Wastage of Indus water in sea by Pakistan versus noble use of Indus by India.

PKPolitics Discuss » Current Issues

[closed]

Wastage of Indus water in sea by Pakistan versus noble use of Indus by India.

(96 posts)

12 Next »

M.AKRAM KHAN NIAZI
Member

Wastage of Indus water in sea by Pakistan versus noble use of Indus by India.
On one side we are blaming India for stealing our water for generation of electricity and irrigation,but question is if we waste our water ourselves in sea as sea fishes are thirsty or as there is shortage of rain on the sea while it is sea which receive the larger portion of rain as compared to land then infact India is doing a noble thing and we Pakistanies by wasting sweet water in the sea, are doing a crime and sin against humanity.
Government of Punjab has chronically failed in protecting the rights of people of Punjab. Which is evident from the fact that it has not made any efforts for the construction of Kalabagh Dam while Govt of Sind is very proactive even in wasting the water of river Indus in Arabian sea.If Punjab govt can not protect the rights of people living alongside river Indus,it will BE better to separate out those areas from Punjab,so that those people can protect their rights themselves. From NFC award it is evident that Punjab Govt has sacrificed the rights of people just for pleasing those who always hate punjab. Moreover Punjab Govt has not raised any concern about the suffering of people of Punjab in Baluchistan,Karachi and Sind. Thar coal project will have adverse effects on each and every living organism,atmosphere,enviroment in Punjab but Punjab Govt foolish leaders has not shown any concern about that project.

Due to incompetent Punjab Government , situation has so much deteriorated that other provinces which are very vocal about Provincial autonomy are interfering in the affairs of Punjab by violating provincial autonomy of Punjab , for example Sindh Province Government and Assembly has started to give suggestions to Punjab that which Canal should be kept opened or closed, which Dam (hydrel project ) should be constructed or not, and which land of Punjab should be cultivated or not, while Punjab Government is completely silent about such interference, while Sindh Government is busy in wasting River Indus water in Arabian sea which is a sin and crime against humanity but Punjab government is making no objection about such wastage.

Posted 2 years ago on 17 Mar 2010 6:03 #
M.AKRAM KHAN NIAZI
Member

Instead of wasting River Indus water in the sea it will be better to divert towards Karachi and Coast of Makran and if it is not feasible then it should be diverted towards arid state of Rajhastan and Gujrat,where land is much more thirsty as compared to fishes of the sea.

Posted 2 years ago on 17 Mar 2010 6:33 #
M.AKRAM KHAN NIAZI
Member

It is very strange that USA which has the largest reservoirs of fresh water in the world, is seeing its future in desalination of its sea water,while follish rulers of Pakistan are wasting its sweet water in the saline water of sea.

Posted 2 years ago on 17 Mar 2010 6:37 #
RajputPuttar
Member

M.AKRAM KHAN NIAZI

There is a genunie need of fresh water being released to sea in order to aovid the seepage of saline water of sea upward. This is what percisely happening right now that since not enough water down stream kotri is being released, the saline water of arabian sea is eating up the agricultural land in Thatta & Badin districts.

Posted 2 years ago on 17 Mar 2010 11:31 #
M.AKRAM KHAN NIAZI
Member

How water of arabian sea is eating up the agricultural land in Thatta & Badin districts, When already huge deposits of saline salts are present in Thatta and most of salts factories are using that salt as raw materials.Any fool can have such logic that Pakistan is a country in the world whose wast land are deserted and arid like Cholistan and Thar and still that country is wasting its sole tinny river sweet water in huge sea, and thinking that sweet water will change the salinity of sea,if it was true then every country of the world was going to waste its river water in the sea for cultivation of crops in its coastal areas, but this foolishness is going on just in Pakistan.

Posted 2 years ago on 17 Mar 2010 11:58 #
M.AKRAM KHAN NIAZI
Member

It is not sea water which is creating problem of salinity,infact it is excessive wastage of River sweet water on land which causes problem of salinity such as in upper sindh where rice crop is cultivated for which extra water is used for irrigation,these are are suffering from problem of salinity due to wastage of water and not due to sea water.

Posted 2 years ago on 17 Mar 2010 12:41 #
M.AKRAM KHAN NIAZI
Member

Sea salt are soluble in both sweet water and saline water,as much water you will you will flow on salt as much salt will spread on land and as much area will continue to suffer from salinity, in Punjab and upper Sindh there is no sea but problem of salinity due to wastage is present infact every where.

Posted 2 years ago on 17 Mar 2010 12:44 #
RajputPuttar
Member

Niazi sahib,

U r a genious but plz have a look at phenomenion known as 'Seawater intrusion'

For your kind reference , i m giving some links.

http://www.megadelta.ecnu.edu.cn/main/upload/Asifpaper1.pdf
http://prr.hec.gov.pk/chapters/2121-4.pdf

http://www.irinnews.org/report.aspx?reportid=13820

http://www.dawn.com/2008/12/15/ebr5.htm

The above refrenece are with respect to indus.

Now , as far as this thing is concerned that this is a **** phenomenion only , then plz have a look at the following.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saltwater_intrusion

http://www.islandcounty.net/health/WatershedPlanning/WatershedPlanning/TopicPapers/SWI.pdf

Posted 2 years ago on 17 Mar 2010 21:37 #
Wahid Doyum
Member

So, it's noble to dam upstream and reduce water downstream?

Posted 2 years ago on 17 Mar 2010 21:43 #
M.AKRAM KHAN NIAZI
Member

India is having large number of rivers and is six times larger than Pakistan but is not wasting water of its any river in the sea.

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 4:54 #
RajputPuttar
Member

Bahiyaa,

First see whether 'seawater intrusion' is a problem or not ? Then we can talk further.

I m also punjabi but just going for 'Punjabi Schonism' is not the way.

Let other nations of pakistan live as well.

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 5:01 #
M.AKRAM KHAN NIAZI
Member

Using Sweet water for irrigation near sea and not using that water for IRRIGATION in other parts of the country where there is abundance of arid land due to non availability of water is a great cruelty

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 5:11 #
M.AKRAM KHAN NIAZI
Member

What damage sea water can cause to thje land of Thatta which has already huge mines of salts and is the source salt for salt factories, follwing is the profile of Company.

OUR SALT FIELDS/MINES
AL-AMIN SALT REFINERY IS HAVING THEIR OWN 550 ACRES OF LAKE SALT MINES APPROX. IN THE DISTRICT OF THARPARKER AND DHABEJI, DISTRICT THATTA. OUR SALT IS HARVESTED FROM NATURALLY OCCURRING SALT LAKES WITH THE PRODUCTION OUT PUT IS 40,000 TONES PER DAY APPROX. OUR RAW SALT HARVESTING TECHNOLOGY IS TOTALLY EQUIPPED WITH MINING TECHNOLOGIES MACHINE TO GUARANTEE THE RAW SALT QUALITY AND BETWEEN 94-97% PURITY. MOST OF OUR SALT FIELDS ARE WELL CONNECTED WITH HIGHWAYS. OUR RAW SALT IS MANUFACTURED AND PROCESSED TO CERTAIN PROCEDURES AND FINALLY TRANSPORTED THROUGH COMPANY OWNED VEHICLES TO OUR REFINERY PLANTS IN KARACHI.

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 5:15 #
RajputPuttar
Member

So, people living close to sea should be killed ? This is what u want ?

Gentelman , i asked u a simple quesiton, whether the seawater intrusion phenomneion exists or not ?

U claimed in the above messages, that its a **** phenomenon only . Bahiiyaa, phley thoraa saa parh laain , what it is infact.

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 5:16 #
M.AKRAM KHAN NIAZI
Member

It is the example of just one factory which is announcing that
in Thatta Their mine OUT PUT IS 40,000 TONES PER DAY, and we are wasting our sea water in not only saline sea but also on huge deposts of natural salt imines.

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 5:19 #
M.AKRAM KHAN NIAZI
Member

In Karachi and in Guwadour there is no sea intrusion ,but just a reason for wastage of River Indus in sea,there is a intrusion of sea water in the mines and lakes of salts.

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 5:22 #
RajputPuttar
Member

Niazi Sahib,

there are about 20-30 lac people (insan--although not punjabi) which leave downstream kotri. Un kaa kiya karain ?

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 5:28 #
M.AKRAM KHAN NIAZI
Member

The foolish reasons on the basis of which we wasting River Indus water in the sea and the way we Pakistanies are Victimimizing and abusing River Indus due to provincialism and ethoncentrism and not utilizing for cultivation of land,not building dams like Kalabgh and other dams and by not using for generation of electricity, it is expected that India will not allow us to do such malpracties in future and will take all advantages by utilizing Idus water itself its own population and it is certain that world community will support India.

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 6:02 #
RajputPuttar
Member

Niazi Sahib,

What to do with non-punjabi insans of Thatta & Badin ?

Why don't u answer this ?

There are studies conducted by WAPDA itself , where it has accpeted that certain amount of water (around 10m Acre Feet) needs to be discharged down stream kotri to avoid seawater intrusion.

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 6:05 #
M.AKRAM KHAN NIAZI
Member

On one side we are blaming India for stealing our water for generation of electricity and irrigation,but question is if we waste our water ourselves in sea as sea fishes are thirsty or as there is shortage of rain on the sea while it is sea which receive the larger portion of rain as compared to land then infact India is doing a noble thing and we Pakistanies by wasting sweet water in the sea, are doing a crime and sin against humanity.

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 6:07 #
RajputPuttar
Member

Bahiyaa,

Sindhis in Thatta and Badin are not indians. There are very much citizens of pak.

Why don't u give a straight answer that what should be done with them ?

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 6:10 #
M.AKRAM KHAN NIAZI
Member

Sea Intrusion a baseless reason For wastage of River Indus water in Sea.
In Rain season all coastal areas and Arabian sea comes under Sweet water but still salinity is there,there fore it is foolish Idea that by wasting River Indus water on land or sea will have any influence on salt content of soil or sea.

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 6:15 #
RajputPuttar
Member

Bahiyaa,

All the technical experts in WAPDA & world over are fools who advise the discharege of freshwater to avoid seawater intrusion.

Mashallaah:)

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 6:23 #
M.AKRAM KHAN NIAZI
Member

Mr. Rajput,it will be better to use water of Indus in the desert of Tharparkar and land between Karachi and Hyderabad,and further beyond Karachi and coastal areas of Makran,but also in state of Rajhastan and Gujrat of India but wastage in the sea or in the salt mines of Thatta is not acceptable to any sensible person or human in any condition.

Poisioning,contaminating and polluting the God giffted River Indus sweet water with sea water or with salts of land and mines is a crime, a sin, a cruelty and denial the blessing of God.

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 6:26 #
RajputPuttar
Member

ook , lets assume water is used in tharparkar.

Now, what the 2-3 million people of Thatta/badin do ?

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 6:28 #
M.AKRAM KHAN NIAZI
Member

All the technical experts in WAPDA are fools due to whom there is acute shortage of water and electricity in the country inspite of huge resources availbale,if we can not use these resources and just waste them then it will be better to give these resources to India.

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 6:29 #
M.AKRAM KHAN NIAZI
Member

People of Thatta/badin should be given as much water as required for cultivation but wastage of God gifted sweet water in the sea or in the salt mines of Thatta is not acceptable to any sensible person or human in any condition.

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 6:32 #
RajputPuttar
Member

M.AKRAM KHAN NIAZI

On one hand , u open another thread for condemning politicians due to their failure to construct dam/dams and now u r holding WAPDA responsbile for that.

BTW, can i please ask your qualification on this subject of hydrology and marine echology ?

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 6:34 #
M.AKRAM KHAN NIAZI
Member

It is very strange to note that present Government is advocating for
Air Polluting Thar Coal Project Versus Enviromental Friendly Kalabagh Dam.

 Kalabagh dam which will increase the water resources of the country is being opposed while Thar coal project,which will consume huge amount of water and will contaminate all water,air and land resources of Pakistan is being adovecated by the governement Clean electricity produced by Kalabagh dam will be available to every one citizen of the country while thar coal project will pollute all water,air and land resources of Pakistan for every one.Thar coal will effect each and every living organism while Kalabagh will not only store water for the time of need but with the generation of electricity will increase the resources of water by sucking up the underground water resources and will provide the clean electricity .

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 9:01 #
RajputPuttar
Member

M.AKRAM KHAN NIAZI

u r concerned about Living organism.
'har coal will effect each and every living organism'

Please consider Pathans and sindhis a bit more than living organisms.

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 12:13 #
semirza
Moderator

Brought over from a similar thread and merged here:
tamaazkhan
Member
Even Musharraf wanted to build the Kalabagh Dam.

RajputPuttar
Members
__PAK ARMY needs water to irrigate lands alloated in the 'GREATER THAR CANAL'

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 14:10 #
RajputPuttar
Member

mirza sahib,

Sorry , what does it stand for ?

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 14:12 #
semirza
Moderator

Author has created another thread (duplicate) while this one is still open for comments. These are posts that have been brought over and merged here.

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 14:13 #
RajputPuttar
Member

thx mirza sahib,

You are most welcome

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 14:15 #
Anonymous

We are not only wasting our river water but we are also wasting millions of gallons of water in daily basis....and in a city like Karachi all this water is dumped to Arabian sea so we need to check this water and try to purifying it and use it for agricultural purposes at least then by that we can also save millions of gallon of water got wasted in our cities and also in our industries...

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 14:15 #
semirza
Moderator

Good that we should not waste even one drop of water. Natural flow/streams should not be blocked in any way when a river ends into a sea. This disturbs the ecosystem, increases salinity through inward encroachment by the sea itself not to forget vital mangroves a barrier between fresh and salt water that are destroyed.
Disturbed weather patterns at times also bring along unexpected rains for an unusually long periods. Dams are opened to accommodate that flow. All that cannot be absorbed along with the unexpected has to be released into the sea.

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 14:26 #
shriq
Member

40,000 TONES PER DAY

How much space is taken up by 40000 tons?

How many people per ton are required to process?

How big is the storage of that facility OR is it shipped / transported to customers daily?

We dont care about figures in data!!!

Do we?

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 14:28 #
RajputPuttar
Member

Nice observation Shirq :)

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 14:56 #
tamaazkhan
Member

In the costal areas of costal areas of Sindh countless villiages have been abandoned due to seawater intrusion.

The trickle that is left of the Indus is the reason behind this ecological destruction.

More dams will only worsen the effect.

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 15:39 #
hariskhan
member

Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,

@Salam: I watched that program with EX-WAPDA/PEPCO Director.

I just want to say that, our people will NEVER want to make the right decisions untill some of them won't die as a result of making bad decisions.

I want to bring about this same situation. If our people still didn't make correct decisions, then may ALLAH ALMIGHTY destroy! our people, and bring up a new nation to replace them.

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 16:15 #
Wahid Doyum
Member

Sindhis have made their viewpoint clear. If it's not right for India to stop water to Pakistan, why is it right for Pakistan to stop water to lower province?

http://www.dawn.com/wps/wcm/connect/dawn-content-library/dawn/the-newspaper/letters-to-the-editor/dam-on-indus-and-sindhs-case-730

Dam on Indus and Sindh’s case

Wednesday, 17 Mar, 2010
font-size small font-size largefont-sizeprint email share
THE Damier-Bhasha Dam project is located on the Indus about 315km upstream of Trabela Dam, 165km downstream of Gilgit and 40km downstream of Chilas. The dam has a maximum height of 270m, and will impound 15 per cent of the annual river flow. It would cover an area of 110km2 and extend 100km upstream of the dam site up to Raikot bridge on the Karakaram Highway.

It will cost $12.6bn and will have a storage capacity of 6,340,000 acre feet. However, it will have power generation capacity of 4,500 megawatts.

Pakistan is currently facing an acute shortage of water, including reduced outflow of water from the Tarbela Dam. This is adversely affecting the agriculture sector.

According to expert estimates, the shortage during the Rabi crop could go up to 40 per cent.

The Indus delta, a famous Ramsar site, earlier occupied about 600,000 hectares, consisting of creeks, mud flats and mangrove forests that spread from Karachi to the Rann of Kutch.

However, at present the active delta is considered to be less than 10 per cent of its original area.

In 1972 the Wildlife Department, declared the deltaic regions of Keti Bunder, Shah Bander, etc, as wildlife sanctuaries because of thick forests and natural grazing fields.

Many species of birds and animals have since left the Indus delta because the natural habitat has been destroyed by persistent shortage of water. As a result, the forest cover is gone and so are grazing fields.

People of the small coastal town of Baghan, Thatha district, still remember the beautiful thick forests along the coastal belt in the Indus delta region, where wildlife species thrived in large numbers.

They remember the days when deer, hares and black and brown partridges were commonly found in the area. However, now all the glories of the past have almost faded away.

We have already opposed the construction of the Damier-Bhasha Dam which would render Sindh barren. We have expressed reservation over the dam before authorities concerned.

The project is scheduled to be completed by 2016. Sindh, being at the tail-end of the river, has always suffered and its concern are genuine. Water shortage in lower Sindh is more severe than in upper Sindh and the government is engaged in talks in an effort to meet the need of growers.

If we don’t get water on time, growers will suffer huge losses. Water should be distributed according to the needs of the provinces, but tail-enders should get priority as had been the practice in the past.

In Sindh the shortage of water -- potable and for irrigation -- has become chronic.

There are thousands of villages where there is no water at all. In Thatta district there are many villages where water for ablution or for giving a bath to the dead is bought from far-flung areas.

The Indus has become a river without water. So far more than 2.2m acres of fertile agricultural land in Thatta and Badin have been destroyed by sea intrusion, as well as because of non-availability of water in Kotri downstream. Sindh bears the burnt of water shortage.

In view of the above facts, the Prime Minister should ask relevant authorities to drop the Bhasha Dam project once and for all. It is, for the sake of national integration and stronger federation.

HUMAIRA ALWANI
MPA, Thatta

Posted 2 years ago on 18 Mar 2010 21:16 #
gujjartalwar
Member

I think both Frontier and Sindh leaders are opposing this issue on faulty grounds.

Storage of water in a dam is useful for both Punjab and Sindh.

There is no real danger to Frontier. A 100 year flood is a statistical worst cas scenario. It may or may not happen. Such an event can happen even without the dam being built. Dikes can safeguard vulnerable areas.

Posted 2 years ago on 19 Mar 2010 0:37 #
RajputPuttar
Member

Gujjar Talwar

Thats one case of extreme flood like 1929 but other problem for pahkhtookhawa is of water logging which will occur as a result of dam storage and increased water levels.

Posted 2 years ago on 19 Mar 2010 0:51 #
gujjartalwar
Member

Water logging occurs in areas where canals run through. Kalabagh is a hilly area where the reservoir will be contained. It does not pose any water logging risk. I don't quite know the dam plans but the area of Frontier, west of Kalabagh is pretty barren. It might even benefit if it gets a small canal for irrigation.

There are always some issues with a project of this magnitude. One obvious concern is that a lot of people will be displaced. On balance, the benefits far outweigh the risks. I am all for this project ASAP but it does not seem to be happening.

Posted 2 years ago on 19 Mar 2010 1:49 #
RajputPuttar
Member

Gujjar Talwar

Bahi , KBD lake will strectch some 100 kms .

Bahi, when dam will store water , the water will seep to adjacent areas resulting in the underground water table and ultimately resulting in water logging.

Posted 2 years ago on 19 Mar 2010 1:54 #
gujjartalwar
Member

If you look at a google map of the area, you see rocky hills from Kalabagh to Attock on both sides of the river. I don't know what damage will happen there because of water seepage. It might even help grow some vegetation.

Posted 2 years ago on 19 Mar 2010 2:13 #
RajputPuttar
Member

Bahi Gujjar,

Kalabagh is around 120 km downstream from tarbeela and around 100km long lake.

Posted 2 years ago on 19 Mar 2010 4:07 #
gujjartalwar
Member

My estimate is that Tarbela is 250-300km from Kalabagh. If the lake is to extend 100km, it will be upto Khushal Garh which is straight west from Rawalpindi, about 100km south of Attock bridge on Indus river.

Posted 2 years ago on 19 Mar 2010 5:12 #
hariskhan
member

Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,

Pakistan desperately! needs Kalabagh Dam. That is, if Pakistan, if Pakistani people want to survive.

If they don't, well, then, who cares ?

Mar! jao sare apas main useless, worthless arguments karte karte

Posted 2 years ago on 19 Mar 2010 5:23 #
Wahid Doyum
Member

A typical response from a colonist mindset degrading Sindhis and stealing their resources on top of it. Is this what your JI approved Islam teaches you? This is the same that you thought of Bengalis and in the end even after killing so many, 90,000 West Pakistanis were surrendering. The same can be shown to establishment by Sindhis, Balochs and Pukhtuns.

Don't try to act in a role of higher authority or Allah can bring your arrogance down again. Your ugly words expose your inner ugliness.

"@Wahid Doyum: People of Sindh are nothing more than people who;

(1) are uneducated
(2) are uninformed
(3) have high ego
(4) have low thinking power
(5) have high tendency to commit treason
(6) are sold-out AHOs

That's what people of Sindh are.

They are destroying Pakistan with their nonsense! of arguments.

There should be a court of law in this nation, where EVERYONE goes to resolve their disputes, even governments.

It is also the absence of this court of law that is killing us :@.

I would SUE ALL of Sindh for making nonsense go on endlessly. "

Posted 2 years ago on 19 Mar 2010 6:22 #