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Who supports terrorist in pakistan? One suspect is this
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/24/world/middleeast/24saudi.html?_r=1&hp
Another drama by propoganda media.
http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/commentators/johann-hari/the-dark-side-of-dubai-1664368.html
a very long but intresting article on the dark side of dubai. The article suggests that South Asians with pakistani workers among them are treated very poorly. I have never been to an arab country. Is anyone on this site living in an arab country? What is living there like? What are the good and the bad?
@fareed
In recent times, I’m also under the impression that majority of the media are hiding the entire truth from the masses and are propagating whatever suits their views only. I’m amazed to see how after 16/03/09 the media seems to be divide–unlike before.
US intent getting clearer — Shireen M Mazari (The News)
http://www.thenews.com.pk/daily_detail.asp?id=184546
A strange new idea — Editorial (The Nation)
http://www.nation.com.pk/pakistan-news-newspaper-daily-english-online/Opinions/Editorials/24-Jun-2009/A-strange-new-idea/
@lota
Saudi Arabia is probably the most racist country. If you seek work there, you salary will be determined not by your skill but by your skin!!! Americans are highest paid, then other goras and then people like us. If your car is hit by a Saudi it is your fault!!!!
Dubai is different because 85% population is non-arab. Donot even think about rights!!!
Finally some voice for democracy within PPP
An excellent article in jang a few days back about how are we dealing with terrorists and how should we be actually dealing with them, by a bonafide tribal(fata) pakhtoon..a must read..
http://www.jang.com.pk/jang/jun2009-daily/23-06-2009/col7.htm
Drone attacks ….
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5j6AkB5RI9Nr8GkZJL6OudGyee9fwD99168T80
@Kashif
I am not big fan of drone attacks, but why attack a funeral?
Oh let me guess, the Taliban animals used to do the same. They attacked funerals to kill more people, presumbly relatives of the individual killed by them so they can wipe out the entire male side of the deceased individual’s family. Specially the tafriki Taliban; they liked to do suicide bombings in funerals so more shias were killed as such more ‘kafirs’ were killed and the Taliban animals get to go to jannat.
Since these things are ruthless and bombing the s*it out of these people isn’t going solve any problems, i condemn these drone attacks. However, i would love to see the face of the suicide bombing instructor who sent these boys to funerals to blow themselves up when the drones (presumably Americans) attacked a funeral of an alleged militant commander.
@bho
If I may interject, I don’t think the govt/drones attacked this funeral because that’s what the Taliban used to do (i.e., a case of unthinking tit for tat).
I believe they did it as this was a congregation of militants and commanders (obviously who else would attend the funeral of a taliban commander) and was a good opportunity to get many of them together.
Make sense?
@Gul
Drone attack on a funeral ( and otherwise) is as bad as a suicide attack on funeral of a police officer, digging of graves and hanging the dead bodies, attacks on mosques, on hotels killing innocent people including children and telling the potential suicide bombers not to worry as every innocent person they kill will go to Janat and will thank them when they meet them there.
@Gul
I am sure your are right, but i heard this news yesterday about the funeral attack and i couldn’t but think about the countless sucide bombs that took place at funerals in Parachinar, DI Khan, Khyber and NWFP in general. I am sure the intent was to get the alleged militants, but i think this is a first such attack of its kind.
CJ vs Aitzaz: no to friendship
Thursday, June 25, 2009
By Muhammad Ahmad Noorani
ISLAMABAD: Though generally ignored, an extremely important development took place recently at the Supreme Court, showing Chief Justice Iftikhar Muhammad Chaudhry’s complete aloofness from the top leader of the lawyers’ movement, Aitzaz Ahsan.
The lawyer wanted the chief justice to stay away from hearing the multibillion rupee scam of the Bank of Punjab (BoP), as Aitzaz finally decided to represent the Haris Steel, the main accused in this scam. The chief justice, however, did not oblige Aitzaz; thus, shutting the mouths of his critics who thought that he would favour those who have been in the forefront of the struggle for the restoration of judiciary.
Aitzaz, on his part, tried to fulfil his public commitment that he would never appear before the chief justice because of their known association but the country’s top judge did not find much weight in the top lawyer’s request that the case already fixed before the bench headed by the chief justice should be shifted to some other bench because the accused party had engaged Aitzaz Ahsan to defend it.
Some wagging tongues suggest Aitzaz Ahsan has been engaged to get the case transferred from the bench headed by the chief justice to some other bench in order to get a favourable judgment because of his influence. Aitzaz was of the view he was approached by the Haris Steel some two years back but he did not take the case as he was not ready to appear before the pre-March 16 judiciary.
A bench of the Islamabad High Court (IHC) was presently hearing the BoP case but the bank had moved a fresh petition in the Supreme Court, praying the case be transferred to the apex court, as it didn’t have trust in the IHC. The petition was fixed for hearing on May 27 by the Bench No-1 headed by the chief justice. Its second hearing was on June 15.
On June 14, the Haris Steel appointed Aitzaz Ahsan as its counsel who, through his junior lawyer Shaukat Ali Javed, requested the chief justice in June 15 hearing that the case be transferred to some other bench. The chief justice observed that Aitzaz could appear before his bench if he wanted to argue the case. The next hearing will be held on June 29.
On the other hand, Aitzaz Ahsan also showed integrity by refusing to appear before the chief justice, keeping the promise he made to the nation. Aitzaz Ahsan, while talking to The News, said: “It was a fresh petition and independent petition and was filed by the BoP. The respondents have the right to choose the counsel of their choice. As the Haris Steel people belong to my constituency and were interested in choosing me as their counsel from the very first day but I was unable to oblige their requests as I was not appearing before the PCO judiciary. I did not supersede anybody as it was a fresh petition. But since the chief justice has decided to continue to head the bench, I will not appear in this case.”
The BoP scam is the biggest ever scam of Pakistan’s banking history. Before Aitzaz, those who represented the Haris Steel in different courts included Sharifuddin Pirzada, Babar Awan and Wasim Sajjad. The Haris Steel and two of its sister companies had obtained financial facility to the tune of Rs8.6 billion from the BoP during the Musharraf regime with the connivance of the then-BoP president and a close Musharraf’s aide Hamesh Khan. The Haris Steel used fake collateral and bogus documents to obtain the loan, a fact confirmed by all related national agencies, including Nadra and the State Bank’s appointed agencies. Owners of the Haris Steel were known for their close association with the then-rulers of Punjab, the Chaudhrys of Gujrat. They argue in courts that their loan had been re-structured by the former BoP management and that they were ready to pay the amount in re-structured instalments. But the BoP wants that those who deceived the whole banking system by using bogus and fake documents to avail of such big financial facility should be exposed and punished.
A leading light of a private group termed this situation a dilemma. Talking to this correspondent, on the condition of not being named, he said he considers Aitzaz as a very competent lawyer. If he wants to acquire his services in a case in the Supreme Court, purely because he thinks that Aitzaz is capable of pleading his case, he cannot do so. He said his right to choose an advocate of his choice and confidence is denied to him. He said not only Aitzaz is a loser, but he also loses in this situation.
http://www.thenews.com.pk/top_story_detail.asp?Id=22923
@Hasanm
if you read the article it says that dubai is like saudi arabia. The native emarati acts that same way as a saudi. I just find it amazing that people can be so racist. I have never seen that and wonder what is the reason for a society to act that way? Please comment if you can
@bho
I am not applogectic on drone attacks. The attack may result in some innocent acsualties but the intention is right. They hope to target militant leadership that is hiding among civilians. Why in the world so called innoent civilans who become victimof colateral demage do not stand up against militants. Its there hospitality and support that attracts drones and operation rah e rast. At the end all these armed pushtoons need Punjab dominated army to clear these areas …. WHY?
As far as this very attak is concerned I read it targeted a meeting after funeral. Even if it targeted funeral you have every right to agitate. I ‘d still support it as the goal was to target same militants who are targeting our soldiers, civlians and state institutions.
@lota
I have never lived in Dubai or Kingdom of Saudi Arabia (KSA), but have visited these places and close friends and family live there.
Dubai is more “liberal” than KSA. The simplest reason is perhaps that you just come across merely 5% of emiratis!!!! The proportion of such racists is much more in KSA. Also mostly your bosses in Dubai are non-Emirati whereas in KSA they may be Saudis.
Exploitation and slavery is present in every third world country (Brick workers “bhatta mazdoor” in Pak is an example) but it is much worse in KSA and Dubai.
Reasons: 1- their old culture of keeping slaves, 2- Lack of tolerance, 3- Uneducated/uncultured, 4- “easy money” of oil, 5- Newly rich people with loads of money without any hard work!!!! , 6- Dictatorial societies generally lack respect for human life and values, where rights if any are given as a charity rather than legal rights.
Example: Few years ago if you were a
- Pakistani specialist doctor your salary was around 6000 Dirham/month,
- if you were a saudi newly qualified doctor it was 11000 D/month,
- if you were an American/UK (white) specialist Doc, it was around 30000 D
- American/UK (non White) specialist – 20000 D
- US/UK qualified (white) nurse more than 15000
You may also have come across the news item recently that more than 7000 Pakistanis are in foreign prisons, 5000 of them in Saudi Arabia!!!!!!
@all
2 news items to share with you all, both bad news in their own right
1- World bank refused to grant loan for Bhasha Dam because it is in disputed area between India and Pakistan. (Express news)
2- “Parliament per hamla nakaam bana diya” – Rehman Malik. A very bad news indeed!!!
good article : http://thenews.jang.com.pk/daily_detail.asp?id=184761
analyses mqm and TI’s position on the militants.
Fazlullah’s aide Shah Doran killed
—
MINGORA: There are reports of killing of Incharge of FM Radio in Swat and deputy Chief of Tehreek Taliban Shah Doran.
NWFP Information Minister Mian Iftikhar Hussain said that he may have been killed, as he was injured some days ago. However, Pak Army spokesman did not confirmed his death.
According to Geo News, the reliable sources privy to the government said Shah Doran the right hand of Taliban supreme leader in Pakistan Fazlullah has been killed.
A local Taliban leader told Geo News that he is not aware of the incident of his killing.
It should be mentioned that the NWFP government has announced Rs20 million for the informer of his death alive or dead.
—
The newspaper needs to do a better job with their headlines. Nowhere in this news item has it been mentioned that this guy is confirmed dead; which will be a welcome news BTW.
Sorry, did not mean to highlight the whole thing above.
@Hasanm
Thank you for the informative, eye opening and disturbing post.
Reasons: 1- their old culture of keeping slaves,
It would have been nice if Islam banned slavery and even if it didn’t it is time we should.
2- Lack of tolerance, this amazes me I have been to different countries in Asia, Africa, Europe and North America. Over whelming majority of people are open minded, accepting and polite. I have not met any close minded people yet maybe I should visit ksa as an anthropological experiment.
3- Uneducated/uncultured, I do know uneducated and uncultured people from different countries and yes they are tolerant.
4- “easy money” of oil,
5- Newly rich people with loads of money without any hard work!!!! ,
6- Dictatorial societies generally lack respect for human life and values, where rights if any are given as a charity rather than legal rights. With everything that has went down in the last 3000 years a society has to work extra hard to remain controlling which lacks respect for human rights maybe all the ills that you talk about are the reasons of being part of a tribal society. This raises the question are civilized people better than tribal people? Are most tribal customs barbarian customs? and let’s not go into women rights in these countries.
It is 2009 and I find it amazing that how a society as a whole can be so dark and evil. The attitudes of a society demonstrate the caliber of individuals that compromise it. Where are the brick workers being exploited in Pakistan? What part? I have not read much about it.
Haroon rasheed sounds perfact sense here
کيسے ان کے ترازو اور کيسے ان کے باٹ
@lota
Islam indeed discouraged & banned slavery but old customs (habits) die hard.
Re: Brick workers – they are all over the country. I have seen it in Punjab where three generations work simultaneously from dawn to dusk without much pay and certainly without any labour rights. Most of the families are enslaved because of the money they borrow at high interest rate from their bosses for their needs like health/child birth and marriage/death etc. And we are not talking about millions – a few thousand rupees are enough to keep a family enslaved for generations!!!! Id you live in Lahore you may go a few miles in the outskirts and see it yourself. Similarly labourers in rural areas are more slaves than workers.
Situation is not very different in India where every year thousands of farmers commit suicide due to financial reasons (money borrowed from “banyia” on heavy interest).
The young Iranian student shot dead by a revolutionary guard sniper:
http://www.boingboing.net/2009/06/21/iran-neda-warning-gr.html
This 26 year old student was a bystander and was targetted and shot at the chest by a revolutionary guard sniper. Very sad.
None of the Abrahamic Religions ever banned slavery.
The roots of racism goes back to Judaism (that i consider nothing but history of Jewish people).
According to Old Testament Book of Genesis,Noah had three sons
1.Shem forefather of semitic people.
2.Japheth the father of Europeans
3.Ham ancestor of Africans.
It is rather disgusting that Canaan fourth son of Ham was cursed by Noah according to OT.
Canaanites were the original inhabitant of present day Palestine.
So it is clear that Jewish people used religion to subjugate their enemies.
BTW,Arabs are also semites (sons of Shem).
In an interview with a Pakistani newspaper (Dawn) on June 21. Obama told the interviewer about his college travels in Pakistan and talked about the exotic dishes he learned to cook there.
“Keema … daal … you name it, I can cook it,” Obama said. Also, the president noted, he reads Urdu poetry.
All this is driving certain people — mostly Republicans — nuts.
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0609/24180.html
@Hasanm
@zia m
Islam indeed discouraged & banned slavery but old customs (habits) die hard.
Islam did not ban slavery or discouraged it. Islam just told us to treat them better and gave them a right to be treated better which does not mean anything. Also you would be perfectly in your rights if you had a slave girl and forced yourself on her. She wouldn’t be able to press charges in a qazi court for rape or assault. Forcing yourself on the slave girl and having children is fine under Islam. If I am saying anything that is incorrect due to my limited knowledge please feel free to correct me. All men are created equal the city of room was using this principal 2000 years ago. Alexander the great considered the boundary of the Persian empire the end of civilized world and anything after occupied by uncivilized and barbaric people. If we still have slavery in any form in Pakistan than we only prove him right still after all these years. It does not speak to highly of us as human beings but who cares right?
None of the Abrahamic Religions ever banned slavery.
Right I agree.
According to Old Testament Book of Genesis,Noah had three sons
1.Shem forefather of semitic people.
2.Japheth the father of Europeans
3.Ham ancestor of Africans.
It is rather disgusting that Canaan fourth son of Ham was cursed by Noah according to OT.
Canaanites were the original inhabitant of present day Palestine.
So it is clear that Jewish people used religion to subjugate their enemies.
BTW,Arabs are also semites (sons of Shem).
religion is a tool used to oppress and subjugate people. The first time I read that I thought Karl Marx was crazy and delusional. This theory couldn’t be right since religion is a beautiful thing. To my everlasting shame I have had to reconsider myself.
Micheal Jackson the biggest Pop Star world has ever witnessed passed away couple of hours ago. It’s an end of an era thats almost impossible for any one to match. I am fortunate to have lived through this legendary star’s era. Michael you will be missed in every nook and corner of the globe. May God rest his soul in peace.
he was the biggest star known to world. shocking news. MJ u will b remember forever
LHC acquits NS in fake helicoptor case
http://www.nation.com.pk/pakistan-news-newspaper-daily-english-online/Politics/26-Jun-2009/LHC-acquits-Nawaz-in-helicopter-reference
LHC acqu!ts NS in f@ke helicoptor case
http://www.nation.com.pk/pakistan-news-newspaper-daily-english-online/Politics/26-Jun-2009/LHC-acquits-Nawaz-in-helicopter-reference
Pakistani Taliban claim Kashmir attack
ISLAMABAD (AP) — A Pakistani Taliban spokesman claimed responsibility for a suicide attack against Pakistani security forces in Kashmir that has broadened the group’s anti-government campaign.
A suicide bomber blew himself up Friday near an army vehicle, killing at least two soldiers in the first such assault in Pakistan’s part of the divided Himalayan territory.
Hakimullah Mehsud, a deputy of Pakistani Taliban leader Baitullah Mehsud, told The Associated Press the attack was launched to prove that Mehsud had not been weakened by more than a week recent strikes on his suspected hideouts in northwest Pakistan.
Mehsud’s group is blamed for a series of deadly suicide attacks in Pakistan to avenge military operations in the volatile region.
I guess the Taliban drone forgot to take the exit for Indian Kashmir and detonated in Azad Kashmir. Should have used satnav.
Why Kashmir? Because Syed Ali Gillani denounced these throat cutters? Victims of Taliban must have the vengeance they seek. The state of Pakistan must react to this senseless murder. This one act of the Taliban speaks volumes.
To see a world in a grain of sand,
And a heaven in a wild flower,
Hold infinity in the palm of your hand,
And eternity in an hour.
A robin redbreast in a cage
Puts all heaven in a rage.
A dog starv’d at his master’s gate
Predicts the ruin of the state.
- Blake
UK Muslims on Taliban fight….BBC Survey
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8119273.stm
@lota6177
Don’t be so negative all the time. So what if slavery wasn’t abolished? Hey, at least we banned alcohol! And as we all know, alcohol is a much greater social evil than slavery. In the 57 OIC countries, alcohol consumption is a taboo and has been so for the last 1400 blessed years. But the bida’a of anti-slavery was only introduced to the world in 1860s by that accursed Abraham Lincoln (on whose progeny be plague).
Yes to sharia, no to bida’a
What would you rather have: drunk free people or sober slaves? For my part, every time I see a drunk blonde in a tank top, I fervently wish and pray for Sharia and the return of slavery. I must tell you my Iman has hardened considerably ever since the summer came along.
Hey! the heart wants what it wants, no?
Two classy articles:
What are our soldiers dying for? by Ayaz Amir
http://www.thenews.com.pk/daily_detail.asp?id=185018
Groping in the dark By Cyril Almeida
http://www.dawn.com/wps/wcm/connect/dawn-content-library/dawn/the-newspaper/columnists/cyril-almeida-groping-in-the-dark-669
Islam Attacks Slavery
By Sayyid Sa’eed Akhtar Rizvi
Islam has often been represented by Christian writers as a religion which not only tolerated slavery but also encouraged it. This is a serious accusation levelled against Islam, and in this book I propose to show its falsity. I would have taken, if possible, the charitable view that the charge against Islam is based on ignorance of facts, but I am grieved to note that in majority of the critics the overflowing motive seems to be prejudice, and malice.
We have mentioned briefly the attitude of Christianity towards slavery, and more will be said afterwards. Here, to begin with, let us have a look at Islam and its codes.
As far as slavery was concerned, Arabs in the pre-Islamic days were as bad offenders as their neighbours. Slaves were a commercial commodity, and slavery was an established institution. It was a source of livelihood for thousands and a source of labour for scores of thousands. To the elite, the number of slaves in the household was a symbol of status.
This was the state of affairs at the advent of Islam. Slavery offended the spirit of Islam as much as idolatry did. But while the latter had its roots in spiritualism and hence could be countered by reason, slavery had its roots in commerce, in social structure, in agriculture undertakings; and reason alone was but a feeble weapon against a foe so insidious and so deeply rooted. How was then slavery to be eradicated?
The ill-informed may well suggest that the Prophet of Islam could have used force. But the ineffectiveness of force for such purpose is well recognised by all dispassionate students of sociology. Force may achieve submission but it inevitably achieves hostility, and very often hostility is so fierce that many a good cause has been lost when force has been employed for its advancement. The sad plight of the Negroes of America is but one illustration of how ineffective the employment of force can be when the object is to achieve a social reform. The emancipation of slaves did not change the attitude of the white masters towards their ex-slaves; and what a bitter legacy of racial antipathy has it left! Toynbee writes, “The Blacks in the United States who were emancipated jurisdically in 1862 are, with good reason, feeling now, more than a century later, that they are still being denied full human rights by the white majority of their fellow-citizens.[1]
Islam’s war against slavery aimed at changing the attitude and mentality of the whole society, so that after emancipation, slaves would become its full-fledged members, without any need of demonstrations, strikes, civil disobedience and racial riots. And Islam achieved this seemingly impossible objective without any war. To say that Islam waged no war against slavery would not be a true statement. A war it waged, but a war in which neither sword was resorted to, nor blood was spilled.
Islam aimed at striking at the roots of its foe and created allies by arousing the finer instincts of its followers. A three-pronged attack on slavery was launched.
***
Firstly, Islam placed restrictions on acquisition of slaves. Prior to Islam, slavery was practised with abandon. Debtors were made slaves, war captives were either killed or made slaves. In weaker nations, people were hunted like animals, killed or captured and reduced to slavery. Islam, in unambiguous terms, forbade its followers to enslave people on any pretext. The only exception was an idolatrous enemy captured in a war which was fought either in self-defence or with the permission of the Prophet or his rightful successors. This exception was, in words of Ameer Ali, “in order to serve as guarantee for the preservation of the lives of the captives.”[2]
As ‘Allamah Tabataba’i has described at great length, prior to Islam strong and dominant people, throughout the world, used to enslave weak persons without any restraint. Important among the “causes” of enslavement were the following three factors:
1. War: The conqueror could do with the vanquished enemy whatever he liked. He could put the arrested soldiers to death, condemn them to slavery or otherwise keep them under his authority or clutch.
2. Domination: A chief or ruler could enslave, depending on his sweet wish, anyone residing under his domain.
3. Guardianship: A father or grandfather had absolute authority over his offspring. He could sell or gift him or her away; could lend him or her to someone else, or exchange him or her with another’s son or daughter.
When Islam came on the scene, it nullified and negated the last two factors completely. No ruler or progenitor was allowed to treat his subjects or offspring as his slaves. Every individual was bestowed with well-defined rights; the ruler and the ruled, the progenitor and the offspring had to live within the limits prescribed by religion; no one could transgress those limits.
And it drastically restricted the first cause, i.e., war, by allowing enslavement only in a war fought against unbelieving enemy. In no other way could anyone be enslaved. At the same time, Islam raised the status of slavery to that of a free man; and opened many ways for their emancipation.[3]
Before slave trade was started on a large scale by the Westerners (when colonisation began), it was only in wars that men were made captives. But Islam did not permit wars of aggression. All the battles fought during the life-time of the Prophet were defensive battles. Not only this, an alternative was also introduced and enforced: “to let the captives go free, either with or without any ransom “(The Qur’an 47:4). In the battles forced upon the Muslims, the Prophet had ordered very humane treatment of the prisoners who fell into Muslim hands. They could purchase their freedom on payment of small sums of money, and some of them were left off without any payment. It all depended upon the discretion of the Prophet or his rightful successors, keeping in view the safety of the Muslims and the extent of danger from the enemy. The captives of the very first Islamic battle, Badr, were freed on ransom (in form of money or work like teaching ten Muslim children how to read and write), while those of the tribe of Tay were freed without any ransom.[4]
Even in such enslavement a condition was attached that a mother was not to be separated from her child, nor brother from brother nor husband from wife nor one member of a clan from his clan. The Prophet and the first Shi’ite Imam, ‘Ali bin Abi Talib, prescribed severest penalties for anyone who took a free man into slavery: cutting off the hand of the culprit.
Ameer Ali writes in Mohammedan Law:
The possession of a slave by the Koranic laws was conditional on a bona-fide war, waged in self-defence, against idolatrous enemies; and it was permitted in order to serve as a guarantee for the preservation of the lives of the captives.. Mohammad found the custom existing among the pagan Arabs; he minimised the evil, and at the same time laid down such strict rules that but for the perversity of his followers, slavery as a social institution would have ceased to exist with the discontinuance of the wars in which the Moslem [sic] nation were at first involved.
The mutilation of the human body was also explicitly forbidden by Mohammad, and the institution which flourished both in the Persian and the Byzantine empires was denounced in severe terms. Slavery by purchase was unknown during the reigns of the first four Caliphs, the khulafai-rashidin, ‘the legitimate Caliphs’ as they are called by the Sunnis. There is, at least, no authentic record of any slave having been acquired by purchase during their tenure of office. But with the accession of the usurping house of Ommeyya [sic] a change came over the spirit of Islam. Mu’awiyah was the first Muslim sovereign who introduced into the Mohammedan world the practice of acquiring slaves by purchase. He was also the first to adopt the Byzantine custom of guarding his women by eunuchs. During the reign of the early Abbasides the Shi’a Imam Ja’far al-Sadiq preached against slavery, and his views were adopted by the Mu’tazila. Karmath, who flourished in the ninth century of the Christian era ..seems to have held slavery to be unlawful.[5]
Thus we see that the earnest attempt of Islam to stop its followers from acquiring new slaves was foiled by Banu Umayyah. And I must record to the lasting disgrace of a large number of Muslims that, in later times, they utterly ignored the precepts of the Prophet and the injunctions of the Qur’an, and the Arabs too participated with the European Christians in the abominable slave-trade of East Africa. The West African slave-trade was totally in the hands of the European Christians.
***
Secondly, Islam commenced an active campaign to emancipate the slaves. Emancipation of slaves was declared to be expiation for a number of sins. This question is related to canonical laws of Islam, but we shall enumerate a few of them to show how for small sins of commission the penalty imposed was manumission of slaves. For instance, if a man failed to fast without any reasonable excuse during the month of Ramadan, or if he failed to observe fast of i’tikaf or vow, etc, he had to free a slave for each day, in addition to fasting afterwards. Similarly, a slave had to be freed for every breach of vow; or for tearing one’s garment as a demonstration of grief on the death of a spouse or child; or if a woman beat herself or cut or pulled her hair in grief over the death of anyone; or for accidental homicide and, in some cases, even for intentionally killing a Muslim; or if a husband told his wife that she was to him like his mother, and for many other trespasses.[6] From these instances, some of them trivial but deeply ingrained in Arab culture, one can see how religious laws were enacted for the emancipation of slaves, and the total eradication of the curse of slavery from the society.
It may well be argued that by prescribing emancipation of slaves as penance for sins, Islam envisaged continuance of slavery as a permanent institution. This was not so. For every instance emancipation of a slave was prescribed as a penance, an alternative was also prescribed – clearly indicating that Islam’s objective was in time to create a society free from this pernicious institution.[7]
Islam also declared that any slave woman who bore a child by her master could not be sold and, on her master’s death, she became automatically a free woman.[8] Moreover; in contrast to all previous customs, Islam ordained that the child born to a slave woman by her master should follow the status of the father.[9] Slaves were given a right to ransom themselves either on payment of an agreed sum or on completion of service for an agreed period. The legal term for this is mukatabah. Allah says in the Qur’an:
And those who seek a deed [of liberation] from among those [slaves] whom your right hands possess, give them the writing (kitab) if you know of goodness in them, and give them of the wealth of Allah which He has given you.. (Qur’an 2433)
The word kitab in the verse stands for the written contract between the slave and his master known as “mukatabah – deed of contract”. The significant factor in mukatabah is that when a slave desires to get into such a mutual written contract, the master should not refuse it.[10] In the verse quoted above, God has made it incumbent upon Muslims to help the slaves in getting liberated. When a slave wants to get himself freed, the master has not only to agree to it, but he is also directed to help the slave from his own wealth,[11] the only provision being the satisfaction to the effect that the slave would live a respectable life after earning his freedom. Thus, about 1400 years ago Islam dealt in the most effective way a death blow to slavery.
It also directed that the slaves seeking freedom should be helped from the public treasury (baytul mal).[12] Thus, as a last resort, the Prophet and his rightful successors were to provide ransom for the slaves out of state coffers. The Qur’an recognises the emancipation of slaves as one of the permissible expenditures of alms and charity. (See the Qur’an 9:60, 2:177.)
It is worth remembering that a slave automatically became free if the master cut his ear or blinded his eye.[13] Also if the slaves, living in an Islamic state, accepted Islam before their masters, then they would become free automatically. If the slave became blind or handicapped he would become free.[14] According to Imam Ja’far al-Sadiq (peace be upon him), if a slave is Muslim and has worked for seven years then he should be set free. Forcing him to work after seven years is not permissible.[15] It is because of this tradition (hadith) that the religious scholars are of the opinion that freeing the slave after seven years is a highly recommended deed of virtue.
In addition to these compulsory ways of emancipation, voluntary emancipation of slaves was declared as the purest form of charity. Imam ‘Ali emancipated one thousand slaves, purchasing them from his own money.[16] The same was the number of the slaves emancipated by the seventh Imam Musa al-Kazim. The fourth Imam, ‘Ali bin al-Husayn, used to emancipate every slave in his household on the eve of ‘Idd (the annual celebration of Muslims). It is important to note that in all the above cases, the freed slaves were provided with sufficient means to earn their livelihood respectably.
Islam is the first and the only religion which has prescribed liberation of slaves as a virtue and a condition of genuine faith in God. No religion other than Islam has ever preached and enjoined how best we can show our love for fellow human beings in bondage. In chapter ninety of the Qur’an, liberating a slave has been prescribed as a cardinal virtue of the faith:
Certainly We have created men [to dwell] in distress. What! Does he think that no one has power over him? He shall say, “I have wasted much wealth” Does he think that no one sees him? Have We not given him two eyes, a tongue and two lips, and We pointed out to him the two conspicuous ways [of good and evil]? But he would not attempt the uphill road. What will make you comprehend what the uphill road is? It is the setting free of a slave….
It should be mentioned that the setting free of a slave has been highly commended. Islam controlled slavery in such a graceful and practical way that it made the maintaining of a slave a great responsibility for the master, and at the same time it enjoined so much care and kindness to the slaves that in many cases when the slaves were set free they did not like to leave their masters.
***
Thirdly, Islam restored dignity to slaves and enhanced their social status. It made no distinction between a slave or a free man, and all were treated with equality. It was this fact that always attracted slaves to Islam. It is painful to see that those who never cease to be vociferous in their unjust criticism of Islam should take no notice of this principle of equality, when even in this enlightened age there are countries where laws are made discriminating against the vast majority of population, to keep them in practical servitude.
Islam recognises no distinction of race or colour, black or white, citizens or soldiers, rulers or subjects; they are perfectly equal, not in theory only, but in practice. The first mu’azzin (herald of the prayer call) of Islam, a devoted adherent of the Prophet and an esteemed disciple, was a Negro slave. The Qur’an lays down the measure of superiority in verse thirteen of chapter forty-nine. It is addressed to mankind, the whole human race, and preaches the natural brotherhood of man without distinction of tribe, clan, race or colour. It says:
O you men! We have created you of a male and a female, and then We made you (into different) races and tribes so that you may know (and recognise) each other. Surely the most honourable of you with Allah is the one who is most pious among you; surely Allah is All-Knowing and Aware.
This verse makes clear the view point of Islam as regards human life on earth. It lays down only one criterion of superiority or honour and that is piety, which means complete obedience to the will of God. It annihilates all man-made and artificial distinctions of race and colour which we find all over the world even now. To explain the qualities of piety, let us note what Allah says:
It is not righteousness that you turn your faces towards the East and the West, righteousness is this that one should believe in Allah, the Last Day, the angels, the Book and the Prophets, and give away wealth out of love for Him to the near of kin, the orphans, the needy, the wayfarer, the beggars and to those in bondage and keep up prayers, pay the poor-rate; and those who fulfil their promise and the patient ones in distress and affliction and in the time of war – these are they who are the truthful and these are they who are pious. (The Qur’an 2:177)
This verse clearly shows that by itself there is no specific virtue in turning towards any particular direction for prayer. (The unity of the Qiblah indicates the unity of faith which leads to spiritual unity and culminates in physical harmony.) The belief and practice enjoined in the verse are the real virtues, and apart from being ordered by God, they appeal to human reasoning. Please mark that “to give away wealth out of love for God to…those in bondage” is one of them.
In a tradition from Imam Muhammad al-Baqir, it is stated that when a person hits his slave (male or female), without any legal justification, then the only way of accounting for that act is setting the slave free even if that act of hitting is within the limits fixed by God. In another tradition, Zurarah asked the same Imam about the attitude of a master towards the slaves. The Imam answered that “an act unintentionally done by the slaves is not punishable but when they are persistently and intentionally disobeying the will of the master, then they can be punished.” It would be of interest to know that a slave was given the right to sue his master. A third tradition from the same Imam says that a man possessing the following four characteristics will be forgiven and will be placed highly in the values of realms of heaven: (1) one who shelters an orphan and takes interest in the circumstances and problems in which orphan is placed and is kind to him in a fatherly way, gives him the love of parents; (2) one who is kind and helpful to the weak; (3) one who spends on his parents and is kind, thoughtful and looking towards them; (4) and lastly, the one who is not furious in his behaviour towards his servant or slave and helps him in the work one has ordered, and refrains from ordering him such task which is beyond his capacity.
“Islam enjoined that a master should treat his slave as one of his family-members; he must be given all the necessities of life, just like any other dependent. The Prophet used to eat together with his slaves and servants, and sit with them; he himself did not eat or dress better than them, nor did he discriminate against them in any way.
“The masters were obliged not to put them under hardship; slaves were not to be tortured, abused or treated unjustly. They could marry among themselves (with their master’s permission) or with free men or women. They could appear as witnesses, and participate with free men in all affairs. Many of them were appointed as governors, commanders of army and administrators.
“In the eyes of Islam, a pious slave has precedence over an unpious free man.”[17]
It is stated in reliable traditions from the Prophet that one should feed his slave what he himself eats and should dress him with what he himself dresses. In his famous sermon in ‘Arafat, on 9th Dhul-hijjah 9 AH, during his last pilgrimage, the Prophet said, “…and your slaves, see that you feed them such food as you eat yourselves and dress him with what you yourself dress. And if they commit a mistake which you are not inclined to forgive then sell them, for they are the servants of Allah and are not to be tormented…”.[18]
To say that Islam treated slaves on the basis of equality would be an understatement. Because, in fact, for a number of offences, the punishment meted out to a slave was half of the punishment meted out to others.[19] This was in contrast to the established practice of every nation to punish slaves more severely than the free men. Professor Davis writes, “The criminal law was almost everywhere more severe for slaves than freemen.”[20]
The Prophet of Islam always exhorted his followers to treat their slaves like family-members. He and his household always treated their servants as such. A female servant in the employ of Fatimah, the Prophet’s daughter, testifies that her mistress had made it a rule to share all household drudgery with her and insisted that the servant should have rest every alternative days when she, Fatimah, would attend to the work. Thus, there was equal division of work between the mistress of the house and the maid-servant
It is also recorded that once ‘Ali and his male servant Qambar went to a shop where ‘Ali selected two garments, one a cheap coarse dress, the other expensive. He gave the expensive garment to Qambar. Qambar was shocked. “Oh Master!”, he said, “This is the better one and you are the ruler of the Muslims. You should take this one.” ‘Ali replied, “No, Qambar, you are young and young man should wear better clothes.” Could such a treatment produce any sense of inferiority in slaves? Masters were forbidden to exact more work than was just and proper. They were ordered never to address their male or female slaves by the degrading appellation, but by the more affectionate name of “my young man’, or “my young maid”; it was also enjoined that all slaves should be dressed, clothed and fed exactly as their masters and mistresses did. It was also ordered that in no case should the mother be separated from her child, nor brother from brother, nor father from son, nor husband from wife, nor one relative from another.
Let us now refer to the Qur’an:
Worship Allah (alone) and associate nothing with Him, and do good to parents, to kinsfolk, to orphans, to the needy, to the neighbour who is a relative, to the neighbour who is a stranger, to a companion by your side, to the wayfarer and to (the slave) which your right hands possess; verily Allah loves not the proud, the boastful. (4:36)
The Holy Prophet gifted a slave to Abu Dharr al-Ghifari and told him to maintain him in the best way, to feed him whatever he himself ate, to clothe him with whatever clothes he liked for himself. Abu Dharr had a robe which he immediately tore into two, and gave one piece to the slave. The Prophet said, “Excellent!” Abu Dharr took the slave home and liberated him. The Prophet was highly pleased with Abu Dharr and said, “God will reward you for it.”
How Imam Zaynul ‘Abidin, the fourth Imam, treated his slave-girl is well-known in Islamic history. Once while serving food to the Imam, she accidentally dropped a bowl of hot soup on him. She was deeply conscious of the injury and pain she had caused to the Imam. She knew very well the disposition of the holy Imam and began reciting the Qur’anic verse, “Those who restrain their anger.”
“I have restrained my anger,” the Imam replied.
“And those who forgive the people,” she went on.
“I have forgiven you,” he said.
Lastly, she said, “And God loves those who do good to others.”
The Imam replied, “I set you free to seek the pleasure of God.”
The slave-girl had quoted those words from verse 133 of chapter 3 of the Qur’an. We reproduce the full verse here:
Those who spend (in alms) alike in prosperity and straitness, and who restrain (their) anger, and those who forgive the people, and Allah loves those who do good (to others).
Once someone remarked that the slaves of Imam Zayn al-’Abidin say to each other that they were not in the least afraid of him. On hearing this, the Imam prostrated to God in thanks-giving and exclaimed, “I thank God that his creatures are not afraid of me.”
From what we have said above it must be clear how kindly and lovingly the slaves were treated by the Holy Prophet and the Imams of Ahlul Bayt, and those who followed the injunctions of the Qur’an and the examples set by the Prophet and the Imams.
On the attitude of Muslim master with his slaves, Will Durant says, “…he handled them with a genial humanity that made their lot no worse – perhaps better, as more secure – than that of a factory worker in nineteenth-century Europe.”[21]
At the end of the 18th century, Mouradgea d’Ohsson (a main source of information for the Western writers on the Ottoman empire) declared:
“There is perhaps no nation where the captives, the slaves, the very toilers in the galleys are better provided for or treated with more kindness than among the Muhammedans.”[22]
P. L Riviere writes:
“A master was enjoined to make his slave share the bounties he received from God. It must be recognised that, in this respect, the Islamic teaching acknowledged such a respect for human personality and showed a sense of equality which is searched for in vain in ancient civilization”[23]
And not only in ancient civilisations; even in the modern Christian civilisation the ingrained belief of racial supremacy is still manifesting itself every day. A. J. Toynbee says in Civilization on Trial:
“The extinction of race consciousness as between Muslims is one of the outstanding achievements of Islam, and in the contemporary world there is, as it happens, a crying need for the propagation of this Islamic virtue…” Then he comments that “in this perilous matter of race feeling it can hardly be denied that (the triumph of English-speaking peoples) has been a misfortune.”[24]
Napoleon Bonaparte is recorded as saying about the condition of slaves in Muslim countries:
“The slave inherits his master’s property and marries his daughter. The majority of the Pashas had been slaves. Many of the grand viziers, all the Mamelukes, Ali Ben Mourad Beg, had been slaves. They began their lives by performing the most menial services in the houses of their masters and were subsequently raised in status for their merit or by favour. In the West, on the contrary, the slave has always been below the position of the domestic servants; he occupies the lowest rug. The Romans emancipated their slaves, but the emancipated were never considered as equal to the free-born. The ideas of the East and West are so different that it took a long time to make the Egyptians understand that all the army was not composed of slaves belonging to the Sultan al-Kabir.”[25]
Notes:
[1]. Toynbee, A. J., Mankind and Mother Earth, (N.Y.: Oxford University Press, 1976), p.12.
[2]. Ameer Ali, Muhammadan Law, vol.2, p.31.
[3]. al-Tabataba’i, Sayyid Muhammad Husayn, al-Mizan fi Tafsir’l Qur’an, vol.16, 2nd ed. (Beirut, 1390/1971), pp. 338-358.
[4]. al-Waqidi, Muhammad bin ‘Umar, Kitabul Maghazi, ed. M. Jones, vol. I (London: Oxford University Press, 1966), p.129; Ibn Sa’d, al-Tabaqatul Kabir, Vol. II:1 (Leiden: E.J. Brill, 1912), pp.11, 14.
[5]. Ameer Ali, Muhammadan Law, vol. 2, pp. 31-2.
[6]. al-Khu’i, Sayyid Abu’l Qasim, Minhajus Salihin, 3rd ed., vol. II (Najaf, 1974), pp. 328-331; also see the Qur’an, 4:92, 5:89, 58:3.
[7]. Ibid.
[8]. al-’Amili, Hurr, Wasa’ilu ‘sh-Shi’ah, vol.16 (Tehran, 1983), p.128.
[9]. Ibid.
[10]. al-’Amili, op. cit., vol.16, p.101.
[11]. Ibid, p. 111.
[12]. Ibid, pp. 121-2.
[13]. al-Hilli, Muhaqqiq, Sharaya’ul Islam, (kitabul-’itq); also see The Encyclopaedia of Islam:, vol. I (Leiden: E.J. Brill, 1960), p. 31.
[14]. Ibid, pp. 31-3.
[15]. Ibid, pp. 43-4.
[16]. Ibid, p. 3.
[17]. al-Tabataba’i, op. cit., vol.16, pp. 338-358.
[18]. Ibn Sa’d, op. cit., vol. II:1, p. 133; al-’Amili, op. cit., vol.16, 21.
[19]. al-Amili, op. cit., vol.18, pp. 401f, 527-8, 586-7; vol. 19, pp. 73, 154f.
[20]. Davis, D.B., The Problem of Slavery in Western Culture (N.Y.: 1969), p. 60.
[21]. Hurgronje C., Mohammedanism, (N.Y., 1916), p. 128 as quoted by W. Durant, The Story of Civilization, vol. IV (N.Y., 1950), p. 209.
[22]. As quoted in The Encyclopaedia of Islam, vol.I, p. 35.
[23]. Riviere P.L., Revue Bleaue (June 1939).
[24]. Toynbee, A.J., Civilization on Trial (New York, 1948), p. 205.
[25]. Cherfils, Bonaparte et l’Islam (Paris, 1914), p. (?).
Another good step by Supreme Court.
CHANDIGARH: Taking cognizance of a TOI report on illegal cross-border organ trade, Pakistan’s Supreme Court has come down heavily on those involved
in the racket and ordered for stringent measures to bring an end to the shocking practice.
TOI’s news of February 7, 2009 ‘Pakistan hospital on WHO kidney sale radar’ was reportedly instrumental in getting the SC to act on a petition moved for implementation of Transplantation of Human Organs and Tissues Ordinance, 2007, earlier this week.
“It is heartening to know of your interest in the fight against organ trade. Your article was… instrumental in the build up of the situation leading to the circumstances finally unfolding in the court’s verdict,” said Human Organ Transplant Authority administrator Maj Gen (retd) Abdul Qadir Usmani in an email to TOI.
While ordering Lahore-based Aadil Hospital, the kidney centre under scanner, to furnish complete details of all operations undertaken by it in the last three years within two weeks, the SC had directed HOTA to oversee its functioning henceforth.
Back home, Vivekanand Jha, additional professor in PGI’s nephrology department and member of ethics committee of Global Transplantation Society, confirmed that the international renal bazaar was very much alive.
“We still get patients who have crossed the border to sell their kidneys, only to return to us with complications. I am in touch with international bodies which are trying to combat this growing menace,” said Jha.
But defending himself, chief executive officer of Aadil Hospital, Abdul Waheed Sheikh, wrote to TOI that he had stopped the trade following SC orders.
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Stop-cross-border-organ-trade-Pak-SC/articleshow/4708359.cms
Why not just declare Slavery Haram and abolish it forever instead of marrying Masters daughters to the Slave and then gloating about it?
Alcohol or Slavery? it was pointed out wonderfully above , but I guess got lost on the slavish mind.
Do we practice Slavery now? . No. Why? Because we know it is wrong. That’s all you don’t need archaic religions to tell you everything. Morlals and values are better now as far as Slavery is concerned.
Karachi!!!!!!!!! Karachi!!!!!!!!!!!
According to ummat newspaper Karachi published on 27 june, 2009: A huge powerful explosion was occurred in a warehouse of explosives in an area of Karachi ‘gharibabad’. The house in which explosive material was stored belonged to Mr.Azeem, an official of muttahida qaumi movement (mazloomon waali party) sector liaqatabad, unit 158. Mr.Azeem of mqm has been involved in this business for years. Due to fear of mqm, no one had courage to object on Mr. Azeem’s illegal business. According to a senior police officer, explosives do not seem to be ordinary explosives that are usually used in calibrations and social events, but from the huge explosion and its destruction on such a large scale it shows that the material stored in the pretext of ordinary explosives, were highly sensitive explosive material that may be used in sabotage and bombings. Due to huge explosion, 3 people were killed, 32 injured in which 4 are in critical condition. At least 7 houses of neighboring area were also destroyed completely. People of Karachi remember various events of sabotage in which highly explosive materials were used for destruction, for example; explosion in benazir’s public meeting in 2007 in Karachi in which more than 300 people were killed, or explosion in eid milad un nabi event in 2006 in nashter park Karachi in which more than 50 ulemas were killed. Not a single criminal has ever been caught and judicially executed. links:
http://www.dawn.com/wps/wcm/connect/dawn-content-library/dawn/news/pakistan/metropolitan/04-explosion-in-karachi-near-railway-lines-qs-08
http://www.ummatpublication.com/2009/06/27/lead2.html
Ex Anti Corruption Director is a robber. Now we can see how car lifters run way so easilly.
http://jang.com.pk/jang/jun2009-daily/27-06-2009/update.htm#09
The “Water civil war” is very much on the horizon.
Sindh blaming Punjab, Baluchistan blaming Sindh and Punjab over water shortages.
The ill-informed may well suggest that the Prophet of Islam could have used force. But the ineffectiveness of force for such purpose is well recognised by all dispassionate students of sociology. Force may achieve submission but it inevitably achieves hostility, and very often hostility is so fierce that many a good cause has been lost when force has been employed for its advancement. The sad plight of the Negroes of America is but one illustration of how ineffective the employment of force can be when the object is to achieve a social reform. The emancipation of slaves did not change the attitude of the white masters towards their ex-slaves; and what a bitter legacy of racial antipathy has it left! Toynbee writes, “The Blacks in the United States who were emancipated jurisdically in 1862 are, with good reason, feeling now, more than a century later, that they are still being denied full human rights by the white majority of their fellow-citizens.[1]
in 40 years after abolishing slavery america has a black president OBAMA. Didnt you notice wake up you missed it. The prophet of islam didnt had to use force. If god wills it in the quran it becomes law. Muslims obey gods will. For a religion that is to be a complete way of life the omission of abolishment of slavery is a big over sight. If god is not going to abolsih slavery than who will?
Slavery is wrong. In any form, way or shape. There is no good condition for it. There is no debate on that. Anyone who tries to justify slavery come off as an idiot so please take the arguments on slavery for the benift of human kind of the table.
Slavery is wrong and immoral. Did you miss the memo. There is no good conditions for slavery. Stop justifing.
immoral practise. Slavery is wrong.
if islam forbade slavery this wouldnt happen would it? One ayah that says nomore slavery and that door is closed.
This shows how high the value of life of a slave his. You can free a slave for any number of trival things but to outlaw it is extremly hard.
Master plz no rape me. Me go to qazi complain. Master ju no go to qazi its all good. If the master forces himself how does the salve stop that? any process for that?
Now why would that happen, why would the loving master would do that?
Hard to work a handicap slave no slave rehabilitation in thoese days cheaper to buy a new one.
six years and three hunder 56 days would be too fast. 7 the right number, i understand. Right.
Woudlnt it be more easier to say” slavery is wrong. period. nomore, you go to hell if you do it. Could that have worked?
@jazoo
Thank you for the wonderful post and providing the references. It is truly sickening and I had no idea being a Muslim about the extent of slavery practiced in Islam. I guess I need to read up all this instances of slavery and study them in depth. This post does explain greatly the Arab attitude towards other people.
@lota
Stop attacking Sharia, you kafir.
Slavery is a sublime Islamic institution and Sharia is for all times, all places.
What part of the following verse do you NOT understand?
Would you take the word of Abraham Lincoln and the execrable British parliament over God?
Slavery is part and parcel of Sharia. Stop picking and choosing from among the Ayaat of God. Ever since the Khilafa was destroyed by the infidels, the profound pillar of Islamic civilization that is slavery has all but disappeared from the lands of Islam.
This was not always so. Even as late as 1880s, New York Times reports slavery in Ottoman Turkey and its capital Istanbul.
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=9E03E1DE143FEE3ABC4C52DFB166838B699FDE
Subhanullah!
So, can you imagine? Even after the infernal Tanzimat reforms, the Khalifatul Islam in 1880s still had slaves in the Sublime Porte. As Amirul Momineen, his word was law. What strength of Iman!
We need a Khalifa today to bring back slavery and DESTROY the Murree brewery. To enjoin good and forbid evil.
Amr bil ma’roof wa anhi anil munkar! Wama alyna illal balaaghul mubeen.
In a serious vein, the idea of slavery being halal and alcohol being haram, is plainly ridiculous. A few thoughts and observations follow on the idea of rationalism in Islam and what Allama Iqbal thought about it:
The Reconstruction of Religious Thought in Islam
http://www.witness-pioneer.org/vil/Books/MI_RRTI/chapter_06.htm
The need for rationalism and reason in Muslims is more urgent today than ever before. Iqbal wrote about the reasons for the failure of Muslims to carry out Ijtihad in his groundbreaking work “The Reconstruction of Religious Thought in Islam”:
1. Fear of the chaos unleashed by the rationalists like the Muta’zilites. The Ashari school of thought with luminaries like Ghazali and Ashari opposed rationalists like Ibn Rushd and Ibn Sina. (Incoherence of philosophers etc)
2. Rise of Sufism and the attendant fear of bida’a forced the orthodox ulema of the 13th century to close the doors of Ijtihad shut.
3. Destruction of Baghdad by the Mongols and the resultant destruction of intellectual and human capital through famine, drought and social upheaval.
Allama Iqbal praises Ibn Taimiyya of the 13th century and his latter day follower Ibn Wahhab for being purtian reformers and Mujtahids but had this to say about the Wahhabies:
On Khilafa turtles, universal Jihad and permanent revolution combined with no Ijtihad (Al Qaida, Taliban), Allama Iqbal had this to say:
Iqbal was very cognizant of the tension between conventional and rationalist Muslims in his time. He identified with the rationalists openly and called for reform and Ijtihad.
http://www.witness-pioneer.org/vil/Books/MI_RRTI/Default.htm
Apparently during Iqbal’s time, the liberal vs. retrograde strains were still in struggle under the watchful eyes of the colonial regimes. Iqbal was afraid that reformers like Sir Syed would go too far in their reform and destroy Islam.
Allama Iqbal underestimated the violent tendencies of Wahabi reformers in India and Saudi Arabia because after independence, the retrogressive forces in Pakistani Islam (Maududi, JI) defeated the progressives (Fazal-ur-Rehman, not Molana Diesel) through violence, agitation and supporting Martial Law regimes.
Then Allama Iqbal goes on to say:
To answer his own question, Allama Iqbal writes:
On the principal of blind Taqleed, Iqbal writes:
On Madrassah reform, Iqbal says:
So, in essence, Iqbal is calling for abolishing Madrassas as places for rote memorization of the Quran and recreating the Madrassa as a place for the study of modern law in the light of Islamic principles behind the Sharia (not Sharia itself).
In other words, Iqbal wants the Madrassas transformed into modern Law Colleges.
And Iqbal closes with:
At least in Allama Iqbal’s opinion, Ijtihad is a necessity and the Muslim world must consider uncomfortable questions like Slavery=Halal/Alcohol=Haram.
The answer is not to haram slavery or halal Alcohol but a thorough and informed debate about the nature of religion in society and the relationship between the state and its religious citizens.
The answer is to think and educate oneself.
Quaid e Azam’s pictures taken off the walls of President House and PM House. Geo reporting
Only BB, ZAB and Zardari’s pictures on disply now along with a 4th picture what seems like Mush’s ????
Shame on Zardari and Gilani for doing this to Pakistani nation. The biggest dacoit and chor of Pakistan – Zardari – has now ordained his picturei n President House – The Supreme Court and National Assembly should take a serious notice of this.
@lota6177
It seems like you grasp the whole article except this part.
Its natural you will try to understand out of context what you feel like…Following two paras must be boring or doesn’t suit your intellectual dishonesty.
“As far as slavery was concerned, Arabs in the pre-Islamic days were as bad offenders as their neighbours. Slaves were a commercial commodity, and slavery was an established institution. It was a source of livelihood for thousands and a source of labour for scores of thousands. To the elite, the number of slaves in the household was a symbol of status.
This was the state of affairs at the advent of Islam. Slavery offended the spirit of Islam as much as idolatry did. But while the latter had its roots in spiritualism and hence could be countered by reason, slavery had its roots in commerce, in social structure, in agriculture undertakings; and reason alone was but a feeble weapon against a foe so insidious and so deeply rooted. How was then slavery to be eradicated?”
@lota6177
One more thing Islam and Quran could be revealed in one day and all the laws should be enforced in no time but it takes 23 years…if you could understand 23 years then you will also understand systematic discouraging of slavery.
The Quran which could wait for a suitable time to ban alcohol…can also wait to eliminate slavery until and after Prophet systematically.
farhatullah babar on removing of quaid’s picture
http://www.geo.tv/6-27-2009/44978.htm
@mb
hallo mate
could you give us the name of the specific essay/book that you’re quoting from
thanks
Slavery in Ancient Times
“O you men!
We have created you of a male and a female,
and then We made you
(into different) races and tribes
so that you may know each other.
Surely the most honourable of you with Allah
is the one who is most pious among you;
surely Allah Is All-Knowing & Aware.”
(The Qur’an 49:13)
Slavery was not an institution invented by Christianity or Islam. It was there long before these religions came into being. Just to give a glimpse of ancient slavery, let me quote from Justice Ameer Ali:
The practice of slavery is coeval with human existence. Historically its traces are visible in every age and in every nation…The Jews, the Greeks, the Romans and the ancient Germans, people whose legal and social institutions have most affected modern manners and customs, recognised and practised both kinds of slavery, praedial servitude as well as household slavery. With establishment of the Western and Northern barbarians on the ruins of the Roman empire, besides personal slavery, territorial servitude, scarcely known to the Romans, became general in all the newly settled countries…The barbaric codes, like the Roman, regarded slavery as an ordinary condition of mankind; and if any protection was afforded the slave, it was chiefly as the property of his master, who alone, besides the State, had the power of the life and death over him.[1]
In Persia the palace of the Emperor had twelve thousand women slaves. When the Byzantine Emperor sat on the throne, thousands of slaves remained in attendance with full attention and hundreds of them bowed when he bent to put on his shoes. In Greece, the number of slaves was far greater than the number of free men, although Greece had produced great advocates of humanity and justice. Every Greek army which entered with ridings of victory over the enemy was followed by a host of slaves. Aristotle, the famous ancient philosopher, while discussing the question whether or not any one is intended by nature to he a slave, says, “There is no difficulty in answering this question, on grounds both of reason and of fact. For that some should rule and others be ruled is a thing not only necessary, but expedient from the hour of their birth, some are marked out for subjection, others for rule.” Then he concludes, “…some men are by nature free, and others slave, and that for these latter slavery is both expedient and right.”[2] With Imperial Rome, the slavery of the ancient world reached its zenith, but when Roman Empire began its decline, the lot of slaves began to improve in some tiny degrees. But the canker of slavery was too evident. It had defeated the skill of Roman legality as it had defeated the subtlety of Greek philosophy. To be compassionate with slaves was regarded not as a natural feeling but as a personal idiosyncrasy. The slave was hardly human; he had no right, he had no soul.[3]
At the time of the advent of Islam (in 7th century CE) slavery was rampant throughout India, Persia, Rome, the Arabian Peninsula, Rumania and Greece. The elite and educated class of these countries did not regard the slaves eligible even for the basic human rights. He was regarded as a commodity not worthier than cattle.[4] Often he was sold cheaper than sheep and goat. On special social occasions the distinguished citizens of the State used to get together with the Head of the State to watch the gladiatorial games in which the slaves were made to fight with swords and spears just like the shows of cock-fights and partridges in our old feudal society. The people cheered the hands until one of the fighters was killed. The audience would then applaud the winner heartily.[5]
On the one side, the Arabian Peninsula was surrounded by countries which still bore traces of the grandeur of the then declining Roman-Greek civilisation, and on the other side, by countries wrapped in Zoroastrianism and Hinduism. As mentioned above, in all these countries slavery was a recognised institution. The twelve Tablets had given its official seal of approval to this institution. The unmitigated hardship and cruelty which the slaves were made to suffer had not abated but, if anything, the slaves were now accepted as animals whose fate was only to work and die for those who owned them. I do not intend this book to be a chronicle of the inhumanity which the slaves suffered but suffice it to say that man must forever carry in his conscience a sense of guilt for having once indulged in slavery.
Notes:
[1]. Ameer Ali, Spirit of Islam (London: University Paper-back, 1965), pp. 259-261; also see Will Durant, The Story of Civilization, vol. III (New York, 1944), p.397.
[2]. Aristotle, Politics, Book I, chp. 5 (New York: Modern Library, 1943), pp.58-60.
[3]. Durant, W., op. cit., vol. III, p., 397; vol. IV (New York, 1950), p.29.
[4]. Ibid.
[5]. Ibid.
oops sorry just saw the link
link from geo re removal of Quaid’s pictures……..also included within the news is the picture as evidence………………..per my earlier post the 4th pic was not Mush………….but guess who????
…………..Bilawal beta!!!
http://www.geo.tv/6-27-2009/44977.htm
Its Pakistan or Bhuttoistan
@admin
Please start a separate thread on this!
Jiye Bhutto! Benazir SHAHEEEEEED Bhutto Development Program! Bhuttostan Zindabad!
Quaid’s portraits removed from President House
ISLAMABAD: The portraits of Founder of Pakistan Quaid-e-Azam Muhammed Ali Jinnah have been removed from the Prime Minister House and Presidential House, Geo News revealed Saturday.
Two days ago, President Asif Ali Zardari hosted a reception in the honour of national cricket team on winning the ICC Twenty20 World Cup title. On this occasion, the team players and officials had a group photo with President Zardari and Prime Minister Syed Yousuf Raza Gilani.
There are pictures of Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto, Benazir Bhutto, Bilawal Zardari Bhutto and President Zardari without any picture of founder of Pakistan are seen hung in the backdrop of photo.
Similarly, an Internship Award ceremony was held with PM Gilani in chair on Friday. On this occasion, the stage was decorated with the pictures of Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto, Benazir Bhutto, President Zardari and PM Gilani; however, there was no picture of Quaid-e-Azam.
In a similar photograph, President Zardari was administering oath of Federal Mohtasib to Dr Shoaib Suddle; however, the backdrop flashed with a picture of Quaid-e-Awam sans any photo of Quaid-e-Azam Muhammed Ali Jinnah.
Similarly, in a meeting with US delegation, no photograph of Muhammed Ali Jinnah was visible.
Under law, to hang the portrait of Quaid-e-Azam at offices of government officials, President and Prime Minister is compulsory.
http://thenews.jang.com.pk/updates.asp?id=81600
Quaid’s portraits removed from President & PM House
http://thenews.com.pk/updates.asp?id=81600
Pakistan’s transformation to Zardaristan is occurring at a good pace, I would say.
just to add to what was said up there about Saudi Arabia etc, I grew up there. spent more than 10 years of my life there from childhood. and I must say that Saudia Arabia is undoubtedly the MOST racist country on the planet. and Saudis are among the most retarded of people. someone asked why they’re like that. it is so because the arabs actually believe that they are better than everyone else. they might pray 35 times a day but that whole arabi and ajmi being equal is too inconvenient for them to remember.
the only people they’re intimidated by are the goras. it’s funny we beat ourselves up on many things including our inferiority complex wrt the goras. but our dysfunctional relationship with the gori chamri is nothing compared to the MASSIVE inferiority complex that the arabs have. anyway, that’s off-topic.
but all I will say is that it’s only us idiotic Pakistanis who shed tears for the supposed Muslim “ummah”, etc. we carry the burden of the whole “ummah” on our shoulders. NEWSFLASH: there is no such thing. anybody who spends any amount of time in saudi arabia will forget this Muslim brotherhood nonsense in milliseconds…
racism is indoctrinated and institutionalized in that forsaken country. it’s funny they say that Islam was revealed in Arab lands because the people there were the most depraved and hence, needed it most. well, guess what… not much has changed… maybe Islam needs to be revealed to those jaahil animals again.
it’s like Nusrat Javed said a few weeks back that we Pakistanis biatch and whine about our country but even in the worst of times, there are still freedoms we hold sacred and fight for no matter how brutal the govt at the time is… but even our most brutal dictators have been almost like Edhi compared to what happens in arab countries. even Dawn had an excellent article on it a while ago…
Quaid’s Pictures have been removed from President and Prime Minister House. Quaid is the founder of Pakistan. What a shameful act!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
http://jang.com.pk/jang/jun2009-daily/27-06-2009/update.htm#91
Quaid’s portraits removed from President House
ISLAMABAD: The portraits of Founder of Pakistan Quaid-e-Azam Muhammed Ali Jinnah have been removed from the Prime Minister House and Presidential House, Geo News revealed Saturday.
Two days ago, President Asif Ali Zardari hosted a reception in the honour of national cricket team on winning the ICC Twenty20 World Cup title. On this occasion, the team players and officials had a group photo with President Zardari and Prime Minister Syed Yousuf Raza Gilani.
There are pictures of Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto, Benazir Bhutto, Bilawal Zardari Bhutto and President Zardari without any picture of founder of Pakistan are seen hung in the backdrop of photo.
Similarly, an Internship Award ceremony was held with PM Gilani in chair on Friday. On this occasion, the stage was decorated with the pictures of Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto, Benazir Bhutto, President Zardari and PM Gilani; however, there was no picture of Quaid-e-Azam.
In a similar photograph, President Zardari was administering oath of Federal Mohtasib to Dr Shoaib Suddle; however, the backdrop flashed with a picture of Quaid-e-Awam sans any photo of Quaid-e-Azam Muhammed Ali Jinnah.
Similarly, in a meeting with US delegation, no photograph of Muhammed Ali Jinnah was visible.
Under law, to hang the portrait of Quaid-e-Azam at offices of government officials, President and Prime Minister is compulsory.
http://geo.tv/6-27-2009/44977.htm
@admin
Please start a seperate thread regarding this shameful act by corruption king I want to see how people defend this psycho zardari this time.
- The Condemnation of Slavery by Islam – Javed Ghamidi’s take
Among many other misconceptions about Islamic is the notion that it gives sanction to slavery and permits its followers to enslave prisoners of war, particularly women and establish extra-marital relations with them. We strongly affirm that Islam has not the slightest link with slavery and concubinage. On the contrary, it completely forbids these practices. It is quite outrageous to associate such barbarities with a religion revealed to upgrade humanity.
The point which needs to be appreciated and which, perhaps, is the real cause of the misconception is that Islam had adopted a gradual process to abolish the institution of slavery because of the social conditions prevalent in Arabia at that time. It must be kept in mind that slavery was an integral part of the pre-Islamic Arab society. There were scores of slave men and women in almost every house. This was largely due to two reasons: First, during those times, the standard practice of dispensing with prisoners of war was to distribute them among the army who captured them. Second, there were extensive slave markets in Arabia in that period where free as well as men and women of all ages were sold like animals.
In these circumstances, in which slavery had become an essential constituent of the Arab society, Islam adopted a gradual way to eliminate it. An immediate order of prohibition would have created immense social and economic problems. It would have become impossible for the society to cater for the needs of a large army of slaves, who were, otherwise, dependent on various families. Also, the national treasury was in no position to provide them all on a permanent basis. A large number among them were old and incapable of supporting themselves. The only alternative left for them, if they were instantly freed, would have been to turn to beggary and become an economic burden for the society. The question of slave girls and women was even more critical, keeping in view their own low moral standards. Freeing them, all of a sudden, would have only resulted in a tremendous increase in brothels.
Perhaps, the reason behind this gradual eradication can be understood better if one considers the position which interest occupies in our economy today. No one can refute that our national economic structure is interest oriented. How the parasite of interest has crippled the national economy is apparent to every keen eye. However, there is no denying the fact that without it our present economic system cannot sustain itself. Every reasonable person will acknowledge that today if a government wishes to rid the economy from this menace then, in spite of its utter prohibition in Islam, it will have to adopt a gradual methodology. During this interim period interest oriented deals will have to be tolerated and temporary laws will have to be enacted to handle them, just as the Qur’ān had given certain provisional directives about slaves during the interim period of their gradual eradication. An alternative economic framework will have to be steadily incorporated in place of the existing one. A sudden abolition, without another parallel base, will only hasten the total collapse of the economic system, which, of course, will be disastrous for the country.
http://www.monthly-renaissance.com/issue/content.aspx?id=883
and more
http://www.monthly-renaissance.com/issue/content.aspx?id=315
Couldn’t agree with you more Mutazalzaluzzaman Tarar
WTF that gay SOB Bilawal is doing in Tax payer’s run house, …. where our founder of nation picture should be …. that haramzada kissi kutti ka bacha … we pay taxes for their ayashii…
@mbokhari
The Reconstruction of Religious Thought in Islam
http://www.witness-pioneer.org/vil/Books/MI_RRTI/chapter_06.htm
thank you for the link. studying it and trying to read every person mentioned in it. Will take a few days to absorb.
AFGHANISTAN: THE VIETNAM PARALLEL ??
“No amount of superior firepower could quell a peasant army that came and went by night and could terrorise or merge into the local population. Tales of American atrocities rolled in each month. The army counted success not in territory held but in enemy dead. A desperate attempt to “train and equip” a new Vietnamese army made it as corrupt as it was unreliable. Billions of dollars were wasted. A treaty with the Vietcong in 1973 did little to hide the humiliation of eventual defeat.
Every one of these steps is being re-enacted in Afghanistan. Every sane observer, even serving generals and diplomats, admit that “we are not winning” and show no sign of doing so.”
“Neither the Pentagon nor the British Ministry of Defence will win Afghanistan through firepower. The strategy of “hearts and minds plus” cannot be realistic, turning Afghanistan into a vast and indefinite barracks with hundreds of thousands of western soldiers sitting atop a colonial Babel of administrators and professionals. It will never be secure. It offers Afghanistan a promise only of relentless war, one that Afghans outside Kabul know that warlords, drug cartels and Taliban sympathisers are winning.”
Simon Jenkins spells out why the Afghan adventure is not going to succeed. However, he ignores the dynamics which have their own momentum. Now the well being of Pakistan’s Military Establishment depends on continued American presence in Afghanistan. The flow of dollars and ‘toy’ arms for the Generals will, otherwise, come to a stop. And Pakistan, more than Bangladesh ever was, is a basket case – socially dysfunctional and economically bankrupt.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2009/jun/25/afghanistan-vietnam-taliban-iraq-dannatt
@fareed
zahiri baat hai bhai! all jinnah did was make a country!
Bhutto shaheeeeeeeeed and BB shaheeeeeeeeed nay qurbanyian dee hain…..zardari saab nay jail kaati hai….or Bilawal nay democracy is best revenge kaha hai.
Wait till the day whe Jinnah’s picture gets removed from bank notes as well and replaced by the Bhutto shaheeeeeeeed!
Jeeay Bhutto! Jinnah Who?
Awami Hakoomat Zindabaad!
And the irony is that our ‘awam’ will continue to vote for these guys. The day is not far away when Bilawal heads the party and talks about jamhooriat kay liay qurbanyian as well….
@rafay79
سب سے زیادہ قربانیاں اس نے دی ھیں۔
رنگ لائے گا لہو شہیدوں کا
@mbokhari
haha! nice one!
@gditpp
In these circumstances, in which slavery had become an essential constituent of the Arab society, Islam adopted a gradual way to eliminate it. An immediate order of prohibition would have created immense social and economic problems. It would have become impossible for the society to cater for the needs of a large army of slaves, who were, otherwise, dependent on various families. Also, the national treasury was in no position to provide them all on a permanent basis. A large number among them were old and incapable of supporting themselves. The only alternative left for them, if they were instantly freed, would have been to turn to beggary and become an economic burden for the society.
Money was not an issue after caliph Omar and onwards.During the Rashidun Caliphate there was an economical boom in the lives of the ordinary people due to the revolutionary economic policies developed by Caliph Umar and his successor Caliph Uthman. At first it was Umar who introduced these reforms on strong bases, his successor Uthman who himself was an intelligent businessman, had further reforms init. During Uthman’s reign the people of the empire enjoyed the most prosper life.
Bait-ul-Maal, (literally, The house of money) was the department that dealt with the revenues and all other economical matters of the state. In the time of Muhammad there was no permanent Bait-ul-Mal or public treasury. Whatever revenues or other amounts were received were distributed immediately. There were no salaries to be paid, and there was no state expenditure. Hence the need for the treasury at public level was not felt. In the time of Abu Bakr as well there was not treasury. Abu Bakr earmarked a house where all money was kept on receipt. As all money was distributed immediately the treasury generally remained locked up. At the time of the death of Abu Bakr there was only one dirham in the public treasury. In the time of Umar things changed. With the extension in conquests money came in larger quantities, Umar also allowed salaries to men fighting in the army. Abu Huraira who was the Governor of Bahrain sent a revenue of five hundred thousand dirhams. Umar summoned a meeting of his Consultative Assembly and sought the opinion of the Companions about the disposal of the money. Uthman ibn Affan advised that the amount should be kept for future needs. Walid bin Hisham suggested that like the Byzantines separate departments of Treasury and Accounts should be set up.After consulting the Companions Umar decided to establish the Central Treasury at Madinah. Abdullah bin Arqam was appointed as the Treasury Officer. He was assisted by Abdur Rahman bin Awf and Muiqib. A separate Accounts Department was also set up and it was required to maintain record of all that was spent. Later provincial treasuries were set up in the provinces. After meeting the local expenditure the provincial treasuries were required to remit the surplus amount to the central treasury at Madinah. According to Yaqubi the salaries and stipends charged to the central treasury amounted to over 30 million dirhams.
The coins were of Persian origin, and had an image of the last Persian emperor, Muslim added the sentence Bismillah to it. A separate building was constructed for the royal treasury by the name bait ul maal, which in large cities was guarded by as many as 400 guards. In most of the historical accounts it states that among the Rashidun Caliphs Uthman ibn Affan was first to struck the coins, some accounts however states that Umar was first to do so. When Persia was conquered three types of coins were current in the conquered territories, namely Baghli of 8 dang; Tabari of 4 dang; and Maghribi of 3 dang. Umar ( according to some accounts Uthman ) made an innovation and struck an Islamic dirham of 6 dang.
The economic resources of the State were:
Zakat Ushr Jazya FayKhums
The allowance was paid only to Muslim citizens, Arabs and non-Arabs, by the state annually. After the Battle of Yarmouk and Battle of al-Qadisiyyah the Muslims won heavy spoils. The coffers at Medina became full to the brim and the problem before Umar was as to what should be done with this money. Some one suggested that money should be kept in the treasury for the purposes of public expenditure only. This view was not acceptable to the general body of the Muslims. Consensus was reached on the point that whatever was received during a year should be distributed.
During the reign of Caliph Abu Bakr, the state was economically weak, while during Umar’s reign because of increase in revenues and other sources of income, the state was on its way to economic prosperity. Hence Umar felt it necessary that the officers be treated in strict way as to prevent the possible greed of money that may lead them to corruption. During his reign, at the time of appointment, every officer was required to make the oath:
That he would not ride a Turkic horse (which was a symbol of pride).
That he would not wear fine clothes.
That he would not eat sifted flour.
That he would not keep a porter at his door.
That he would always keep his door open to the public.
Caliph Umar himself followed the above postulates strictly. During the reign of Uthman the state become more economically prosperous then ever before; the allowance of the citizens was increased by 25% and the economical condition of the ordinary person was more stable, which lead Caliph Uthman to revoke the 2nd and 3rd postulates of the oath. At the time of appointment a complete inventory of all the possessions of the person concerned was prepared and kept in record. If there was an unusual increase in the possessions of the office holder, he was immediately called to account, and the unlawful property was confiscated by the State. The principal officers were required to come to Mecca on the occasion of the Hajj, during which people were free to present any complaint against them. In order to minimize the chances of corruption, Umar made it a point to pay high salaries to the staff. Provincial governor received as much as five to seven thousand dirham annually besides their shares of the spoils of war (if they were also the commander in chief of the army of there sector).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rashidun_Empire#Economy
@gditpp
An immediate order of prohibition would have created immense social and economic problems.
Slavery is the biggest problem. There was civil war in America when it was abolished but it wasnt the end of the world and america came out more stronger. Today they have a black president Obama.
It would have become impossible for the society to cater for the needs of a large army of slaves, who were, otherwise, dependent on various families. Also, the national treasury was in no position to provide them all on a permanent basis. A large number among them were old and incapable of supporting themselves. The only alternative left for them, if they were instantly freed, would have been to turn to beggary and become an economic burden for the society.
Wrong we already established money was flowing in the caliphate of omar and onwards. Money was not an issue.
The question of slave girls and women was even more critical, keeping in view their own low moral standards. Freeing them, all of a sudden, would have only resulted in a tremendous increase in brothels.
Blame the victim is always a bad stragtegy. The woman asked for it is an absurd and insane argument. It is ok to have a private brothel but to keep from having public brothels open up continue slavery? These peaceful and honruable african women were plucked from their native homelands from Africa because they had low moral standards. How absurd does that sound. Are you serious?
@lota
You can use the “blockquote” tags to indicate where your quote starts and ends and where your own argument begins. Use the same tag before and after the quote, except the ending tag should be preceded by ‘/’.
Or check this:
http://www.w3schools.com/TAGS/tag_blockquote.asp
@all
For those who find conveying their thoughts in English difficult (or for the sake of the rest of us), and I am not particularly pointing out Aflatoons like Adnan Arshad Majboori (though I am), a new Google service allows you to type in ROMAN URDU which then comes out in actual Urdu.
http://www.google.com/transliterate/indic/Urdu
It is our misfortune that Islamic scholars instead of doing ijtehad keep twisting the facts to conform to literal meaning of scriptures.
We believe in same God as Jews do if Yaweh meant to ban slavery He could have told Moses when He talked to him in a burning bush.
Thou shalt not enslave fellow humans.
Especially after Jews supposedly spent 400 years in Egyptian slavery.
But instead He commanded (Ten Commandments)
Thou must keep Sabath.
For Islamic apologists Moses lived about 2000 years before Islam was revealed that was not enough time for Yaweh to reform the mankind.
We must face the facts people are not stupid.
We need to separate religion and state.
@lota6177
In this time and age, or rather in any time and age, how can any one who believes in equality of human beings justify or even tolerate Slavery. Yet at the same time I think Slavery must be seen in its historical perspective. Though Islam never liked or encouraged slavery yet its abolition was an idea whose time had not come yet. It was only in a post industrial revolution milieu of early 1800s that its abolishment could be put into practice, when use of machines replaced the toil of slaves, finally bringing the much needed emancipation of the latter. So it had little to do with any particular believe system and more to do with “means of production”. Humans are clever animals, animals nevertheless.
And providing Ghamidi’s link was simply to give another point of view.
Javed Ghamdi is a Modern man. He can not believe what he sees in Islam. Being a good Muslim he tries to justify everything , find the argument Ghamdi, find the reason. This man has this mission. Give him anything totally absurd and he will make it wonderful for you.
Ghamdi is the biggest spin doctor of Islam. Guru of twisted logic.
Gradual eradication of the interest? But excuse me it is already declared Haram. No gradual no nothing. it was BANNED 1400 years ago. From that day on it was not to be practiced and economy will be better off. Or that was another hoax?If it is so essential today-after 1400 years of its banning- then Slavery that was not declared haram,why that has receded faster?
ALL Religions are man made and devoid of reason and logic. Iman-bil-Ghaib. Close your eyes and follow. One man’s word against all the reasoning and common sense that entire human experience can muster. I don’t think so.
Benazir Bhutto who stole millions and Quaid who gave back everything he had to make this country a better place.
Bilawal Bhutto using the same money to get the priviliged education, while half of us can not afford to find a decent school or just any school for our children, this is what is wrong here, very very wrong. His father the NRO man. President.
Do not despair ‘fareed’. People know the truth. Jinnah’s picture will be back.
Lies are lies are lies.
Lobbying dollars flowing out at super speed
Sunday, June 28, 2009
By Shaheen Sehbai
WASHINTGON: At least 11 big and small, known and unknown, lobbying companies have been hired by Pakistan and state-owned Pakistani organisations in the US, paying them hundreds of thousands of dollars every month, some of them having mysterious names and almost dubious credentials.
Although lobbying is a legal profession in Washington, the way it is conducted has earned it the nickname of “officially certified corruption” and what the Pakistan government, Pakistan Embassy and Pakistani organisations are doing may come close to this unofficial definition, analysts say.
The information about these lobbying firms is public record and is available on official websites of US government agencies and organisations. But somehow Pakistani clients of these lobbying firms have tried to camouflage their widely spread activities under different names and different categories so that at one time not more than two or three companies could be officially acknowledged as government lobbyists.
The lobbying debate was fired by Geo TV’s talk show “Meray Mutabiq” hosted by Dr Shahid Masood on Saturday night but details gathered by The News revealed much more than the programme could cover.
All lobbyists are registered in the US as “foreign agents” under the Foreign Agents Registration Act (FARA) and have to disclose their activities and operations under the Lobbying Disclosure Act of 1995. All this data is then made available to the public through information posted on their official websites.
Under FARA data seven Pakistani entities are listed as clients of at least 11 lobbying companies. One such firm was de-listed in March and its client was the PPP.
Likewise lobbyists’ info, an official organisation that keeps all the data on lobbyists for the last 40 years and is the best recognised source of latest information on lobbying and lobbyists, lists seven Pakistani entities, which have hired the 11 lobbying firms in the US. These in their order of listing include:
- Council on Pakistan Relations (CPR): This is said to be based in Michigan but no other information is available except an expensive Washington DC address, 1455 Pennsylvania Avenue, one block away from the White House and next to the famous Willard Hotel. There is a website for this organisation, http://www.pakistanrelations.org, but it does not name any one or any organisation, which can be identified. The details of the website are also hidden and when The News tried to find who owned the website and where it was located, Go-Daddy.com, the domain provider listed it as a secret/private website. Go-Daddy.com charges $10 extra to keep all the information about the website owner secret. CPR has hired one of the most expensive firms in Washington, Cassidy and Associates which has former Assistant Secretary Robin Raphel as one of the senior vice presidents. General Musharraf had also hired this company in October 2007 at $1.2 million per year to lobby for him just before the imposition of the emergency in Nov 07.
- Pakistan American Business Association: This is described as a non-profit organisation and has hired a big firm Baker, Donelson, Bearman, Caldwell & Berkowitz, PC, ranked by The National Law Journal in 2006 as one of the 100 largest law firms in the country. Who are these Pak-American businessmen and where are they getting the huge dollars to pay this firm and for what results is not yet known.
- Pakistan International Airlines (PIA) has hired Benazir Bhutto’s personal lobbyist, Mark Siegel’s firm Locke Lord Strategies on a one-time payment of $150,000 to lobby for PIA’s landing rights in the US.
- Pakistan People’s Party (PPP) until recently had three lobbyists, BKSH, a subsidiary of Burson Marsteller, Mark Siegel’s firm LLS and a firm owned by one T Dean Reed. Lakhs of dollars were paid by PPP before the elections 2008 when Benazir Bhutto was trying to win over the US leaders to replace General Musharraf. On March 9, 2009 PPP terminated the contract of BKSH.
- Embassy of Pakistan in Washington: The latest information on lobbyists.info shows that the Pakistan Embassy has currently retained three main lobbying firms: Moses Boyd, Mark Siegel’s LLS and Ogilvy Public Relations (one of the names in this firm’s list of associates is Irfan Kamal. Who is he and what role he plays, whether any, is not known).
- Islamic Republic of Pakistan, Government of Pakistan: Under this name, a mysterious firm named ‘Team Eagle’ has been hired as one of the two lobbying companies, the other bang White & Case LLP in which one Pakistani name, Imran R Mir, is mentioned as an associate.
- Government of Pakistan, Ministry of Information and Broadcasting: Under this name only one name of a Pakistan-based company Asiatic Advertising is registered. No details of transactions are available for this firm.
These seven Pakistani organisations have thus hired 11 firms, separately and mysteriously in some cases, but what output and results are these companies providing is unknown and not clear. It would be a suitable case for parliamentary oversight bodies like the Public Accounts Committee to look into the details of these firms and how much they were paid for what results.
The data provided by US government under the Foreign Agents Registration Act (FARA) until June 2008 is as follows. This lists some of the firms hired and paid by the Musharraf regime and some by the PPP government. It is amusing to note that the purpose of payment in some cases is just ridiculous like training Pakistani officials in the Embassy on how to deal with US media. The following is the data as listed on FARA web site:
- BKSH & Associates #5402, 1110 Vermont Avenue, NW Suite 1000 Washington, DC 20005
Pakistan People’s Party (t) Nature of Services: Public Relations.
The registrant contacted congressional staffers, members of the Congress, and the US government officials to check on status of Resolution 445 and to assist the foreign principal in its effort to promote democracy in Pakistan and in providing its views on the current political, economic and humanitarian situation on the ground in Pakistan. The registrant also contacted congressional staffers to discuss upcoming visit of representatives of the foreign principal to the United States. $31,299.65 for the six-month period ending June 30, 2008.
- Burson-Marsteller #2469 1110 Vermont Avenue, NW, 12th Floor Washington, DC 20005-3544
Pakistan People’s Party (t) 60 Nature of Services: Media Relations.
The registrant developed media monitoring reports, spoke with media representatives, secured and attended meetings for party representatives, and secured and staffed interviews for party representatives on behalf of the foreign principal. $49,837.13 for the six-month period ending April 30, 2008.
- Cassidy & Associates, Inc #5643 700 13th Street, N.W. Suite 400 Washington, DC 20005
Embassy of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan (t) 60 Nature of Services: Lobbying.
The registrant contacted congressional staffers and the US government officials to promote a better understanding of the foreign principal’s political, social and economic developments. $100,000.00 for the six-month period ending March 31, 2008. Printed as of: February 11, 2009 Page 160 of 229 Pakistan.
- Dewey & LeBoeuf, LLP #5835 1101 New York Avenue, NW Suite 1100 Washington, DC 20005-4213
Ministry of Commerce, Government of Pakistan, Embassy 60 Nature of Services: Legal and Other Services/Lobbying.
The registrant provided services to the foreign principal including developing action plans that advance Pakistan’s commercial and trade objectives vis-‡-vis the US government and the private sector. $294,042.83 for the six-month period ending April 30, 2008.
- JWT Asiatic, a division of WPP Marketing Communications (Pvt.) Ltd #5722 ABN Amro Bank Building 16 Abdullah Haroon Road Karachi, Pakistan.
Government of Pakistan 60 Nature of Services: Advertising. Activities: None Reported Finances: None Reported.
- Locke Lord Strategies, LP #5856 401 9th Street, NW Suite 400 South Washington, DC 20004
Pakistan Peoples Party (PPP); Asif Ali Zardari, Co-Chairperson of the PPP 60.
Nature of Services: Lobbying.
The registrant agreed to promote the democratic transition of Pakistan and to encourage the international investigation of the assassination of Prime Minister Benazir Bhutto. Finances: None Reported
- Locke Lord Strategies, LP #5856 401 9th Street, NW Suite 400 South Washington, DC 20004
The Embassy of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan 60. Nature of Services: Lobbying.
The registrant will conduct strategic and governmental affairs communications on behalf of the foreign principal. Finances: None Reported
Printed as of: February 11, 2009 Page 161 of 229 Pakistan.
- Ogilvy Public Relations Worldwide #5807 1111 19th Street, NW 10th Floor Washington, DC 20036
Embassy of Pakistan (t) 60 Nature of Services: Media Relations.
On behalf of the foreign principal, the registrant provided media training to embassy staff, drafted informational materials for distribution to journalists and other media outlets, facilitated the embassy’s interactions with journalists and other media outlets, and provided strategic guidance with respect to the United States media. $256,809.00 for the six-month period ending May 31, 2008.
- Reed, T Dean #5044 37277 Branchriver Road Purcellville, VA 20132-1922
Pakistan Peoples Party (t) 60 Nature of Services: Public Relations.
The registrant provided public relations advice and consultation to the foreign principal and the editing of a newsletter. $10,500.00 for the six-month period ending March 31, 2008.
- Van Scoyoc Associates, Inc. #5401 101 Constitution Avenue, NW Suite 600 West Washington, DC 20001
Government of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan, Embassy (t) 60
Nature of Services: Legal and Other Services/Lobbying.
The registrant monitored, advised and evaluated legislative issues, as well as arranged meetings and accompanied Pakistani government officials to meetings with members of the Congress, and congressional staffers to discuss general US-Pakistan issues. Representatives of the registrant also traveled to Pakistan to meet with Pakistani government officials. $330,000.00 for the six-month period ending June 30, 2008.
I think some of the money is going into Zardari’s secret accounts.
@Jutt Kharak
All religions are not man made. Imaan bil Ghaib is not closing your eyes and following one man’s words. Reason and logic have its own place but they do have their own limitations – where do you go from where you are left by the reason and logic!
Do you think you only believe in things you see or even understand? Is it possible? See the impact of science around you. If I donot know anything or doesnot understand it, or have not experienced it, does that mean it doesnot exist?
The mistake we make is to try to explain everything from withinn the domain of our knowledge or info, which at its best is very very limited and flawed.
@m bokhari
Thaks for the google link.
@Hasanm
When you don’t know something or don’t understand something, you have to be honest and say I don’t understand ,I don’t know. On the other hand there will always be someone around the corner trying to sell you the snake oil -or saanday ka teil- , in other words when there is no obvious answer or understanding ,when humans are still struggling to find answers to this complex universe, you will be misled by those who claim to know what you don’t know. Their flimsy,conjectural ,storytelling explanations are not the truth. You have been sold snake oil in the name of religion. Those who claim to know this complex universe , and have talked to the creator themselves are just selling you ‘sanday ka teil’. You want to buy it ? It is up to you.
@ Jutt Kharak
“Those who claim to know this complex universe , and have talked to the creator themselves are just selling you ’sanday ka teil’. You want to buy it ? It is up to you.”
So where does this argument leads mankind to. No where! Do we wait for the Creator himself to talk to us? Thats not going to happen. Thats why Allah has asked mankind to do “taddabur and Taffakur” so that no one can sell you snake oil.
“Guzar ja aqal se agay keh yeh noor
Chirag-e-rah he, manzil nahin”
R a uf K lASRA the mnetal retard
In love with angelina joli critizing cricket team specially younis and afridi.
Has this journalist gone mad/ Does he know the salary ofcricketer and income from one movie for angelina.
Asking cicketers to donate for IDP , good thing to ask, . what they have done is dedicated win to IDP, THAT HAS HIGHLIGHTED THING MORE than klasra crap.
By THE WAY WHY NOT HE donated his sarkari plot tken from CDA .
Looser
@mbokhari
Reference your nice comments and advice on 28th June 1:15 AM.
If some one is even not able to write correctly in Urdu, (and I am not particularly pointing out Aflatoons like Adnan Arshad Majboori, though I am), then ? ? ? ! ! !
all thanks to Zaradri and PPP Govt………….without partcularly President Sahib’s relentless efforts and tours across the world Pakistan would have never achieved such a milestone and recognition at Internal stage
http://www.thenews.com.pk/updates.asp?id=81666
according to the report Pakistan is No 10 in world ranking this year………..and if Zardari is allowed to complete their tenure Pakistan will be No 1 in the ranking
Jyeaa Bhutto ………Jeyaa Zaradri
What are we up against?
By Ayesha Siddiqa
A very interesting read:
Haroon Rashid blasts the PPP government on its corruption and on the Washington Lobby Scandal. Refers to Hazrat Ali’s letter to Ibne Ashtar on governance and quotes Plato from The Republic.
Further, Haroon exhorts the political class to increase transparency in politics and stop treating their legacies as family heirlooms:
http://www.jang.com.pk/jang/jun2009-daily/29-06-2009/editorial/col4.gif
http://www.jang.com.pk/jang/jun2009-daily/29-06-2009/editorial/col4a.gif
David Kilcullen’s “The Accidental Guerrilla”
http://rapidshare.com/files/249848698/9780195368345.rar.html
Book Review by Salon:
What Democracy?
Unfari deal
How come these things escape our parliament and always result in Pakistan losing out in the long run.
What’s the opposition doing..only attending tv talk shows?
Democracy teaches tolerance,respect of people’s mandate,criticizing Govt’s negative sides in order to improve and appreciate positive sides to encourage.Unfortunately,Dictators run the govt for decades but when it comes to democracy,some class of ppl cant hardly wait for few months and start crying and making all sort of nefarious propaganda in order to malign leadership and destabilize Govt.
whether one accept it or not but the Govt is in power through democratic process not any other illegal move and they have right to govern.The problems of decades cant be resolved within few years.One should give fair space and time to Democratic govt to govern and improve because its only democracy which can save federation and future of Pakistan.
Dont be part of campaign against democracy otherwise you are cutting the branch of tree ..on which u are sitting.The future and survival of our nation is with democracy,let it function and mature,when you have given so much time to dictators…. now give some breathing space n time to democratic govt to complete its constitutional tenure.
Be on the side of democracy!!
Another great plan by PPP govt under the leadeship of The ‘Husband’ (ooops i mean President)
http://www.nation.com.pk/pakistan-news-newspaper-daily-english-online/Politics/30-Jun-2009/Minister-hints-at-tax-on-excess-kids
- Federal Minister Dr Firdous Awan said the government might impose tax on kids more than the permissible number …………. Taxation under PPP is certainly very ingenious!
At midnight we’ll be IMF’d…………Govt decides to increase POL prices Petrol to go up by Rs6.20, diesel Rs6, kerosene Rs7.50; 10pc cut in industrial gas charges, 2pc for domestic
http://www.thenews.com.pk/top_story_detail.asp?Id=23007
in other news
Zero supply from Mangla worsens power crisis………The power crisis was aggravated on Monday with a shortfall of 3,650 megawatts in the national grid, leaving the people helpless………there are only 6 months to go until Dec 2009, the date promised by Zaradri’s govt that we will get rid of load shedding! OR was that promise made 6 months ago and is therefore not applicable anymore???
http://www.thenews.com.pk/top_story_detail.asp?Id=23008
@Mir Munsif
Very well said. We must give democracy a chance and must no look for another saviour Bandooq Ali Khan as Javed Chaudary calls it. Zardari government is incompetent & inefficient. let it be there 5 years and let the will of people prevail.
@ Mir Munsif
I completely agree with your comments. But what to do with a group of people patronized and supported by our Religious parties, who believe in achieving their objectives using force and terrorizing common men. There is a need for strong advocacy campaign by civil society organizations to save Pakistan and Pakistanis from the evil of terrorism.
@mir musif,i also completely agree with ur comments.but with the same time i m very disappionted too.these hate filled people are growing in number and getting more crazy.i am afraid they will succeed to finish zerdari government.these people cannt govern and they will never govern any body else too.they will destroy our country.
Democrate..These guys know one thing …….
http://columnonline.blogspot.com/2009/06/imran-khan.html
“the Govt is in power through democratic process not any other illegal move”, whole world knows that benazir signed NRO agreement through UK/US brokers… she use to meet general musharraf and then lie
greed for power took her life-
People voted for PPP,they have every right to finish their term.It is foolish to try to bring them down through undemocratic ways.We should learn from past experiences.
I wish they had a better leader than Zardari,I say that as a sympathiser of PPP.
It is upto the party leadership.
I wish them well.
We need to unite in order to confront the Taliban crisis.
Thanks to PPP govt……another ‘tuhfa’ delivered to awam on behalf of BB Shaheed….which is on top of the budget announced only less than a month ago!
‘After the approval by the PM, the petrol price would be Rs62.13 with an addition of Rs5.92; hi-speed diesel will be Rs62.65 with an addition of Rs6.94; light diesel oil will be Rs54.94 with an addition of Rs6.94′……..
http://www.thenews.com.pk/updates.asp?id=81770
i.e approx 10-12% on all types of fuel which will be filtered down to every necessity of poor and middle class…..the increase in diesel was around 12% thus effecting agriculture and farming the most………in turn increase in basic food prices to follow
all petrol stations should now be named after BB Shaheed??
It is the democratic right of the people to bring down the govt any time they feel the Govt is not delivering
The whole era of Musharraf BB Shaheed has crocodile tears and false shouts about genuine opposition against Musharraf Convergence of power. Now PPP has the exact same power … they fought Mushi for 8 years against that … and now they will take 8 years to give the power back to PM and parliment …. PPP you are a dictator l2cking party. Democrated values shows by the actions and your actions are the same as dictator …
@PPP hard lovers…
First of all People who belong to PPP here who use word “Zardari Government” and shout for long live democracy … use brains and think … Zardari is President and it means you are saying “Presidential Government” … you are negating the fact that people government in Pakistan means “Parlimentary Government” .
“Presidential Government” is another form of dictatorship on our country, with EXACTLY the same laws and power distribution inherited from Musharraf.
You guys do not love democracy but you love democrated Dictator. Parliment is dummy…. how many laws and decision are taken by Parliment till now??? give me one ….
The myth of the ‘removal’ of the Quaid portrait was discussed in another Pakistani forum–that one: http://forum.pakistanidefence.com/index.php?showtopic=83459
stoops even lower in their hatred against PPP than this blogspace; except the other one is very pro-Musharraf.
Jang News made the Quaid portrait removal as its THE MAIN news briefly but upon denial by Babar Awan there is not a word about it from Jang. Some journalism! What actually happened was most probably the picture was taken in place where PPP shamelessly did self-promotion but neither the Quaid portrait was ‘removed’ nor was it covered.
There was certainly a case to bitterly criticise PPP for ignoring Jinnah’s portrait but people both in that other forum as well as here have gone overboard in their hatred. I alone had to standup in that forum and clarify the situation. Even that was not enough and one young most probably expat MQM punk remarked that one of the portraits should have been of Bhutto’s with the hangman’s nooze around him! How ugly and uncouth.
Have we no introspection? No moral bounds? No sense of fair play or proportion? I’d like to believe it is just the blogspace which is so jingoistic.
When this nation should be more interested to know what happened to looted money and when CJ is going to touch this issue.
What happened to going on corruption as pointed our by Ansar Abbasi and Shaheen Sehbai and many other journalists.
Why Nuclear Budget is drastically cut off.
Why coal of Thar is not used to make cheap electricity.
Who sold the exclusive rights of exploration of minerals and valued stones and Oil and gas in Baluchistan and at what rate.
Who is behind land mafia
I learn everyday some Sindhi bought a land for 15 lacs and sold it next day at 40 lacs.
Who are these people in a rush to accumulate money and who is helping them.
What happened to 17th amendment.
When we have to talk and learn about all these and many more issues….someone is always there to start a non issue like Kala bagh Dam or Saraiki Suba or create a controversy on distribution of water…or manhandling women MPAs or fighting over sanctity of their so called leaders.
Infact when you can think beyond today you are called conspiracy theorist because you are thinking of tomorrow not today.
Cj recent threat to Hamesh Khan of Bank of Punjab is significant and loaded with wielded threat to Zardari that you can not hide anywhere in world with your looted money…This court will come after you its better you return the loot.
Zardari is shrewd enough to not left this country capable of coming after any looter…He may be forced to leave his office in few months or at the end of his tenure but he will make sure country is weak enough or its Courts are corrupt enough to not to come after him when he leaves office….He can not enjoy his loot if he has no peace of mind.
@Jazoo
And may I remind my fellows here about biggest money laundering in history of PAKISTAN that has happened in this PPP tenure …. are we still waiting for the names behind that? arent we ….. who money was converted to $$$ and how and where it went out?
perhaps PPP looters cannot expose their own names….
@Everyone,
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Mian Tufail Muhammad ex chief of jamat islami died this week. This is the guy who arranged the witnesses in the Bhutto Capital murder trial for Zia ul Haq. Zia ul Haq knew that he couldn’t leave the witnesses alive or they would be on TV when the government changed and asking for forgiveness. He ordered there execution also and when that happened their panic stricken families rushed to Mian Tufail Muhammad and asked him to keep the deal they signed up for. This same guy in 1971 after the breakup of Pakistan went to lick the shoes of Yahiya khan and declared I swear the new constitution Yahiya khan is creating is 100% Islamic. He acted like a dal… in east and west Pakistan and got rewarded by Zia Ul Haq with representation in the mujlis shura. The morons gave us the 17th Amendment and it was during the gifted rule by mushi to mma that these molvies freely brought containers of weapons that are being used against civilians and the army. Al Qaeda high ranking officials have already been arrested from homes of ji members. Sri Lankan cricket team is lucky they escaped the evil designs of these people. In short the cancer in Pakistan died because of cancer.
@ lota6177
Would you like to tell who didn,t allow to trasfer power to majority party of 1970 election. Who supported the military operation in east Pakistan and after launching military operation who gave the statement “Thanks God, Pakistan has been saved”? Who appointed the main character of military operation in East Pakistan (General Tikka Khan) as a Governor Punjab? Do you like to listen more?????????
lota6177@
Would you like to tell who didn,t allow to trasfer power to majority party of 1970 election. Who supported the military operation in east Pakistan and after launching military operation who gave the statement .
someone with limited intellgence even like you can answer these questions.
Who was the ruler of pakistan?
Who conducted the election?
who was suppose to hand over power to mujib ul rehman?
who improssioned mujib ul rehman?
who controlled the army and the airforce?
who gave the order for the military operation?
let me give you a hint Yahiya khan
now plz answer you get a biscuit for answering correctly
@bawa typo
@ lota6177
My so called intelligent brother, all that glitter is not gold. Bhutto was fully involved in separation and he supported military operation in East Pakistan because that was the only way to get the government of Pakistan.
See how all four main charaters of separation of Pakistan (Indra Gandhi, Bhutto, Mujib ur Rehman and Yahya Khan) were died.
Please give your biscuit to Balawal Bhuttu Zardari (What a stupid name is it!)
put up or shut up.now u have ur own cj,prove zerdari guilty otherwise shut up.
democrate your knowledge lack the lowest values … as 1. president he cant be tried until he holds his post. 2. CJ is not just any one CJ. your own so called shaheed bb called him her own CJ… “ya hamara cj hay…”,. your own party central committee person AA was all the way along to CJ till his restoration … PPP were every where with CJ name using his name for their own sake and election compaign…. kindly just dont post emotional comments .. post some logic using mind if you have one
NFP is working for Zionist+Hindu axis of evil !
http://blog.dawn.com:91/dblog/2009/07/01/gone-fishing/
@suppercreature,zerdari became president one year ago but cj ifthkhar was there long time ago.if zerdari was so big thief why cj did,nt convict him.why shabaz shreef put presure on judges to convict zerdari.these judges and shabz shreef are criminal.judges kept zerdari 9 years behind bars illegully.
zerdari is better than all other leaders.for example just compare him with nawaz shreef.zerdari is a brave man.on the other hand nawaz shreef is coward man.compare both men life in prison.nawaz shreef was near break down.his eyes was always filled with tears.on the other hand zerdari showed a trmendous corage.nawaz shreef supported the dictator zia.zerdari and his family never supported any dictator.nawaz shreef put his opponents in jail.zerdari did,nt.
حق مغفرت کرے عجب ۔۔۔۔
محمد حنیف
http://www.bbc.co.uk/urdu/columns/2009/07/090701_tufail_hanif_zs.shtml
بی بی سی اردو ڈاٹ کام، کراچی
مولانا طفیل جماعتِ اسلامی کے بانی ارکان میں سے تھے
بعض لوگوں کی زندگی کے اسرار ان کی موت کے بعد کھلتے ہیں۔ جماعت اسلامی کے بانی رکن اور سابق امیر مولانا طفیل محمد کے انتقال پر ملال کے بعد اخبارات میں ان کے پرستاروں نے بلکہ ان کے مخالفوں نے بھی جو مضامین لکھے ہیں اس سے یہ بات تو قطعی طور پر ثابت ہوگئی کہ ہمارا ملک بلکہ امت مسلم نابغۂ روزگار عالم دین اور پاکباز سیاستدان سے مرحوم ہوگئی۔
لیکن بات یہیں پہ ختم نہیں ہوئی۔ ایک مضمون نگار نے ان کے سیدھے جنت جانے کی بشارت دی جہاں حضرت مولانا مودودی ان کا استقبال کریں گے، ایک نے فرمایا کہ وہ عہد حاضر کے ولی تھے۔ ان کے نظریاتی مخالفین نے انکی سادگی کی تعریف میں پل باندھے اور انکی عبادات کے خشوع و خضوع کا ذکر کیا۔
میں انتظار کرتا رہا کہ شاید کوئی حلوے کا ذکر بھی کر دے۔ ان کی جنرل ضیاء سے قربت اور اس روحانی ماموں بھانجے کی اس جوڑی نے اس ملک کو جس رستے پر ڈالا اس کی بات بھی نکل آئے۔ لیکن ایسا کچھ نہیں ہوا کیوں کہ آج کل ہمارے اکثر تجزیہ نگار، کالم کار کسی منبر پر بیٹھ کر لکھتے ہیں اگر یقین نہ آئے تو کسی اردو اخبار کا ادارتی صفحہ اٹھا کر دیکھ لیجیے اکثر مضامین کا آغاز قرآنی آیت سے ہوتا اور انجام کسی دعا سے یا اکثر بددعا سے۔ ایسے آسمانی دلائل کے سامنے تاریخ، حقائق یا تجزیہ کیا حیثیت رکھتے ہیں۔
دس سال پہلے میری مرحوم مولانا سے ایک مختصر ملاقات منصورہ میں انکی رہائش گاہ پر ہوئی تھی۔ پہلی بات جو مجھے حیران کن لگی وہ یہ کہ منصورہ کے اندر کا ماحول بالکل وہی تھا جو فوجی چھاؤنیوں میں ہوتا ہے۔ ہر چیز انتہائی منظم اور بالترتیب۔ صرف سڑکوں پر مارچ کرتے رنگروٹوں کی کمی تھی۔
یونیورسٹیوں میں مخالفین کی ٹانگیں توڑنے سے لے کر میڈیا کے نیوز روموں کو ہائی جیک کرنے تک، جماعت نے ہر حربہ آزما کر دیکھ لیا لیکن یہ قوم ہے کہ اب بھی انہیں شک کی نظر سے دیکھتی ہے۔ ووٹ دینے کے لیے نکلتی ہے تو پھر کسی پرانے پاپی کو آزمانے کے لیے تیار ہو جاتی ہے۔ کیا یہ محض اتفاق ہے کہ جماعت اسلامی کو دو دفعہ اقتدار میں حصہ ملا دونوں دفعہ فوجی آمروں کے دور میں۔
مولانا مرحوم نے انٹرویو کافی بیزاری سے دیا۔ مسکرانا ان کے نزدیک گناہ نہیں تو بدعت ضرور تھی۔ لیکن انٹرویو کے دوران ایک بار ان سے یہ ’بدعت‘ ضرور سرزد ہوئی۔ میں نے جنرل ضیاء کے دور حکومت اور بھٹو کی پھانسی کے بارے میں ایک سوال کیا۔ فرمایا کہ اس دن تو لوگوں نے حلوے کی دیگیں پکائی تھیں اور بانٹی تھیں۔ ان کے ہونٹوں پر ایک میٹھی سی مسکراہٹ آئی جیسے انہیں حلوے کی شیرینی اب تک یاد ہو۔
مولانا طفیل محمد کو جماعت اسلامی کا مستقل جنرل سیکرٹری مقرر کرتے وقت حضرت مودودی نے مولانا سے پوچھا تھا کہ کیا میں اپنی تقریر میں جماعت اسلامی کے بارے میں یہ کہہ دوں کہ یہ اب لوہے کا چنا ثابت ہوگی؟ مولانا نے ایک توقف کے بعد فرمایا کہہ دیں اور جماعت اسلامی واقعی لوہے کا چنا ثابت ہوئی۔
ہمارے ایک بزرگ فرمایا کرتے تھے کہ محاوروں اور ضرب المثل میں کبھی کبھی صدیوں کی حکمت پوشیدہ ہوتی ہے تو کبھی کبھی صدیوں کی جہالت۔
لوہے کے چنوں کا بھی کچھ ایسا ہی حساب ہے۔ اس چنے سے نہ تو غریب کا پیٹ بھرتا ہے نہ ہی اس کا لوہا کسی کاریگر کے کام آتا ہے۔ یہ صرف اور صرف دشمن کے دانت کھٹے کرنے کے لیے ہے اور جماعت اسلامی نے پہلے جنرل ضیاء کے ساتھ مل کر اور اس کے بعد مشرف کی حمایت کر کے بار بار اپنے دشمنوں کے چھکے چھڑائے ہیں۔
مولانا طفیل اور انکے مرشد مودودی نے لوہے کے چنوں کی جو فصل بوئی اور جس کی آبیاری کبھی امریکی ڈالروں سے کی تو کبھی سعودی ریالوں سے، وہ فصل اب پک کر تیار ہے اور اٹھارہ کروڑ کی بھوکی عوام اس کو دیکھ دیکھ پریشان ہے کہ یا اللہ اس کا کریں کیا۔ حلوہ بھرے پیٹوں پر ہاتھ پھیر کر جواب دیا جاتا ہے کہ ہم دشمنوں کے دانت کھٹے کر دیں گے۔
یونیورسٹیوں میں مخالفین کی ٹانگیں توڑنے سے لے کر میڈیا کے نیوز روموں کو ہائی جیک کرنے تک، جماعت نے ہر حربہ آزما کر دیکھ لیا لیکن یہ قوم ہے کہ اب بھی انہیں شک کی نظر سے دیکھتی ہے۔ ووٹ دینے کے لیے نکلتی ہے تو پھر کسی پرانے پاپی کو آزمانے کے لیے تیار ہو جاتی ہے۔ کیا یہ محض اتفاق ہے کہ جماعت اسلامی کو دو دفعہ اقتدار میں حصہ ملا دونوں دفعہ فوجی آمروں کے دور میں۔
اب جماعت اسلامی ہوس ناک نظروں سے طالبان اور انکے حواریوں کو دیکھتی ہے، مولانا صوفی محمد کو ان کا اصلی مشن یاد کرواتی ہے۔ پاک فوج کو جہاد کے اصل معنی سمجھانے کی کوشش کرتی ہے۔ اے کاش، اے کاش۔۔۔۔
مولانا طفیل اور انکے مرشد مودودی نے لوہے کے چنوں کی جو فصل بوئی اور جس کی آبیاری کبھی امریکی ڈالروں سے کی تو کبھی سعودی ریالوں سے، وہ فصل اب پک کر تیار ہے اور اٹھارہ کروڑ کی بھوکی عوام اس کو دیکھ دیکھ پریشان ہے کہ یا اللہ اس کا کریں کیا۔ حلوہ بھرے پیٹوں پر ہاتھ پھیر کر جواب دیا جاتا ہے کہ ہم دشمنوں کے دانت کھٹے کر دیں گے۔
مولانا طفیل محمد مرحوم سے کسی نے ایک دفعہ پوچھا کہ کیا انہیں مولانا مودودی کے افکار یا شخصیت سے کبھی اختلاف ہوا انہوں نے کہا ہرگز نہیں۔ بس ان کی دو باتیں پسند نہیں تھیں۔ ایک تو نہاری کھاتے اور دوسرا پان۔
حق مغفرت کرے عجب ۔۔۔۔
@mbokhari
I was at a wedding in pindi few months ago and i tried the halwa at dinner. The halwa was very delicious and tasty. I could see how a halwa habit can program a person to start killing other people to feed his addiction. Never underestimate the power of halwa.
@Bawa
See how all four main charaters of separation of Pakistan (Indra Gandhi, Bhutto, Mujib ur Rehman and Yahya Khan) were died.
3 out 4 caliphs were murdered? What did they do to deserve it? Human history is filled with examples of people expiring due to unnatural circumstances. If you are looking for divine power or magic in a murder than you have mental issues. Yahiya Khan, Gen Tiger Niazi, Gen Tikka Khan and Gen Jagjit Singh Aurora all expired naturally. Care to explain why they were spared azab illahi for breaking up East Pakistan?
Bhutto was fully involved in separation and he supported military operation in East Pakistan because that was the only way to get the government of Pakistan.
The army and Gen Yahiya held all the power and made all the decisions. Who gave the order for operation Searchlight and what was operation Searchlight? That is your homework. When it comes to the reason for the breakup of Pakistan there were two main reasons. One would be not handing over the power to the elected members of the parliament. The other would be the operation searchlight and everyone who participated in it be it the army, the al badr and al shamus. When it comes to bhutto we have three charges that have been laid on him in the pakistani press. In lahore he said Idhar tum idhar hum. Clarification of that has been given by the journalist who filed it. The larkana meeting with Yahiya khan and the Tearing up of the poland resoloution in the un.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qYHUJBRRnc4
@bawa
if you want to read on what happened in east pakistan
http://pkpolitics.com/documents/
Martial Law kaa Siyaasi Andaaz by M.A.K Choudhry (Scribd)
Main nay Dhakka Doobtay daekhaa by Siddique Salik (Scribd)
there are many more but this is homework.
@AClarion Call
You said
“You are wrong; you are doing great dis-service to Islam on this Blog with your highly dangerous views. Calling Taliban’s fake Islam true shows how much brainwashed you are. You are the only one on this Blog who wants to start a sectarian discussion (Deobandi vs Brailvi) on this Blog. ”
>>>
I’m quoting below some of my relevant comments for you
———————————–
Mullah Omar said:
@zainengineer
You need to understand that Moulan Hasan Jan Shaheed was killed by some american agents to malign Talibans !
He was in fact a supporter of Taliban and their ideology.
Taliban have never killed/harmed any deobandi/wahabi Aalim.
Taliban have never detonated a bomb in a deobandi/wahabi mosque.
No deobandi party like JUI, JI, PTI, SSP, Jaish-e-Mohammad, and Lashkar-e-Jhangvi has ever demonstrated against Taliban Mujahadeen !
No renowned Pakistani Deobandi Aalim has ever condemned Taliban’s ideology.
No renowned Pakistani Deobandi Aalim like Mufti Rafi Usmani, Mufti Taqui Usmani, Hanif Jalindhari, Moulana Saleem Ullah Khan, Moulana Asfandyar Khan, Moulana Sami ul Haq, Moulana Qazi Hussain Ahmed, Moulana Munawwar Hasan, Moulana Ahmed Ludhianvi, Moulana Gul Naseeb Khan, Moulana Ali Sher Haidri, and Moulana Masood Azhar has ever issued fatwa against Taliban declaring their activites and ideology as un-islamic !
Now come to Daul Ulum Deoband’s fatwa, you need to understand that Ulma of Deoband in India issued that fatwa under pressure from Indian government !
India is a Kaafir country and due to different circumstances we are not bound to accept every fatwa issued by Deoband of India !
We have got our own Ulma-e-Haq whose names I have mentioned above and we just seek their advices for our actions !
8 July 2009 at 5:39 am
mbokhari said:……………………..I am not particularly pointing out Aflatoons like Adnan Arshad……………………
mbokhari Meray Mathay Lug Kur Hoogi Tumhay Sarasirr Khawari
Mein Hoon Aflatoon – Yah Kay Head of Islamic Revolutionist – Platoon
Tumahra Nahi Yeh Dard e Sirr – Guman hay Kay Tumhay hay Mouth Piles ki Bemaree.
@Adhanan Arshad Manzoori
Again same AEEN, BAEEEN, SHAEEEEN with the addition of filthy language.
Attn: All the Participants of this forum if you want to read/see the hieght of Stupid Comments of ===bhosa=== vide the following pls.
Ulta Chore Kutwal ko Dantay- Kiya yehi Taleem Dee Hai Apkay Mehboob Raihnuma AZ Nay.
http://pkpolitics.com/2009/07/07/siyasi-log-7-july-2009/#comments
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