PTI intra-party elections - Q & A

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PTI intra-party elections - Q & A

(34 posts)

Shirazi

After Islamabad polls the numbers & results were very clear on PTI site, almost 63k registered voter out of which almost 31k voted.

We don't have same clarity after KPK elections. I saw some whers on site that there are around 1M registered votes but there are no numbers after elections. How many people actually voted in KPK? How many votes each candidate got? Now on site all you see is name of victors where as after Islamabad they also listed number of votes each candidate got.

I assume next phase is Punjab. When will we have elections in Punjab. Do we have registered voter list that describes number of registered PTI members in each district?

Posted 4 months ago on 07 Feb 2013 11:57 #
drgulkhan

Succesfull UC level elections held yesterday in Bhawalpur and DG Khan divisions.

Posted 4 months ago on 07 Feb 2013 12:08 #
drgulkhan

Today elections in Sargodha and Faisalabad divisions.

Posted 4 months ago on 07 Feb 2013 12:28 #
tsunami

Shirazi bhais concern is wel placed but I guess at this time IK has really asked the teams to step on the gas and announce results asap.

I guess this info will be available in time

Posted 4 months ago on 07 Feb 2013 12:30 #
asif65

shriazi bahi,

when will be intra party election in PPP ? Are you going to contest for a party position? What is about king zardari and prince Bilawal Bhutto ? They will contest also in intra party election or they don't need to do this ?

Posted 4 months ago on 07 Feb 2013 13:24 #
Shirazi

@asif bahi

کسی پیالے سے پوچھا ہے سرائی نے سبب میہ کا

جو خود بے ہوش ہو وہ کیا بتا ے ہوش کتنا ہے

:)

Posted 4 months ago on 07 Feb 2013 14:29 #
Shirazi

BTW I don't think PTI is revolutionzing our political culture by holding these intra-party elections. I am just interested in them as a bench mark to gauge their support in masses as we don't have any data on how popular they are.

The other main stream parties PPP and PMLN have proved their roots among masses in elections and have examples of lower class and lower middle class in leadership role at lower level. But when it comes to electoral politics, the actual power of corridors - politics is made for haves. No one has changed it and no one can. People like Shahid Sahi and Sheikh Rashid when they rise up their economic cadre is changed too. I don't think Imran Khan or anyone can change this harsh reality. Let's not fool ourselves and others.

Posted 4 months ago on 07 Feb 2013 14:42 #
asif65

The other main stream parties PPP and PMLN have proved their roots among masses  

The Kings & Queens of other main stream parties PPP and PMLN have proved eating the wealth of masses!

 

تم بھی کھاو ۔ ہم بھی کھاتے ہیں ۔ لیکن عوام کو کھانے کا موقعہ نہیں دیں گیں ۔۔۔۔۔۔۔
  

یہ ہے شاہی خاندان ۔ بھٹو زرداری خاندان اور شریف خاندان کا نیا نعرہ ۔۔۔۔۔

 

‎بھائی ملک و قوم کی دولت کھانے کی بھی کوئی حد ہوتی ہے ۔۔۔۔۔۔
 
 

Posted 4 months ago on 07 Feb 2013 15:13 #
Shirazi

@asif bahi

"تم بھی کھاو ۔ ہم بھی کھاتے ہیں ۔ لیکن عوام کو کھانے کا موقعہ نہیں دیں گیں ۔۔۔۔۔۔۔"

What about Benazir income support program?

:)

Posted 4 months ago on 07 Feb 2013 15:32 #
tsunami

have examples of lower class and lower middle class in leadership role at lower level

Any 5 names, if u wouldnt mind.

Posted 4 months ago on 07 Feb 2013 15:36 #
Shirazi

@tsunami bahi

I know many from Rawalpindi ...

Malik Shakeel Awan - the PMLN MNA who defeated Sheikh Rasheed, Jamshed Dasti, Abrar Malik (PMLN MP from Pindi)
Qazi Sultan Mehmood and Rashid Mir both Presidents of PPP in Pindi at diferent times.

The problem is electoral politics and the consequent power is game of haves. That's why people like Shah Mehmood and Javed Hashmi superseded those who were with PTI for decades. It's a global phenomena. Youth Congress in India is entirely different class from elected Congress leadership.

I am not saying Imran or anyone can change this all I am saying we should not fool masses that now PTI or any other party will challenge the political culture and will start sending Joe the plumber to Parliament.

Posted 4 months ago on 07 Feb 2013 16:36 #
electric

We shall have to wait and see. Imran Khan promised youth 25% tickets

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Feb 2013 14:40 #
tsunami

If im not mistaken, shakeel awan runs an advertising business.

Chacha Humayun runs a tailor master shop. Surprising u can see a comparison.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Feb 2013 14:45 #
xainahmed

This is the schedule for UC elections in Punjab

D. G. Khan and Bahawalpur Divisions February 6
Rawalpindi, Sargodha and Faisalabad Divisions February 7
Multan and Sahiwal Divisions February 8
Gujranwala Division February 9
Lahore Division February 10/11

Source: http://insaf.pk/AboutUs/IntraPartyElections12/tabid/319/Default.aspx

http://insaf.pk/News/tabid/60/articleType/ArticleView/articleId/14959/Postponement-of-UC-Elections-in-District-Rawalpindi-CEC-PTI.aspx

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Feb 2013 15:06 #
mawan1971

There is no doubt there have been some other examples of poor political workers who came up on big stage but these are rare things in our political history. Khwaja Saaad Rafique was son of a poor party worker, when his father was killed and his mother participated in elections all the constituency people ran his campaign, she has nothing to spend. I hope PTI is bringing a change where other middle class people will get a chance to become MNA and MPA's.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Feb 2013 15:15 #
xainahmed

@Shirazi: Talking about numbers, just have a look at Dist. Lahore for example.

District Lahore PTI Members and Comparison with other Parties

2008 Election "Voters" for Parties:
PMLN - 739,386
PPPP - 315,838
PMLQ - 155,431

Now, only the registered "Members" of PTI in District Lahore are: 502,394

This number is only of those members who provided PTI their CNIC. Those members who didn't provide CNIC were cut off.

We can approximate that number of "Voters" would approximately double the number of members at minimum.

Source: http://insaf.pk/AboutUs/IntraPartyElections12/tabid/319/Default.aspx

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Feb 2013 15:34 #
Shirazi

@xainahmed Sb

Thank You for above numbers. I assume it's Lahore District - 11 seats not the division. These numbers look very healthy. It will be interesting to see what will be 5age of turnout? In Islamabad it was around 50%, 31k out of 63k voted.

Do you have similar numbers for Rawal Pindi and Ghujranwala division or district. Lahore, Pindi and Ghujranwala divisions constitute 67 seats of national assembly.

Obama campaign gets lot of credit for digitizing their campaign but I don't think even they had this kind of precise information. This is unprecedented.

PTI claims they have 7M registered members, PMLN got 6.7M, PMLQ 8M and PPP 10.5M votes in 2008. If PTI has unique 7M NICs DB it will be an uphill task for rest of the parties to challenge them.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Feb 2013 16:08 #
mawan1971

@xainahmed
Brother Xain these are theoretical numbers and do not have any co-relation with actual vote poll in real elections. PTI youth has not seen real elections, where were PTI registered voters in Sahiwal elections when PTI candidate just got his personal votes which he got in the last elections as well. It is just like PPP were adding PML(Q) voters with them to assume they will defeat PML(N)easily but things were way different in Dec-04/2012 bi-elections.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Feb 2013 16:11 #
xainahmed

@mawan1971:
It is true that the true test would be on Election day. But before elections, we can only come up with stats and theoretical numbers to approximate voters of parties. In PTI's case, we can approximate their votes by the number of their members. Other parties have shown their votebank in previous Elections.

Also, in approximating, the results of general elections should only be looked at. By-elections can easily be manipulated by the Govt. as the polling agents are Govt. own people and other several reasons which you know better. PMLQ also won all the by-elections when they were in power. So, to say that parties would surely get same vote as in by-elections would be wrong too. You can only "approximate" on basis of it. As I have done by using number of members and previous election results.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Feb 2013 17:07 #
mawan1971

@Xainahmed
Federal election are influenced by ruling party in federal government and provincial elections are influenced by provincial ruling party. PPP, PML(Q) and PML(N) were all in power in last bi-election but PML(N) won heavily. It was the results of those elections that Qadri was brought in a hurry to sabotash next election process. PTI is a big force in Punjab and will remain but I always say don't be dis-heart if they don't win two many seats. It is their first test of water and water is very deep, PML(N) is very experienced party they know how to attract the people to vote them before elections. The change is underway and we will see middle class and educated people in assembly inshallah.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Feb 2013 17:31 #
tsunami

^^
Thanks for the wishes awan. Dont be surprised when PTI IA sweeps left right center either.

Cheers

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Feb 2013 17:49 #
xainahmed

@mawan1971
Elections (Provincial or National) have nothing to do with Federal Govt. Most of the Polling staff are Govt. school teachers and are appointed in a school by Provincial Govt. not by Federal Govt. , as Education comes under Provincial Govt. Plus all parties have already launched their election campaign and PTI has yet to launch its election campaign. So, we might still see a turnaround near election day. And I am not going to be disheartened if PTI didn't win much seats. ;)

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Feb 2013 17:56 #
mawan1971

In by-election everyone want to see their MNA or MPA in power to solve their problems. When Moosa Gilani took 90,000 votes people know he can do the development work and they voted them. Similar way people prefer PML(N) in provincial assembly as they are in power and can provide benefits to voters and workers. Polling staff cannot rig election as throughout the polling process a poling agent from each party is there to monitor the process. In the end when all poling agents sign that everything was O.K counting is started and completed in front of them. Government has influence but that does not mean they pole fake votes or rig the election.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Feb 2013 18:23 #
mawan1971

Our political process is so ugly, there are fights, firings and everything that PTI kids will be afraid of that. Most of the party workers are un-educated and they abuse other party workers, Dhakam pale, mar dhar, this is what our politics is. Whoever get a chance will do the dhandli, it is not just one party, every party want to win by fair or foul method whatever they can do to win elections. Most of PTI kids never voted so they do not have practical training of voting day.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Feb 2013 18:28 #
bechari-awam

@tsunami
"If im not mistaken, shakeel awan runs an advertising business.

Chacha Humayun runs a tailor master shop. Surprising u can see a comparison. "

Shakeel awan belongs to a lower middle class family and lives in a very small house. Running a business doesn't mean that he is a millionaire, the same way chacha humayun runs his tailor shop business and is not a millionaire. BTW there are rumors that there is a big controversy over his winning and in second count of votes, he actually lost. Can you please confirm or deny this news.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Feb 2013 18:57 #
Shirazi

@tsunami bahi

"If im not mistaken, shakeel awan runs an advertising business.

Chacha Humayun runs a tailor master shop. Surprising u can see a comparison. "
~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Another differece the former is an MNA who got 75000 + votes and later local ward leader who got 199 votes.

:)

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Feb 2013 20:06 #
xainahmed

@mawan1971
I am not singling out any factor in rigging of elections. As you have pointed out, there are also several other methods to rig elections. Polling agents of parties are not allowed inside polling booths. So what goes inside polling booth can't be seen and checked by polling agents. Only the polling agents of the party in Govt. may get inside polling booth forcibly.
Plus I am not singling out PTI as the winner here. The 'kids' you are talking about are the 'highly-educated' lot, living in cities, who might count for less than 10% of total vote. So PTI won't win on their vote alone. That's where the members of PTI count, as PTI have loads of members in even rural areas (if you go through the list of members). I belong to a rural area myself, and most of the people in my area want to give chance to new party as well. So its not all about kids coming out to vote or not.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Feb 2013 20:08 #
xainahmed

@Shirazi
Chacha Humayun fought for the post of District President. And District President is voted by the elected office bearers of UCs. Members of PTI elect office bearers of their UC and other posts. The elected member of UC then elect the District and Tehsil Office bearers. So 199 elected office bearers of UC voted for Chacha Humayun.

There are 25,000 members of PTI in Kohat. These members elected 13 UC office bearers in each Union Council. There are 33 UCs in Kohat. Which makes it almost 400 elected UC office bearers in Kohat who voted for District elections.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Feb 2013 20:14 #
mawan1971

Xain, I am following the politics and watching election since 1988 elections. Over the years we went into a two party system and some regional parties who have influence in certain areas like JUI(F), ANP, MQM and Baloch nationalist parties. When there is two party system it make difficult for third one to sneak in. Benazir's killing created a wide vacuum and also PPP popularity was already reducing year by year, this opened door for third party. IK was there for 16 years but these two parties were not giving any space. Last few years poverty has increased to alarming levels and new voter do not trust old parties to bring change in their life. I do not expect any Tsunami from PTI this election but they will make good in roads in Pakistan politics. This is not failure at all, political forces are not built overnight. 2018 election are the one I am looking for PTI to gain majority single handily.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Feb 2013 20:59 #
LHR

Clouds hover over the possibility of intra-party polls in Rawalpindi

http://www.thenews.com.pk/Todays-News-2-159191-PTIs-disgruntled-leaders-to-stage-sit-in-today

disgruntled leaders and activists of PTI plan to stage a sit-in before the party central secretariat against registration of alleged bogus voters and leaving out tens of thousands of genuine voters in the electoral rolls in Rawalpindi district

Posted 4 months ago on 10 Feb 2013 8:39 #
psychonaut

@mawan1971
"This is not failure at all, political forces are not built overnight. 2018 election are the one I am looking for PTI to gain majority single handily."

I was thinking the same thing couple of days ago but the problem is IK really really wants to win major seats in this election. I think in his eagerness he is pushing PTI to make bad decisions like taking electable after lahore jalsa bcos he thought thats the only way to make PTI bigger in one year time. Sheikh Rashid was another example, Now he is thinking about alliance with Qadri which in my opinion would be drastic for PTI.

I think if he does not worry too much about winning this election, and dont make stupid decisions in rush, he would have a good shot in 2018.

Posted 4 months ago on 10 Feb 2013 9:46 #
tsunami

Another differece the former is an MNA who got 75000 + votes and later local ward leader who got 199 votes.

:)

U seem like a nice person and really I dont want to sound mean to you atleast but for the last time I refuse to believe ur dumb.

Ur comparing apples with an orange. Chacha Humayun hasnt contested general elections. He has contested intra party polls which Shakeel awan hasnt.

..and as for 199, thanks for the clarification xain, hope shirazi bhai ko kuch samajh lag gai hogi aur is k jawab main ye na keh dain k 199 votes millain ge to NA kee seat kese jeete ga?

Posted 4 months ago on 10 Feb 2013 10:21 #
LHR

Oh no not again.....

It is clear that this is PMLN ploy to start an armed struggle within PTI using their moles in PTI......IK should immediately use his internal intelligence and flush the moles out

http://www.thenews.com.pk/Todays-News-2-159334-PTI-workers-up-in-arms

- PTI, which is aligned with Dr Tahirul Qadri .......on Sunday hundreds of its activists gathered to agitate on alleged irregularities in the on-going intra-party election

- They chanted slogans against the Election Commission, headed by its chief election commissioner....They wanted transparent voter lists prior to the election

- Imran Khan’s party, like Dr Qadri, wants replacement of the incumbent ECP set-up in order to ensure fairness, transparency and independence in holding the general election. But it faces a revolt-like scene on its own election front.

Posted 4 months ago on 11 Feb 2013 9:49 #
drgulkhan

election going very well ...better than expected

Posted 4 months ago on 11 Feb 2013 15:37 #