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Afghanistan — A bridge too far!....

(9 posts)
  1. Far-called our navies melt away
    On dune and headland sinks the fire
    Lo, all our pomp of yesterday
    Is one with Nineveh and Tyre!
    Rudyard Kipling “Recessional”

    War is waged to achieve political objectives, not to kill enemies. Politically, the US has achieved nothing in Afghanistan after ten years of desultory war and destruction.

    So in this sense, the United States has already lost the Afghan conflict, its longest war. Militarily its forces have been stalemated, meaning that it has lost the all-important military initiative and is now on the strategic defensive.

    Once more, Afghanistan fulfills its grim title as “graveyard of empires.”

    The US has failed to install an obedient regime in Kabul that controls Afghanistan. It has made bitter foes of the nation’s Pashtun majority, and, in pursuing this war, gravely undermined Pakistan. Claims that US forces were only in Afghanistan to hunt the late Osama bin Laden were widely disbelieved.

    Last Wednesday, President Barack Obama bowed to public opinion, approaching elections, military reality and financial woes by announcing he would withdraw a third of the 100,000 US troops from Afghanistan by the end of next summer. Pentagon brass growled open opposition.

    US allies France and Germany announced similar troop reductions. All foreign troops are supposed to quit Afghanistan by the end of 2014.

    This staggered withdrawal will take the US garrison roughly back to the size it was before President Obama sent 30,000 reinforcements to Afghanistan. Enough to hold the main urban centers and connecting roads, but not enough to defeat Taliban guerrillas in the field, or to block the Afghan-Pakistan border.

    Washington currently spends at least $10 billion monthly on the Afghan war, not counting “black” payments, CIA and NSA operations. The US has poured $18.8 billion in development aid into Afghanistan since 2001 with nothing to show for the effort. Pakistan has been given $20 billion to support the Afghan War. Each US soldier in Afghanistan costs $1 million per annum, not counting full support costs.

    The US deficit is heading over $1.4 trillion. The national debt, when unfunded pensions and benefits are added, is likely $100 trillion, according to the chief of PIMCO, the world’s largest bond trader.

    Forty-four million Americans now receive food stamps; the national infrastructure of roads, airports, bridges and schools is crumbling from neglect. Unemployment, officially at 9.5%, is probably closer to 20%.

    The cry is being heard: “Rebuild America, not Afghanistan.”
    In spite of intense pro-war propaganda, over half of Americans now oppose the Afghan War. Even US-installed Afghan president Hamid Karzai calls it, “ineffective, apart from causing civilian casualties.”

    So will the US really pull out of Afghanistan? That remains to be seen. There are many contradictory signs.

    Mid-level talks between the US and Taliban have been conducted for over a year. Washington’s plan was to try to split Taliban through such talks.

    US Afghan supremo Gen. David Petraeus tried to buy off Afghan resistance in the same manner he had bribed Iraq’s Sunni tribes into quiescence. This gambit did not work with Taliban’s hardened warriors, for whom honor holds as much value as money.

    The US will probably keep a sizable number of its remaining 66,000 soldiers in Afghanistan after 2014, rebranding them training troops. The huge US bases at Kandahar and Bagram will be retained.

    Billions more will be spent on the Afghan government army and police. They have so far proved ineffective because most are composed of Tajik and Uzbek mercenaries who are hated and distrusted by the Pashtun.

    A similar process is underway in Iraq where “withdrawal” means keeping combat brigades in Iraq, renamed “training units” and counter-terrorism units,” thousands of mercenaries, and mobile US combat forces in neighboring
    Kuwait and the Gulf.

    New US embassies in Baghdad and Kabul — huge, fortified complexes with their own mercenary combat forces — will be the world’s biggest. Kabul will have a staff of 1,000 US personnel. Bin Laden called them “crusader fortresses.” Fortified US consulates are under construction in other parts of Afghanistan.

    In addition, the US will still arm and finance allied Tajik and Uzbek militias in Afghanistan, and CIA-run mercenary forces. Financing Pakistan’s US-backed regimes and Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan, and Tajikistan must also continue at around $3 billion yearly. What political concessions the US is giving Moscow to allow passage of war supplies remains a secret.

    The US appears to be going and staying at the same time. By contrast, the Taliban’s position is clear and simple: it will continue fighting until all foreign troops are withdrawn. US special forces, drones and hit squads have been unable to assassinate enough Taliban commanders to make the mujahedin stop fighting.

    Americans never study history, not even their own. They don’t recall a founding father, the great Benjamin Franklin, who said, “there is no good war, and no bad peace.” Or that the Pashtun Taliban and its allies are dedicated, undefeated warriors who fight where they live, and have all the time in the world.

    I’ve been in combat with the Pashtun warriors and remain in awe of their courage and love of combat. The Pashtun mujahedin will keep fighting as long as their ammunition lasts.

    America, for all its B-1 heavy bombers, strike fighters, missiles, helicopter gunships and drones, armor, super electronics, spies in the sky and all the other high tech weapons of modern war has failed to defeat some 30,000 tribal fighters armed with nothing more than light weapons and legendary valor.

    The US has lost the political war in Afghanistan. It may linger there, but it cannot win.

    http://pakpotpourri2.wordpress.com/2011/06/29/afghanistan-a-bridget-too-far/

    Posted 10 months ago on 02 Jul 2011 9:42 #
  2. Oh, excellent. I was about to post this Eric Margolis piece myself. At least he wrote with verve and acknowledged certain fundamental truths about the Afghan warrior and his allies, truths borne out by the course of history.

    Unlike Margolis, however, I don't believe the west can even linger on in Afghanistan. Their worsenng economic situation will not allow them to do so finally.

    Posted 10 months ago on 02 Jul 2011 10:18 #
  3. newobserver
    Member

    خود اپنے دام میں صیاد آ گیا

    Posted 10 months ago on 02 Jul 2011 10:42 #
  4. mangotango
    Member

    Winner or loser are relative to context. What we define as 'win' in particular context. I believe US is not in Afghanistan to 'win' in usual context. She is there to 'manage' the 'conflict' for long long time. Why because war creates 'debts' and supports jobs at its arms and ammunition industry as well R&D for future. Unfortunately, Afghans n Pakistanis will end up like Vietnam or Cambodia who lost great deal but 'won' the war

    To explain my point. 'Win' means selling arms and security (the only US product) to the customers who wouldn't really need them unless they are in conflicts with the money they dont have (fiat currency - second US product) - to have and have nots in arms race.

    layman terms a successful salesman sells you something you dont need, to make buy with money dont have and he is selling the best product in the market!

    Posted 10 months ago on 02 Jul 2011 11:14 #
  5. mangotango, thanks for showing some understanding of the US economy: Weapons, fiat currency and - you forgot this one, debts. And actually, these three things also define the economy of the entire west lands.

    Now as to who is winning and who is losing, we are winning this one, no doubt whatsoever. If one thinks of what exactly the Af-Pak war has achieved for the world, the downfall of the west as the ruling power, it's nothing short of tremendous. Ask the South Americans, they will tell you how they came out the first beneficiaries of what the Muslims have had to put up with. Also, Vietnam and its co-victims Laos and Cambodia, what their great achievement was: the end of the Buddhist wars.

    One thing we must hand to the west, impartiality: after going after the Buddhists and failing, they have now come after us and once again will fail resoundingly.

    Posted 10 months ago on 02 Jul 2011 12:53 #
  6. mangotango
    Member

    MG, I dont think I have made my point clear.

    America as a country has nothing to SELL to the world but biggest consumer market on earth (per capita consumer). If every country on earth is equal, no one would even buy USD for toilet roll. The only product she has is the technological edge in arms and security and $. US needs to SELL this product. They cant unless you BUY from it and you wont buy unless you are in a conflict. Therefore to create a buyer, there is need for MARKET. These conflicts/ flashpoints creates buyers and thus the debtors. Infact YOU even finance these debts yourselves (i.e. when you deposit 100 in bank bank needs to hold $5 under fractional banking and invest the remaining $95 in the capital market. So your bank buys the securitised loan from your $95 which funds the arms bought for the conflicts)

    I appreciate your patriotism that YOU might think you are winning but infact WE (all the humans) are losing it and there is none to blame except ourselves.

    Iran/ Iraq war is the best example. I can't stop laughing how these two stupids' kept fighting with arms bought from same supplier.

    Author George Crile, in his book Charlie Wilson's War, writes regarding CIA involvement in the Iran–Iraq War: explained by Ed Juchniewicz - Avrakotos's patron and the number two man in the Operations Division at that time - they were just leveling the playing field: "We didn't want either side to have the advantage. We just wanted them to kick the **** out of each other"

    Richard Sale of UPI quoted a former U.S. official as follows:[2]:
    a former official said that he personally had signed off on a document that shared U.S. satellite intelligence with both Iraq and Iran in an attempt to produce a military stalemate. "When I signed it, I thought I was losing my mind", the former official told UPI.

    Personal example. 10 years ago very few people had guns on them in Karachi. Now MOST of the ppl have guns on them why? they are 'afraid' of each other. Same way Afghans, Pakistan, Iran, India, China, Northern Alliance, Saudi Arabia, and so are 'afraid' and will be for next atleast 20 years and will keep buying arms from same supplier funded by themselves but MANAGED by US.

    Honestly, US is winning it, believe me. This system is beautifully designed in a way that YOU work hard 24/7 to earn money which infact kills you, your family and your neighbour. I would have explained it better graphically, I hope it helps.

    May be I am dillusional, but I believe in few years there will be another Iran/Iraq kind of war at a larger scale to repeat the success of Iran/Iraq war. I referred to it on another thread but was closed by the admin.
    http://pkpolitics.com/discuss/topic/gogmagog-shia-sunni

    As a financial analytst Peak is generally the indication of top-out i.e. beginning of the end. Hazrat Ali's saying that I recognise GOD with my inability to fulfil my will against His. Mastermind of this system must be laughing all the way, how well they implemented the system and everything is going per the plan.

    Posted 10 months ago on 02 Jul 2011 13:47 #
  7. Mangotango, very interesting that was. Still, I beg to disagree. What you describe above is definitely part of the plan. But only part of the plan. There are other plans ongoing as well which I won't go into at the moment.

    Back to the economy of the west. So US has the biggest consumer population in the world. So, so what? These consumers have no more money. So what are they going to use to indulge in their favourite pastime? Also, the main thing which no one ever mentions. Since 2006, the US has lost its reserve currency status, though not many know about it yet. And that puts paid to the dictatorship of the dollar.

    I think you're quite right about the need to sell foolish things like weapons simply to keep going on. Hence the whole incredible war machinery, the obsession with "safety", the incredible fairytale of "terrorism" and, best of all: the doctrine of perpetual war for perpetual peace.

    And honestly, no, the US - or better said, the west is not winning this war. No way that I can see. Not enough time now, but I'll go and have a look at your gogmagog - you a Sheikh Imran Hossein follower as well? - thread later. And we'll take it from there.

    One last thing: the west is not intelligent, has never been so and never will be so. You attribute too much of it to them, seems to me. But I did like Hazrat's Ali's saying.

    Posted 10 months ago on 02 Jul 2011 14:26 #
  8. mangotango
    Member

    'Back to the economy of the west. So US has the biggest consumer population in the world. So, so what? These consumers have no more money. So what are they going to use to indulge in their favourite pastime?'

    Thts wht I am saying that they have no money and never had any. Ability to print $ and demand for $ keeps it going.

    'Also, the main thing which no one ever mentions. Since 2006, the US has lost its reserve currency status, though not many know about it yet. And that puts paid to the dictatorship of the dollar.'

    Just wait for one conflict poping up and where $ will be, crashing all indices.

    you a Sheikh Imran Hossein follower as well? - thread later. And we'll take it from there.

    Never heard of him.

    Posted 10 months ago on 02 Jul 2011 14:53 #
  9. Sheikh Imran Hossein is a leading Islamic scholar specialised in eschatology and Islamic economic thought. Now, if I do appreciate him for his views on the latter, the former beats me completely. In other words, I have absolutely failed to understand the meaning of the Gog and Magog battle which he deals with at length from the Islamic point of view. He has both written on it and given lectures on the subject. If at all interested, google him or try him on YouTube.

    Posted 10 months ago on 02 Jul 2011 17:55 #

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