Iran supports American war « PKPolitics Discuss

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Iran supports American war

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toamin
member

i hope this program would help clarify the reality to those who think that iran defies the west-

http://pkpolitics.com/2010/09/13/jirga-13-september-2010/

gulbadeen hikmat yaar with salim safi

Posted 1 year ago on 14 Sep 2010 2:15 #
toamin
member

guys it is a very important program -a must watch for all-

Posted 1 year ago on 14 Sep 2010 6:00 #
nota
Member

@salam
Sorry but i will not take Gulbudin Hikmatyar's word for it and that too on Jirga with Safi as it would contain added spin (not that "Iran supporting US" on some issues would surprise me after the proven examples of Libyan and Syrian regimes being part of the game)

Posted 1 year ago on 14 Sep 2010 6:08 #
Hussain Farooqui
Member

Iranis are very patriotic to their country. They don't confuse their patriotism with any other feelings or emotions. They do what they feel to be the best in the interest of their country and nation. In their best interest, they supported the USA in the cases of both Afghanistan and Iraq.

Posted 1 year ago on 14 Sep 2010 7:02 #
haider3
member

Can we, then, add that Pakistan is also a very patriotic country because it gave support to the enemy in its Muslim wars?

I have often been told that Islam is inscribed in the DNA of the Muslim. I must say that DNA over time has been diluted in a lot of double-crossing of fellow Muslims.

If what is said above is halfway true, I'm glad I'm Pakistani and not Iranian, Libyen, Syrian or Saudi. At least we have the guts to fight a war within a war.

Posted 1 year ago on 14 Sep 2010 8:36 #
Hussain Farooqui
Member

We fought the wars for others without safeguarding our national interests, so all our cooperation with the USA came to our total disadvantage. Iranis cooperated with the USA TO safeguard of their national interests. This the evident difference between the Iranian and Pakistani leaderships.

Their leadership is loyal to their country and nation, whereas ours is otherwise.

Posted 1 year ago on 14 Sep 2010 11:17 #
haider3
member

HF, yes. But in the present context, our nation happens to be less important than our Afghan brethren. We are fighting alongside them in our own way. And paying the price, too, in human lives, infrastructure, stability, security.

I for one am glad we have not left the Afghan Resistance with no support at all. We have turned out to be, in our own curious way, more of a Muslim nation than any of the others named so far on this thread.

Posted 1 year ago on 14 Sep 2010 11:27 #
Not Possible
Blocked

Why is Salam no longer responding?? Why are people like him hell bent on mailigning Iran?

You speak of Iran? What about Americas Middles Eastern pet gulf States? What About best buddies the Saudis (60bn arms deal) Jordanians, Egyptians what about them?

Posted 1 year ago on 15 Sep 2010 3:59 #
Abdul Rahman
Member

NP,

All are in the same boat. Ahmedinijad visited Saudi as well as Gulf states and has excellent relationship with those criminals. Why can't Iran boycott those clowns? Iran has not boycotted the criminal Maliki of Iraq who runs his government under American guns. How can Iran support the American installed puppet in Iraq. BTW, Ahmedinijad supports another installed puppet-Karzai. Why he is on side of oppressors? The dubious role played by the so called Islamic Republic of Iran certainly merits strong outrage.

Posted 1 year ago on 15 Sep 2010 4:08 #
Not Possible
Blocked

Iran stands against the oppressor on a world stage, it vocaly opposes the US and Isreal. It helps the Palestinains, it leads the Al-Quds rallies. It supported the Hezbollah to victory aginst Isreal.

Iran also stands by Ithad Bainul Muslameen, believing no matter you still stand by your own. It wants good relations with all muslim countries.

Taliban massacared the Shia Hazras, yet Iran stood up to voice support for them against the US. Shias and Sunni Kurds were brutally masacared in the Saddam regieme, Iran would support stability in Iraq in a way so that shias and others are never suppresed again.

Posted 1 year ago on 15 Sep 2010 4:53 #
haider3
member

NP, I'm an Iran person myself. How not to be? they've done such a splendid job of bringing their country round to Muslim ways.

But I do object to the constant propaganda stuff against Saddam Hussein's Iraq. He did make a lot of mistakes. I'm not defending those. I'll tell you one thing I'll not forgive Iran for: they contributed along with the criminals called the "world community" to the deaths of half a million or so people, many of them kids, during the near 12 years of international sanctions against Iraq. That was no Muslim act on their part, believe you me. Just an act of mean revenge. Power politics do not square with the Islamic ethos. Never has done and never will do so.

Posted 1 year ago on 15 Sep 2010 11:02 #
toamin
member

well, with all due respect but iran's role in iraq invasion and afghan invasion can not be ignored, the sher political influence that iran enjoys today in iraq and afghanistan is unprecedented-

if it wasn't for iran's agreement, US would never have been able to stablize iraq, shia joined the american backed political system with iranian patronage-

iran is a major beneficiary of iraqi invasion -forget what ahmadinejad says, just look at ground reality for God's sake.

Posted 1 year ago on 15 Sep 2010 11:14 #
nota
Member

@Salam
"iran is a major beneficiary of iraqi invasion -forget what ahmadinejad says, just look at ground reality for God's sake."

True. But let's not forget the past beneficiaries who made deals with the devil...the Devil works in a curious way...he always turns 'round towards his partners (ask Saddam, Noreiga, etc....).

So, Iran Beware! ;-)

Posted 1 year ago on 15 Sep 2010 11:40 #
Hussain Farooqui
Member

Khomeni strongly criticized Saddam, Zia and the Arab leaders. In my opinion too, they deserved criticism. Why did not Khomeni ever criticize the Syrian culprit 'Hafiz Ul Asad'? Was he different from other leaders of the Muslim states?

Posted 1 year ago on 15 Sep 2010 16:45 #
Not Possible
Blocked

What deal with the devil, Iran wants America to get out off Iraq and Afghanistan ASAP, what proof do you have to doubt your intentions. As for Saddam well he gassed thosands of Kurds and Shias in Iraq alone, the atrocities that he commited during the Iran and Iraq war were far out numbered.

One more thing, why does Iran not have the right to protect shias from oppression, and persecution that they face?

Posted 1 year ago on 15 Sep 2010 16:49 #
Abdul Rahman
Member

"Iran wants America to get out off Iraq and Afghanistan ASAP"

Iran knows very well that Americans are there to stay for decades. America will not leave ASAP as you imagine. That will not happen even after America hands over power to puppets like Maliki and Karzai.

Posted 1 year ago on 15 Sep 2010 17:18 #
haider3
member

What world do all of you live in? You seem to know neither what Saddam Hussein did or did not do. Nor your Syria, Nor, for that matter, your Iran. As for US staying on in Iraq and Afghanistan, ha, bloody ha! Have none of you any idea of what the US economy is doing? The dollar has stopped being the reserve currency of the world and no one has caught on so far? And defending Iran does not mean to overlook its many errors as well. And, for your information, it was Iran that gassed the stupid Kurds not Saddam through that much-maligned person who came to be known as Chemical Ali.

Posted 1 year ago on 15 Sep 2010 18:14 #
hariskhan
member

Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,

@Salam: (1) What are you trying to say here, through this thread ?

(2) What ground realities ?

I'll admit, right now, I have no idea of 'Middle East' 'politics'.

--------------------------------------------------------

(3) US/Nato and their allies are 'routing' their 'military supplies' through Pakistan

A great deal of them. What is Iran doing to help USA's 'cause' ?

You did hear Mr. Hikmatyar say, he was 'safe' in Iran, before US <-> Afghan war, right ?

Posted 1 year ago on 15 Sep 2010 22:26 #
toamin
member

HK, what i am trying to say is that watch the program-
see if you can study middle east conflicts, powers, roles, stake holders etc...

Posted 1 year ago on 16 Sep 2010 3:05 #
Hussain Farooqui
Member

Some oppressors in the Muslim world are visible and some are invisible. The acts of both are condemnable.

Posted 1 year ago on 16 Sep 2010 10:32 #
haider3
member

HF, tell me, please. As things stand, which happens to be the best Muslim country in your eyes?

Posted 1 year ago on 16 Sep 2010 10:45 #
hariskhan
member

Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,

@Salam: I have seen this program. There's nothing much in it.

Posted 1 year ago on 16 Sep 2010 10:47 #
toamin
member

iran has been instrumental in iraqi/afghani occupation, after occupation they have been instrumental in 'stabilizing' political setup, factions that have spiritual backing from iran abandoned resistance and joined occupational forces and helped in political structure-

Posted 1 year ago on 16 Sep 2010 12:07 #
Hussain Farooqui
Member

MG

All the Muslim countries need to be reformed completely. Malaysia is a comparatively better. However, they are ignoring their defense capability.

Posted 1 year ago on 16 Sep 2010 12:41 #
hariskhan
member

Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,

@Salam: Iran is supporting this puppet Govt. in Iraq ?

What is their agenda ? To overthrow Muslims, in Muslim lands.

Are you saying Irani people are trying to resurrect, to re-instate their old / 'ancient' empire ?

Posted 1 year ago on 16 Sep 2010 13:16 #
wantinsaf
Member

Iran just takes care of its own interest and this is where it starts and this is where it ends for Iran.Iran is one reason we Muslims are not united.Iran has done nothing for uniting Muslims but Pakistan surely has done a lot.

Iran is against USA because of its own interest and it would support USA keeping its own interests.So any move from Iran would depend on its own interests.

Posted 1 year ago on 16 Sep 2010 13:48 #
hariskhan
member

Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,

The question I want to raise is, where the heck! are all the Sunni Muslims, in this world ?

What the heck are all of the Sunni Muslims doing, to;

(1) safeguard interests of Muslims
(2) move towards reunification of the UMMAH
(3) 'improve' economies of Muslim nation states
(4) fight off foreign attacks on Muslim lands
(5) make sure justice system works as per Islam's standards in all Muslim nation states

?

Posted 1 year ago on 16 Sep 2010 14:21 #
haider3
member

HK, They are all busy playing the Wahibi, that's what they are doing. And if you're all going to run down Iran for imagined crimes, then how about doing the same for KSA with its more than obvious crimes, starting with its siding with the Jews over Palestine.

Thanks for reply, HF. Malaysia figures also very high on my list of tomorrow^s leading Ummah countries.

Posted 1 year ago on 16 Sep 2010 14:25 #
hariskhan
member

Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,

@Mirza Ghalib: Come again, please ?

Posted 1 year ago on 16 Sep 2010 14:28 #
toamin
member

mirza ghalib

my answer to your question of best country would be PAKISTAN without any doubt

iran -no way

malaysia -i don't think so

Haris Khan

what is iran's agenda? well, to benefit from restructuring that is taking place under US/NATO umbrella in ME/CA

Posted 1 year ago on 16 Sep 2010 14:43 #
hariskhan
member

Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,

Iran already had a 'presence' 'before' this 'restructuring'. How does Iran benefit from 'this' 'restructuring' ?

What has Iran gained, as a result of 'this' 'restructuring' ?

My question(s) remain unanswered.

Posted 1 year ago on 16 Sep 2010 15:16 #
haider3
member

HK, this time, no way. I'm not repeating what I said above. It's crystal clear. Except that I could add Egypt as well to KSA. Except that the mover is still the latter.

Salam Sahib, Strange but true. I quite agree with you about Pakistan and did say so in other words elsewhere on this thread.

Posted 1 year ago on 16 Sep 2010 15:33 #
hariskhan
member

Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,

I'm not running down Iran. I'm asking questions. I have many unanswered questions.

..and I do have 'indications' that Iran is also 'playing' this great game, at least in this region.

Posted 1 year ago on 16 Sep 2010 15:52 #
toamin
member

mirza jee

yes.. quite strange.. let me give an example.. a strange example.. just a few decades ago the criterion of citizenship in pakistan was just deen-e-islam

if you came to pakistan and were muslim -vola! you are a pakistani citizen, and i think it is going to repeat again soon inshAllah :)

Posted 1 year ago on 16 Sep 2010 16:29 #
haider3
member

Inshallah, Salam Sahib, Inshallah. We are the most generous, the most open-hearted and tolerant and excellent Muslims as a rule. And we are the only Islamic nation in the world really practising Jihad in our own way.

Posted 1 year ago on 16 Sep 2010 17:16 #
hariskhan
member

Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,

@Mirza Ghalib: Brother, Muslim movements are not operating in Pakistan alone. They are operating in almost all of the Muslim nation states.

Posted 1 year ago on 16 Sep 2010 17:31 #
haider3
member

HK, a small misunderstanding between us. I mean official Pak, not simply Muslim movements. I'd rather not say more about this, if you don't mind. I was sure everyone would understand what I meant without further clarification,

Posted 1 year ago on 16 Sep 2010 17:59 #
hariskhan
member

Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,

Well, I have to ask questions, if I'm to know, to understand what is going on around me, around us.

Posted 1 year ago on 16 Sep 2010 21:24 #
haider3
member

Sure, HK, go ahead. Ask any questions you like. I wasn't reproaching you with anything. And no one else either.

Posted 1 year ago on 16 Sep 2010 22:18 #
hariskhan
member

Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,

@Salam: Brother, was that not the 'criterion' for being 'citizen' in Muslim UMMAH of the past ?

So, what's the point ?

You want to say 'anyone', even a criminal, looter/plunderer of wealth, traitor, criminal, murderer, mass murderer can 'pose' as a Muslim, and get the same rights ?

For what ?

Posted 1 year ago on 16 Sep 2010 22:24 #
toamin
member

haris khan

i don't know why is there so much distance between what i say and what you actually understand -i really don't know

today if you go out and ask any person to imagine a state where the criterion for citizenship is their religion only, no need to have B-Form or Domicile Certificate or NADRA card, just citizenship and you get a house/land and support from local as one of local one-

in the past there were no passports or citizenship processes -or were there?

Posted 1 year ago on 17 Sep 2010 0:10 #
hariskhan
member

Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,

I'm not getting the message :|

Posted 1 year ago on 17 Sep 2010 0:13 #
toamin
member

don't worry HK, just telling you history of Pakistan from early days and comparing it with today when we so divided-

Posted 1 year ago on 17 Sep 2010 0:18 #
Hussain Farooqui
Member

During the independence movement before 1947, all the Muslims of the subcontinent declared their nationality as Muslim and language as Urdu. There were slogans, "Hindi Hindi Hindustan, Urdu Urdu Pakistan". The charismatic leaders of the Muslim League had united the Muslims of the subcontinent on one platform of nationality and linguistic entity.

Posted 1 year ago on 17 Sep 2010 11:17 #
hariskhan
member

Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,

@Mirza Ghalib: Brother, you are supportive of Iran, its positive role for Muslims, and 'Salam' is 'opposed' to Iran, pointing at 'dangerous' stuff.

I'm stuck in between. I'm trying to find a positive outlook.

Mankind has more a tendency to being good than bad, especially Muslims, since they are 'deen-dar' (in urdu) human beings.

--------------------------------------------------------

@Salam: Your point is;

(1) the world has become 'deceptive', 'devious'

(2) more-so, since Muslim UMMAH was 'forcefully' divided into multiple nation states

.. and ..

(3) yet we/Muslims, we the people of Pakistan have not 'compensated', not 'adjusted' ourselves, our system over time (i.e., decades) to 'compensate' for it

?

Posted 1 year ago on 17 Sep 2010 13:16 #
Hussain Farooqui
Member

The internal disputes of the Muslim world will be over by the passage of time and then will come into existence a great caliphate comprising of all 56 Muslim countries.

Posted 1 year ago on 18 Sep 2010 7:36 #
haider3
member

HK, thank you for above. Let me put forward my point of view in defence of Iran though, never forget, I'm not blind to their faults. A line on history first: Some people consider the Shah of Iran was a great man and Ayatollah Khomeini a CIA-asset. Salam Sahib may be among those. I'm not. I think Ayatollah Khomeini was exactly what he appeared to be: a great religious leader.

Now Iran's internal politics: in spite of multiple dangers they managed to set up some kind of an Islami Nizam there. Not perfect, granted. But it was a step in the right direction. And it brought great comfort to the rest of the Muslim world. How they might have developed, I cannot say. What they call the "imposed war" broke out with Iraq and that was fatal to their intial efforts. That war lasted some 8 years and cost them a tremendous amount of lives and treasury. Iraq was equally affected.

Thereafter, their reconstruction efforts were admirable. Their venture into an egalitarian, welfare state has proved very effective. They have applied Ijtehad in a model manner, but then it's always been easier for the Shia to do so, than many a Sunni-majority country. And, according to me, they are the only, I repeat only, country in the world to practise true democracy.

The Iranians are born politicians, like the Chinese, and unlike ourselves in Pakistan, for instance. They have been extremely lucky in the people who came forward to lead them. And they have always been staunch friends to Pakistan.

The stories doing the rounds about their US connection regarding the Iraq and Afghan wars are just that, I expect, stories. That is probably one of the reasons for Salam Sahib's present suspicion of Iran. Iran may be playing a double game. But then so is Pakistan. Survival dictates.

One last point in an already overlong post: Sick of their success, some Iranians have gone over to the Zionist side. I speak here from personal knowledge. I know some of them. They were the ones whom one calls the "greenies" and who tried to destabilise the country during the last election. Greed was their motive - and they were well paid.

Keep a close eye on Pres Ahmedinejad. He's one of the great statesmen in the world today, steering Iran and other Muslim countries through the extremely dangerous waters of an impending nuclear war. May Allah grant him every success. Otherwise we're all done for.

Posted 1 year ago on 18 Sep 2010 9:09 #
toamin
member

i think you support iran only because of your faith, else there is no reason to actually believe that iran is streeing other muslim countries through dangerous waters...

iran's role has been instrumental in prolonging current world order, the political influence they play in US/NATO occupied countries is unprecedented-

all shia who are spiritually bound by iranian clergy (yes clergy) are part of US/NATO mission, those rhetorical statements coming from ahmadinejad are just hollow talks of a carpet seller-

Posted 1 year ago on 18 Sep 2010 9:19 #
haider3
member

Salam Sahib, we leave poor HK back where he started from, torn between my view on Iran and yours. I hope I'm right. But that does not mean to say you might not be the one who's seen things with a keener eye. But if that is indeed the case, then God help us all!

I personally have been counting on Iran, Turkey, Malaysia, eventually Indonesia (but I don't know much about them, I confess) to get us out of the present mess, i.e. west wars on Islam through the military victory of the Afghan Resistance over the invaders and then rapid reconstruction.

If I love Iran, what should I say about Turkey? I think I could write a whole book to express my unending respect for Erdogan. He might be even greater than Ahmadinejad, the carpet seller as you so eloquently call him. In any case, his task is a much more difficult one to achieve.

And so Salam Sahib, if you are right and I am wrong, where do you see immediate salvation coming from to get the Muslims back on their feet again?

Posted 1 year ago on 18 Sep 2010 9:38 #
toamin
member

Pakistan!

Posted 1 year ago on 18 Sep 2010 9:45 #