Question to Imran Khan - Why should dual citizen Pakistanis be allowed to vote?

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Question to Imran Khan - Why should dual citizen Pakistanis be allowed to vote?

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sipahi
Member

Question to Imran Khan and his supporters.
Why should dual citizen Pakistanis be allowed to vote?

Posted 5 months ago on 17 Dec 2011 20:15 #
Bawa
Member

دوہری شہریت کے حامل پاکستانیوں کو ووٹ کا حق کیوں نہیں؟

کیا وہ پاکستانی شہری نہیں ہیں؟ کیا انکے پاس پاکستان کا شناختی کارڈ یا پاسپورٹ نہیں ہے؟

کیا ان سے صرف زرمبادلہ لینا ہی مطلوب ہے؟

Posted 5 months ago on 17 Dec 2011 20:42 #
insaftak
Member

@ Bawa

Fully agree with You.

Pakistan is effectively run on money sent by ex-pakistanis (wink) so they should be given a right to vote as well.

Posted 5 months ago on 17 Dec 2011 20:54 #
d0ct0r
Member

So that Imran could rig elections easily. ISI would orchestrate the whole thing in such a way that Imran would end up getting 102% of all overseas pakistanis votes.Nobody would be able to figure out from where these angels came and voted in favour of PM Khan.

Posted 5 months ago on 17 Dec 2011 21:04 #
sipahi
Member

@Bawa
@insaftak

Question is: which nation they are more loyal, Pakistan or their current residence?
If they are more loyal to Pakistan, why don't they give up their citizenship of other country?
Right to vote should not be on sale.

Posted 5 months ago on 17 Dec 2011 21:05 #
santri
Member

اچھا ہے. ووٹ کا حق ہر پاکستانی کو ہونا چاہے

Posted 5 months ago on 17 Dec 2011 21:07 #
EasyGo
Member

@Bawa Jee
Lets hope.......
================
پشاور…وفاقی کابینہ کا اجلاس آج گورنر ہاوٴس پشاور میں وزیر اعظم یوسف رضا گیلانی کی صدارت میں جاری ہے۔ اجلاس میں بیرون ملک مقیم 37لاکھ پاکستانیوں کو ووٹ کا حق دینے ، اسٹیل ملز، خیبر پختونخوا کیلئے اعلان کردہ خصوصی پیکیج میں توسیع اور دیگر فیصلوں کی منظوری دی جائے گی۔
http://www.jang.net/urdu/update_details.asp?nid=132638

Posted 5 months ago on 17 Dec 2011 21:08 #
d0ct0r
Member

how many votes did sc declared bogus?

Posted 5 months ago on 17 Dec 2011 21:09 #
scandinavian
Member

@doc

How could a Noon-Goon like you think differently since you people have been in this dirty business since the birth of **** League in a dictators lap.

Posted 5 months ago on 17 Dec 2011 21:11 #
EasyGo
Member

@doc
3.7 million

Posted 5 months ago on 17 Dec 2011 21:15 #
pacemaker
Member

yeh, there residense outside Pakistan is a open proof of their loyalty to country of residence, Now Pakistan govt. should go one step further and reject $, £, & Euros remittances sent by overseas pakistanies !

Posted 5 months ago on 17 Dec 2011 21:19 #
sipahi
Member

@santri

My question again is: which nation they are more loyal, Pakistan or their current residence?
If they are more loyal to Pakistan, why don't they give up their citizenship of other country?
Right to vote should not be on sale.

They must have acquired other nationality because it was personal beneficial for them.
If they feel interest of their country is more than personal or other country they can give up their nationality of other country.

Posted 5 months ago on 17 Dec 2011 21:21 #
Bawa
Member

sipahi
@Bawa
@insaftak

Question is: which nation they are more loyal, Pakistan or their current residence?
If they are more loyal to Pakistan, why don't they give up their citizenship of other country?
Right to vote should not be on sale.

یہ تو بالکل ہی غیر منتقی بات ہے - زر مبادلہ کی ضرورت ہو تو ہم پاکستانی اور ووٹ کا ذکر ہو تو ہم غیر

یہ بات ہم سے کینیڈین تو نہیں پوچھتے کہ تم کینیڈا سے وفادار ہو یا پاکستان سے؟

اگر بیرون پاکستان آباد پاکستانیوں سے کوئی تکلف ہے تو حکومت پاکستان دوہری شہریت کا قانون ختم کر دے اور دوہری شہرت کے حامل پاکستانیوں کی شہریت ختم کر دے

ووٹ کا ہر شہری کو حق ہے تو بیرون ملک پاکستانیوں کو کون نہیں؟

ہم بخوبی جانتے ہیں کہ جو گدھیں پاکستان میں بیٹھ کر پاکستان اسکے جسم سے گوشت نوچ رہی ہیں وہ پاکستان سے کتنی مخلص ہیں

ہم نے گڑھ بننے سے انکار کیا اور پاکستان کا گوشت نوچنے کی بجائے اسکی خدمت کے جذبے سے باہر نکل آئے

Posted 5 months ago on 17 Dec 2011 21:49 #
pakstar
Member

dual nationality holder must have right to vote but they

MUST NOT be eligible for contesting elections to be MPA or MNA, or senator etc..

how can one look after intresst of Pakistan when they take oath to be faithful to another country.

Posted 5 months ago on 17 Dec 2011 21:58 #
stingingnettle
Member

Sipahi,

Should we by the same token, disqualify those leader who abandon ship when things get too hot for them in Pakistan? Perhaps we should also disqualify those who who properties and money abroad, especially Switzerland.

Pakistani who live abroad are the ones with the best ideas, money and the will to change Pakistan for the better. Sadly these are the people who are not politically active and a huge majority never exercises their right vote which is a huge tragedy for Pakistan.

Stop suffering from paranoia and put down your rubber stamp of patriotism and focus on real problems, corruption, nepotism, institutional failure, sectarianism and many more.

Take up a hobby if you have nothing better to do with your time.

Posted 5 months ago on 17 Dec 2011 22:04 #
pakstar
Member

Vote dalanay ka Haq sab ka hona chahyey.. lakin kissi ko be minister , senator, or 19 grade say oper ka officer bananay liay SIRF Pakistani hona shert rekh do..

adhay say ziyada siasi dramay baaz khud gaib ho jaingey..

Imran Khan k pass to dual nationality nahi ha na.. wo tu bach jay ga? :)

Posted 5 months ago on 18 Dec 2011 1:55 #
expakistani
Member

Well only people living in Pakistan should be able to vote.... People with dual Nationality cant take best decision for Pakistan while living away.... most of them are emotionally involved with Pakistan but ground realities are different.

I see voting right is honor, you gota earn this right. If i am in power i wouldnt let Dual citizens vote or even someone without HSC degree.

Posted 5 months ago on 18 Dec 2011 2:52 #
Bawa
Member

بھولے پنچھی کب گھر لوٹ آئیں - کوئی پتہ نہیں ہوتا - ان پر گھر کے دروازے بند نہیں ہونے چاہیے

یہ ہو سکتا ہے کہ دوہری شہریت کے حامل پاکستانیوں کو اس صورت میں الیکشن میں حصہ لینے کی اجازت دے دینی چائیے اگر وہ الیکشن سے قبل دو سال مسلسل پاکستان میں رہے ہوں

ہاں دوہری شہریت کے حامل لوگوں پر صدر اور وزیر اعظم، گورنر، وزیر اعلی ا جیسے اہم عہدوں کا انتخاب لڑنے پر پابندی لگا دینی چاہئیے

یہاں تو ایک طرف لوگ بیرون ملک سوشل ویلفیئر لے رہے ہوتے ہیں اور دوسری طرف پاکستان میں گورنر بنے بیٹھے ہوتے ہیں

Posted 5 months ago on 18 Dec 2011 3:52 #
ahmed yar
Member

Only pak citizen allowed to vote we don't want their foreign money actually this money is sent by them for their relatives they have left this country for reasons known to them, not all of them but few just come to this country to rule it like Shaukat Aziz, Moin Qureshi many from the present set up like Rehman Malik,Wajid Shams ul Hasan & others will Rehman Malik stay here if not in power definately he will prefer to run his barber saloon in uk and send some ponds for his kin in Sialkoat screaming I m sending foreign exchange to Pakistan.

Posted 5 months ago on 18 Dec 2011 7:37 #
supercreature
Member

to this thread starter:

bahi,

when Balawal can chairman of PPP who spend his whole like out of pakistan, Benazir who spend major like out of Pakistan can be PM. Altaf hussain, shoukat Aziz then why not ordinary Pakistan who add so much money in Pakistan by working hard unlike corrupt politicians who take money out of Pakistan.

@ahmed yar

if you think dont know any thing about how much Overseas Pakistani plays in Pakistan economy and how much overseas plays part in every country. take Philippine for example

Posted 5 months ago on 18 Dec 2011 11:28 #
stingingnettle
Member

Based on merit and proper democratic mandate (minus of course the jaali votes) , any Pakistani should be allowed to contribute to Pakistan politically and financially. Whilst I accept that certain position holders in Pakistan cannot be holders of dual nationalities (and dual assets) but these would only be jobs at the very top or those concerned with national security. Leaders cannot be allowed to abandon Pakistan for 'hard' life abroad when the going get tough in Pakistan. To live like a leader, requires you die like one, if that be the case.

Posted 5 months ago on 18 Dec 2011 12:08 #
gunnerz30
Member

@siphai bhai
bro any 1 with a pakistani nationality who is over the age of 18 is allowed to vote.. however such people cant be allowed to contest elections.. even if canada for e.g people with dual nationalities have voting rights but not the right to contest elections .. where ever citizens are allowed dual nationality voting rights are given but not the right to contest election s]

Posted 5 months ago on 18 Dec 2011 14:25 #
Rohail Taqi
Member

Siphai

With your limited grasp of common matters it would be hard for you to understand this but still I would say.

Living and working outside or within ones country has no relation what so ever with a persons patriotism.

Today Indians take pride in the number of their fellow countrymen working in NASA, Lockheed Martin or researching at Harvard and MIT etc. Where as you have come up with this golden idea that Pakistanis who are working are somewhat lesser Pakistanis.

Silly thing that you generalized it. For example, a construction worker, lets say, in Dubai who is earning some money working during 55 C, so that he can feed his family in Deer is worse than you. Wow, you are an idiot.

Posted 5 months ago on 18 Dec 2011 15:58 #
syedramiz
Member

@sipahi:
most of the Pakistanis are living abroad just for the sake of their families,,,as the economy of Pakistan is destroyed by our beloved ppp and pml n so thats y they had to go abroad to earn some money to fed their childs and family..

most of the Pakistanis wants to live with their families, and their nation in Pakistan but they could not do so,, but their hearts beat for Pakistan so thats y they have full right to cast vote in Pakistan..

Posted 5 months ago on 18 Dec 2011 17:13 #
salaudin
Member

I agree with the suggestion that if they really do not consider duel citizenship Pakistanis living abroad as Pakistanis, they can repeal the duel citizenship law.
But a better move would be to disqualify every politician from contesting election who fled from the country.
The person who has started this thread has a limited understanding of legality and how nation run. Either you like it or not, overseas Pakistanis are still Pakistanis and legally speaking, they have every right to VOTE.
BTW, @expakistani, vote is a right, not a privilege !!!!!

Posted 5 months ago on 18 Dec 2011 17:21 #
sipahi
Member

@ all those who did name calling
You do not deserve any answer, your name calling shows your intelligence.

@ others - who respectfully discussed their point of view

One of the most important requirement is for rebuilding Pakistan is "SACRIFICE" from all Paklistanis.
"SACRIFICE" is always bigger for those who have more to lose. I challenge Dual Citizen Pakistanis and all those who have assets overseas is to show their willingness to sacrifice by giving up their citizenship of other country. In most cases, these dual citizen Pakistanis originally gave up Pakistani citizenship to acquire citizenship of other country. This is because, originally most of the countries did not have dual citizenship agreement with Pakistan. Now, most of them got back Pakistani citizenship after they were allowed to keep dual citizenship. Most of them got dual for convinience of travelling to Pakistan.

Most of the overseas Pakistanis came to work in order to send remittances to Pakistan for their loved ones in Pakistan. When they came at least, they did not came to serve their country. Actually, prior to strict remittance laws after 2001, the same Pakistanis used to send money such that it did not go through official channels, so that they can get higher unofficial rate.

SACRIFICE is needed from all, overseas Pakistanis have small sacrifice to pay. Once you sacrifice, you will have more at stake and you will make more effort.

In this thread, I am not discussing the leadership. I hear you all. I have started another thread for them , that all of them must meet 62 & 63 Article of the constitution.

Posted 5 months ago on 19 Dec 2011 4:56 #
salaudin
Member

One of the most important requirement is for rebuilding Pakistan is "SACRIFICE" from all Paklistanis.

So, once you start REBUILDING Pakistan, feel free to ask for sacrifices. Until then, let them contribute towards the person who can literally rebuild Pakistan.

Posted 5 months ago on 19 Dec 2011 6:07 #
Hussain Farooqui
Member

The thing of greater concern is dual character. Any politicians are rarely said to be the people of non dual character.

Posted 5 months ago on 19 Dec 2011 6:23 #
sipahi
Member

I have not seen response to my question, which nation they are more loyal, Pakistan or their current residence?

Considering, at least the oath taken by new citizens of USA points to that they declare their allegience to USA and give up their allegience to other countries.

USA OATH:

"I hereby declare, on oath, that I absolutely and entirely renounce and abjure all allegiance and fidelity to any foreign prince, potentate, state, or sovereignty of whom or which I have heretofore been a subject or citizen; that I will support and defend the Constitution and laws of the United States of America against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; ..."

Canada OATH:

I swear (or affirm) that I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth II, Queen of Canada, Her Heirs and Successors, and that I will faithfully observe the laws of Canada and fulfil my duties as a Canadian citizen.[9]

UK Oath:

I, [name], [swear by Almighty God] [do solemnly, sincerely and truly affirm and declare] that, on becoming a British citizen, I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth II, her heirs, and successors, according to law.

If they are more loyal to Pakistan, why don't they give up their citizenship of other country?

Right to vote should not be on sale.

By the way, the Government of Pakistan now recognizes and allows its citizens to also hold the citizenships of 16 countries:
1.United Kingdom
2.Italy
3.France
4.Belgium
5.Iceland
6.Australia
7.New Zealand
8.Sweden
9.United States
10.Ireland
11.Netherlands
12.Switzerland
13.Canada
14.Egypt
15.Jordan
16.Syria

Posted 5 months ago on 21 Dec 2011 5:12 #
sipahi
Member

@ Dual Citizens of USA, Canada and UK

I am still looking for your response based on the oath you have taken.
http://pkpolitics.com/discuss/topic/question-to-imran-khan-why-should-dual-citizen-pakistanis-be-allowed-to-vote#post-290033

Posted 5 months ago on 26 Dec 2011 5:09 #
TanoliMns
Member

There are leaders in the both PPP, PML (N) and MQM who have billions of their dollars abroad plunder from national ex checquer. They are not ready to bring their assets back to pakistan rather they take their begging bowel and go around the world for seeking money and thats too for their own interest. Take look at their tax returns how much tax they have paid. Rs. 5000/- by nawaz sharif and Rs. 7000/- by Gillani. Not only that they have emotional exploit the people by asking them to give money for so called "Qarz utaro Mulk Sunwaro". What do we expect from these hypocrite leaders.

Posted 5 months ago on 26 Dec 2011 9:30 #
stingingnettle
Member

Tell me, how many Pakistanis take any oath of allegiance to Pakistan?

More importantly, judging from the splendid job the patriotic Pakistanis living in Pakistan have done of screwing up the country, do a few hundred thousand votes matter?

As usual the focus is on non-issues, whilst the country is pillaged and starved by our patriotic Government of single nationality holders.

Give me strength.....

Posted 5 months ago on 26 Dec 2011 9:44 #
Anwer Kamal
Member

Reply is here.
The power behind.
Divorced First lady of PTI
“Who needs the Queen’s speech? That was emotional. My boys are proud." - Jemima
http://www.pakistantoday.com.pk/2011/12/imran%e2%80%99s-speech-more-emotional-than-queen%e2%80%99s-jemima/
Imran’s speech more emotional than Queen’s: Jemima
- Pakistan Tehreek-e-Insaaf (PTI) Chairman Imran Khan’s ex-wife, Jemima Goldsmith, hailed PTI’s massive rally in Karachi on Sunday and termed Imran’s speech more effective and emotional than that of Britain’s Queen Elizabeth II.
I am sad for Dukhtar e Pakistan ,The crown princess of Lahore .
Tyrian-Khan-White
Let her celebrate her fathers biggest event of his life .
Her mother is not alive to issue a statement .

Posted 5 months ago on 26 Dec 2011 22:53 #
stingingnettle
Member

Anwer Kemal

Do you believe in fairies?

Posted 5 months ago on 26 Dec 2011 23:01 #
sandman
Member

@siphai

"@ Dual Citizens of USA, Canada and UK

I am still looking for your response based on the oath you have taken."

Ok I am a dual citizen of UK and I took the oath in 1999. It doesn't mean much to me. What have I done since then?

I work full time in the IT field but on the side in 2000 I started an IT company with another pakistani friend , which is still running today. 95%+ of our development is done in Karachi - this was one of the objectives, to help in developing the IT sector in pakistan.

We got contracts from USA, UK, Saudia Arabia and Dubai. A rough estimate is that over the last 10 years we have sent about £500,000 to pakistan to pay for development work. 100% of this has gone to pakistani companies.

On a personal note, I also sponsor orphans in Pakistan and donate to charities in Pakistan.

Should I not have a right to vote?

Posted 5 months ago on 27 Dec 2011 2:19 #
sipahi
Member

@sandman

First, congratulations on your success and charitable contributions.

Before, I answer your question, can you please answer my questions.

1. "Ok I am a dual citizen of UK and I took the oath in 1999. It doesn't mean much to me." Are you proud of this?
2. Where is your IT company registered?
3. How much has been revenue of your company over the same period?
4. How much has been profit of your company over the same period?
5. How much taxes you paid to Pakistani goverment, both corporate and individual?
6. How much your profit would have been reduced, if you had hired people in your country of residence (UK)?

Posted 5 months ago on 27 Dec 2011 3:49 #
sandman
Member

@siphai

have pm'ed you.

Posted 5 months ago on 27 Dec 2011 4:06 #
sipahi
Member

WASHINGTON - Farhanaz Ispahani, wife of former Pakistan ambassador to United States Husain Haqqani, has met US State Department officials to express concerns for her husband’s safety in Pakistan.
State Department spokesperson Victoria Nuland while confirming her meetings said, “We have regular contact with her, and we have since he went home.”

http://www.pakistantoday.com.pk/2012/01/haqqani%E2%80%99s-wife-lobbies-in-washington-for-his-safety-in-pakistan/

This is what happens when you give power to "Dual Citizen Pakistanis", they openly lobby against Pakistan first time any decision is made against them.

It shouldn't be surprising, since she has taken following oath

USA OATH:

"I hereby declare, on oath, that I absolutely and entirely renounce and abjure all allegiance and fidelity to any foreign prince, potentate, state, or sovereignty of whom or which I have heretofore been a subject or citizen; that I will support and defend the Constitution and laws of the United States of America against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; ..."

She is no friend of Pakistan. Pakistan should take away citizenship of Pakistan from her.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 7:07 #
pakstar
Member

Personally I think, Farhanaz Ispahani should keep her faith in Allah and confidence in Supreme court of Pakistan, If Haqani has done nothing, he won't get harmed.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 13:55 #
sandman
Member

Simple solution:

dual nationals should not hold any public office in Govt of pakistan

Dual nationals should be allowed to vote

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 14:28 #
pakstar
Member

@sandman

thats exactly what I suggested above.

Agreed!!!

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 14:31 #
sipahi
Member

@sandman
@pakstar

I would extend it further,

Dual Citizens or Citizens with a spouse of foriegn or dual nationality should not be allowed to be either part of parliment, judiciary or hold any public office in government of Pakistan.

This will apply to HH, since her wife(FI) with dual nationality is working against Pakistan with the blessing of a Pakistani citizen (HH).

Posted 4 months ago on 10 Jan 2012 0:35 #
Dusky
Member

HH no love for him, but before you dish out Farahnaz Ispahani, do some research about her.

Her family financial contributed for Pakistan well being right after and before partition. Her grandfather Abol Hassan Ispahani (yes we have a street in Karachi named after him) was Pakistan's first ambassador to Washington, Pakistan's ambassadors official residence in Washington was purchased and donated to Pakistan by him. That's where Ms. Asfahani was residing as wife of HH.

Google about Quaid-e-Azam and Abol Hassan Ispahani, you will know what kinda family she belongs.

Posted 4 months ago on 10 Jan 2012 2:47 #
Dusky
Member

Since we are talking about oaths, here is another oath.

Question is should the violators of this oath should be allowed to vote?

Members Of The Armed Forces Oath
[Article 244]

(In the name of Allah, the most Beneficent, the most Merciful.)
I, ____________, do solemnly swear that I will bear true faith and allegiance to Pakistan and uphold the Constitution of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan which embodies the will of the people, that I will not engage myself in any political activities whatsoever and that I will honestly and faithfully serve Pakistan in the Pakistan Army (or Navy or Air Force) as required by and under the law.

May Allah Almighty help and guide me (A'meen).

Posted 4 months ago on 10 Jan 2012 2:58 #
barackosama
Member

I really marvel at the PTI tola.

They want politicians with only Pakistani citizenship (coz it suits PTI). They want votes from expatriates with dual citizenships, meaning that the people settled in the West whose children have secure jobs, education, healthcare and live fairly well off and who have allegedly taken oath to defend their country of neutralization should the time comes, would decide on the future of Pakistan (coz it also fits PTI).

One unsung rule I have been able to infer from PTI tola, anything is fair and should be implemented as long as it befits Imran Khan/PTI, anything that benefits someone else is crap!

Posted 4 months ago on 10 Jan 2012 18:45 #
sweettruth
Member

All overseas Pakistanis should have the right to vote.

Posted 4 months ago on 10 Jan 2012 19:01 #
sandman
Member

@barackosama

Not all people with dual nationalities are PTI supporters. There are many PMLN,PPP and MQM supporters in the UK.

Posted 4 months ago on 11 Jan 2012 9:17 #
Adonis
Member

There is a difference between the "right to vote" and the "right to become member of parliament".

Pakistan, as well as many other countries allow their nationals the right to vote no matter how many additional nationalities they possess.

However, when it comes to becoming member of parliament, neither Pakistani constitution nor the law in any other country of the world as far as I know allows dual citizens to do so.

The reason is that you can not be allowed to be at a position of such responsibility as member of parliament when you have divided loyalties.

It is strange that Imran Khan wants dual nationality holders to be allowed to become members of parliament in Pakistan. For one, such a step would need an amendment in constitution. Furthermore, if dual nationality holders are so desperate to "serve" Pakistan, why can't they renounce their foreign nationality and keep only Pakistani nationality before contesting elections?

Posted 4 months ago on 11 Jan 2012 9:46 #
iamsowise
Commenter

Overseas Pakistanis are suffering because of incompetent rulers, they have equal right to chose one good for them and their relatives.

Posted 4 months ago on 11 Jan 2012 10:29 #
Adonis
Member

Nobody is denying the overseas Pakistanis the right to choose the rulers in Pakistan. The law only stops them from becoming the rulers themselves without renouncing their foreign nationalities.

Posted 4 months ago on 11 Jan 2012 10:41 #