rocketrevolt
Blocked
In early school we were taught a story about Dhobi and his dog.And outside book we were made familiarized with the saying "Dhobi ka kutta na gher ka na ghaat ka"....Thats exactly where Secularism in pakistan would co-relate to that saying.
Where Dhobi would be 'Secularism in Pakistan'...;)
ps. Enjoy this song suitable for pkkanjers.com
@RockTheVolt
قیامت آنے والی ھے.
End of time is near. These songs were done about 38 years ago. During the time of first Pee Pee Pee rule. Enjoy
rocketrevolt
Blocked
wow!
thats a **** song?
LMAO...some funny moves there...!
:)
ps.Well then I Understand where the garbage on this forum is coming from.Its some of the previous generation's kartoot.Good luck!
ps1.I cant talk about 'qayamat' cause no one knows the time its gonna take place.
talalkhan
Member
Thank u for entertaining us. Such dances create healthy minds.
shikra
Blocked
Before capturing the city of Madina there was a command from Allah in the Holy Quran, about the mutual relations of all the nationalities living in Mecca, which means:
'our religion is for us and your religion is for you'.
Was that not a form of Secularism?
Wali Gohar
shahzad1924
member
no
liberty to practice one's religion is different from separating religion from the affairs of the state.
the systems implemented in mecca were all islamic
rocketrevolt
Blocked
"Was that not a form of Secularism?"
actually shahzad they are not even clear about secularism.Ask them how the social fabric would function under secularism in Pakistan...Just like its in present form or it would be something different?
What are their beliefs and What law they would employ? What social code and moral code they would apply?Would they be open minded and accept those codes for their family system as well?
:)
netengr
blocked
Jamaati type mulla are secular in their private life
and want Shariat in politics
Red-Scorpion
Blocked
@rocketrevolt + shahzad1924
Please tell us what exactly you mean by 'secularism' ?
talalkhan
Member
Red Scorpian
Please mail the link
nak.lodhi@yahoo.com
Red-Scorpion
Blocked
@talal khan
Have you noted my last comments ?
Red-Scorpion
Blocked
@talal khan
It's Ali Sina's website, you may google-search it too !
rocketrevolt
Blocked
What are you talking about Ijay?...
:)
Red-Scorpion
Blocked
@rocketrevolt
""Thats exactly where Secularism in pakistan would co-relate to that saying.
Where Dhobi would be 'Secularism in Pakistan'...;)"""
>>>
This is your post and in order to start a discussion you first come up with 'your' definition of 'secularism' !
talalkhan
Member
Separation of religion from state business is secularism.
Red Scorpion
I am highly grateful to you .faithfreedom.org is a great blog to clear ones ideas.
sasherwani
Members
I believe respecting other's religion and cultural practices and having a non-ethnocentric approach is "secularism".
The dictionary defines it as:
Secularism is the assertion that governmental practices or institutions should exist separately from religion and/or religious beliefs.
Extremists define it as:
Thinking your too kool have a beard so you start copying the goraz. You end up being a nobody coz ur not one of us nor one of them.
shikra
Blocked
The practical life from Peon to President in Pakistan is Secular.
it is a combination and blend of different cultures.
Please examine the ground reality looking at the working of all of the institutions in Pakistan.
It is secular way of life.
Offices, Schools, colleges, business, sports, international relations, media, religious places, clubs, hotels, structure of Government.....all is based upon secularism.
@talal khan
Go to debate section of that site and look for Ismahan Levi debate. you will love it.
talalkhan
Member
Remeber the forefathers of majority of Pakistanis were Hindus
@rocketrevolt
Bhaijan Aap khairiyat se to hain??????
my post was addressed to talal khan.And what is this Bible thumping ? You think I am Christian?
I dont believe it to be word of God.Infact I dont believe any book to be from God.
talalkhan
Member
peterpan
you are right.If one objectively eads the books mentioned by you they reveal the human touch of emotions,hatred, schism,tribalism,antifeminism,bias,clearly.Are these words of God?
shahzad1924
member
there is no freedom of belief in Islam. and Islam makes it an obligation to implement the Islamic systems.
secularism is a way ...it could be a way to rule and judge too.
but certainly its not a suitable way of managing different ethnic groups and rule them simultaneously .
as we have seen a bad example of Secular india.
ask Ahmedabad ppl ,how secular indian Govt is ?
Red-Scorpion
Blocked
@shahzad1924
""there is no freedom of belief in Islam""
>>>
So, Islam is a deen of Jabar !!!
Red-Scorpion
Blocked
@Beena
"""but certainly its not a suitable way of managing different ethnic groups and rule them simultaneously ."""
>>>>
USA, Britain, France, and Canada are secular states.
These countries have different ethnic groups and what I understand they are doing well with different ethnic/religious groups, what do you think ???
rocketrevolt
Blocked
Beenai in action again?
:)
ps.Silencing my response?
@Redscorpio,
what is required to make a good dish is not only spices ...
but the good balance of them ...
in USA,Britain ,France and Canada ..maybe they have the accurate balance and recipe.
but in india ,we have seen a poor secularism .
in which Muslims of india has been suffering badly.
@rocket and Redscorpio,
sorry but i have removed exchange of cross fire between two of u .
members need to read serious thoughts and focused discussion on topic.
shahzad1924
member
"So, Islam is a deen of Jabar !!!"
think whatever you want to think. as if it makes a difference.
rocketrevolt
Blocked
what a sad case...please delete this whole post.
:(
ps.Pointless!
Revivalist
member
Red-scorpion,
Apostasy is considered to be sin that deserves capital punishment in Islam. If I say there is no freedom to steal in secularism, so it’s merciless! It doesn’t make any sense, as every system has its own mechanism of protecting it self and society. For example according to the constitution of Pakistan and probably article 6, Musharraf has committed treason and should be hanged, WHY? Because the law said so!!!! Similarly there is no freedom of belief in Islam” Why? Because Allah (swt) said so!!! Understand????
DeadlyHonest
member
RS,
whether secular or some other system.Certain rules must be followed under different crcumstances...The society whether secular or Islamic must follow some rules and regulations..
Secular ones chooses to accept/made some rules and regulations.Islamic ines chooses to implement Islamic law under different situations.....Its matter of understandings for the people to choose a pure materialistic approach in shape of secular,OR pure religious approach having your soul satisfation in depth...
For example Idia or other non secular nations not developed yet or under progress does not mean that secularism guarantee you sudden boom in education,high tech,and things like that..
Your experiences as a nation,your ability of learning from history and specially the situation around you decides how much you should be technological developed,scientific education and other development.....
secularism is not the key to develop suddenly at religion is not the hurdle between development and education..
yes some of development may not be neccessary under religious sysytem and every thing is allowed under secular system...
So if secularism is the key to free the people to every thing they wish is against the Islamic philosiphy of control the wishes to have a reward in after life...so secularism is totally related with this time of world.Is their any key with secularism to guarantee a good life after death for muslims..
If some one would say that secularism guarantee you religion personal matter and act.than if sysytem promotes at large things hurdled to your religion it is impossible to offer prayer at a place having a concert at the next corner..
Religion have the clause to promote a strict rules and regulations at govt level not to promote or advertise things,causing anti-religion attraction....secularism is failed here to save the interests of the people at large,acting religion......
sasherwani
Members
@ (only) Beenai,
Secularism is the key! You yourself mentioned the problems India faced and you yourself stated that they were a result of "poor" secularism. If a rational secular government was in power, India too would hae been sucessful.
Countries practicing secularism within their boundries are generally successful and peaceful. Ofcourse Secularism has its faults and its not "the perfect" system but do study modern history and study the general sentiments of the people belonging to secular vs. religious states.
Red-Scorpion
Blocked
@Revivalist
"""there is no freedom of belief in Islam” Why? Because Allah (swt) said so!!! Understand???? """
>>>>
It is Jabar, there's no other word for it !
Now, consider if Christians of USA, Britain, France, Germany or other countries say
'there's no freedom of belief in Christianity, coz their God said so', what will happen to the Muslims living there? What about HT's meetings in UK and other western countries ??
For me in a multi-religious society like Pakistan secularism ist the best possible option for peace and harmony in society !
zia m
Member
@RS
They are promoting Qital for non-believers,You are talking about jabar.
DeadlyHonest
member
(((For me in a multi-religious society like Pakistan secularism ist the best possible option for peace and harmony in society !))).
pure Islamic system has a nice treatment for minorities acording to their religious beliefs and religious code of conduct..
When Islam has a solution for it why go for secular system which is not system but KHICHRY.Having no identification between good or bad,halal or haram.....
DeadlyHonest
member
Qital is good if some one attacks you.Attackers in any religion or social set of rules, have idea of Garlands to attackers.....
DeadlyHonest
member
The sysytem or set of rules implemented by france,uk,germany,us may also be called jabar implemented by the govts to its people.....
Their should be no rules and regulations at all their to implement every one should be free to do any thing..
If some thing is their as rule of law to go with than why not muslims should have their own set of rules to implement......????Any logic???
Red-Scorpion
Blocked
@DH
""When Islam has a solution for it why go for secular system which is not system but KHICHRY.Having no identification between good or bad,halal or haram..... """
>>>
Please enlighten us for the 'solution' which Islam has for minorities !
What do you understand by secularism, pls define it briefly !
shahzad1924
member
@Red-Scorpion "Now, consider if Christians of USA, Britain, France, Germany or other countries say 'there's no freedom of belief in Christianity, coz their God said so', whay will happen to the Muslims living there?"
please dont say something you do not own. don't worry about the Muslims living in USA etc.
@Red-Scorpion "What about HT's meetings in UK and other western countries ??"
yeah, what about it?
Red-Scorpion
Blocked
@shahzad1924
Pls elaborate your points as I'm really unable to understand !
shahzad1924
member
first of all, that was a hypothetical problem. secondly, you dont need to care about Muslims. the khilafah is very near, it will solve all the problems of the Muslims.
Red-Scorpion
Blocked
@shahzad1924
""the khilafah is very near, ""
>>>
Can I become Khalifah ??
Will do bay'at on my hand ??
What is the criterion of Khalifah ?
What do you mean by 'very near' ???
"""it will solve all the problems of the Muslims. """
>>>
During Khilalat era, were muslim societies problem free ??
Weren't there any wars, amongst muslims ?
How did Khailafah no. 02, 03, and 04 die ??
DeadlyHonest
member
shehzad i think no need to discuss further more as he is never interested to learn but try to find some thing wrong for hit......stop this and wait for some one else to question or answer......
shahzad1924
member
yes and i just remembered, he was on my ignore list :)
Revivalist
member
Red-scorpion,
I told you to please read the post carefully and then reply!!!! If you refer to my post you would realize that you are mixing apples and oranges. I said apostasy is a grave sin in Islam, which means that a Muslim changes his religion and not that a Christian or a Jew or a Hindu etc cant live in the Islamic state. FYI ‘freedom of religion’ means a person is free adopt any religion he or she wills and not what you understood!!!!! I hope you got the point!!!
Red-Scorpion
Blocked
@Revivalist
""I said apostasy is a grave sin in Islam, which means that a Muslim changes his religion""
>>>
Wow, muslims are not allowed to change religion, but others are even forced to change their religion and accept Islam !!!
What do you call it ? Hypocrisy or what ?
Muslims should be allowed to live as they want in India or western countries, but non-muslims should be living like Dhimmis in muslim countries, Hypocrisy isn't it ?
Muslims should be allowed to do Dawa'ah in Kafir countries but Kafirs are not allowed to preach their ideologies in muslim countries, Hyporcisy isn't it ?
shahzad1924
member
so, whats your problem?
Red-Scorpion
Blocked
@shahzad1924
Nothing man :)))
Am I bothering you ???
shahzad1924
member
If that's the way you think Islam is, then you shouldn't be worried about it because such fallacy will never allow it to dominate any region, let alone the whole world. and in that case, you need not worry.
This topic has been closed to new replies.
