Who is the 2nd worst leader of Pakistan? « PKPolitics Discuss

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Who is the 2nd worst leader of Pakistan?

(62 posts)

sasherwani
Members

I dont need to explain who the worst-ever leader of Pakistan is. Yes the same person who went to a college that never existed and graduated in a discipline he often forgets. He tried to shag Sarah Palin by saying 'You are gorgeous, can I hug you?'. He isnt much of a spelling-guru which was evident from the note he left on Quaid ka Mizaar. Yes he is Mr. 10% himself, the most corrupt man known to mankind. His corruption overshadows Madoff's. Yes he is the wadaira who allegedly killed his own wife, Sadr e Pakistan Asif Ali Zardari!

Now, who is the 2nd worst leader of Pakistan?

Musharraf?
Nawaz Sharif?
Benazir Bhutto?
Ayyub Khan?
Zia ul Haque?

http://pakistaniat.com/2009/08/24/bad-pakistan-leaders/

Added by admin. @sasherwani, let me know if you want me to remove it

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 8:12 #
Beenai
Moderator

second worst is Musharraf for sure .
he has damaged Pakistan ...in a way that nobody else can touch his performance in this regard .
seller of Pakistanis.

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 8:31 #
netengr
blocked

1-Zia Ul Haq
2-Ayub Khan
3-Musharraf

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 8:32 #
zia m
Member

I will take a corrupt politician over any dictator.

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 8:39 #
sasherwani
Members

zia,

whats the difference between a corrupt politician (zardari) and a dictator (musharraf)?

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 8:43 #
zia m
Member

It is much easier to remove Zardari than a dictator.

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 8:46 #
semirza
Moderator

Dictators are dictators military or civilian. Even a one man rule is a form of dictatorship. But on the other hand a military dictator tends to last out longer because of support from the army itself.

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 8:56 #
tamza2k
Members

Obviously Zia was the one who had laid a stone to Taliban so in my opinion he was/is 2nd at rank.

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 9:05 #
sasherwani
Members

@Zia:

"It is much easier to remove Zardari than a dictator"

Firstly dictators can be both military or civilian (as Semirza pointed out). As for who is easier to remove, well I'd say removing King Abdullah from power would be as difficult as removing Gaddafi or Hassani Mubarak (keeping in mind the latter two belong to military backgrounds).

Secondly, just because a person is easier to remove doesn't get him any extra fan-support. Zardari might be easier to remove (in your opinion) but during his tenure, he would destroy Pakistan as much as would an army dictator.

P.S. Julius Caeser was a dictator!

@ Tam,

I believe so too. Zia ul Haque is the main cause of all the unrest we see in Pakistan. He was also the main reason behind the transformation of a progressive Pakistan to a 'confused' Pakistan.

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 9:08 #
zia m
Member

Sasherwani
By corrupt politicians i mean the people elected through some form of electoral process and "dictators" i mean military dictators.Kings,Khalifas or Monarchs have the support of religious institutions or army.Like Church of England supported British kings.
It is better to have some form of democratic process for people to be able to get rid of corrupt leaders.

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 9:35 #
Beenai
Moderator

dictator can be civilian too.
we have a history of having a Civilian Martail law administrator too.

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 9:46 #
Oriel
Member

I think the heads of all the parties with en-mass support religious and simply political all come an equal second. We need a clean sweep........... flush them all out simultaneously!!!!!! Otherwise change will remain a wish we taqlk about solely on the net.

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 10:03 #
shriq
Member

If the dictator understands the sources of power in his country, and he makes those sources and forces his allies, then it is difficult to remove him.

sasherwani,

"progressive Pakistan to a 'confused' Pakistan"

VERY well said!

On the topic:

I think overall it was ZA Bhutto as he:
1. Pulled back the progressive industrialization by nationalisation.
2. Was a party to the breakup of Pakistan.
3. Nationalised schools
4. Without first educating allowed trade and students unions (this was like giving knife to a child who hurts himself)
5. Gave undue freedom to film industry (to counter that Zia got sympathies and support by his slogan of Islamisation - people were not with Zia actually they were anti-Bhutto on these matters).

He is overall, in current scenario it is without doubt NS.

My opinion only, you have all the rights to disagree!

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 10:16 #
Beenai
Moderator

@sasherwani,
i agree with u completely .

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 10:20 #
sasherwani
Members

@ Zia,

Democratic process doesnt guarantee the removal of a leader (may it be political/ religious or both).

Three examples of non-military dictatorships:

1. Kingdom:
King Abdullah is a dictator and has barely any support from the Saudi nationals. Yet he will continue to reign till he dies. No Saudi national, religious authorities or the army will be able to do anything about it. Do some research on the 1979 Grand Mosque Siege to find out how powerless the religious forces are infront of the King in KSA.

2. Democracy:
Many leaders like Mubarak, Gaddafi or Robert Mugabe of Zimbabwe get elected democratically everytime though they are mocked and ridiculed by the majority of the population. These dictators are as irremovable as the Pakistani 'army' dictators and have been ruling their countries for decades.

3. Religious:
In the Vatican city, the pope gets elected by an electoral process called the conclave. Once elected, the pope of St. Peter's Church has infinite powers to do anything he wants. Even cage and torture people who speak against the church. He doesnt get removed till he dies. Some say even the electoral process is 'rigged' and only one among the 'preferati' chosen by the ex-pope gets elected.

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 10:32 #
javedsheikh
Members

The problem is not with the leaders.
Pakistan got a wrong person at a wrong time, or
A right person at a wrong time, or
A wrong person at a right time.
Pakistan badly needs a Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto right now.
He would have played an impressive game under the current circumstances.
He was a man of crises.

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 10:32 #
usayd
Member

@ all
Why u ppl confusing democracy and dictatorship. The two are actually the same thing ( two sides of the same coin). with a slight difference. In dictatorship one person dictates rest of the people. While in democracy there are many. A person who is elected can be a dictor just like the one who is not elected. In essence it is the right of legislation which makes a person or a group of people dictator(s). The right to choose for people.

zia m:

you put Khaleefah in the same category that of dictators and kings. i disagree with u for two reasons:

1. Khaleefah must be elected through the process of Bayah. So he is not a King. Simply being son of khaleefah doesn't make u khaleefah or even candidate for the next khaleefah.

2.Khaleefah doesn't dictate his laws and wishes. He has to rule by the Sharia. Otherwise he is to be deposed as happened with many Khulafah. So Khlaeefah is not a dictator.

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 10:47 #
javedsheikh
Members

lo khaleefa beech mein phir aa gya

How President Mohammad Hussain or Dictator Mohammad Hussain could be good as Khaleefa Mohammad Hussain?

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 10:53 #
sasherwani
Members

@ usayd,

..and the Khalifa will 'define' this Shariah himself ?:) What is haraam and what is halaal is still a debate even among the top aalims. Which version will he listen to? What about the nonmuslims who dont even care what is haram or halal?

Khilafat if established in today's world, will be another dictatorship.

Back 2 the question..

2nd worst leader in Pakistan's history?

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 10:55 #
shriq
Member

@Usayd

What is "the process of Bayah"??

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 10:56 #
linkwheel
Member

All of them!!

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 14:13 #
Anonymous

Who told you Zardari killed BB???

How about I say your favourite NS killed Abba ji??? so he can own his steel empire.

1)Zia
2)Zia
3)Musharraf
4)Ayub

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 14:47 #
shriq
Member

@bsobaid

lolz....

"killed Abba ji???"

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 15:18 #
zingaro
Member

My dears each and every leader who did any thing bad to Pakistan is the most worst person on earth. Whether it is Zardari, Nawaz Sharif, or anyone else.

Secondly, please remove Musharraf's name from this list because we are talking about so called leaders and he does not fall in this category. He was a bloody dictator and a **** pot and nothing else.

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 17:14 #
tamza2k
Members

BTW Zia & Yahya too were dictators........

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 17:42 #
zingaro
Member

tamza2k.. absolutely right ... i intentionally ignored their names, as they are not alive. But Mush is still alive and can feel the heat ..

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 17:49 #
raheb
Member

................AND WHAT this counting or numbering leads to?
Make any sense in thrown NON-SENSE!

raheb

Posted 2 years ago on 14 Oct 2009 21:12 #
Beenai
Moderator

that shows what is the criteria of 'bigger evil' and 'lesser evil' in our eyes .
it will serve as a survey of politicians ....who is worse than worse ?
and help us categorize them in order to take our future decisions to vote .

Posted 2 years ago on 15 Oct 2009 5:29 #
usayd
Member

@ JS:
Its not about titles and nominclature, its about systems and their basis.

@ sasherwani:

No, Khalifa cannot define Sharia himself. Sharia is defined by the Quran And Sunnah, Qiyas and consensus. The job of Khalifa is to implement sharia.

You are right in pointing out that there is difference of opinion among the muslim jurists in some issues. So the job of the Khalifa is to adopt one of the sharii opinions. And his adoption resolves the dispute. This understanding is from the well known sharii principle: " The adoption of the Imam resolves the difference." and an additional point here is that all the muslim schools of thought recognize this principle. and one more thing that the difference of opinion is in a few issues not in all the issues.

This also happens in democracy in an another way that the view of the majority is adopted to resolve the difference.

I hope you got my point. So Khalifa has to adopt from the sharii opinions and it is not upto his own sweet will. so he is not a dictatar. He is actually accountable before the law.

Posted 2 years ago on 15 Oct 2009 5:39 #
kingsalah
Blocked

every one is worst, No one has done nothing for political, economical and social system of Islam. They have done only one thing that is making the wealth of world. So they should be appreciated that in this world they have won but the next world is for Rasoolullah's campanions.

Posted 2 years ago on 15 Oct 2009 6:51 #
Beenai
Moderator

if every one is worst .
than we should do either of the two things:
1. get rid off all of them and go for the leader hunt from today

2. choose the lesser evil out of the present lot

choice is yours!

Posted 2 years ago on 15 Oct 2009 8:27 #
Anonymous

A very commong argument made by awam is to get rid of all top politicians and everything will be fine.

Hussain Haqqani has done some good empirical research on this argument and has proven with hard data that such approach never works. This approach has been tested in many Latim American countries and all such efforts failed miserably.

We as a nation get stuck with ideas. We should challenge our own arguments and move forward to resolve the issue rather than getting stuck with some superficial, baseless argument and do nothing about it.

Posted 2 years ago on 15 Oct 2009 14:42 #
amin1924
member

Right Bilal, changing a face with another face doesn't resolve anything. We have seen change of face -mush leaving & zardari coming and experienced no change. In fact situation has deteriorated.

By the way what do say about Ijaz-ul-Haq's ultimatum?

Posted 2 years ago on 15 Oct 2009 15:02 #
Anonymous

Yes JJ, no problems with that.
Who is a new face and how is he/she better than current faces? or if you dont want to go in personalities then tell me how will you compare a new face with old one and how will you reach a conclusion which one is better? what will be the criteria??

If the criteria is ghairat-o-hummiat and muhibb-e-watan and islami jazba then I am happy with the current lot but if the criteria is policies and clear road map and solutions out of our current problems then I am all for it.

About Ijaz-ul-Haq, I will be very sad if it becomes true. Nazir Naji said the same the other day in his column.

Posted 2 years ago on 15 Oct 2009 15:35 #
amin1924
member

bsobaid,

Regarding criteria, just one word -result-

People want to see results, not empty promises.

Posted 2 years ago on 15 Oct 2009 15:59 #
expakistani
Member

-1: BABA- E- Quam & Co, neither we are Islamic nor secular,
left us no where !!!!

-2: Quaid_e-Millat & Co: We are in "Amerika ke gulam" bcz of him

-3: Musharaf: He failed to hang NS, Bhttos, Choudries
his Ehtesab was very personal....

Posted 2 years ago on 15 Oct 2009 16:12 #
Anonymous

Where will you get results from new faces??
They are new faces because they have'nt had a chance to deliver anything yet, so result is not a valid criteria.
Also, nation do not need to wait until someone produces result. Results come from policies and road maps. Looking at policies and road maps is enough to conclude who is better. If there is no policy or road map then no matter how pious or naik aur amanat daar that person is, I wont vote for him/her.

I'd base my criteria on the solutions they provide for existing problems.

N-League do not provide any solutions at all and they do not present any policy. Their acceptance or refusal of a government initiative is based on rhetoric.

Tell me some about some other faces and we will analyse them one by one.

Posted 2 years ago on 15 Oct 2009 16:14 #
Anonymous

ex-Pakistani, I'd say your comment on Quaid-e-Azam is based on lack of understanding. Please read Quaid's speeches carefully and you will know what he wanted.

http://pkpolitics.com/discuss/topic/feb-1948-quaids-broadcast-talk-to-the-people-of-us-of-a#post-80833

http://pkpolitics.com/discuss/topic/aug-11th-1947-quaids-address-to-the-constituent-assembly-of-pakistan

Posted 2 years ago on 15 Oct 2009 16:17 #
amin1924
member

bsobaid,

Tell me which face is new and had no chance to produce result? Most of them had many chances at various positions.

Posted 2 years ago on 15 Oct 2009 16:20 #
Anonymous

Imran Khan can run the country because he built a hospitail and won world cup ?? sorry, I dont agree with that.

n-league?? they are'nt a new face. or you think they have produced better results than PPP when they were in federal government?

Posted 2 years ago on 15 Oct 2009 16:28 #
amin1924
member

Can Imran's candidates beat jageerdars/waderas/mqm? I don't think so. He may enjoy youth's support in urban areas but that is not good enough to form a govt in current system.

PML-N and PPP are together in govt, remember carbon tax fiasco? In fact mostly all parties are in govt. There is no opposition except some losers who don't have much to do.

Posted 2 years ago on 15 Oct 2009 16:44 #
Anonymous

Q-League is opposition.

When you present your argument about Imran Khan, think about Zulfi Bhutto. Yes, he got surrounded by jageerdars but in the beginning it was all grass root movement and awam rallied behind him.

If ZA Bhutto can do it, anyone else including Imran Khan can do it but Imran Khan (or any other leader at the moment)is not even close to Bhutto. I'd say justice movement or Ch. Iftikhar has the potential. This is why I kept saying that instead of illegaly becoming an illegitimate cheif justice he should have made a political party laikin Ch. Iftikhar kay dimagh mein Bangladesh model samayaa hoaa hai.

Posted 2 years ago on 15 Oct 2009 16:47 #
expakistani
Member

@bsobaid
Thanks Bro... Going through speeches 1 by 1, but bunch of secular guys asking for Muslim homeland....? that's not right.

Posted 2 years ago on 15 Oct 2009 16:51 #
amin1924
member

No, bunch of seculars asking for Muslim vote, not "Muslim Land".

Posted 2 years ago on 15 Oct 2009 16:55 #
raheb
Member

Beenai, " that shows what is the criteria of 'bigger evil' and 'lesser evil' in our eyes .???????????????

that is even BIGGER NON-SENSE than topic itself. You don't know what a criteria is?? is it really sooooo?
raheb

Posted 2 years ago on 15 Oct 2009 19:54 #
expakistani
Member

How about blindly following leader, just stuck to party you support and bring some good changes....

Like Ahtezaz Ihasan is still with PPP
or Good guy Javed Hashmi and CH Nisar are still with
choor shrifs

Posted 2 years ago on 15 Oct 2009 22:31 #
zjshami
Member

Could anyone name any acceptable and the most popular political leader, born after 1947 at the Pakistan soil?

I guess, after eating Mexi-Pak wheat, Pakistani parents ceased giving birth to a capable child who could become a good political leader.

This could be an American conspiracy?

Posted 2 years ago on 15 Oct 2009 23:04 #
Anonymous

Claim that Pakistan never produced any leader after 47 is a mainfestation of extreme pessimism and generalization or probably lack of understanding???

Posted 2 years ago on 16 Oct 2009 0:03 #
expakistani
Member

@zjshami
Browse thorugh pkpolitics you will find 1 -2 leader of high quality on each post...

Yeah per to har shakh per eik leader betha hey.

any how Mujeeb ZAB and Altaf hussain can fits in popular political leaders category .....

(may be less of leader type more like popular..)

Posted 2 years ago on 16 Oct 2009 0:50 #
javedsheikh
Members

http://www.geocities.com/sheikh.javed/dastan.jpg

Posted 2 years ago on 16 Oct 2009 3:00 #

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