Posted by brother of a Lashkar member killed by American drones. Very insightful commentary of the dual role of ISI and the rebellion of some jihadi assets from their ISI handlers. Must watch.
PKPolitics Discuss » Current Issues
Excellent video exposing dual ISI/Pakistani Army jihadi policy
(26 posts)-
Wahid Doyum
MemberPosted 2 years ago on 26 Apr 2010 0:41 # -
zia m
MemberI do feel your pain.
Posted 2 years ago on 26 Apr 2010 0:55 # -
Wahid Doyum
MemberThe ISI planned to use its fasadi assets to kill others, but instead they rebelled against their masters.
...and the best of planners is Allah.
Posted 2 years ago on 26 Apr 2010 1:53 # -
all jehadis, their fathers, their financers and their supporters are main tool of terrorism & destruction in pakistan/Afghanistan/kashmir and even in yemen, Somalia and same alike countries.
pakistan nation should stand against all these culprits of humen crimes.
Posted 2 years ago on 26 Apr 2010 7:42 # -
Wahid Doyum
MemberMust see video to all who deny ISI role in fasad and how its backfiring.
Posted 2 years ago on 28 Apr 2010 2:47 # -
rashidsaleem
MemberA very lame effort to win public sympathy. The people who kill their fellow humans in the name of religion are not noble but criminals. They people they kill are also the bread and butter providers of many families. Have they ever thought how the lives of those families changed after the so-called noble effort of these demented terrorists? It’s shameful and disgusting. These terrorists are not even worth calling humans.
Posted 2 years ago on 28 Apr 2010 12:13 # -
Wahid Doyum
MemberWell thee are the same people that are heroes of JI, JUI, ISI, PTI, PML-N block and now they are turning against their handlers manipulation.
Syed Saleem Shehzad, an expert on jihadi groups who has predicted many events accurately once again exposes the ISI/Taliban network in place and the overthrow of the old order ISI connected jihadis with the new order of independent foreign Arab, Punjabi, Uzbek, Chechan jihadis who are rejecting their former handlers as the double faced opportunists they are.
Summary:
- Involvement of active ISI agent Khalid Khwaja in Lal Masjid event
- Hakeemullah Mehsud is indeed alive as Khalid Khwaja met him. Today this was admitted by ISI agent to journalists.
- Involvement of other big jihadi bosses like Shah Abdul Aziz, a former Taliban commander and member of Pakistan parliament.
- Further attempt by pro-ISI jihadi group to create rift between taliban on basis of Afghan and Pakistan, "good" and "bad" taliban labels. This is rejected by Al Qaeda, Uzbeks and Punjabis who want to fight against "murtaad" Pakistan.
- Anti-ISI Taliban faction has already decided to kill Khalid Khwaja - at least one enemy of Pukhtuns will be killed by Taliban themselves.Read for yourself! More juicy details about Khalid Khwaja and his dual ISI/CIA connections.
http://www.atimes.com/atimes/South_Asia/LD28Df04.htmlPosted 2 years ago on 29 Apr 2010 3:11 # -
Wahid Doyum
MemberThis video and article by syed saleem is worth seeing now after isi agent khalid khawaja was killed by taliban faction.
Posted 2 years ago on 01 May 2010 1:45 # -
WD, Your Asia Times journalist, SSS, is himself a CIA-asset. In all the years I've followed his writings, I've never come across one favourable word from him about Pakistan. Nor from you either, come to think of it. But never mind that. "Murtaad" Pakistan, is it? How about "murtaad" FATA? And yes: the best of planners is Allah and we'll all see what he has in store for traitors.
Posted 2 years ago on 01 May 2010 8:42 # -
Wahid Doyum
MemberLOL at CIA asset. He is the most connected journalist to the jihadis writing in English today.
Why should he or I say anything positive about Pakistan when there is nothing positive about this country?
I'm also surprised why you are projecting nationalist thoughts, which is rejected by mullahs and jihadis and as a taliban supporter you too would be worthy of death in their eyes for this double game.
The thinking of jihadis is very clear - you either support all of them or none of them. Trying to create differences between afghan and pakistani taliban is just stupid.
Posted 2 years ago on 01 May 2010 20:56 # -
WD, Thanks for reply. Yes, I don't doubt I'll be anathema in everyone's eyes. But what to do? I still don't see any similarity between the Afghan Resistance and the FATA people killing their own. Can't help it if I see Pakistan as one single country of Muslim persuasion. Others do what they like. But again, let's wait and see what time brings. It shouldn't be too long now. As for nothing positive to say about Pakistan, that did make me wince. But who ever said you'd go easy on your home country. Regards.
Posted 2 years ago on 01 May 2010 21:28 # -
Wahid Doyum
MemberI am amazed that you don't see the commonality between jihadis who cross the border into Afghanistan and come back - they are the same people!
Forget just the two countries, jihadis share the same ideals from Algeria to Yemen - killing those opposed to them and allied with kuffar.
Just to simplify it even more for you:
Afghan government - allied with US
Pakistan government - allied with USISI viewpoint - killing of agents and forces of Afghan government = allowed. Killing of agents and forces of Pakistani government = not allowed.
Jihadi viewpoint - killing of agents and forces of Afghan and Pakistani government = killing of murtaad forces. ISI = munaafiq.
Get it? Even Haris khan has better understanding of this. Watch the video above again and dispute any of the facts presented.
Posted 2 years ago on 01 May 2010 21:50 # -
OK, WD, Thanks again. I'll think this over and get back to you. You have put it very clearly. I start getting a glimmer of what you might mean. And don't underestimate Haris Khan. He's one smart guy. As you are yourself.
Give me a bit of time to assimilate all these notions, some of which I'd never thought of before. I know of the version of the RAW-Mossad-CIA forces in FATA. But apparently, from what you say that's not right. I'll give you a reply by tomorrow.
Posted 2 years ago on 01 May 2010 22:18 # -
Anwer Kamal
MemberPropaganda of killers.
Posted 2 years ago on 01 May 2010 23:34 # -
AK, if we don't even try to understand what they mean, how to counter them? I mean even the "propaganda of killers", as long as they are Pakistani, deserves a bit of our time and concentration. Or am I wrong?
Posted 2 years ago on 02 May 2010 6:29 # -
Hussain Farooqui
MemberUS President Ronald Regan hosted a reception in the honor of the then militants of the Afghan War and introduced them as the "heroes of the century". Time Magazine also always used the terminoloty of 'Mujahideens' for the militants. Time often wrote the word 'Mujahideens' with explaination in brackets as "(Holy Warriors)". The American backed so called Jihad is now a nuisance for the whole Muslim world.
Posted 2 years ago on 02 May 2010 6:50 # -
WD, I think I'm ready now, more or less, to try and reply to your above post. I have now understood why ISI is considered munaafiq by some. And they may even be right. There is nothing I can prove or disprove about the video you show. It's extremely moving, that's for sure. And there's one sentence there which is spot on: The ISI forgot its jihad duties and concentrated on saving Pakistan as a country. Also, I understand, that Kashmir can have little hope of help from Pakistan in its struggles the way things stand.
One thing I do not understand, though, have never understood, is why is Jihad just the job of a few chosen Muslims. Why is it not the job of every Muslim in the world? Shouldn't we all be there fighting the invaders? Good, old story. No need to reply. I understand the reasons myself.
Now back to Asia Times' SSS. I quote below:
"Many, especially those allied with the predominately Pashtun Haqqani network, want to concentrate all of their efforts on Afghanistan, hence the peace accord with the army. Al-Qaeda-linked militants, including Punjabis, see the state as their enemy, in addition to the foreign forces across the border."
Now, for me this is pure CIA stuff. There has never been any Al-Qaeda, a genuine, home-grown form of resistance. The only Al-Qaeda I know of is a CIA construct. And the only job this fake organisation is supposed to manage here is the total and utter destruction of Pakistan through destabilisation tactics and, dream of dreams, civil war, ethnic forces fighting ethnic forces. But how a Muslim believer can kill innocent men, women and children in cold blood, I do not understand. That is not how Islam was taught to anyone as far as I know.
WD, if you do believe in the coming Ummah as I do, you must see united we stand and divided we fall.
As for the ISI and army, derfah karo, as one says. If everything above is true, it's a napak bunch with weapons, well suited to the napak rulers it serves. But there is still another story doing the rounds: The RAW-Mossad-CIA connection in FATA, the only aim of which is to destroy Pakistan if possible. This you have never addressed so far, I think.
Anyway, thanks for your patience. And may Allah help all of us not to go astray.
Posted 2 years ago on 02 May 2010 7:10 # -
Wahid Doyum
MemberHamid Mir adds some more insight to this topic.
Posted 2 years ago on 02 May 2010 7:48 # -
Wahid Doyum
Member@MG,
"One thing I do not understand, though, have never understood, is why is Jihad just the job of a few chosen Muslims. Why is it not the job of every Muslim in the world? Shouldn't we all be there fighting the invaders? Good, old story. No need to reply. I understand the reasons myself"
That is exactly what the trained jihadis of ISI are asking themselves now. For them majority of pakisatnis are traitors to islam who deserve more and more suicide bombings and executions. From a jihadi fundamentalist point of view it is hard to argue with their logic.
"Now, for me this is pure CIA stuff. There has never been any Al-Qaeda, a genuine, home-grown form of resistance. The only Al-Qaeda I know of is a CIA construct. And the only job this fake organisation is supposed to manage here is the total and utter destruction of Pakistan through destabilisation tactics and, dream of dreams, civil war, ethnic forces fighting ethnic forces. But how a Muslim believer can kill innocent men, women and children in cold blood, I do not understand. That is not how Islam was taught to anyone as far as I know. "
If there has never been an al qaeda, do you also believe osama, zawahiri, al-libbi, zarqawi, and coutnelss other arab, uzbek, chechan etc. jihadis do not exist and are not present in the region despite there being a mountain of evidence from lcoal people in the area? You can call it by any name, but such a takfiri network does exist as you yourself are a believer in this ummah concept.
If you believ in jiahd and ummah like you say you do, then not beliveing in the destruction of pakistani state would also make you a munaafiq. You can't play this double game where attacks against other pro US governments is halal, but attacks against your own pro US government is haraam. This is the game ISI tried to play when it used jihadis as its assets against other countries, but now it must bear the consequences.
"WD, if you do believe in the coming Ummah as I do, you must see united we stand and divided we fall."
I reject all fundamentalist jamaati propaganda and the abuse of islaam by the pakistani state to further its policy games on the bodies of pukhtuns. If you believe in this ummah and jihad thing, why don't you do a khudkhush hamla on pakistani forces? If you don't, then you are also a hypocrite like khalid khwaja.
"As for the ISI and army, derfah karo, as one says. If everything above is true, it's a napak bunch with weapons, well suited to the napak rulers it serves. But there is still another story doing the rounds: The RAW-Mossad-CIA connection in FATA, the only aim of which is to destroy Pakistan if possible. This you have never addressed so far, I think."
The other story going around is the invention of ISI itself to save its favorite assets in afghna taliban while trying to defeat the pakistani taliban who believe the same thing as afghan taliban, but just towards pakistan. Why shouldn't jihadis aim to bring pakistan to its knees? Like you said, isn't it the aim of all muslims to fight against the kufaar and their followers? Sicne you believe in fundamentalism, you should be at the forefront and join punjabi taliban immediately. Don't try play this zaid hamid/isi game.
Soon all pakistanis will have to choose which side they're on. When you commit to jihadi side, you have to go in 100% and attack all munaafiqs, miurtaad and kuffar equally.
Posted 2 years ago on 02 May 2010 8:04 # -
OK, well done. Good reply. But what gives you the idea I'm in anyway a fundamentalist. And I'm completely out of my depth in their way of thnking. Being simple-minded, I see that the west invaders must be removed from Afghanistan. Then and only then, can one deal with the tremendous anomalies in Pakistan itself. And all this is stupid in the extreme. The Afghan Resistance needs Pakistan to win its battle. They fight like men against men. All said and done, the so-called Pak "jihadis" sound much more like CIA instruments to me. Islam does not allow the killing of innocents. Not even in the name of Jihad. But thanks. WD. I learnt a lot out of this one.
Posted 2 years ago on 02 May 2010 8:15 # -
Wahid Doyum
MemberYour line about believing in pan-islamism is one that you share with fundamentalists.
"WD, if you do believe in the coming Ummah as I do, you must see united we stand and divided we fall. "
Your other obsession with hating the west while glossing over pakistan and its mullah team's crucial role in turning pukthun lands bloody gives you up not only as a fundamentalist, but a typical pakistani one with an hypocritical agenda. You belong to the class of people like hamid gul, col imam, aslam beg, khalid khwaja, munawar hassan, shah abdul aziz, javed paracha, zaid hamid etc.
"The Afghan Resistance needs Pakistan to win its battle. "
No, it doesn't. Pakistan needs the afghan taliban to colnize pukhtuns.
"All said and done, the so-called Pak "jihadis" sound much more like CIA instruments to me. Islam does not allow the killing of innocents. Not even in the name of Jihad."
Then why do you support the afghan taliban who attack and murder civilians everyday? This is your hypocrisy on display.
Also why do the pakistani taliban and jihadis sound like CIA instruments to you? They are attacking forces and people allied with the US after all. Your beliefs should prompt you to support them 100%.
You have not provided one single source of logic to disprove the jihadi point of view on pakistan.
Posted 2 years ago on 02 May 2010 8:31 # -
Wahid Doyum
MemberTo add, if you say that CIA is active in North Wazirstan, why don't all the mullah leaders support army operation against CIA in FATA?
Stop playing this dual game Mirza Glaib.
Posted 2 years ago on 02 May 2010 8:44 # -
WD, again, no double game playing on my part. If anything ignorance. But never the other thing. I shouldn't know how. OK, true, but I've never denied it, my main source of information on this whole sorry situation in the Pukhtoon lands is derived from Zaid Hamid. He was the first to make me feel ashamed of being me and so absolutely indifferent to the fate of my country. I do trust him a great deal. But if he's right on many things, he may be wrong about matters Pukhtoon. Who knows? But again:
I do know some small thing about the Afghan Taliban, the only Taliban that exists. They do not kill civilians on a daily basis. No way. They do not kill women and children and the man in the street. That's been more the case of Iraq. When they kill fellow Afghans, it's targeted as a rule, what they call the puppet Afghan army, the puppet Afghan police. I can't find it in my heart really to blame them for that. Their main target, and God they are good at it, was, is and remains getting rid of the foreign invader.
The Pakistani version of this sounds simply a caricature of what the Afghan Resistance is doing. And they seem to have no scruples about who their victims might be. Sorry. This does not sound right. More foreign-influenced than anything else. About Waziristan, I've been told, the south was in the hands of foreign elements, the north, on the other hand, supported Pakistan. Perhaps it's been infiltrated since, what do I know? What bothers me most about the whole thing are the drone attacks. I cannot for the life of me understand how a so-called sovereign country with a powerful standing army can allow such horrendous antics.
You must not expect me to come at you with logic, facts, figures and dates. That's your province. I'm just a poor bystander trying to understand situations of great complexity. But I remember the blueprint of action you once presented on some other thread. You began with Pindi and ended with US and in between there were a whole host of enemies to overcome, including the Northern Alliance. A blueprint for an entire lifetime.
And all the while the US would be sitting on your heads - ah, yes, in a recent piece of daydreaming, NATO now has decided the war will go on for about another 4 years and after that they would have to spend another 10 to 15 years in Afghanistan training people. Training them to do what, I wonder? Becoming proficient in how to polish their boots? Give me the failure-ridden ISI anyday to any US occupation.
To end: I don't know what the west-coined term fundamentalist means either. If I see no way forward for us except through an Islamic Nizam in Pakistan and a slow but inevitable resurgence of the Muslim Ummah worldwide, it does not qualify as fundamentalism in my eyes, but most defnitely in those of any West person. You're not one such yourself, WD, are you? A pity. We started off so well here and end up at the very same point as ever.
Posted 2 years ago on 02 May 2010 10:34 # -
Wahid Doyum
Member"my main source of information on this whole sorry situation in the Pukhtoon lands is derived from Zaid Hamid. "
Hahaha, are you serious? No wonder you're so confused and can only repeat ISI propaganda.
"They do not kill civilians on a daily basis."
This is a lie. Taliban massacred Afghans under the orders of ISI. Mazar-i-Sharif massacre is well known. Kabul massacre by ISI pets is well known. Taliban blew up a bomb just yesterday that killed 7 civilians.
You are a liar like your ISI trained hero Zahid Hamid.
"When they kill fellow Afghans, it's targeted as a rule, what they call the puppet Afghan army, the puppet Afghan police. I can't find it in my heart really to blame them for that."
Of course you can't find it in your Pakistani heart to condemn murder of Afghans. Well, I cannot find it in my Pukthun/Afghan heart to care when your Punjabi qaum gets blown up by the very jihadis it trained and nurtured.
Anything more, it is not worth debating with you, as you are brainwashed with ISI propaganda. Islami nizam as dreamed by your type is nothing but death, murder, and destruction as seen in the areas ruled by taliban over and over again. Anyone who still fails to see danger of this talibani rule is either mentally unstable or brainwashed.
Posted 2 years ago on 03 May 2010 0:14 # -
Right, WD, scream and abuse. And then take time off and tell us someday the right path to take. Surely it can't be sinply to submit to direct/indirect US rule. Also, why always condemn Punjabis, as good a people as any, I don't doubt, although I'm not one of them.
Posted 2 years ago on 03 May 2010 17:13 # -
Wahid Doyum
-This is a lie. Taliban massacred Afghans under the orders of ISI.
-Of course you can't find it in your Pakistani heart
-You are a liar like your ISI trained hero Zahid Hamid.
-I cannot find it in my Pukthun/Afghan heart to care when your Punjabi qaum gets blown up by the very jihadis it trained and nurtured.You don’t find sympathy for us Pakistanis (in this case Punjabis) when blown up. How very kind of you.
Never forget to mention Pakistanis as YOU while WE were your HOST for so many years (even today). Still you muster enough courage furthering your hate to ‘Punjabi qoum’ when you should say Pakistanis.
Why you are here Wahid Doyum?Posted 2 years ago on 03 May 2010 17:25 #
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