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ISI/Taliban murder 41 Pukhtuns in IDP camp

(18 posts)
  1. Wahid Doyum
    Member

    What a wretched life this ISI/Pakistani establishment has given us as reward for joining Pakistan. The genocide and pogrom either through PAF jets or suicidal strategic assets of the army continues. Thanks to great game of army, we are not safe in our villages, in refugee camps, maybe we are not even safe after dying as surely Pakistan will send its suicide bombers after us even in the afterlife.

    One of those killed was Azmat Ali Khan Bangash, a reporter from SAMAA TV who had exposed the brutality of Taliban devil Mullah Toofan.

    The blackmail of Pakistan must be stopped by the world community. We cannot trust this country with nuclear weapons or even guns. The world community has to step in and save Pukhtuns from the devils of pindi.

    Posted 2 years ago on 17 Apr 2010 16:44 #
  2. shriq
    Member

    The killer of these innocent people must be brought to justices asap!

    Posted 2 years ago on 17 Apr 2010 16:48 #
  3. khanseena1
    Member

    @Wahid

    What proof do u have for ISI involvement?

    Posted 2 years ago on 17 Apr 2010 19:39 #
  4. @Wahid
    What proof you have of Taliban involvement? What do they gain from it? Zilch!
    Maybe the army did it to make people forget/justify those innocents they killed recently. And no this is not my theory:
    http://teeth.com.pk/blog/2010/04/17/op-ed-flogging-my-sentiments/comment-page-1#comment-247660

    :-P

    Posted 2 years ago on 17 Apr 2010 19:49 #
  5. skunkk
    Member

    couldn't agree more wahid, they think they can force people to surrender if they kill more and more civilians. Its about time the government should take action against ISI and army for their lack of heart in fighting terrorism. Kiyani is stalling operation in North Waziristan and Taliban League aka N-League is not allowing operation in South Punjab.

    Posted 2 years ago on 17 Apr 2010 21:59 #
  6. Wahid Doyum
    Member

    "@Wahid
    What proof you have of Taliban involvement? What do they gain from it? Zilch!
    Maybe the army did it to make people forget/justify those innocents they killed recently. And no this is not my theory:
    http://teeth.com.pk/blog/2010/04/17/op-ed-flogging-my-sentiments/comment-page-1#comment-247660

    :-P "

    You always like to act so naive. Ask any Pukhtun from affected areas and they can tell you exactly which army officer were meeting with which taliban commander and when. ISI and Taliban are attached at the hip. They are two limbs of the same body and there is a mountain of evidence available, including admissions from former ISI honchos on the close relationship between the two organizations. Even the ISI model of working in semi-independent cells was adopted by Al Qaeda/Taliban after being advised by ISI agents.

    Your theories may be good for internet chatting, but this is more serious issue then you can understand right now.

    As for your simplistic question of what Taliban gained from killing Pukhtuns who abandoned their homes after being threatened not to abandon their homes and provide human shields to Taliban, so I really have to answer that? Just look up which tribes were affected by the bombings and what relationship those tribes had with Taliban. This has happened umpteen times before, so is nothing new in this line of taliban atrocities.

    Posted 2 years ago on 18 Apr 2010 1:44 #
  7. Wahid Doyum
    Member

    "@Wahid

    What proof do u have for ISI involvement? "

    That is a question that can be asked from Col Imam and Khalid Khwaja who are sitting in company of Wali-ur-Rehman having a good laugh in Occupied North Waziristan.

    Posted 2 years ago on 18 Apr 2010 1:45 #
  8. shriq
    Member

    @skunk,

    "Kiyani is stalling operation in North Waziristan and Taliban League aka N-League is not allowing operation in South Punjab."

    Questions to you:

    1 - If N-League is not allowing operation, dont you think it is dangerous for Punjab as well?

    2 - I was wondering when and where you have seen an army request to do operation in South Punjab and which was then disallowed by NL!!!

    3 - Do you think NL is leading all the terrorism activities in Pakistan? At least your post suggests so!!

    By the way I am not a ML(N) supportter! Only wondering!!

    Posted 2 years ago on 18 Apr 2010 5:22 #
  9. azipashtoon
    Blocked

    all

    Can some body explain me why ur Army is getting dollars from america on innocent Pashtoon blood , why my PAshtoon houses are buldoses , why kids and women are killed.. why they have to register in karachi and their not alowed to go to school in karachi ..

    wat kind of muslim ur and then you will sit and discuss other people .

    i ll never ever forgive pakistan for that !!! shame on PAshtoons who live in pakistan and call themselves pakistani

    Posted 2 years ago on 18 Apr 2010 8:26 #
  10. Nor taliban or ISI are involved in it. Many ISI people are paktuns.
    I belive its done by these fake taliban(so called taliban tarikhe-pakistan ).
    They want us muslims to fight each other. USA and India are involved in our war. The only way to stop them is to love each other more.

    Posted 2 years ago on 18 Apr 2010 13:57 #
  11. @Wahid
    "ISI and Taliban are attached at the hip."

    Oh come on! But for the sake of argument, let us assume they are. But then you can not ignore who else is joined at the hips with ISI. Yes, U.S.(see 'And There Goes The "ISI vs US Intelligence" Myth' http://tinyurl.com/yyt7eya ) But then this doesn't suit you so you ignore that fact -- and for the moment I will too.

    So are you saying ISI and taliban are joined at the hip. But the ISI is Pakistan Army so are you saying Pakistan Army and Taliban are joined at the hip? Or are you saying that "our war" is in fact a war between Army and its baby ISI? Or are you saying Army has no control over ISI ergo it is at one level a fight between Kiyani and Shuja Pasha (both of whom indirectly get paid by U.S. -- you know, through U.S. Aid). If they are not fighting then is is just ****-kusti (in which just innocents die so no big deal)

    Now if we put U.S. back in the equation -- you are not going to continue with that myth I mentioned, are you? -- the situation becomes even more interesting. Cause then ISI ends up having a really big hip with Taliban, U.S., ISI, and Army all attached to it....

    So please tell me are ISI and Army joined at the hips or are you saying ISI is completely rogue and army has no control over it??

    (And I hope you are not going to suggest 'It is some rogue elements in the ISI that control the Taliban' -- it is just too fantastic...)

    Posted 2 years ago on 18 Apr 2010 15:15 #
  12. Why there is so much propaganda against Pakistan Army including ISI:

    MI is the supreme Intelligence gathering apparatus of Pakistan.

    ISI was and is a Political Wing of MI.

    Sole purpose including objectives: keep an eye on each and everything done under the pretext of politics.

    Political manipulation remains one of the tools of ISI. To gain it's objectives/goals new political factions, if and when required are created to dilute/tone/downsize hyper active political activities who keep forgetting sanctity of Pakistan’s national boundaries.

    It is common belief that all thing secret are handled by the ISI. The fact is ISI is the only overt wing of Pakistan Military Intelligence.

    Hathi key dant. Khaney key our dikhaney key our.

    http://pkpolitics.com/discuss/topic/isi-agents-meeting-with-taliban#post-140676

    Posted 2 years ago on 18 Apr 2010 18:08 #
  13. skunkk
    Member

    @ shirq:

    N-League is not promoting terrorism, they just want to remain neutral which is unacceptable.

    You forget bro, N-League and Taliban had a ceasefire a while back when Shahbaz Sharif asked them to spare Punjab. Taliban did make a counter offer and it seems that N League grabbed it. No attacks in Punjab since then. Operation by police in South Punjab has been requested by the Federal and KP government but N League remains adamant.

    On the other hand why army is not starting an operation in N Waziristan is not known. On the face of it they say, they need to consolidate but that is only giving time to the terrorists. If they can conduct Azm e Nau soyem they surely can conduct an operation in N Waziristan which is way more necessary.

    Posted 2 years ago on 18 Apr 2010 18:20 #
  14. Wahid Doyum
    Member

    Nota, and semirza, I'm afraid both of you do not understand what the ISI is and how it operates. MI falls in line with the military hierarchy and it's official objective is to gather intelligence for military operations and enemy activities across the border. All official MI people are from the military, while ISI has many civilians, ex-military and current military, diplomats, mullahs, jihadis in its ranks.

    Despite the secrecy of ISI, there is still enough information available in the public domain that tells us that the ISI works in semi-independents cells and directorates. The counter terrorist directorate that works with CIA to capture Taliban terrorists has no knowledge of what the infamous "S" directorate is up to that works with taliban, lashakr-e-taiba, al qaeda, lashkar-jhangvi etc.

    ISI was created to be the controller of the jihadi assets and in case of Indian or Soviet invasion its goal was to disperse (Aslam Beg interview on this matter is good reading) among the population and be untraceable to fight guerrilla war. This network still exists today and has been used effectively by taliban to train, equip and rest in ISI safe houses. The jihadi charities, the hospitals providing care for wounded talibs, the weapon supply line, the funds being transferred from gulf and from criminals activities within pakistan to taliban are all running openly and under the guidance or knowledge of various ISI cells.

    How else do you all think the taliban can survive for so long in Afghanistan or Pakistan? Only someone very naive will think this can exist without any official sanction. These are open secrets, but just not reported on to often in media.

    It is not at all rogue element, As Shuja Pasha controls the overall direction, but each independent ISI unit has control over tactical matters and so it is very much a reality that they may work against each other from time to time. But that's not a big problem, as this way there is always plausible deniablity for helping in terrorist attacks (Major Rana who helped in Mumbai attacks for example). And this allows them to still work with CIA and take out elements no longer following ISI set strategic goals (Mullah Baradar, Abdullah Mehsud, Mullah Dadullah etc.) and also receive funding from CIA at the same time while keeping allied with jihadi groups as needed.

    Some jihadi groups have indeed seen through ISI duplicity and have gone against ISI, but even then they ONLY attack the counter terrorist units of ISI, not the other directorate, as they know they have to rely on ISI in the end for sustaining operations.

    Posted 2 years ago on 18 Apr 2010 19:07 #
  15. Wahid Doyum
    Member

    Nota, your description of how spy agencies like ISI operate is very simplistic. There is no set rule that says that ISI cannot be joined at the hip with both CIA and Taliban/AQ/Jihadis at the same time. In fact there is decades of experience and history in doing EXACTLY this. They have nearly perfected the art of double dealing.

    To think that this would be impossible shows that you do not understand how intel agencies and especially ISI work. This is a symbiotic relationship that has been developed over many years.

    Also, I ask you to read this portion of my post again. Everything happens for a reason and your "shock" at taliban targeting certain tribes should not be a shock to anyone.

    "As for your simplistic question of what Taliban gained from killing Pukhtuns who abandoned their homes after being threatened not to abandon their homes and provide human shields to Taliban, so I really have to answer that? Just look up which tribes were affected by the bombings and what relationship those tribes had with Taliban. This has happened umpteen times before, so is nothing new in this line of taliban atrocities. "

    Posted 2 years ago on 18 Apr 2010 19:11 #
  16. rashidsaleem
    Member

    Pakistan army would never want to kill anyone who exposes the brutalities of Taliban’s. There are several examples in this regard, the lady who exposed the Taliban’s with the flogging video. Pakistan army did not kill her. It is Taliban who have threatened everybody who has tried to expose them. Pakistan army with the support of locals has fought a tremendous battle against the insurgency.

    Posted 2 years ago on 19 Apr 2010 9:41 #
  17. LalBichoo
    Blocked

    semirza,

    """MI is the supreme Intelligence gathering apparatus of Pakistan.
    ISI was and is a Political Wing of MI."""

    >>>

    From where did you get this information ????

    http://www.fas.org/irp/world/pakistan/index.html

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Pakistani_Intelligence_agencies

    Posted 2 years ago on 19 Apr 2010 9:52 #
  18. LalBichoo
    Blocked

    semirza,

    """Why there is so much propaganda against Pakistan Army including ISI:"""

    >>>

    Becoz it was Pak Army / ISI which created Taliban monsters who have so far killed more than twenty thousand Pakistani civilians !!!!

    Posted 2 years ago on 19 Apr 2010 10:19 #

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