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Why do we have a soft corner for Afghan Taliban?

(78 posts)
12

  1. hariskhan
    member

    Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,

    I'm sorry Salam, your still busy in 'clowning around'.

    Who knows what 'TTP' is doing or not doing ?

    Who knows if what we are watching, reading on local mass media is even true or not ?

    I or people of Pakistan don't even know who or what is 'TTP' ? Who are the people in it ? Where do these people live ? What tribes do they belong to ? What is their history ? What is the history of their people ? etc etc.

    There is no court of law in this nation that imparts justice, where a common man can go and ask for justice.

    What to talk about TTP in a nation where there is no justice, no standards of justice that everyone agree upon ?

    Who has the credibility to say what is right and what is wrong ?

    Posted 1 year ago on 21 Nov 2010 11:01 #

  2. toamin
    member

    HK, i happened to be visiting Pak right now and spent my Eid in Peshawar, I think I've fair good idea of FATA situation, I'm not relying on newspaper reports, I understand based on my LOCAL OBSERVATION-

    there are dozens of lose & disconnected groups, some are good while some are bad, there is no clear BLACK & WHITE

    in general i am against both parties who are fighting each other (army & groups loyal to mehsud)

    there are major groups lead by gul bahadur & haqqani who are not against Pak, these people are being killed everyday, even on day of Eid they were killed by the terror machines (drones) hovering over their heads 24-7

    Posted 1 year ago on 21 Nov 2010 11:20 #

  3. zenith
    Member

    @ Haris Khan

    You spent much time in describing how the West is corrupted.
    My question to you is WHO CARES?

    Why are we so much concerned about the west? We have to look upon ourselves. All these crimes that you enlisted are much more rampant in our society. Why? This I believe is God's wrath upon us for doing nothing except blaming the west. The corruption in the US should be of no concern to us. Cleanliness must begin from our homes. No reasonable person can condone US policies as they are committing injustices everywhere. They are free to do whatever they like because they are being allowed to do so by your muslim ummah. Unfortunately, we are shamless hypocrites who have angered the Alimighty. Despite the fact that people in pakistan pray so much, they are embroiled in disasters. Why?

    Who cares about the US? And why should we even bother. No one can conquer you unless you open the gates for them.

    The crimes in the west are their problem, not ours. We have our own to deal with. My original question about the Taliban was regarding their brand of Islam and not on their freedom struggle because the taliban are not the only ones asking for freedom from NATO, many non taliban afghans and non-pashtuns want it too.

    And as far as TTP is concerned, some of them had no intention to fight Pakistan, but were made to do so after the army killed many innocent tribal people. The other groups, however, are criminals and do not represent Islam in any way ( these were formerly with the army). Some groups are still with the army and waiting for their instructions.

    Posted 1 year ago on 21 Nov 2010 21:39 #

  4. hariskhan
    member

    Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,

    @zenith: The point of my lengthy explaination is not just to 'blame' the west. You'v missed the point.

    The point of going through all that excersize was to lay down the 'big canvas' in-front of 'you people' so when I start talking about 'Muslims' you'll be able to 'understand' what I'm saying.

    So it will make sense to you, because, then you'd be aware of the 'context'.

    (1) We care, about what people in the west are doing.

    Why ? Because 'we' get 'affected' by it, in more ways than one, that is 'directly' as well as 'indirectly', on a daily basis.

    (2) Yes, I agree to your point. We do have to look at ourselves in order to 'improve', in order to be able to do something about it. Having said that, it is important for us to 'understand' what is happening around us, to 'understand' the 'context', so we'll be able to make sense of what is going on around us. That is why it is important for me to lay down the 'big canvas' in-front of you people, before I start explaining;

    (a) where we Muslims are going wrong
    (b) how Muslims are conducting themselves
    (c) how Muslims should be conducting themselves
    (d) where is it that Muslims are making mistakes, committing crimes
    (e) where is it that Muslims are not making mistakes, not committing crimes
    (f) what and where is that Muslims need to 'improve' upon/in
    (g) what is it that Muslims need to do
    (h) what is it that Muslims need to stop! doing
    (i) etc etc

    --------------------------------------------------------

    P.S. I haven't finished my earlier dissertation though :P. I'd have to cover 1-3 to even 6 centuries worth of history to lay down the big canvas in-front of you. I'v just put recent history before you people that I think may prove to be enough for you guys to understand what I'm going to say about Muslims.

    Posted 1 year ago on 22 Nov 2010 6:24 #

  5. hariskhan
    member

    Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,

    @zenith: (3) Why Muslims are embroiled in 'disasters' ?

    There's a lengthy answer to this question. Again, I'd have to lay down the big canvas in-front of you, or a good part of it. 'Salam' can 'put it' in 'sweeter' 'words' than I can, for the moment.

    (4) Yes, I agree. No one can conquer us unless we open the gates for them. Yet, we people are in a 'confused' state. We need to 'understand' the 'context', 'understand' what is happening around us, in order to help ourselves in making educated/informed decisions, taking educated/informed actions that help us improve our overall situation.

    What we people are doing right now, is 'shooting blindly'. That hasn't helped us in over 50+ years.

    Posted 1 year ago on 22 Nov 2010 6:43 #

  6. hariskhan
    member

    Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,

    @zenith: Personally, I think these notions of;

    (1) 'their' brand of Islam', or
    (2) 'our' 'brand of Islam', or
    (3) 'his' 'brand of Islam', or
    (4) 'her' 'brand of Islam', or
    (5) etc etc

    were 'created' to 'mislead' people/masses. They don't have any worth.

    Its like saying my 'Physics' or your 'Physics' or anyone else's 'Physics'. When 'Physics' is just one thing. There is no my or yours or anyone else's Physics.

    These notions are as worthless in discussions as they are in real life. They don't exist/apply.

    There's only ONE Islam. Islam that ALLAH ALMIGHTY sent to mankind. ALLAH ALMIGHTY sent only ONE Islam to mankind. Islam is ONE entity. The problem starts when we don't read, when we 'blindly' accept what others tell us about Islam. We 'engage' in 'speculation' about Islam, when we should clearly say that we don't know what Islam says about something.

    There is no my Islam or your Islam or anyone else's Islam. There is only ONE Islam that ALLAH ALMIGHTY sent to mankind through Muhammad (SAW). That is what matters.

    Posted 1 year ago on 22 Nov 2010 8:10 #

  7. hkbajwa
    Member

    HK

    Again we return to a very basic problem in your reasoning.

    You are quite right that there is only ONE Islam. This is neither a revolutionary thought nor one that has escaped the world.

    People DO agree that there is only one islam. What people DON'T agree on is what that ONE Islam IS.

    And that is where we have the issue. WHO decides who is following the ONE islam?? From barely a few decades after the death of the Prophet (pbuh) muslims have been embroiled in this conflict and it has resulted in greater and greater schisms.

    The problem arises when somebody WITHIN the croup insists on EXCLUDING certain members of the group by arbitrarily declaring them non-muslims. ALL of the sects of islam are the result of certain people within the Ummah excluding others. These people took upon themselves God's exclusive right to decide who is muslim and who is not.

    So pray tell.. who is a part of the ummah? Who makes that judgement? Who has the authority to do so?

    You are merely repeating what everybody agrees on already, but you are not explaining how such unity is possible. Such unity is only possible when the self-appointed leaders of the ummah accept the diversity of perception about Islam that exists among the believers.

    There are a myriad of beautiful implementations of islamic philosophy in the world and it is only when this diversity is accepted that unity is possible.

    It is when our self-appointed "muslim leaders" assume that UNITY is the same as UNIFORMITY that they take the first step towards complete fragmentation. Faith is individual and will NEVER be uniform for ANYBODY. Faith can only look uniform on the SURFACE, but the reality is that there are as many different interpretations as there are people in the world.

    your assumption is that everybody reads the Quran in the same way, that everybody can ONLY come to ONE conclusion and that there is no possiblity of multiple interpretations. This is of course completely untrue (as 1400 years of division quite adequately proves)

    Btw it is patently false to blame this fragmentation of the ummah on outsiders (jews, christians, americans etc). While they do take advantage of these internal schisms, the fragmentation is wholly self-inflicted. If certain members of the ummah weren't so gung-ho about exclusing those who arrived at a different understanding from the same text, this fragmentation would not even be an issue.

    Posted 1 year ago on 22 Nov 2010 8:47 #

  8. shafiq12
    member

    @Zenith

    Cleanliness must begin from our homes. No reasonable person can condone US policies as they are committing injustices everywhere.

    How u will clean the imagination of Children studying under the thoughts of West. How u clean the thoughts of those people whose mind is fully developed under the thoughts of westren School. It's very easy to write

    Cleanliness must begin from our homes. U can't clean ur homes who are dirty and furnished with westren living styles. The cure is Dinullah. Support and struggle for Dinullah. The only cure for all the diseases of World.
    So Quran is solution.The Law of Quran should be implemented in the world. U can't clean ur house unless u used the razor of Quran

    Posted 1 year ago on 22 Nov 2010 8:55 #

  9. quaidkamazaar
    Member

    @HussainFarooqui

    If Afghan Taliban were really that tolerant, I wonder why they forced people to keep beards. sir with due respect, I think you are really really mistaken about this.

    Posted 1 year ago on 22 Nov 2010 10:50 #

  10. shafiq12
    member

    qaid ka mazaar,

    What's wrong in beards, Do u want to look like woman, If that is the case i suggest u should keep veil on ur mouth and sit in ur house and cook food for the hungry kids. Do u want to be follower of bristish because they are the founder of this ritual i.e cleaning of shaves. We happily follow the sunnat of Britisher but feel ashmed on the sunnat of Rasool. How irony?

    Posted 1 year ago on 22 Nov 2010 11:20 #

  11. hariskhan
    member

    Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,

    @quaidkamazaar: Let's put Taliban on one side for the moment.

    Let's talk about the other side of the coin, where you 'think' 'freedom' 'exists'. Do they offer 'freedom' or slavery/'coercion' ?

    Posted 1 year ago on 22 Nov 2010 12:28 #

  12. gv
    Member

    @ss

    "Do u want to look like woman, If that is the case i suggest u should keep veil on ur mouth and sit in ur house and cook food for the hungry kids"

    you really are the perfect poster boy for the perfect islamic society

    where can i sign up!!!! ps. do i get any discounts for already keeping a beard??

    Posted 1 year ago on 22 Nov 2010 14:54 #

  13. dildar
    Member

    @gv

    oops... you got a beard????

    I thought you are a decent guy ;))

    Posted 1 year ago on 22 Nov 2010 15:19 #

  14. gv
    Member

    @dildar

    well you see before that people said i looked a bit like one of those awful women creatures and my wife was threatening to make me cover my mouth and spend all day cooking for the children. ..

    so to make sure i could be counted as a real man i grew a beard !!!

    Posted 1 year ago on 22 Nov 2010 15:39 #

  15. bublibangash
    Member

    We have many gud reason for being pro Afghani Taliban
    Firstly,,,,, We Share a Single Faith of Islam.
    Secondly,,, We, both have Anti Americanism Sentiments
    Thridly,,,,, They are made by Pakistan during Eightess
    Fourthly,,,, They are Fighting against the Foreign invaders (the US/NATO Alliance) on their soil.... and so on......

    Posted 1 year ago on 22 Nov 2010 15:50 #

  16. shafiq12
    member

    gv

    there is no perfection. No body is perfect, Not even Prophets

    So why u said=

    perfect poster boy

    It show ur hate. It shows ur polluted ideas, It shows the corruption of ur knowedlge. SO u shave ur face everday to show what that u are perfect boy of the pefect liberal tyrants.

    Posted 1 year ago on 22 Nov 2010 15:54 #

  17. gv
    Member

    @SS

    you seem to have missed the point.. i have a beard already.. i just want to join up when you set up your little society so i do some real man's work and make sure the women stick to the cooking and housework.. because i actually have to cook every now and then for my wife and family and am really tired of it.. please keep me posted on gv@hotmail.com

    Posted 1 year ago on 22 Nov 2010 16:01 #

  18. shafiq12
    member

    Gv

    Sorry My Err,

    I am not in favor using of stick, But i am telling people who shave their face everyday to look like woman, Why they don't sit in their house and care for hungry children. If they really want to Look like women and give their women a Chance. May be they can change the world. They want liberation

    BTW I am very happy u have the Beard that u are not like gays

    Posted 1 year ago on 22 Nov 2010 16:19 #

  19. gv
    Member

    @ss

    funny you should say that given that many famous 'gays' have beards... ian mckellan, george michael to name but two...

    Posted 1 year ago on 22 Nov 2010 16:30 #

  20. shafiq12
    member

    gv

    ian mckellan, george michael to name but two... Beard?

    I don't believe. What is proof. Do u check them

    Posted 1 year ago on 22 Nov 2010 16:44 #

  21. gv
    Member

    @ss

    well you can google it yourself after all "seeing is believing"

    Posted 1 year ago on 22 Nov 2010 16:50 #

  22. shafiq12
    member

    gv

    geoge Micheal has no beard are u trying to cheat me

    Posted 1 year ago on 22 Nov 2010 16:54 #

  23. gv
    Member

    Apologies

    is ian mckellen good enough for now

    http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://blogs.liverpooldailypost.co.uk/geekworld/ian%2520mckellen.jpg&imgrefurl=http://blogs.liverpooldailypost.co.uk/geekworld/2009/10/ian-mckellen---im-too-old-to-p.html&h=449&w=300&sz=24&tbnid=CqLWtH8-GKW6jM:&tbnh=127&tbnw=85&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dian%2Bmckellen&zoom=1&q=ian+mckellen&hl=en&usg=__YVfA8pgAgDi7DzqOKnhrQe9YPUY=&sa=X&ei=rqDqTOfKO4qBhQeMg8HGDA&ved=0CEoQ9QEwBQ

    Posted 1 year ago on 22 Nov 2010 16:56 #

  24. shafiq12
    member

    gv

    i think the title of thread should be

    Why gv has soft corner for gays

    Posted 1 year ago on 22 Nov 2010 16:57 #

  25. gv
    Member

    @ss

    i was merely pointing out that there are some gay people who have beards.. but please dont mind me and carry on...i wouldnt want to get in the way of all your hard work in establishing your great society.

    Posted 1 year ago on 22 Nov 2010 17:00 #

  26. shafiq12
    member

    gv

    Why u keep beard can u please explain. What the reason.

    Please try to tell me the real reason don't dodge me.

    Do u have beard according to Sunnat of Rasool.

    Or u have beard like some people keep fashioned beard

    Posted 1 year ago on 22 Nov 2010 17:04 #

  27. gv
    Member

    my dear ss

    To be perfectly honest i keep a beard because most men in my family keep a beard (and have done so for generations) and because i like the way it looks. It has absolutely nothing to do with 'Sunnat of Rasool' whatsoever and i have no qualms telling you that.

    Posted 1 year ago on 22 Nov 2010 17:19 #

  28. shafiq12
    member

    gv

    U are good man, I admire ur honestly and loyalty. But u can make it more worth if u keep in ur mind as it is sunnat of Rasool {Saw}. Because we are the follower Rasool. Every act of Rasool is guideline for Us. This will not only benefit u in this world but hereafter. I ask sorry to if u r hurt with my words. U have proved urself a really good man. If there is no intention behind like this. Than it is better for u to shave ur face.

    as u are following the rituals of ur family?

    Posted 1 year ago on 22 Nov 2010 17:26 #

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