shimatoree
Member
After the Russians withdrew- the Secularists in the then Afghan Govt took away all the geological records obtained by the Russians geological surveys- to prevent the Taliban from BENEFITING from the wealth under ground.
These same secularists brought out those geological maps for the Americans.
Here is the story-
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/14/world/asia/14minerals.html?emc=eta1
Even if those people who have known about all the minerals in Afghanistan they wont have gave it to Taliban because they know what does minerals worth in the hands of Taliban as Afghanistan was sanctioned and Pakistan was also sanctioned country so their wont be anyway for them to earn money from those minerals and why would they have it to Taliban on the first place???To buy more weapons and to kill more Tajik, Hazara, Uzbek and others who were living alongside with Pashtuns...
Look, if you believe anything that Jewish rag of a NY Times says, then you'll also believe you have wings and can fly. This is propaganda of the cheapest sort. I have never known anyhing coming form the NYT to be even close to the truth.
As for the usual anti-Taliban propaganda, don't you ever get tired of it? Can't you ever distinguish between a freedom fighter and a so-called "terrorist"? And don't you believe anyone learns from past mistakes?
Well, let's hope you're both wrong and I am right.
Plundering untapped resources from Afghanistan is a real reason for this staged war drama among Russia (former USSR) and America. As a result Afghanistan is now occupied due to a deviously engineered false pretext of terrorism.
All countries surrounding Afghanistan are blessed with oil, gas and minerals. So is Afghanistan!
@Mirza Ghalib
OK so whole world is lying but Taliban are speaking truth...Is that what you want to say???Do you even know that Iran was close to war with Taliban Govt. of Afghanistan as they deployed 300000 troops to bordering Afghanistan due to mass massacre of Sia population of Afghanistan...Central Asian countries were against Pakistan for all this because their counterparts in Afghanistan were also getting killed every day(Tajik, Uzbek) this was a Go0vt. which was only accepted by 3 countries and even our relations with China was also went in cold because of destroying Budha statue by them and you still believe that all others lie???Were Iranian lieing when they deployed 300000 troops to Afghan borders or Israel ask them to do so???Were Central Asian countries lieing that their ethnicity were getting killed their???Just come out of this myth about Taliban Govt. and try to accept the reality becaue the world dont revolve according to wishes of Mullah or Taliban supporters....
Look, gazi23, about the Taliban government, that's quite a different matter. And much can be said about that no doubt. My comments were restricted to the freedom fighter, getting rid of the invaders in Afghanistan. The last time round, the Taliban along with the Northern Alliance forced the Soviets out. This time, it's left to the Taliban to do it alone, the N.A. having joined forces with the invader. Though my own personal belief is that the N.A., staunch Muslims, too, have also joined up with the Pukhtoons in this present ouster campaign. And I know the Uzbeks have as well.
Whatever, I don't see any of you ever criticise the West, ever write fearful words about another West takeover of our parts. The West is not your bogeyman, but the Taliban are. In my case it's the other way round. If you are all so fond of the West, go and live there, for heaven's sake. And make haste before they go down the drain. Just leave us be to fight their horrid designs on us in our own way.
@Mirza Ghalib
So your post was restricted to Taliban who are fighting against Invading Foreign forces then you should also consider their background as well because even though they are doing good job their but they are also worse alternative for Afghan people and your assumption about "Taliban defeating Soviet with the help of Northern Alliance" is pure fantasy because Taliban or Mullah Umer was nothing but a FOOT SOLDIER at that time and the real once who defeated Soviets were Northern Alliance, Dostum and Gulbadin Hikmatyar and Taliban or its leader had nothing to do with freedom fighting as Taliban came to picture in 1994 and before that Taliban doesnt exist....and when Taliban marched Kabul they killed thousands of Hazara(Shia) which provoked Iran and Northern Alliance who were mainly consists of Tajiks were against them while Uzbeks were divided between Taliban and Northern Alliance support but majority of them were supporting Northern Alliance....So their IS NO WAY TALIBAN and NA join force because they are different from each other as Taliban are mostly Pashtuns while having small minority of Uzbeks but NA is mostly Tajik with support of Hazara and Few Uzbeks as well so Taliban might be fighting what ever war BUT THE FACT IS THEY CANT BE TRUSTED BECAUSE OF HAVING PASHTUN ONLY IMAGE.....NA on the other hand have been dissolved(I think) because the purpose of NA was to drag Taliban out and USA has already fulfilled that purpose and now NA commanders who were mostly war lords are interested in their own CONTROLLED areas and may be FIGHTING EACH OTHERS FOR CONTROL...
If I dont criticize west it doesnt mean that I LOVE WEST but its like I am more INTERESTED IN SHORTCOMINGS OF OUR SOCIETY instead of criticizing west all the time as We havent learn anything from past and still moving towards same directions that should be avoided....What we are doing is putting everything on west while thinking we have no problems in Pakistan so this attitude is what I dont support...West ARE PLAYING WITH US DUE TO OUR SHORTCOMINGS not due to their ARROGANCE....Even they know that Pakistan is capable of destroying drones but why are they not worried about it???Just to give you an example When Musharraf was running the whole thing then Army was moving very cautiously in Tribal areas and due to that they suffer heavy losses and also the process of military was slow and you should also acknowledge that Musharraf never let USA do drone Attacks in Pakistan as when once it happened in Pakistan he gave his huge voice against it then USA had to stop drone Attacks but when we kicked him out we saw Army doing a massive operation without any caution about the people of tribal areas and we are watching the results....
Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,
BBC Radio: "The purpose of the Afghan war" is to stop the "return of the Caliphate" - UK General
15-May-2010
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Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,
There are many objectives they want to achieve by going in Afghanistan. Its just one reason. Its many reasons;
(1) Reach on border with China, to make their military presence in that region to have a stand off with China
USA did the same thing by using Georgia. We saw this when Russia fought military conflict from Georgia some months back.
(2) Making, securing 14-24 military/air bases for future operations in this entire region
(3) Secure oil pipeline route from Caspian sea to sea ports of Pakistan for benefit of USA or western nations over-all
There are trillions of barrels of oil in Caspian Sea.
(4) Launch operations inside Pakistan to neutralize nuclear facilities, nuclear warheads inside Pakistan to ensure survival of Israel, to ensure there's no military threat to Israel
(5) Spur internal conflicts, civil war inside Pakistan, break Pakistan, take control through American boots on the ground
(6) Maintain income from drugs that USA wants produced in Afghanistan
The history of drugs goes far back to the British Colonial Era. Britain and China as history is written have fought wars, which were named 'Opium Wars'. Google it to find more on this.
(7) To give India the role of hegemon of this region
That is why USA has invested heavily in India. Its **** for tat i.e., interests of non-Muslims converge whenever there's campaign against Islam, against Muslims
(8) Forcefully stopping of re-establishment of Khilafat System / Islami Nizam in any Muslim nation state, worldwide
(9) To ensure Israel the role of next ruling state in the world in Middle East, after downfall of USA
Israel needs this to portray to the whole world that they are ALLAH ordained ones to rule the world, which is a lie
(10) To establish greater Israel, preferably encompassing ALL oil producing Muslim nation states of the Middle East, Turkey, etc etc
They will try to annex as much land as they can through war, when Israel establishes itself as the next ruling state in the world.
gazi23, From what I know of the situation, Taliban and NA did join forces and chuck out the Soveits together. I want to point out one thing about that first war: The greatest warrior there was Ahmad Shah Masood and bang, when the US came in, the first thing they did was to have him assassinated. Had he been alive today, I am convinced the whole thing would have been over by now.
In his absence, the only freedom fighters remaining are the Taliban or, preferably, the Afghan Resistance because many others are also involved whose names are not mentioned in the news.
We know the old refrain: ...West ARE PLAYING WITH US DUE TO OUR SHORTCOMINGS not due to their ARROGANCE. You're a hundred percent wrong there, sorry. We are a pretty bad lot because all our leading people have been bought up by the West. But as for the West itself, it's the Disease of the World. But I'm not going to argue about that. Up to you to think what you like. Time will tell who is right and who is wrong here. What I can confirm already is that a more arrogant bunch than the West dwellers the world has yet to see.
Now your plea for Musharraf. True, the drone attacks were not a daily occurrence then. For that my gratitude to him, certainly. But, again, and for heaven's sake don't all jump down my throat, I do not forgive him for letting the US into Afghanistan in the first place and, mainly, try as I might, he cannot be forgiven in my eyes for what he did in the Lal Masjid massacre.
HK, Of course, it's all about preventing Muslim unity. And also about restarting the colinisation process in a new form so that they can once again get their hands on our natural resources. Inshallah, this time they'll fail.
Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,
(11) Afghanistan is the heart of this entire region. Whoever has military presence/control as well as air power in Afghanistan can effectively operate in this entire region of Middle East And EurAsia. Be it;
(a) Afghanistan
(b) Pakistan
(c) Iran
(d) Iraq
(e) Caspian Sea
(f) China
(g) Uzbekistan
(h) Tajikistan
(i) Turkmenistan
(j) Kyrgyzstan
(k) Kazakhstan
(l) etc etc
they can contain many threats or potential rivals.
(12) If they succeed in capturing Middle East and EurAsia, then they'll have no problems in capturing Africa
(13) etc etc
Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,
Thank Musharraf on small frequency of drone attacks ?
No one owes anything to Musharraf for that.
HK, epic stuff you wrote above. Covered all the aspects of what is at stake in Afghanistan. And why, come what may, we must get them out of there. And we will, we will.
achtung
Member
they have plan for leaving out next summer.
achtung, may this be true and not just one of those false promises US specialises in. Once they go, it is my greatestt hope our country will pull itself together and start building instead of just destroying what little we had before, starting with a change in government.
‘Discovery’ of Afghan riches a pro-war PR scam?
...“The ‘discovery’ of Afghanistan’s minerals will sound pretty silly to old timers,” a "retired former senior US official" tells Politico's Laura Rosen. “When I was living in Kabul in the early 1970’s the [US government], the Russians, the World Bank, the UN and others were all highly focused on the wide range of Afghan mineral deposits. Cheap ways of moving the ore to ocean ports has always been the limiting factor.”
So why is this news now? To many, the story's timing suggests a Pentagon public relations campaign designed to extend public support for the war with the hope that, in time, Afghanistan may be able to raise itself out of abject poverty.
"Why the story broke in the NYT on Sunday could be linked to a desire by the Pentagon to create a reason why US troops might want to stick around in Afghanistan for some time to come," writes Paul Jay at the Huffington Post. "Things are not going very well on the ground and the promise of vast mineral riches would sound enticing."
Some "veteran Afghan hands detect an echo of [Gen. David] Petraeus’ effort to 'put a little more time on the Washington clock' for the Afghanistan surge, as he once described his public relations strategy to buy time in the US for the Iraq surge," Rosen reports....
Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,
(13) USA wants to control water ways, sea ports of this region, trade routes, etc etc in order to make this region earn more money for them, while at the same time depriving people of this region from the resource they were gifted by ALLAH ALMIGHTY.
(14) etc etc
Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,
They need to have power in these nations in order to control as well as exploit their money, resources, skilled labour, business markets, etc etc.
What we, the people of Muslim nation states need to do is to break that control, break their power.
We need to give power to OUR people, who have OUR interests at heart, who are from within us, who's living and die'ing is with us.
We can shove foreign entities out of this entire region as well as ALL of Muslim UMMAH, if we unite, if we focus our abilities, our energy, our resources in fighting them, in pushing them out! of this entire region (i.e., ALL Muslim nation states, starting from Pakistan + Afghanistan).
Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,
People of foreign countries openly talk about our resources, as if we don't exist, or if it is their property.
The question I want to ask from people of Pakistan, people of ALL Muslim nation states is;
Are you going them to;
(1) loot you, and then claim that they are better than you, that they prospered, you didn't ?
(2) mock you all for the unjust way they treat you/us/me/ALL of us ?
(3) get away with ALL of their injustice they treated us ALL with ?
(4) gain enough strength to fight wars against you, after all the injustice they propagated against you ?
Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,
Video: Who Will Benefit From Afghanistan's Trillion Dollar Mineral Discovery
14-June-2010
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Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,
Can you people see it ? People of foreign countries, western countries talk about OUR! resources, our land, that which ALLAH ALMIGHTY gifted us! with, as if we don't own them, as if they! own them, as if we don't exist.
Are you, the people of Muslim nation states going to allow them to loot you, your money, your nation's resources, your nation's skilled labour ?
ALLAH ALMIGHTY gifted you! with all of that. Why don't you thank ALLAH ALMIGHTY for what HE gifted us with, stand up against the west, fight! back and get! back to protect that which is yours.
If you allow this, they will get yet another chance to mock us, that they prospered, while we/our people will again be left to live a miserable life.
zia m
Member
It is old news resurfacing now.It would need billions of dollars investment in infrastructure to mine anything.
The timing of news makes me wonder, the pentagon is due for funding from the congress.
Quite right, zia m. Furthermore it is hoped thereby to entice the fed up public back to the necessity of carrying on the Afghan War. Also, from what I read, the whole thing would require some 30-35 years before it began to pay off.
shimatoree
Member
I would have to disgaree about the LONG time frame suggested for harvesting the mineral ore.
Yes it would need investment but I am sure there are a lots of people in the NON- WEST world who re more than willing to put in the money once the invaders leave.
The main problem will remain the govt in Pakistan. If the current lot remains or those of the friendly opposition- then yes things will be lost but hope springs eternal and let us hope that the Muslims will finally get it togather.
The Chinese are there already so that is a hoepful sign.
zia m
Member
The distance between West and non West is shrinking.It does not matter that much anymore who provides the financing.The ultimate beneficiaries will be the Internationals(corporations).
The nations that lack scientific and technical know how will always be the losers.
Manufacturing and industrialization is essential for developing countries with large populations to improve their lot.
The largest manufacturers of mining equipment are still US,Japanese, Europeans and Australians.
Any contracts won by Chinese will ultimately benefit the Internationals.
shimatoree
Member
Most of these mineral resources are located in the Pushtoon dominated areas.
Security is essential for any development- and that means Taliban.
So the hand writing on the wall is-
Invaders leave and Taliban will take over- then exploitation of the mineral resources can go forward.
Sorry no other solution possible!
zia m, your tendency to undersetimate the Chinese and their skills beats me. Their universities are among the best in the world. Their brains super: when you have a pool of over a billion to choose from, what more could be expected? And they are scrupulously fair in their business dealings. Forget your west forever refrain. The Freeworld forever (= non-west) would be more like it. Come on, zia m., give it a try.
zia m
Member
It is upto the Afghans to decide what form of government they want.Nato forces will eventually leave.
India, Iran and Pakistan need to keep their noses out of it.
Pakistani installed Taliban government already failed in Afghanistan.We need to learn from history.
zia m
Member
MG,
The Chinese have achieved tremendous success with the help of West.They know how to succeed.Sure, there will be some conflict of interest between China and US, but they don't have anti west feelings.
I do criticise west for their neo-colonialism but, sorry, i can't hate anybody for the fun of it.
We need to put our own house in order, blaming west for everything is getting too old.
zia m, I couldn't agree less. See, China is our own house, our best ally and an Asian country and it is perfectly in order. China hates the West from the bottom of its heart. Hasn't it suffered colonialism in the shape of the Opium Wars? Ditto for Russia. They hate the West, too, for all that's been done to them and Russia, too, more part of the Asian continent than the European one. The West is the disease of the world, whatever you might say. Now if by our own house, you mean Pakistan. It will be fine as soon as the invaders leave - and among the invaders I include our politicians. They should all go back where they belong in the areas where hard currency still prevails. And then we'll all begin to thrive. I can't give you any proof as such of what I'm saying. I can just ask you to wait and see. But let me repeat: that's how little you know China if you think it's a West friend. Ever been to the place?
shimatoree
Member
I have heard a lot about this so-called " Pakistan installed " Taliban.
Such a statement can only be made by those that do not know the Afghans-( means Pushtoons).
The word Afghan means Pushtoon- has always meant that.
It was a Pushtoon king Amir Ahmad Shah Abdali-( Durrani) and Amir Abdur Rehaman who " MADE" Afghanistan of to-day by their military conquests.
The Pushtoons will decide as to who rules as the 60 plus percent of any country must rule.
And guess who is fighting the invaders- the Taliban and only the Taliban. Everyone else is working with the invaders.
So when the invaders leave- you guessed it. The Taliban will rule with cooperation of the non- Taliban Pushtoons.
shimatoree. full marks on the above short analysis of the Taliban Pushtoons. Of course they'll run Afghanistan once it's freed from the invaders.
zia m - a few more things about China friend of the West. Do you think they've forgotten the Korean War or Taiwan or the Uighur uprising funded by the CIA? A collective memory is a strong thing, not like our own flimsy individual ones. No, China is no friend to the West. Forget is straightaway. Though it's an ancient and highly politiced people and know when to speak up and when to keep silent. and we're a fairly ancient people too, but we've lost our political skills.
zia m
Member
MG,
I never said that chinese love the Americans.Like any other great nation they have the capacity to rise above their differences and collaborate with other nations.Japan is another example of cooperation and success.
We live in a global village and must try to find a way to getalong with other countries.
During last 30 or so years, since establishing relations with US, China's economy has grown more than fifteen fold.
Almost 400 out of Fortune 500 corporations are doing business in China today.
I have never been to China, but do have some chinese friends and unlike my Pakistani friends they hardly bad mouth the US.
A very good Pakistani friend of mine who retired from a US multi national tire company a couple of years back, tried to do some consultation work for a Pakistani tire outfit.But was very disappointed.We have this national trait "we know it all".
He was later offered consultation work in China, he could not believe the difference in attitude of the people there.
When you have some time, please listen to this lecture at MIT by the Chinese ambassador.
I don't know why this word "Talib" makes everyone so uneasy.
I have stopped taking part in discussion about Talibaan and Pushtuns as non Pushtuns will never understand the psyche of a Pashtun and hence people who wants to rule Afghanistan or north of Pakistan will never succeed. Khair... Yahan tou ghoroun aur Ghadhaoun kay samnay been bajjaney ka koyee faiyda nahee..
KHAN_Sahib, Don't you know what it's all about? There is a group on this blog who blame the Talibaan for all the sins of the world and praise the West for all the good in the world. It's an automatic reflex in their case, must have picked it up from the cradle. That some of them having lived their entire lives in Pakistan still don't know what the Pushtoon are like is somewhat surprising, but so it is.
zia m. The Chinese are the politest people in the world unlike the Pakistanis. We say what we think often. Whatever, I'm as tired of your racist attitudes towards our own country as you must be fed up with my *racist" attitude towards your country of adoption. To each his own racism, let's say. But I'll repeat it once again: the West is the disease of the world and, thank God, the West is toast.
US “surge” in Afghanistan in disarray
By Barry Grey
June 14, 2010 - In the midst of one of the bloodiest weeks for US and NATO forces in the nearly nine-year war in Afghanistan, Gen. Stanley McChrystal, the overall commander, announced Thursday that major military operations around Kandahar would be delayed until September. The offensive had been slated to begin this month, but, as McChrystal admitted, the US has been unable to win the support either of tribal leaders and power brokers or of the populace in and around Afghanistan’s second largest city. The town of 450,000 in the heart of the Pashtun-dominated south is the birthplace of the Taliban and remains a key stronghold of the anti-occupation insurgency...
continua / continued [67047] [ 15-jun-2010 07:36
http://www.uruknet.de/?p=m67047&hd=&size=1&l=e
Afghanistan's Mineral Riches: A Conveniently Timed Zombie Story (Updated)
By Steve Hynd
June 14, 2010 - Last night, the New York Times' James Risen "broke" what the mainstream media are insisting is a blockbuster story about Afghanistan's untapped mineral wealth - not just iron and copper but strategically significant minerals like lithium and all told valued at around $1 trillion. Wow! Only...not wow. When the NYT published Risen's story to the web last night, I tweeted "What a convenient time to find $1 trillion, eh?" and "Just as McChrystal's in big trouble, liberal thinktanks starting to shift anti-war, Pentagon publicizes $1 trillion Afghan treasure trove," because this is a zombie story, resurrected yet again for political purposes...
zia m
Member
MG,
Now you sound like Bush--"Either you are with us, or you are with the terrorists. ...
Touché. right! But I still think I'm not quite wrong about racial, patronising attitudes towards people with whom one has biological links and an overdose of admiration towards people with whom one has none simply because they hold the monopoly on the money concerns of the world. And by this I don't necessarily mean you, zia m, I mean Pakistanis in general. But that business about the "global village", another West ploy to make everyone feel all nice and cosy you can forget altogether. We are not a global village, we are at the mercy of invaders who want to kill us with the most modern of weapons and, failing victory, to leave our countries drowning in DU residue. Best then, zia m, that you stay away for a while, otherwise you too might get contaminated. And plese, friend, do answer sometime the points I so laboriously try to make. I do so because I have conceived a certain admiration for your pluck and grit, but if no answers are forthcoming, then how does one ever advance? As for the topic of present thread, having carefully thought it over, it's just a PR ploy to carry on the war, see extracts above. And if it were not, does anyone really think any Afghan worth the name would let the unbelievers touch an inch of his sacred soil?
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