Translated and compiled by mbokhari from the sources listed below.
Update: Brig Imtiaz, Plots and NRO
NEW!! – Benazir Bhutto on MQM Role in Karachi
They say dead men tell no tales. But they do, if justice is blind and applied equally. The judicial investigation of the May 12th killing in Karachi has opened a veritable Pandora’s Box in Pakistani politics and, as a result, the MQM chief has been summoned to the Sindh High Court. Feeling the heat, Altaf Hussain has decided to join 
forces with Pervez Musharraf who has been plotting to launch a massive propaganda campaign against Nawaz Sharif. Ummat Daily News has learned through reliable sources that London-based leadership of MQM has been in close consultation with the ex-dictator during the last few days. The flurry of activity in London was prompted by the issuance of notices by the Sindh High Court to Pervez Musharraf and Altaf Hussain to appear before the court. The court has directed the duo to appear personally and clarify their role in the events of May 12th, 2007 and in the killings of lawyers and media activists during the Chief Justice’s visit to Karachi that day.
A source close to the London secretariat of the MQM revealed that the original plan of action involved cooperation with the PPP to hash out a strategy that would save the MQM head honcho from appearing before the judge. The governing party, however, did not give an unconditional pledge of support and so in despair, the MQM made contact with Pervez Musharraf. The ex-dictator and onetime strongman of Pakistan, Pervez Musharraf, has fled to the UK since the Chief Justice, whom he imprisoned for 5 months, was restored to the bench.
The MQM sector and unit in-charges in London are greatly worried about the judicial proceedings and a large source of anxiety in the party leadership remains the possibility that any decision by the court against the MQM may make it difficult for Altaf to stay indefinitely in the UK. If the Sindh High Court finds the defendant Altaf Hussain guilty of orchestrating the horrific round of violence on that fateful day in Karachi, the party leadership fears his opponents may move the courts in the UK to expel Altaf, or at least, to limit his capacity for organized violence.
What Altaf has been reported to be most afraid of, is the fact that if it becomes impossible for him to stay in the UK, the only other country that would grant him asylum would be India. Staying in the UK, however, is not only politically defensible for the MQM, it also allows Altaf to monitor his extensive business interests in Europe and North America. Claiming asylum in India would not only be political suicide for the MQM but would also pinch Altaf’s wallet most painfully. Understandably, Altaf is willing to go to any length to keep on staying in the UK.
Insider sources claim the MQM chief originally planned to stage manage a public show of force in Karachi soon after Eid. The ostensible demands of the post-Eid tableau vivant were to be the release of MQM activists allegedly in custody since the 1992 Army operation. Supposedly, some sections of the PPP have agreed to look the other way as the street theater of MQM has been planned to finish with a spectacular display of firearms and wanton violence after a moving address by the leading performance artist Altaf Hussain. According to sources, it was Musharraf’s idea to prod MQM into making a massive public show of force after the Eid. Ironically, a similarly brilliant collaboration between Musharraf and Altaf resulted in the original bloodletting on May 12th, 2007.
Musharraf has advised Altaf that a show of Awami Taqat after Eid, demanding an investigation of the 1992 army action, was the only way Altaf could wriggle out of the tightening noose around his neck that is the May 12th case.
But the blinding speed with which politics in Pakistan is conducted has put paid to any plans to wait out the Ramadan slow season. Altaf has been forced to move the release date early. The situation seems so dire in London that the MQM even offered the Lawyers’ leadership a grand bargain in the spirit of “Nazriye-e-Zaroorat” involving payment of restitution to the families of the more than 50 killed that day. Adding one more to the series of ironies, some of these victims had already been claimed by the MQM as its own martyrs. Unsurprisingly, the Lawyer leadership rejected these overtures with the firm declaration that it would never broker a deal to save the MQM. The refusal was served with a side order of stern advice that MQM had better not try to influence the court proceedings, for if it did, its problems would swiftly multiply.
In the official MQM doctrine of victimization, the most villainous Army Operation against the MQM was initiated in 1996 when the PPP was in power. Interestingly, the MQM is willing to absolve the PPP for its role in the 1996 operation, and is only interested in investigating the 1992 operation. Perhaps that is because the PPP currently happens to be in power and controls the federal purse strings?
Lt. Gen (R) Naseer Akhtar is the person who delivered the opening salvo of the battle, and it would be fitting to explore his background briefly. The 1996 Army Operation was carried out under the direct supervision of Lt. General Naseer Akhtar who was posted as Corps Commander Karachi during the previous PPP government. It was under his supervision that the feared FIT was created as an elite counter-terrorism outfit for hunting down MQM terrorists. However, after retiring, Lt. General (R) Naseer Akhtar, fearing for his life, approached Altaf Hussain seeking clemency. He had some family in Karachi and some business interests which prompted frequent visits, and he did not want to die.
The other shady character starring in the latest Altaf Hussain production is Brig. (R) Imtiaz of the Intelligence Bureau. Brig Imtiaz was involved in attempts to dislodge the 1988 PPP government through a No Confidence move in the parliament through buying MNA’s votes. The auction price for the 12 MQM legislators in the National Assembly was set at Rs. 100 million.
Musharraf and Altaf have collaborated before, most notably on May 12th, 2007, but the fierce urgency of their respective legal troubles has forced the two in an intimate embrace, While Musharraf finds the noose of Article 6 rustling against his shirt collar very unsettling, Altaf fears the Sindh High Court more than he fears a good shower. Musharraf has even tried to use his influence on the renegade PML (Q), but has been unable so far to sway the party to come out in his favor publicly. The fast fragmenting Q has further splintered along pro- and anti-Musharraf lines and is expected to be of no help against Article 6.
As MQM’s sphere of influence does not extend beyond Karachi and Hyderabad, it is in no position to stage a violent public uprising. It will however use the threat of holding Karachi hostage as a bargaining chip with the PPP and the establishment. The pro-Musharraf wing of the PPP is tuned to the MQM wavelength and is trying to bring the top leadership of PPP in line. They plan to use the threat of public disorder in Karachi to twist the PMLN arm and force them to back down from demanding Article 6 for Musharraf.
In essence, Altaf Hussain plans a 3-target multiple strike through the grand opening of his show on the 1992 operation. He plans to deter PMLN from insisting on accountability for Musharraf, intimidate the newly restored judiciary and force the PPP to side with MQM using the threat of public disorder
The situation is in flux and expect many updates. The PMLN and other opposition parties are watching the developments closely and have intensified their contacts with Prime Minister Gillani bypassing the Presidency.
Source 1: The Nation
Source 2: The News
Source 3: Ummat
the whole nation need to unite against this bhatta force mqm. this terror organization which was created by the agencies, also have close links with india. when the bombay bombings stage drama was initiated by indian agencies, their helping hands in karachi, mqm, killed more people just to show solidarity with thier mentors.
it is high time that we start real operation clean-up. army is playing with fire by supporting this terrorist organization just to save the skin of mush, shame on these agencies. ppp govt. must realize that they are partners in crime and must act to save this nation.
Interestingly there is no author of this piece.
Also, no focus on the possibility of a PPP-PML-N deal: PPP gets the NRO certified and PML-N gets Musharraf’s trial. The PPP foot dragging is simply NRO based, and deals with MQM or any other party will be NRO based.
MQM can overlook the 1996 events in return for supporting the NRO.
Mr. 10% has to save his neck too — and more importantly his loot: he is scheming to find a way to open a bank account in Hell to stash away his wealth when he will no longer be able to manage his Swiss and other Western bank accounts.
@fulan
Its author is the Ummat article in source 3. It’s a translation.
ZARDARI+ MUSH + ALTAF = NRO.
I hope Justice will be served and the courts will give free and fair verdict according to the law and constituition.
M Bokhari is back again
But sorry let me read his article first
Altaf Bhai app british passport chordh du yeh apki insult kerwa raha hain log imran khan ko acha kehtay hain us ne gori se shadhi ki magar apna passport na badla apne forun london ja ker yeh kiya kerdiya please british passpot chordh ker proud to be a pakistani.
apki british passport k sath tasveer dil par zkham lagati hain
Altaf bhai zardari ko maaf kerdiya tu nawaz sharif ko bhi kerday kya jata hain
Altaf bhai ka dil sumander se bardha hain woh British Passport chordh de gay aik din
@imrankhandwala
Altaf bhai will only give you his British Passport when you can pry it from his cold, dead, fat hands.
@mbokhri please aisa na kaho itna burra bhi nahi Altaf Hussain woh british passport kiya isjaisay hazarooo passport tayar kernay ko tayar hain.
OPEN REQUEST TO QUAID-E-TEHREEK ALTAF HUSSAIN
Please give up your British Passport hold Pakistani Passport in your hands and send pictures to media.
apka khadim,
Imran Khandwala
@mbokahri
There is some truth to it. However, most of it just street chatter.
And you lose credibility if you cite Ummat as your source. Ummat will probably find credible sources linking MQM to global warming and unrest in China.
Good effort in translation & compilation but the actual credit should go to the sources who did the research, not the translator!
Improvement in selection of subject (monkey is evolving), but seems political mistake because after annoying people who have soft corner for imran khan & religion, he has annoyed mqm supporters. If not all, most of the people who celebrated imran/ji bashing in his last work were mqm, but this politically illustrate idiot doesn’t comprehend that.
Last time he received awami chitrol from one camp and now he will receive awami chitrol from another camp
Either way awami chitrol is his destiny!
@JJ Khan
Dear Jungli Janjhar Ki Jhankar, Jheengar Janwar Ki Khankhar, Jootay Jurabon Ki Kataar:
Altaf Hussain is a murdering terrorist and your love for the Kali Mata shows itself too clearly. You were really hurt to see Altaf Hussain being exposed, weren’t you?
MQM’s attempt at multiple strikes against the judiciary, democracy and justice will be defeated. You may cry if you like, but don’t let the mirchaiN hurt you too much.
mbokhari,
You said same thing in your previous writing where you claimed I was imran khan fan…
You forgot already, or too old to remember things you said yesterday?
LOLzz…
Nice-work if this is an Original — Slayer’s play in other words Karachi Own Style scientific Killing Field & now such hypocrisy at TV talk shows I just don’t think we as human should kill own Muslims for our pleasure. That is why Blood Islamic Revolution is required.
Khoon Tou Aaisay Or Waisay Dounoun Hee Tariqoun Say Baihta Chala Jai –
Taqat-O-Daulat Kay Kheil Mein – Islami Nizam Kay Nifaz Ko Bhee Shamil Kurliya Jai -
@JJK
Yar ap to naraaz ho gaye
I was only joking. Dil pay mat lay yar.
I don’t remember what you stand for, first because I couldn’t care less, and mostly because you seem to be really lacking in the upstairs department. I do, however, remember your hilarious grammar. Did you have anything original or new to say or you were just here to cry and yelp ‘see see’ after seeing Altaf Hussain being insulted? I know how the discussion will proceed:
You will defend Altaf Hussain. People will mock both you and Altaf Hussain. Then you, being you, an aggressive moron with the mental age of a five-year-old and the linguistic sophistication of a donkey, will descend to profanity.
And people will still mock you. The cycle of life will continue
It is surprising whenever N-League get caught in a scandal, people come up with all these conspiracy theories and at all other times they dont feel an iota of shame spreading rediculous rumours such as “zardari ne nuclear program amreeka ko X billion dollars mein bach dala” as if he is the sole owner of nuclear program and keeps it in his pocket and goes around selling it.
Whatever MQM has been involved in, question here is.
WHY N-LEAGUE DID NOT STOP ARMY OPERATION????
Simple as that.
Even if, as they rediculously claim, they were not aware of the start of army operation why did they not stop it when they found out about it ? The army operation obviously went way beyond the list of 82 patharaydaars, what was N-League doing at that time?? I want answers to these questions.
Araticle written well but with bais and prejudice approach. When we lost East Pakistan, the news was that Army is doing very well. So one should not be very happy and use some brain. The biggest problem that we are not one nation and this is because of power base that is Punjab which needs to be broken in further provinces so that a balanced party system can be established. Punjab and NWFP are dominating in agencies and establishment which are the reason for deprivation in Baluchistan and Sindh. These power hungry agencies supressed the movement in Baluchistan because people are not much educated but they could not do in Sindh particularly in Karachi. It is always that Punjab and NWFP play the role of pious people and the rest are either terrorist or traiter.
We have to give up this practice and learn to live together and accommodate other people as well. Branding other party leaders with different names and accusing with baseless charges should be stopped in he interest of Pakistan.
@bsobaid
A more important question is: Why NOW? Why isn’t MQM focusing on the 1996 operation which would bring it in confrontation with the PPP?
The MQM is trying to forment trouble by playing for the Establishment side. They plan to target the judiciary and attack CJ Chaudhary.
It’s as simple as that.
mbokhari,
you said:
Again you got it wrong, I am not support of Altaf Hussain.
Secondly you said:
Evidence shows who is an aggressive moron with the mental age of a five-year-old and the linguistic sophistication of a donkey, and descends to profanity!
LOLzz…
learn to absorb the awami chitroll
don’t run after every comment… take it easy even if it hurts!
got to go now… good luck with chitrol
Alas
the paksitani Politics is living in the past
be futuristic man
it’s time to grow
@JJK
Dear Jungli Janjhar Ki Jhankar, Jheengar Janwar Ki Khankhar, Jootay Jurabon Ki Kataar
Come on. The fun was only starting. You still haven’t explained why you commented here attacking me to deflect attention away from your Kali Mata Altaf Hussain?
@mbokhari
yar chor do es fool JJkhan ko en ko bhi shayad passport chahye ho enky ALTAF BHAi ki TARAH.
BWGHAIRTO & MURDERER’s PARTY MQM
@mbokhari,
No, I 100% disagree with you. To me, timing is not important at all. The question is not about what Altaf Hussain wants to gain or what Nawaz Shareef will loose. The question is about the innocent AWAM who lost their lives.
I dont care what Altaf Hussain may achieve from it. I only care about what government was doing at that time when army was engaged in an operation domestically.
Your political affinity (or hatred) is blinding you from an abhorent “zulm” that was perpetreted on Pakistani awam, as alleged. Do you think Musharraf trial is more important than all those people who allegedly lost their lives in the operation?? Answer my question and dont tell me we should ignore the army operation and the responsibles of alleged killing of thousands of lives for the sake of bringing Musharraf to court.
@Innocent.citizen said:
haha…He doesn’t need a passport. He can travel in the pet cage in the booked cargo. Come to think of it, so can AH
MQM is not after ‘neutered’ CJ. CJ has shown plenty that he is not interested in missing persons, May 12, corruption , Musharraf trial or anything else which crosses the line of govt or the americans.
There is something else about it. It probably just to take the heat from Musharraf. There will be no trial of Musharraf. Even PML-N and Nawaz knows that very well.
MQM certainly has its hands dirty but that does not give any excuse to Army or Nawaz to execute people or turn a blind eye to operation.
mujh mujh ki behan, buffalo buffalo are sisters, these two altafa and mush gheedars too much coward, cant go to pakistan, they afraid of death. BOTH ARE FUNNEY
BOTH ARE MARASAIES
…………….LIARS
……………..G……..
……………..MOST HATERED IN PAKISTAN
……………..DRAMA BAAZ
ETC ETC…
IF ALTAFA EVER GO TO PAKISTAN MQM HAQIQI WILL GIVE BIG DANDA IN HIS AS*** AND HIS CRY WILL BE HEARD EVERY CORNER OF KARACHI
well Mr. bokhari, I would have really appriciated you if I did’nt know your personal and political motives.
Let me tell you, I am supporter of PTI so you can imgine my views about MQM and altaf hussain but I don’ t appriciate what you have posted here. Because whenever you are engaged in personal attack or want to take persona revenage then there is no objectivity.
First you targetted Imran khan & PTI as PTI supporters were exposing Nawaz sharif’s friendly opposition politics and now when this MQM vs PML-N issuse came on screen few days back to counter that you come up with this translation of news and articles.
Why it took so long for you to understand and translate what MQM and Altaf hussain is doing? why this came to PKPOLITICS when PML-N is being blamed for miltary operation in karachi?
I request all here please identify and ignore those who have personal motives and promote objectivity. We all can support or against a particulary political party within our capacity but this blame game and dirty politics should be stopped.
@bsoabid
All zulm must be investigated. That’s why Altaf Hussain needs to come back to Pakistan and face the Sindh High Court. The judiciary is free now and everything should come out in the open.
But MQM doesn’t want the 1992 operation investigated. They just want to attack the CJ, the judiciary and the PMLN on the behest of the Army/Establishment. That is the real deviance in their stand and must be exposed.
@Salman Cheema, please read mbokari’s profile. That should answer your question.
@mbokhari
good job
we do want to have serious input from different authors in this site.
on current situation though i believe the problem is that the serious and polular leadership of punjab for the first time in the history of Pakistan is anti establishment.
NaPak Army which draws most of its power from punjab is now facing the biggest problem of the largest province is not any more supporting its corrupt and crooked role.
It was well known that no one can try and punish the generals if the local leadership of all the smaller provinces is perceived as marginally patriotic and the punjab leadership both political and army undoubtedly patriotic.Now the situation has changed for the first time for these PPG (peeing in the pants
generals) and they will face the music after singing it with Hamid ali Khan
well ADMIN
please correct the date shown in the article that is 12th may 2007 not 12th may 2008
plz correct it
@mbokhari,
Court need not to wait for Altaf to start a trial. If MQM do not want investigation into 92 operation, who cares? lets start the investigation. N-League is the main opposition party in the parliament. They chair many parliamentary committees. Their favourite judge heads the supreme court of Pakistan. Why not Qadam Barhao Nawaz Shareef hum tumharay saath hein??
However, investigation is an after thought. The issue in hand at the moment is, why N-League did not stop the army operation. N-League claims the operation was started without prior approval of government which makes this whole operation illegal. N-League being a self-proclaimed custodian of judicial supremacy kept quite at this blatant mockery of government writ and rule of law and watched army operation unfold (as well as allegations of gross human-rights violations) silently?? and now that this issue has been uncovered N-Leaguers are alleging Altaf Hussain of having dual passports?? Does that make any sense to anyone??
Call Altaf Hussain a mulk dushman or whatever you like since likes of you have a history of distributing ghaddari certificate, my question still is why all those people had to suffer who have nothing to do with Altaf Hussain and why did Nawaz Shareef not do anything about it??
mbokari said
“A more important question is: Why NOW? Why isn’t MQM focusing on the 1996 operation which would bring it in confrontation with the PPP?”
Why do you expect MQM to raise it anyway as according to you MQM is a mulk-dushman, Indian agent party? Indeed they will never raise this issue.
However, Nawaz Sharif is a true Pakistani. Why did he not stop this illegal army operation?? Forget about the investigation, Nawaz Sharif himself is saying he did not approve the army operation. Should we not ask NAwaz Shareef then why did he not do anything about it? If he does not have an answer to that, and I am sure he and none of his supporters including yourselves can answer that, then we really need to wonder who is the real ghulaam of army and establishment.
@salman cheema
My personal feelings as a Pakistani are for Pakistan’s safety and peace. To that end, I, as only a poster, make my feelings known when I have some free time to post comments here.
You whole comment is laden with innuendo and implied winks. Why don’t you say what are you trying to say more clearly?
And, as flattering as it may sound to you, PTI does not have an impact on national politics. They try to punch above their weight, which is admirable, but sadly they fail. Taking PTI in account when making political maneuvers is like taking a harmonium to a funeral: it is noisy and embarrassing. Second of all, PKP’s policy is not in sync with any political party, though I can’t presume to speak on its behalf, and even if it were, I, personally, have never been pressured to go along with any agenda. I write when I get time, and about things that seem important to me. PTI is a genuine political party and million times better than MQM. There is ample evidence of terrorism against both the MQM and the Taliban. They are equivalent. Taliban is the MQM of the North and MQM is the Taliban of the South. PTI is not equivalent to either the Taliban or the MQM, but has made an error of judgment in opposing the operation and confusing the public about the Taliban. IK’s stance threatened vital national security interests at a time of war and that must be criticized and discussed. That is all.
In my philosophy, all political leaders make mistakes and are corrupt (excepting perhaps IK). Our part, as intelligent voters, must be to expose and criticize the stands taken by our politicians like NS, IK etc and through our criticism, make them correct their mistakes. And once they apologize, we must give them another chance, OR, start supporting alternative parties. That is the purpose of websites like PKP: making opinion, debating ideas and cutting through propaganda spun by political parties.
Just to recap: I think Taliban were Pakistan’s enemies and needed to be decimated. IK stood in their defense and gathered contempt and criticism from all quarters. He will continue doing so until he retracts his steps, makes some semblance of an apology and then, all will be fine. Personally, I think IK is one of the most sincere politicians around and his colossal mistake of opposing the operation needs to be criticized so that he can reexamine his stance. After all, he did apologize for supporting Musharraf, and once he made that apology, not many people bring that against him. IK is an asset for Pakistan but he must stop acting foolishly about the Swat Taliban.
The search button to the right is your friend. Introduce yourself to the search function and go through the PKP archives. Then, once you have some evidence of your allegations, come back and we will talk about it. PKP has published countless featured articles critical of almost every party in Pakistan. I am only a poster here, but the only PKP policy that I have ever detected is this: Anything goes, except opposing democracy, supporting dictatorship and attacking the judiciary.
Blame and dirty games are not synonymous with balanced critique of political parties. Please learn to differentiate.
@bsobaid
i believe your question was answered in detail by nusrat javed yesterday in Live with talat.Having said that my question to altaf hussein is why did he support army rule for 9 yrs.
altaf hussein needs to come back to pakistan like his dady Musharraf and sing the duet since both have “special interests”
@justice, I dont know nusrat javed neither do I see him on this webpage. I only know mbokhari who has translated and compiled this article on this website. I’d rather have him answer my question.
So Justice, you are saying Nawaz Shareef did not stop this illegal army operation becase Nawaz Shareed knew MQM will support army rule for 9 years?
How is MQM supporting of army rule for 9 years and Musharraf being its daddy have anything to do with Nawaz Shareef not doing anything about an illegal army operation in the biggest city of the country??
For your reminder, N_League itself calls this operation illegal.
Just a small observation. The May 12 incident was in 2007.
@bsobaid
@justice has made a very important point above. If the army had killed thousands of innocent MQM workers in its operations then why did MQM still side with Musharraf and sat in its lap (or he sat in MQM’s lap) for 9 years? This contradicts with its hue and cry against the army operation.
However, I do agree with you that why did the-then government did not intervene once it became aware of the operation. But, it is also a known fact that the army had discovered a lot of MQM torture cells during the operation.
@bsobaid
You ask valid questions. The MQM is reviled all over Pakistan for its terrorist activities like burning lawyers alive and shooting on TV stations.
It is also reviled and called an Indian agent on the basis of the infamous clip where Altaf Hussain calls the birth of Pakistan the grrraaytust blunderrr in the history of mankind.
You see, these are valid questions as well. You ask why did NS not stop the illegal army operation. I don’t know. Nobody knows. Questions like these can only be answered through judicial investigations.
That is why Altaf Hussain needs to come back to Pakistan. If NS has committed a crime, he should be hauled in court. Those who supported a dictator for 9 years unashamedly yelling about meeeeedle klaaas geedarship also need to be hauled up in court.
Bottom line: There are allegations on NS. There are allegations on Altaf Hussain. Only a court can decide which allegations are genuine and which are malicious. NS is here in Pakistan to face the court, Altaf is not.
Why ever not?
@bsobaid
it would be best if you had tried to know a little more since curosity kills the cats ONLY.
Since again the answer of your question is adequate in the discussion with talat i will refrain from explaining that again and again.
My question remain the same that after seven yrs of the action of 92 why did Altaf hussein when he was singing the duet with the COAS, did not ask the army chief.
What is preventing altaf hussein from coming back to pakistan or is he going to launch a new music group with the daddy
I must say that we are the most divided nation.
we try to support any party blindly.
Grow up guys. i am so sad that political parties have practically divided the country into
mafia zone like mentality.
pp p —- thinks they are the owner of interior sindh and have sole rights to do whatever it wants—- like they have bought the land .
pm l n— think they have bought punjab and it is their baap ki jageer.
mqm— wants to control karachi from a-z—- thinking they can give people right to speak
anp — in frontier ha s smae feeling like —- pm l n
balochistan me hamary fauji bhayon ku mehrban si fauj waaly khud directly control karna chatey han.
gyuys grow up from party politics and say what is bad.
It was munafiqat on the part of P ml n and mq m to sit together in 1997 if both have genuine concerns in the past.
Brig imtiaz billa key xameer ke bary me koy kaya kahey.
@Amir Hameed, just to reiterate my point. After reading mbokhair’s article compilation I also think MQM is a mulk-dushman and an Indian-agent party with Altaf Hussain and Musharraf being sons of Indian parents are in reality RAW agents.
My point here is, MQM being a mulk-dushman and MQM and Musharraf both being Indians are expected to do what they did. I cant care less about Altaf or Musharraf. I only care about many innocent lives that were lost during an illegal army operation and the truest and the greats Pakistani of all times, Mian Mohammad Nawaz Shareef, did not do anything to stop that???
My question is, how is Rashid Nadeem’s death, a North-Karachi 15 year old resident who got killed in a cross fire, has anything to do with MQM sitting in the lap of Musharraf?
My question is, why did Nawaz Shareef, who is a true Pakistani and son of the soil, did not stop this from happening???
Just answer this question. No point in telling me Altaf and Musharraf are best friends and MQM is mulk-dushman. I already know that. Just answer my question, if you can, and if you are a true Pakistani then atleast think about my question and draw your conculisions on your conscience’s voice.
MQM is like a mafia and I feel sorry for people who follow this party. After 63 years if you still call yourself a Muhajir then shame on you. The bottomline is MQM was is and will be a party that will be look upon as suspicious party. When their workers had and still have weapons in their hands, I being a non Muhajir would always feel insecure.
@mbokahri said
“You see, these are valid questions as well. You ask why did NS not stop the illegal army operation. I don’t know. Nobody knows. Questions like these can only be answered through judicial investigations.”
Do we need a judicial investigation to ask Nawaz Shareef, who is in the country, why he did not act?? I dont think so. A Hamid Meer or Kashif Abbasi show should do.
@mbokhari further said “There are allegations on NS. There are allegations on Altaf Hussain. Only a court can decide which allegations are genuine and which are malicious. NS is here in Pakistan to face the court, Altaf is not”
There are no allegations against NS. No one is alleging Nawaz Shareef for not acting against an illegal army operation. He himself and his party has confessed they did not do anything to stop the army operation. I dont see any allegations here.
So does it not make more sense to ask Nawaz Shareef to explain the killing of Ghulam Rasool in Naee KArachi Kachi abadi than asking Altaf Hussain why he supported Musharraf rule??
@Mobkhari
Serious mentality people know about the credibility of UMMAT and its so-called reliable source. UMMAT style of reporting and using reference of reliable source is same as TAKBIR.
TAKBIR has a very long record of MQM bashing, what is the result? the result is given below please see it with open eyes and mind:
MQM MNAs = 25
MQM Senators = 06
MQM MPS = 52
MQM Parliments in Azad Kashmir = 2.
Now instead of absoulte answer about 1992 Army Operation in which more than 15000 innocent people were killed, you are using abusive language, by using abusive language you also are looing your credibility, because a sensible person never use abusive language instead of logics. now come to the point:-
1992 Army Operation was imposed on MQM based on fabricated stories; the main purpose of this operation was to stop MQM spreading all over the country. One of the prime stories was that MQM has agenda to create Jinnah Pur. During the callous operation more than 15000 workers and Sympathizers of MQM were brutally killed extra judicially and thousands were seriously injured. After 17 years Lt-Gen (retd) Naseer Akhtar, a former corps commander of Karachi (1992), and Brig Imtiaz Ahmed, a former director-general of the Intelligence Bureau(1992), have said that MQM had nothing to do with the ‘Jinnahpur conspiracy and this conspiracy was a DRAMA and that 1992 Army operation was ordered by then Prime Minister of Pakistan Mr. Nawaz Shareef.’
Creating and executing the Conspiracy as the Prime Minister of Pakistan Mr. Nawaz Shareef has comitted nation wide crime that kills 15000+ innocent workers of MQM and left thousands of injured.
Instead of condemning Nawaz Sharif’s act of barbarian, you started to curse Altaf Hussain and defend Nawaz Sharif.
If you want people to hear your opinion and take you serious, please do not use abusive language, your language depicts your family background and your level of education.
bsobaid
I only care about many innocent lives that were lost during an illegal army operation and the truest and the greats Pakistani of all times, Mian Mohammad Nawaz Shareef, did not do anything to stop that???
I have never considered NS as a diehard Pakistani or a visionary leader because he is not. He has made billions when he was the CM of Punjab under Zia’s era and then when he was the PM twice. He has evaded tons of money in taxes and to me that act alone should disqualify him from politics forever.
So, I am with you on this and that is why it is important that these operations be investigated and truth be brought into light.
@bsobaid
i believe the local leadership of the army should asked this question instead of nawaz sharif
like if a police officer accepts a bribe from a person, then how is shahbaz sharif responsible for that in lahore today.
lets imagine even if you take this matter to SS for explaination in response he would refer the matter to the police department at best as soon as possible.
This is the logic i am trying to explain to you sir,that when AH had the opportunity to be the part of the same set up then wh did he not uncover the facts for 7-10 about the unfortunate dath of ghulam rasul
@mbokhair, please help me understand you.
Army operation took place in 1992.
Many people lost their lives.
Nawaz Shareef says, he did not approve the army operation.
I say, ask Nawaz Shareef why he as a Prime Minister did not do anything or said anything to stop this illegal army operation. I propose, Hamid MEer or Kashif Abbasi can ask these questions because NAwaz Shareef lives in Raiwand.
@mbokhari and friends say We cant ask this question from Nawaz Shareef who lives in Raiwand, because:
a) Altaf Hussain is an Indian agent
b)Altaf Hussain lives in London
c) Altaf Hussain supported Musharraf’s army rule.
d) We need a judicial inquiry of the other KArachi operation
I dont get it.
@justice , Karachi operation was not about a civilian bribing a local police man.
Karachi operation involved hundres of men from Pak Army and Rangers doing a military operation in the biggest city of Pakistan resulting in the deaths of thousands of Pakistanis, both civials and army men.
This matter is too important to be left at local military leadership.
Nawaz Shareef talks about an investigation into Kargill issue, should we not expect him to talk about Karachi operation as well??
یہ ہی سچ ہے مشرف اور زرداری این ار او مشرف ٹرئیل ركوانے كے لیے ہی یہ سارا ڈرامہ شروع كیا گیا ہے چیف جسٹس كی بہالی پر بھی اسے ہی ڈرامے كیے اور كراے گے اور استمال ایم كیو ایم كو كیا گیا ٹی وی اینكرز جو اس كام كے لیےچنے گے ہیں سب كے سامنے ہے مگر ان غداروں كا كھیل زیاداہ دیر نہ چلے گا آعوام میں اب شعور آ چكا ہے امید ہے جلدی ہی كاشف پھر سے سكرین سے غائب كر دیا جاے گا اپ درست فرما رہے ہو
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WtbpOTh0KI8
@bsobaid
Nawaz Shareef talks about an investigation into Kargill issue, should we not expect him to talk about Karachi operation as well??
Valid point.
@bsobaid
reposting:
http://pkpolitics.com/2009/08/26/altaf-plots-multiple-target-strike/#comment-249479
You ask why did NS not stop the illegal army operation. I don’t know. Nobody knows. Questions like these can only be answered through judicial investigations. Thousands of innocent Karachiites died in those operations and someone must hang for these. Punishment must be meted out. Who can award this punishment? Hamid Mir? Kashif Abbasi? No. Only a court.
That is why Altaf Hussain needs to come back to Pakistan. If NS has committed a crime, he should be hauled in court. Those who supported a dictator for 9 years unashamedly yelling about meeeeedle klaaas geedarship also need to be hauled up in court.
Bottom line: There are allegations on NS. There are allegations on Altaf Hussain. Only a court can decide which allegations are genuine and which are malicious. NS is here in Pakistan to face the court, Altaf is not.
Why ever not?
@Amir Hameed
I think Nawaz Shareef is a true patriot and cheif custodian of Pakistaniat and judicial supremecy. So I disagree with you.
Also, judicial investigation should be held, but it will take some time to initiate it. We have a mundane but an important issue in hand and we can have Nawaz Shareef answer th is question in Hamid Meer show. This can be done in a couple of hours. This will be a very good first step in bringing those Indians (Altaf and Musharraf) to justice.
Majority of the writers have racial thinking and all they dream and think is about mqm. Brothers there are other issues in the country which are more important. Why you guys are playing the same game of 1971.
MQM is a reality and more and more people are joining in Sindh and other provinces and their numbers are increasing and no matter what you think or write it is beyond your control. When army could not crush them in 1990 then you can not achieve this objective.
They may have made mistakes in the past but they have vision for poor and middle class becuase people are tired of vaderas, jagirdar, sardars and qabail system.
Despite your affiliation either with PPP, PML, JI or ANP, your party leaders are willing to accomodate MQ in the centre and on provincial level. Even PMLN wants that MQM quit PPP and join their hands to get rid of PPP.
Lets talk sensible and do not waste our time on personal vandetta and issues relating to personality because 99% leaders have dirty past.
@bsobaid
again it was an example to make a point and let me try to do that again.
operation date 92
question date 09
MQM potential for answer date when NS(culprit) out of country 99-08
The question is thousands of people affected had the right to know when civilian leadership(AH) and military leadership(Gen Musharraf) were in power and had the resources and responsibility to unveil the villain(NS).
but they did not,instead ask now and only to one person about the same issue which is too great and needs both civilian+military leadership.
@mobkhair, me reposting as well:
@mbokahri said
“You see, these are valid questions as well. You ask why did NS not stop the illegal army operation. I don’t know. Nobody knows. Questions like these can only be answered through judicial investigations.”
Do we need a judicial investigation to ask Nawaz Shareef, who is in the country, why he did not act?? I dont think so. A Hamid Meer or Kashif Abbasi show should do.
@mbokhari further said “There are allegations on NS. There are allegations on Altaf Hussain. Only a court can decide which allegations are genuine and which are malicious. NS is here in Pakistan to face the court, Altaf is not”
There are no allegations against NS. No one is alleging Nawaz Shareef for not acting against an illegal army operation. He himself and his party has confessed they did not do anything to stop the army operation. I dont see any allegations here.
So does it not make more sense to ask Nawaz Shareef to explain the killing of Ghulam Rasool in Naee KArachi Kachi abadi than asking Altaf Hussain why he supported Musharraf rule??
We dont need a judicial investigation to ask NAwaz Shareef this simple question. He lives in Raiwand. He can arrange an interview with Hamid Meer but instead of that his whole party is wasting their efforts on repeating the divine truth that we all know that “Altaf Hussain is an Indian agent”.
@bsobaid
Bhai aap kyon apna sar phor rehay ho… There is no point arguing. These Pakistani “Patriots” are more Pakistani then anyone else. They have the right to declare anyone ‘mulk dushman’.
They have declared that MQM is a terrorist and whatever happened in 92, 96 was the only way to handle these terrorists from Karachi.. Rashid Nadeem and countless others were just collateral damage. Live with it.
Irrespective of the fact who created MQM. The reason MQM rose quickly was because it talked about the injustice done to Karachites by Patriots. No doubt it failed miserably in delivering and the power and money corrupted its leadership.
CJ can do tauba, NS can do tauba but aur kisi k liay ‘tauba’ haraam hae.
@mbokhari,
Excellent project, it should not fade away or die down. It must be kept alive until Altaf and his associates are branded, proven and convicted to be terrorists for what they really are.
I wonder however that,
While Pakistani nation’s entire military, police, agencies, government, politicians are madly busy in finding Osama Bin Ladin (the alleged terrorist behind three thousand killed in New York) and his associates, and have lost over 50 billion dollars in doing so in exchange for 10 billion dollars and self destruction, why don’t we want to nab our own biggest terrorist Altaf Hussain?
Altaf and his associates have been on a continuing killing spree for over two decades now. Thousands killed and many FIRs and cases in the courts against him and his associates.
There is no case or FIR anywhere in world against Bin Ladin!!!
@justice,
Why do you expect the two Indians, namely Altaf Hussain and Musharraf to take this issue that concerns Pakistanis.
Instead, expect NAwaz Shareef to tell why he did not do or even said anything to stop an illegal operation in Hamid Meer show. Is’nt it easy??
@runaway
I agree with your comments except that MQM can also do tauba but they dont and that is the failure of leadership.I only wish that they did and stood with the people who were looking for justice but MQM chose to butcher them like taliban in swat.
@bsobaid
i dont expect but ask only, why they did not?
and ask you too why dont you ask them as well?
It is schockingly amazing see the amount of hatred which prevails among the so called patriotic Pakistanis who are also unfortunately allegedly educated ones at that. Well, all I can say is that even education has not ‘cured’ your chronically single track minds. No, who has the wisdom or the interest to see what MQM stands for and what is its vote bank. Who has the gall to call MQM or its supporters anti Pakistan – certainly not those who passed the so called ‘sharia’ bill of the Talibans without even loking into it – also not those who do not have the courage to even let election of two National Assembly constituencies take place (and not in Swat but in Rawalpindi & Lahore!!!!). I am afraid that those drunk by the sense of being the “big brothers” have not been allowed to learn nothing from history. A minority when pushed too far by the majority in India created a new country out of a country that existed since recorded history. A majority in Pakistan when pushed to far on the basis of naked military might refused to be fooled by a fake sense of nationality on the basis of a regious dogma and created Bangladesh. And if our myopic political leaders refuse to learn and if we let them play their politics of self – interests then I guess what we are witnessing is a sad replay of events from the past. Let’s see how many of us re familiar with the wisdom, “Tang aamad, bajang aamad”!
I agree with Saleem,
“Tang aamad, bajang aamad”!
Sorry, @mbokhari
Usuaaly Ummat presents speculated and tabled stories.
@mbokhari
you actually put all that stuff from Ummat story. Ummat has well known recognition of severe anti MQM stance and everyone knows, it is the intelligence paper. Who funds it?
Nawaz Sharif claims being uninformed about :
What happend to the Supreme Court of Pakistan on November 27, 1997 ! (Nawaz Sharif does not know who’s responsible to protect the sanctity of the highest court in the land !)
Nawaz Sharif does not know what is ‘contempt of court’ !
Under what circumstances the then Chief Justice of Pakistan Syed Sajjad Ali Shah was attacked by the mobs organized by Nawaz League !
What treatment was meted out to journalists Sethi & Haqqani & The Jang Group !
The whole country has heard the conversation between Nawaz Sharif’s NAB Chairman (his best buddy and side kick – Saif Ur Rehman Piracha) and Mir Jameel ur Rehman – recorded & released by Mir Jameelur rehman !
Nawaz Sharif’s Law Minister Khalid Anwer communicates desires of the rulers to the Judge of the High Court Malik Qayum about the concocted criminal cases against Benazir Bhutto & her husband Asif Ali Zardari – the whole communication was recorded and released and everyone and his cousin heard it but – Nawaz Sharif doesn’t know it !
Of course!!! Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif did not know anything about Kargil – no he doesn’t know nothing about who paid millions of Sterling Pounds on his behalf in London to save his luxury appartments near Marble Arch when a British Court passed a judgement against his group in a loan default case !
Nawaz doesn’t know who paid for his palace construction in Saudi Arabia or the Raiwind Complex (the future capital of the Independent Dutchy of the Central Punjab ! )
And the list goes on and on and on ad- infinitum!
And now he has been declared as innocent as a ‘stuffed rabbit’ – Supreme Court think so!
And I say let him be as innocent and as ignorant as he wishes to pretend but I ask you all here – why should we let a nincompoop like Nawaz Sharif play havoc with our destiny yet another time? What makes you think that this incompetent man has suddenly become so excptionally qualified that you can’t find out of 180 millions of us?
Whatever the motives, I wish Altaf terrorist Inc. and his bud Mush had done some homework before launching themselves on this slippery slope. This is going to back fire big time, only if they knew the ground reality today in Pakistan today.
I predict with confidence the more this debate goes on NS popularity is going to shoot up exponentially in Punjab, Paktoonkhwa, Balochistan and even among Sindhis. PPP vote bank will solidly support NS against Altaf terrorist Inc in the face of their party leader’s hypocrisy, particularly in Punjab.
Continued from above……….
No body need to know.
@ Saleem Butt
Spot On NS doesnt know anything that goes around him most of the time it seems
“A story” and of all places from a ragtag – Bukhari, one would think that you are trying to inform us with some news and if you lack access to a right source, at least your own honest opinion – you are failing on both counts! What is this source which you so ‘proudly’ quote ? I mean say that name again, please. Come on, put your hand on yor hearts, and say honest God, who all had even heard of this “piece” of whatever it is – Ummat – whose ummat, I ask, not of the same tribe of news “manufacturers” and manipulators of public opinion.
I spit on those people who make it political . Karachi lost 20,000/- youths and thats the bitter part. Who will justify this. Those who being the PM had not idea what’s happening around or those who are really after Karachi. Karachi lost 20,000 youths and that were between 18-30 years of age. Someone has to take the responsibility.
Truth and Reconciliation Commission is needed for sure. Nawaz should answer why he kept haunting for Mohajirs and MQM. First in the form of 1992 operation, then in 1997 again and then 2004 asking all parties not to work with MQM. Seems Jati Umrah still have the roots in Punjab. The most unpatriotic maligning the most patriotic.
Ghazala said: “I agree with Saleem,”
“Tang aamad, bajang aamad”!
NO YOU DON’T – OTHERWISE YOU WON’T BE DISCOURAGING VOICES OF REASON TO BE HEARD ON TPS – !!!
Mr. Mbokhari
Thx for your detailed answer to my post. I appriciate your explanation and take your criticism about Imran and PTI in a postive sense although I comletely dissgree with you. One comment abt Imran, may be he is the only one who apologized for his mistake to support Musharaf. I wait when NZ will apology for asking amnesty from dictator MUSHARAF, attcking SC, supporting Zia ul Haq ‘dictator’ etc.
As you said your objecitve and PKP is to identify mistakes of various parties so they can correct.
So I will wait an article from your side about PML-N’s mistakes and their silence on all major issues right now thats for me is not less then a crime….I hope you think that PML-N is not perfect?
@swali
“I spit on those people who make it political”
I am afraid you may need to look up and spit so that it falls on your face as you are one of many who are making this issue political
Jinnah Pur conspiracy was not hatched in PM house or Jati Umra it was hatched in GHQ. But since MQM is in bed with GHQ for past 8 years or so they are ignoring the actual culprit GHQ and are accusing Nawaz Sharif who BTW is also complaining that he was kept in dark by security agencies. It seems to me MQM is playing what we call politics as usual on this issue.
All political forces PPP, PMLN, MQM, JI, PMLQ etc should unite and raise voice on security agencies role in politics. MQM firing with all cylanders to NS can definitely draw some political polints but it will not address the bigger ISSUE …. The role of GHQ/ISI/IB/MI in politics.
Salman, merely apologizing for one crime does not absolve a criminal with a long history of crimes committed – does it? Nawaz did not only support the evil dictator Zia; Nawaz is his creation! His gang encouraged execution of Shaheed Prime Minister Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto. Nawaz intrigued against the democratic government of Prime Minister Junejo.
And Imran Khan – the less you take him under the loop the greater favor you would be doing to the man. He is confused and wishes to be captaining us into total disaster. He is more dangerous with his worlview than all of those ‘jihadists’ put together. Remember, the man can deceive the masses by claiming his so called “expert knowledge” about the rest of the world and who could be better than him to create fear and confusion. He is being used to pave the way for total chaos in our society and evetual talibanization under the ‘sacred’ guidance of jingoists like Hameed Gul. Imran is just a ‘babe’ in the jungle of our confused religio-political-economic-ethnic-provincial- culture. He and people like him with same naively dangerous political agendas must be just plain simply ignored in a very democratic manner.
syed1508 said: “Majority of the writers have racial thinking and all they dream and think is about mqm. Brothers there are other issues in the country which are more important. Why you guys are playing the same game of 1971.”
Right!
They are playing 1971 because of their ignorance – those involved in this crime might be litterate but you can be sure od them being also ‘alitterate’ otherwise they would read the history – damn – it’s not even history, it’s almost yesterday when we chased away a majority of good Pakistanis who fought more actively for the creation of Pakistan. It is a curse when you don’t learn from your past it keeps haunting you and haunting you till completely destroyed.
@Kashif,
Why did NAwaz Sharif, who was a prime minister, did not do anything or say anything when this illegal army operation was taking place? Swali is not making this issue political at all, you are!
Nawaz Sharif was kept in dark??? ok, he was kept in dark about the planning but he was’nt kept in dark during the execution of army operation. It was’nt an overnight event. It went on for a while. Why did Nawaz Shareef not do anything to stop th army operation?
Nawaz Shareef wants to make a commission on Kargill issue because he was kept in dark (although Bill Clinton played recording of NAwaz Shareef getting briefing from army) then why has NAwaz Shareef not yet, in 17 years, said a word about KArachi operation? Why, unlike Kargill issue, he never said he was kept in dark about KArachi operation? Why ? It has been 17 years and Nawaz Shareef has not complained once that he was kept in dark about Karachi operation? Why??? He has been complaining all that time about KArgill, why not this operation?
There is a tendency to do a wash when it comes to Nawaz Shareef. People always say, ok Nawaz Shareef did that but everyone else did that as well. So it does;nt matter. but when it comes to any other political parties, our media grill those parties to death. There is no wash in that case.
I have been raising basic basic questions in this discussion and no one seems to know the answers. What I do see here is an effort to wash. Same goes in media. Media is also trying to wash the issue. They are raising questions about Altaf Hussain which they all say is an Indian agent. Why do they expect Altaf Hussain to do the right thing considering he is an Indian agent? We should be asking questions from NAwaz Shareef. The same question I am asking in this post and previous posts in this discussion.
If Nawaz Sharif is so naive and such a simpleton that in all matters of national importance he is kept or decides to be kept uninformed then WHY DOES HE WANT TO INFLICT HIMSELF LIKE A WOUND ON US THE POOR PEOPLE OF PAKISTAN – is there any justification for us to even take him seriously at all?
@bs obaid
again the point is this,since AH did not take any action when he was in power and when he could. while NS was not in power in the last few years
so the answer to your question again rests with AH
@saleem butt
zia had two kids if you remember clearly
nawaz and altaf why mention only one?
Malice or ignorance
Nawaz Sharif and Co should have got the message and quit politics, first a operation happens and they have no knowledge and then the CHOSEN ONE decides to cross the border and start a low intensity conflict with our nemesis and still have no knowledge of this happening until the damage had been done.
OPEN REQUEST TO QUAID-E-TEHREEK ALTAF HUSSAIN BHAI
Please give up your British Passport hold Pakistani Passport in your hands and send pictures to media.
apka khadim,
Imran Khandwala
@justice
If this is the case, why does Nawaz Shareef keep saying he wants to setup a Kargill comission? What wass stopping him from saying he wants to setup a similar comission for Karachi operation. Was he again “kept in dark” ??
No, I dont agree with you. I have said this before and you and mbokhair also say the same. Altaf is an Indian agent. Why do you expect Altaf to take up this issue? Nawaz Shareef is a true patriot, he should have taken this issue up regardless of what Altaf the Indian agent has said or done. Ofcourse, Altaf never took up the issue because he is not sincere with the people. Why has NAwaz SHareef, who is a true pakistani, refrained from talking about the issue?
Its not even about Nawaz Sharif not being in power. I am asking about what he did when he was in power??N awaz Shareef was prime minister of the country and he was kept in dark. OK. But after the operation was started, did he do or say anything to stop this illegal operation when he was a Prime Minister? In past 17 years, did he ever say a single word about this illegal operation? As far as I remember Altaf whines and cries about this operation in his every single speech.
Also, Nawaz Shareef supporters claim he is a national leader. When you blame Altaf Hussain for not taking up this issue before, you are basically suggesting Nawaz Shareef did not look into the issue because Altaf Hussain never raised this issue. Are you saying NAwaz Shareef, for past 17 years, kept in dark by Altaf Hussain about Karachi operation? well, I am not surprised since this national leader called Nawaz Shareef has’nt stepped in Sindh in past over an year.
Essentially what you re saying is, Agar NAwaz Nay nahi kiaa tou Altaf nay bhi tou nahi kiaa. Iss liyay Altaf Indian Agent hai aur NAwaz Shareef sacha Pakistani hai.
Obviously, its not making any sense.
From all this discussion, I have concluded one thing.
Nihari, paaye and lassi (desi brand of wine) should be banned that make our ex-primeminister unaware of many events.
What happend to the Supreme Court of Pakistan on November 27, 1997 ! He does not know who’s responsible to protect the sanctity of the highest court.
1992 operation. He is not informed.
kargil operation. He was not in loop.
He signs agreement and leave for exile but he has no idea whatsoever abt agreement.
If you ask him abt his wealth, he will probably reply the same ” I dont know if have this much assets and if i do have this much assets i dont know where it come from”
@mbokhari
Good job.
Everything started with speech of Ch Nisar…so to me it looks like Ch Nisar was integrated into main chip to play major roll in saving necks of Mush and Altaf Bhai.
In recent political design PMLN has to keep their face clear…..1992 massacre not easy to ignore.
Best play by PMLN could be to stay away from May 12th proceeding let the Lawyers be the defendant forcing PPP to prosecute.
@imrankhandwala
What does your request have anything to do with 92 operation?
What does Altaf Hussain’s dual citizenship have anyhting to do with Mohammad Ikram getting shot near Haidery market in NOrth Nazimabad?
Altaf is an Indian agent, but those who get killed were not?? or atleast many of them were not?? or were they all Indian agent because their parents were born in India??
What are you saying? Altaf Hussain is a British and Indian citizen. Agred!
But NAwaz Shareef is not. Why did he not do anything to stop the killing of Waseem Ikram in lolokhet, Karachi?
If he was kept in dark before the start of operation, why he did not do anything about it after the operation was started?
Why after 17 years he never demanded setting up a comission for 92 operation until now? because Altaf Hussain live in London?? but hey, Altaf is a British citizen and NAwaz Shareef is not.
justice (what sahab or sahiba?)
I guess it is ignorance on your part – if you had any interest or knowledge about the conditions in Karachi University campus you would know what created APMSO & eventually MQM and if your brand of ‘selective justice’ prevails (God forbid!) then you will witness creations of certain painful and never healing wounds here.
MQM is acceptable to those who feel oppressed and exploited because it has managed to grab back power base from the feudals and their allies in the urban areas of Sindh and MQM is not acceptable to those forces of evil who have been taking us for a ride all over the country since its founding.
Only fair course for us all, who have any postive thinking for Pakistan, is to go for an open mind and have a real commission headed by not any, including this Chaudhry Justice, PCO judges (not once PCO nor twice or three time oaths under any PCO – this man took oath twice !!!!!) whic must be not ‘Truth & Reconciliation’ but ‘Admission of Guilt – Repentance – Pardon’ – Let all those who played monkey with us come to us and plead guilty in public, show remorse and beg for our forgiveness – all without any exceptions, only one pardon granted they may show their stained and soiled faces in public again.
@Zahid, Nawaz was also “kept in dark” about maafi nama. Thats why he kept on denying any such maafi nama exist in khana kaaba, masjid-e-nabvi, Jeddah and London. He only found out about it when the maafi nama was presented in Sindh court. Yes, he was kept in dark.
Gussess,, u can win million dollor,
Who was the prime minister and does not know about 1992 operation in karachi.
who was the prime minister and does not know about Kargil operation.
Who took 30 million rupee from ISI to fund IJI canidates.
who was the prime minister does not want nuclear test after india does it in pokhran.Then forced to do by Army.
who was the prime minister who denies deal with Musharaf and then accepted.
He is kept in dark because he is a victim of the wraths of gods – remember – when gods wish to destroy someone they just destroy their brains (senses of comprehension, retention, apprehension, power of judgement etc) !
He is a victim and we must not blame him for his mental limitations just keep him in a safe place to prevent him causing further damages to our national life (of course provide him his favorite targets of ‘Nihari – Halwa-puri- lassi’ and let him attack with full vigor and vengence all that what he can swallow & wash down his instiably hungry tummy bag!). This will do good to him and us all. Is that fair?
Until n unless we do not have impartial inquiry of 1992 military operation this allegation and counter allegation will continue. We have to find out who was actually responsible, who were the mastermind of this operation and how much there was requirement of it. We cannot only held responsible MQM for all of this…Post operation inquiry should be compulsory for all operation so that no one should cash his position to vent out his animosity against any person,party and community and this will also prevent any person of higher hierarchy promote his personal agenda at the cost of ppl of this country.
Another interesting thing is, army and agencies trust PPP way way less than Nawaz Shareef. Nawaz Shareef has always been considered close to military establishment and PP traditionally has been considered anti-establishment until recently and yet, PPP never complained it was kept in dark. It is always Nawaz Shareef who complains.
Typical rhetoric from NAwaz Lovers
Hamein nahi pata thaa
Hamein nahi bataya
Zardari ne dhokaa day diyaa
Zardari ne ullo bana diaa
Now if a person like Zardari can make NAwaz Shareef ulloo aur give him dhooka, just imagine how all those world leaders can make a fool out of Nawaz Shareef and later Shareef sahab will say,
India ne dhokha day diaa
Obama bohot bara jhoota hai, oss ne jhoot bol diaa
Manmohan ne hum ko bataya h ee nahi
Karzai ne waada karr kay tor dala, haey ab mein kiaa karoon??
Reality is, they know everything and they are hypocrate enough to lie in front of the whole nation. Yes, they are too dumb to come up with a better excuse but they are hypocrate enough to say “we were kept in dark”. He tried lieing to Bill Clinton also by saying he does not know anything about Kargill operation and he was kept in dark, at that point, Bill Clinton played a recording where Nawaz Shareef was getting briefing from army. Obviously, Nawaz Shareef had to shut up.
Saleembutt, if nawaz is a by product of miltary rule….Imran is confused and very dangerous for country….then who you support? I guess he is the same confused who is shouting for independence judiciary from 13 years, for one educational system for whole country ,for reforms in taxation, asking leadership to put their assets in country and lot of things…yes he is really confused infact stupid to waste his time in Pakistan, doing alot for country and yet receving seneseless blames…i.e agent of jews lobby, taleban khan etc…
coming back to point so you support PPP or Zardari? Do I have to explain NRO, deal with dictator, corruption, 10% and so on
Do you support MQM? Torture, ethnic violence, terrorism, politics of fear and lot of other things…
or PML-Q
….no comments……
Whenever I say somebody is good or bad, I talk in relative terms……its un imaginable to agree with everything of a person in recent pakistani politics… We don’t need an expert like Shukat aziz to run Pakistan we need a fearless, honest, brave and most important real PAKISTANI as our leader who has everything in Pakistan…if Pakistan goes down he would feel same effect…Not like Zardari, sharif or altaf they can fly anytime and Pakistan & Pakistanis go to hell….
It is sad to see MQM supporters monotonously ranting about NS not stopping the ’92 operation. Meanwhile, why not ask PPP to explain the ’96 operation?
It is our predicament that we fail to concentrate on an issue long enough to solve it once and for all.
The Pakistani media is becoming a pawn in the games played by these extremely corrupt politicians. Please, STOP MAKING A NON-ISSUE INTO A NATIONAL PROBLEM. If MQM has beef with NS, take him to court.
Altaf should come back to Pakistan. He should face the independent judiciary of Pakistan. Justice will be done to whoever committed atrocities against innocent civilians. Be it the early ’90s or 2007.
@bsobaid
Its a news to me that Bill Clinton played video of NS being briefed by Army on Kargill. I am not a NS supporter. Every time PMLN is asked about getting dictations from Washington they say they are the one who did explosions despite Washington pressure. They forget Nawaz Sharif was the one who announced Kargill cease fire along side President Bill Clinton outside White House.
Coming back to the topic. I agree with you every thing you said about Nawaz Sharif. He should be accountable for all you said and much more. Point I was trying to make politicans like Sharifs, Bhuttos, Altafs etc were on the receiving ends from GHQ. Bhttos whole family is vanished and GHQ is the prime suspect. Every one knows Altaf Hussein can not come to Pakistan not because of any political party its bcaz of GHQ. Sharifs were exiled and their gov was dismissed twice by GHQ. Bughti was killed by Army (that BTW I do think was necessary).
My point was political point scoring is all good and legitimate but it will divert our attention from real culprit GHQ. If NS kept quite for 17 years so did AH and BB. Our political machinery does not have guts or I should say resources to stand up against GHQ. Everytime they tried they were either killed or exiled. Politicans should unite against GHQ games to kick them out of political arena for good.
@ bsobaid
Intresting point c linton played recording of breifing shareef had. pleas egive areference to this pont . this is intresting.—- This will clear a lot of things
thanks
@mbokhari
Good job.
Everything started with speech of Ch Nisar…so to me it looks like Ch Nisar was integrated into main chip to play major roll in saving necks of Mush and Altaf Bhai.
In recent political design PMLN has to keep their face clear…..1992 massacre not easy to ignore.
Best play by PMLN could be to stay away from May 12th proceeding let the Lawyers be the defendant forcing PPP to prosecute.
@KAshif what you said about GHQ is true but again you are trying to do a wash. NAwaz Shareef did not do anything about it, so what? BB and Altaf did not do anything either. This kind of wash only seem to take place when Nawaz Shareef is in question. You will never see this happening in case of MQM or PPP. They never say Zardari did corruption, so what? Nawaz also did corruption. No, never you will find that but when NAwaz Shareef’s corruption is uncovered they always start talking about Zardari. They tal about NRO and BB cutting a deal with Musharraf but they never talk about maafi nama. However, when you talk about Maafi nama, all nawaz lovers and our media start ranting about NRO.
This, in my opinion is unjust and biased and unfair. While GHQ is responsible for this mess, we must also not overlook what NAwaz Shareef did. He is not innocent. Whole media is trying to portray h im as ameer-ul-momineen and Mr. Clean which is not true.
salman cheema said: “……… taleban khan” !
Yes, Salaman let’s say that is what is his biggest shortcoming. He is inspired by Taliban brand of politics and frankly I will support anybody , repeat, anybody but these ‘sickos’ – they will, with Imran the Talib-e-Power, leads us back to where we started. All I can wish for him is that may the good God grant Imran’s wishes to a real nice (even better than his wonderful house in Islamabad which he calls his ‘heavens’!) real nice place in ‘real’ paradise and quickly with a special flight. Khas kam jehan paak!
By the way his idol for democracy is another sicko by the name Mahatir Mohammad – ask for your guidance Malaysians for their experience under this dictator Mahatir.
Usman and KAshif, you may have forgotten, but I have not. Read news coverage at that time in The News and Jang and many other newspapers. It was a front page investigative report by Kamran Khan and I think Hamid Meer also later confirmed the report. Although I am not 100% sure about Hamid MEer, it may have been another journalist. Also, it was’nt a video recording, it was audio recording.
Your very own and favourite Kamran Khan reported the story and so did other foreign officials.
@bsobaid
I agree with you. Nawaz Sharif should not be given clean slip. He should be hammered on this.
@Kashif
Please do correct me if i am wrong but i could have sworn that you declared yourself to be a PML(N) supporter in one of the threads on this site.
@rafay, that does’nt matter. You can be a supporter of a party and still quote its short-comings. Only a true and sincere Pakistani will do that. We must not blindly support anyone.
However, coming back to the topic, I am curious to see any newsanchor asking and grilling N-League for not taking any action on illegal army operation and not saying a word about the operation until now.
Surely, they will now blame agencies and what not, but the fact remains.
saleem butt…I did’nt get answer of my questions…
you have right if you don’t want to reply but don’t copy past my words out of context and don’t reply out of context….
Why you are afraid to openly say to whom you support?
Thx
@bs obaid
not all are saying that AH is an indian agent to keep the record straight.I can say about myself
lets try that in another way.
A(army) starts an operation on M(MQM). Then A and M become partner for ten years and now according to your logic N(Nawaz Sharif) should apologize for the actions of A on M and take the responsibility.
It does not matter if M is an indian agent or not in this matter.Like it does not matter if the indian agent can understand basic logic
@bsobaid
Thats a perfectly reasonable approach and i myself get irked by people who only look at one side of the picture; be it the ones who talk of PPP’s qurbanian, MQM pay zulm or PTI/IK being the only hope who can do nothing wrong.
However, its the words ‘I am not a NS supporter’ which sort of looked odd given his earlier thoughts. Again, I might be confusing him with someone else so apologies if i have got it wrong.
It all has started after the interview of army officers by media. The timing of these interviews and MQMs rheotoric is very interesting. Everyone knows that Musharrafs trial is a demand of general public, 77% people think that it must be done. Moreover, Muhsarraf and Altaf Hussain were summoned by Sindh High Court for the May 2007 massacre. Now to save the ass of Musharraf and Altaf, MQM is out to divert the attention of the masses but now it is not possible.
Although it was created by the agencies, MQM was hope for the people of Karachi in the beginning but the culture of torture, bhatta, gang rape, robberies and drugs and arms dealings was introduced mostly by the criminals who were looking for some save heavens. Unfortunately it was provided by MQM. They had internal fighting, hundreds died due to internal classhes and many leaders also lost their lives. Altaf fled the country because of his crimes. Now the general public of Karachi is fedup with this mafia.
Some of our friends here are giving the impression that it is always Nawaz Sharif who is ignorant about the happenings. Let the record straight. Agencies in Pakistan, Pak Army to be precise, always play dirty tricks, there were inovloved in those activities without the knowledge of civil govt., they are doing the same now and will be doing in the future also if ppp did mistake of exonerating Musharraf.
When asked by the host of Jawab Deh, who killed Murtaza Bhutto? Benazir replied that it was the work of Agencies. This clip is being shown on regular basis these days. Benazir was Prime Minister of the country so according to the assertion of our friends here she must have been informed…. Was that the case? No. Agencies work like that.
Again when benazir was bashing Talibans while talking to some foreign media, they asked her that the Talibans were created while you were Prime Minister. She replied no, agencies were involved in that and she had no idea of the happenings. If we see the saga of creation of Talibans then it was a big operation, where a force was created and the capital of a country was attacked and taken over by the mullahs. So my dear friends whether it being Bhutto, Junejo, Nawaz Sharif, Benazir and others after them, agencies in Pakistan have very strong roots and it will take real committment to root it out but unfortunatly ppps leadership has strengthened the hands of agencies. We must give credit to Nawaz Sharif who was brave enough to take action against the work of agencies. He lost his govts. both time because when the agencies realized that he is after them. Same happened to Junejo when he asked about the resignation of army generals responsible for ojhri camp disaster.
@saleembutt
yes i know and that was the beginning of APMSO when AH killed some IJT and later on found enough money from the “donations”to establish the whole organization.
I also know how the MQM unit and sector in-charge used to collect donations actually i have myself “voluntarily” given some after couple of bones broken and family under threat.
So please dont give me your BS.
I have seen the unseen on may 12th in karachi without the camera too and heard your “salaar haider” which he prefers to be called in private
wow, wow
It for sure looks like a well knit strategy to save moshe’s skin. Suddenly moshe’s trial is in the back burner and every one is talking about something that happened 17 yrs ago, for which even accuser knows that the alleged culprit was not involved. We see a lot of barsati maindak coming out supporting bhatta-khors but as always this is sure gonna back-fire and this time it will be very hard. People of Pakistan are not stupid and understand the motives behind all this fuss, especially at this time. In the age of electronic media and with anchors like Kashif Abbasi and Talat Hussain, it is already showing signs of things slipping out of MQM’s hands and it will not be too long before you see tables turning over it and its patron-in-chief moshe, the great (ch00ha). As an indicator, very soon you will hear drama-baaz coming out on TV and asking NS for reconciliation and to forget past and move forward. But as we know NS’s nature, he never forgets and forgive and surely going to take his revenge when the time comes.
@justice
and this is what I say.
A starts an operation on M, ILLEGALLY!!
Lots of people, including civilians died.
The operation was illegal because A kept N in dark while N was the prime minister and N did not approve the operation.
You tell me, there is a massive military operation going on in the country and the ruler of the country not doing anything about it. Does it make any sense???
So, N being a sitting prime minister had the responsibility to do something about an illegal action. Does’nt matter the operation was against M or whoever. The question is the illegality of operation and N being a prime minister not doing anything about it.
Now, M slept with A is another important questions which we are all concentrating on but that DOES NOT make N innocent. The question of N not doing anything during a massive illegal military operation under his watch make him way way more responsible than anyone else.
Also, I am saying we dont need a judicial investigation into this question. N lives in Raiwand, why dont he invite his favourite Kashif Abbasi or Hamid MEer and tell everyone why he did not do anything about it?
Dig???
@rafay79
I try to visualize politics as gray. I do not believe in absolute evil or absolute good. I have admired and criticised PMLN, PPPP, MQM, PMLQ, ANP, JI, PTI, Army, US, India, Isreal etc . I do not recall ever supporting Taliban but there are certainly few positives that I can bring up. I try to remain independent. It gives me more room and flexibility while blogging. Plus I am not being paid to defend any side out of the way.
I may have supported PMLN on specific issues but I won’t have permanent loyalties or hostalities.
@bs obaid
Wow so the problem some how between in your logic A and M who are sleeping together and N is responsible only.
somehow everything else is either another question or not a question at all since Ah is an indian agent.
OK we cannot have a tunnel vision let me say that
because every question has to be seen in its perspective and after 17 years post operational issues.
@ justice, I am surprised why you cant get this simple point. Probably because you dont want to?? or may be not.
Even if Army and MQM made a deal later how does that justify Nawaz NOT taking any action against illegal operation and not saying a single word about it in last 17 years??
Do you think only MQM party members got killed in the operation? ofcourse not, a big number of regular civilians also died. Even if you blame Indian agent Altaf Hussain for not taking up the killings of its Indian agent party workers, what about the regular civialians who had nothing to do with politics? Was Nawaz Shareef also “kept in dark” about the killings of innocent civilians? You can grill Altaf Hussain as much as you want for not taking up the issue but how can you not ask this very important and basic question to NAwaz Shareef and give him “credit” for going after intel agencies??
If Nawaz Shareef talks about setting up a Kargill comission today, after 10 years, what is the problem in talking about KArachi operation?
To bring into perspective, the media coverage we are seeing today, including this article by mbokhari responds to this whole issue by calling Altaf Hussain an Indian agent and blaming it to sit with dictators. I am saying, why are we not asking NAwaz Shareef why he did n ot stop the operation??
but I think we have sort of reached concensus because as you said “Wow so the problem some how between in your logic A and M who are sleeping together and N is responsible only.”
the last word of your sentence “only” tells me you also think Nawaz Shareef is also responsible and therefore I demand and request everyone to analyse NAwaz Shareef’s role in this issue rather than calling Altaf Hussain an Indian agent.
However, there is one difference. Altaf Hussain and MQM have been demanding an independent judicial comission to investigate the operation. Altaf Hussain has also pardoned those army operations (although he does not have the right to do that). After pardoning and in the name of reconciliation, MQM has worked with other political parties while at the same time they have demanded (although fakely) a judicial comission to investigate the operation. So MQM has sort of tried to explain and justify its political actions. N-League on the other hand never ever said a word about an illegal army operation ever and now they blame MQM for it. You can clearly see hypocracy and bayghairtee here.
Y Altaf should nt be trialed for karachi violence.
@bs obaid
i really cant see why you would pick one and leave the others alone since it is convenient or it is limited partnership.
I am against cherry picking and that is the point.
and the death of civilians again should be investigated by the authorities and dealt according to the law.
@bsobaid
AH is not an Indian agent but he does head MQM that has a militant wing. BTW I am on same page with AH on partition of subcontinent. There may not be any Jinnah Pur conspiracy that doesn’t mean MQM is clean. MQM is terrorist organization that needed and probably still needs Army operation. I have always advocated Army operation against Taliban on right and I do the same for more educated but equally brutal MQM. I actually demand one against JI’s militant wing. We can not have militancy packaged with political philosphy in 21st century. I supported operation against Bugti on very same grounds. Every one knows I staunchly oppose extreme right views of PTI but I admire them for not taking the route of militancy along with selling their political philosphy.
When any political party develops militant wing it can only be countered by Army. I understand why MQM developed it to counter IJT’s militancy. But we need to come out of this vicious circle.
@justice
Its not me who is picking one and leaving others.
Read this article by mbokhari on which we all are commenting and you will know who is picking one and leaving the rest.
I think we are on same wavelength now.
As far as judicial investigation is concerned, I am all for that but in the mean time we can get answers for very basic questions such as “why Nawaz did not do anything to stop the operation” by having NAwaz Shareef appearing on Hamid Meer show and explaining his position.
We can ask the same question to Altaf hussain about him being an Indian agent and being responsible for Karachi operation, but Altaf Hussain will deny the charge and we therefore need judicial inquiry into that.
Nawaz Shareef, on the other hand does not deny that he did not do anything to stop the operation. He confesses he did not do anything and the reason he gives is he was “kept in dark” even during the time when 50-60 people were getting killed in Karachi on daily basis which sounds very bogus and we dont need a judicial bench to tell us NAwaz Shareef is lieing.
@bs obaid
“ONLY” does say while A+M are singing/sleeping together N only is targeted.
The problem is A(Army) which is obviously busy singing with M(MQM).I would totally agree if you had asked why on the death of innocent civilians AH formed an alliance with the army at the cost of the blood of his own supporters/voters.
How can AH forgive the death of innocent civilians?
i think MQM has the shooter in front but deliberately is looking on the other side
@Kashif, you raised an important point but I am afraid we will go off-topic if we start discussing that.
I’d recommend you to come to the “discuss” section of pkpolitics and we can discuss it there. You can start a new thread there.
http://pkpolitics.com/discuss/
@justice, again, how does MQM’s support of Musharraf justify Nawaz Sharif’s inaction over an illegal army operation?? I have explained my point many times already. I wont repeat it again. It is a simple point for anyone who wants to understand it.
@bs obaid
one more time “cherry picking”+”tunnel vision”=your point
sorry but that is the shortest version.
I really dont know your focus,i thought it was killing of innocent civilians but it is probably not coz all your energy is spent on NS.
I believe once we have the same focus we can conclude, but till you have political points to score
I can only say keep it up to try to make an invalid point–valid
@ bsobaid
Reference please —- kargil—- shreef — cli nton- which audia you are talking about.
hamid meir never siad that. how on the earth amrecia people will give their tapped thing to people like mir or khan—
did zinni s bookk said this
please give us solid proof so that every one can say bad names to sh ref. othewise its like jinnah pur map shown by some onwe to be with drawn later.
salman cheema said: “saleem butt…I did’nt get answer of my questions…
you have right if you don’t want to reply but don’t copy past my words out of context and don’t reply out of context….
Why you are afraid to openly say to whom you support?
Thx”
Cheema Jee!
I honestly don’t know which question and what answer you are referring to – I am aware of my rights and would deinitely wish to give you a replywithout any fear. Which words have I copied and pasted from you and where? I don’t know what are you talking about. I have been replying to anything and everything that interested or provoked my interest – by the way I have been constantly moderated and I don’t know if some of my utterances didn’t pass the test of the moderators. Regarding your question who do I support – frankly I don’t think it is any of anyone’s concern which particular political party or individual one finds favorable to one’s sense of propriety. Hope you will allow me this liberty. If this is of any help – I am extremely disappointed and disturbed by the selective justice and media trial taking place. You just can not label a people traitor, simply because they refuse to let you get away with murder. In my view it is serious existential error that we are repeating, last time one part broke away this time – I fear much much horrible scenario.
Miss/Mr/Ms. justice, so if I understood correcly it’s your broken bones which are motivating you to propagate this hatred and MQM demolishing campaign. Well, life does sometimes play cruel jokes on us all – however, thr stronger from us leave personal pain at home when talk about more important issues in public life. Try to see beyond yourself, it will help you, life is much more than just me & my limited experience. Good luck!
@Kashif
Fair enough.
They accuse PMLN of not stopping the army operation. Well if that is the case then they should not sit with PPP because Naseer ullah Babar also conducted an operation against them on orders of Benazir Bhutto.
MQM when formed was formed by Zia ul Haq to destroy Jamat Islami and PPP in Karachi and Hyderabad.
The initial training of Altaf Hussain was done in America where he worked as a taxi driver
By holding British passport he looks like Ali Ijaz in that famous drama Dubai chalo where he shows off his passport also when he going to Dubai
There is nothing to show off if you have a British or foreign passport. We should be proud of our Pakistani passport and thats it.
MQ M is only trying to protect their god father Musharraf. And they have been called by Sindh High Court and so they are trying to put pressure on judiciary. But like they failed to stop restoration of judiciary they would fail again. Altaf Hussain is the biggest terrorist and MQM is the leading terrorist organization like all banned religious organization. They are on pay roll of RAW and they would even throw out their member and minister from the party because he dared to protest Sulman Rushidie being elevated to knighthood.
Interesting co incidence
1992 OPERATION—- interior minister choory shujaat hussain-
Killing o fakbar bugti — choory shujjat negotiator-
lal masjid killings — choory negotiator— leader of ruling party.
1199 kargil—– important minister.
WALAHANA ISTIQBAL IN 90—–
bilatabsra.
to be fair
one innocent killed is big sin.
the problem here is some parties are not at all intrested( by default or by design) to challenge the real rulers of the country aka fauj.
all of them have coolaborated with fauj at one time or other.
this is time for all to say no fuaji janta and ask for the trial of ASLLI OR BAREY HUKMRAN
#just ice
It is about killing of innocent. Ofcourse it is. You tell me, what is the responsibility of a ruler of a country when innocent civilians are being killed? Just answer the question.
At that very date, when innocents were getting killed on the streets of Karachi, andI am not talking about MQM party workers, I am talking about regular innocent civilians, what was prime minister doing?? At that very date and on all those days, what was NAwaz Shareef doing in his prime minister palace?
Was he trying to stop the operation? NO! because Nawaz Shareef never said it ever tried to stop the operation. So this means, while innocent civilians were getting killed, Nawaz Shareef was sitting in his palace watching them die!!
simple as that.
Now you talk about Altaf Hussain being an Indian agent and what not, that does not have any relevance to NAwaz Sharif’s inaction ( or his complete support in killing of innocent civilians)
@Usman said
“this is time for all to say no fuaji janta and ask for the trial of ASLLI OR BAREY HUKMRAN”
I agree with you but your very own N-League leaders say Musharraf acted alone in declaring emergency, abrogating constitution and coup and army was not involved in all that at all. They thsemselves are clarifying Army’s position and they want to try Musharraf alone and not the other generals and army who were as much involved, if not more, in all this. However, this is off-topic. We can discuss that in “discuss” section of the website.
@ bs obaid
innocent civilians are being killed in the streets of karachi by pakistani army and altaf hussein with the killers to form a long term alliance.
So again as you said innocent people being killed and people who are having tears for the innocent people are sleeping with killers
so i am not sure who i am talking to killers or innocent people or both at the same time in one person.It looks like your argument is this
I am the one killed and i am the one killing at the same time
I request Admin to discuss the money distributed among the politions which also included Nawaz Sharif.
http://www.jang.com.pk/jang/aug2009-daily/26-08-2009/index.html
@ BSOBAID
i am not a shareef supporter. i am a democrat who support every pro democracy party.
i ahve been labeeled a jiyala on this forum. so i dont care about criticism.
learn to say truth rather than point scoring.
so stop your crap of bias.
I have answered simple question — answer not given . this means your calim is hollow.
where has musharaf come into my question.
now you have brought him into question– plase bring other jurnails into court as well.
i dont care.
that is the reason start the trial o fmush and then bring all other jurnails who supported him.
why shy from this.
grow up now and talk with sense.
@ bsobaid
bring kiyani, tariq, nadeem taj, and whole toly to trial.
i am for it. but you are acting chicken.
@ bso baid
plase bring proof of audeo of kargil breifing—-
hmm You mean Rs 47.6 million in current value. Not bad
12 may has become nightmare for MQM ,Yes this is true MQM was involved in this incident and they should be punished by court .
But I failed to understand our political and religious parties attitute towards taliban compare to MQM .
talibans have killed 10 times more then MQM all over Pakistan but still no political (except some )and religious party call them terrorist .
MQM killed 40 people on 12 may but baitullah Mehsoud killed 100 people in just one blast by suicide bomber ,Fazlullah killed thousands including pakistan army men ,but all religious groups want to negotiate with taliban and do not call them terrorist .
I am not defending MQM I am just pointing the double standards from political /religious groups
If 12 May is a date for them, there are many ohter dates for others if you wnat to keep digging the past. Go on into the future. Nawaz Sharif touts will kill the country with their vengence and vendetta politics. They must play forgive and forget development politics. Move on man. This article is far too one sided to be taken seriously. Sorry.
netengr,
Come on doesn’t your party call them terrorists/traitors?
MQM are also armed & terrorize people of karachi, why not an operation to clean them up?
MUSH AND ALTAF WILL BECOME THE VICTIM OF THE WHEEL OF CHANGE IN MONTHS OR YEARS TO COME.
92 Karchi Operation-Sar-e-Aeena Nawa-i-Waqt
http://www.nawaiwaqt.com.pk/E-Paper/Lahore/2009-08-27/page-11/detail-5
Time to go after MQM. Why? Did they have a “encounter” with P M L – Nawaz Sharif Butt?
I am not a supporter of MQM thugs/criminals, but is it a coincidence that mbemari is renting out his pen against MQM now?
The MQM leadership has no association with the Karachi and Hyderabad public. They are a bunch of crooks and creation of notorious pakistani agencies. Insha Allah, with the help of this judiciary and sincere politicians like Imran Khan, we will be able to nip this evil(Altaf and Musharaf) in the bud. In Imrans visit to sydney, he promised that he wont give up his follow up against Altaf in London. Now is the best time to tighten up rope around him. He has long been enjoying that lavish life at the cost of poor Karachi and Sindhi Pakistanies. Now If Nawaz Sharif is really sincere to country, he should also come up and tell the reality about this MQM mafia. May Allah help our nation to come out of this turmoil of sincere leadership.
@just ice
I dont know what you are talking about.
I have said this numersous times, stop telling me Altaf is a thug or killer.
I DONT CARE ABOUT MQM OR ALTAF!!!
I am not an MQM kaarkun!!!!
I care about the prime minister of Pakistan who could have stopped this illegal operation but he did not!!!!!!!!!
Please dont repeat the same lines you have been repeating about Altaf because that does not answer my question and I dont care about that either.
My question is, when this whole “illegal” army operation was taking place, what was prime minister of Pakistan doing? What was Nawaz Shareef, the prime minister, doing on those days?? Prime Minister of Pakistan was the ONLY person who had consitutional and legal power to stop this operation. Did he try to use his constitutional muscle to stop it? YES or NO ?? We dont know the answer of this basic basic question.
You are not answering my question.
I ask what was Prime Minister doing during the days when there were street battles fought in Karachi and you tell me Altaf is a killer. You tell me, does it make any sense?
How does Altaf being a killer justify Nawaz Shareef the prime minister not doing anything about an illegal army operation???
@Muhammad Usman
I think you do not read my posts carefully. You may not be a shareef supporter. I take my words back but I did respond to your question. I said ” I agree with you “. Bring all those generals to the court. Review our intelligence agencies meddling in politics in parliament or take it to court, whatever is appropriate.
About recording, I gave you clues where to get the proof. Read jang coverage and investigative reports by Kamran Khan in Jang newspaper who quote foreign officials who were peresent in the summit. Dig Jang archives and you will find the proof. However, this an off-topic discussion. Anthony Zeni will offcourse not quote that in his book, because it illegal to record such breifings. I ask you again to dig jang archives. This is a separate topic.
WTF !!..my comment showed up and then removed by the invisible hand
@ bsobaid
Onus is on you my friend to prove your comment. Because i have not seen any report like this. i am a regualr reader of newspaper specially jang.
kamran khan is not at all reliable source. he is mouth piece of establishment—-
if you are saying some thing you should have credible source of that.
the fact is mush / aziz / mahmood planned and executed kargil without approval of civilain authority. when they ere in trouble they beg for prime minister help[. what should a prime minsiter do-in situation when soldiers were dying— country was under attack. i think for me greatest achievement of sharieef was statesman ship at that time for ceasefire with the help of cli nton.
regarding 1992 operation after watching 3-4 programs in which brig billa imtiaz uttered his ZAMEER KI AWAZ…. did you not listen to him compleetly if you believe his one statement . believe his other statement as weel.
he said prime minister was not aware of M Q M specific operation this was asif nawaz, gen naseer who planned and execute dthis. if theu give breifing to prime minister there are torcher cell., trget killings , swaping of orisioners between warring factions and say these are credible after the implementation of operation, what is prime ministe rsupposed to do.
your fav ourite brig imtiaz also said according to him 20% tortur ceels were actual ansd peopel were killing —– do you believe him or not.
ispr—- brig asif haroon arranged a press conference claiming some thing—- did civilian leadership asked him to do this press conference.
your faviurte brig imtiaz also said —- president ishaq khan and asif nwaz janjua want to t dislodge civilain government.
What you are not trying to understand i guess intentionally this was all done by fauji janta.
you are trying to save the culprits and doing politic
I LEAVE furhter comments after your tabsra,
@ bsobaid
no foreign news paper claim what you are saying about kargil.
you should have the guts to say you are just trying to fire in air—–
MQM mna supported no confidence against PPP 1989 govt on the advice of agencies.
why did mqm voted aginst ppp .
this is the time if any one support democratic forces—-
if you keep protecting Mush THE EVIL then you are part of problem
@Mohammad Usman
“he said prime minister was not aware of MQM specific operation this was asif nawaz, gen naseer who planned and execute dthis. if theu give breifing to prime minister there are torcher cell., trget killings , swaping of orisioners between warring factions and say these are credible after the implementation of operation, what is prime ministe rsupposed to do.
”
Prime Minister was not aware of MQM specific operation? Prime Minister has to be a mad, dumb and deaf man to be “unaware” of this “MQM specific operation” in which hundreds of innocent civilians ( who had nothing to do with MQM or politics) were getting killed on the streets of Karachi. So you are saying just like Zardari gave NAwaz Shareef dhoka, similarly, those generals gave NAwaz Shareef dhoka as well? What kind of a person Nawaz is? Anyone can come and give this allah mian kee gaey “dhokaa” ??
Usman you seem to suggest that Nawaz Shareef later approved this operation after getting briefings from army. ok, but I have not heard N-League saying this yet. You are probably being more pious than the bishop?
So, in the end, what you are saying is this:
* Operation was started without PM being aware of it
* After operation was started PM was made fool by giving false briefings
* Based on those false briefings, Nawaz Shareef DID NOT DO ANYTHING to stop the operation. He instead supported it, regardless of the fact that army did not seek his approval on starting this operation and hundreds of innocent civilians got killed in the process.
right?
Although I have not heard N-League politician saying that they were given false briefings and Nawaz Shareef later supported this operation based on those false briefings. All N-League people are saying there were just “unaware” of this whole thing.
So if this is all true, why this whole media including this article by mbokhair is focusing on Altaf Hussain? Should we not ask questions from army then? Should we also not ask questions from Nawaz Shareef?? No one is asking any questions from NAwaz Shareef. I ask why not???
If what you are saying happened in reality, what is stopping NAwaz Shareef from saying so?
People are asking why did Nawaz Shareef did not do anything to stop the operation.
Why is Nawaz Shareef not saying, he did not do anything to stop the operation because army nee “dhooka” day diaa and because of that I, NAwaz Shareef, supported army in this operation.
Simple as that. That was my whole question. Why did NS not do anything about this illegal army operation and according to you, the anwer is, army ne Nawaz Shareef ko dhooka day diaa. Fair enough.
However, I do wonder, in all these years when NAwaz Shareef has said numerous times he will set up an investigation into Kargill operation because he was “kept in dark” why did he never say any such thing about Karachi operation? probably because he supported the operation and he still thinks it was a valid operation regardless of all those innocent lives lost in the operation???
I rest my case.
@ bs obaid
i dont think the question you are asking can be answered without knowing the details of everyone involved so answer to your question cannot be yes or no.
the point you are making seem to be very cleverly designed to point one person at fault and that is indication of your motive to be mailcious(mqm)
if you want to have a serious and meaningful discussion then stop cherry picking and expand your horizon,
I am done with your bs obaid
sorry but you dont seem to have a point
@Mohammad Usman
“if you keep protecting Mush THE EVIL then you are part of problem”
Who is protectin g Musharraf here? No one has stopped N-League to present a resolution in parliament. No one has stopped N-League to go to supreme court.
Since, Gen Naseer Akhtar and other army generals gave “dhooka” to NAwaz Shareef, why is Nawaz Shareef not going to court against them? let alone giving a single statement in newspaper against those generals. Telling Farooq Sattar is Landhi jail that he made a mistake does not count.
Now that Usman, you have answered my previous quetion, please answer another question:
a) How Brig Imtiaz’s TV interview is is stopping N-League to file a petition against Musharraf in Supreme Court?
b) How Brig Imtiaz’s TV interview is is stopping N-League to table a resolution in parliament?
People say this issue has distracted nation’s attention from Musharraf but I say Musharraf’s fate will be decided in Supreme Court and Parliament, not by “nation’s attention”.
Qadam barhao Nawaz Shareef hum tumharay saath hein!
@just ice said:
“i dont think the question you are asking can be answered without knowing the details of everyone involved so answer to your question cannot be yes or no.”
So my question why did Nawaz Shareef did not do anything to stop an illegal army operation can not be answered by Nawaz Shareef, who lives in Raiwand, because, according to you, “we need to know the details of everyone who was involved” ???
Sorry, this reason does’nt fly well, but you have made your point and I did also, so I respect and agree with your decision to stop this debate, as I said in my previous post directed to Usman “I rest my case”.
The propaganda is on!
http://www.jang.com.pk/jang/aug2009-daily/27-08-2009/col8.htm
@bsobaid
why did Nawaz Shareef did not do anything to stop the operation.
why did Nawaz Shareef did not do anything to stop the operation.
why did Nawaz Shareef did not do anything to stop the operation.
You are ranting this in each of your comments, don’t you have anything else to say. Everybody knows why he didn’t stop the operation. Karachi was peaceful again after the operation, but hooligans are again on rampant now. We need another operation at much larger scale, but this time it must start from London.
@adil, I am ranting because no one is giving me answers.
So you are saying, Nawaz Shareef supported the operation, rite? Why is Nawaz Shareef and his party not saying this? They have’nt said this yet. All they say is we were “kept in dark” and by that I believe they imply that they would have stopped the operation if they were not kept in dark, rite? because if it was a successful operation, only a fool will not take credit for it.
@bsobaid
yes i agree that if we need to debate we have to talk about everyone involved and their role and not cherry pick.
like if we want to investigate a crime we want to know every detail of even the witness’s background(to rue out professional lying) although who may not be directly related to that crime; instead of cherry picking one particular person in the whole seen; and also try to understand the motive of everyone involved.
This is exactly my point and again i rest my case too.
@Adil
we absolutely donot need another operation.we can do better.we can actually do a lot better.
we can give confidence and security to the people of karachi to become witness of the atrocities of mqm and that will solve the problem to a very large extent if at the same time the decisions are made fast and swift by the judiciary
@bsobaid
I will be be brief. A little pressed for time.
- As the constitution stood in 1992, the Prime Minister was NOT the Supreme Commander of Army. The President was. Ghulam Ishaq Khan was constitutionally responsible for commanding the Army into battle operations. We all know how powerful he was.
- With your frequent questions, you are beginning to be like Uncle Kyon. Asking all and sundry why NS can’t appear on the Hamid Mir show
میں کس کے ھاتھ پر اپنا لہو تلاش کروں
I keed, I keed, I jokh, I jokh
A counter question:
Why was PM Benazir not able to stop the ISI moves against her government? And why was she not able to visit Kahuta? Why did PM Benazir have to accept the Foreign Minster and Finance Minister who were handpicked by the Establishment in 1988?
Why did Benazir award Tamgha-e-Jamhooriat to Aslam Beg when he was the one leading the intrigue against her government ?
Curious Minds Want to Know….
@mbokhari
let me respond from bs obaid
the questions you are asking does not answer my question and that is why nwaz sharif did not do any thing and why does he not show up in hamid mirs show(only) and admit this.
What does Brig. Imtiaz’s plots and corruption have anything to do with 92 operation. Is anyone challenging his claims???
Brig Imtiaz said, “there were no Jinnah Pur maps”.
Is Nawaz Shareef or anyone else claimining Brig Imtiaz is lying and there were maps found???
Gen Nasser Akhtar calls MQM “as our brothers”
Has anyone disputed or challenged his claim?
Tell me one single claim of Brig Imtiaz related to 92 operation that anyone is disputing. I have’nt heard N-Leaug saying Brig. Imtiaz is lying. Brig may have done corruption. File a petition in Supreme court. Go ahead, who is stopping you but how does that effect claims about 92 operation?
and as far as Musharraf trial is concerned, I ask the same question again
a) How Brig Imtiaz’s TV interview is is stopping N-League to file a petition against Musharraf in Supreme Court?
b) How Brig Imtiaz’s TV interview is is stopping N-League to table a resolution in parliament?
People say this issue has distracted nation’s attention from Musharraf but I say Musharraf’s fate will be decided in Supreme Court and Parliament, not by “nation’s attention”.
@mbokhari again
now you have got the real answer from mr obaid
i had only posted the short version the bottom line
enjoy the longer version
@mbokhari said
“As the constitution stood in 1992, the Prime Minister was NOT the Supreme Commander of Army. The President was. Ghulam Ishaq Khan was constitutionally responsible for commanding the Army into battle operations. We all know how powerful he was”
So you are saying army did not need Prime Minister’s approval to launh an army operation in the country?? President may be the supreme commander, but he acts on Prime Minister’s advice. Cabinet and Prime Minister approve such operations.
@mbokhari further said
“Why was PM Benazir not able to stop the ISI moves against her government?”
I dont know. Do I care? how is it realted to 92 operation. Even if she was not able to stop ISI, she atleast tried to and later she claimed ISI did all that. On the other hand, why did NAwaz Shareef never said “ISI ne dhooka day diaa”. Nawaz Shareef never said that in past 17 years until now. BB, on the other hand, pointed towards ISI involvement when ISI was acting against the government and when ISI brought her government down. She said that right away, without waiting for Brig. Imtiaz to give an interview after 17 years.
@mbokhair further said
“Why did Benazir award Tamgha-e-Jamhooriat to Aslam Beg when he was the one leading the intrigue against her government ?”
I dont know, do I care? how is that related to 92 operation? she probably did that because Aslam Baig had a chance to delcare martial law but he did not and because BB did not believe in personal vendetta?? or may be not, whatever the reason may be, how is that related to 92 operation?
@bsobaid
I am sure GIK followed this to the letter when he dismissed the first PMLN government.
This is the real gem in your post: “I dont know. Do I care?”
My response exactly to your question “Why did NS not stop the operation”.
I dont know.
Do I care? Not really.
The only way we can find anything out is through the court. Not by having Nawaz Sharif appearing on the Hamid Mir show.
But I surge ahead of myself. Perhaps you suggest we replace the judiciary by one big Hamid Mir show? Aha! Smart move! I can see Hamid Mir in the CJ’s chair taking aim and throwing his gavel when he sees Wasi Zafar’s ball tampering action, shaking his head and going, “yeh kya bay-hayai hai!”.
It would be an act of great injustice with poor Wasi Zafar (he has the seven year itch) but at least it would be entertainment. I suppose that’s the kind of justice/entertainment you are looking for with your farmaishi program of NS on Hamid Mir Show.
Since you argue against punishment, which can only be awarded by a court, the only sentence that can be carried out on the whole nation, will be an insufferable episode of yet another Capital Talk. My eyes! They burn!
Hey, I know! Why don’t Nawaz Sharif and Altaf Hussain both appear on the Hamid Mir show? I wonder. I really wonder, will Altaf travel to Pakistan to appear live? I doubt it. You see, the bil batoRi Benazir must have drawn a line with salt along the geographical borders of Pakistan before her death. I suppose that’s why Altaf bhai, Pir Sahib London town, dreads to set foot on Pakistani soil. His skin burns within 20 nautical miles of the border. I suggest calling Pir Pinjar forthwith to clear the line of salt along the border so that Altaf bhai can land in Karachi and appear on the Hamid Mir show.
(What do you have against Talat? Uh..Don’t answer that.)
میرے پیارے ہم وطنوں بلخصوص م بخاری صاحب کچھ آپ کے دل عزیز محترم قبلہ نواز شریف صاحب کے دامن پر حرف سا آنے لگا ہے – کچھ عرض کرینگے ک کیا وجہہ بنی کے فرشتہ صفت ہستی نے ٣٥ لاکھ روپے میں اپنا ایمان بیچ دیا – خدارا جواب دیجئے گا – آئیں بائیں شائیں سے تسللی نہیں ہو پی گی – فقط آپ کا حقیر قاری.-
معاف کیجئے گا – ملاحظہ ہو م بخاری صاحب –
thenews.jang.com.pk/updates.asp?id=85837
http://www.jang.com.pk/jang/aug2009-daily/26-08-2009/u3523.htm
@ justice
I agree we should not kill innocent people. But the problem won’t be solved by judiciary alone. Unless we exterminate this Rat holding the red passport (which doesn’t suite to his personality, it looks like he borrowed it from someone for a picture, he should be holding a JHARO in his hand CHOHRA) and his cronies.
@bsobaid
I am least bother whether NS supported the operation or not. This all episode of operation was blossomed up to divert the attention of nation from Mushi trial.
It was pre planned and Dr Danish is the main character who staged all this in his scripted programme on ARY. It happens when you give USTRA to an idiot. He should be doing programme on Hockey. I don’t know who asked him to do programmes on politics.
Yar main MQM ka hooo please yeh non issue hain iss par baat band kerdu aur altaf bhai app karachi aker humary dukh bantoo bijaye london main maza kernay k please karachi aoo khud hi tu app kehtay hoo hum apke bachay hain tu kyu dor hoo humsey
hum logo k pass bijli pani roti kuch nahi aue app fone calls par sabak detay hoo bass kero tumhay ALLAH RASOOL ka wasta bass kerdu yeh sab dramay Altaf bhai apko itna khayal hain tu aoo karachi apne logo main london ki tafreeh kerna chordo
محترم قاری لئیق صدیق صاحب
بسم اللّٰہ الرحمن الرحیم
نحمدہ ونصلی علٰی رسولہ الکریم ط
اسلام علیکم ورحمۃ اللہ وبرکاتہ۔
اولین و آخرین حضور خاتم النبیین افضل المرسلین صلی اللہ تعالی علیہ وسلم
سیدالانبیاء محمد صلی اللہ تعالٰی علیہ وسلم
اما بعد
پینتیس لاکھ میں سامان بیچا یا ایمان بیچا۔ کس کا ایمان بیچا؟ کہاں بیچا؟ کس نے خریدا؟ ایمان کا لنڈا بازار کدھر لگتا ھے؟
لنڈا بازار کا لندن سے کیا تعلق ھے؟ لندن کا لنگور سے کیا تعلق ھے؟ لنگور اگر لندن کے لنڈا بازارمیں لونڈوں کی وردی کا چورن بیچے تو کتنا بھاؤ لگے گا۔
یہ سب تحقیق طلب امور ھیں۔ امید ھے قبلہ قاری صاحب بعد از مسواک اور سونے سے پہلے ان اہم فقہی مسائل پر غور فرمائیں گے۔
فقط، فق اط ، وغیرہ وغیرہ
امام م۔ بخاری، فقہہ بخاریہ ، رجسٹرڈ
پس تحریر: قبلہ قاری ،مکاری سے دکانداری نہیں چلتی۔ اگر ایجنسیاں قابل بھروسہ نھیں ھیں، بوجہ دروغ گوئی در امر جناح پور، تو نواز شریف پر بہتان باندھنے میں ایجنسیوں کو کیا امر مانع ھے۔ باالفاظ دیگر ، اور ناظرین، قارئین، ظالمین آخرین کے لیے باالغتہ الانگریزیہ کہے دیتے ھیں۔
If the ISI lied about Jinnahpur, why would they be telling the truth about Nawaz Sharif. I detet failure in logic.
I also detect FAIL.
Altaf bhai wapas aoo muqadmo k samna kero hum apke sath hain aur jo paisey london khruch kertay hoo karachi la ker shuda k khandano ko doo ta ke dua millay apko.
Altaf Hussain murdabad muhajir kaum zindabad.
LONDON walay london rahay hum yaha tum waha
@Kashif
Ah….”Jinah Pur” You are right
MQM is a terorrist organization again you are right.
Jinah Pur in itself is very conflicting and contradictory NAME for a terrorist organization which is not loyal to Pakistan created by Jinah.
Things would be more in line if it were GM Syed Pur or Mumtaz Bhutto Pur or Pir pagara Pur or Sasi Pleejo Pur.
They are terrorist alright but perhaps theres some substance behind turning them terrorist worth need attention.
One man really flogged all of you.
Admin Pk Politics.
Sir ji dont underestimate the standard of your viewers please encourage other talented people to come into journalism than not some puppets who probably took a very long time to figure out translations.
Nation’s attention plays a vital role in decisions of Supreme Court and Parliament.
No @mbokahri
I said this “I dont know. Do I care?” ” because this question is irrelevant to 1992 operation and I did not want you to go off-topic. Ofcourse I care about it if you ask me otherwise, but you tell me :
does it matter why BB gave Aslam BEg tamgha-e-jamhooriat when it comes to 92 operation????
and if you say you dont care why Nawaz Shareef did not stop 1992 operation then, allow me, you are dead wrong and misguided by your own political affinity.
Why on earth will you not care about Nawaz Shareef not stopping this operation????
I dont understand how can you even say that. He was the prime minister and the only person who had legal right to halt the operation. If ISI or army did’nt listen to him then SAY SO!!!! why dont NAwaz Shareef or his N-Leage representative say that on TV?? MQM says it all the time. Agencies did all that. Why not N-League is saying this? Why does’nt N-League say, GHQ did not listen to prime minister and listened to IShaaq Khan instead? Why did they not say that in past 17 years even once? They said that about Kargill, why not Karachi operation?
Again, you need a judicial comission on somethng that is disputed. Such as, Altaf Hussain says MQM party-workers were innocent. Nawaz Shareef and army think they were not innocent and the operation was justified. So yes, there is a dispute and a court needs to decide that.
On the other hand, there is no dispute surrounding Nawaz Shareef’s inaction over an illegal military operation. Nawaz Shareef himself is saying he was “kept in dark”. Army is saying “he was kept in dark” and probably Altaf Hussain is also not disputing this fact. So no disputer there. However, during the days of operation when everyone knew it was taking place on ground, what did Nawaz Shareef did to stop it??? This is the question. Feel free to setup a judicial comission, but this question can be answered in a Hamid MEer or whatever TV show. It is simple, NAwaz Shareef can say one of two things:
a) I tried my best to stop the operation but ISI did not listen
b) I did not try to stop the operation because army did the right thing
Now you can have judicial comission investigating his either claim, but he is not even clarifying his position. All he says is “I was kept in dark” aray baaba, maan liaa aap ko andheray mein rakha, laikin jab subah hogaee tou aap ne kiaa kiaa? iss ko tou jawab dein naa?
MQM has made its position cleared a thousand times over 92 operation. They say it was unjust and illegal and illegally targeted MQM. They will say the same on Hamid MEer show or any other show. If you want to verify the claim, feel free to set up a judicial comission, I am all for it but NAwaz Shareef and his party is’nt even presenting his case or clarifying his position. This is my whole problem.
@adil,
Please read my previos post about Mush’s trial. I am reposting parts of it for you.
a) How Brig Imtiaz’s TV interview is is stopping N-League to file a petition against Musharraf in Supreme Court?
b) How Brig Imtiaz’s TV interview is is stopping N-League to table a resolution in parliament?
People say this issue has distracted nation’s attention from Musharraf but I say Musharraf’s fate will be decided in Supreme Court and Parliament, not by “nation’s attention”.
عرض کیا تھا ک آئیں بائیں شائیں نہ کیجئے گا – مگر کیا کہتے ہیں پنجابی میں بقول عمران خان کے کہ بندر ہووے تے چھال نہ مارے – حضور کچھ لنک بیجھے تھے آپ کی خدمت میں ان کو دیکھ لیتے تو لنگور سے لنڈا بازار کا اور لندن سے جدّہ کا تعلق آپ کی سمجھ میں ضرور آجاتا – آپ کی تحریر سے اندازہ ہوتا تھا کے کوئی چو ل ہی لکھ رہا ہے کبھی عمران خان ک پیچھے پر جاتا ہے کبھی کیسے اور کے متحدہ تو ویسے ہے قبل ذکر نہیں ہے میرے لیے – مگر آپ کی ذہنی حالت کا سہی اندازہ آپ کے جوابات دیکھ ک ہوتا ہے – خدارا ایسے حرکتیں کریں ک مستقبل میں جب اس ویب سا یت کا کو اپنی تحقیقاتی خبروں کا حوالہ دینا ہو تو آپ جیسے ذہنی مریض کی وجہہ سے شرمندگی کا سامنا نہ کرنا پڑے – لنک دوبارہ ملاحظہ ہوں -
thenews.jang.com.pk/updates.asp?id=85837
http://www.jang.com.pk/jang/aug2009-daily/26-08-2009/u3523.htm
@adil said “Nation’s attention plays a vital role in decisions of Supreme Court and Parliament”
You are saying court gives decision according to public mood rather than law of the land???
obviously, this notion is dead wrong.
Also, this case was brought up recently and N-LEague had enough time to present the bil in the parliament or to file a petition in the court. They even promised to table a resolution in the parliament, then I dont know what happened after Mark Lyl’s visit. By the way, N-League has stepped back from its promise and now they have made it clear they wont present the bill in the parliament and will use “other means” and “public pressue”. This reminds me of Mulla Nasseruddin.
One night, where there was chaudhween kaa chand, Mulla Naseeruddin was looking for something on the street.
His neighour asked what is he looking for.
Mulla said, he lost his keys.
Neighbour asked, where you dropped it
Mulla said, in my bedroom
Neighbour asked, why are you looking on the street then?
Mulla said, kionkay there is moonlight outside and it is dark in the bedroom
How Brig Imtiaz’s TV interview is is stopping N-League to file a petition against Musharraf in Supreme Cour
Petition has already been filed by zafar ali shah I reckon.
@adil I guess bsobaid was referring to resolution in the parliament against 17th amendment. PML N has not putting stress on that lately and I believe that there is some sort of deal going on.
قاری صاحب آپ تو ناراض ھو کر غیر پارلیمانی زبان پر اتر آئے۔۔۔چچ چچ ۔۔۔ چلیں منہ سے پان نکال کر غصہ تھوک دیں ۔۔۔عرض یہ ھے کہ ایک سرکاری ایجنسی کے سابق اہلکار نے اسی ھفتے اپنے جھوٹ اور دروغ گوئی کا برملا اقرار کیا ھے۔ اس اقرار کے پیچھے کیا عوامل کار فرما ھیں ،مثلا مشرف کا احتساب وغیرہ،یہ ایک الگ بحث ھے۔
مگر یہ سچ ھے کہ جناح پور سکینڈل نے ایجنسیوں اور فوج کی کریڈیبیلٹی اور ساکھ کے ساتھ وھی کیا ھے جو غنڈوں نے رضیہ کے ساتھ کیا تھا۔ اس ماحول میں ایجنسیوں کے مرتب کردہ ایک جھوٹ کے پلندے کی حیثیت پر کاہ سے کم ھے۔
اصل مسئلہ مشرف ، تارا مسیح اور بان کی اس رسی کا ھے جو سابق صدر ناٹ لگا کر عالم بالا جائیں گے۔ نواز شریف چور ھو گا، ھوتا رھے، لیکن مشرف نے دستور توڑا، عدلیہ توڑی اور اسکے احتساب کے راستے میں آنے والا ھر باگڑ بلا مشرف کا حامی اور پاکستان کا دشمن ھے۔
مجھے خوشی ہوتی اگر آپ یہ کہتے کہ حمام میں سب ہی ننگے ہیں – بھر حال مسلہ مشرّف کا ہو یا ضیاء کا نواز کا ہو یا الطاف کا سزا ہر اس شخص کو ملے گی جس نے اس ملک کو اپنی لونڈی سمجھا – وہ وقت دور نہیں جب یہ اقتدار کے بھوکے اقتدار سے اپنے انجام کو پوھچیں گے – پھر کوئی لندن جاسکے گا نہ جدّہ اور دبئی – اور حضور آخر میں ایک گزارش بہت ادب سے جب تک ہم ایک دوسرے سے تعصب نہیں ختم کرینگے یہ گدھ ہمیں نوچتے رہینگے اس لیے صوبائی اور لسانی تعصب سے بھر آجانے کا وقت آچکا ہے – میں انگلش بہتر لکھ سکتا ہوں لیکن مقصد صرف اردو میں گفتگو کرنا تھا – رہا سوال پان کا تو میں تو کھاتا نہیں آپ کہیں تو آپ ک لیے بجھوادوں – وسلام
@bsobaid
I knew that you will ask that question, in fact I was about to explain it to you, in that comment but I left it to your understanding to save my time. But alas I have to reduce the stroke life of my keyboard to explain it now. My friend or uncle (according to age) people’s attention doesn’t mean people’s mood. Of course Supreme Court doesn’t make the decision on people’s mood but it takes action on the vital issues concerning people’s attention. Mushraff trial was a (and is) vital issue before all this operation drama was created, and we can now hear the voices asking supreme court to take action on operation as well. So this is all Topi Darama by MQM. Musharraf is using them very intelligently, he is trying to put MQM, NS and Army against each other.If NS says he wasn’t informed about the operation or he tried to halt it but the army didn’t listened to him, it may create uneasiness between army and NS. And Musharraf will be benefited of it.
آواز خلق کو نقارہ خدا سمجھو
@mbokhair,
How is 1992 operation case is preventing Nawaz Shareef to present a bill in the parliament?
SC has asked parliament to resolve issue with article 6 in 4 months. When will N-League present a bill to resolve it in the parliament?? and how does Brig. Imtiaz’s interview has stopped N-League parliamentarian to do so??
Brig’s interview might be distracting, but who is asking N-League to get distracted? go ahead and present the bill. No one is asking N-League to get distracted bhai.
or after 4 months they are going to say:
” Brig. Imtiaz ne apnay interview se distract kara kay dhokaa day diaa”
aisay leader kaa kiaa keejeay jo hurr aik se dhooka khaa jaaata hai??
@ BSOBAID
TALK WITH SENSE
For your kind information Syed zafar ali shah of N league has filed a petition in supreme court for trial of musharaf——– GOT THE ANSWER.
The resolution is not tabled in the parliament as the party fo sharef has 91 members . so how can that start the procedings.
Regarding brig imtiaz either you believe his whole ZAMERR KI AWAZ or you want to be selective.
If all the agencies provide proof to govt that including isi, ib, police that some one has indulged in wrong doing and proofs are already shown to press—– what shoudl a govrt do.stop operation.
why are you supporting army operation in swat. same army is giving breifings.. do press conference— claiming capturing dehsat gurd—- is the govt stopiing the operation that innocent people are killed.
your point of view is irrational and non debatable,
By thw way no answer on your ridicilous claim of kargil tapping. you know what whose tape eas caught —- it was mush talking to gen aziz—–
QUADI TEHREEK ki masomeat dekhan 2 times nwaz league or ppp se dhoka khya.
@adil said
“If NS says he wasn’t informed about the operation or he tried to halt it but the army didn’t listened to him, it may create uneasiness between army and NS. And Musharraf will be benefited of it.”
N-League is today’s biggest anti-establishment party (after signing maafi nama). Since when they started to care about army?? They want true democracy in the country. They want army’s role to end in the politics, then why are they using doctrine of necessity?
If army intervenes in Musharraf case, do a long march. N-League is an anti-establishment party with 79% popular support. darr kiss baat kaa hai???
qadam barhao nawaz shareef
hum tumharay saath hein
yaa phirr N-League kee mardaana taqat kaa raaz ISI kee funding mein chupaa hai??
Whatever it may be, why scared of army? why nazarya-e-zaroorat?? present a bill in the parliament, if army intervenes, then
Long March!!!
or do a million march with “thousands” of people
@bsobaid
He may be anti establishment now, and army is keeping itself on a distance as well. When everything is going smooth, who are these people, who trying to drag army again?
Million March or Long March is not Khala gi ka Ghar, jab moo uthaya chalay gaye.
We don’t need Long March to solve every problem.
I don’t know why NS is not tabling the resolution in the parliament, may be he thinks it might be failed, and don’t want to show the world that our parliament cannot pass a resolution against a dictator. Save the embarrassment and jug hansai, it may make Musharraf case more stronger. After all there are so many Rats there in the parliament.
@Usman
“The resolution is not tabled in the parliament as the party fo sharef has 91 members . so how can that start the procedings. ”
Does’nt matter. Look what N-League did to Q-League in Punjab assembly. They can do the same in National assembly, what is the big deal??
and even if their resolution fails to pass, they can atleast say they did their part and other parties saved Musharraf. This way, doodh kaa doodh aur paani kaa paani hojaey gaa.
If petition has already been filed in SC, then what is the problem? SC will take its notice. How will Brig Imtiaz’s interview effect that?
I suppose PLMN is not tabling the motion becasue once it failed and it definitely will fail without support from PPP, it will give a greatest weapon in the hands of opponents for this motion that will of the people (parliment) does not want it. PPP will simply say we want harmony in the country and do not want to go into this issue at this time.
So I guess PLMN has filed a personal petition through Zafar Ali Shah, although it is most likely to be rejected by Supreme Court as you can only file a constitutional petition in the SC if your basic human rights have been effected and in this case Zafari Ali Shah has not been effected in personal capacity.
Please let everyone know if there are any other motives for not moving this motion in the parliment.
@bsobaid
If reolution is defeated in the parliament then no law can start the trial.. are you stupid.
if q lwague support the resolution it will not fget the majority.
you do what ever you want mush kutta will be punished.
i dont care if sharef is pak oe saf —
if he can do this – this will take our nation to its destiny.
civilian govt free of fauji janta.
@ bsobaid
kargil audio bhai log kahan ha—– SAWAL YEH HA?
@bsobaid
said
“N-League is today’s biggest anti-establishment party (after signing maafi nama)”
that is the motive,absurd logic of cherry picking, clearly tunneling vision and the intention I was talking about .
Just to let you know and show your tricks.
@Usman
Janab, supreme court cheenkh cheenkh kay kah rahee hai, dont drag SC into this issue. Parliament should decide it itself.
http://jang.com.pk/jang/aug2009-daily/27-08-2009/u3611.htm
Zafar Ali Shah’s petition has been returned back to the petitioner and is asked to take issue to the parliament.
No law is starting musharraf trial anyways!!!
SC has been saying it again and again and again, parliament should try Musharraf.
N-League should do what it has been doing in Punjab parliament. Horse trading!!
Buy Q-League
Balcoh parliamentarians
FATA (always up for the best bid)
and do it!!!
Street protest and jumping up and down in Hamid MEer show and having ANsar Abbasic write “investigative” reports again government wont achieve anything!!!
@ET,
Other motives for N-League to not table a motion in parliament are as follows:
*Mark Lyl Grant
*Richard Halbrooke
*Kind Abdullah
*General Kiyani
If not article 6, then why not Bugti.
Who is stopping N-League to file a petition against Bugti’s murder??
I know why, because army as an institution was involved in Bugti’s murder, not just Musharraf. N-League dushmani is with Musharraf, not with the army.
Not even SC, or parliament, lets just start a parliamentary hearing against Laal Masjid or Baloch operation or Bugti murder.
N-League chairs many parliamentary committee, why dont start it there???
@bs obaid again
i am a relative of an innocent civilian who died in 92 military action.i know NS is punjabi and will not support me he is a bad person.i care less for him.
my question is to AH who gets our vote and claims to understand our problem and raise a voice for our rights
why did he collaborate with my relative killers over and over again?why did he betray all the urdu speaking families by conspiring with the killers
Is AH my traitor,why do we vote for him what should we do to bring him back
@bsobaid
Indian people do not like any of the four people you have listed, so you obiously are an Indian.
What is your real name, Vikram or Vijay?
Go to your Indian sites buddy, this is a Pakistani political forum.
@adil
again i would not be in favor a military operation because of collateral damage and innocent civilans being killed.i am also aware that army will be corrupted in the cities which will have long term negative impacts.
I would want closely monitored police action transparent enough to get people to go up to witness stand and tell the truth.
i know people who be one of them but they dont feel secure enough since these(mqm) people will kill him and his family
Yaar what is the problem with @bullshiitobaid? Did someone he love die in ’92 operation?
Shireen Mazari and the program host say they both saw XE (Blackwater) in F6 Islamabad. Roadblocks and all. That they are coming here without visa or documentations. She also says that the 1000 plus marines are in Islamabad for purposes other than protection of the embassy.
She points towards the location of USSR embassies at prize land in Afghanistan and Central Asian countries. The programme is on News 1.
@justice
Yes I am against the killing of innocent people in the name of collateral damage, but it can be done with better intelligence and with specific targets. Once we are done with this Kalia thing, everything will be settled down.
Lol,,hahahahahahaha.. yeh tareekh ka Tamacha ha.wo sub log jo ISI and Brig Imtiaz sey paisey laitey rehein hein ,,un key mounh per waqat ney siyahi mal di ha. Nawaz shreef,,Jamaat islami and other should ask appology from the nation,they are the traiters.Becoz of them pakistan is suffering.
@atruepakistani
you should mention mqm for 89 vote of no confidence as well.having said that the difference between amar bin hasham and omer bin khatab is that one remained with musharraf and the other with the people fighting musharraf
@adil
robust,precise and honest police action with swift justice.I totally agree just keep the army out of it directly.we can use their intelligence forces but on ground only police boots.It is very important and critical
@justice.its true,,but i only stress on shameful charecter of NS,Ji ans others including MQM.
Bsobaid appears to be an mqm terrorist chamcha, probably assigned to handle this website with a bunch of others from secretariat in London to aggressively pursue talking point “NS started 1992 operation”. I say God bless if he started. We need another one a much bigger one, as some of you say here, to eradicate terrorist mqm and all the other mafias in Karachi. There will be 100% support for it in Punjab, Pakhtoonkhwa, Balochistan, and interior Sindh and yes by the majority held hostage in Karachi.
For those who want to know how helpless and in the dark Pakistani PMs are against our so called establishment, the latest one is that Musharraf’s PM Shaukat Aziz recently pleaded complete ignorance regarding his part about November 3rd emergency and even dismissal of Judiciary.
@molvirpg
It seems that has been a good collection of Bhatta this year and London Secreteriat has hired a few educated idiots to defend Kali Matta.
Bagal Main Churi aur Munh Main Ram Ram.
@ET
Right on
I believe a cell has been created by this swelling cockroach (Kali Mata) with the duty and bhatta given to some lal baigs to monitor this website round the clock and reply every post on it to defend this neck less monster creature.
I think that we‘re not enough matured to face the realities of Pakistani Politics. It is often said and believed that Pakistani public has very poor memories. We actually don’t like Democracy, honesty and transparency… I have noticed that MQM is the only political entity which is being criticized by all the political forces in Pakistan and at times the then allies also feels restless even having collation. We have to be realistic that MQM inspite of all disliking is becoming a reality like ANP. History will take its course if our nation remained myopic. We shall move forward setting aside noises like Mr.10% ,Jinnahpur.Jag Punjabi Jag teri Pug no Laga Dagh,. What is going on in this point in time? Can we do something to save our country?
@mbokhari
I really like your style of writing and especially your sarcastic comments. However, I really failed to understand why and how can you deny the charge on NS that he took 3.5 million ruppees from ISI !
“”"If the ISI lied about Jinnahpur, why would they be telling the truth about Nawaz Sharif. I detet failure in logic.
I also detect FAIL.”"”
>>>
What Nawaz-League doing in last 12/13 years ?
Why didn’t the deny the charges before ?
BTW it’s not only Gen. Asad Durrani but also Gen. Aslam Baig and NS’ mentor Gen. Hamid Gul who have also accepted that money was disbursed amongst right-wing politicians and it was infact ISI which created IJI to counter PPP !
[...] trial but no success so guess so first the Saraiki provice fuss and now the new drama? This PKpolitics post (alternate link ) saves my time to explain in detail the reason why MQM is hell bent upon [...]
Nawaz shairf took 35 Lak money from the ISI in 1990 for election which is equivalent to 3 kror in today value.
How is he talking now?????????
Altaf khud kabhi british passport nahi chorray ga balkay British wale hee iss sey passport cheeen lain ge. Kitna khush hay saala hath main passport liye, shame on you, itnay loagoon ka khoon tairey sur pe hay, aakhrat ka passport banwata tu kitna acha tha.
Kitne din jiye ga tu badmaash,maut aagye tu aglay mint ka pata nahi chalay ga. Abhi bhi apni harkatoon se baaz nahi aaya, abhi bhi pata nahi kitnay maisoom loagoon ko qatal kerwaye ga tu ramzam ke baad.. Toaba Toaba
@molvirpg
You did’nt read my posts carefully. Yes, NS was “kept i n dark” when the operation was planned but how could he possibly be kept in dark when the operation was taking place on ground?? When hundreds of people were getting killed on the streets of KArachi? When rangers and police men were getting killed everyday??
How could he possibly be in dark??
My only question is, when he found out about the operation was taking place about which he was not informed or taken approval from, what did he do about it????
Did he support the operation?
Did he try to stop the operation but ISI would’nt listen?
Whatever the answer is, he should come forward and spell it out for the nation rather than getting all those journalists on his payroll to start a campiagn against MQM and to create ethnic tension in the country. Yes, many N-League supporter are increasingly making this issue an ethnic one. They are suggesting Musharraf and MQM are friends because they are both mohajir. This is rediculous and very very dangerous for the nation. N-League must realise it is essentially a Punjabi party, if it is a national party then how come Nawaz Shareef has’nt visited Sindh in about two years??? What kind of a national leader he is ?
Altaf Hussain do not have any support in Punjab yet, but atleast he is trying to expand in Punjab, Pakhtoonkhowa and Kashmir. What is Sher-e-Punjab doing ??
I’d highly recommend all N-Leaguers to NOT make this issue an ethnic one. We should raise above regionalism and ethnicism. N-League have demonstrated this tendency numerous times to stoop at the lower moral level possible in the face of a scandal that includes personal and family attacks (remember Salman Tasser family pictures??) and criticising one’s ethnic background. This must stop!!!!!
Another question, why such operations are demanded and take place only in smaller provinces?
I must give credit to PPP and MQM for staying away from exploiting ethnic divisions and violence. After analysis the media coverage and real face of N-Leaguers I wonder who is the real threat to Pakistan’s unity.
We need a leader who is charoon soboo kee zanjeer
rather than lahore raiwand kee zanjeer
I 100% support a trial on Musharraf along with other army generals involved in coup and emergency rule (no matter how much N-League try to defend other generals and intel agencies) and a judicial inquiry into 92 – 96 operations.
Intel agencies involvement in Pakistani politics must end!!!!!
IJI leaders must stop licking army boots.
I know almost every single political party have openly condemned intel agencies involvement in politics except N-League and even if they do criticise them, they do that in dhakay chupay alfaaz and try to blame individuals instead.
N-League journalists were the only ones who were going head over heels praising Kiyani when he bacame army chief (remember jang articles by Ataul Haq Qasmi and Ifan Siddiqui and others??)
Hypocracy thy name is N-League!
@bsobaid
Indian agents not welcome on this site. Vikram go back, you have lost your way.
Nawaz Shareef will loose his next election if he continues to live in the past. Instead of realising his mistakes and going forward he wants Musharraf’s trial. He is wasting his energies. Even his die hard supporters are loosing patience.
Due to recent revealations the whole politics have been changed. Many shareef and innocent faces are turning yellow and theier association with army and agencies in the past. Saeeduzama Siddiquie a close friend of Nawaz has disclosed the list of people recieved money from agencies and Nawaz is one of the receipient.
Now we have to decide who will throw the first stone.
@bsobaid
You have blackened pages answering this blog with redundant litany of why NS did not know or stop 1992 Operation that killed a few mqm terrorists. You have been sufficiently answered by some good folks here.
Fact: Mqm is a terrorist organization led by a murderer and killer terrorist Altaf Hussain. This fact is crystal clear to CIA, MI6, and MI5 and of course ISI. He was created by ISI under Zia, took shelter under RAW and moved on to his ultimate and current bosses which is CIA, MI5 and MI6. They will continue to use him for their purposes in Pakistan. He is going to live and die in their clutches.
Those with no roots in Pakistan, nowhere to go back to in Pakistan, find becoming a foreign power’s agent, as the only vehicle to fulfill their nefarious ambitions. Kali Mata and Tabalchi see this as their only option.
@molvirpg
Altaf Hussain Indian terrorist.
ANP separatist
Bramdagh Bugti traitor
PPP security risk
Bass ail Nawaz Shareef hai Sher-e-Lahore aur Lahore Badshah sacha pakistani.
Poeple like you have been distributing ghaddari certificates for past 60 years and look where it has brought us to.
Guys, Nature Has No Mercy.
corrupt politician and impotent nation.
Pakistan is in mess.
I have lived in Karachi in the late sixties. I was not born or raised in that city. First sight I fell in love with that city. It was a city of love peace, diversity and so much more that I can write a book about it. Since the beginning of this terrorist Altaf monster and his mqm Karachi has degenerated into a city of blood, gore, a killing field full of hatred, insecurity, thuggary, robbery, no go areas, and a permanent state of violence. I have been in and out of that city in the nineties and couple of times since 2000. It has changed for worst. I have been insulted and gang robbed. My relations feel like living in a state of siege, one of them, entire family hands tied property looted overnight. The master terrorist’s pictures with blood dripping from his teeth everywhere. A city and its population held hostage. It’s like Gotham city. I bet its worst than Ciudad Suarez. This condition has been arrived at thanks to mqm and its Zombie leader.
@bsobaid (Vikram)
It has brought us to a point that Indian agents naming themselves as bsobaid want to create further rift in our country’s internal politics. Go away, Indians not welcome here.
ARY BAHI QAIDE THEHRIK SAY NA ULJHU MEHNGA PERY GA TUM KU
altaf bahi ki ezzat karu asy leder kabhi kabhi milty hain pakistan may warna tu ap nay deak hi lye hain pani bijli walley aur rest of gohsi type kay jin ku english tu dur ki bat apni language bhi nhi ati theak tarha
musharaf is with MQM in 92 operation
http://www.ummatpublication.com/2009/08/28/story3.html
MQM, Zardari & Hussain Haqani exposed. They are behind this propaganda
http://www.express.com.pk/epaper/PoPupwindow.aspx?newsID=1100703305&Issue=NP_LHE&Date=20090829
So is this the best PPP could come with??
Anyhow, these retired generals cannot be trusted. In my sight MQM will always remain a terrorist organization, until and unless they apologize publicly. And as far as Zardari is concerned he will never ever gain mine and the publics respect. I regret saying this but Fauzia Wahab, is the most shameless women I’ve ever seen!
And well, NS is no angel either, PMLN did many mistakes and I have seen Shahbaz Shariff, Ch Nisar and Kh. Asif apologize for that, and I will prefer them over any political party (unless, they commit a blunder), uh! except maybe PTI, if IK can broaden his base.
Syed talat hussain has written a good article, and he is of course one of the few journalists, one can trust.
Anyway, what do you guys think of “Kamran Khan”? He seems shady to me!
Kamran Khan is an agent of establishment and MQM
i guess most people here are just following what media is telling us, and everyone
knows media itself is not not unbiased. in pakistan 70% people are illetrate and
they just watch tv to know what is going on so you can see how media can be used
to set the agenda and misguide the majority of pakistan.
If you look closely what is going on in pakistan is very simple, there are two groups
in pakistan, one which has always been ruling the pakistan and has control on all
the resources of pakistan and major institutions of pakistan, Nawaz – Iftikhar and
Kiyani represent that group and the second group is everyone else, like PPP-MQM-ANP and
now musharraf.
That if why if you look closely , all this lawer and judges issue started only after Musharraf
decided to have agreement with benazir bhutoo and tried to form next govt with the support of PPP and MQP. But this alliance would have been against the group which is
always ruling the pakistan.
So politicaly there was no option to break this alliance and remove musharraf, so judges
were used to disrupt everything.
If you look at the alliance, Musharraf, PPP and may be MQM , this alliance would have
had popular support of majority of pakistan and also would have been a strong and
progressive govt for pakistan. This plan was good and pakistan would have been stronger
and better in future.
But ruling group did not want to lose the power at the expense of pakistan. so they
destroyed everything and now we have no directions.
Musharraf wanted benazir to play role not zardari, but kiyani and nawaz sharif made
zardari president and removed musharraf. and now they are after zardari.
chief justice was restored recently by kiyani to control the govt from the top. now
whenever govt does anything they dont like, they can control it through judges.
so if we understand this , we will easily know the backgrounds of all what is happening
now. now musharraf is next target because he wants to come to politics and again
he will be a threat to nawaz group so they want to use courts against him.
so we should decide which group we stand with, the ruling one which always ruled
the country or with the group who have the support of majority of the people of
poor pakistanis.
also think, who is most capable leader to lead our nation. then support that leader.
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