PKPolitics Discuss » Faith and Religion

Sex education for Muslims

(31 posts)
  1. khanseena1
    Member

    Interesting read.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-south-asia-12117519

    Dr Mobin Akhtar is on a mission to educate Pakistanis in sexual matters, but his latest attempt to do so has caused controversy.

    The release of his book - Sex Education for Muslims - aims to teach people about sex in a way that is in keeping with Islamic instruction.

    Dr Akhtar, 81, says the fact that sex is not discussed in Pakistan is having serious repercussions. As a psychiatrist, he says he has witnessed them himself, and that is why he felt the need to write his book.

    "There's a huge problem in our country," he says.

    "Adolescents, especially boys, when they get to puberty, and the changes that come with puberty, they think it's due to some disease.

    "They start masturbating, and they are told that is very dangerous to health, and that this is sinful, very sinful."
    'Misconceptions'

    Dr Akhtar says he has seen cases where teenagers, not understanding what is happening to their bodies, have become depressed and even committed suicide.

    "I myself passed through that stage with all these concerns, and there's no-one to tell you otherwise, and that these are wrong perceptions. It was only when I entered medical college that I found out that these were all misconceptions."
    The book
    Continue reading the main story
    “Start Quote

    Ignorance about sexual matters is causing a lot of our young people unnecessary psychological distress”

    End Quote Dr Mobin Akhtar Author of Sex Education for Muslims

    He says even now in Pakistan, many doctors do not discuss sexual matters openly, and that teachers and parents are embarrassed about the issues. There is no sex education teaching in government schools.

    Dr Akhtar says it is not seen as appropriate to broach the subject of sex in the conservative culture of Pakistan, and that it is also felt that doing so might encourage young people to behave in an "un-Islamic" way.

    "They ask me when you should start sex education, and I say as soon as the child can talk. They should be told the names of the genitals just as they are told about hands and eyes and ears, and nose," he says.

    "When they get a little bigger and they ask where a child comes from, you can say it. That doesn't make the child sexually active or immoral."

    Dr Akhtar says there is also nothing un-Islamic about discussing sex.

    He says he felt that the best way to help people understand that was to write a book which brought together basic sex education with information about the Islamic perspective on the subject.

    "When I started to study what the Koran, Islamic law and religious scholars had to say about it, I realised there is so much discussion about sex in Islam. One would be surprised.

    "There are sayings from the Prophet Muhammad about sexual matters, and historical sources tell us he answered detailed queries on the subject from both men and women."

    The writings in Dr Akhtar's book are interspersed with quotes from the Prophet Muhammad, and also from the Koran, like this one: "You are allowed intercourse at night with your wives during the month of fasting. They are as intimate for you as your own clothes, and vice versa." (Koran, Surah Baqra, Verse 187)
    'Quack'

    Among many other topics, Dr Akhtar writes of the Islamic thinking about masturbation, marital problems and how a man should wash himself after having sex so that he is clean enough to perform prayers.

    But many Pakistanis have found Dr Akhtar's book unpalatable.
    Pakistani children Pakistani children have no access to sex education

    He tried to tone down the title - Sex Education for Muslims is the name of the English version of the book, in Urdu the title is Special Problems for Young People.

    But that has not been enough to appease some.

    "I have had threats. Even other doctors have accused me of acting like a maverick, a quack," he says.

    "A provincial politician even hauled me into his office and said I was encouraging pornography. I explained I was doing nothing of the sort."

    Dr Akhtar says he has found very few bookshops willing to stock his book, or any newspapers that will print paid advertisements for it.

    "It is a very sad reaction. Ignorance about sexual matters is causing a lot of our young people unnecessary psychological distress, and we have to change that.

    "I am only talking about educating people gradually and sensitively, but at the moment we are not even doing that."

    Posted 1 year ago on 10 Jan 2011 4:28 #
  2. saqib55
    Member

    Yeh mara jai ga. Kai, mullah ghalti say TV actor/compere Moin Akhtar ko na maar day.

    Posted 1 year ago on 10 Jan 2011 4:38 #
  3. LOL, Musalmanon ko sub pata hai sex kay baray mein. Just look at the population growth rate ;)

    @Saqib

    I agree bechara moin Akhter hi na mara jaye

    Posted 1 year ago on 10 Jan 2011 5:57 #
  4. shafiq12
    member

    Arabic shaikh are expert in sex education, their work in the field of sex education can't be forgotten. :)

    those who want sex education they should hire shaikhs

    Posted 1 year ago on 10 Jan 2011 6:14 #
  5. hkbajwa
    Member

    This is actually no laughing matter.

    A MASSIVE part of the problems muslim cultures face in terms of gender relations is the general ignorance that exists among youth and adults alike.

    If the act of sex and intimacy were de-mystified and young people taught the merits of a healthy sex-life within the confines of marriage i believe we would see a massive reduction in rape, pre-marital sex, extra marital affairs and issues within the marriage.

    Because sex is defined as a "dirty" act rather than an act of love and intimacy between a married couple, you find that many men have "reproductive sex" with their wives and have a mistress with whom to have "fun sex" with.

    there are also many cultural taboos regarding the sexual drive of women in pakistan. Women who enjoy sex (even if they only have it with their husbands) are often labelled as "loose" or "depraved". This is also the cause of much unhappiness in many marriages.

    I do not suggest that promiscuity should be encouraged or even that pre-marital sex should be "accepted".

    As liberal a background as i have, i still think that the healthiest thing for any individual is to enjoy this level of intimacy with their spouse only. I have no objection to sex-education including a lesson on the importance of doing it within the confines of matrimony.

    However there are tons of myths, misunderstandings and misconceptions that young people deserve to be informed about.

    I feel that the sanctity of the institution of marriage depends on it.

    Posted 1 year ago on 10 Jan 2011 7:27 #
  6. shafiq12
    member

    bajwa

    Some things are related to human nature they don't need to be taught. The sex education can destroy the minds if it is made popular.

    Posted 1 year ago on 10 Jan 2011 7:41 #
  7. hkbajwa
    Member

    @ SS

    Nonsense... To equate education about a basic human function is NOT the same as encouraging promiscuity or anything of the sort.

    I have several doctors in my circle of family and friends who lament this lack of basic understanding among the population of pakistan. there are countless issues (physical and psychological) that could be avoided if only people had basic knowledge about sex.

    In no way am i talking about any sort of transition into the "western model".

    I am talking about being an honest muslim society that teaches its youth those things it needs to know WITHIN the values of an islamic society.

    Don't forget that it is the doctors and psychologists who actually deal with these problems on a daily basis that are promoting such education for the youth. As far as the physical and mental health is concerned, don't you think they know better?

    Does being a "good muslim" really mean that you remain silent and let your youth be ignorant about something that is a basic essential of human society?

    Posted 1 year ago on 10 Jan 2011 7:53 #
  8. hkbajwa
    Member

    @ SS

    It's classical over-the-top thinking that makes you picture sex education as a porn movie.

    Get your mind out of the gutter dude.

    In fact i would think that with the prevalence and easy availability of completely unrealistic pornographic content it is ALL THE MORE IMPORTANT that muslim societies create a counter-narrative for the youth to learn from.

    Posted 1 year ago on 10 Jan 2011 7:55 #
  9. shafiq12
    member

    bajwa

    some year ago i watched a movie on national geographic channel, a women was teaching her children about sex who even did't know what is sex.

    Bajwa i know what is sex education.

    Sex education is for those who popularize sex, Western.

    See how their society is getting destroyed coz they cross the limits. If u remain within limit i.e with in Nature, than there is no need sex education

    We should promote islamic education. Islam has every education to build a perfect society.

    Posted 1 year ago on 10 Jan 2011 8:15 #
  10. hkbajwa
    Member

    @ SS

    I have already specified that this is education that will be formulated within the values of an islamic society and with a clear focus on the fact that only sex within a marriage is the "right way".

    It will be a curriculum created by muslims, keeping in mind the cultural sensitivities of muslims.

    To equate it to a westernization is absolute nonsense.

    And i can certainly assure you that you have haven;t the foggiest idea what sex-education is.

    If you knew (like muslim doctors and psychologists know) then you wouldn;t have these ridiculous assumptions in your mind (which i am sure are born entirely because your mind simply does not go beyond gutter pornography).

    "I have seen it on National Geographic"... sheeeeesh.. as if that makes you an authority.

    Posted 1 year ago on 10 Jan 2011 8:31 #
  11. shafiq12
    member

    bajwa

    The most dangerous disadvantages of sex education is that it may spark the curiosity of an innocent person, which would lead him or her to try it or worst, force someone to do it. Your otherwise good intentions could turn to inadvertently promoting it. Learning about sex before being mature enough to handle the importance and consequences can sometimes lead to promiscuity and even perversion.

    "I have seen it on National Geographic"... sheeeeesh.. as if that makes you an authority.

    Bajwa i am not a hypocrite so u don't need to sheeesh.

    Posted 1 year ago on 10 Jan 2011 8:34 #
  12. hkbajwa
    Member

    @ SS

    Firstly, i am not implying that kids should be given sex education before they hit puberty. There is very little point in that.

    However once young people reach puberty their own bodies will start creating the urges that you are talking about.

    it is very important at this juncture that young people learn what is happening to their bodies and why they suddenly have these urges and what to do with them.

    it is because of the silence of the older generation that young kids don't behave in a decent fashion when they are faced with these realities.

    Are you really saying that pubescent teens don't know about sex and don't feel the urges unless they are spoken about?? I'm pretty sure you can see that such is certainly not the case.

    Whether you talk about it or not, young people will have active sex drives. Society then has two choices. it can either remain silent and let the kids fumble their way through and act as they do now OR society can teach kids how to control their urges, how to deal with the changes in their bodies and make it very clear to them that sex is an important matter of intimacy between a married couple.

    You insist on assuming that sex education is pornography for immature minds. That is only the case if they are being taught by a pervert.

    If however they are being taught some realities (which are relevant to them on account of them having reached puberty) by professional doctors, nurses and psychologists, do you really think it will be as dirty as you envision it?

    Posted 1 year ago on 10 Jan 2011 8:47 #
  13. shafiq12
    member

    bajwa

    Let me clear u , u think every one like u, I have clear idea what sex education is so u don't need to put ur own imagination on me. (please for mirza ghulam's sake)

    Sex education is a broad term used to describe education about human sexual anatomy, sexual reproduction, sexual intercourse, reproductive health, emotional relations, reproductive rights and responsibilities, abstinence, contraception, and other aspects of human sexual behavior. Common avenues for sex education are parents or caregivers, school programs, and public health campaigns.

    I am talking its aspect why people are trying to spread because they cross limits. They have changed their religion.

    Posted 1 year ago on 10 Jan 2011 8:58 #
  14. hkbajwa
    Member

    @ SS

    What a useless thing to drag Mirza into this argument. I'm very impressed with your ability to resort to irrelevant cheap shots.

    Anyhow i repeat. you do NOT know what sex education is. If you did, you would not see it as pornography.

    You have quoted a definition that you have taken off the internet. can you tell me what is wrong with young people who have a sex drive (which ALL kids in puberty have as a basic result of their physiology) knowing such things??

    That young people have sexual urges is a reality that can not be changed. that they have questions is a reality that cannot be changed. That they often act in inappropriate ways because they are ignorant is a reality that CAN be changed.

    And that is what doctors, nurses, psychologists and other health & social workers are wishing to change.

    If young people know all these things it can only benefit this society. It will NOT increase the likelihood of them engaging in pre-marital sex, it will NOT make them more promiscuous and it will NOT make them into perverts.

    You refuse to understand the fact that i am saying sex-education within the values of Islam. What is wrong with that?

    You are providing no reason for it other than a very ignorant statement that it will "ruin their minds" (for which you are unable to come up with any sort of argument)

    And as to your last statement i have NO IDEA how talking about a basic biological fact is "changing the religion".

    Posted 1 year ago on 10 Jan 2011 9:07 #
  15. shafiq12
    member

    bajwa

    "SEX EDUCATION" - AN EFFECTIVE TOOL OF THE WEST FOR THE PROMOTION OF DEBASED SEXUAL VALUES:

    The West is making a vigorous effort to promote their libertine culture and values upon the nations of the world. To this end, they are employing all the resources available at their disposal. One such powerful medium is education, via the Western, secular educational system. In order to promote it's liberal culture on sex, the West introduced the concept of sex "education" (Corruption) as an important element of the educational curriculum. Through this, it hopes to imbue the coming generations with its corrupt values on sex from a very tender age. Corrupt and perverted values on sex are being foisted onto the minds of the unwary victims in the name of sex "education". Young, impressionable minds are being slowly corrupted with debased Western sexual values at secular institutions under the guise of "education". Tangible examples of such degenerate sexual values is encouragement towards sexual "experimentation" in the form of masturbation, dating, viewing pornographic material, premarital sex, depraved sexual acts and practices and casting aside modesty and natural inhibitions. These are the anti-thesis of all that which Islam stands for. The danger this poses to the Muslims, especially the Muslim youth, is indescribable, as it shakes the very foundations of their faith, their morality and their value systems. Yet many parents and concerned citizens of society are blissfully unaware of the magnitude of the problem. If this trend continues unchecked, the tidal wave of depravity will certainly destroy the morality of the Islamic society. Every member of society has to play a meaningful role in stanching this rot and decay that is sure to devastate our present and coming generations.

    May Allah protect one and all from this avalanche of pollution. Aameen.
    Mufti Z. Bhayat

    bajwa hope u get the point what i am trying to tell.

    Posted 1 year ago on 10 Jan 2011 9:47 #
  16. shafiq12
    member

    bajwa

    As a liberal u can't understand what i am saying, because liberals are liberals

    The society of liberal will suicide according to iqbal

    ديار مغرب کے رہنے والو! خدا کي بستي دکاں نہيں ہے
    کھرا جسے تم سمجھ رہے ہو ، وہ اب زر کم عيار ہو گا
    تمھاري تہذيب اپنے خنجر سے آپ ہي خود کشي کرے گي
    جوشاخ نازک پہ آشيانہ بنے گا ، ناپائدار ہو گا

    Posted 1 year ago on 10 Jan 2011 9:52 #
  17. hkbajwa
    Member

    @ SS

    OMFG dude... what are you not understanding about "Sex education curriculum FOR muslims BY muslims and keeping in mind islamic values".

    The nonsense you have posted above is just another useless paranoid diatribe by a man who clearly does not know what the heck he is talking about.

    He is talking about WESTERN sec education created by people from a WESTERN culture in which sex is viewed in an entirely different way.

    NOBODY is saying that we should implement anything of the sort (as i have made quite clear again and again and again in this thread).

    Labeling sex education as a "western tool" is in fact the classic fall-back position for mullahs every time they fail to come up with any sort of logical arguments. Anything that cannot be countered with reason, will be countered with ridiculous and irrational propaganda.

    You have still failed to respond to any of my arguments with anything other than the usual "western conspiracy" nonsense.

    Still waiting for something resembling a valid argument......

    Posted 1 year ago on 10 Jan 2011 9:57 #
  18. hkbajwa
    Member

    @ SS

    I'm also not understanding why the epithet of "liberal" has to be attached to this particular point of view (not that i mind it honestly).

    I am giving you rational arguments as to why sex education is necessary for young people in muslim societies.

    Other than copy-pasting a clerical diatribe against WESTERN sex education i have not really seen much in the way of an actual point from you.

    Posted 1 year ago on 10 Jan 2011 12:57 #
  19. bsobaid
    Member

    Excellent work by Dr. Mobeen. For those who dont know this great person, he is a well-reputed and highly qualified psychiatrist, who runs a welfare psychiatric hospital in Karachi, treating hundreds of patients for free or for nominal fees.

    In addition to that, he should also persuade urban societies to lower the age of marriage to 20.

    Posted 1 year ago on 10 Jan 2011 15:37 #
  20. kulla
    Member

    interesing....i agree with bajwa on some accounts, however in our society where governance of all sorts seems to be non existance, it will be v hard to impliment this.

    On the contratry, I think our society is getting worst and worst because we are so far away from our religion. Maybe sex education in the context of islam would be beneficial only if proper religous aspect is maintained, and education starts only after kids hit puberty or something like the age of 14 or so, just so that they have matured enough to understand the importance of our religious teachings.

    If un managed, it can further destroy our society morally just like it has done in the west. Also not everything West does is right, and there has always been a section of society that thinks early sex education is not right.

    Posted 1 year ago on 10 Jan 2011 16:43 #
  21. kulla
    Member

    ... also, abuse of this sex edcuation by perverts is going to be another issue. The west is full of it as an example.

    so at the end, it comes down to pros/cons... what will do more damage.

    Posted 1 year ago on 10 Jan 2011 16:44 #
  22. bsobaid
    Member

    If this question was raised 10 years ago, I'd have said we dont need this but these days chidren in 6th 7th class watch all sorts of porn on internet in addition to all soft porn shown in bolloywood crap that runs on TV in our homes all the time. Children are already exposed of it and books such as that of Dr. Mobeen (by the way, he is a long time well-known jamati) will help deal with the issue rather than corrupting children.

    I had a thread long time ago about marriage age for urban youth that discussed it in detail but I cant seem to find it anymore. Wish there was an "advanced search" feature on the forum.

    Posted 1 year ago on 10 Jan 2011 16:55 #
  23. hkbajwa
    Member

    @ bsobaid

    Precisely my point. there is no way that the youth can be shielded from all the sexual innuendo in the media, nor can one hope to shield them from their own bodily desires.

    In such a situation is it IMPERATIVE that they be given the tools with which to deal with adolescence, sex and the opposite gender.

    I mean so far our society has kept its mouth shut and NOT spoken to the youth.. And where exactly has that gotten us?

    Posted 1 year ago on 11 Jan 2011 7:40 #
  24. Bajwa!
    In Europe they have sexual education in schools. Hence in UK, the average age for sex is 13 years and Ireland which is one of the most conservative country in Europe, has an average age of 14 when a girl loses her virginity. ( These figures are 6/7 years old)
    Would you comment on this, keeping in mind that all these countries has highest number of teenage, single parent, out of we'd lock pregnancies!

    Posted 1 year ago on 11 Jan 2011 8:31 #
  25. hkbajwa
    Member

    @ Khansahib

    I don't know how many time si have to repeat this

    I DO NOT RECOMMEND SEX EDUCATION IN THE WESTERN STYLE

    I am saying that MUSLIM doctors/nurses/psychologists should develop a curriculum based on MUSLIM values for a MUSLIM youth.

    the objective isn't to get the youth more ACTIVE in sex, but rather to arm them with the tools with which to deal with the basic biological changes their bodies are undergoing and get an understanding of its physical and psychological impact.

    I am talking about teaching a sexually frustrated and ignorant youth about some basic realities of life.

    This curriculum should for instance include things like why pre-marital sex is not advisable (unwanted pregnancy, exploitation and STDs), why sex should be restricted to your spouse (STDs and a destruction of harmony at home), why adultery is socially and psychologically damaging (breach of marital contracts and a breach of trust). I am talking about the muslim youth being aware of sex in the context of islamic values.

    I just don't get what the heck is wrong with that.

    fact is that we have a youth in Pakistan that is inundated with sexual content and innuendo every hour of their lives, but they have no resource that can help them deal with this reality. They have no way of acquiring information because the adults don't want to talk about it.

    How does keeping the youth ignorant about sex in an islamic context help them in any way?

    Posted 1 year ago on 11 Jan 2011 8:43 #
  26. its pointless to discuss this .
    for some its not at all needed .
    for some its already known .
    and for some ...
    its too late .

    Posted 1 year ago on 11 Jan 2011 8:48 #
  27. Bajwa sahib!
    Relax and cool down" your bp must have shot up now. If u chose to take part in discussions on a forum then sometime you have to repeat yourself as I can't read your mind!

    I am not against sexual education but not to the extent the they teach in Europe too. I think they should just incorporate this into their biology or sociology lessons rather then making it a separate education or else we will have to wait for another 50/60 years before sex as a subject will be acceptable to our ignorant masses.

    Posted 1 year ago on 11 Jan 2011 8:49 #
  28. hkbajwa
    Member

    @ khansahib

    hehehehehe... yes indeed i suppose my bp did shoot up a bit. My apologies. Of course i understand some things need to be repeated.

    And yes i think your idea certainly has merit. This information can be packaged in any way society deems fit.

    My point is only that the youth deserve this guidance from its elders, and those who oppose it are doing an injustice to the next generation.

    Posted 1 year ago on 11 Jan 2011 8:54 #
  29. My point is only that the youth deserve this guidance from its elders, and those who oppose it are doing an injustice to the next generation.

    That is unlikely to happen unless u have educated parents / grandparents ( I guess 2 generations)

    Posted 1 year ago on 11 Jan 2011 9:02 #
  30. actually what we are debating is quite pointless .
    because , lots of parents told their kids about these things .
    if our society is working and spreading ,ppl are getting married and getting their families ...that means there is knowldge .
    for girls , Moms even Nanis and Dadis tell them things .
    boys get these things learn from their fellows .

    Posted 1 year ago on 11 Jan 2011 9:14 #
  31. bsobaid
    Member

    Some youth in west may lose viginity at the age of 13 not because of sex education but just because the nature of the society. The sex education helps those teens avoid diseases and unplanned pregnancy. It is called damage control.

    We can either dig our heads in sand like an ostrich all scared of uriyaani and fahashi while our teens go crazy like rabbits and develop all sorts of diseases and unplanned pregnancy or we can think with our heads and do some planning about it. Remove mulla from your minds and you may think wisely.

    Posted 1 year ago on 11 Jan 2011 15:04 #

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