PKPolitics Discuss » Current Issues

Dragging Central Asia into the Afghan War....

(15 posts)
  1. One of the ways the Mujahideen defeated the USSR’s occupation of Afghanistan in the 80s was that they severed the supply lines to Afghanistan from the USSR, which at the time included Tajikistan and Uzbekistan etc. They constantly harassed and attacked the conveys. The supply lines from Central Asia are very vulnerable to attack.

    The US is trying to diversify its supply chain. The maps show that it is an impossible task to get supplies to Afghanistan without the support of Pakistan.

    This is the long circuitous route the US has to take in order to get supplies to Afghanistan. It is expensive, unreliable and subject to the whim of Russia and a whole bunch of states that have to be constantly bribed

    The alternate supply lines using the “Northern corridor” are good news from Pakistan. The Talibs will focus on the supply routes in Central Asia. Already the IMU is very active in Tajikistan and Uzbekistan. The NATO trucks rumbling through these former Turkish states will act as magnets for the militants. The last time the supplies came from the Northern route, it destabilized the region from the Amu Darya all the way to the Caucus Mountains. Because of the militancy, Chechnya Dagestan, Tartaristan, Angushtiya, Kazakhstan, Azerbaijan, Tajikistan and Uzbekistan all rose up in revolt against the Soviet empire.

    The USSR had to retreat from Afghanistan, but it also had to give up give up control of the former Turkish states.
    This time around, the supply routes, as they are being shifted through Tajikistan and Uzbekistan will create havoc for the regimes in Astana, Dushanbe, Fergana and other regional hubs.

    As the Americans move more and more supplies to those supply routes, Russia will have to weigh the costs.
    The Northern Supply routes are unsustainable and cannot be relied upon for any extended period, especially in the winter. No war in the history of humanity has been able to be waged with such an extended supply chain.
    Army seizes large quantity of Indian ammunition in hands of ‘Afghan’ terrorists.

    The end game in Afghanistan has begun. Proxies are taking up positions on both sides of the border testing the waters and attempting to stake out the territory. Events point to the future after the US leaves. It will leave a contingent of Afghans that are beholden to the West. Those Afghan will die for no reason at all-cannon fodder for the empire that refuses to call itself an empire.

    Press reports have Pakistani officials indirectly blaming Delhi for the cross-border raids from Afghanistan.
    Apparently, a ‘game’ was being played at the behest of some regional stakeholders who were averse to Pakistan-Afghan rapprochement.

    During a recent operation against militants, the army seized a large quantity of Indian, American, Russian and Chinese weapons and ammunition.
    Pakistani officials said there was no doubt that they had tacit support of regional leaders and some elements within the Afghan government.

    “There could be no other explanation for groups of 200-300 militants moving in Kunar to launch attacks on Pakistani posts. They have a continuous supply line of arms and finances in addition to logistical support.”

    There have been five major raids by militants based in eastern Afghanistan. The militants, many of whom had fled operations in Bajaur, Mohmand and Swat, are occupying an area between River Kunar and the border because of a void created by withdrawal of Isaf forces from the area.
    “They attack the Pakistani areas to regain the territory lost because of army operations,” a military official said. Pakistan has protested over militant attacks with the Afghan government, Isaf and ANA.

    Delhi is openly supporting the terrorists. Iran is supporting factions. Pakistan is building up alliances. China is investing. Russia is taking stock and the former Turkish states of Tajikistan and Uzbekistan are scared. As the US begins to retreat from Afghanistan, it will begin to sugar coat the defeat with spectacular raids, and high-profile acts, which will hide the pain, felt by the NATO forces.

    One such event is the vacation of areas along the Pakistani border. The Afghan National Army (ANA) has not taken up the area and the US forces have withdrawn. Bharti sponsored forces call the Tehrik e Taliban (TTP) are being brought into this area to attack Pakistan from Afghanistan.
    Islamabad has repeatedly asked the ISAF and ANA forces to clean up the cesspool. Because the ANA has failed to clear up the area, the Pakistan Army had to do it itself. The sanitization is in progress.

    Belatedly the Army did admit that it had conducted operations to clear the area. Pakistan army had earlier this week said that the mortar rounds could have “accidentally crossed the border” and denied that the shelling was intentional. With the Afghan National Army (ANA) with its embedded, US advisors fired rounds into Pakistani territory too.

    According to press reports, the Pakistani military commanders say the root of the problem lies in Afghanistan where militants have sanctuaries in areas bordering Pakistan from where they “launch attacks on our posts”.
    Military officials say when Pakistani forces retaliate against the militant attacks some rounds possibly land in Afghan territory.

    “We have told ISAF and the ANA about the presence of Swati Taliban and militants led by Faqir Mohammad (Bajaur) and Abdul Wali (Mohmand),” a military official said, adding no action was being taken against their sanctuaries.
    Another official said there was no doubt that they had tacit support of regional leaders and some elements within the Afghan government.

    The US is scrambling to find other routes to get its supplies to Afghanistan. It is stubbornly refusing to defend the indefensible-the refusal to vacate the Shamsi airbase, ostensibly on the pretext that they rented it from the UAE. The Emirates were apparently using it for falconry and then leased it to the Americans. Pakistan has halted food and water supplies to the base, and the US is not flying drones of the base, at least temporarily.

    Pakistan Defense Minister Mukhtar Ahmad’s comments this week that the government had ended U.S. drone flights out of Shamsi air base deep in southwest Baluchistan province has injected new controversy in their troubled relationship.

    Washington’s dismissal of the Pakistan government’s stand is quite extraordinary.
    Can a country, even if it is the world’s strongest power, continue to use an air base despite the refusal of the host country?

    Imagine the United States encamped in Pakistan using its airstrip to run a not-so-secret assassination campaign against militant leaders including Pakistanis while Islamabad fumes (Christian Science Monitor).

    http://ghalibsultan.wordpress.com/2011/07/13/dragging-central-asia-in-to-the-war/

    Posted 10 months ago on 23 Jul 2011 11:48 #
  2. About the airbase, Mirza Sahib, there's a shabby way out there: Claims are being made that since Shamsi has been let ut to the Qatar (or is it Dubai?) people, Pakistan has no jurisdiction over it. That agreement should be torn up and made null and voic, of course.

    As for Central Asia, the last time they tried to bring in supplies from there, some two or three weeks ago now, the cargo plane was shot down. Whichever way they might try to do it, success is out of their hands completely.

    Posted 10 months ago on 23 Jul 2011 12:20 #
  3. Mirza Sahab, brother I will say that the agreement about Shamsi air strip is a shadow agreement. First lease to UAE and then UAE leases the same to USA. Do you think that Pakistanis are so stupid to over look this aspect; releasing to a third party?

    I don't think so. They are shrewed conmen, experts in white collar crimes who are involved. BB, Zardar and their NRO God father General Musharraf.

    Ever thought why pakistani vegabonds are taken on board by UK or USA and European countries under the cloak of asylum seekers (political or religious)?

    One day we have to shatter this axix of evil known as political asylum where wanted by a country are nurtured, trained, brainwashed in process and then slotted in the third world, as stooges by and of the west safeguarding their concerns.

    Posted 10 months ago on 23 Jul 2011 12:35 #
  4. Agreed down the line. About the asylum seekers, their days are numbered in any case as the west grows poorer and poorer.

    It is about time we got rid of the conmen (good word) who've been running Pakistan with impunity for too many years now. I think something like this is about to happen in the months ahead.

    As for the end game in Afghanistan, two things strike me: The Resistance might well surprise us all and set up a coalition government for the take over. And also, no need for a Pakistan-Afghanistan "rapprochement". The two neighbours have always been on the best of terms and nothing we might see happening in the future will change anything to that. The millions of Afghans Pakistan housed, fed and educated during the Soviet invasion and many of whom now run that country will ensure that we will always have a place of choice in the hearts of the Afghans.

    Posted 10 months ago on 23 Jul 2011 13:06 #
  5. Rumi.Balkhi
    Member

    Taliban and other "islamic" radicals are as much threat to the central asian states and Russia as it is to the U,S. It would be wrong to compare Pakistan to central asian states. The northern supply route would be longer but definitely much safer than Pakistani supply route. There is no lawless or the so called no mensland like landi kotal or khyber agency in these states. In addition the logistic contractor is a big Russian company close to russian government. So definitly it is a win win situation.

    The situation in Pakistan especially in the Pakhtunkhaw and Bulichistan is going to get much worse. NATO's focus is moving from SouthWest towards East of Afghanistan bordering Nort Waziristan. Paksitan's backed terrorist groups such as Haqqani Network and Hizibi Islami are the prime targets. In addition it is very likely that there will be frequent night raids by NATO and Afghan especial forces deep inside north waziristan.

    Posted 10 months ago on 23 Jul 2011 13:22 #
  6. Rumi.Balkhi
    Member

    Mirza Ghalib, I couldnt agree more with you. There is definitely going to be some sort of coalition government in Afghanitan which will include Quetta and Peshwar shura of Taliban and Hykmatyar led Hizbi Islami .

    Posted 10 months ago on 23 Jul 2011 13:30 #
  7. aftab arif
    Member

    @ Rumi.Balkhi

    The Yanks had no toilet paper to use when Pakistan cut the supply line for a couple of weeks.

    How do you know there is Quetta/Peshawer shura?, and if there is such a shura how come the Yanks have not done a commando raid because Quetta/Peshawer are certainly more closer to the Afghan border then Abbottabad.

    Posted 10 months ago on 23 Jul 2011 13:44 #
  8. The northern supply route would be longer but definitely much safer than Pakistani supply route. There is no lawless or the so called no mensland like landi kotal or khyber agency in these states. In addition the logistic contractor is a big Russian company close to russian government. So definitly it is a win win situation.

    Rumi.Balkhi??? You speak like 'His Masters voice'.
    Good that you are exposed.

    Posted 10 months ago on 23 Jul 2011 13:45 #
  9. Afghanistan and Pakistan are two states recoginized by the UNO. What ever happened during American Occupation of Afghanistan followed by illegal medeling in Pakistani Baluchistan are nothing but intrusions and undue, uncalled for interference into affairs of a soveign state-Pakistan.

    Leave this area for your OWN GOOD. Leave the people of this land in peace. Can you do that?

    Posted 10 months ago on 23 Jul 2011 14:00 #
  10. aftab arif
    Member

    @ Mirga G

    Looks like there are going to learn the hardway, better for them if there leave this area and concentrate on the myriad of problems they have at home, beginning with how to get there massive debt under control.

    Posted 10 months ago on 23 Jul 2011 14:22 #
  11. Rumi.Balkhi
    Member

    When a Sovereign state start harbouring, nurturing training terrorists organizations and using them against other sovereign states, then what would you expect?
    Aftab, had Pakistan army or intellectually bankrupt and ultra nationalist like you EVER admitted that Bin Laden was hiding or I should say (was hidden ) deep inside Pakistan?????
    The answer is No. Yet the Panjabi army continued shamelessly filling their pockets with US dollars .

    Similarly, you would continue deny about the presence of Mullah Omar ( Quetta and Peshawar Shura) and Saraj uddin Haqqani in Pakistan, until you get caught with your pants down.. You all wish to see Taliban with their evil wahabi,deo bandi ideology who knows nothing but to kill, oppress women to come to power in Afghanistan BUT hate to have a Taliban regime in Pakistan....... Hypocrisy at its highest level.

    As far as the US debt concerned you shouldn’t be worried as Panjabi Army will continue receiving dollars for quite sometimes. America stop giving dollars in 1990s and what happened? Nuke tests and proliferation , cross border terrorism, hijacking planes and etc etc. They don’t want to repeat the same mistake.
    ---------------------------------
    Post edited. Abusive content removed.

    Posted 10 months ago on 23 Jul 2011 15:37 #
  12. aftab arif
    Member

    @ Rumi

    Do you believe that killing OBL was done without the consent of the Pakistani Military?

    Posted 10 months ago on 23 Jul 2011 19:00 #
  13. aftab, I liked your query. It was very much to the point. Even more to the point was that OBL died sometime ago. So whatever may have happened in Abottabad, it had nothing whatsoever to do with the man in question, unless, of course, the dead have since learnt to resurrect, a miracle about which we have heard nothing so far.

    As for the Shura and Mullah Omar, etc., Quetta is it, they are in? Well, I'm sure we'll all be delighted to know of this new turn in events. If anyone thinks Mullah Omar is sitting miles away from the battlefield and giving orders to his minions, they perhaps don't know their Mullah Omar that well.

    And while on the subject of the Afghan Resistance, may I allow myself to post these two items here?

    - Invaders helicopter destroyed during raid July. 22 – Yesterday at around 02:00 pm, Mujahideen shot down a US helicopter from a mountain side in Wishtano village of Ghorak district as the invaders were carrying out an operation in the area. It is said that the invaders later detained and took away 3 innocent civilians to their bases.

    - UAV shot down in Shahjoe July. 22 – A UAV (unmanned aerial vehicle) of ISAF invaders was shot down by Mujahideen of Islamic Emirate at 09:00 am this morning in Spini Ghbargi area of Shahjoe district, the wreckage of which is still lying at the site.

    Posted 10 months ago on 23 Jul 2011 20:50 #
  14. scindian
    Member

    Bros
    Air bases at Jacob abad and some where at karachi are still under US control what about that ?

    Posted 10 months ago on 25 Jul 2011 17:35 #
  15. scindian, you may well be right. The fuss over Shamsi is because that's where the drones leave from. I think the Pak armed forces have not cut off all ties with US, no, not yet. But it's palpable in the air that the relations between the two so-called "allies" is at a very low point. Rupture is now also among the facts we might have to face in coming days.

    The latest US hit below the belt at the Pakistani establishment:

    US turns heat on ISI, says it spies on Pakistani-Americans
    Chidanand Rajghatta, TNN Jul 24, 2011, 11.41pm

    WASHINGTON: In further signs that ties between the United States and Pakistan continue to deteriorate, American interlocutors have now accused Pakistan's intelligence agency ISI of spying on the Pakistani diaspora in America and intimidating them.

    The latest salvo, aired through leaks in the New York Times on Sunday, comes on the heels of the FBI's arrest of Kashmiri activist Syed Ghulam Nabi Fai on charges that he illegally funnelled money from the Pakistani ISI into the US to influence American policy makers.

    Unnamed US officials have released the name of yet another ISI operative, who, working under diplomatic cover in New York, allegedly spied on Pakistani dissidents in America, in what some analysts suggest may be payback for Pakistanis outing CIA operatives and harassing CIA assets in Pakistan.

    http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/2011-07-24/us/29809297_1_ahmed-shuja-pasha-isi-operatives-pakistani-isi

    Posted 10 months ago on 27 Jul 2011 10:05 #

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