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Chairman CBR Abdullah Yusuf Senior Most Bureaucrat Dancing in front of Musharaf/

(54 posts)
  1. Londonistan

    Posted 7 years ago on 19 May 2008 9:54 #
  2. adeel

    wah sir jee wah U should have been hired as investigative journalists. U Might B as good as Ansar abbasi.
    What a pitty The whole nation is crying 4 bread & these rotten leeches with their sl*t wives R busy dancing \\\"under influence\\\"

    Posted 7 years ago on 19 May 2008 10:21 #
  3. Londonistan

    Guess what! its been wah pakistan establishment... inshallah we will crush you, burn you on the streets of pakistan, inshallah very soon

    Posted 7 years ago on 19 May 2008 20:32 #
  4. In ko jala do! in ka nishan mita do!
    in ko ragar kar mita do!
    Yeh nishan e ibrat bana do!
    Meri ummat ko jaga do!


    Posted 7 years ago on 19 May 2008 20:41 #
  5. AccountabilityAdvocate

    Please circulate widely, because this video is being removed from YouTube again!

    Posted 7 years ago on 19 May 2008 23:17 #
  6. AccountabilityAdvocate

    What is most disgusting is the chief tax collector of the country showing boot-licking skills to the masters. Unfortunately, this continuing saga of sing-along bureaucrats and diplomats (together with their begamat) has perpetuated the ruin of the homeland over the last 60 years.

    Posted 7 years ago on 20 May 2008 1:25 #
  7. check this >>

    Posted 7 years ago on 20 May 2008 2:08 #
  8. AccountabilityAdvocate

    @power2rule: Thanks. Very appropriate yet tragic juxtaposition!

    @mulla1: I see 1789, where shortage of bread too became the immediate trigger.

    Posted 7 years ago on 20 May 2008 2:18 #
  9. disgusting - admin put this on front page

    Posted 7 years ago on 20 May 2008 2:47 #
  10. adeel

    Here is the downloadable version!

    Posted 7 years ago on 20 May 2008 9:29 #
  11. nazia

    Teray ashiq nachaia kar kay thaya thaya

    why readers are angry on this nice gestrue of our top mangement.They are doing this on the call of their soul as said hazrat amir khusoroo.He is in blind love with mush,he is their almighty god father, his sain,his bhagwaan, his ......In our culture lower class dances in front of their pir shaihb to amuse them and that what he is doing.if our CJP iftikhat would had such kind of talent he could be second man of Mush but his personal dignity has led him down from the eyes of mush. I hope to see same videos of Kamal shah, altaf hussain,mailk qayyum, qusari,tariq aziz, gen durrani and many many more.Come on guys keep hunting the hi fi talent of our ruling mafia.I am desparetly looking for same performace from our chaudaries and zardari too.

    Posted 7 years ago on 20 May 2008 13:35 #
  12. Very disgusting, should be sent to Geo or Aaj to air this.

    Posted 7 years ago on 20 May 2008 15:04 #
  13. Rafi

    My comment may be little different.
    1. Dancing and drinking are personal choices, having a good time is every individuals right. I have no right to comment on that.
    2. **** kissing is national practices. AZ and NS also has **** kissers in their party. Even IK isn\'t above this practice.
    3. But I do condemn this attitude from ruling elites who show their indifference from corridors of power towards ultra poor masses who are struggling day in and day out. This shows that they give a **** about ultra poor. But Mush circle isn\'t only guilty party in this game. PPP recently gave and extravagent dinner, dinner is fine (government funcationary must meet informally) as long as it isn\'t too extravagment.

    Posted 7 years ago on 20 May 2008 15:30 #
  14. Londonistan

    @Gorazada Rafi saab,

    **** kissing is national practices. AZ and NS also has **** kissers in their party. Even IK isn\'t above this practice:

    Mr **** kisser saab could you explain the last part with proof? What makes IK part of your class i.e. **** licker

    Secondly, drinking is a practice not appreciated in our culture unless your dad is a Gora or you are a son of corrupt elite

    “Dancing and drinking are personal choices, having a good time is every individuals right. I have no right to comment on that.”

    Above statement is a standard statement of corrupt elites of Pakistan given to their children when they first time see their parents drunk in a house.

    Posted 7 years ago on 20 May 2008 18:15 #
  15. Rafi,

    Dont you understand?

    In Khalifa personal choices will not be tolerated, decisions will be made on your behalf and enforced on you by the govt.

    How dare that guy dance like a ****! Dancing and other such infidel-like acts will be punishable in Khalifa by flogging and/or stoning and/or be-heading, like it would be in any decent society with good morals.

    Posted 7 years ago on 20 May 2008 20:03 #
  16. misalligned

    Mr. secular, you fail to understand a simple fact. Dancing is not bad but i hope you know what society thinks of people who use dancing to get some personal benifits. Do you recall something, ok let me tell u we call them prostitutes and pimps and such pimps are ruling over us and that is a shame which we need to realize.

    Posted 7 years ago on 20 May 2008 20:18 #
  17. Rafi

    Dear London Bhai:
    I like my new nick name \'Gorazada\'. I am hoping to see first African American president in USA, this will be a history when worlds most poweful person or decision maker will be black, then you may hate blacks too.Yeh Yeh, the most powerful being is almighty but right now i am talking about human. You talk about Khilafah, but what about basic and simple message from last sermon which said that no white is superior than black and vice versa. Racism generates bigotry.
    I stand by what I said earlier. I condemn State controlled religion, it is voluntary thing. If I have to follow religion then I will do it out of love of God and Prophet not beacuse I fear them. As far as drinking is concern, if somebody is doing it in privacy of his home and nobody is disturb by his act. It is fine with and if God doesn\'t like it then he will punish that person on the day of judgement. But if he get drunk and start cursing fellow passer-by or get behind the wheel and start driving eratically then he must be arrested and put behind bars for next 30-60 days. His sentence may get longer if he hurt or abuse somebody under influence.
    I understand in your system of Khilafah (which is infact a fascistic approach in the name of religion), that is why I will continue to oppose your proposal.

    I like IK, I am his supporter and I made donations to his party too. And I guess you didn\'t get what I said, IK himself isn\'t an **** kisser but he has **** kisser behind him. I haven\'t seen any other voice or public face from the party. What message it convey?

    I always laugh whenever I hear or read these words \'****\' or \'Groupie\'. Remind me of something.

    Posted 7 years ago on 20 May 2008 20:43 #
  18. AccountabilityAdvocate

    @misalligned: well said. Nothing wrong with pimps and prostitutes (the oldest professions)-- but here the country\'s tax revenue is oozing through the fat a$$es of these dallas and begumats, while the down-trodden are selling kidneys for survival and/or committing suicide!

    Posted 7 years ago on 20 May 2008 21:54 #
  19. AccountabilityAdvocate


    As a moderator, could you please send the attached video clip to all your contacts in the media channels. Thank you. [It is already in circulation in the global financial markets.]

    Posted 7 years ago on 20 May 2008 22:05 #
  20. Londonistan

    I didnt said anything regarding Khilafah here, just showed the true face of your system\'s powerful people! Drunken Bastards Pimps and Prostitutes. And this is not done in privacy...this drunken **** is dancing in front of all the Haramee Establishment....

    Posted 7 years ago on 20 May 2008 22:51 #
  21. Rafi

    You and Khilafah are two sides of one coin. You don\'t have to say that in every thread.

    Posted 7 years ago on 20 May 2008 23:07 #
  22. rauf

    who was in charge.....of beloved land of pure...........Economic Hitman Shaukat Nafs Aziz or Commando Mushharaf ?

    Note the commanding shoka in the video

    Posted 7 years ago on 20 May 2008 23:37 #
  23. rauf

    Dear Londonistan.................I understand your sincerity...............but boiling in hate is not going to lead us towards a solution.........................our leaders are reflections of our own.............

    Posted 7 years ago on 20 May 2008 23:57 #
  24. Rafi

    GEO run that clip, its national news now.

    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 3:21 #
  25. Beenai

    yup...after runing that clip ...Capital talk went off air ...
    after resuming programme back..the whole discussion regarding the clip from Wasi Zafar,Farzana Raja and Hamid Mir been muted.......
    @accountability bhai,
    i am a moderator ...just like Yousuf Raza Gillani is the PM of
    just kidding....
    all the contacts are with Admin...he can send it across to all members....
    i think...after Capital talk ..its no need to send it ....actually...
    everybody can watch it on Capital Talk episode of May20th....

    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 4:44 #
  26. This is a disgrace.

    Look at how pathetic and unprofessional our media is.

    What is the need of showing a youtube video clip from a private function on national television.

    What was the purpose of this? This was a private function and what does it bother Hamid Mir and GEO if chairman CBR was giving a **** to Musharraf?

    What are they going to do if Imran Khan becomes PM? Show nude pics of him with Jemima?

    They might as well start recording clips of Yousuf Gilani having sex with his wife now and say \"Awam is facing atta and electricity crisis and our leaders are having sex in PM house\"

    This is absolutely disgraceful. I had some respect for Hamid Mir as he was a more professional journalist and was not fair and balanced on his programme than many other so called journalists like Shahid Masood, NJ and Mushtaq Minhas, but, today he **** me off

    I am never ever going to watch Geo News again, except Kamran Khan, geo news might as well add showing porno to its list of cheap tricks to gain viewership. Shameful.


    What does it bother you what A does in the presence of B or C? It is none of your business. If you have a problem with how they behave towards others or manage their jobs or departments or affect the country, thats a different thing, but, learn a thing or two about tolerance.

    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 8:02 #
  27. Beenai

    Secular bhai sahib,
    why we r worried about Mujra malangs in beurocracy and Govt?
    please go to any history book site and read about Mughlia Saltanat kay Zawal kay Asbab.
    or read baout Mohammad Shah Rangeela .....
    u can find strange simlilarities....

    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 8:33 #
  28. Anonymous

    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 9:18 #
  29. Adonis

    In western countries, media follows every move of public figures. One misstep and they are shreded to pieces by the media. This is accountability. Seems like this trend is now gaining ground in Pakistan as well which is a godd development.

    Incidentally, in this particular function, although not shown in this clip, mush also started his pathetic dance afterwards. (No this was not the infamous function in which he danced with a wine glass on his head).

    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 9:24 #
  30. Anonymous

    Nach Nach Yar manawan dey...

    Phawey Kanjri Ban\'na pai jawey..

    Ishq na darda ,, camera kolon..

    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 9:45 #

  31. Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 10:52 #
  32. Beenai

    why need the help of photoshop ?
    our General can provide us actual and real footage.

    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 11:30 #
  33. AccountabilityAdvocate


    Some people continue to be bereft of understanding the difference between a government run by USURPERS versus that by elected and accountable respresentatives of the people. The latter are subject to public scrutiny--and once their public misdeeds are exposed--they are eradicated from the system in not too long a time. [Mr.10-percent won\'t last either.] Get it!

    The wonderful juxtaposition of this clipping is that here the country\\\'s tax revenue is oozing through the fat a$$es of these self-IMPOSED dallas and begumats, while the down-trodden are selling kidneys for survival and/or committing suicide!

    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 14:58 #
  34. LOL your funny

    Democracy is over-rated. And, many instances, it doesnt work. I draw this conclusion after carefully following the politics of many many countries everyday for many many years. The reason? In democracy, you assume people are rational, you assume people will make the right decisions. In reality, in many many instances, they dont make the right decisions, for many reasons. Religion, sect, tribalism, race, creed, self-interest, short term interests rather than long term focus, ,emotionalism, superstition, ir-rational and illogical views and beliefs, socialism, protectionism, hate, fear, lack of understanding of critical areas and/or lack of intelligence and/or lack of information. I mean this is a scientific fact, the majority is always mediocre in terms of knowledge and intelligence, this applies everywhere, only a small minorty is extra-ordinarily intelligent and knowing, and, equally, a small minority is extra-ordinarily stupid. You can see this everywhere, schools, universities, a few get A+ and a few fail, the mojority always gets Bs and Cs. This applies to the general public, most average people are mediocres, they earn average salaries, do normal jobs, I mean this should be self-evident. Ofcourse many other reasons as well.

    Democracy is over-rated, the Nazis and Hitler were democratically elected, George Bush was democratically elected, Hamas was democratically elected, mullahs in the Arab world are democratically elected again and again and again. Most socialist govts. were democratically elected, it doesnt mean nothing.

    The greatest country of the 21st century, China, is run by usurpers and dictators. Democracy is over-rated.

    Just wait and watch, now hopefully the army wont come into politics and after a few elections, youll realise my point, democracy is over-rated, when there is no Musharraf or army for everyone to aim their guns at, people will understand this, soon enough, we (and by we I mean you and other people) will be fed up of democratic govts as well, election after election, people will be happy for the first few months, then they\\\\\\\'ll be like this is bullcrap lool Democracy is over-rated, right now you and the media are suffering from Musharraf-phobia, democracy will cure this, you will realise this, just wait and see a few years of democracy and a few elections.


    Please live in the present, I know about the stories of Mughals, they failed not because they sang and danced, but, because they didnt do anything else, the US presidents always sings and sometimes even dance, they didnt collapse because of that, I dont believe in such superstition.

    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 16:10 #
  35. AccountabilityAdvocate


    May you rest in peace and enjoy the loot through your benefactor dictators.

    Long live Hamid Mir!

    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 16:36 #
  36. Adonis,

    In western countries, media follows every move of public figures. One misstep and they are shreded to pieces by the media.

    Yes, in western countries, the media follows every move of Paris Hilton and Lindsay Lohan and David Beckham, such media outlets and programs are viewed people with peanut sized brains and Britney Spears wannabees.

    Yes, this is exactly what we have been missing in Pakistan.

    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 16:40 #
  37. My dear Secular_Pakistan,
    Without involving into a long academic, intellectual and scholarly debate,
    I understand that Democracy is the only civilized, logical, the best available and universally accepted system to hand over the Sovereignty of a State to the representatives of the people through a peaceful change over, without bloodshed, killings and tyranny.
    A few bad democracies or a few good dictatorships do not constitute a criterion to establish the principle of acceptance or rejection.
    The Institution of Democracy evolved through a long historical process of trial and errors starting from the century’s old principle to capture the power through sword and a force of elephants.
    A few bad children born out of a universally accepted and recognized norm of Wedding, cannot be condemned, where we find a few very good and successful bastards.

    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 16:59 #
  38. Londonistan

    I Rest My Case!

    The following is a the lecture which Hazrat Ali gave to one of this governors Malik before sending him to his region.

    Maalik! You must create in your mind kindness, compassion and love for your subjects. Do not behave towards them as if you are a voracious and ravenous beast and as if your success lies in devouring them.

    Remember Maalik that amongst your subjects there are two kinds of people: ?those who have the same religion as you have; they are brothers to you, and ?those who have religions other than yours, they are human beings like you. Men ?of either category suffer from the same weaknesses and disabilities that human ?beings are inclined to, they commit sins, indulge in vices either intentionally or ?unintentionally and mistakenly without realizing the enormity of their deeds. Let ?your mercy and compassion come to their rescue and help in the same way and ?to the same extent that you expect Allah(God) to show mercy and forgiveness to you. ?You must never forget that if you are a ruler over them, than your wali [Imam Ali ??(pbuh) is referring to himself] is the ruler over you and Allah is the Supreme Lord ?over the wali. And the reality is that He has appointed you as the governor and ?tested you through the responsibility of this rule [that He has given you] over ?them. ?
    ?*?? ??*?? ??*?

    And you should never be remorseful if you forgive. And do not be pleased and ?proud of your punishment. Do not get angry and lose your temper quickly over the mistakes and failures of those over whom you rule. On the contrary, be patient and sympathetic with them. Anger and desire of vengeance are not going ?to be of much help to you in your administration.

    If you ever feel any pride or vanity on account of your rule over your subjects ?then think of the Supreme Rule of the Lord over the Universe, the extent of His ?creations, the supremacy of His Might and Glory, His Power to do things which ?you cannot even dream of doing and His control over you which is more ?dominating than that which you can ever achieve over anything around you. ?Such thoughts will cure your mental weakness, will keep you away from vanity ?and rebellion (against Allah), will reduce your arrogance and haughtiness and will ?take you back to the sanity which you had foolishly deserted.?

    So far as your own affairs or those of your relatives and friends are concerned take care that you do not violate the duties laid down upon you by Allah and do ?not usurp the rights of mankind, be impartial and do justice to them, because if ?you give up equity and justice, then you will certainly be a tyrant and an ?oppressor. And whoever tyrannizes and oppresses the creatures of Allah, will ?earn enmity of Allah along with the hatred of those whom he has oppressed and ?whoever earns the Wrath of Allah loses all chances of salvation and he has no ?excuse to offer on the Day of Judgment. Every tyrant and oppressor is an enemy ?of Allah unless he repents and gives up oppression. Remember Maalik, that ?there is nothing in this world more effective to turn His Blessings into His Wrath ?than to insist upon oppression over His creatures because the Merciful Allah will ?always hear the prayers of those who have been oppressed and He will give no ?chance to oppressors.

    You must always appreciate and adopt a policy which is neither too severe nor ?too lenient; a policy which is based upon equity will be largely appreciated. ?Remember that the displeasure of common men, the have-nots and the ?depressed persons lays heavier in the balance than the approval of important ?persons, while the displeasure of a few big people will be excused by the Lord if ?the general public and the masses of your subjects are happy with you. ?

    Remember Maalik, that these personages are the people who will be the worst ?drag upon you during your moments of peace and happiness, and the least ?useful to you during your hours of need and adversity, they hate justice the most, ?they will keep on demanding more and more out of the State resources and will ?seldom be satisfied with what they receive and will never be obliged for the favor ?shown to them if their demands are justifiable refused, they will never accept any ?reasonable excuse or any rational argument and when the time changes, you will ?never find them staunch, faithful and loyal. ?

    While the common men, the poor and apparently less important section of your subjects are the pillars of Islam, they are the real congregation of Muslims and ?the power and defensive force against the enemies of Islam. Keep your mind on their affairs, be more friendly with them and secure their trust and goodwill.

    But be careful in forming your contacts (whether with the important persons or ?the commoners). Keep such people away from you and think them to be the ?enemy of the State who are scandal-mongers and who try to find fault with others ?and carry on propaganda against them because everywhere people have ?weaknesses and failings and it is the duty of the government to overlook (minor) ?shortcomings. You must not try to go in search of those weaknesses which are ?hidden from you, leave them to Allah, and about those weaknesses which come ?to your notice, you must try to teach them how to overcome them. Try not to ?expose the weaknesses of the people and Allah will conceal your own ?weaknesses which you do not want anybody to know.?

    Do not give cause to the people to envy each other [man against man, tribe ?against tribe or one section of the society against the other]. Try to alleviate and ?root out mutual distrust and enmity from amongst your subjects.?

    Be fair, impartial and just in your dealings with all, individually and collectively ?and be careful not to make your person, position and favors act as sources of ?malice. Do not let any such thing or such person come near to you who does not ?deserve your nearness and your favor. Never lower your dignity and prestige.?

    Remember that backbiters and scandal-mongers belong to a mean and cunning ?group, though they pretend to be sincere advisers. Do not make haste to believe ?the news they bring and do not heed to their advice.?

    Do not accept the advice of bakheel [bakheel is a person who is not only very ?stingy with his own money, but has an envious character and does not like others ?to contribute anything of theirs to other people]. They will try their best to keep ?you away from acts of kindness and from doing good to others. They will make ?you frightened of poverty.?

    Similarly do not allow cowards to act as your advisers because they will make ?you timid in enforcing your orders, will scare you from handling important affairs boldly and will make your enterprises and invasions timid and fearful attempts. At ?the same time avoid greedy and covetous persons who would aspire to the ?position of acting as your counselor because he will teach you how to exploit the community and how to oppress people to get their wealth. Remember that ?miserliness, cowardice and greed appear to be different wicked qualities but they ?all arise from the same evil mentality of having no faith and no trust in Allah.

    Your worst ministers will be the men who had been ministers to the despotic ?rulers before you and who had been a party of atrocities committed by them. ?Such persons should not be taken into your confidence and should not be trusted ?because they have aided sinners and have assisted tyrants and cruel rulers.?

    In their stead you can comfortably find persons who are equally wise and learned ?but who have not developed sinful and criminal mentalities, who have neither ?helped the tyrants in their tyrannies nor have they assisted them to carry on their ?sinful deeds.?

    Such persons will prove the least troublesome to you. They will be the most ?helpful. They will sincerely sympathize with you. If you take them in your ?confidence they will sever their connections with your opponents. Keep such ?people with you as your companions in your informal company as well as in ?official gatherings in audience. From amongst such honest and humane companions and ministers some would receive your fullest confidence and trust. They are those who can always speak out the bitter truth to you and ?unreservedly and without fear of your status, can refuse to assist you or associate with you in the deeds which Allah does not like His good creatures to commit.

    Select honest, truthful and pious people as your companions. Train them not to flatter you and not to seek your favor by false praises because flattery and false ?praises create vanity and conceit and they make a man lose sight of his real self and ignore his duties.

    You should not treat good and bad people alike because in this way you will be discouraging good persons and at the same time emboldening the wicked to carry on their wickedness. Everyone should receive the treatment which his deeds make him deserve.

    Have a lot of dialogues with aalims [learned scholars] and a lot of discussions with hukama [wise persons who are truth-seekers and thinkers] because these [dialogues and discussions] would initiate and stabilize prosperity and improvement for the country. And also restore law and order which existed in the past.

    You must know Maalik that the people over whom you rule are divided into classes and grades and the prosperity and welfare of each class of the society ?individually and collectively are so interdependent upon the well-being of the ?other classes that the whole set-up represents a closely woven and reciprocal ?net. One class cannot exist peacefully, cannot live happily and cannot work ?without the support and good wishes of the other. ?

    Amongst them are God’s faithful soldiers who defend His cause, the next class is ?that of the secretaries of the State to whom duties of writing out and issuing ?special or general orders are assigned, the third group is that of the judges and ?magistrates to administer justice, the fourth is of officers who maintain law and ?order and guard the peace and prosperity of the country. Then there are common men, the Muslims who pay the taxes levied by the government, and non-Muslims who pay the taxes levied by the government, and non-Muslims who pay tribute to the State (in lieu of taxes). Then comes the class of men who carry on various professions and trades and the last but not the least are the poor and the have-nots who are considered as the lowest class of the society. The Merciful Allah ?has fixed the rights and duties of each one of them. They have been either mentioned in His Book or explained through the instructions of the Holy Prophet (pbuh). A complete code of them is preserved with us.

    Then there is the class of the poor and the disabled persons. It is absolutely necessary that they should be looked after, helped and well-provided for. The Merciful Allah has explained the ways and means of maintaining and providing for each of these classes. And everyone of this class has the right upon the ruler of the State that the minimum necessities for its well-being and contented living are provided for.

    Remember, Maalik that Almighty Allah will not absolve any ruler from his obligations unless he sincerely tries his best to discharge his duties, invokes Allah to help him in their performance, remains steadfast and diligent on the path of truth and justice and bears all this whether the performance of these duties is congenial or hateful to him.

    Protect your government from dishonest officers. If you find any of them dishonest and your confidential intelligence service submits acceptable proofs of his dishonesty, then you must punish him. This may be corporal punishment besides dismissal from service and taking back from him all which he has dishonestly collected. He must be humiliated and must be made to realize the ?infamy of his wicked deeds. His humiliation and punishment must be given publicly so that it may serve as a lesson and a deterrent to others.

    In reality a state lives upon the revenues collected from the tax-payers. Therefore, more importance should be attached to the fertility of land than to the collection of taxes because actual taxable capacity of people rests upon the fertility of the land. The ruler, who does not pay attention to the prosperity of his subjects and fertility of the land but concentrates only on collection of revenues, lays waste the land and consequently ruins the State and brings destruction to the creatures of Allah. His rule cannot last for long.

    By Allah, by Allah, I want to caution you about the poor. Fear Allah about their conditions and your attitude towards them. They have no support, no resources and no opportunities. They are poor, they are destitute and many of them are ?disabled and unfit for work. Some of them come out begging and some (who maintain self-respect) do not beg, but their condition speaks of their distress, poverty, destitution and need. For the sake of Allah, Maalik, protect them and ?their rights. He has laid the responsibility of this upon your shoulders. You must ?fix a share for them from Beit-ul Maal (the Government Treasury). Besides this ?reserve in cash, you must also reserve a share in kind of crops from government granaries in cities where food-grains are stored as are cultivated on State-owned land because in these storages the share of those living far away from any ?particular city is equal to the share of those living nearby.

    Let me remind you once again that you are made responsible for guarding the rights of the poor people and for looking after their welfare. Take care that the conceit of your position and vanity of wealth may not deceive you to lose sight of such a grave and important responsibility. Yours is such an important post that you cannot claim immunity from the responsibility of even minor errors of commission or omission with an excuse that you were engrossed in the major problems of the State which you have solved diligently.

    Therefore, be very careful of the welfare of the poor people. Do not be arrogant and vain against them. Remember that you have to take particular care of those ?who cannot reach you, who’s poverty-stricken and disease-ridden sight may be hateful to you, and whom society treats with disgust, loathing and contempt. You should be a source of comfort, love and respect to them. Appoint a respectable, ?honest and pious person - a person who fears Allah and who can treat them ?honorably, order him to find out everything about them and to submit a report to you.

    Then treat these poor people in such a way that on the Day of Judgment you can plead your case successfully before Allah because of all classes of your subjects this class deserves more of your attention, sympathy and fair-deal.

    Though every one of these poor persons deserves your sympathy and you will ?have to do justice to His cause to achieve His favor, yet you should pay more ?attention to young orphans and the old disabled. They neither have any support ?nor can they conveniently come out begging. They cannot reach you, therefore, ?you must reach them.?

    Remember that the fulfillment of this obligation and duty is considered as a ?tiresome burden by most of the rulers but to those who desire to achieve His ?Blessings and to enter into His Realm, even this work seems light and congenial. ?They bear it happily, dutifully and sincerely. They find pleasures in it and they believe in the promise made by Allah.?

    Out of your hours of work, fix a time for the complainants and for those who want ?to approach you with their grievances. During this time you should not do other ?work but hear them and pay attention to their complaints and grievances. For this ?purpose you must arrange public audience for them during this audience, for the ?sake of Allah, treat them with kindness, courtesy and respect. Do not let your ?army and police be in the audience hall at such times so that those who have ?grievances against your regime may speak to you freely, unreservedly and ?without fear.?

    All this is a necessary factor of your rule because I have often heard the Holy ?Prophet (pbuh) saying, “The nation, where that rights of the oppressed, destitute ?and down-trodden are not guarded and where the mighty and powerful persons ?are not forced to accede these rights, cannot achieve salvation”. You must ?remember that in those audiences the most common men will gather. Therefore, ?if you find them misbehaving, becoming unmannerly or if you feel that their talk is ?irrelevant, tolerate them; do not be rude and do not insult them, so that Allah may ?be kind and merciful to you and may reward you for obeying His commands ?explicitly. Treat them courteously, hear their grievances patiently and if you are ?forced to reject their demands then reject them in such a way that your rejection ?may please them as much as your grants.

    Then there are certain duties which only you will have to perform and which none ?of your officers can carry out. Among them are replies to the letters of your ?commissioners and governors and they are beyond the jurisdiction or preview of ?your secretaries. If you find that your officers are not attending as much to the ?complaints of the public as they should, then you should personally attend to ?them.?

    You must finish a day’s work on that day only because each day will bring its own ?special work for you. Reserve your best time for prayers to Allah, though every ?work of the State is the work of Allah, especially, if you are sincere and honest, ?and if your subjects are happy with your rule and are safe from your oppression.

    Among those duties that you are to perform diligently must be your daily prayers. ?These should be offered sincerely and persistently. You must fix times for this ?during days and nights. You must tax your bodily strength for this duty though it ?may tire you.?

    ?* * *?

    You must take care not to cut yourself off from the public. Do not place a curtain ?of false prestige between you and those over whom you rule. Such pretensions ?and show of pomp and pride are in reality manifestations of inferiority complex ?and vanity. The result of such an attitude is that you remain ignorant of the ?conditions of your subjects and of the actual cases of the events occurring in the ?State.?

    You will fail to realize comparative importance of events taking place and may ?attach great significance to minor events and may slip over important facts, ?similarly you may attach importance to mediocre or insignificant people and may ?ignore real men of consequence; and what is more, you may lose the power of ?distinction between good and bad and may take one for the other or hopelessly ?mix up the two.

    You should never overlook the fact that around the rulers there usually are ?certain privileged persons (relatives and friends). They may often try to take advantage of their status and may resort to selfishness, intrigues, fraud, ?corruption and oppression. If you find such people around you then do away with ?them (however closely connected they may be with you), immediately bring an ?end to the scandal and clear your surroundings of all such moral and spiritual ?filth.?

    You must never give lands in permanent lease with all proprietary and ownership ?rights to your friends and relatives. You must never allow them to take ?possession of the source of water-supply or lands which have special utility for ?the communities. If they get possession of such holdings they will oppress others ?to derive undue benefits and thus gather all the fruits for themselves leaving for ?you a bad reputation in this world and punishment in the next.?

    Be fair in dispensing justice. Punish those who deserve punishment even though ?he may be your near relation or a close friend and even if such an action may ?give you pangs of sorrow and grief. Bear such a sorrow patiently and hope for ?Divine reward. I assure you this will bear good fruits.?

    If on account of your strict measures people get suspicious of your behaving like ?a tyrant and oppressor, then come out openly before them and explain to them ?the reasons of your actions and let them see the facts for themselves and realize ?the truth. This will give training to your mind, will be an act of kindness to the ?subjects and the confidence thus reposed in them will make them support justice ?and truth while you will achieve the end you have in view of obtaining their ?support in the cause of truth.?

    If your enemy invites you to a peace treaty that will be agreeable to Allah, then ?never refuse to accept such an offer because peace will bring rest and comfort to your armies, will relieve you of anxieties and worries, and will bring prosperity ?and affluence to your people. But even after such treaties be very careful of the enemies and do not place too much confidence in their promises because they often resort to peace treaty to deceive and delude you and take advantage of ?your negligence, carelessness and trust.

    At the same time be very careful, never break your promise with your enemy, ?never forsake the protection or support that you have offered to him, never go ?back upon your words, and never violate the terms of the treaty. You must even ?risk your life to fulfill the promises given and the terms settled because of all the ?obligations laid by Almighty Allah upon man (in respect to other men) there is ?none so important as to keep one’s promises when made. ?

    Allah has given promises and treaties the high rank of being messengers of peace and prosperity and through His Kindness and Mercy has made them a ?common desire (of keeping promises) in the minds of all men and a common requirement for all human beings. He has made them such a shelter and asylum that everybody desires to be under their protection.

    Therefore, there should be no mental reservation, no fraud, no deception and no ?underlying meanings in between the lines when you make a promise or conclude ?a treaty. Do not use such words and phrases in your promises and treaties as ?have possibilities of being translated in more than one way or as may have ?various interpretations and many explanations, let there be no ambiguity in them, ?and let them be clear, precise and to the point. And when once a treaty has been ?finally concluded, do not try to take advantage of any ambiguous word or phrase ?in it. If you find yourself in a critical situation on account of the treaty made in the ?cause of Allah, then try to face the situation and bear the consequences bravely ?and do not try to back out of the terms that account, because to face such ?perplexing situations as may gain His Rewards and Blessings is better than to ?break your promises on that account and earn that about which you feel nervous ?and for which you will have to answer Allah and which may bring down His Wrath ?upon you in this world and damnation in the next.?

    Beware and do not develop the trait of self-admiration and self-appreciation. Do not get conceited of the good points that you find in your good character or good ?deeds that you have done. Do not let flattery and cajolery make you vain and ?ego-centric. Remember that of all the cunning ruses of the devil to undo good ?deeds of the pious people and to affect their piety, flattery and false praises are the ones on which it relies the most.

    Do not boast of the favors and kindnesses that you have done to your subjects ?and do not try to make them realize this, do not think too much of the good that ?you have done to them, and do not go back upon the promises made, all these ?three habits are very ugly features of one’s character. The practice of boasting ?over the favors done undoes the good done, the habit of exaggerating and ?thinking very highly of our good actions will make us lose the guidance of Allah, ?and the habit of breaking one’s promises is disliked both by Allah and by man. ?The Merciful Allah says, “It is most hateful in the sight of Allah, to say something ?and not to practice it.” [Holy Qur\'an, 61:3].?

    Do not be hasty and do not precipitate your decisions and actions, when the time ?comes for an action to be done, or a decision to be taken, then do not be lazy ?and do not waste time and do not show weakness. When you do not find a true ?way to do the thing on hand, then do not persist on the wrong way and when you ?have found a correct solution, then do not be lethargic in adopting it. ?
    In short do everything at a proper time and in a proper way and keep everything ?in its proper place.?

    I beseech Allah that by His Limitless Mercy and by His Supreme Might He may ?grant our prayers, that He may lead both of us to the Divine Guidance of achieving His Pleasure, of successfully pleading our cases before Him, justifying our deeds before man, of gaining good repute, of leaving good results of our ?benign and just rule with ever-expanding prosperity and ever-increasing welfare ?of the State and of meeting our ends as martyrs and pious persons, as our return is towards Him only.

    May the peace of Allah be upon theHoly Prophet (pbuh) and His chosen descendants.

    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 17:06 #
  39. Accountability,

    Excuse me but what do you mean by loot through my benefactor dictators???

    I have nothing to do with Musharraf or PML-Q or army or even politics or beuracracy. I have one family member who was a major in the army and retired a long time ago, and, he too has nothing to do with politics or beuracracy. Infact, he hates Musharraf.

    Is this your level of tolerance? That you launch personal attacks if you cant/dont want to debate?

    Mr. Shiekh long time no see,

    Sir, it is not a few democracies that are flawed, but, if most. If you look at all the countries in the world that have democratic govts. You will see that MOST of them could be run much better by someone with half a brain. There are only a few democracies where you could say, this country is governed as best as it can be.

    And, no sir, I am not saying that dictatorship is good. That would be such a vague and generalised view for something that varies so much from case to case. North Korea and Cuba are also dictatorships. Do I support them? Are they run well? Not at all.

    I judge governments case by case, not based on whether they are democracies or dictatorships. These are very arbitrary concepts. Look, democracy is not a divine or a holy or a magical concept as people like Accountability Advocate and our democracy deprived media portray it to be. It is not even a perfect concept. The thing is democracy is the best out of all the options IN THE LONG RUN. I agree to that as well, but, in the long run, eventually, that is the end objective. It doesnt mean you have to have democracy now and that all countries must have it now. There is a reason behind why democracy is the best option in the LONG RUN. Now, lets say you have a monarchy. Now, lets say the monarch is the most intelligent, most sincere, hard working, brightest, visionary ruler. He does the best that could possibly be done in his given situation. He achieves for the country what no democracy would, but, eventually, this monarch will die, and, his son will replace him, what guarantee is there that his son will be a visionary too? What guarantee is there that his son will be sincere? What guarantee is that his son wont be a ****? There is none. This monarch could be any one person. He could be an emperor, he could be a general, he could be an undisputed civilian ruler. There are many many instances where there are such one man ruled countries.

    Similarly, you could have a one party system where only one party runs the govt. and thats it. But, what guarantee is there that after years and years of power, they wont become incompetent and complacent and lazy and corrupt? There is none.

    Now, imagine these systems in the LONG RUN, lets say over a 200 year period. What will happen? In 200 years, you could go from being ruled by the greatest monarch ever to Kim Jong Il or Fidel Castro.

    This is why democracy is the best out of all these options in the LONG RUN, because, in democracy, if the people wont be 80%, they\\\'ll be 60% right or 50% right. If they wont be right today, maybe theyll make the right choices in 10 years or 20 years or 30 years or 50 years. If they arent 90% logical, theyll be 70% logical or 60% logical or 50% logical, but, with a monarchy, or a one man rule, or a one party rule, there is no guarantee you will even get 1% logic in 50 years from now. In other systems, the ruler may be a blind deaf and dumb monkey clone, there is no guarantee he wont be.

    This is why democracy is the best out of all the governing systems. But, again, it is far from perfect, there is nothing great or holy or divine about democracy as many portray it to be.

    Democracy is more of a goal or target which is eventually to be achieved to ensure the other scenarios I mentioned dont come about. It is an END GOAL. It is not something that you have to have today or have to have this year. It is not something that will come and everything will start changing immediately. It might be 50 years before democracy starts delivering anything. There are many instances where, democracy will take a 100 years to delivery what autocratic regimes deliver in 15 or 20 years.

    In such a situation, you may have the trade-off between democracy and extra-ordinary achievements. In such a situation, the best thing is that even if democracy has to wait another 20 years, you should aim for that achievement. If today, China is confronted with the chance of maintaining its pace of progress and development and economic growth, and, complete democracy, it should go for the former. Because, democracy will come in the end anyways, and, development only speeds up the process, but, lost time cannot be recovered (and eventually there will be a democratic China). The difference between China and India is that India started in the 90s what China did in the 80s, a mere 10 years gap, and, look at the difference. There are many examples where autocratic regimes achieve what democratic govts. would take 10 times as many years to do.

    So, I judge regimes individually on a case by case basis, not on arbitrary basis of democracy or dictatorship.

    Democracy is an end goal, something to be achieved in the long run, and, in the meantime, I assess regimes on a case by case basis. It is an ideal that should be the long term aim.

    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 17:40 #
  40. AccountabilityAdvocate

    I am mighty pleased that the Capital Talk\'s airing of the current FBR Chairman\'s video is being widely hailed globally (including International Financial Institutions, donor agencies, and the Media) as FREEDOM of Exposure. Not surprisingly, in most dictatorships like ours, it was pulled off the air and from YouTube by those who felt tabasco in their glorious a$$es!

    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 17:50 #
  41. My dear Londonistan,
    The 95% of the lecture from Hazrat Ali, is in practice in the USA, UK, France, Germany, Japan, China, Russia, Denmark, Holland, Australia, Canada, Switzerland and so many other States of the Globe, with the exception of a single Islamic State.
    How is that?

    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 18:28 #
  42. Ok, I edited my last post, it was posted first by mistake.

    Freedom of everything should exist. But, media should show responsibility towards its journalistic duties. Do you see BBC airing Gordon Brown and alistair campbell dancing at private parties? Do they make animations of their ministers and politicians and play their edited clips with bollywood music in the background?

    I mean, I believe in freedom of expression, but, media should behave responsibly and most importantly this means performing their duties rightfully.

    Plus think of the impact such things have on the common person who is not very educated or bright.

    I mean this is like if a Dutch news channel brings out the Quran and start tearing it off and flushing it down the toilet on national television and then say FREEDOM OF MEDIA AND SPEECH, ITS OUR RIGHT!

    This is not responsible behaviour, this is not wise behaviour, it is counterproductive.

    This is not the role of the media.

    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 18:41 #
  43. AccountabilityAdvocate

    @ Secular_Pakistan:

    What is it that infuriated you so much about an independent TV channel airing the video of the FBR Chairman? Surely, it did not please loan defaulters--which I do NOT think you are.

    Surely, FREEDOM of SPEECH has limits---as long as it is not offensive. If the event were a private function, the CBR Chairman is entitled to file a libel suit.

    Let\'s not forget: in public life, nothing is private. As for making fun of politicians, watch this:

    [This amusing viral video casts the Iraq war alliance between George W. Bush and Tony Blair in a whole new light. Created by Johan Söderberg for a Swedish television program called \'Kobra,\' this parody synchs up images of Bush and Blair singing Diana Ross and Lionel Richie\'s breathless ballad \"Endless Love.\" Their war may have gone horribly awry, but their hearts still beat as one.]

    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 19:28 #
  44. oh yar bas vi karo...koi hoor gal karo!


    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 19:36 #
  45. Accountability,

    What infuriates me is the lack of professionalism, objectivism and bias, sensationalism and stupidity of the media.

    File a libel suit in Pakistan? lol

    The media will start crying as it usually does and say it is an attempt to silence the media and prevent them from showing the truth.

    Look, I am not saying freedom of speech has limits, Hamid Mir can say whatever he wants about anyone off the screen. I am saying professional journalism has its requirements and standards, like many other professions do. On national (and international now) television, show some responsbility, show responsibility towards your own profession! You know, even all the media and journalists associations in Pakistan have their ethics and code of conduct which state things like nothing will be sensationalised, we wont be biased, we wont emotionalise things, we will be objective, all this stuff that responsible and professional media should follow, but no one does in Pakistan. I am so disappointed by the Pakistani media that now I only watch Kamran Khan on GEO and Dawn News.

    Look what you posted is made apparently for some Swedish channel or something, but, you wont find this crap and the other crap they show on GEO on like BBC News and stuff. For gods sake, GEO is Pakistans most watched channel, its not like your posting something on youtube.

    I also wanted to add 2 more points.

    You can sum up my previous post as, democracy is the only sustainable long term system. Do a rough analogy with fossil fuels and renewable energy. Renewable energy is the only sustainable long term fuel source, but, does that mean we all have to start using 100% renewable today? No sir. In many cases, doing so will mean you will be living a 17th century lifestyle in a cave. What this means is, that, eventually you will need to come to renewable sources. That is the end goal. So is democracy. And, you never achieve democracy in a day or in a year. You can try any revolution, it wont happen, it will take its time and over time you will become more and more democratic. Pakistan today is more democratic than at any time in its 60 year history, and, hopefully, this will only improve. The best strategy is continous steady progress.

    Another point I think I mentioned in another thread as well. Democracy can only properly work in a developed country. You can run this. All the developed countries are also democracies, but, not all democracies are developed, or even fast developing. This is I a beahavioural phenomenon, when people are empowered, educated, wealthy, informed, they have more concern for democracy and human rights and their rights. People who struggle everyday to make ends meet and who have to worry about how they will put food on the table at night, they dont have much concern for such things. In human resource management, there is a hierarchy of needs according to some theorist, first concern is stuff like food, shelter, clothing, if you dont have food to eat, you probably dont care much for democracy and human rights and independent judiciary, once a level of needs is met, you move on to the next level. Once material and financial needs are met, you are more concerned for other psychological, spiritual and these kinds of needs. This is why these issues are important in the urban middle classes, this is evident in Pakistan. Also, along with education, wealth, healthcare comes empowerment. Someone who is a mazdoor is not very empowered no matter how many times he can go and vote.

    So, in my opinion, the best strategy for developing countries is, to first of all kickstart development, economic growth and progress, once these become sustainable and irreversible, start gradual and steady democratization. But democracy without development, a good economy and progress means nothing. Also, it wont be a true democracy anyways, you need an educated and well off population for true democracy anyways.

    For developed countries, obivously the priorities are different because they are ALREADY developed.

    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 20:27 #
  46. misalligned

    Mulla bahi jaan, pare da mara! da se maghozo satak de?

    OMG very long posts, believe me even if i want i am not able to read these long messages. sorry for that.

    for secular bahi jaan, anything against Quran could hurt billions muslims because this is sacred for them and showing the MUJRA of one **** will hurt only few ppl like you who support these a**holes and their master. So difference is there, you just need to open your eyes.

    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 20:29 #
  47. Rafi

    Too much back and forth happernned. I am not going to write in detail but I am going to second and endorse pretty mush everything JS Saheb wrote. Democratic institutions are more important than individuals. If Bush made mistakes then people will not even vote for Republican in Nov\\\'08. And Democrats will take over for change of policy. Also doesn\\\'t matter if masses have avergae IQ, but bringing masses in the loop of selecting Governemt will give them space to think outside the box. They won\\\'t feel stangled by over IQ masses, also it is not necessary that all ruling class has above average IQ and all ruled class had low IQ. Some low IQ upper class people are in that position because of their connections, family or inheritence. Some lower class peoeple also carry very good IQ but they may be slave of their circumstance, they can\\\'t crooss class boundry. I guess your argument is pretty much flawed.

    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 20:37 #
  48. AccountabilityAdvocate


    I agree. Mein tey thak gayan haan es Secular noon samjha samjha key!

    Secular_Pakistan: Please no more further discussion with me; hope you respect my wishes.

    THE END.

    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 20:41 #
  49. Misalligned,

    Our discussion is based on how the media should behave, not whether it hurts someone or not.


    Please read my previous posts, looking at your post tells me you didnt read them. Read them you might get where I am coming from talking about democracy.

    I am out, I am on the wrong forum.

    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 21:58 #
  50. shikra

    What a beautiful argument to differentiate between the good and bad!

    **A few bad children born out of a universally accepted and recognized norm of Wedding, cannot be condemned, where we find a few very good and successful bastards.**

    The Institution of wedding cannot be discarded or replaced if some children, genetically turn out bad out of a wedlock.
    Democracy, how bad it could be, should not be replaced by dictatorship, how good a particular Dictator might be.

    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 23:21 #
  51. Rafi

    I wish if I could read your post but it was too long.

    Posted 7 years ago on 21 May 2008 23:52 #
  52. Rafi

    I quickly scanned your points.
    1. I disagee that development first and then domecracy. America is democratic for 230 years, it wasn\'t too developed in first 100 years.
    2. Once again, media is product and we are consumer. Make a choice and switch chasnnel if you don\'t like Hamid Mir. As far influencing people is concern, in USA Rush Limbaugh, Shaun Hennity also influnce educated masses. Please don\'t think illiterates doesn\'t posses required intelligence. Intelligence and education are two different ball games.

    Posted 7 years ago on 22 May 2008 0:18 #
  53. misalligned

    secular just in one sentence. Your building is baseless, its not on the ground. You are defending one dictator. The worst democracy is better than a very good dictator. case closed.

    Posted 7 years ago on 22 May 2008 11:09 #
  54. Please stay at the track of the thread.
    Only one bitter piece cannot drop the status of Mango, for being the King of Fruit.

    Posted 7 years ago on 23 May 2008 13:39 #

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