'The Unholy Law' - Blasphemy laws in Pakistan

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'The Unholy Law' - Blasphemy laws in Pakistan

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gv
Member

Interesting article in Dawn regarding the background of Blasphemy laws in Pakistan.

http://www.dawn.com/wps/wcm/connect/dawn-content-library/dawn/news/pakistan/02-the-unholy-law-02

Posted 2 years ago on 19 Jan 2010 18:35 #
zia m
Member

gv,
Good to see you back.

Posted 2 years ago on 19 Jan 2010 18:52 #
M.AKRAM KHAN NIAZI
Member

Blasphemy laws are must for harmony and for stability in Society:

*Those people who are opposing Blasphemy laws infact want freedom for abusing religion and religious leaders of other religions.

*There are clear guidelines from leaders of one religion to use abusive language against Islam, so that spread of Islam could be blocked.

*In the evidence of this hundreds of websites and articles are present on internet mostly from western countries using abusive language against Islam and Prophet Muhammad(Peace be Upon Him).

* This is quite rubbish that no one is committing blasphemy, infact there is quite strong evidence is present that members of a specific religion are using abusive language against Islam as a tool and weapon and are also demanding removal of Blaphemy Laws.It is the responsibilty of Muslims Scholars and Government Officials to approach religious leaders of that religion to not to involve in such hilarious practices.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 6:30 #
gv
Member

@M.A Niazi

I don't think you bothered to read the article but if you did should i suppose that you are denying the quranic verses quoted in the article?

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 10:10 #
toamin
member

Some article by a worker affiliated with an international NGO.

NGO's selection of subject and target tells about their real motive.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 10:37 #
gv
Member

jj i think you need to actually bother reading the article - the issue the article raises is that there is no mention of the death penalty for blasphemy in early islam - it is clearly a later addition

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 10:47 #
toamin
member

gv,

First i have to convince myself on why should I read this article from an international NGO? What is the objective of this NGO?

Once I establish the motive then we can set the common ground or benchmark for discussion and then we can debate based on agreed frame of reference.

What do you know about jj?

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 10:51 #
gv
Member

well if you don't read the article you can't exactly make valid comments on it now can you??

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 10:56 #
toamin
member

My comment was that this international NGO (who?) has chosen a subject in Pakistan which is not a major social issue for the people of Pakistan.

Selection of subject tells us on their propaganda mission in Pakistan.

My suggestion, expose these NGOs by brining out their true motives. Why don't they pick issue that 97% of population faces, why they pick something which is related with 1% population of the country?

Target of Propaganda = Islam (camouflaged as extremism)

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 11:02 #
hariskhan
member

Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,

DAWN News: The unholy law

By Mansoor Raza
Tuesday, 19 Jan, 2010
--------------------------------------------------------

Mansoor Raza is a Karachi-based researcher affiliated with an international NGO, and can be reached at mansooraza@gmail.com.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

@gv: Do you have nothing better to do ?

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 11:07 #
gv
Member

@salam

my suggestion; read something before you comment on it.. your comments are invalid otherwise

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 11:16 #
toamin
member

No, not invalid because I am questioning the motive, timing and objective of this campaign.

Of course you would like people to blindly follow the campaigns without knowing about the real designs behind these paid media campaigns.

I have read the article and observed it's format, ideas, sources and objective. After looking at it I have called it a questionable article due to its links with international NGOs running media campaigns.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 11:23 #
gv
Member

Well what would you like to say on the following 'questionable' piece from the article?

If a Blasphemy Law must exist, from an Islamic point of view, Dr. Zaheer believes it must satisfy the following conditions:

a) Capital punishment cannot be given to a person who is found guilty of committing blasphemy. According to the Qur'an, capital punishment can only be given to murderers and those who take the law into their hands. (Qur'an; 5:32)

b) The punishment should be applicable to those found guilty of blasphemy against revered personalities, deities of all faiths and it should be equally applicable to both Muslims and non-Muslims. The Qur'an says: "Don't use abusive language against their false gods lest they should use the same language against yours in retaliation." (Qur'an; 6:108)

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 11:31 #
toamin
member

I would first ask the member who puts this question to agree to accept Sharia-Law as benchmark of discussion.

Do you take sharia-law as the governing model for society?

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 11:38 #
gv
Member

sure

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 11:45 #
change_is_close
Member

@gv

If a Blasphemy Law must exist, from an Islamic point of view, Dr. Zaheer believes it must satisfy the following conditions:

I think someone should tell the learned Dr. Zaheer that Hadith is also a 'primary source' of Sharia. On the same note, the agreed upon secondary/derived sources of Sharia include Ijmaa-as-Sahaba and Qiaas.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 11:48 #
toamin
member

Good point CiC

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 11:58 #
gv
Member

so youre saying the hadith supercedes the quran ?

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 12:20 #
change_is_close
Member

@gv
whaoooo... what deduction skills... i'm impressed, dude! =D

what did i say that makes you think so?

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 12:28 #
gv
Member

Why don't you focus on the crux of the issue instead of blindly banging on about your various agendas to all and sundry...

the main points are that

i) the blasphemy laws in Pakistan in their current state are draconian,
2) they are one sided and
3) there is no sanction in the quran for capital punishment for committing blasphemy.

stick to those and we'll have a discussion..

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 12:39 #
zia m
Member

All religious groups act like crybabies.They love to hide behind draconian laws.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 12:52 #
change_is_close
Member

@gv
honestly, i don't have sufficient knowledge to comment on (1) and (2), and you might be correct - since we don't have Sharia law, there is always a chance of misuse of law. so, because of my ignorance about the pakistani law, i won't say that you're wrong.

on #3, i'd again say that sunnah/hadith is also a primary source of sharia. tell me this, where in the quran do you find the complete method of salaah (prayers) in the quran? where do you find the number of rakaat for each prayer?

it is my opinion that basically, the discussion is around the capital punishment for blasphemy - this is the direction of the article, and this is what i commented on.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 13:20 #
gv
Member

@change is close

thank you ! appreciate your comments. Agree with you that sunnah/hadith is a primary source of sharia but the writer of the article argues that if the prophet himself did not prescribe capital punishment for blasphemy so why should we?

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 13:25 #
jaypk
Member

@gv...mate...do you want to come into the list of...munkar e nabuwat and kafir and tauheen e risalat..sorry if i m forgetting any of them......the article has pointed out a very basic disfunctionality of our qaum but i m sure tht ppl would come up with arguments against it..some of them already has..here you go..our dilemma as a nation is that we only beleive firstly what has been shown to us....and we believe it without researching secondhand on tht issue...becasue we are not bothered to go into islamic discussions...and beleive whd our JAYED ulemas have told us..blindly....secondly..our biggest problem is that we have made religion an entity..and we try to impose it on everyone..according to our style...and as soon as sumone comes with an argument...we call him kafir straightaway..and thn dnt mind burning them alive or killin them fr tht matter..cz humaray jazbaat bohat jaldi majrooh ho jatay hain....just like javed ahmed ghamidi..!! so the impact is as soon as ppl would read his name in the front lines of any article..they wouldnt bother reading it fully....!! Khuda ki maar hay humari akalon par..thts it.!

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 14:10 #
change_is_close
Member

At the recent PR seminar, Dr. Zaheer mentioned that even though there are several mentions of blasphemy committed by the polytheists of Makkah and hypocrites of Madinah against Islam and its Prophet (PBUH), no worldly punishment has even been hinted at in the Qur'an.

if this is the piece that you're referring to, then what i get from it is that the order does not appear in Qur'an, it doesn't say that the Prophet (SAW) didn't do it. reading the authentic books of seerah reveals that at the conquest of makkah, the Prophet (SAW) ordered to kill some ppl, even if they "hid in the curtains of the ka'bah." these ppl included singers, who used to sing poems satirizing the Prophet (SAW).

Also this hadith in Abu Dawood (Book 38, Number 4348):

Narrated Abdullah Ibn Abbas:

A blind man had a slave-mother who used to abuse the Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) and disparage him. He forbade her but she did not stop. He rebuked her but she did not give up her habit. One night she began to slander the Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) and abuse him. So he took a dagger, placed it on her belly, pressed it, and killed her. A child who came between her legs was smeared with the blood that was there. When the morning came, the Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) was informed about it.

He assembled the people and said: I adjure by Allah the man who has done this action and I adjure him by my right to him that he should stand up. Jumping over the necks of the people and trembling the man stood up.

He sat before the Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) and said: Apostle of Allah! I am her master; she used to abuse you and disparage you. I forbade her, but she did not stop, and I rebuked her, but she did not abandon her habit. I have two sons like pearls from her, and she was my companion. Last night she began to abuse and disparage you. So I took a dagger, put it on her belly and pressed it till I killed her.

Thereupon the Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: Oh be witness, no retaliation is payable for her blood.

there are many other narrations, but i'm not a jurist or scholar so i cannot discuss the minute details of this issue (like what signifies blasphemy, what should be the punishment for a specific kind of blasphemy, etc.). however, i know that classical scholars have discussed this in detail and that most (if not all) of them agree that the blasphemer should be executed.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 14:17 #
zingaro
Member

yaar simple baat ye hay kay is law say kis ko takleef hay ? aur kion takleef hay ?

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 14:22 #
toamin
member

Right Zingaro, I've tried to say the same thing that why these international NGOs overlook the issues faced by 97% of the population?

What is the motive/objective behind targeting these subjects that relate with Sharia? Why they don't object to subjects related with british legacy such as immunity to a ruler? There is no immunity for a ruler in Islam.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 14:32 #
change_is_close
Member

@Salam
that's exactly the point! as i said, classical scholars have discussed this issue in detail and they agree on the punishment. if one goes and reads their books, there are detailed evidences from quran and sunnah. this is just a part of the global campaign to 'liberalize' and 'soften' the Islamic Shariah.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 14:38 #
gv
Member

The point is that the laws are irrational, unfair and inhuman and are abused by powerful people in order to further their own personal agendas.

Secondly just becasue a scholar from a few hundred years ago said something does not make it infallible. If an old law is irrational and does not have CLEAR sanction in the quran or the hadith we should be able to question and revise it to make it more rational and effective.

That is called a dynamic system - islam is a dynamic faith meant for all times and all worlds not just for the medieval levant.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 15:40 #
jaypk
Member

@Gv...no sir..islam nowadays is pik n chose..or mix n match..!!

@CIC..classical scholars???......??!!out of 41 chapters of sunan abu dawood you have quoted chaptr 38 for punishments...do you practice the other 40 somehow in your life fully??? thn y only punihsments? This is a bit confusing but i think in the era of our holy Prophet(PBUH) he has strict guidelines for the prisoners of war which were not to kill them and shudnt be slain..but someone who was waging a war against the holy prophet(PBUH) was definitely a murtakib of tauheen e risalat..anyhow....by the way classical scholars have told us many other things as well like self correction,abstaining from the forbidden, rememberance of death and unbiased help and service to the mankind....do we do anyone of them in its entirety? we are so happy to follow blasphemy laws and to practice it and go and killin ppl in the name of those laws..forgettin that we can fulfill sunnah by driking water in 3 breaks and have to sit and not stand and we can show our love and affection towards our holy prophet(PBUH) by sending darud and salam on him.. i think the ppl who march out in the rallies for implemeting these laws in the love of our Holy prophet(PBUH)hardly knows the gist of mercy shown by (PBUH) in his whole life may they be kuffar or anyone.

@CIC... this is just a part of the global campaign to 'liberalize' and 'soften' the Islamic Shariah.

You must be kidding me...!! sharia has lost its meaning nowadays so get to know first what is sharia..!

so you are sayin tht islamic sharia has to be more harsh..or you think it is...fine then..kindly go and wear shalwar kameez only and refrain from shaving your beard..your shalwar has to be knee high..coevr your head all the time..none of the women in your family has to go out without an immediate relative..entertainment has to be restricted..burn all the CDs in your house..say no to TV..!!
i hope you dnt do one of them..so i am afraid you yourself are very liberal..so carry on with this and stop being choosy when it comes to religion....you yourself are practicing the chosy soft sharia so why complain!!

By the way…which sharia you are talking about..the one which you have to impose in swat…the one which needs to be imposed by force…and for that a ceasefire was necessary..the one for which we have lost 191 or so schools.…is that the sharia you are looking for..and plz dnt come up with the example of saudia arabia in respect of sharia...the sharia in which you can make an amendment any time you want like misyar marriages…!!

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 16:08 #
change_is_close
Member

@gv
i agree that if a scholar (from any age) has said something, it does not make it infallible, you can always go and check the evidences they've used from sharia sources to derive a hukam sharaii. i just gave you one hadith, doesn't it indicate the clear approval from the Prophet (SAW)? and what about CLEAR orders from the Prophet (SAW) to kill those singers 'even if they hid in the curtains of ka'bah'?

we are only ordered to follow one person without questioning, and that is the Prophet (SAW). no scholar or jurist is infallible. we can question anyone, and although permissible, the taqleed that we do today is NOT the method recommended by Islam. Islam encourages us to question the jurist/scholar about evidences from sharaii sources. but, if you want to question the work of a scholar, you should at least give them a read and see what evidences they've used to arrive at a verdict. when you do that, you'll know that they have clear evidences on this issue.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 16:36 #
change_is_close
Member

@jaypk
amusing post, that! =D

brother, i was only discussing if there is capital punishment for blasphemy in islam, or not. i provided evidences from hadith, which made sense to me. the discussion here is not that i'm a practicing muslim or not - i don't want to discuss it and make it personal. suppose i don't pray even once in a day, does that change the fact that the five-times prayer is obligatory? the discussion was around the latter part, not the former... i'm not the topic of the discussion here.

to end, let me say that i agree that we should adopt the sharia as a whole, in our personal and collective matters. what taliban did in swat or elsewhere does not mean that everyone who talks of sharia must agree to their thinking - so i oppose it!

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 16:46 #
jaypk
Member

@CIC...come on mate...dnt call it amusing..i spent 15 mins on it...:)...i think the post went over yer head...read it again wheneve you haev time.....and trust me ...you ll understand the bottomline..!!

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 17:01 #
change_is_close
Member

amusing, because you totally missed the topic and came in personal on me, for no reason... i mean, the guy who posted this topic was having a calm discussion on the subject matter, and for no reason (obvious to me), you make it personal by discussing me, instead of the topic.

and once again, you're discussing my the first line of my comment, missing the whole response to your comment. i'm sorry if my comment hurt your feelings, bro - wasn't intended.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 17:32 #
change_is_close
Member

@gv
btw, i got your bottomline, and i mentioned in my response that i agree that we should practice islam as a whole; in our personal, as well as collective lives. that's the point you were trying to make, right? couldn't agree more. there could be difference of opinion b/w us on the ahkaam sharaii in specific matters, but i CANNOT disagree with the notion of following islam in personal lives. again, thing is, we were discussing the islamic ruling on a specific matter, so i would like to keep it that way.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 17:37 #
jaypk
Member

@cic...sorry if you call answerin sumones opinion being personal...yaar itna he hay to share he na karo na apnay thoughts and ideas...jub share kar saktay ho..to sunnay ki bhee sakat rakho meray bhai...i m sorry i didnt know tht you are not open to tht....accept my apologies..i didnt discuss you..i pointed your lines..and discuss it in a broader version...thts a diff thing tht it went ever yer head like a mirage and you smash it bak on me by callin it personal remarks...!!

anyhow...if you took it all personal thn accept my apologies on tht...!!..again try to read my post ....by nt takin it personal..:)

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 17:49 #
change_is_close
Member

bro, in every comment that i make, i'm either discussing the topic, or trying to push you towards the discussion on the subject matter, but it seem like you've sworn not to.

how about giving your opinion about the correct sharaii ruling on blasphemy? what do you think should be done to the blasphemer? do you disagree with the opinion that i have adopted and presented here? since this discussion is from a sharaii perspective, in case you have a different opinion, i would be highly obliged if you care to include some evidences from the sharaii sources of jurisprudence.

for the third and last time, let me state that i agree with your 'broader version' that we should follow islam in personal and collective matters. this is what i understood from your post. i mentioned this in my last post, so if this is not what you were trying to say, then you should've corrected me. and actually, that's my point, you put aside the meat of my comments and respond on the rest.

btw, amused ≠ angered! hope you know that! =D

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 18:31 #
NNL
member

Lol

Gv come on yaar you are taking Ghamidi and Zaheer as Islamic Scholars. I then urge you to read the dialogue between them and Ali Sina believe you me he was also confused as they were when they both tried to explain their version of Islam. Confused ppl mate.

As for this guy Mansoor Raza he didnt get the point of the Blasphemy Law at all. Since he couldnt debate it in religion he imprinted his own view on the events that transpired.

Gv. What is your understanding of the Blasphemy Law.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 19:28 #
NNL
member

@CiC
you overlooked the next statement that fool Zaheer made. I mean can you believe this guy he is talking nonsense.

Instead, the Qur'an urges Muslims to ignore what the blasphemers were doing, to not participate when they blaspheme, and create circumstances that do not allow blasphemy to take place.

.

Man he is way dumber than i thought he is. Following his own dumb logic - Like first you tell there is nothing of this sort in the Quran and then you say Quran has emphasized the Muslims to block circumstances that allow Blasphemy. Then what do you think the Later Muslims did . They cut off the heads of the people who wanted to do blasphemy the best way to stop the circumstances dont you think ? wth lol

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 19:34 #
NNL
member

Out of all the Muslim Scholars of the Past this Raza chap finds to idiots of the block to quote and paraphrase lol.

Man i feel sorry for this guy's lack of understanding.

Posted 2 years ago on 20 Jan 2010 19:36 #
zingaro
Member

well said NNL...

Posted 2 years ago on 21 Jan 2010 8:10 #
change_is_close
Member

@NNL
"They cut off the heads of the people who wanted to do blasphemy the best way to stop the circumstances dont you think ? "

agreed, but the point is that you don't execute blasphemers just because 'you think' that this is the best way to stop them. instead, you do that because this is the divine verdict of Allah, practiced by the Prophet (SAW). in a nut shell, we need evidence from sharaah to decide 'HOW' to stop blasphemy, and it is pretty obvious from the sunnah that the blasphemer should be executed.

Posted 2 years ago on 21 Jan 2010 11:40 #
NNL
member

@CiC.

I know that i was merely bringing his dumb logic to an obvious conclusion. I dont why do ppl think he is some great thinker, the guy is pretty much like Ace Ventura Pet Detective movie when Jim Carrey stands on a tree shows his behind and starts shouting from the top of his lungs and all the jungle animals seem to listen to him.

Then i wondered are our Pakistani pseudo intellectuals that gullible to bs that easily.

Posted 2 years ago on 21 Jan 2010 12:31 #
change_is_close
Member

@NNL
i think it's just that they're purposefully given media projection to promote the so called 'moderate' view of islam, that's all! starting from ptv, to geo, aaj, duniya, etc. u'll see only these guys doing regular shows.

Posted 2 years ago on 21 Jan 2010 12:52 #
jaypk
Member

@CIC..buddy.. i ll try to come back to you with a detailed answer later on....as far as my knowledge is concerned...besides..i was never angry..if i sound angry thn you have to spend sumtime on this forum and you ll get to know whd i m talkin abt..:)..my view was and still is tht these laws are just ammendment been done by ourselves or human beings like us..in order to either gain some more votes or to please the masses who are more then jazbati whn it comes to religious matters..thr has to be a limit and we all love islam..and it hurts when someone tries to play with islam..but why killling?...if someone is going against our basic beleifs these laws help our jazbati masses to go and kill anyone in the name of religion and they (killers) cant be prosecuted fr tht...so whn this law or these laws are used unfairly and being manipulated by our bholi bhaali masses then i have a problem with tht..if a christan has somehow burnt the Holy Quran thn is it fair to go and set him and his family on fire as well??

and kindly explain this last line buddy..."and it is pretty obvious from the sunnah that the blasphemer should be executed."

so you are sayin if anyone said anythign against our holy prophet (PBUH) he himself asked tht person to be executed?

Posted 2 years ago on 21 Jan 2010 15:21 #
gv
Member

@cic, nnl

so you guys are arguing that an omniscient and omnipresent god needs humans to protect his honour?

Posted 2 years ago on 21 Jan 2010 22:20 #
semirza
Moderator

Religious issues - moved to 'faith and religion'.

Posted 2 years ago on 22 Jan 2010 5:03 #
NNL
member

@GV

Was that a retort ?

lol

buddy where did you get that idea that I am arguing that The Creator Allah Izza Wa Jal needs us to protect His Honor.

Did i say that ?

Arent you assuming things again.

I will give example of what i think.

Your daughter comes up to you and says you are an impotent and a bas-**** of an ahole , now before you react to that your wife steps in and sets the bejesus in your daughter straight. Doesnt mean you as a man are incapable of handling the situation ? (you in the example is in general terms not as in you specifically)

No it doesnt.

The same diminutive analysis would be applicable in here. Allah Izza Wa Jal doesnt need anyone to protect him ( case in point Abrahah and his army )but we muslims arent that depraved or immoral or '****' people that we allow someone to insult our religion and all things in it. And then we deal with the person as it is foretold to us in Sharia. We react in a way which is prescribed by Rasool Allah Sallaho Alahi Wasallam. We do whatever he did. For us the topic is over after that.

Posted 2 years ago on 22 Jan 2010 14:42 #
jaypk
Member

@all..

Whd gud this law is for…what it has deliverd? What good is it for? What benefits has this law delivered to our nation?

The thing which I don’t understand is that why are we so eager to support this law which is nothing less then killing or hanging others in the name of religion. Our Holy prophet was Rehmatul lil Alimeen…he was the only sign of peace the world ever had and ever will. If we try to confuse this with his personality then what are we showing to kuffar? What is the difference then between him(PBUH) and any ordinary human being. If we are content on this that He(PBUH) didn’t show any remorse on someones execution then I think we have to read his(PBUH) biography again.

No doubt religion is so dear to us and so is our holy prophet(PBUH). There are ways by which we can show our love and gratitude towards him. We attend eid e milad un nabi mahafils and send darood and salam on him and we can try to act upon the sunnah and get the blessings of Allah SWT. For our shame nowadays we feel proud in taking pride when we kill someone or support someone when they say that the convict was accused of blasphemy and we do this blindly as it not only serves the purpose for targeting any specific segment but also we have been told that by doing this we are doing Allahs SWT work so do it.

There are various verses in the quran which tells us that we have to let go those people who make a mock of religion or at most ignore them but there is hardly any evidence which gives us that impression that apostate or blasphemer has to be killed or executed.
One of that is surah al baqra ayat 109 where the Almighty Allah SWT is asking the believers to forgive and overlook and that Allah SWT has all the powers and not the mankind. There are other verses as well which I will quote if needed. Bottom line is that there is no punishment for blasphemy in quran. However if we interpret and make it say that this what the real meaning is then there is no end to interpretation.

Now if we take a look at our holy prophet(PBUH) life he was insulted and blasphemed and tortured by kuffar in every possible way. There would be a long list of executions starts from ikrimah ibn abu jehal to abu sufyan ibn e harb and hind bint utbah. )PBUH was forced to migrate from mecca to medina because of the severe torture and persecution but we hardly see any evidence of execution let alone been given by Our holy Prophet(PBUH) himself.

Where I disagree to this notion is not that I work for an NGO  and I want to liberalize islam( so some mean that islam is not liberal) but the point is that who are we to declare some one as blasphemous and apostate? Who gave us the authority to call anyone a blasphemer and even if it is then who gave us the authority to go and kill them. We have been told to show tolerance and mercy in every possible way. We go and burn ppl alive in thr homes doesn’t matter if we have seen the proof or not. If our jayed mullahs frm the mosques would be sayin to go and make mincemeat of those Christians accused of blasphemy then we wouldn’t be thinking more do we.?

Posted 2 years ago on 22 Jan 2010 17:24 #
gv
Member

@nnl

you may not agree with me but i think there is a considerable difference between the relationship of a man and his wife and between god and his creation

i wouldnt like to confuse the two

also 'ghairat' is a human concept - it does not apply to a perfect god

Posted 2 years ago on 23 Jan 2010 15:19 #