Should Pervaiz Musharaaf be tried for his numerous crimes against Pakistan? « PKPolitics Discuss

PKPolitics Discuss » Current Issues

Should Pervaiz Musharaaf be tried for his numerous crimes against Pakistan?

(50 posts)

docsarmad
Member

Please give your opinion about Pervaiz Musharaaf's trial. Should he be tried for his numerous crimes?
He is accused of violation of constitution, murder of Bugti & Benazir, May 12 massacre, Lal mosque massacre, attack on judiciary, NRO, selling numerous Pakistanis to other countries & bringing a bad name to our armed forces.
And please vote on this issue https://www.facebook.com/groups/276741795717024/

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 13:53 #
pakstar
Member

Yes! he must be "FAIRLY" tried. It has to start from somewhere, our ARMY has failed to scrutinise army Generals which lead to more democratic instability in Pakistan.

Once these Army Generals will be held accountable for this acts then No General will dream to become President by over-stepping the constitution. otherwise it's never-ending story..

He must be asked about
Karil war,
Plane hijacking story,
Quo in 1999,
Bughti murder,
Lal Masjdi,
NRO,
12th May,
Beynazir murder,
dismissaL OF chief justice,
house arrest of AQ Khan,
participation in so-called war of ter..ism
Shamsi and other airforce base hand-over.
etc..

whatever he did in his illegal-term of government must be questioned.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 14:00 #
zingaro
Member

Not only Musharraf but everyone must be tried and investigated. I also support that a "fair and merciless" trial should be done. Whoever is found guilty should be handed over to firing squad without delay.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 14:49 #
pakstar
Member

@zingaro

agreed!!! Ayub Khan and Zia already departed but Musharaf can be tried , Many people lost their lives because of Musharaf..

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 14:51 #
runaway
Member

Did Musharraf did all this alone?

Kiayni was his right hand in all the mess. If you have the courage and want to be fair then use Kiyani's name in the same sentence. In fact, ask your Sharifs to do the same. Otherwise, it is just hypocrisy.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 16:04 #
siddiqi73
Member

@runaway,

Sorry pal, but the buck stops with Ustad Tabla and him alone. If we start mentioning Kiyani in the same breath, than there were many other besides Kiyani as well and there will be no point in naming each and everyone of them.

Once you put Sharab-Abadi on the electric chair, others would automatically get 10 to 20.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 16:07 #
zingaro
Member

hmmmmmmmmmmmmm Siddiq73 .. ye Mush ko bithaey ga kaun electric chair pay? with due apology, apnay N-league waalay to Pindi mein ik FIR nahi darj karva sakay Mush kay Khilaf. Ya phir jo FIR Ch. Aslam nay karvai thi us pay prosecution hi zara tagri si karva detay ... bechara Aslam Sh. Supreme Court gia tab kahein jaa kay suni gai us ki .

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 16:14 #
siddiqi73
Member

Who is Chaudhry Aslam?

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 16:19 #
zingaro
Member

Siddiq73 bhai .. google karo with reference to BB murder :) Kuch mehnat aap bhi to karo na

cheers :)

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 16:24 #
anasyounus
Member

In Dunya News Program "In Session" Fawad Ch of APML mentioned that If Article 6 is applied, all the judges and politicians who supported Mush and zia would also be trialed as accessory to crime..
If I am not wrong acts of Zia and Msuh's 12th october 99 were later validated from parliament, so no one is talking about applying article 6 on Mush for 12th october incident... it is the 3rd Nov 2007 acts which have no constitutional cover and where he is completely exposed to article 6..

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 16:30 #
Pakistani Expat
Member

General Pervez Musharraf is coming to Pakistan to bail out Asif Zardari and to provide Zardari a face-saving exit from Pakistan, the same way Musharraf was granted a safe passage by Zardari & PPP after guard of honor in August 2008.

Let us not forget that Musharraf is meeting his American masters on 24-26 January 2012 and, after having their guarantee/ assurance, will come to Pakistan between 27-30 January 2012. The US will allow another NRO to cover up all the wrongdoings of Musharraf & Zardari.

On the other hand, Zardari has already taken a head-on confontration with the Supreme Court of Pakistan by openly defying its orders. On Supreme Court's possible judgement against the government (NRO verdict and letter to Switzerland govt), PPP will become a 'political martyr' /'siyaasi shaheed'. Asif Zardari is already too weak since his sudden illness and run-off treatment in Dubai during December 2010. Now he wants an exit from the government BUT with the guarantee that his ill-gotten wealth will not be confiscated!

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 17:10 #
sipahi
Member

@Pakistani Expat
"Let us not forget that Musharraf is meeting his American masters on 24-26 January 2012 and, after having their guarantee/ assurance, will come to Pakistan between 27-30 January 2012. The US will allow another NRO to cover up all the wrongdoings of Musharraf & Zardari."

Do you have source for this info?

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 19:06 #
Dusky
Member

@pakstar:
"Ayub Khan and Zia already departed but Musharaf can be tried , Many people lost their lives because of Musharaf.."

Does their departure washes away their sins they committed against Pakistan and people of Pakistan? If not, they do their trial as well.
Otherwise, I don't see why we trial BB for corruption charges after her death. Or in words of Zardari "Qabar ka trial", lf her trial is justified, then no exception for Yahya, Ayub ad Zia.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 19:28 #
Dusky
Member

Regarding Musharaf, absolutely bring him to the court of law. Not only him, all those as well who were his partner in crimes.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 19:31 #
sipahi
Member

@Dusky

No one can be tried in a court of law after death, this is universal law.
No one is trying BB or any other dead person.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 19:32 #
Dusky
Member

@siddiqi73"
"Sorry pal, but the buck stops with Ustad Tabla and him alone. If we start mentioning Kiyani in the same breath, than there were many other besides Kiyani as well and there will be no point in naming each and everyone of them.

Once you put Sharab-Abadi on the electric chair, others would automatically get 10 to 20."

Siddiqui bhai, only way to stop this nepotism is by bringing all corrupts to the court of law, being it Musharaf, Kiyani or the political and judicial associates helped them cave their way. Selective justice will never bring any change.

In this case, put a urdu speaking EX COAS to trial and give a blank cheque to current punjabi COAS who is equally involved in crimes is not going to make a good precedence.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 19:38 #
raheb
Member

Crime means that someone knows that it will not lead to something good, and that calculations can be wrong.

What He did was intention to do something good but the results/consequences did not show it, then it must be considered as wrong choice, not bad intention.

Over all he was sincere and good to Pakistan, but he did some poor choices, which he did not know the consequences, he should not ne punished for that.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 19:47 #
sipahi
Member

@rehab

Are you saying, "Ends Justify Means"?

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 19:51 #
raheb
Member

........even a court and a judge go on it.............that what was intention?????
I wanted to save mr. A but my choice of method did not support my intention.... and given result was not positive....yet I have to be considered as a positive or not?

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 19:54 #
siddiqi73
Member

Zingaro Bhai,

Acha, that Chaudhry Aslam....Bro, first off; what was the content of his FIR lodged in Pindi? Did he specifically named Bush's p00dle in that FIR? Supposedly this FIR was lodged in 2007 and PML (N) formed Punjab Government in March, 2008 at which time Ustad Tabla Master was very much a President. On the basis of such an FIR, can a provisional government even touch a sitting President with immunity? Besides, in this whole affair, you have completely absolved the federal government which came in existence from the sympathy vote of BB's assasination and was the aggreived party.

@Raheb,

Musharraf along with his other hum nawala and hum piyala generals should be fed to the d0gs.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 19:56 #
Sharif Aadmi
Member

Dusky
'
n this case, put a urdu speaking EX COAS to trial and give a blank cheque to current punjabi COAS who is equally involved in crimes is not going to make a good precedence.
'

Quite right.

Secondly , the previous generals like ayub, yahya , zia , tooka khan,aslam beg, hamid gul , waheed, asif nawaz, durrani should also be tried for their interference in politics.

Great nations have tried the culprits after death .

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 19:59 #
sipahi
Member

@rehab

I have intention (niyat) of providing food to poor and hungry. With that intention, I steal from a rich person and use all that stolen money to buy food for poor and hungry. Then, I distribute it among the most poor and hungry.

Does that mean that my amal will get reward from Allah (SWT), because my intention was good?

Ofcourse, the answer is NO. Actually, I will get punishment for my action.

In Islam, theory of "Ends Justify the Means" is not acceptable. Both End and Means must be allowed per Islamic teachings.

Amaal ka daromadar neyatoo per hain, is only applicable if Amal is an allowed in Islam.

Same thing applies to the constitution of Pakistan and laws of Pakistan. You can't break constitution ot laws of Pakistan with best of objectives.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 19:59 #
Dusky
Member

@sipahi: "No one can be tried in a court of law after death, this is universal law.
No one is trying BB or any other dead person."

I guess you never heard of symbolic trials and hangings of criminals of humanity after death.
In case of BB, Zia, Ayub, their families still enjoying the fruits of their corruption. Their parents deaths does not make them "pak putar".

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 19:59 #
sipahi
Member

@Dusky

Those symbolic trials are for revenge only. They lack view of the accused.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 20:06 #
Dusky
Member

@sipahi:

They don't serve the purpose of revenge only. They acknowledge the wrong doings of them and put the perpetrators at shame in history.
If you don't do this, then Yeaha, Ayub, Zia and Bhutto as civilian marshal-law administrator always regard as lawful rulers of Pakistan in history.

Posted 4 months ago on 08 Jan 2012 20:12 #
docsarmad
Member

Hi Guys, If you are a face book user, then please vote on this issue on the following link.
https://www.facebook.com/questions/10150512528399391/

Thanks

Posted 4 months ago on 09 Jan 2012 5:39 #
zingaro
Member

@Siddiq73 meray pyaarey .. Musharraf ko resign kiay hoey bhi 3 saal nahi honey lagey ? aur janab ye kion kaha aap nay PPP aggrieved party hay ... Janab ik pakistani aurat ka sar-e-aaam qatal hova tha to poori society aggrieved hay. Kahien aisa to nahi kay aap log Musharraf kay resign kar denay kay bawajood aaj tak usay President hi samj rahay hein ??

Posted 4 months ago on 09 Jan 2012 5:47 #
siddiqi73
Member

@Zingaro Bhai,

Bhai sahab, Pakistanioon ki turjumani Pakistan ki government karti hai. Jub government hee apnay aik citizen aur apni hee party ki Chairperson kay murderers ko insaf nahi dilana chachtee, tu kiya jai?

Rah giya sawal Ustad Tabla Master ko president samajhnay ka sawal, tu mera nahi khiyal aisee koi baat hai.

Posted 4 months ago on 09 Jan 2012 6:09 #
Hussain Farooqui
Member

The man responsible for the tragedy of 1971 was a military dictator Gen. Yahaya Khan. His punishment was just house arrest up till Zia's period. He was then released by another dictator Gen. Zia Ul Haq. Zardari was detained in jails for long time, but then he was released and made the president of Pakistan. Shariff brothers were jailed but then freed and transported to Saudi Arabia. They are also back to the country holding important political potions.

Our system of justice is just like the playing clay of children which can be shaped into favourite toys.

Posted 4 months ago on 09 Jan 2012 6:16 #
sipahi
Member

Another question, which is more crucial, is

Can Pervaiz Musharaaf be tried for his numerous crimes against Pakistan?

Posted 4 months ago on 09 Jan 2012 6:22 #
Hussain Farooqui
Member

siphi

Many leaders like Shariff brothers and Zardari were tried. In some cases, even punishments were awarded by the courts of law but what was the end result later? Their exoneration from all cases. judiciary has just been a toy in all the regimes.

Posted 4 months ago on 09 Jan 2012 6:25 #
anasyounus
Member

for an FIR submitted in Punjab province.. who is suppose to prosecute? Federal Government or Punjab government?

Posted 4 months ago on 09 Jan 2012 6:30 #
Hussain Farooqui
Member

Billi kay gallay mein ghanti koon bandhay gaa? ha ha ha

Posted 4 months ago on 09 Jan 2012 6:32 #
iamsowise
Commenter

Posted 4 months ago on 09 Jan 2012 7:49 #
sultanalikhan
Member

Seeing the current crop of civilian leadership in action, Mushy appears an angel.......bring him back!!!

Posted 4 months ago on 09 Jan 2012 11:09 #
Hussain Farooqui
Member

SAK

It is always the corruption and incompetence of politicians that brings a dictator on the helm of the affairs. The political institutions in India have been strong, so no military men could even think about any military coup. In the political matters, even Bangladesh and Srilanka are far better.

Posted 4 months ago on 09 Jan 2012 11:16 #
Sharif Aadmi
Member

Hussain Farooqui

Don't compare india with pakistan. There are a few fundamental differences

a) India, as a country has got a hisotry of thousands of years.

b) Pakistan , was crafted by colonial rulers , to continue in-direcct colonoinal rule as well as to provide a chiragah for their 'khudam khas'.i.e. BAHDUR FAUJ , Feudals and mullahs.

c) India has a continues , un-inerrupted political process which pakistan doesn't have. So , politicans will only grow in the nursery of GHQ.

d) Pakistani masses over the last 65 years have been brain-washed against the political process and pakistan has become a security state .

Due to these & many more reasons , its impossible to try any UNIFORMED ANGEL , be it tokka khan of bengal or yahha khan or niazi or ayub or zia or mush or kiyani or just a capt.hammad.

Posted 4 months ago on 09 Jan 2012 12:39 #
Hussain Farooqui
Member

Shariff Aadmi

You are right that most of the politicians are bred in the military hatchery. The hatched politicians are supposed to be incompetent to overcome the military generals. That is why their rules always turn up to be failures and thus give military again to take over the reins of the country.

Posted 4 months ago on 09 Jan 2012 13:01 #
Sharif Aadmi
Member

HF

Bahi meeray , civilains are just placed as puppets by BAHDUR FAUJ with actuall powers still in GHQ.

Who decides that civlians have failed ????????

a) In aug 1990 , BB government was dismissed ? Why ??? Who decided that govt has failed ??? Why it was not allowed to complete its tenure ???

b) In April 93 , NS govt was dismissed ? Who decided it has failed ?? It was restored by SC , even then it was again dimissed in Jul 93 ? Who decided it has failed and on what grounds ???

same story in second term of NS & BB...

Sir jee, why and on what basis we call civlians a failure ????

Posted 4 months ago on 09 Jan 2012 13:05 #
Hussain Farooqui
Member

Shariff Aadmi

I don't disagree with most of your points:

When MQM tried to challenge the army by kidnapping a major and the niece of Gen. Asif Nawaz, the army set free a jackal called Nasirullah Baber.

When Shariff Brothers tried to play with the army, we all know what happened to them. ha ha ha

However, the present democratic regime is costing very dearly to the nation. True that democracy is the best revenge. BB rightly said that. ha ha ha

Posted 4 months ago on 09 Jan 2012 13:23 #
d0ct0r
Member

Pervez Musharraf should worry about himself rather about Israel

Pervez Musharraf should worry about himself rather about Israel
Former president, General (Retd) Pervez Musharraf, who favored the recognition of Israel, should not worry about her rather more about himself. His demand shows that he had no concerns with desires of the Pakistanis.
The former military dictator, who ruled the country for nine years, did not take this action in his regime. Even he was the first leader who participated in a ceremony organized by World Jewish Congress (WJC).
It is unclear that either he was afraid of Pakistani people or he realized the unprincipled nature of the move. While interviewing to Haaretz, an Israeli daily, he spoke in the favor of recognition to Israel, terming it adjuvant step for Pakistan.
Although his remarks will have gone down well with US lobbies, it was quite insulting for the Palestinian citizens.
At the same time, this view would please the Israeli audience because a former leader of one of the largest Muslim countries spoke about their recognition. Apparently, his remarks show that he has same viewpoint as he was in the past.
These remarks will further decline the image of the former dictatorial president in the country. According to the reports, he is making a comeback in the country by the end of January 2012.
He was out of the country for last three years because he fears that he will be apprehended on his arrival. The former military chief is proclaimed offender in cases which include the murder of Benazir Bhutto and Nawab Akbar Bugti.
Although legal aides of Musharraf filed applications to the courts, the FIA (Federal Investigative Agency) Prosecutor of the Benazir Bhutto case clarified that he would be held on arrival.
He is thinking about participating in the upcoming elections but he should reconsider his comeback. He would have observed the garner support of Imran Khan’s PTI which he was seeking for his party.
Upon his arrival, if he is liable to be handcuffed, he may not able to contest the next general polls.
Although Pakistan will become a laughingstock in case of his arrestment, he will be the real sufferer. General Pervez Musharraf, if he really wants to contest elections, should care the feelings of Pakistani people.

http://www.newspakistan.pk/2012/01/09/pervez-musharraf-worry-israel/

Posted 4 months ago on 09 Jan 2012 13:51 #
runaway
Member

@siddiqi

Your obsession with Tabla Khan still continues.

Apparently, PML-N is the most against Musharraf. All I was asking, if Musharraf is guilty, what about all his other colleagues esp ex DG-ISI General Kiyani.

What a lame excuse, can't name all the people. Why? Tongue of Mr. Nawaz Sharif will get twisted or the hands of the typist writing the press release will get tired?

Sir, accept the reality, the lion of Punjab does not have the balls to blame all the involved people. Mush without his uniform is an easy target.

How is Tabla Khan related to this? Tabla Khan did not sack Mr. Shareef and sent him packing.

Posted 4 months ago on 09 Jan 2012 13:55 #
stingingnettle
Member

Why should Pakistan's love affair with accountability start with Musharraf?

There is no love lost between Musharraf and I. but by suffering from selective dementia viz a viz political malpractice of past and present rulers, we continue to live a lie and our disdain and contempt for Pakistani public is self-evident.

No selective dementia.

Posted 4 months ago on 09 Jan 2012 17:22 #
bsobaid
Member

Why not?
However, the current judiciary is not capable of trying him due to bad blood between the two.
It will not be a fair trial.

Posted 4 months ago on 09 Jan 2012 18:47 #
stingingnettle
Member

bsobaid;

Does the the history of misrule begin with Musharraf?

Did angels rule Pakistan before that or now?

In Pakistan, laws do not apply to politicians and ruler as Mr Zardari and his cronies are proving to to and the rulers of the past proved quite definitively. I am not actually sure who the laws of Pakistan apply to any more, Pakistan does not seem to have a system of justice but a system of miscarriage of justice.

I would challenge you to find a single person who says that they trust the justice provided by the lower courts in Pakistan.

Posted 4 months ago on 09 Jan 2012 21:41 #
bsobaid
Member

This is an MQM-type argument.

When someone demands punishing criminals and killers they demand killers of Karachi operation must also be punished all the way back to Liaquat Ali Khan's killers.

Anyone alive who is currently or in past involved in crimes must be tried, specially jurnails.

PPP has been tried in courts and is currently under court trial. They are only using delay tactics but they will be out of government in a year's time and then next ruling party can open cases against all NRO beneficiaries.

Criminal at hand right now is Musharraf and he should be given a free trial which I believe is not possible under current SC.

Posted 4 months ago on 09 Jan 2012 21:46 #
stingingnettle
Member

bsobaid;

No I am not saying that we must clear the trails of the last 60 years; my suggestion is first make sure you have a system that works and they let there be a free for all.

In the British system it is very unusual for a trial to last more than two weeks once they start. A day or two for high court appeals. The fact that trials in Pakistan can go on for years means that the crooks you call leaders do not want a functioning judiciary.

So, try anyone you like but using the same justice, for this you must fix the judicial system properly. That is easily the first system that anyone must fix to start the process of healing for Pakistan.

Posted 4 months ago on 09 Jan 2012 21:53 #
Hussain Farooqui
Member

The system of justice in not existent at all in our country. Cases over the political personalities are just political games.

Posted 4 months ago on 10 Jan 2012 5:26 #
junaid
Member

i think there are multiple arrest warrants against him. he was not a politician either that people will get betray and adore him once again.

Posted 4 months ago on 10 Jan 2012 6:42 #
Hussain Farooqui
Member

Our courts of law are more like political playgrounds rather than the centres of justice. Our history 64 years history is full of political games played in the courts of law. Our judiciary is a colonial style judiciary which was established by the white masters to play their political games.

Posted 4 months ago on 10 Jan 2012 11:54 #

RSS feed for this topic

Reply

You must log in to post.