Black Banners from Khurasan (Afghanistan) to Jerusalem

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Black Banners from Khurasan (Afghanistan) to Jerusalem

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KHAN_Sahib
Member

I want to know your opinion about these hadith concerning the black flags/ banners from Khurasaan

Black Banners from Khurasan (Afghanistan) to Jerusalem

Reported on a chain of transmission on the authority of Kaab "The sign of the Mahdi's appearance will be war banners coming from the west, lead by a man with a disability from "Kinda".
(Nuaym son of Hammad, Al-Fitan page 205)

Abu Abdullah Nuaim Ibn Hammad on a chain of transmission on the authority of Al Zuhari who said "The black flags will come from the East, led by mighty men, with long hair and beards, their surnames are taken from the names of their home towns (i.e. Khosti or from Khost etc.) and their first names are from a "Kunya".
(Asmal Masalik Lieyyam Mahdiyy Maliki Li Kull-id Dunya Biemrillah-il Malik, Qalda bin Zayd)

Narrated Abdullah ibn Hawalah al-Azdi: "The Apostle of Allah (peace be upon him) sent us on foot to get spoil, but we returned without getting any. When he saw the signs of distress on our faces, he stood up on our faces and said: O Allah, do not put them under my care, for I would be too weak to care for them; do not put them in care of themselves, for they would be incapable of that, and do not put them in the care of men, for they would choose the best things for themselves. He then placed his hand on my head and said: Ibn Hawalah, when you see the caliphate has settled in the holy land (i.e., Palestine), earthquakes, sorrows and serious matters will have drawn near and on that day the Last Hour will be nearer to mankind than this hand of mine is to your head.
(Translation of Sunan Abu-Dawud, Jihad (Kitab Al-Jihad), Book 14, Number 2529)

Ammar, the son of Yasir, may Allah be pleased with both of them, said: "When As-Sufyaani reaches Kufa and kills the supporters of the family of Muhammad, praise and peace be upon him, the Mahdi will come and the bearer of his Banner will be Shuayb, the son of Salih."

Nuaim Ibn Hammad on a chain of transmission on the authority of Al Zuhari who said, "If the people of the black flag divide, then the people of the yellow banner will attack, they will gather in the canal of Egypt and the people of the East and the West will fight for seven (days or months or years)..."
(Asmal Masalik Lieyyam Mahdiyy Maliki Li Kull-id Dunya Biemrillah-il Malik,
Qalda bin Zayd)

Muhammad, son of Al Hanaffia, said:"The Black Banners will come out for the children of Al Abbas. The other black banners will come from Khurasan. Their turbans will be black and their clothes white. At their front will be a man named Shuayb, the son of Salih, from Tamim. They will defeat the companions of The Sufyaani until he comes to the House of Jerusalem where he will establish his power for the Mahdi, and he will be supplied with three hundred (men) from Syria after his arrival and the matter will be settled for the Mahdi in seventy-two months (six years)."

Said son of Al Musayyab reported: "The Black Banners will come from the East from the children of Al Abbas. Then there will remain whatsoever Allah wishes. Then, small Black Banners will come to fight a man from the children of Abu Sufyaan from the East. They will give their allegiance to the Mahdi."
(Nuaym son of Hammad.)

Al Hasan Al Basri said:
"A man of medium stature will come from Ar-Ray (a far-eastern town). He will be dark and from the children of Tamim -- a Wasaj, named Shuayb son of Salih with four thousand men. Their clothes will be white and Banners black, and at his front is the Mahdi. He meets no one that he does not defeat and scatter."

Abdullah, the son of Shuraykh, said:
"With the Mahdi is the marked Banner of the Messenger of Allah, praise and peace be upon him."

Ammar, the son of Yasir, may Allah be pleased with both of them, said:
"The bearer of the Banner of the Mahdi is Shuayb, the son of Salih."

Reported by Abu Said Al Khudri: "A man from my nation will come who speaks with my Sunnah and Allah, the Mighty, the Glorified will send showers of rain from the heavens so that the earth will produce its blessing. Through him the earth will be filled with fairness and justice just as it had been filled by oppression and injustice. He will govern this nation for seven years, and go to Jerusalem."
(Abu Dawud, Al Hakim, At-Tirmidhi, Ahmad, son of Hibban, Muslim, Al Tabarani, Al Barudi and Abu Nuaym)

On the authority of Thawban, the Messenger of Allah (upon whom be blessings and peace) said:The Prophet Sallallahu ‘Alaihi Wa Sallam said: "Before your treasure, three will kill each other -- all of them are sons of a different caliph but none will be the recipient. Then the Black Banners will appear from the East and they will kill you in a way that has never before been done by a nation."
Thawban, a companion said: 'Then he said something that I do not remember by heart' then continued to say that the Prophet, praise and peace be upon him, said: "If you see him give him your allegiance, even if you have to crawl over ice, because surely he is the Caliph of Allah, the Mahdi. If you see the black (meaning war) flags coming from Khurasan (Afghanistan), join that army, even if you have to crawl over ice, for this is the army of the Caliph, the Mahdi and no one can stop that army until it reaches Jerusalem."
(Son of Majah, Al Busiri, Al Hakim, Ahmad Nuaym, Ad-Daylami, Hasan, son of Sufyaan, and Abu Nuaym.)

Related by Abu Hurayrah: The Prophet Sallallahu ‘Alaihi Wa Sallam said: "(Armies carrying) black flags will come from Khurasan (Afghanistan). No power will be able to stop them and they will finally reach Jerusalem where they will erect their flags." (Tirmidhi)

Ali said, “The Prophet said, ‘A man named al-Harith son of Hirath will come from Transoxania (Tajikistan). His army will be led by a man named Mansoor. He will be pave the way for and establish the government of the family of Muhammad, just as the Quraysh established the government of the Messenger of Allah. Every believer will be obliged to support them.’” (Abu-Dawud.)

Buraidah says that Rasulullah Sallallahu Alayhi Wasallam said: "There will be many armies after me. You must join that army which will come from Khurasaan." (Ibn Adi)

Abu Hurairah says that Rasulullah Sallallahu Alayhi Wasallam said: "(Armies carrying) black flags will come from Khurasaan. No power will be able to stop them and they will finally reach Eela (Baitul Maqdas) where they will erect their flags."

Posted 3 years ago on 19 May 2009 23:34 #
skyfacts
Blocked

deniel is not possible to remain muslim,of any hadees.
I m also searching for an issue relating hadees below,

Reported on a chain of transmission on the authority of Kaab "The sign of the Mahdi's appearance will be war banners coming from the west, lead by a man with a disability from "Kinda".
(Nuaym son of Hammad, Al-Fitan page 205)

Now (kinda) means canada in arabic.
The general richard myers was disable by one leg,he was american commander at the time ,and announce war on afghanistan.
The issue is,
i could not confirm it in video but i have read it in a paper that he was disable by one leg,'
The other issue is that he was born in ARKANSAS U.S.A not in canada. Now arkansas is boundries with canada search remains to whether this arkansas was part of canada in thie old times.

Any one can help me out,would be appreciated much.

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 0:15 #
R_A_J_A_Bhai
Member

What about this hadees that says that Dajjal would appear from a land in east called Khurasan and his followers would be the ones who have faces "Majan al Matriqa".

‏حدثنا ‏ ‏محمد بن بشار ‏ ‏وأحمد بن منيع ‏ ‏قالا حدثنا ‏ ‏روح بن عبادة ‏ ‏حدثنا ‏ ‏سعيد بن أبي عروبة ‏ ‏عن ‏ ‏أبي التياح ‏ ‏عن ‏ ‏المغيرة بن سبيع ‏ ‏عن ‏ ‏عمرو بن حريث ‏ ‏عن ‏ ‏أبي بكر الصديق ‏ ‏قال ‏
‏حدثنا رسول الله ‏ ‏صلى الله عليه وسلم ‏ ‏قال ‏ ‏الدجال ‏ ‏يخرج من أرض بالمشرق يقال لها ‏ ‏خراسان ‏ ‏يتبعه أقوام كأن وجوههم ‏ ‏المجان ‏ ‏المطرقة ‏
‏
http://hadith.al-islam.com/Display/Display.asp?hnum=2163&doc=2&IMAGE=%DA%D1%D6+%C7%E1%CD%CF%ED%CB

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 1:01 #
skyfacts
Blocked

R_A_J_A_Bhai,

It is clear very much from ahadees that dajjal will comeout in pelistine,and he will be a jews.

Now pelistine is in east or west.

Latter i will quote ahadees with sanads.

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 1:22 #
IJay
member

khan sahib!

black flag kub yaad agai!

Haan Ji khan sahib ..

its true even i read references from other holy books!
all are aware of black flag army including bible gospel
and other prophecies scriptures

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 7:43 #
IJay
member

Black Banners will appear from the East and they will kill you in a way that has never before been done by a nation

This you can also witness in current conflict

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 7:49 #
IJay
member

And the most disturbing fact now its alos become reality its related with swat refugees very important sign! in one the prophecies....>READ THIS BELOW HADITH VERY CAREFULLY

Narrated by Hazrat Abdullah bin Masood (RA) that Prophet (SAW) said: A Nation will come from the east with black flags and they will ask for some “Khair” (because of them being needy) but the people will not give them, then, they will fight and win over those people (who did not give them what they asked). Now the people will give them what they asked for but they will not accept it until they will hand it over to a person from my progeny who will fill this earth with justice just as it was previously filled with oppression and tyranny. So if anyone of you finds this nation (i.e. from the east with black flags) then you must join them even if you have to crawl over ice”

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 7:53 #
IJay
member

Many leading Ulemas of teh world are waiting for these final signs from pakistan but unfortunately DO NUMBERS ULEMAs of pakistan ARE HIDING THIS FACT!

Interesting part many ulemas will reject is hadeth because
they calle dit daef but what i have found out that its rejetced by arab ulemas becuase some these hadeth also mentioned that Arabs will not support Mahdi and only 5% of their population will offer him support.

But as i said earlier black flag army from khurasan is also mentioned in other scriptures so after reading those prophecies i can't call it daef!

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 8:01 #
Revivalist
member

Dear all,

"Khilafah will re-establish on the method of prophethood" (Masnad Ahmed). From this and all other mentioned Ahadees one thing is sure that khilafah will re-establish but the thing of concern for us as Muslims is what is our share in it???? Are we struggling for it???? Are we fulfilling our responsibility???? As the opportunity of establishing Allah's deen was once with Prophet Muhammad (saw) and his noble Sahaba and now with us, can you imagine the seriousness of the opportunity we have in our hands!!!!

So please don’t wait for a superman to come rather put your due share in the great effort that is going on in the world for khilafah. Hizb_ut-tahrir offers you a platform to re-establish khilafah and fulfill your obligation as a Muslim.

Regards

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 8:32 #
chechen
Member

Hizb Tahrir never participate in Jihad. They are not seen in Chechnya, Palestine, Somalia, Iraq and Afghanistan. If they want Khilafa they should join Taliban. Looks like they are agents of West. The founder of HT was a Jordanian who fooled the naive Muslims sayingKhilafa. He was asufi crackpot and has no idea about Jihad

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 9:47 #
LetsDoIt
Member

Dear Khan

I have already posted my comments on this topic. All the ahadiths concerning black flags are actually weak ahadiths having broken or unauthentic link. Also if you read history you will find that why and where these ahadiths were used in the history.

if you want i could discuss each hadith which is discussing black flags. Their autheticity was the reason why you dont find any such hadith in the SAHEEH Bukhari or SAHEEH muslim.

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 11:07 #
chechen
Member

Wrong my friend.

That whole area is part of Khurasaan and there a Sahih not deaeef Hadith of Prophet SAS:

Narrated By Auf bin Mali: I went to the Prophet during the Ghazwa of Tabuk while he was sitting in a leather tent. He said, “Count six signs that indicate the approach of the Hour: my death, the conquest of Jerusalem, a plague that will afflict you (and kill you in great numbers) as the plague that afflicts sheep, the increase of wealth to such an extent that even if one is given one hundred Dinars, he will not be satisfied; then an affliction which no Arab house will escape, and then a truce between you and Bani Al-Asfar (i.e. the Byzantines) who will betray you and attack you under eighty flags. Under each flag will be twelve thousand soldiers.”

Sahih Bukhari: Vol 4, Book 53. One-fifth Of Booty To The Cause Of

All, Hadith 401

Is not Khuraasaan present-day Afghanistan? And is not the United Dajjal forces (knowing this hadith more than most of us do) are trying with all their might to destroy the Mujahideen (in Afghanistan and its surroundings, who are waving the “Black Banners”) before they reach Palestine and rescue our brothers and sisters in al-Quds as-Shareef
and Bayt al-Maqdis from the Zionist Jews? Why do these Dajjal forces sit back muted and watched with amusement, when Illegal Israel pounded Gaza for days together, slaughtering children, women, men, bombarding masaajid, hospitals, schools, and yet when a Muslim even open his mouth to support his or her brothers and sisters in Islam, they are quickly labeled as “terrorists”, banned from the public sphere or they are sent to torture to death camps? Why these Dajjal forces gathered up in Afghanistan almost under 80 flags, with up to 80,000 of their “soon to be dead” terrorist troops?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/5c/Afghanistan_ISAF_Sept2008.jpg

If you count other countries that have miitary presence not shown on the map you will come to the number 80 predicted by Prophet SAS. Even tiny Guatamalo from South America has troops there. India has also a large military presence in guise of protecting their illegal workers. Their consulates are filled with military. Unfortunately the mercenary Pakistani army is also one of them. Any doubts?

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 11:14 #
NNL
member

Just to point out a fact. If a hadith is not mentioned in the Sahihain that doesnt make it weak. There is a science of Hadith. If any hadith stands the test and comes with no contradiction or weakness then it can be accepted.

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 11:14 #
netengr
blocked

Well there can be many interpretations ,in one haddes it is mentioned that dajjal will be killed in the place called ludh by Hazrat Essa AS .

It can be interpreted like
Dajjal is Mullah Umer will be killed on the area in waziristan called "ludh " (there is area name ludh in waziristan too )

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 11:31 #
netengr
blocked

Well there can be many interpretations ,in one haddes it is mentioned that dajjal will be killed in the place called ludh by Hazrat Essa AS .

It can be interpreted like
Dajjal is Mullah Umer will be killed on the area in waziristan called "ludh " (there is area name ludh in waziristan too )

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 11:32 #
LetsDoIt
Member

chechen

please dont mix and twist the ahadiths. The black flag ahadiths are totally different and they are highlighting different topic.

These ahadiths are now again used by some losers to portray these Talibans as Mujhahedeen. The talibans version of Islam is very much different than the Islam presented by beloved Prophet Muhammad (saw). How some one could claim themselves to have help from Allah(swt) who are not muslim at all.

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 11:47 #
skyfacts
Blocked

@netengr,

Think you, before give any opinion upon a hadith,you totally wrong,why you using hadith just to proof that you are right,think 100 times than before you quote.
The place in waziristan,named LADHA,

DAJJAL WILL BE KILLED,AT BABE LUDH,ONE OF THE DOOR OF BAITUL MAQDAS.
DAJJAL WILL BE BORN IN PELISTINE'S TOWN,AND HE WILL BE JEWS.

NOW MATCH YOUR FACTS,.
I WOULD NOT ALLOW YOU USING HADITH,LIKE YOU DID THIS TIME,MIND IT.

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 12:10 #
Revivalist
member

@ chechan

HT does not do Jihad as a method to re-establish khilafah and that is because of the method of prophet (saw), however if you see and find out thousands of HT members are being put behind the bars in most of the Muslim state, like Uzbekistan, Syria, Egypt, labia, Bangladesh, Pakistan, Afghanistan etc and is severely banned in almost all Muslim country, because the solution which HT is presenting is in fact the SOLUTION to the problems of the Ummah.

Please abstain from putting false blames on Muslim scholars, can you show me a single evidence that Sheikh Taqi was Sufi, rather FYI he died because of sever torture by the Syrian and Iraqi authorities...

Regards

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 12:13 #
skyfacts
Blocked

LetsDoIt,
rethink your hadith knowledge.Every author of the hadith book has collected hadiths from variouse places,

SAHIA MUSLIM AND SHAI BUKHARI HAD VERY TIGHT (SHARAIT),FOR HADITHS THEREFORE THEY GOT VERY FEW HADITHS AS COMPARED TO OTHER BOOKS,
THE OTHER BOOKS HAVE OWN HEADINGS OF ,SAHIH HADEES,GHAREEB HADEES,MUZOOEE HADEES.
WHO TOLD YOU JUST HADEES IN BUKHARI AND SAHI MUSLIM ARE SAHI.AND THE OTHER BOOKS ARE GHARIB HADEES.

NOW PROVE HERE THAT BLACK BANNESRS HADITHS ARE GHAREEB OR MAOUZOEE.ONE BY ONE,M WAITING

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 12:26 #
skyfacts
Blocked

@IJay
Explain your understanding of both ahadees.

The will kill you in a way like no other nation did it ever.
and

The other khair wali hadees.

give your complete opinion what is your understanding,leave the others to blame.

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 12:38 #
IJay
member

i am sorry to say but MR LETSDOTIT always say no although he has no sound knowledge to prove his claim as i said these
hadeth are reject by arabs ulema becuase arabs are not mention in this army! my brothers how can they approve anything which contain anything without arabs if read the chain you would find out that only 5% arabs will be part of mahdi army! but LETSDOIT keeps saying deaf daef O' iF YOU THINK ITS DAEF then prove it.

Already said in my post that there other prophecies scriptures present with black army reference and mr letsdoit
they are not hadith! and for kind info end of times predictions also mentioned in other books and scriptures too..but we are in state of denial we will remain in denial untill we see it with our own eyes!

keep focus on swat! specially part of khair you will get your answer soon

everyone who has imaan in his heart will sense the arrival of black army!

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 12:49 #
netengr
blocked

Mehdi will be from Medina
and Dajjal will be from Khurasan having one eye .

by the way My religion is not based on predictions ,what I believe is those who kill innocent civilians ,slaughtering people ,Terrorizing the nation cannot be called a muslim ,they are evil and companion of Sahitaan .

one the other side what I believe that a true Momin will be polite ,peacefull ,who gives blessing to the people ,People would feel comfort and peace in his companionship .

those evils are killings ,bombing and terrorizing people on what ever reason cannot be the part of Imam mehdi army

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 12:59 #
IJay
member

Net

"one the other side what I believe that a true Momin will be polite ,peacefull ,who gives blessing to the people ,People would feel comfort and peace in his companionship" .

check history islam .there is no such example of so called peaceful life before and after prophet(pbuh) ERA.

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 13:01 #
skyfacts
Blocked

@IJay,
Arab govt ulemmas must reject but the otherones are knowing the facts.you know saudi govt have a tight system for ulemme,so how they can?
If you count the ppl in jihad its hardly i think about .40% of all the muslim population,its good if 5% arabs are accepting.look in paksitan .2% may be or less in jihad.

YA YE MAMLA SHOROO HO CHOKA HE.i believe it.

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 13:02 #
IJay
member

everyone who has imaan in his heart will sense the arrival of black army!

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 13:03 #
LetsDoIt
Member

skyfacts

Thank you for your reply. I never claimed that hadiths only in Muslim and Bukhari are saheeh and rest are not. I only claimed that this matter was of BIG importance and how come Bukhari and Muslim when they collected all the ahadiths about the END OF TIMES have not come acrossed these ahadiths. My point was since their criteria was so strict so such ahadiths were filtered out. Now after clearning my point let us analyze these ahadiths one by one and later perhaps you and Mr. Ijay could educate me more about that.

The hadiths of black flags are stated in Masnad Ahmed and Ibn-Maja. The chain is from Khalid to Abi qalaba to Abi-asma to Soban to the Prophet Muhammad PBUH and on the basis of narrator Khalid this hadith is declaired as Da'eef.
The next time this hadith is narrated then the chain is direct from Abi-qalaba to Soban and it is clear in the history that Abi qulaba never met with Soban

These were the hadiths which were made to support Abbasis over Ummayyad in the opinion of many Ulema

Please also read the history and read about Abu Muslim Khorasani, who forced every one to wear black clothes and hold black flags while fighting against Umayyad.

If you want i could write more and even write these ahadiths word by word so to compare and analyze. Also one should read history and then it will be clear that these ahadiths were made by ABBASIS to get advantage over UMAYYAD

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 13:45 #
IJay
member

letsdoi

Abi qulaba never met with Soban

who told you... you were there who wrote this histroy you have any proof..becuase you read in some book this reference
you gave this BS to everybody..you tell me now what is authenticty of that book!

you can call hadith daef but you have no courage to decalre that so called history book false!

plz if you dont believe it go away but don't misguide others! as i told you there are many christian blog where black army prophecies are mentioned...so just buzz off with your bloody false history book!!!

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 13:56 #
chechen
Member

I will provide you with links with some resources, to know more about the United Dajjal forces ( US, NATO etc etc) who have already submitted 100% to the Dajjal forces and those under the “80 flags and those joining them in their war against Islam and against the Mujahideen from Khuraasaan:
.
ISAF terrorist troops under NATO command and their Locations in Afghanistan:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/5c/Afghanistan_ISAF_Sept2008.jpg
.
The Next Link is the ISAF terrorist contributors:
Current contributors are in dark green, potential future contributors are in light green, and former contributors are in cyan:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/b/bc/ISAF_contributors.png
.
Detailed Dajjal Forces contributors:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Security_Assistance_Force

“So obey Allah and obey the Messenger (Muhammad); but if you turn away – then upon Our Messenger is only [the duty of] clear notification.”
…………
[Surah At-TagAbun, Ayat 12]

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 13:57 #
IJay
member

chechen

ignore this letsdoit! he has no evidence just one crappy old history book which even higher than hadith

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 13:58 #
skyfacts
Blocked

we should not play in the hands of christians as for as our religiouse history is concerned and avoid such sites.
IJay

now pls help me in that hadees of (.kinda).about the disable commander which will announce war against khurasan.

pls help me out.

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 14:05 #
IJay
member

well they said its also became true

when richard mayers decalred war against afghanistan on crutches

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 14:28 #
LetsDoIt
Member

IJAY

Stupidity should have a limit. If you dont know something why instead of asking you start writing. Its no history book which tell me what is correct and what is not. Have you ever heard the term SCIENCE OF HADITH and how the rules are made to authenticate the hadith. This is something so sacred that could never be done without the help of Allah swt and you are such a idiot who is nullifying all the efforts put into this. This was not done by some specific sect, this was done by muslims to save the word of Prophet PBUH so idiots like you will not be able to corrupt it.

have you ever heard of Ilm ar rijal. this tells us whose report was authetic and whose is not? this tells us who met whom and when. This is not written by me, these criteria are written and developed by great Muhadeseen including Bukhari, Muslim, abi daud etc. According to them they never met its not according to me.

You write almost 10 times that i am writing without having any knowledge, i agree that i am not very knowledgeable but i have read all these ahadiths in detail. Could you who are more knowledgeable even write few of them with their references. Could you write the comments of great scholars about those ahadiths.

Its stated by AHMED BIN HANBAL that one of the narrators is not reliable. Now tell me which sect of SUNNI dont think AHMED BIN HANBAL is not reliable. Please tell me your criteria to declare hadith saheeh.

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 15:13 #
IJay
member

I HAVE THREE WORDS FOR THIS LONG POST!

LOL!

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 15:26 #
IJay
member

SCIENCE OF HADITH and how the rules are made to authenticate the hadith. This is something so sacred that could never be done without the help of Allah swt and you are such a idiot who is nullifying all the efforts put into this. This was not done by some specific sect, this was done by muslims to save the word of Prophet PBUH so idiots like you will not be able to corrupt it.

who made this rule! names ..proofs! no stories

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 15:27 #
IJay
member

show where they say according them " they never met"
references not your words mr letsdoit!

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 15:28 #
IJay
member

letsdoit!

its my iman no one in this world can corrupt his word!

what is yours?

you think it can be corrupted? well done1 end of discussion

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 15:32 #
zingaro
Member

Ijay..i agree with letsdoIt..all Ahadith are analyzed on the standards of Ismaa-ar-Rijal..As per my information .. around 500,000 people's history was recorded just to verify the truth of a statement claimed to be linked with Prophet (SAW). And this was not done by only one or few people but certainly a large number of researchers were involved. This was such a glorious efforts made by the followers of Prophet (SAW) that other religions are unable to present such an example. And by the way Munkireen-e-Ahadith has problem with such kind of work because if they accept this science then their motives are buried alive.

One thing more .. all Sunni sects admit asmaa-ar-rijal and thats why in any conflict when they have debate..sometimes...one party admits the other's point of view..

Cheers:)

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 15:36 #
zingaro
Member

@Ijay .. you are right no one can actually corrupt his words.. but there are people who try to do so but they get failed...because there are standards available to srutinize..now please don't say that Ijmaa-e-Ummat is wrong ... because one sect can have something weak belief but Ijmaa-e-Ummat can't be wrong ...

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 15:38 #
IJay
member

who made those standards! if they are set by sunni sects they will rejects shia claims and if they are made by shais sect they will reject sunni claims

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 15:45 #
IJay
member

if this thing related with any of the imams specially wahabis i totally reject it

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 15:47 #
IJay
member

i think this is endless debate
time will answer thsi question i see many signs! i sense few things lets see
this day will come and will reveal everything to all of us!

but i totally reject what letsdoit said becuase i am doing research on this and i have found co relation of this hadeth with other religion scriptures!

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 15:51 #
zingaro
Member

@Ijay .. as per my information .. Shias also follow the same methodology of linkage in narration of Ahadith and most of the things and narrators are common except where are the matters purely related to some shia specific beliefs.

On the other hand .. in Sunni side .. they include all masaaliks of sunnis and there is actually nothing like Wahabis (a word actually used by British), because the real person whom this word is linked was named Mohammad and his father name was Abdul Wahab (Saudi Arabia) and he was also a follower of Hanbali sect of Sunnis..

and please also share with us your research on the topic..

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 16:05 #
NNL
member

Dude Ijay

When the sciences were organised by the Great Imams and Muhaddiths the rules were explicitly laid down and accepted by everyone. All the scholars agreed on this fact. The rules were laid down.

IF you are so sure that you have found the right Hadith and you believe it to be correct then you must have a valid source which says that Hadith is correct. can you post that source or the school of thought which declares it ok .

As for the part that Arabs Ulema will reject it. Thats a line i have a lot of times from the Bralvis when they want to do some phiri muradi bs. If you think that the arabs arent in the "Khurasan Army" then you are my friend are blinded by racism. and my first proof is that A hadith quoted by Chechan in Sahih Bukhari: Vol 4, Book 53. One-fifth Of Booty To The Cause Of All, Hadith 401. It mentions Arabs making pacts with the EU and EU will have its forces.

Please dont confuse things. And especially if one is bringing you some fact dont go yelling liar liar fake fake unless you havent heard the other side completely and have a rebuttal with extensive proof.
Its the emotional side we show when someone disagrees with our view we start off with takhfeer which is haram. Its gives Nonmuslims ( Qadyanis and others) on this site and elsewhere the point to fuss over.

PS The Shias dont have a Science of Hadiths. If you dont believe me then find out for yourself. They will have a book with the narrators names and thats pretty much it.

@Letsdoit.
Also whenever concerning ahadiths always be sure to mention the Book with the Imams have declared the Hadiths as weak.

@ Everyone.
Quran is the word of Allah(SWT). Its the only word that is promised to be in original State by Allah(SWT).
The Ahadiths have a science of its own in regards to ascertaining its strength cos the enemies of Islam have tried to do a lot of damage by conjuring up Ahadiths. The science was formulated by a lot of Muhadditeens who had devoted their lives on this aspect of Islam checking almost every hadith they came across. The Imams Bukhari and Muslim (rahimullah) had made lists of people who were deemed untrustworthy due a lot of reasons and those reasons are mentioned by them besides their names. Please remember that at that time different scholars were working on different fields. If Imam Bukhari was teaching Imam Hambal hadiths then Imam Shafi was Teaching him Fiqh. Same goes for Imam Abu Haneefa and others. These sciences and their decisions are all accepted by the Sunni community whether of any fiqh. There isnt any dispute period.

Allah Hu Alam

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 16:09 #
NNL
member

@ Ijay.

May i ask you why you hate Wahabis. ?

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 16:11 #
NNL
member

I can tell you exactly what the bible says and suprisingly it conincides with a few Hadiths related to the end of times or rather the Descent of Hazrat Essa PBUH

According to them US has to down on its knees and the Join EU and then all the Jews have to be in Israel and then EU will rule for 7 yrs and after that there will be a war and Essa ibn-e-Mariam PBUH will descent from the Heavens and take all the Evangelicals up in the heavens while the earth is being cleaned up.

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 16:15 #
NNL
member

Addition to the above post

These sciences and their decisions are all accepted by the Sunni community whether of any fiqh. There isnt any dispute period.
Unless some sect comes along and states that their Imam is more knowledgable then these Muhaddithteens and has a direct Line with Allah SWT who tells him what to do and what not to do. then you can have all sorts of things which have been proven false ie Ahmadiyya sect/Qadyanis.

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 16:21 #
IJay
member

there is no sunni community nobody follows complete sunnah they called themselves sunni! hypocrates!

same with shia they dont follow true teaching of imam husain and hazrat ali they called themselves shiyan ali!

Both sects are based on false claims these claims will be shattered after the arrival of imam mehdi! our true imam!

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 16:27 #
NNL
member

Sorry Disagree
My TRUE IMAM IS PROPHET MUHAMMAD SALALAHO ALAHAY WA SALLAM.
No Imam is parallel to him and incase you dont know that Hazrat Essa will lead the final battle.

As regards to Imam Mahdi the Shia community believes more in his powers than the Sunnis.

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 16:37 #
skyfacts
Blocked

@IJay
pls provide me help with that hadith of kinda.also any videos or news about his disability,proff of his citizenship,that he was canadian,how he was canadian.

yaar aap log larna shoroo ker daithy ho.comment and provide any proof of a hadith ,if you want to participate.

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 18:22 #
misalligned
Member

IJAY

you are a complete idiot. I suggest you to consult some scholar of your sect and ask him about the effectiveness of all this.

Posted 3 years ago on 20 May 2009 22:28 #