much to do to establish justice among the people.
It has much to do to have an educated populace.
It has much to do to make itself a powerful economy.
The people of this land, may be bad, may be less literate, but they are mounting attacks against other nations.
They are not occupying other nations. They are not killing people in other countries, they are not affecting lives of millions in other countries, they are not destroying the economy of other countries.
Even now, governments in our countries, in Muslim countries, is causing MORE harm than the populace.
HarisKhan
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
Check this out;
Video Title: Nuclear threats and double standards Pt.1
Gustavo Zlauvinen, the IAEA Representative to United Nations, on the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty
HarisKhan
maybe, because the army’s popped in every single time, middle of their terms and the people vote for them because they were not a given a full term to fullfil their promises, thanks to the army’s interference.
unless these parties mend their ways, a system of regular elections, will eventually weed these parties out…including the MMA and the JI.
@hariskhan
You mohrtaram Qazi sahab wason the the piller of Musharraf Era … 17th emendment was gift from them … in alliance of that Mullah Fazalur rahman diesal … the biggest croooook on earth ….
The motive of MMA was to rule and rule nothing else… please put MMA in the same bucket as others…. like PMLN /ANP/PPP please … I know what your dear JI do at student union levels in various colleges and universities …. the same JI student union who fled Punjab university when student felt enough is enough … these cowards sobs JI student union leaders fled the scene leaving their underpants … please come with good examples …
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
@supercreature: Yet, this is the same Qazi sb. who “organized” the “tehreek” against signing of NPT and CTBT by Pakistan government. When NO other in Pakistan protested. No one in Pakistan was doing anything about it.
Why do you only talk about Jamee’at? Why the hypocrisy? If you want to talk about student unions, why not talk about ALL of them? Common! .. open the pandora’s box and let’s see through ALL of it.
Why not go to the root cause?!?!!!
Why .. just condemn one group and leave ALL the others ?!?!!!
HarisKhan
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
See the reality;
Video Title: War Criminals, Obama, and Torture: from the horses´ mouth
Link #2: Video Title: War Criminals, Obama, and Torture: from the horses´ mouth
HarisKhan
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
Let me show you a glimpse of “safety” of mothers, sisters and daughters in hands of Americans;
Link #1: Video Title: “Woman Stripped down by male officers for nothing” (this can happend to you)
Link #2: Video Title: “Woman Stripped down by male officers for nothing” (this can happend to you)
You call these educated people?!?!!!
I don’t think Taliban could even look through this, much less do it.
Watch this, if you want to know how “safe” people are in the hands of Americans;
Reference: puppetgov website: Video Title: New Jersey Cop Beats Man for Standing On Corner
This video is dated: June 7th, 2009
Find the recent video news of a man who stole a car. When that man ran into a dead end and was caught by police, the policemen beat him brutally.
HarisKhan
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
Let me show you a glimpse of “safety” in Obama’s hands;
Links #1: Reference: puppetgov: Video Title: Congress, Obama Supporting Expanded Secrecy Law
Link #2: News Article: Obama’s support for the new Graham-Lieberman secrecy law
Dated: Monday June 1, 2009 05:02 EDT
It was one thing when President Obama reversed himself last month by announcing that he would appeal the Second Circuit’s ruling that the Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) compelled disclosure of various photographs of detainee abuse sought by the ACLU. Agree or disagree with Obama’s decision, at least the basic legal framework of transparency was being respected, since Obama’s actions amounted to nothing more than a request that the Supreme Court review whether the mandates of FOIA actually required disclosure in this case. But now — obviously anticipating that the Government is likely to lose in court again (.pdf) — Obama wants Congress to change FOIA by retroactively narrowing its disclosure requirements, prevent a legal ruling by the courts, and vest himself with brand new secrecy powers under the law which, just as a factual matter, not even George Bush sought for himself.
HarisKhan
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
Let me show you a glimpse of “safety” in Obama’s hands;
You know how Obama is bringing US/Nato troops back home, from Iraq and Afghanistan? He’s hiring private contractors to do the job instead. Look at this;
Links #1: Reference: puppetgov: Video Title: Bill Moyers Slams Obama on Afghanistan
Links #2: Reference: pbs video archive: Video Title: Bill Moyers Slams Obama on Afghanistan
Included in these private contractors is Black Water, who has changed its name, after it came under fire when its personnel committed crimes in Iraq.
No! one! can stop them because these private contractors and their forces are there under totally impunity. That means, NO laws apply to them. That means no one can punish them. And you can understand what that means.
Don’t believe me? See for yourself!
HarisKhan
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
Checkout the website ‘rebelreports’ and see what good you can find about Obama.
Let me know if you find it.
Still not convinced, let me show you more;
News Article: Reference: rebelreports: Gen. Taguba Says Telegraph Quoted Him Correctly on Prisoner ‘Rape’ Photos
Taguba, however, now says that the photos he saw are not part of the ones at the center of an ACLU lawsuit. So where are the ‘rape’ photos Taguba described?
By Jeremy Scahill
Just a day after White House Press Secretary Robert Gibbs smeared the entire British media over a damning report in one British paper, Maj. Gen. Antonio Taguba says that Britain’s Daily Telegraph quoted him correctly when he told the paper last week he had seen pictures depicting heinous acts commited against prisoners by US personnel that “show torture, abuse, rape and every indecency.” On Friday, Gibbs said “you’re not gonna find many of these [British] newspapers and ‘truth’ within say 25 words of each other.”
…
HarisKhan
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
Still feel safe under Obama? Watch this;
Thursday, 4th, June, 2009
News Article: Reference: rebelreports: UN Human Rights Council Blasts US for Killing Civilians, Drone Attacks and Using Mercenaries
Link #2: News Article: Reference: CNN: UN Human Rights Council Blasts US for Killing Civilians, Drone Attacks and Using Mercenaries
HarisKhan
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
Complete Transcript of the above video titled: Bill Moyers Slams Obama on Afghanistan
BILL MOYERS: But many people will say of course, the truth, which is he inherited a quagmire from the Bush administration. What’s he to do?
JEREMY SCAHILL: Well, there’s no question that Obama inherited an absolute mess from President Bush. But the reality is that Obama is escalating the war in Afghanistan right now. And is maintaining the occupation of Iraq. If Obama was serious about fully ending the occupation of Iraq, he wouldn’t allow the U.S. to have a colonial fortress that they’re passing off as an embassy in Baghdad. Bill, this place is the size of 80 football fields. Who do you think is going to run the security operation for this 80 football field sized embassy? Well, it’s mercenary contractors.
BILL MOYERS: So we’re supposed to be withdrawing from Iraq. But you’re suggesting, in all that you’ve written, that I’ve read lately, that we will be leaving a large mercenary force there.
JEREMY SCAHILL:Absolutely. In fact, you’re going to have a sizable presence, not only of U.S. forces, certainly in the region, but also in Iraq. These residual forces… I mean, Bill, you remember, during Vietnam, the people who were classified as military advisors. Or analysts. And, in reality, the U.S. was fighting an undeclared war. So, in Iraq, I think that we’ve seen reports from Jim Miklaszewski, NBC News’ Pentagon correspondent. He’s quoting military sources saying that they expect to be in Iraq 15 to 20 years in sizable numbers. Afghanistan, though, really is going to become Obama’s war. And, unfortunately, many Democrats are portraying it as the good war.
BILL MOYERS: Let me show you a snippet of what he said in Cairo on Thursday. Take a look:
PRESIDENT OBAMA: Make no mistake. We do not want to keep our troops in Afghanistan. We seek no military bases there. It is agonizing for America to lose our young men and women. It is costly and politically difficult to continue this conflict. We would gladly bring every single one of our troops home if we could be confident that there were not violent extremists in Afghanistan and now Pakistan determined to kill as many Americans as they possibly can. But that is not yet the case.
JEREMY SCAHILL: Well, I mean, we have two parallel realities here. We have the speeches of President Obama. I’m not questioning his sincerity. And then you have the sort of official punditry that’s allowed access to the corporate media. And they have one debate. On the ground though, in Afghanistan and Pakistan, you hear the stories of the people that are forced to live on the other side of the barrel of the gun that is U.S. foreign policy. And you get a very different sense. If the United States, as President Obama says, doesn’t want a permanent presence in Afghanistan, why allocate a billion dollars to build this fortress like embassy, similar to the one in Baghdad, in Islamabad, Pakistan? Another one in Peshawar. Having an increase in mercenary forces. Expanding the US military presence there.
Wake up. See the reality with your own eyes.
HarisKhan
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
Some interesting stuff, about Taliban and human shields, from above video titled;
Complete Transcript of the above video titled: Bill Moyers Slams Obama on Afghanistan
The important part is highlighted in bold
BILL MOYERS: You mentioned you mentioned drones a moment ago. I was impressed to hear our new commander of our troops in Afghanistan admit this week that the United States cannot go on killing civilians. He said, in fact, this is creating a dangerous situation for our own country.
JEREMY SCAHILL:Well, that that I mean, on the one hand, that those words are true. I think that the fact is that, when you are killing civilians, in what is perceived to be an indiscriminate way certainly by the people of Pakistan you’re going to give rise to more people that want to attack the United States. They view themselves as fighting a defensive war. But never are the statistics cited that come out of Pakistan. 687 people are documented to have been killed. That the Pakistani authorities say are civilians since 2006. In the first 99 days of this year over 100 people were killed. And the fact is…
BILL MOYERS: By American military action?
JEREMY SCAHILL: Right. By American military action with these robotic drones.
BILL MOYERS: 60 Minutes, on CBS News, recently got some very special access to the military. And came out with a report on drones. Let me show you a few excerpts from that.
LARA LOGAN: Right now, there are dozens of them over the skies of Iraq and Afghanistan. Hunting down insurgents every minute of every day. The fight for the pilot is on the video screen. Here a truck full of insurgents in Afghanistan is being tracked by the pilot. When the ground commander gives the order-he first, hitting his target. The trigger is pulled in Nevada. Inside these cramped single white trailers of small offices.
COL. CHRIS CHAMBLISS: And that white spot that this guy is carrying is actually a hot gun. It’s been fired and already know that it’s been used. We’ve met positive identification criteria that these are bad guys. And so now we can go ahead and strike these targets.
BILL MOYERS: Now, many people are like that fellow. They say that these drones are new miracle weapons that enable the United States military to kill the bad guys, as he said, without exposing Americans to danger. There’s truth in that, right?
JEREMY SCAHILL:Now, I have a lot of respect for Lara Logan, the CBS correspondent. She’s really put her neck on the line and been in the thick of battle, and has been injured in battle. But I think that this piece was propaganda. She allowed the military to make claims about the effectiveness of their weapons that are being contested passionately by the people on the ground in Pakistan itself. I recently did an article about “Time” magazine’s coverage of this. They said that the Taliban are using civilians as human shields. And that’s why so many civilians have been killed. Their source for that was an Air Force intelligence officer who was allowed to speak on as though it was a Pentagon press release. I think that this is sick. Where you turn war, essentially, into a videogame that can be waged by people half a world away. What this does, these drones, is they it sanitizes war. It means that we increase the number of people that don’t have to see that war is hell on the ground. And it means that wars are going to be easier in the future because it’s not as tough of a sell.
HarisKhan
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
Some interesting stuff, about private contractors from above video titled;
Complete Transcript of the above video titled: Bill Moyers Slams Obama on Afghanistan
The important part is highlighted in bold
BILL MOYERS: You will find agreement on people who say war is hell. But you’ll also find a lot of people in this country, America a lot of Democrats and Republicans, who say Jeremy Scahill is wrong. That we need to be doing what we’re doing in Afghanistan because, if we don’t, there’ll be another attack like 9/11 on this country.
JEREMY SCAHILL: I think that what we’re doing in Afghanistan increases the likelihood that there’s going to be another attack.
BILL MOYERS: Why?
JEREMY SCAHILL:Because we’re killing innocent civilians regularly. When the United States goes in and bombs Farah province in Afghanistan, on May 4th, and kills civilians, according to the Red Cross and other sources, 13 members of one family, that has a ricochet impact. The relatives of those people are going to say maybe they did trust the United States. Maybe they viewed the United States as a beacon of freedom in the world. But you just took you just took that guy’s daughter. You just killed that guy’s wife. That’s one more person that’s going to line up and say, “We’re going to fight the United States.” We are indiscriminately killing civilians, according to the UN Human Rights Council. A report that was just released this week by the UN says that the United States is indiscriminately killing civilians in Afghanistan and elsewhere around the world. That should be a collective shame that we feel in this society. And yet we have people calling it the good war.
HarisKhan
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
Some more interesting and equally deadful stuff, about private contractors from above video titled;
Complete Transcript of the above video titled: Bill Moyers Slams Obama on Afghanistan
The important part is highlighted in bold
BILL MOYERS: So, step back to that issue of military contractors. You’ve been you’ve been writing about privatization and military contractors for a long time. In the large scheme of things what do you military contractors represent to you?
JEREMY SCAHILL:Yeah. Well, I think that what we have seen happen, as a result of this incredible reliance on private military contractors, is that the United States has created a new system for waging war. Where you no longer have to depend exclusively on your own citizens to sign up for the military and say, “I believe in this war, so I’m willing to sign up and risk my life for it.” You turn the entire world into your recruiting ground. You intricately link corporate profits to an escalation of warfare and make it profitable for companies to participate in your wars. In the process of doing that you undermine U.S. democratic processes. And you also violate the sovereignty of other nations, ’cause you’re making their citizens in combatants in a war to which their country is not a party. I feel that the end game of all of this could well be the disintegration of the nation state apparatus in the world. And it could be replaced by a scenario where you have corporations with their own private armies. To me, that would be a devastating development. But it’s on. It’s happening on a micro level. And I fear it will start to happen on a much bigger scale.
Do you see the horror or a private contractor fighting wars for country?
It could start a chain of events, which would lead to continued fighting and total chaos in the world, while a small group of people earn profits because of it.
HarisKhan
@harriskhan
bahi jaan, please show me the protest evidence/long march of Qazi against CTBT please….???
secondly I am not just condemning Qazi and his party I condemn PPP, MQM, ANP PML N where ever they are wrong …. PPP is wrong as ever at most fronts and MQM being a terrorist bhatta khoor group;….
So there is no hypocracy at my end but yes at your end … two wrong does not make it right … you could not even defend JI student wing …. and just starting pointing at others student unions, although none other made run away with their pants down like JI Student union was made ….
I also condemn student union like MSF etc…
so look at your posting and see who is full of hypocracy … and please give me independence evidence for CTBT/NPT long march by JI next time you post … should be a credible evidence though….
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
@supercreature: I didn’t talk about Jamee-at alone, because if I only talk about Jamee-at you’ll succeed in your efforts to ignore the “context” in which events took place or still take place. You’ll end up showing a small picture of a very large canvas. That doesn’t serve any purpose, other than dis-informing people.
Its like Israel. Israel is showing Americans a biased view of the Palestine – Israel conflict to Americans. All over American media, you’ll see Palestinians doing this and Palestinians doing that. They ALWAYS intentionally miss or intentionally ignore or intentionally hide the “context”.
I believe you are trying to do the same, in your lust to discredit someone.
Secondly, I don’t have unlimited ammount of time to spend searching for evidence. I believe if you want to get to the bottom of something, you have to make an effort. I am not going be there to do your homework all the time.
Start doing your own independent research boy. Start reading. Start watching relevant videos, finding relevant pictures. Start searching. Do! your own digging!
HarisKhan
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
Also, if everyone is ready to keep an open mind, try to search videos on the topics;
Obama’s relation to the New world order
For example this video from youtube -> Kissinger: Obama Will Create A New World Order
Hear his words very clearly. He says “his task will be to develop an overall strategy for America, in this period when really a new world order can be created. Its a great opportunity. I think it is a crisis…”
These are my own views;
Personally, I believe this new world order is the time of dajjal, because all of the signs of dajjal’s arrival are nearly present.
The whole world is in financial chaos. There’s indiscriminate killing going on, all over the world.
The killing has already spilled over in Pakistan via the conflict in NWFP, FATA, PATA.
HarisKhan
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
This is link #2 for the same content. This one shows words in letters;
Here is the link to the video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VkWlKsb7UZ4
Here is the video;
HarisKhan
@hariskhan
You will never be able to convince us. Nor we can convince you. We are completely different people, our way of thinking is very different than the way you or others like you perceive things. I mean what you are trying to do here by showing videos and articles, all this things have been debated before on many forums. Its not worth it.
And I hate Jamaat-e-Islami, because they were responsible for exile of one of the greatest scientist in the history of Pakistan simply because of his Ahmedi Faith.
There have been moments in the human history far worse than what we have today. Far more people have killed each other.
I mean I dont know much about the Dajjal and his scheduled arrival – but, the human condition has been FARRR worse than it is today.
I agree. The american/u.s. forces should not kill civilians.
Also, one other point that is rarely highlighted by any of us.
If the taliban, are the so called holy warriors, they should fight in uniform so that civilians are not routinely mistaken to be hostile by the forces fighting against them.
Haris, I can find FAR more links that support my opinions because my opinion is shared by the mainstream media.
When you copy-paste a ton of links you don’t really strengthen your case. For your own benefit, don’t overdo it…
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
I understand, I may be over-doing it. But I’m stating hard facts, which are translating to realities. What you are showing may be popular in publicity, but its not the reality.
Be my guest. I invite an open argument based on facts.
There are only two things i.e., right and wrong. Something cannot be right and wrong at the same time. Either it is right or it is wrong.
Right doesn’t become wrong no matter how small the publicity it gets.
Similarly, wrong doesn’t become right no matter how much it is projected.
HarisKhan
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
First, you know, I was not posting this just for you. I was posting this for the masses who read these discussions.
Secondly, I don’t hate criminals. I hate the crimes they commit, the harm they cause. I do not hate you for your opinions, or for your associations, even if they are miss-placed.
Thirdly, You know what they say about snakes? -> If you nurture a snake, give it milk, raise it, the snake will still sting you/bite you one day.
The jews were killed, thrown out of Europe for their bad practices. There was a good reason behind what the Europeans did at that time.
Today .. jews are the most educated and brilliant people in the world. They run or control the best companies in the world. They are in total control of the whole world’s economy. But that doesn’t change the fact that they are like a snake.
Pakistan was wise to have had no expectations from a snake.
I agree with JI’s decision. Snakes deserve for their heads to be chopped off as soon as possible. For snakes will kill or harm as many people as they come across.
HarisKhan
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
@zia8925: Lastly, ALLAH says, your job is to give out information. Your job is to convey my message.
It is not my job to convince you or to force you to believe. My job to convey information. Once I’v done that, my obligation is complete. That which was expected of me is done. My work is finished.
After that, its between you and ALLAH ALMIGHTY.
ALLAH ALMIGHTY also says, when you give them all the information and they still don’t believe, let them be.
That is exactly what I do.
ALLAH Hafiz,
HarisKhan
@hariskhan
“It is not my job to convince you or to force you to believe. My job to convey information. Once I’v done that, my obligation is complete. That which was expected of me is done. My work is finished.”
Yaar this is the exact same thing media reporters were saying who were reporting from Swat and near by region …. but why your Friends Talibs were threatening the several reporters for dire consequences ….. ??? or would you like some one to threat you like Taliban’s did/do ….
Can you please condemn those taliban’s …. I hope you knows what taliban’s group I am talking about … (Taliban’s admitted that on media during several interviews)
Waiting for your condemnation instead of aain bain shain as usual….
It is ironic that Obama’s critisim is coming from
1.Orthodox Jews and their friends Evangelical Christians.
2.Taliban and their supporters.
He must be saying something right.
@Haris Khan,what makes you think Allah chose you to do His job?
@hariskhan
It is BECAUSE of US/Nato’s interference in these Muslim countries, that the minority always get elected.
lol thank you for the joke of the month. You really cheered me up. If it wasnt for the us intervention ji would sweep the parliment in the election. This is funny ji has only won a few seats due to zia or mushi. A dead guy in his grave bhutto still wins elections in sindh. When your alive and you get beat by a dead guy who passed away 30 years ago that means people dont take your party seriously. What part of pakistan does ji gets it support from? None!! As for jimiat the only karnama they performed was beating up imran khan and then have him arrested. How low was that? Beating up a national hero who was fighting for restoration of democrasy just because you are afraid of his popularity with the students. If pti takes away punjab university than it will be the end of the world of jamiat. Thank you for providing dark comedy. You guys are hilarious.
@zia m
“@Haris Khan,what makes you think Allah chose you to do His job?”
Because he is the choosen one …. lol
@Molvi hariskhan
Please quote the reference where did Allah said what you have mentioned … about giving information … (please elaborate with type of information asked to give) and so one … and also please correlate with the posting contents what you post and orders of Allah
I was trying to test how to qout someone.
@haris
wow, im finally making inroads into your head, Haris
to quote Faiz…’Ek ek kar kay huway jatay hein taray roshan”
Haris,
To add to what you said..I feel a lot of the muslim world’s misery is attributed to our own failures as a people. Even today, we are not building the kind of environment is which one can see muslims playing a larger role in the world despite the fact that we are more than 1.2 billion in number.
The arab world’s too busy spending it’s petrodollars on construction projects/hotels/towers/ etc. None of them, barring kuwait and bahrain have an iota of democratic systems in place. Very few of them have finally started pushing for education reform. Very few of them protect the rights of guest workers. etc. etc.
If anything, I find Pakistan to be best placed as it has all the essential ingredients (though of low quality, right now) that can form a sustainable society. We just need a bit more focus on our education system (just a bit more, really) – and solid business action plans for the economy. We have a ton of resources, but we just cant seem to put them to use in an efficient manner.
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
Ali Q: Generally, I agree with your assessment, in this case.
Pakistanis’ however lack commitment, wisdom. Most of all, they lack the trait called “honesty”.
HarisKhan
@hariskhan
I actusally feel sorry for Jamaat-eIslami. I mean nobody supports them. Whats more shocking is people would prefer PPP, PML N, or even MQM over Jamaat-e-Islami. To prove that was the recent elections, where MMA got slaughtered by ANP in NWFP. You know why that happened, because your continues extremism. People have rejected extremism, a reality that you haven’t overcome. Nobody is going to vote for you because you hate jews or you consider them snakes.
But people will vote for you, if are willing to engage in dialogue and build your country in a positive direction.
Assalam-o-Alaikum ALL,
I must add though, I’v seen videos on CNN Video service, where CNN shows that people in Middle East have started working on alternates to petro-dollars, which also contain ideas like chain of stores, building property etc etc.
So it does show, to some extent they are moving towards entrepreneurship, at least in some sectors.
But, when we talk in general terms, you are right.
HarisKhan
I thank pkpolitics for bringing up this topic and I have something important to say:
I think President Barack Husain Obama has spoken with a deep inside knowledge into the causes of the no-unity among the Muslims, if this was there, there will be no terrorism. I and you must agree most of it is from among the Muslims and no hoodwinking!
The iterpretaion that their faith is the rightest and the rest others’ wrong is the cause of the disunity and he has spoken out those thoughts which Muslims knowing would dare not speak, living in the false world of illusion that they will be killing unity between Muslims – a unity which is non existent.
The Muslims should be thankful to President Obama and encourage him demolish these barriers betwween Muslim sects so that they may unite to agree on the Hadees and the iterpretation of Quran.
Why don’t they take Hadees from the House of the Prophet SAWW ( the progenies of the Prophet and the Twelve Imams) and stop to take it from other sources unless absolute, stop taking from notably such as Abu Harayra who has been admonished by two Caliphs, Hazrat Umer and Hazrat Ali Als for fabricating Hadees.
Then President Obama has talked of two states in Palestine. This policy is their old policy and is the beehive of conflict to persist in the M.E.
Our learned and the most sane leader of the Arab world Col. Moammar Qadafi has said there should be only one state for Palestinians and the Israelites and its name should be ‘Instine’, with one constitution. And we Muslims have to encourage President Obama to think on those lines.
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