This is not our war! « PKPolitics Discuss

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This is not our war!

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shahzad1924
member

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 4:35 #
Beenai
Moderator

it has been made of our own war unfortunately.

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 4:40 #
shahzad1924
member

its still not our war.

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 4:59 #
amin1924
member

Some battles have been imposed on us, but the WAR is not ours. They are trying to get us involved through tactics applied in Iraq.

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 5:02 #
amin1924
member

If this is our war then Hillary Clinton should say this is your internal matter and we have no say in it, but she says we are monitoring closely and we are paying for it -why?

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 5:05 #
Beenai
Moderator

they have imposed it on us .
whether it is ours or not ,but we have to fight it out anyways . do u see any other option>??????

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 5:20 #
shahzad1924
member

yes, close down the US embassy in Islamabad, the US consulates in Mai Kolachi and Peshawar. close down the hundreds of secret CIA and blackwater cells across Pakistan. arrest all CIA and Blackwater operatives and try them for the bomb blasts and armed attacks in Pakistan. cut the supply lines to the US and NATO troops in Afghanistan. send forces back to the eastern border. and just send on brigade to kabul to free the occupation.

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 5:28 #
NNL
member

No one of you are getting it.

Pakistan is being brought down to a split.

Look at the events

India having nukes part gets in doubt their main people say well its impossible

Then Pakistan sees a huge increase in the people of those whom the Taliban had killed they start attacking Pakistanis

Like we were fighting them in FATA and they declare Sharia in Swat doesnt make sense does it.

dont you see they are wiping the only main source of minerals in the name of religion.

Dont you think they themselves are more interested in what the Quran and Ahadiths have said about the end of times. Even the most ardent Jew believes but only our kin and kiln wont.

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 5:40 #
Adonis
Member

There are two wars going on. The war in Afghanistan is America's war and the war in FATA is our war.

We can take care of our own war without American help. America should also try to fight its war without our help.

Our being allies of USA is only bringing American war into our country and as a result, Pakistanis are dying for protection of American interests.

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 6:57 #
Adonis
Member

"Even the most ardent Jew believes but only our kin and "kiln" wont. "
-----------------------------------------------------

And this "kiln" belongs to a steel mill or cement mill?

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 6:58 #
shahzad1924
member

hello! have you ever heard the term "Af-Pak" ?

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 7:05 #
semirza
Moderator

@Adonis
Very well said! Brief but to the point.

America as a sole super power should fend for itself. The mess it creates and chaos that follow is an indicator that America wants to rule the world under a false pretext of 'American interests and values' that should essentially remain confined within American borders. No country, however powerful should be allowed to challenge the sovereignty of another and manipulate their politics and resources through clandestine means and that includes propaganda too.

However we are fighting a war with elements within Pakistan who have challenged the writ of Pakistan government, have allied to and are aided by all means and channels through anti Pakistani sources.

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 7:08 #
netengr
blocked

Yeh hamari jang ban jati hay jab Usama bin ladin ,Aiman azawahri ya mulla Umer hamari qayadat keray ..

aur yeh hamari jang nahi hoti jab Pakistan Army lernay ka ailan keray .

Tou bhai yeh pakistan Kiyon banaya hay ?

Pakistan ko Usma , Mulla umer ya Fazlullah kay hawalay hi ker dain phir

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 7:17 #
shahzad1924
member

"Yeh hamari jang ban jati hay jab Usama bin ladin ,Aiman azawahri ya mulla Umer hamari qayadat keray .."

what are you talking about?

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 7:47 #
lota6177
Members

Our own created monsters are drinking the blood of innocent citizens of our country today. This is not our war but this is humarie ghalityoun ki sazza. We are the victim of terrorists who believe in imposing a religious dictatorship by spreading terror for the achievement of their political objectives. Once again we hear the all-too-familiar cries of a "Muslims can't do this. Tehreek-e-Taliban Pakistan the Lashkar-e-Taiba, Jaish-e-Mohammed or other jihadi outfits bent upon unleashing death and destruction are actually organizations that give education in writing code for Microsoft Windows 7. Yeh saab India, Israel, America, Russia, France, Denmark or Spain ki saazish haie. If we all repeat this mantra it will solve our problems. Our only choice for peace is to hand over Pakistan to terrorist who will enforce nizam adil and will give us a nice strain of true Islam as advertised in Saudi Arabia and Afghanistan.

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 8:18 #
amin1924
member

We are getting paid for this job and we also being monitored very closely and with suspicion from the bosses of this war!

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 8:36 #
lota6177
Members

jjkhan
Given the state of our economy and the militancy challenge being faced by our military it is not something to sneer at. We can use all the help we can get. I bet you never had a problem when 2 billion US dollars + 2 billion saudi dollars that were coming every year to fight the russians. Aab pocket money bund h o gaie haie tu bora lag reha haie. Pehlay hamid gul bhie charlie wilson zindabad kaie naraiy laga reha tha aab mind change h o giya haie. Kal ka zindabad aaj ka murdabad

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 8:55 #
choosy
Member

this is US war ....but they are fighting it at our doorstep.

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 8:58 #
semirza
Moderator

-When these monsters were created – After, when Mujahideen were engaged with Russians for two years, alone. America engaged in Pakistan with the help of Saudi Arabia and ‘Taliban’ were created. Not just general Zia but BB was involved in this stage drama.

-After the Russians were routed out of Afghanistan, Americans left too, leaving these heavily armed and well trained Taliban on their own in a war torn country nothing more than ruins. A delibrate mistake! Ofcourse by the Americans as this is what they do normally when their goals/aims are achieved.

-Lashkare Taiba and Jaishe Mohammed are not representing Islam or 170 million Muslims in Pakistan, but armed outfits and were involved in attacks on each other.

-India is a sworn enemy of Pakistan and Muslims and so is Israel. No doubts about that.
-Nizame Adel is a just demand and means Justice for All, nothing more nothing less.

We should get down to the roots of who is fomenting trouble in Pakistan, without involving ourselves in ‘blame games’, false labeling, or mudslinging.

By keeping in mind that every incident that is happening in Pakistan could not be achieved without:
Planning-Targets
Purpose (Inflicting damage and creating fear.)
Methods (means including weapons/implements used.)
Resources(Supplies)
Only than it may be more clear WHO IS THE ACTUAL BENEFICIARY OUT OF ALL THIS KILLING AND CHAOS. At the moment media is not giving out a clear picture.

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 9:10 #
lota6177
Members

The more we remain in denial about our own historical events, the policies we implemented for strategic depth and strategic assets, foreign involvement in Pakistan from America and Saudi Arabia and the many deadly games that our agencies played molding armies of fanatical and violent Monsters with the help of these countries, the deeper we shall tumble into the bottomless pit we have managed to dig for ourselves.

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 9:42 #
amin1924
member

We are not in denial we are under pressure to do more!

While our policy is beg more $$$!

We never had any option?

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 10:04 #
faisalabadsher
Blocked

jihadis brought us in this situation to be forced to beg for $$$$

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 10:18 #
amin1924
member

Blame the Russian invasion, not the ones who help you defend Pakistan.

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 10:53 #
gv
Member

@jj

last i checked they were defending afghanistan...and yankee strategic interests...

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 10:56 #
amin1924
member

No, they were not defending yankee's interests. Yankee and Afghans interests were common -to repel Russian invasion.

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 11:06 #
gv
Member

ummm that exactly what i said above...

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 11:28 #
NNL
member

Vicky Mallu and Group.

I know you all have the horrors of the Day when a Drunkard denounced you as Non Muslims and you fear that if a drunkard did this then what will a God Fearing will do.

Again twisting the topic.

The Monsters werent created by Pakistan. The Monsters were created after US left Afghanistan. You did be dumb not to see Sen. Charlie Wilson comments on the matter. The man who rallied the US Govt after the Afghans and Pakistanis.

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 12:15 #
truepakistani
Member

This is our war.
if we say this is not our war and its american war then you foolish people think that;
American military and financial aid shall be stopped.

If American aid is stopped how will our army generals will sustain??

How will Pakistan economy will sustain ??

How will our politicians will become more wealthy??
How will our beaurucracy will carry on corruption ??

How will all system of pakistan will sustain ??
How molvees will run the business of terrorism??
How molvees will run the madtrissas ??

We all will die without American aid.

So, innocent & idiots we can not survive without foreign aid.

Its better to call this war as our war. In this way, we can get more and more aid.

As a nation we have collapsed in the year 1952 when Liaqat Ali Khan was killed and Ayub Khan as army chief became Defence Minister and used to attend the cabenit meeting. Then we became member of Seato/Cento and close puppet of USA.

Since then we have ceased to exist as nation.
Pakistan is now security state not national state.

Pakistanio ke gherat mar chuke hey.
We are dead nation.
Thats all.
Our people are slaves of army generals and molvees.

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 13:04 #
NNL
member

Hmm i agree with you.

The day we decided that our daughters look beautiful in those flashy clothes on that catwalk we sold our gheerat to the hindu.

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 13:10 #
Ghareeb
Old-chechen

What was supposed to be "our war" to liberate Kashmir was abondoned to fight some one else war. SubhanAllah.

http://arabnews.com/page=4&section=0&article=127873&d=30&m=10&y=2009

India pulls out 15,000 troops from Kashmir. US war criminals have asked both India and Pakistan to concentrate on the "war on terror".

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 13:30 #
javedsheikh
Members

1. The myth has been propagated that Pakistan should have not offered support to America after the incident of 9/11.
It is absolutely wrong.
Had there been Liaqat Ali Khan, Ayub Khan, Yahya Khan, Z.A.Bhutto, Zia ul Haq, Nawaz Sharif, Benazir, Junejo, Jamaati Islami, Tehreek-i-Insaf, MQM , ANP, JUI, PMLN, PMLQ, they would have done the same, what Gen. Musharaf did.

2. Pakistan is one of the biggest hubs of extremism where thousands of Madrassas are incubating suicide bombers of the future.
The civil society of Pakistan cannot afford to maintain a constant threat hanging over the future generations.
3. Pakistan was the key partner during the American War against the Russian Invasion of Afghanistan and how Pakistan could stay non-aligned when there is a counter attack.
4. Here are the players who contributed and pushed to make this War as 100% Pakistan's War:

1. Lashkar-e-Omar (LeO)
2. Sipah-e-Sahaba Pakistan (SSP)
3. Tehreek-e-Jaferia Pakistan (TJP)
4. Tehreek-e-Nafaz-e-Shariat-e-Mohammadi
5. Lashkar-eJhangvi (LeJ)
6. Sipah-e-Muhammad Pakistan (SMP)
7. Jamaat-ul-Fuqra
8. Nadeem Commando
9. Popular Front for Armed Resistance
10. Muslim United Army
11. Harkat-ul-Mujahideen Al-alami
12. Hizb-ul-Mujahideen (HM)
13. Harkat-ul-Ansar (HuA, presently known as Harkat-ul Mujahideen)
14. Lashkar-e-Toiba (LeT)
15. Jaish-e-Mohammad Mujahideen E-Tanzeem (JeM)
16. Harkat-ul Mujahideen (HuM, previously known as Harkat-ul-Ansar)
17. Al Badr
18. Jamait-ul-Mujahideen (JuM)
19. Lashkar-e-Jabbar (LeJ)
20. Harkat-ul-Jehad-al-Islami
21. Muttahida Jehad Council (MJC)
22. Al Barq
23. Tehrik-ul-Mujahideen
24. Al Jehad
25. Jammu & Kashir National Liberation Army
26. People’s League
27. Muslim Janbaz Force
28. Kashmir Jehad Force
29. Al Jehad Force (combines Muslim Janbaz Force and Kashmir Jehad Force)
30. Al Umar Mujahideen
31. Mahaz-e-Azadi
32. Islami Jamaat-e-Tulba
33. Jammu & Kashmir Students Liberation Front
34. Ikhwan-ul-Mujahideen
35. Islamic Students League
36. Tehrik-e-Hurriat-e-Kashmir
37. Tehrik-e-Nifaz-e-Fiqar Jafaria
38. Al Mustafa Liberation Fighters
39. Tehrik-e-Jehad-e-Islami
40. Muslim Mujahideen
41. Al Mujahid Force
42. Tehrik-e-Jehad
43. Islami Inquilabi Mahaz
Supporting Trusts:
1. Al-Rashid Trust
2. Al-Akhtar Trust
3. Rabita Trust
4. Ummah Tamir-e-Nau

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 13:39 #
amin1924
member

Gen Collen Powell said that Mush crumbled and fell down one phone call, we were surprised on his extent of support!

Remember the famous threat of tora-bora!

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 13:55 #
Ghareeb
Old-chechen

There is only one HUB of terrorism in the world and the tentacles have spread all over. And Insha'Allah all those 43 grass roots organizations mentioned above will put the final nail in the coffin of terrorism emanating from Whitehouse, United States of America.

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 13:58 #
javedsheikh
Members

" Had there been Liaqat Ali Khan, Ayub Khan, Yahya Khan, Z.A.Bhutto, Zia ul Haq, Nawaz Sharif, Benazir, Junejo, Jamaati Islami, Tehreek-i-Insaf, MQM , ANP, JUI, PMLN, PMLQ, they would have done the same, what Gen. Musharaf did."

Musharraf did that after a Telephone Call,
what Zia ul Haq and Taliban did without a Telephone Call, in 80's.

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 13:59 #
semirza
Moderator

@Ghareeb
Is is possible and if the article (link you have posted) is not too long, could be posted here as I am not able to access arabnews from our part of the world. If you dont mind.

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 14:03 #
Ghareeb
Old-chechen

semirza,

Here is the full text. 15,000 is peanuts compared to approx. 1,000,000 Indian occupation army. It is symbolic.

India pulls out 15,000 troops from Kashmir
Agencies

JAMMU, India: India is withdrawing about 15,000 soldiers from Jammu and Kashmir, a military official said Thursday, in a move aimed at boosting prospects of peace talks with the disputed region’s separatist groups.

India has been under international pressure in recent months to reduce tensions along its border with Pakistan particularly Kashmir so that Islamabad could focus on fighting the Taleban on its western border with Afghanistan.

But military analysts said the slight thinning of troops in the Jammu region was linked with ongoing efforts to resume talks with Kashmir’s separatist All Parties Hurriyat Conference rather than extending an olive branch to Pakistan.

Kashmiri separatists urged New Delhi to pull out troops, release prisoners and end alleged human rights violations after the Indian government offered to resume talks this month to end a two-decade insurgency.

A military spokesman said one army division was being moved in a phased manner since September from the border districts of Rajouri and Poonch because of improvement in the security situation. It was not clear if these were troops deployed on the border or on internal security duties.

“The readjustment and relocation of troops is subject to security reviews and periodic assessment of ground situation,” Lt. Col. Biplab Nath said.

The troops which are being moved out are in the Jammu region and not the Kashmir Valley which is the center of the revolt.

Violence is now at its lowest in Kashmir since a separatist insurgency against Indian rule in the region broke out in 1989, but officials say incidents of “infiltration” of militants from Pakistan have risen over the past few months.

Ashok Mehta, a retired army general and New Delhi-based strategic analyst, said the removal of troops was a goodwill gesture aimed at Kashmiri groups. “The current de-induction of troops has nothing to do with the war in Afghanistan,” he said.

The announcement of the troop movement came as Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh who is touring Kashmir said the security of the disputed region must rest in the hands of police. “The responsibility for maintaining law and order in the state will be increasingly devolved on the Jammu and Kashmir police,” he said.

India moved about 4,000 soldiers from its border with Pakistan in Kashmir in March. There are an estimated half a million Indian security personnel, including soldiers, deployed in Kashmir.

“Deployment and redeployment is based on threat perceptions and this particular army division has moved out as the situation is better,” said Col. S. Om Singh, another army spokesman.

A faction of the All Parties Hurriyat Conference began a dialogue with the government in 2004, the first since the beginning of the insurgency, but it broke down two years later.

Winding up a two-day trip to the Muslim-majority Kashmir Valley, Singh reiterated on Thursday his government’s willingness to hold talks with all separatist groups opposed to Indian rule as long as they renounced violence.

“I believe that a new chapter is opening in the peace process in the state and we are turning a corner,” Singh told a news conference in Indian-administered Kashmir’s summer capital Srinagar.

“We are willing to engage in serious discussions with every group provided they shun the path of violence,” Singh said as he announced a series of economic measures to boost the region’s infrastructure and tourist economy. But one veteran separatist leader who is considered a moderate swiftly rebuffed Singh’s offer. “We will never accept talks within the framework of the Indian constitution,” Shabir Shah said.

“The talks have to be trilateral involving Pakistan, India and the separatists.” said Shah, who has been in and out of Indian jails for participating in some of the biggest anti-India demonstrations in two decades. “If talks are to be held for development, they should be held with pro-India leaders,” Shah added. “We are for freedom and if they (Indians) are willing to discuss that with us, we will talk,” he added.

Last month, Indian Home Minister P. Chidambaram offered to start a “quiet dialogue” with separatist politicians in the disputed region. The offer was welcomed by local moderates but rejected by hard-liners.

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 14:11 #
semirza
Moderator

@Ghareeb
Thanks a lot for the article. Removing army from Jammu makes no difference at all as Jammu is a hindu majority area.

As far as the war is concerned, Afghans were fighting the Russian occupation. Americans got involved as they love proxy wars and are getting used to humiliation much like in the past, if they realize it or not remains doubtful.
Shame on a super power to win what it entered into on its own and is inducing/pulling Pakistan in to contribute actively in Afghanistan. Who says they were not warned, not to enter Afghanistan and now to get out and save face also seems so difficult for them.
They should be left on their own, for the world to witness what happens to a super power at the hands of simple Afghans who want to relieve their nation of an occupation.

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 14:29 #
NNL
member

Ah again the jahil speaks out of ignorance and his love of Taghut.

The Americans came looking for them both Zia and Taliban and not the other way around.

Your ilk may not need a a telephone call even you might just take hint from the speech of your bosses. such is your obedience to Taghut.

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 14:55 #
raheb
Member

IS it possible that two opponents borrow some territory from some third country to have a war? Can I ask Mr. X to come to Mr. Y's house, there we can fight?

It doen NOT matter who's War is it, Fact is it is going on in Pakistan territorey, so we cannot be mere audience or.......?

raheb

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 21:50 #
faisalabadsher
Blocked

it is a war of whoever is fighting

Posted 2 years ago on 30 Oct 2009 22:30 #
quaidkamazaar
Member

this is not our war?

WHAT A MYTH.

this is our war...

you are crazy because you probably are not living under threat of bomb attack any second.

it is Pakistanis that die... period

so it is our war,
otherwise, watch more Pakistanis die and clap like chakkeys.

sorry to be rude, but our own people are dying,
whether in NWFP WAziristan through drones, or in marketplaces, this is our war. end of story.

if you dont like USA invovlement in it, then so what? what can be done? you know that Pakistan Army is defending its people on its own this time and its a do or die situation, once you get rid of Taliban and seal border thats the end of the whole story, then a new era begins...

Posted 2 years ago on 31 Oct 2009 1:18 #
javedsheikh
Members

A Group of organizations is fighting to create a
State within a State.
Innocent citizens of an internationally recognized sovereign State of Pakistan, are being killed.
The social, political, Moral, economic and psychological fabric of Pakistan has been shattered.
Infrastructure and normal social activities has been jeopardized.
A group holding 2.5 % of approval rate is adamant to impose its manifesto of confusion, illusion and pollution over the general will of 97.5 % of the Population.
How this war is not our war?

Posted 2 years ago on 31 Oct 2009 2:02 #
latentry
Member

JavedSheikh Sahab

You are again spot on. Well said

Posted 2 years ago on 31 Oct 2009 4:18 #
amin1924
member

Even the liberal secular intellectuals who are patriot Pakistanis disagree with your views.

Before spreading further ignorance, watch this program and educate yourself on this geo-political issue.

http://pkpolitics.com/2009/10/29/dunya-today-29-october-2009/

Posted 2 years ago on 31 Oct 2009 5:11 #
lota6177
Members

javedsheikh
A group holding 2.5 % of approval rate
comment of the month lol.

Posted 2 years ago on 31 Oct 2009 5:54 #
amin1924
member

Thanks Ghareeb for the article.

Posted 2 years ago on 31 Oct 2009 6:05 #
quaidkamazaar
Member

thanks javedsheikh saahab,
your views make total sense and you cleared out a myth.

Posted 2 years ago on 31 Oct 2009 14:53 #
Ghareeb
Old-chechen

Looks like Pakistani army should immediately pull back to barracks and let politicians talk. When their masters are unable to defeat the rag tag army for last 8 years with all kinds of state of the art aircraft, helicopters, tanks, smart bombs, missiles, how can you expect the army to do better in Waziristan.

US/NATO outnumber Mujahideen 12:1

By SLOBODAN LEKIC, Associated Press Writer Slobodan Lekic, Associated Press Writer – Tue Oct 27,

BRUSSELS – There are already more than 100,000 international troops in Afghanistan working with 200,000 Afghan security forces and police. It adds up to a 12-1 numerical advantage over Taliban rebels, but it hasn't led to anything close to victory.

Now, the top U.S. and NATO commander in Afghanistan is asking for tens of thousands more troops to stem the escalating insurgency, raising the question of how many more troops it would take to succeed.

Posted 2 years ago on 31 Oct 2009 16:23 #
shahzad1924
member

http://www.nation.com.pk/pakistan-news-newspaper-daily-english-online/Opinions/Columns/28-Oct-2009/140000-troops-are-not-enough

bring all the forces from the world, nothing is going to change!

Posted 2 years ago on 31 Oct 2009 17:48 #
lota6177
Members

The nature of the beast
By Ayesha Siddiqa
http://www.dawn.com/wps/wcm/connect/dawn-content-library/dawn/the-newspaper/columnists/14-ayesha-siddiqa-the-nature-of-the-beast-009-zj-04
A lot of allegations made against PML N for giving jihadis a free hand in punjab. I really doubt it if that is party policy but maybe some low level leaders doing some local politics on the side. If you have more information please share.
For all the aflatoons saying This is not our war. This girl in peshwar is convinced of that fact like them.
http://news.yahoo.com/nphotos/Pakistani-rescuers-carry-injured-girl-after-she-dug-out-rubble/photo//091028/photos_ca_afp/071781e4a650444b4c40cd82a0d7320b/
yeh finland ki jaang haie
http://www.zimbio.com/pictures/2XKmuez2AiG/Car+Bomb+Blast+Peshawar+Kills+Least+11/Gm6Xh1JAHCF
http://www.monstersandcritics.com/news/southasia/features/article_1509927.php/In-Pictures-Pakistan-Peshawar-Bomb-Blast?page=5
if this is not our war than why are Pakistanis bleeding to death?
http://www.monstersandcritics.com/news/southasia/features/article_1509927.php/In-Pictures-Pakistan-Peshawar-Bomb-Blast?page=15

Posted 2 years ago on 31 Oct 2009 18:16 #