A new soon conflict has to be started ......
Personal Religion versus Organized authoritative Religion.
Man Defines Divine, or Divine Defines Man ?
Mulla!
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Personal Religion vs Organized Relgion. (non islamic topic)
(66 posts)-
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 3:00 #
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NNL
memberDivine Defines Man
Its the rule for the Muslims. Who gives about rest of the people.
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 3:02 # -
What does Divine look like ?
Mulla!
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 3:31 # -
shahzad1924
member"What does Divine look like ?"
man is limited, so all knowledge of the divine comes from divine itself. simple example; if there is a man on the other side of a door and you cannot open the door, your knowledge of him is limited to what he tells you.
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 3:34 # -
so, what kinda divine is that which cannot open the door ?
we agree man is limited but divine is limited too ?
Mulla!
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 3:37 # -
NNL
memberDivine is defined in the Quran and He Looks He Says He IS.
For anyone who claims he has seen Divine is mostly a farce.
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 3:38 # -
shahzad1924
memberno divine is not limited. that was just an example
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 3:38 # -
Who wrote Quran ? Divine ? or men who said they worked for divine ? who ?
so if divine is not seeable, then who defines divine, men? yes ?
so men defines divine, what a weak divine you guys have ...
Mulla!
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 3:40 # -
then go get a better example or a more powerful divine then...
I am here waiting...
Mulla!
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 3:40 # -
shahzad1924
member"so if divine is not seeable, then who defines divine, men? yes ?
so men defines divine, what a weak divine you guys have ..."
that's what im saying. man does not DEFINE divine. divine defines it itself
"Who wrote Quran ? Divine ? or men who said they worked for divine ? who ?"
the Quran was written by man
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 3:42 # -
NNL
memberYaar Mullay
Are we heading into that Discussion on whether Quran was Created ?
Seriously yaar.
Buss kar humain pata hai bhabi maikay mein hain magar phir bhi humari drill na kar bhejay ki.
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 3:42 # -
shahzad1924
member"then go get a better example or a more powerful divine then..."
hold your horses. the example was not about opening the door or not? why do you always try to go off topic?
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 3:43 # -
buhut jaldi har gaye meri jan!
aisi baat naheen hai, aap ne jo dalleel layi thi us ka aik mantqai question mein ne poocha hai!
Mulla!
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 3:45 # -
shahzad1924
membero bhai the person on the other side of the door does not want to open the door.
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 3:46 # -
i will try my best to stay on topic, but I proved your example as insufficient...so I request you get a new example...lets keep it that way...lets stay on topic ...sorry for making it look like I was changing the topic...
so....
Mulla!
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 3:47 # -
the only reason, the door might not be being opened is , cause he is "afraid" that you will "find out" the reality ?
what if what you think of divine is not really devine....?
Mulla!
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 3:48 # -
shahzad1924
memberlook, i said that suppose that there is a person on the other side of the door. we will be limited to what the person tells about himself. why did you bring the topic of opening the door into this discussion
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 3:49 # -
shahzad1924
member"the only reason, the door might not be being opened is , cause he is "afraid" that you will "find out" the reality ?
what if what you think of divine is not really devine....?"
if you want to continue the discussion a rational basis im in.
if you want to base it on "what ifs". then wassalam
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 3:49 # -
dont get upset this early, in three posts you are rendered answerless ?
I am rational......you are allowing anger to side track you....
NNL already lost! he couldnt support his documentary evidence and shied away...
so lets see,....
state your argument again so we can focus without the anger ...
Mulla!
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 3:52 # -
shahzad1924
memberman is limited, so it cannot comprehend the unlimited
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 3:54 # -
NNL
memberDude I didnt shy away
I asked you whether you are heading to that Quran is Created Argument.
Plus i think my earlier post mentioned the correct assessment of your situation.
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 3:55 # -
shahzad sab:
thank you very much, so we are screwed then, cause all our efforts as man are faulty then to understand the divine....see thats what I have been saying all along and you guys kept fighting....humans yet have to comprehend the divine and all models of their understandings are limited and partial...do you agree ?
Mulla!
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 3:57 # -
NNL:
your argument is satisfied and you lost........its ok, you can sit outside and watch now.....
Mulla!
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 3:57 # -
shahzad1924
memberwe can comprehend the existence of the creator but we cannot comprehend his form (how many eyes he has, how many hands he has etc.)
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 3:58 # -
but quran says he has hands and he has eyes too....have you read quran in arabic or urdu ? and if you say that you know more quran than Allah cause Allah couldnt say what he wanted so you needed to do the tafseer ?
who is limited man or divine ? I guess your divine is very man-like cause he "needs" someone to do tafseer ? amazing nukta isnt it ?
Mulla!
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 4:01 # -
shahzad1924
member"but quran says he has hands and he has eyes too....have you read quran in arabic or urdu ? and if you say that you know more quran than Allah cause Allah couldnt say what he wanted so you needed to do the tafseer ?"
those were metaphors. and we need tafseers because we dont know the arabic of that time. the tafseers tell us that XYZ is a metaphor among other things.
"who is limited man or divine ? I guess your divine is very man-like cause he "needs" someone to do tafseer ? amazing nukta isnt it ?"
no he doesn't need anyone to do tafseer. it is us who need the tafseer because we dont understand the language. and we dont understand the language of that time.
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 4:12 # -
shahzad1924
memberokay, now my turn.
is man limited in time and space?
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 4:13 # -
mans physical reality, the body is limited.
But mans God particle body, the spiritual reality is not limited.
if what you call "man" is only the physical reality then man is very limited....but if what you call man is the "spiritual" reality then no......
Mulla!
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 4:18 # -
what kinda divine is that who speakth a language which one cannot comprehend ?
its really funny ..isnt it ...that divine chooses a speech which one does not comprehend and you consider divine to be Aleem ?
Mulla!
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 4:19 # -
shahzad1924
member"But mans God particle body, the spiritual reality is not limited.
if what you call "man" is only the physical reality then man is very limited....but if what you call man is the "spiritual" reality then no......"
where did spirituality come in? remember, this is a rational discussion.
"its really funny ..isnt it ...that divine chooses a speech which one does not comprehend and you consider divine to be Aleem ?"
who said arabic is not comprehend-able?
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 4:25 # -
wow!
so you deny that man is a carbon based life form and there is no such thing called "spirit" in it ?
wow....what a limited understanding you have....now I see your disease....hmmmmmmm......wow!
so in your eyes, man is only carbon based life form ?
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 4:34 # -
if Arabic is comprehend able then why do you need "ibn kaseer" ?
Mulla!
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 4:34 # -
shahzad1924
memberyaar the discussion is about proving God. abhi prove hua nahi aur aap spirit pay pohonch gaye hain
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 4:35 # -
shahzad1924
member"if Arabic is comprehend able then why do you need "ibn kaseer" ?"
i need it because i have not mastered arabic.
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 4:35 # -
bhai jan,
yeh kiya mizakh hai keh aap insaan ko poora tasleem hi naheen kar rahay, bahghair god particle ke, to aap insaan ko "mahaz laash" yani dead body tasawur kar rahay haain, khuda ka khoof khain....
yeh kis kism ki behooda sazish hai kutay molvi ki jis ne insaan ko sirf maddiyat ka putla banay...o bhai mere meri to need hi ura di aap ne yeh baat kar key keh, jo johar hai insaan ka us ki nafi kar keh...yeh kis kism ka mazhaab aap parh rhahay hain mian.....
aap baray mehrbani "insaan" par baat karain, na keh lash par!
Mulla!
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 4:48 # -
not mastering arabic ?
so you are saying that, you are following a message which is not even in your own tounge ?
you mastered english ? which was imposed on you only 150 years ago and you did not master the language of divine which your ancestors have had since 800 years plus ?
what kinda joke is that ?
arabic is a must! we must all have moti moti understanding of arabic or else, we will be molested by "master"....
mentally bhi or sexually bhi!
its a divine fareeda to understand moti moti arabic! its the most beautifull language !
Mulla!
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 4:50 # -
shahzad1924
member"yeh kiya mizakh hai keh aap insaan ko poora tasleem hi naheen kar rahay, bahghair god particle ke, to aap insaan ko "mahaz laash" yani dead body tasawur kar rahay haain, khuda ka khoof khain....
yeh kis kism ki behooda sazish hai kutay molvi ki jis ne insaan ko sirf maddiyat ka putla banay...o bhai mere meri to need hi ura di aap ne yeh baat kar key keh, jo johar hai insaan ka us ki nafi kar keh...yeh kis kism ka mazhaab aap parh rhahay hain mian.....
aap baray mehrbani "insaan" par baat karain, na keh lash par!"
apna falsafa apnay paas rakhain. and answer the question.
is man limited or not?
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 4:53 # -
shahzad1924
member"arabic is a must! we must all have moti moti understanding of arabic or else, we will be molested by "master"....
mentally bhi or sexually bhi!
its a divine fareeda to understand moti moti arabic! its the most beautifull language !"
o bhai! why cant you stick to the topic?
i never said im not trying to learn arabic
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 4:54 # -
NNL
memberWelcome to Mullay's world of Circular Arguments Shahzad.
Tharki apni thark kisi bhi tarah mita ta hai.......
;)
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 4:54 # -
bhai jan jo baat aap ko off topic lagay us ka jawab mat diya karain....is tarah focus rahay ga...
please aap "man" ko define karain zara ....mein is ka jawab subh doon ga, sikhoon wala time ho gaya hai...or inshallah kal bhi guftagu jari rahey gi...
Mulla!
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 5:03 # -
Sahnaz
MemberMullah g
there is a question for u?? it just cm in ma min after reading yr posts. u r talking abt Body with spirit. thts true. but wat happnd when we die?? where our soul goes till the day of judgement. ds it wander here to there without any motive?? and wat abt badruh's(bad spirits)?? is it true or just a hoax?? i hv sm more question but after u replied these.
thnxPosted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 5:28 # -
shahzad1924
memberokay, let me rephrase the question.
as this is a rational discussion, it should be limited to things we can see, touch or hear. so, the question is, is man limited in time and space (physically)?
"...sikhoon wala time ho gaya hai..."
jee, aap kay comments say andaaza ho raha tha.
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 5:29 # -
NNL
memberChalo Khud hi badruh apnay app ko nahin pehchan ti.
lol agar yeh sheesha dekh lati tou khud hi mar jati. magar kitna accha ho keh iss ka bhi jali account ho.
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 5:30 # -
Sahnaz
MemberShzd or Mulla
Cud u plz repy ma question i hv asked above..im really curious to knw. i will be thnkful if u reply me..plzzzzz
thnx
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 5:35 # -
shikra
BlockedWhat came first?
Egg or Hen?
How hen was capable to lay Egg without any activity by the ****?
And where from **** came?Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 5:37 # -
talalkhan
MemberArabic is compehendible but many sentences are vague in Holy books, Even the the word KAUSAR has 14 meanings.
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 5:37 # -
ciphered
Member@ shahnaz, the soul after leaving the body goes to a place called barzakh, it stay there till the end of time. as for you qs about bad rooh, in islam thre is no such concept, i assume this has something to do with our ex-hindu roots and culture
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 5:40 # -
shahzad1924
member@Shanaz
"Shzd or Mulla
Cud u plz repy ma question i hv asked above..im really curious to knw. i will be thnkful if u reply me..plzzzzz"
lets stick to the discussion, please.
@talal
"Arabic is compehendible but many sentences are vague in Holy books, Even the the word KAUSAR has 14 meanings."
so?
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 5:45 # -
Sahnaz
Memberthnx ciphered fr yr ans
next question tht wat they do there in barzakh and wat is barzakh?? do they communicate with each other their in barzakh?? do they knw wat good or bad deeds they they did did on earth?? can they do pray in bazrakh?? if there is nt badrooh thn why people do say " is te badruh da saya e, isnu koi dhaaga taveet karao??"
and on the day judgement will those spirits go to their bodies or nt?? if they will go back to body so wat was teh purpose of going out of body??
thnxPosted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 5:50 # -
Sahnaz
Membershahzad
c u r people high knowladgble n its yr farz to ans. lolzz...kyun ans kyun nahi de sakte...??or shud i open a new thread??
Posted 2 years ago on 11 Aug 2009 5:52 #
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