To the Atheists, Seculars, Qadyanis who love to criticise Islam!!

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To the Atheists, Seculars, Qadyanis who love to criticise Islam!!

(47 posts)

NNL
member

Bring it.

It was Ramadan a month of mercy and forgiveness.

You have a lot of questions regarding Islam.

So lets discuss them here.

Posted 2 years ago on 24 Sep 2009 8:15 #
netengr
blocked

If you criticize the terrorist you would be called Secular,Qadiyani and Atheist.

A member directly from Jannat now here to answer your questions
:)

Posted 2 years ago on 24 Sep 2009 8:24 #
NNL
member

Criticize the Terrorists ?

I m with you on that one.

There is no proof of Suicide Bombings none whatsoever throughout Nabi's sallahu alahi wasallam life and that of the Khulfa-e-Rashdain.

So why now and how whats the justification ?

there is none.

Islam explicitly states killing of women and children is haram. and also civilians.

So thats the end of it.

So Whats up Cableman in Saudi.

Posted 2 years ago on 24 Sep 2009 8:29 #
netengr
blocked

I am not in saudi ...:)
I am in Riyadh....!

Posted 2 years ago on 24 Sep 2009 8:31 #
NNL
member

accha bro

Mulla had said so .

Posted 2 years ago on 24 Sep 2009 8:33 #
amin1924
member

NNL, welcome back!

Posted 2 years ago on 24 Sep 2009 8:47 #
Beenai
Moderator

@NNL,
this is again a religious debate to start off.
as u have came back after some time.
i may remind u that religion related topics are subject to be avoided as they always ends up as hatred debate and exchange of heat .

Posted 2 years ago on 24 Sep 2009 8:56 #
NNL
member

Then Beenai i sincerely urge you to delete all those post which bring in religion and make audacious claims of Islam.
I just thought to gather all of them in one place and then exterminate them.

So ready to delete every post which bring in defame to religion ?

Posted 2 years ago on 24 Sep 2009 8:59 #
NNL
member

i will be cool with any decision you make.

Posted 2 years ago on 24 Sep 2009 9:01 #
Beenai
Moderator

@NNL,
yah sure .
i am doing it for quite a long time.
will do so ...inshallah

Posted 2 years ago on 24 Sep 2009 9:23 #
KHAN_Sahib
Member

I thought religious topics were ban during Ramadan! Wasn't that the agreed decision? If u ban religion all together then u will have to delete 70% of your forum postings!

Posted 2 years ago on 24 Sep 2009 9:46 #
NNL
member

it did be funny Khan Sahib i would love to see some atheists getting their posts deleted when they abuse Islam.

IT would be a good change.

Posted 2 years ago on 25 Sep 2009 0:54 #
Beenai
Moderator

@NNL,
whoever try to breach the COC .
would get his post deleted .
simple rule .

Posted 2 years ago on 25 Sep 2009 6:14 #
KHAN_Sahib
Member

@beenai
if this is true then the abusive post on the thread, kiyani should be deleted and not just closed! Reading a filthy post like this will affect the reputation of this forum in general!

Posted 2 years ago on 25 Sep 2009 6:45 #
shriq
Member

I am a new member of the forum. I was surprised to read a few comments in other posts about the religion. How did they dare to write such things which are in clear contradiction to Islam.

When people try to be OPEN-MINDED, they forget all rules of dececny while speaking about religion. DO NOT blame religion after seeing the practices of the people who call themselves muslim or the relion on their ID cards reads ISLAM. Please take sometime to read Quran and Hadith before saying something non-intelligible about Islam.

KINDLY note our Religion Islam:

Does not allow ANY BODY to kill others (yes any other person muslim or non-muslim) without any legitimate reasons. Slaughtering people, suicide bombings are NOT Islam. It is stated in Quran that who ever saves the life of a human being (Yes my dear open minded friends human being not the word muslim) saves all man-kind. So Allah (swt) is praising those people who save other humans. It is strange that people think that only those terrorists are muslims and then start all sorts of wars against Islam (verbal, in letters and the real one).

Does not disallow women to participate in any activity (within the limits of decency). To get knowledge is FARZ on every muslim and muslima. This is a Hadith, no one can deny it. The terrorist who burn girls school are NOT muslim. Dont get befooled by their beards or their claim of being muslims. The people who are leading this JIHAD are definitely ignorant of basic concepts in Islam.

Does not chain the women, confine them to the boundaries of homes. In fact kindly read the ahadith where our Prophet (pbuh) praises the person who takes good care of his wife.

Please dont blame Islam, blame muslims.

Posted 2 years ago on 25 Sep 2009 8:57 #
zjshami
Member

Playing with emotions is very easy but cannot be productive always.
One should not be irritated, angry or hyper where a person admits that he/she doesn't believe in any religion.
We should respect his/her position if we want him/her to respect our position.
There is no Law or Constitutional provision forcing a human being to be religious.
You can invite but can't force anyone to join a particular Faith or School of Thought.

Posted 2 years ago on 25 Sep 2009 10:59 #
kingsalah
Blocked

A new sun is going to rise don't worry every hypocrite will see his fate

Posted 2 years ago on 25 Sep 2009 11:02 #
semirza
Moderator

Dr. Muhammad Rafi-ud-Din: On Secularism and Hypocrisy has four points as:

1. Intellectual Secularism has brought the development of the human and social sciences to a dead stop as a portent of the impending collapse of civilization. It has adversely affected the growth of the biological sciences in the right direction. It must ultimately affect the growth of physical sciences to their full dimensions. It is the greatest and the most fundamental cause of wars and bloodshed in this age.

2. Intellectual Secularism is a prejudice, a dogma or an irrational belief of the Western Scientists, born of the peculiar Christian attitude towards man and the Universe and nourished and strengthened by a chain of events favorable to it, in the history of Europe. It is opposed equally to Islam and to Science.

3. Intellectual Secularism is a far greater threat to the unity and existence of Pakistan and even to the unity and existence of the entire human race.

4. Pakistan has a great role to play in the modern world for the world outlook of the people of Pakistan makes them eminently fit to deliver mankind from Intellectual Secularism. But we must make a beginning at home by revising our school and college text-books of all classes in all the sciences in such a manner that those who read them begin to realize, feel and experience the truth that the idea of God is the very core or the essence of all scientific knowledge.

Sheikh Salman b. Fahd al-Oadah says:
Secularists in our lands believe that the affairs of people and society can never be set right except by importing systems of law from the East or West. This is why we find the Secularists following like beggars behind the East and West. They are only good at blind following. They even bring to us the most wretched problems of those civilizations, claiming that this is the path to development and civilization.

If the Jahiliyyah of old appealed to the pagan practices of the Arabian tribes for its laws, then the Secularists want us to appeal to the constitutions and laws of other countries that have their own legal philosophies that run contrary to our religion and our view of life, crime, judgment, punishment, and sometimes even our concept of right and wrong.

A poet once wrote:

He has a thousand faces after he lost his own face,
So you will never know which face to believe.

This is the case with the secularists in the Muslim world. They present many different faces and have numerous masks. Their hearts are fickle. Therefore, it is necessary to expose them. Allah says about the hypocrites: “They are the enemy, so beware of them. The curse of Allah is on them. How they are deluded!” (Surah al-Munafiqun: 4)

Posted 2 years ago on 25 Sep 2009 13:04 #
amin1924
member

Good points on exposing secularists as hypocrites.

They present many different faces and have numerous masks. Their hearts are fickle. Therefore, it is necessary to expose them.

He has a thousand faces after he lost his own face,
So you will never know which face to believe.

Posted 2 years ago on 25 Sep 2009 13:38 #
semirza
Moderator

Yes but to identifly them first and than expose them for awareness of others.

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 10:58 #
zjshami
Member

Unfortunately Secularists are dominating the world arena.
In spite of many faces, they are running the show, in America, Europe, India, Australia, Canada and other regions of the World, where the Anti-Secularism is just an allusion, a slogan for the spiritual delectation.

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 11:18 #
Anonymous

Every religion is criticised by a big number of people, including religious and non-religious people.

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 11:31 #
amin1924
member

Unfortunately OR fortunately!

USSR also dominated parts of the world for some time and everyone knows what happened! Temporary position doesn't justify the actions or thoughts.

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 11:36 #
Anonymous

Unfortunately OR fortunately!

Islam also dominated parts of the world for some time and everyone knows what happened! Temporary position doesn't justify the actions or thoughts.

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 11:40 #
amin1924
member

Good copy paste, but the paster forgot that in USSR people stopped believing in communism and reject it as way of life, but Muslims still not only believe in it but demand it!!

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 11:41 #
semirza
Moderator

Secularims is dying out on it own because it has failed......simple! and a large amount of data proving this is lying out there in cyber space for the skeptics to reach out and realize for themselves.

Our scholars here are alert enough to use intellect/logic and conclude the illusionists presence here. They know very well that America, Europe, India, Australia, Canada are occupied by Christians, Muslims, Hindus, Sikhs, Jains, and a whole lot of -isms, not just only Secularists. Hollow arguments!.......It would be nice to leave you alone!

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 11:42 #
Anonymous

"Secularims is dying out on it own because it has failed"

Good news.

I wish it happen sooner than later.

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 11:45 #
amin1924
member

I wish you could see it happening right now!

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 11:46 #
Anonymous

I see it otherwise.

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 11:56 #
amin1924
member

Then your wish above was fake?

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 11:57 #
semirza
Moderator

@ALL
secularism dies in the world or not but at pkpolitics there is going to be end to -isms. This is my understanding that these so called -isms, are the root cause of intellectual discussions being detoured towards spread of such false ideologies.
Members looking forward to having fruitful discussions can come up with favourable suggestions.

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 12:01 #
zjshami
Member

Mirza Sahib,
Don't mix up Secularism and Atheism.
Secularism is an advice for the State not to impose a particular religion upon its subjects but let every religion survive and flourish within its boundaries.
I am surprised where literate people fail to understand the basic meaning of Secularism.
I, as a Muslim enjoy all the Privileges of my religion, while living in a Secular State what the religious people living in a religious State don't have.

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 12:10 #
amin1924
member

That definition is flawed because secularism is rejection of religion from state and public affairs. It is separation of Allah and State.

Let every religion flourish within it's boundaries means religion has to be kept inside the boundaries drawn by state. It means something like I lock you up in a room and tell you that you are free to do whatever you want in that room!

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 12:16 #
zjshami
Member

Actually it is a religious State which blocks and locks up the citizens in a deep well.
It is a religious State which forces the citizens to submit without asking any question.
That is the reason why a pure religious State has not emerged at the Map of the Globe.
Please, do some research and you will reach the reality.

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 12:24 #
amin1924
member

If it hasn't emerged and doesn't exist then why worry? It should be a non-issue then, why waste time on something that doesn't even exist?

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 12:26 #
amin1924
member

Secondly how did you reach to above definite conclusions without presence of any such state? May I know the model that you studied to draw above conclusions?

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 12:30 #
zjshami
Member

Burden of proof lies with you not me.
Show me the Model of what you are visualizing?

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 12:38 #
amin1924
member

You made those absolute conclusions without any basis or evidence.

Before you diverge the subject, care to tell me where am I visualizing? Perhaps another false assumption?

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 12:49 #
semirza
Moderator

@zjshami

I am surprised where literate people fail to understand the basic meaning of Secularism.
-----------------------------------------------------------
Where did I mixed up Atheism and Secularism?

Also you are saying that you are the one who is literate enough to understand the meaning of Secularism......while the other's don't? How wise of you!

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 13:14 #
Oriel
Member

Mirza Sahib:

I concur with your push to free the forum from 'isms'. May I make a suggestion to eradicate the following first: extremism, egoism, Mullaism, fundamentalism, theykedaarism.

Thank you.

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 14:07 #
semirza
Moderator

There is no need to be personal with me. Just respond to posts and comments without being personal. The thread will remain open for comments but anything of personal nature should not be here and will be removed.
Up till now I have not named or quoted you in this thread at all. You dont have to quote me any more.

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 14:16 #
semirza
Moderator

My post is for zjshami and not for you. I have ignored your comments.

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 14:21 #
Oriel
Member

Lol, ok. Ignore away.

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 14:25 #
semirza
Moderator

extremism, egoism, Mullaism, fundamentalism, theykedaarism.
in fact all the isms are the real cause of language misuse including attack on faiths that should not be favoured at all. A perfect intellectual discussion is totally destroyed by such isms.

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 14:26 #
Oriel
Member

The 'isms' are not a mis-use of language. They are used deliberately and with sense as to the effect of their use.

As for attacks on faith. It is in the job description of those that do not have faith to try to ridicule or belittle those that have faith. We should understand this by now and master how to deal with it.

The posts regarding Islam and modernism/secularism/and other form of 'ism' will be argued until Qayamat.... what I do not understand is how or why this argument is so rife on a Pakistani site. Our weaknesses speak volumes just by looking at topics discussed on this forum. We are all meant to be Muslims here. We are all meant to be one. We are so obviously not.

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 14:39 #
semirza
Moderator

I have tried to cover this subject a bit at:

http://pkpolitics.com/discuss/topic/islam-is-not-in-any-dangerbut-muslims-are

I believe I have to write some more but from a different view point/points!

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 14:50 #
amin1924
member

I guess the burden of proof proved to be heavier than anticipated.

Posted 2 years ago on 27 Sep 2009 15:09 #