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An intolerant nation

(28 posts)

yahya
Member

Sane voices are there but how many are listening?

We are reaping the harvest of the seeds of hatred sown in the seventies and eighties. Pakistan is becoming an increasingly intolerant nation where religious and sectarian minorities live in fear and are awarded little or no protection by the state. Difference is unacceptable to the obscurantists who want everyone to toe their line. And if that takes intimidation, torture or even murder, then so be it, for no option is unavailable to the self-righteous who believe that they alone have seen the light.

http://www.dawn.com/wps/wcm/connect/dawn-content-library/dawn/the-newspaper/editorial/an-intolerant-nation-940

Posted 2 years ago on 19 Apr 2010 20:31 #
LiberalKarachi
Member

religious bigotry and self-rightist mentality feeds to intolerance...both of which are thankfully abundant in our country

Posted 2 years ago on 19 Apr 2010 23:02 #
sweettruth
Member

@LiberalKarachi
Well commented
Our nation is now recognized as the most intolerant in the world. Our connections with talibans and their supporters like Jamat Islami have left us in an awkward situation.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Apr 2010 1:22 #
dildar
Member

Agreed 100%!!

"The Punjab government needs to act, and act now, to protect Faisalabad’s Ahmadi community and other minorities in the province. But that is perhaps asking too much of an administration whose law minister consorts openly with known extremists. Organisations such as the SSP and Lashkar-i-Jhangvi are proscribed only in name. Their strength remains undiminished and the leader of the Ahl-i-Sunnat Waljamaat is granted audiences with provincial chief ministers and at least one governor. This double-game must end if extremism is to be curbed"

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Apr 2010 1:57 #
LalBichoo
Blocked

Until and unless terrorist organisations like SSP (now Ahl-i-Sunnat Waljamaat ), Lashkar-e-Jhangvi and Jaish Mohammad are completely and effectively banned, religious minorities like Ahmedis and even Shias (recently LJ's suicide-bomber killed many Shias in Quetta and Kohat) will not feel safe and secure !!!

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Apr 2010 5:41 #
Beenai
Moderator

tolerance is a rare commodity when it comes to Pakistani nation ...
matter of the fact is that ,we use to be tolerant in the past .
millions of immigrants from india ,Pakistanis were tolerant enough to welcome them open heartedly .
millions of Pakistanis in Karachi for jobs ,Karachities were tolerant to accept that reality ,that being a metro city ,they have to have guests from other cities .

different sects of religion use to be tolerant enough to mingle ,marry and have food with each other .

but with the passage of time ,tolerance is dropping down like anything .
different sects are not ready to accept each other .
Karachties has been told by leaders to hate and throw out the out siders .
immigrants from other areas has not been welcomed .

settling of the victims of earthquake and war on terror, in other provinces ,becomes a bight mare ....
so on and so forth ....

dont know ,from where we can get some tolerance back????

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Apr 2010 6:18 #
choosy
Member

hum bijli jana tolerate karaty hain.
hum ganda pani peena tolerate karaty hain.
hum bazaron mein bomb blasts tolerate kartay hain.
hum cheeni 70 rupees kilo tolerate kartay hain.
hum Fazlo ,Qazi aur Altaf loser ko tolerate karaty hain.
hum Nawaz ,BB ,Zardrai ,Asfand wali ko tolrate karaty hain.
hum india ki dhamkiyon ko tolerate karaty hain.
hum IMF ko tolerate karaty hain.
hum Hallbroke ko tolerate karaty hain...

aur duniya phir bhi kehti hay kay hum intolerant nation hain ...wahh bhaiii wahh .

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Apr 2010 7:36 #
wantinsaf
Member

Well it is really amazing how we take the words of others so seriously particularly Americans.Are we oblivious to our own country?It seems there are few here on this forum who exactly don't know what Pakistanis are and what mess we as a nation going through.
I being a Pakistani know about Pakistan and its people more than intolerant Americans who would like to kill anyone for personal gains.Pakistanis are very beautiful people who are as tolerant as others are.Terror activities take place everywhere.
We need to stand united and what unites us is our religion and culture.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Apr 2010 9:23 #
yahya
Member

"Pakistanis are very beautiful people who are as tolerant as others are."

Un..huh...

"Terror activities take place everywhere."

Not really. How many Muslims got burnt alive in west last year, like Christians were burnt in Gojra? Pakistan is the most dangerous country for Muslims too; more Muslims get killed here than any other place in the world including in non-Muslim countries.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Apr 2010 9:30 #
rashidsaleem
Member

The seeds of hatred and intolerance were sowed many years back. Now that we have seen that intolerance towards each other’s values whether religious or cultural would only bring us tears and dead bodies, we must learn to coexist. The minorities live under a constant threat of an assault anytime by a fundamentalist group. It is highly encouraging to see so many liberal voices on this forum. This is a big indicator of the fact that we are learning from our mistakes. We must continue healthy debates and exchange ideas/opinions without trying to impose our thoughts on anyone else.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Apr 2010 11:08 #
wantinsaf
Member

@YAHYA
Little knowledge is always dangerous.
Have you forgotten four months ago a woman was murdered brutally in France for wearing Burqa?
you are not that well versed with current affairs as France has been since last couple of months witnessing Burqa row?
What is Ban on minarets of mosques in different European countries?

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Apr 2010 11:11 #
wantinsaf
Member

@RashidSaleem
In Pakistan poors have been killed too,why not condemn their killings?
In Pakistan Balochies,Sindhis,Pakhtuns,Mohajers and Punjabis have been killed too,why not condemn their killings?
Why show hypocricy?
Your comments are dividing people on the basis of minority or majority.Humans are humans and this is how they should be treated.If you keep treating religion as something alien you would suffer.You guys desperately need to understand difference between Islam and other relgion.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Apr 2010 11:15 #
wantinsaf
Member

There are few things which I have noticed here.One of them is unfortunately biased opinion of dogmatic liberals.
They would leave no stone unturn in condemning sectarian killings,but what about ethnic killing?Killing is killing be it ethnic or sectarian.The reason behind their biased opinion is their reluctance to follow religion and their belief Islam is outdated.This is where problem lies.Why not show character to follow Islam,a religion Muhammed brought for promoting peace.
We have abundance of illiterates who happen to be hypocrites at the same time.Their agenda has never been promoting justice,equality,prosperity,moral values,self respect and a society based on rich rituals of Islam.Their agenda rather is an alien concept called liberalism.
Thank God our collective wisdom has badly rejected this westernized concept.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Apr 2010 11:22 #
ammarisb
Member

The threshold of tolerance in Pakistan is low, which is why arguments turn into fist fights, political protests turn into mob violence. Intolerance can be seen in our rallies, public processions or even in ticket line of cinema extremist tendencies can be observed everywhere.
In a recent BBC POLL Pakistan is ranked 2nd as country with negative perceptions in the world. Such ranking influence the foreign investors why would they want to invest in Pakistan? We need to introspect on why violence is so rampant? Until we put forth the positive perceptions of Pakistani nations we cannot progress in the international arena

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Apr 2010 14:29 #
achtung
Member

yahya bhai.

credit goes to gen zia. uss ney apney iqtidar ki khatir mulk ki jarrein khokhli kar dein.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Apr 2010 15:17 #
Anonymous

For this topic I would like to post something that I have posted in another thread...

[Quote]:Yesterday I was watching a movie "Kingdom of Heavens" I realized that in the end Salaudin Ayubi took over Jerusalem without even entering the walls of Jerusalem as he promised to spare the lives of every single person in Jerusalem Muslims, Christians or Jews....Now if you remember when Hazrat Umer(RA) took over Jerusalem almost same happened as he went to Jerusalem and negotiated the surrender instead of Fighting wars inside the holy city for three religion so this gives an impression that Muslims never fought inside this city or kill people inside this city and they after taking over the city kept themselves effective in ensuring peace between different religions whom call it Holy land and didnt allow one group(even Muslims) to have absolute power on all other groups living their....

Today the situation is exactly opposite in the Muslim world as today we cant even tolerate groups within Muslims and start fighting with Muslims ourselves so why would Allah ever give the land where perfect balance between faiths and religion should be maintained and peace should be preserved at any cost as people call it "Holy Land"???Today how much bad or violent jews are but one thing is for sure that despite of their hatred they didnt even try to touch Muslim worship place call it fear or call it something else but imagine if Muslims are able to took over Jerusalem tomorrow then can we expect them to spare the lives of jews???I think no because all we got is revenge inside our hearts against them but we should also take an example that Salaudin Ayubi and his army would have butchered every single Christian in revenge of butchering Muslims since since first crusade but he didnt and he tried to preserve peace in Jerusalem so now this is what we need to learn from great heroes of Islam...
Posted 1 hour ago on 20 Apr 2010 15:54 #:[Unquote]

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Apr 2010 17:35 #
shriq
Member

@ originator of this post:

"We are reaping the harvest of the seeds of hatred sown in the seventies and eighties."

Yes I can feel the hatred by people mentioning so lovingly about Lahore and Allama Iqbal.

Listen to the sane voices and try to eliminate the hatred.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Apr 2010 18:12 #
haider3
member

choosy, I was on the point of writing a letter of resignation to this blog. Quite by chance, I read your comment above. And do you know what? Wham! I changed my mind. Perhaps I will go on a bit longer here. If you can see how false this whole discussion is, then there's still hope for us and our country.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Apr 2010 19:46 #
achtung
Member

mirza ghalib bhai. meri aap sey darkhast hogi keh aap resignation ka kabhi na soochna. yeh baat mein iss liye keh raha hoo kionkeh mein aapko tolerant, polite aur achha insaan samajhta hoon. iss baat sey koi faraq nahee parrta keh kis aadmi kay kiya views hein.

mujhay iss baat mein koi shak nahee keh, yes there is hope for us and our country. otherwise, yes we are intolerent nation, despite fact we are tolerating what choosy bhai say.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Apr 2010 20:32 #
yahya
Member

"Little knowledge is always dangerous.
Have you forgotten four months ago a woman was murdered brutally in France for wearing Burqa?"

@wantinsaf: Actually it was Germany (little knowledge!) and the man was apprehended, tried and sentenced to life (highest penalty in Germany) and is now serving his sentence. How many have been tried for burning Christians alive while it happened in broad day light and everyone knows who perpetrators were? None. Even the DPO who did nothing to protect the Christians has been given promotion. There is a big difference in western societies and Pakistan in that if a crime is committed in west the perpetrators are prosecuted while in Pakistan the are rewarded.

"you are not that well versed with current affairs as France has been since last couple of months witnessing Burqa row?
What is Ban on minarets of mosques in different European countries?"

So, should they encourage those who burn people? I would be scared too if I were French.

But the probelm also is that in 'Islam ka Qila' Pakistan its a large number of Muslims who are being butchered too.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Apr 2010 21:05 #
achtung
Member

yahya bhai. issay kehtay hein

doosray ki aankh mein tinka bhi nazar aa jana aur apni aankh mein shehteer ka bhi nazar na aana.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Apr 2010 21:13 #
haider3
member

The minarets, by the way, was Switzerland. Don't go on, west-dazzled. We've got the message. Say something positive about Pakistan or our religious feelings, we are promptly termed "extremist" or we are charged with "glorifying suicide bombers" and God knows what else. So, God be with you all, and now give us a bit of peace and leave us to work things out our own way. We need no lessons from anyone, least of all the West.

achtung, thanks, that was beautiful and undeserved on my part, but it did help to make me feel better. Also the last quirky sentence did the trick. Pure achtung that was in his very best style.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Apr 2010 21:16 #
LiberalKarachi
Member

@Sweettruth,

"@LiberalKarachi
Well commented
Our connections with talibans and their supporters like Jamat Islami have left us in an awkward situation."

Thank you :) I agree with you...but luckily, the nation is waking up, and saner voices are being heard. An example is the media, I remember Javed Chaudary (of Kal talk on Express news) comparing the Talibans in swat with the "French revolutionists" and now he calls them "deshatgard"!

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Apr 2010 23:45 #
rashidsaleem
Member

@ wantinsaf: If humans are humans then why are you segregating them into poor and rich. Anyone killed in an act of violence or terrorism is a victim of that brutal act. Secondly, in Pakistan, only Pakistani’s are being killed. Please don’t divide them as Punjabi’s, Balochi’s, Pukhtoon’s etc. The division on the basis of minority and majority would always exist. And only because of that, EVERY country has a set code towards the minorities in their land. Nowhere in my comment have I compared Islam with any other religion. I was merely pointing out the radical Islamic element which has been injected into us by this Mullah band.

Posted 2 years ago on 21 Apr 2010 8:40 #
wantinsaf
Member

@Yahya
Your earlier comments showed that voilence take place in Pakistan only,thank God now you have admitted it happens everywhere.
Can you please name even a single culprit in Gojra incident so that we as a soceity can take actions against him or her?
We don't know who is the culprit,do we?This all has been happening because we are more concerned about alien concepts like liberalism and less about law and order.Law and order is the solution,not alien concepts.
This is not about encouraging and discouraging.This is about putting blind eye to one issue and paying more attention to other .And that's what makes us unable to look at things in broader persepctive.
What do you think of "Babri Mosque incident"?
As I wrote earlier such things happen everyhwere but important thing is sorting out the issue.And solution is education reforms,law reforms and competent leader.

Posted 2 years ago on 21 Apr 2010 9:33 #
wantinsaf
Member

@RashidSaleem
I challenged your biasism but you have started talking about division in society.Law has to be implemented across the board.In the same manner your opinion should not put blind eye to other portions of society and pay more attention to one portion of society.
Division has to be there but that doesn't mean you should become biased.Solution to our problem lie in implementing law and order, not alien concept like liberalism.

Posted 2 years ago on 21 Apr 2010 9:37 #
jaypk
Member

@yahya...i second you on this..!

we might be intolerant in general or not is a diff issue..but when it comes to being the so called thaikedars of islam...we are intolerant as intolerants can be...!Go anywhere in the muslim world….you wouldn’t find religious based hatred as you find here…and you wouldn’t find that PRIDE in calling each other kafirs as you find here..and you wouldn’t find religious based propaganda as you find here!

Posted 2 years ago on 21 Apr 2010 15:52 #
semirza
Moderator

Intolerant nation that is Pakistan...ending up on thaikedars of Islam!
Thread is painting Pakistanis as intolerant nation; is being seen too much and too often under a pretext of freedom of speech/expression that is negative for Pakistan.

Closed as no forseeable positive outcome emerging from this thread for Pakistan or Pakistanis.

Posted 2 years ago on 21 Apr 2010 18:08 #