PKPolitics Discuss » Current Issues

US Drone War

(26 posts)
  1. Pakistan: unlawful US drone war kills 140 innocent civilians for 1 CIA-alleged "terrorist" - January 9, 2010

    Pakistan’s government reported US drones killed only civilians in 39 of 44 attacks on their country in 2009; with over 700 innocent civilians killed, according to Pakistan's most widely-read English newspaper. Pakistan has repeatedly publicly denounced the US attacks, making the US guilty of War Crimes as they do not have explicit permission from Pakistan’s government.

    Senator and 2008 Republican Presidential choice John McCain called the unlawful program effective and that it should continue. In Orwellian conclusion, Mr. McCain said, "We are always with Pakistan and the people of Pakistan, and our relationship does not have time limitation." Mr. Obama must be in agreement for this prima facie unlawful program, as more drone attacks have occurred in the first year of his presidency than all years of his predecessor.

    Some analysis of Pakistan’s refusal of US armed attacks on their soil: if Pakistan is covertly in agreement with the US, they must publicly disagree or else be in likely admission of murder under Pakistan law. If so, the US would also be guilty of mass murders under Pakistan law. With Pakistan’s public refusal, the US is guilty of War Crimes.

    Analysis: The drone war is:
    unlawful,
    covert and from the same secretive people who torture and lied to initiate illegal wars in Iraq and Afghanistan,
    kills targets who are lawfully engaging US troops in self-defense from an unauthorized and unlawful armed attack and invasion from the US on Afghanistan,
    kills civilians at an evil ratio even if the CIA secret evidence against alleged "terrorists" is justified. In CIA talk a "terrorist" is anyone who, in word or deed, resists Ziowest hegemony over the lands of Islam.

    Posted 2 years ago on 11 Jan 2010 8:12 #
  2. toamin
    member

    This illegitimate CIA project gets support from Zardari/Kayani/Gillani troika.

    Posted 2 years ago on 11 Jan 2010 9:40 #
  3. Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,

    In the recent rift in political scene in Pakistan, new came up on mass media which said Pakistan's Defense Minister Ahmad Mukhtar and Rehman Malik are two guys who are spearheading US's war efforts in Afghanistan. I believe these are the people pushing this drone project forward.

    Posted 2 years ago on 11 Jan 2010 10:58 #
  4. Salam, hariskhan, you both speak true, no doubt. But do remember, the troika or the two M's, Mukhtar and Malik, do not a country make. The people of Pakistan also has some say in the matter, muted at the moment, but growing louder by the minute. The illegitimacy of what they do, killing and maiming women and children and men, looting and pillaging, all this will come to haunt the west when their time is up. Which, as history goes, will also be anyday soon. We personally hear the roars from Pakistan coinciding with and downing out the squeaks of distress from the ziowest.

    Posted 2 years ago on 11 Jan 2010 11:12 #
  5. netengr
    blocked

    Out of 700 "Civilians" there are 600 Militants

    Posted 2 years ago on 11 Jan 2010 11:19 #
  6. toamin
    member

    Look at the comment of people driven by hate, they want to massacre innocent Pakistanis to quench their blood thirst.

    Posted 2 years ago on 11 Jan 2010 11:27 #
  7. netengr
    blocked

    Ten thousand innocent people killed by Taliban on the name of Islam and people are supporting them ..

    Posted 2 years ago on 11 Jan 2010 11:28 #
  8. Red-Scorpion
    Blocked

    Drone attacks -- a survey

    By Farhat Taj
    The Aryana Institute for Regional Research and Advocacy, a think tank of researchers and political activists from the NWFP and FATA, conducts research, surveys and collect statistics on various issues concerning the Taliban and Al-Qaeda terrorism and human security there. AIRRA research teams go deep inside Taliban- and Al-Qaeda-occupied areas of FATA to collect information. Most of the areas are not accessible to journalists.

    Between last November and January AIRRA sent five teams, each made up of five researchers, to the parts of FATA that are often hit by American drones, to conduct a survey of public opinion about the attacks. The team visited Wana (South Waziristan), Ladda (South Waziristan), Miranshah (North Waziristan), Razmak (North Waziristan) and Parachinar (Kurram Agency). The teams handed out 650 structured questionnaires to people in the areas. The questionnaires were in Pashto, English and Urdu. The 550 respondents (100 declined to answer) were from professions related to business, education, health and transport. Following are the questions and the responses of the people of FATA.

    -- Do you see drone attacks bringing about fear and terror in the common people? (Yes 45%, No 55%)

    -- Do you think the drones are accurate in their strikes? (Yes 52%, No 48%)

    -- Do you think anti-American feelings in the area increased due to drone attacks recently? (Yes 42%, No 58%)

    -- Should Pakistan military carry out targeted strikes at the militant organisations? (Yes 70%, No 30%)

    -- Do the militant organisations get damaged due to drone attacks? (Yes 60%, No 40%)

    A group of researchers at AIRRA draw these conclusions from the survey. The popular notion outside the Pakhtun belt that a large majority of the local population supports the Taliban movement lacks substance. The notion that anti-Americanism in the region has not increased due to drone attacks is rejected. The study supports the notion that a large majority of the people in the Pakhtun belt wants to be incorporated with the state and wants to integrate with the rest of the world.

    The survey also reinforces my own ethnographic interactions with people of FATA, both inside FATA and the FATA IDP’s in the NWFP. This includes people I personally met and those I am in contact with through telephone calls and emails. This includes men and women, from illiterate to people with university level education. The number is well over 2000. I asked almost all those people if they see the US drone attacks on FATA as violation of Pakistan’s sovereignty. More than two-third said they did not. Pakistan’s sovereignty, they argued, was insulted and annihilated by Al-Qaeda and the Taliban, whose territory FATA is after Pakistan lost it to them. The US is violating the sovereignty of the Taliban and Al-Qaeda, not of Pakistan. Almost half the people said that the US drones attacking Islamabad or Lahore will be violation of the sovereignty of Pakistan, because these areas are not taken over by the Taliban and Al Qaeda. Many people laughed when I mentioned the word sovereignty with respect to Pakistan.

    Over two-thirds of the people viewed Al-Qaeda and the Taliban as enemy number one, and wanted the Pakistani army to clear the area of the militants. A little under two-thirds want the Americans to continue the drone attack because the Pakistani army is unable or unwilling to retake the territory from the Taliban.

    The people I asked about civilian causalities in the drone attacks said most of the attacks had hit their targets, which include Arab, Chechen, Uzbek and Tajik terrorists of Al-Qaeda, Pakistani Taliban (Pakhtun and Punjabis) and training camps of the terrorists. There has been some collateral damage.

    The drones hit hujras or houses which the Taliban forced people to rent out to them. There is collateral damage when the family forced to rent out the property is living in an adjacent house or a portion of the property rented out.

    The Taliban and Al Qaeda have unleashed a reign of terror on the people of FATA. People are afraid that the Taliban will suspect their loyalty and behead them. Thus, in order to prove their loyalty to the Taliban and Al-Qaeda, they offer them to rent their houses and hujras for residential purposes.

    There are people who are linked with the Taliban. Terrorists visit their houses as guests and live in the houses and hujras. The drones attacks kill women and small children of the hosts. These are innocent deaths because the women and children have no role in the men’s links with terrorists.

    Other innocent victims are local people who just happen to be at the wrong place at the wrong time.

    People told me that typically what happens after every drone attack is that the Taliban and Al-Qaeda terrorists cordon off the area. No one from the local population is allowed to access the site, even if there are local people killed or injured. Their relatives cry and beg the terrorists to let them go near the site. But the Taliban and Al Qaeda do not allow them. The Taliban and Al Qaeda remove everything they want from the site and then allow the locals to see the site.

    The survey conducted by AIRRA and my ethnographic interactions contradict the mantra of violation of the sovereignty of Pakistan perpetuated by the armchair analysts in the media. I have been arguing on these pages that analyses of those analysts have nothing to do with the reality of the FATA people. For some reason they take FATA for granted. They feel they are at liberty to fantasise whatever they like about FATA and present to the audience as a truth. Some of those armchair analysts also have a misplaced optimism about themselves. They believe my challenge to their fantasies about FATA is because I like to give them time! I give time to the land I love--FATA and the NWFP--and to the state I am loyal to--Pakistan.

    What is happening in FATA is destroying the lives and culture of the FATA people, threatening the integrity of Pakistan and world peace. Fantasies of the armchair analysts are helping no one but Al Qaeda and the Taliban--enemies of the land and culture I love, and our state. I will therefore continue to challenge the fantasies of the armchairs analysts, whenever possible.

    http://www.thenews.com.pk/editorial_detail.asp?id=165781

    Posted 2 years ago on 11 Jan 2010 11:33 #
  9. Red-Scorpion
    Blocked

    Howling at the moon

    By Irfan Husain

    Many of us in the punditry profession are guilty of making generalisations about what is happening in the tribal areas without having visited them in recent times. Thus, when we hear about the anger and outrage supposedly sweeping though the people of Fata over the frequent drone attacks, we tend to accept this as the gospel truth.

    This myth was recently exploded by Farhat Taj in her article ‘Drone attacks: challenging some fabrications’, published recently in a national daily. Dr Taj is an academic at the University of Oslo, but more importantly, she comes from the region and has a degree of access to tribal Pakhtuns that is rare.

    Over the last couple of years, the air has been thick with charges that the US drone campaign is ‘counter-productive’ as it is supposed to have caused the death of many non-combatants. The Pakistani government has lodged numerous protests with the Americans over the collateral damage their attacks have caused, and how they are destabilising the Zardari administration. The hypocrisy inherent in these protests is little short of breathtaking, considering that many of these remote controlled aircraft are said to operate from runways located in Pakistan.

    However, as Dr Taj explains in her important article, ordinary people in Fata are delighted that at least somebody is killing the ruthless thugs who have seized control of their villages and their lives. She says that Pakistani and US media have tossed around the figure of ‘600-700 civilian casualties’ without citing any evidence.

    According to Dr Taj, “…after every attack the terrorists cordon off the area and no one, including the local villagers, are allowed to come even near the targeted place. The militants themselves collect the bodies, bury the dead and then issue the statement that all of them were innocent civilians.”

    Dr Taj goes on to explain that the only civilians who have been killed are the family members of the militants in whose houses other terrorists have gathered. In effect, these killers are using these women and children as human shields, hoping their presence will deter drone attacks. In any case, it is impossible to make even a rough estimate of how many civilians have been killed in the drone campaign.

    The writer goes on to say: “The people of Waziristan are suffering a brutal kind of occupation under the Taliban and Al Qaeda. It is in this context that they would welcome anyone, Americans, Israelis, Indians or even the devil, to rid them of the Taliban and Al Qaeda. Therefore, they welcome the drone attacks. Secondly, the people feel comfortable with the drone attacks because of their precision and targeted strikes. [People prefer them to] the Pakistan Army’s attacks which always result in collateral damage.…”

    Dr Taj makes perfect sense: after all, why would the people under Taliban and Al Qaeda occupation and oppression not cheer when these murderers are killed? What does not make sense is the chorus of protests over these drone attacks emanating from people like Imran Khan and Hamid Gul — to name only two — who claim to speak for the people of the tribal areas. What exactly is their agenda, and why are they acting as cheerleaders for these terrorists?

    The breach of our supposedly sacred sovereignty has been cited as the reason for this outrage over the American campaign of targeting terrorists seeking shelter in the tribal areas, and attacking western forces over the border in Afghanistan. However, why should the Americans wait passively for their soldiers to be picked off by militants who use our territory as a base for cross-border attacks?

    With the concept of sovereignty comes the responsibility to exercise control over territory. Successive Pakistani governments have failed to seal our borders, and the entire region is suffering from terrorism as a result. All our neighbours have complained publicly and privately over the Pakistani state’s inability or unwillingness to effectively prevent cross-border attacks of the kind we have been witnessing for over two decades now. Indeed, we have been accused of using our lawless borders to further our establishment’s agenda.

    In any case, sovereignty is never absolute. Just as nations have the duty to prevent effluents from their factories from contaminating rivers that flow down to lower riparian neighbours, so too do they have the responsibility of halting terrorists from crossing into other states.

    Dr Taj concludes her article thus: “Moreover, Al Qaeda and the Taliban have done everything to stop the drone attacks by killing hundreds of innocent civilians on the pretext of their being American spies. They thought that by overwhelming the innocent people of Waziristan with terror tactics they would deter any potential informer, but they have failed…. Interestingly, no one in Pakistan has raised objections to killings [sic] of the people of Waziristan on charges of spying for the US. This, the people of Waziristan informed, is a source of torture for them that their fellow Pakistanis condemn the killing of terrorists, but fall into deadly silence over the routine murders of tribesmen.…”

    I have often wondered about this callous hypocrisy too. If we condemn the Americans so vociferously over the drone campaign, should we not be more critical of the thugs who are killing far more Pakistani civilians? And yet, it seems that our more popular Urdu anchorpersons and TV chat show guests reserve their outrage for Washington, while giving the Taliban and Al Qaeda a free pass over their vicious suicide bombings that have taken hundreds of innocent lives in recent weeks.

    Why then are we silent over the daily killings of fellow Pakistanis by the TTP and other terror groups, while frothing at the mouth over the drone attacks? Clearly, this irrational and double-faced reaction is based in the anti-American sentiment that has taken root in Pakistan.

    However, if we are to win the war against extremism, we need to analyse where our best interests lie. First we need to face the fact that the war is not going well. Even though the army has cleared most of South Waziristan of the TTP, it does not have the manpower to both hold the area it has wrested from the terrorists, and to take them on in the other regions they have fled to.

    We need to wake up to the reality that the enemy has grown very strong in the years we temporised and tried to do deals with them. Clearly, we need allies in this fight. Howling at the moon is not going to get us the cooperation we so desperately need. A solid case can be made for more drone attacks, not less.

    http://www.dawn.com/wps/wcm/connect/dawn-content-library/dawn/the-newspaper/columnists/14-irfan-husain-howling-at-the-moon-910-zj-11

    Posted 2 years ago on 11 Jan 2010 11:37 #
  10. toamin
    member

    Yea, let us bring it on Karachi too to clear up MQM criminal thugs!

    Posted 2 years ago on 11 Jan 2010 11:40 #
  11. abukhalid
    Member

    @ Red scorpion

    what about these crimes done by pakistani Govt. ? is these acts done by 1 person ? or you would give here a diplomatic sentence that it was related to previouse govt. ? whatever your Government, Army, Intelligence have done since 9 years with a neighbout muslim nation and with thier own civilians its the time histroy paying you....you should ashamed before to say all these shits you mentioned above..!!

    Pay Back Time for Pakistan

    If first I am a Muslim then Pakistani, so I should think this way before blamed to all oppositions. I would appreciate comments & discussion upon.

    “War against Terror was not our War but now today it’s in our house why? Because “we wanted to make our bread in other’s kitchen “so today if our hand’s are burning with the fire so why we are crying? See the True picture of our policies which made us in trouble today”.

    1.From 7th November 2001 Pakistani Intelligence agencies are providing information about the hide outs of the Taliban & Al Qaida fighters in Afghanistan & due to this irreligious act against a Muslim nation over one hundred & fifty thousand local Afghani civilians are died & most of them were women’s & Childs.

    2.Average 200 Trucks on daily basis crossing Pakistani boarders & helping Americans in so called war on Terror. 80% of the US & NATO supplies in Afghanistan by Pakistani silk roads including Ammunitions, food, medical facilities & Military equipments so Taliban’s consider Pakistan as a helping hands of America and in large extend its true.

    3. Pakistani govt. providing Air force bases in Pakistan to Americans to facilitate them like take off facility to UAV drones, to up load Missiles in UAV drones & operating control rooms, receive dead bodies, high Electronics equipments, construction build materials etc.

    4.Recruitments of local Pakistani citizens as a spy for Americans to gave them US $.

    5.It’s proved now that Xe Company (black water) is working in Pakistan & most of the attacks carried out by them as they did in Iraq to divide same nation in different opinions.
    6.Revenge of the over 1400 (registered) innocent civilians died during 2006 till now from US drone attacks. Mostly their relatives are joining Taliban to offer for the suicide attacks.

    7.Revenge of their commanders like Abu Khabab al misry, Naik Mohammab, Baitullah Mehsud, Rashid Rauf, Abu liese al leibie, sheikh Abu hamza rabiah al misree etc.

    8.In the hatred of Pakistani citizens to hand over to americans including Dr. Afia Siddiqui, Mullah zaif mutawakil (X Taliban ambassador in Pakistan), Khalid sheikh Mohammad, Ramazi yousuf & over 600 pakistani nationals.

    9.In the revenge of to destroy their villages, cattle’s, battle fields & houses by Pakistan army & there is no pay back money except announcing for reimbursed.
    10.There is no single Media allow to capture the brutal acts of Pakistani & US forces in Afghanistan & Pakistani border areas to show the word what actually make these peoples anger to becomes a suicide bombers. Nobody listening or understanding them except the part of evil today.

    11.Falls proxy war strategies & campaigns against Taliban in local Pakistani Media’s to make polls against them i:e today Americans are using MQM in Karachi as a second contract party like the old one Black Water to make anarchy in Pakistan against Taliban like MQM blamed bomb blast in Karachi to Taliban which later on proved was not done by the Taliban.

    12.Mobilization of local citizen against Taliban to blamed every attack in Pakistan done by Taliban which actually were not done by Taliban for example Peshawar market attacks, Islamic university of women. Every channel is hurry to get news first in the race & our public is already doing have choice expect to accept these links.

    13.Today every Muslim knows that to help against Muslim is Haram & againt the Allah orders but we are helping them from 60 years and getting US $ against, what a joking we are doing with Allah and his religion!! Allah said in Quran ;

    “51. O ye who believe! Take not the Jews and Christians for friends. They are friends one to another. He among you who taketh them for friends is (one) of them. Lo! Allah guideth not wrongdoing folk.

    “52. Those in whose heart is a disease thou seest how eagerly they run about amongst them saying: "We do fear lest a change of fortune bring us disaster." Ah! Perhaps Allah will give (thee) victory or a decision according to His Will. Then will they repent of the thoughts which they secretly harbored in their hearts. (AL MAYDAH, ayat 51-52)

    14.Pakistani Media is not condemning death of innocent peoples by Pakistani Air force jet planes and show small news or like ‘ we are trying minimum death toll of civilians but it’s war & we have to bear this “ but if attacked carried out by Taliban is showing as a bomb on nation. If its war so its 2 side when you are attacking on their peoples so what you are expecting from them? So the 2 faces of the Media is not accepting to local peoples of Waziristan & Northern civilians of Pakistan & they are angry against you.

    15.Personal meetings of American ambassador with different political & religious parties including MQM, PMLN, PMLF & PPP. Isn’t true they all are puppets from decades?

    16.Two face of Pakistan army, when Pakistan face a danger sign of the attack from India so they warn to American’s that they will up their hands from war on terror and will remove their army from Northern border & more over Baitullah Mehsud is a true Pakistani we don’t have any big issue we will talk and fixed the issue ‘(Major General Athar Abbas, spokes man of Pakistan army) in the front of press briefing in 2009.

    17.Brutal Attack on Lal Masjid killed over 2500 Men’s, Women’s & Childs by utilization of white phosphorus & other war machines. ( see Talat hussain programe at that time)

    Conclusion:

    “The bad part of the history is that people never learn from “. You are destroying a Muslim nation from last 9 years by helping non Muslims and more over getting monthly or yearly money and benefit against, so what you are looking from Allah?? Peace? Freedom? Boosting you Economy? This is the biggest joke Pakistani authorities is doing with their civilians and expecting
    To win this war! See today who is surviving Taliban or you? Americans & their allies are on their knees today. So check what you did & what you are paying for… so don’t cry… history is returning to you…!!! May Allah gave us a right way of understanding ‘.

    Posted 2 years ago on 11 Jan 2010 12:08 #
  12. Red-Scorpion
    Blocked

    Drone strike kills Al-Qaeda man !

    http://www.jang.com.pk/jang/jan2010-daily/12-01-2010/u17372.htm

    Posted 2 years ago on 12 Jan 2010 12:58 #
  13. BaliMA
    Member

    mahmoud mehdi al qaeda ka dehshatgard killer of innocent civilians drone humlay maie **** ki maut mara giya.

    Posted 2 years ago on 12 Jan 2010 17:25 #
  14. quaidkamazaar
    Member

    if Pakistan is not going to wipe out militants and Alqaeda in its hideouts,,, US will do it for them with collateral damage... its the sad truth. lets come to terms of it.

    Posted 2 years ago on 12 Jan 2010 17:29 #
  15. Anonymous

    The worry amongst the Taliban lovers is not the deaths of innocent civilians but the gradual elimination of Taliban key members in drone attacks.

    Why don't these Taliban lovers tell their 'warriors of Islam' to stop using human shield by hiding in civilian population and come out to fight with their enemy directly.

    Posted 2 years ago on 12 Jan 2010 19:15 #
  16. Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,

    The people who you call 'Al-Qaeda' or 'Taliban', 90+ % of them turn out to be innocent civilians according to published reports.

    @quaidkamazaar: You know what? Someone should spread propaganda that you'r hiding criminals at your home. You know why ? So someone powerful living in another part of the same city can bomb! your house and call it 'victory'! :-) I bet! you'd love! that very much, won't you ? :D

    @adnak: When you go to war with an enemy far bigger than you, what strategy do you adopt for defeating them ? Go face to face with them ?

    Wouldn't that go against common sense ?

    What person 'repeatedly' talks against common sense ?

    Posted 2 years ago on 13 Jan 2010 13:31 #
  17. Anonymous

    Haris Khan

    Baat ki hai ya …

    “When you go to war with an enemy far bigger than you, what strategy do you adopt for defeating them? Go face to face with them?”

    You mean strategy should be that if beast Taliban are killed by Americans, they in retaliation, should suicide bomb innocent civilians in the markets?

    What a jahalat! What a common sense!

    Posted 2 years ago on 13 Jan 2010 14:05 #
  18. Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,

    @adnak: No one has proven to-date that 'Taliban' did any of that or those 'posing' as 'Taliban' did any of them. You'r talking fiction, propaganda, hot air.

    'Taliban' are those who are resisting foreign occupation forces in Afghanistan.

    That is not what I asked you. I asked you a very specific question. Don't try to change the subject or run away from my question by turning and twisting my words according to your own thinking.

    Posted 2 years ago on 13 Jan 2010 14:30 #
  19. Anonymous

    Haris Khan

    If you really believe that “Taliban are those who are resisting foreign occupation forces in Afghanistan”, then I have a good news for you. My comments are not directed towards ‘'Taliban' who are resisting foreign occupation forces in Afghanistan” but against those blood thirsty beasts who are in Pakistan.

    It is proven without any doubt and also proudly admitted by the ‘beasts’, that all these actions of bloodshed on the innocent civilians are their activities. After any suicide bombing, people like Qazi, Munawar Hassan and you say that ‘yeh radde-amal’ hai and justify it. How is that?

    I think it is time now to realize that our ‘aafiat’ is in clearing our Pak land from the dirty Talibans so that drone attacks stop once for all.

    Posted 2 years ago on 13 Jan 2010 14:57 #
  20. quaidkamazaar
    Member

    i hate it when people live in denial.

    haris saahab, why do you call hiding of criminals and militants propaganda???

    there is no more than enough evidence that Uzbek and Arab terrorists have used our wilderness for hiding and training and recruiting.

    please explain your Taliban friends and "warriors of Islam", "Afghan resistance (in pakistan? lol)" that suicide bombing markets is not the way to go... thanks.

    Posted 2 years ago on 13 Jan 2010 15:04 #
  21. toamin
    member

    QKM,

    Actually North Waziristan Agency is pro-pakstain people, they do not attack pakistan army or civilians.

    Amrika has gone crazy and is firing missiles daily on Pakistan on the people that are patriot pakistanis.

    I don't think you people in karachi can differentiate different groups in FATA and view everything as one just like most of people here can't differentiate your MQM and see all MQM in karachi and all bad.

    So drone missiles will create more enemies for Pakistan by converting pro-pakistan groups to anti-pakistan groups.

    Pakistan knows this plan and is protesting against it.

    Posted 2 years ago on 13 Jan 2010 15:28 #
  22. Wahid Doyum
    Member

    "Actually North Waziristan Agency is pro-pakstain people, they do not attack pakistan army or civilians."

    LOL, you obviously know nothing about the region. Come and visit N. Waziristan and try to raise Pakistan flag and we will see what happens to you.

    Posted 2 years ago on 18 Jan 2010 7:15 #
  23. Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,

    @quaidkamazaar: When Govt. will;

    - apprehend perpetrators
    - make them go through due course of prosecution through the court of law
    - punish criminals

    peace will automatically overwhelm society. None of that is not happening right now.

    When the common man does not have confidence in the drama govt. officials are staging, then what the heck are you talking about ? No one has been proven to be a criminal to-date.

    I don't take mere statements of Govt. officials as 'credible evidence' or 'hard fact' in a scenario. I rarely believe statements in this era. You know why ? Because I'v found 99.8% of them to be false, baseless, propaganda, void of logic, void of common sense, too outrageous to believe, BS! in other words.

    Pak Govt., Punjab Govt. has run these 'dramay' (in urdu) in the past, throwing allegations at Jamaat-e-Islami, for example they staged the drama of JI holding terrorists in Mansoora. That died off because it was just a 'baseless' 'allegation'. If Govt. had a strong case against JI, they would have taken JI to court of law, they would have banned JI long ago.

    Why would I trust known criminals, like Zardari and his lot, who are 'charged' with heinous crimes in many cases to talk about critical issues of state like war ?

    They'd have to give me damn good reasons in shape of hard evidence for me to believe them. Untill their reputation remains questionable, I am not ready to believe their words.

    Posted 2 years ago on 18 Jan 2010 7:34 #
  24. shahzad1924
    member

    @Wahid Doyum - "LOL, you obviously know nothing about the region. Come and visit N. Waziristan and try to raise Pakistan flag and we will see what happens to you."

    thanks for bringing this latest bulletin directly from N. Waziristan!

    you are saying as if you live there!

    BTW, have you ever set foot in Pakistan?

    the reality is that the US is using the Pakistani Army to fight its war in 7 agencies. and as for N. Waziristan, they are fighting the war themselves there, with their drones.

    Posted 2 years ago on 18 Jan 2010 8:17 #
  25. toamin
    member

    Shahzad,

    Good point, that is the picture from higher level. These foreigners (doyum) come here to keep people hung up on military operations inside Pakistan.

    Posted 2 years ago on 18 Jan 2010 13:55 #
  26. Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,

    DAWN News: US drones unlikely to break militants in long term

    Monday, 18 Jan, 2010
    --------------------------------------------------------

    Do you see the dis-satisfaction of the people which is showing on their faces in the picture on this news ?

    This is the common man of Pakistan today.

    Posted 2 years ago on 18 Jan 2010 17:16 #

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