SufiSoul
Member
Missguiding the muslims over name of Islam is not a new concept..
Looking back into the History one may find such delibrate acts by lots of people/leaders..
In separate nation struggle"Pakistan ka matlab kiya lailaha illallah" was the motive behind Pakistan moment..
The use of religion is too bad to back up your aims other than ISLAM..
This is true in present as well as for the past too..
Should not we stop using the name of ISLAM when their is no ultimate aim to establish ISLAMIC RULE.....
Religion is one of the tools to consolidate public opinion through emotional motivation.
Throughout the World, there are millions of followers who hardly follow the commands of their religions but would be willing to sacrifice their lives in the name of religion.
Why the Indian Muslim League and the Qauid-e-Azam used the Religion Card?
1. That was a political strategy which worked to defeat the Indian National Congress.
2. Leaders of the Indian Muslim League believed in a practicable and moderate, Tajdeedi version of Islam commensurate to the needs of the future generations.
3. The chaos, confusion, conflict and cloudy situation has been created where the sect # 56 or sect # 38, is adamant to enforce its version of Islam over the other 72 sects of Muslims.
Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,
We intend to implement Islami Nizam. We will settle for nothing! less.
LalBichoo
Blocked
"""We intend to implement Islami Nizam. We will settle for nothing! less. """
>>>
If Pakistan was created to impose so-called 'Islami Nizam' then Why did Jamiat Ulema-e-Hind and Jamaat-e-Islami oppose Pakistan's creation ???
SufiSoul
Member
Quote:
1. That was a political strategy which worked to defeat the Indian National Congress.....
Than "it seems that two nation theory was alsoa mere theory"..
If yes than what was the "hidden Agenda" behind the separate PAKISTAN...
SufiSoul
Member
Quote:
If Pakistan was created to impose so-called 'Islami Nizam' then Why did Jamiat Ulema-e-Hind and Jamaat-e-Islami oppose Pakistan's creation ???
You are right here cuz motive was not ISLAMI NIZAM so they sit in opposition.......
Now that we have used ISLAM Slogan in creation of Pakistan (Guilty!!!!) Can we now move forward and try to make this country an ideal Islamic country? Or shall we live in the past and discuss/blame each other for the rest of our sad lives.
SufiSoul
Member
That past, created two shools of thought,
1.to implement ISLAMI NIZAM
2.To implement liberal laws
The actual issue is how to settle between these two school of thoughts..
Unfortunately, more we talk about Unity, Faith and Discipline, more we get Divided, Faithless and Lost.
Religious Leaders have failed to convince and unite the nation at one platform and agenda.
ہجوم کیوں ہے زیادہ شراب خانے میں
فقط یہ بات کہ پیر مغاں ہے مرد خلیق
Why not treat this issue in a democratic way. A vote on type of system Pakistanis would prefer to have. Islamic or non Islamic let the vote decide.
We are Muslims and the only system which will work efficiently and will be acceptable to the vast majority is an ISLAMIC System but NOT the system which TTP is Preaching! I am DEAD AGAINST this.
How can a illiterate guy from a village make decision of Deen and Duniya for us. It has to be a PROPER system where these so called ISLAM KAY THAIKADAAR should also be brought to justice for their crimes. I don't buy the story of collateral damage and also don't approve of the Sharia law which only caters one ethnic or religious group. The law should be based ONLY on the teaching of QURAN and SUNNAH!
These laws should be discussed and implemented by a group of Ulemma and Moderate Muslim representatives. For example, people who object on use of Loud Speaker for Azzan Purpose should be kicked out along with those who wants to use Loud speakers of a mosque for other purposes other then azzan.
tamaazkhan
Member
Simply put,
Paksitan was created for Muslims, Islam is their religion.
I feel those looking for an Islami Nizam are look for some type of divnely guided caliphate.
The Phrophet (pbuh) is no more, any system you implement will be implemented by man and will be flawed.
Just becuase Mullahs run it or Seculars run it wont make it more or less Islami Nizam!
I feel those looking for an Islami Nizam are look for some type of divnely guided caliphate.
Being Judgmental will take you no where! NOT everyone wants the divinely guided system as that guidance stopped after Prophet MUHAMMAD Peace be upon him. The Only Guidance we seek is from Quran and Sunnah!
I would support the Islamic version # 72 as the best for Pakistan, which carries a synthesis out of 71 theses on Islam.
Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,
Islami Nizam will not be imposed on anyone. It is the will of the people of Pakistan.
Those who engage in saying it will be imposed, they are spreading propaganda.
gv
Member
@hk
the issue is not the 'imposition' of an islami nizam - the issue is getting everyone involved to agree on what an islami nizam should be
p.s. thanks for the videos will try and view them over the weekend
CORRECT JV
Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,
There is wide-spread consensus for implementing Islami Nizam within Pakistani people.
There is so much I can show you all, in shape of examples, in shape of logical evidence, compared to what we have today.
@gv: Take your time *thumbs up*.
There's no problem as far as agreement on Islam's principles is concerned.
MMA was a unity of multiple religious groups for a good! cause. It shows! consensus is! present.
Its just a matter of having the 'will' to go forward with it. To make the effort.
gv
Member
@hk
In principle yes - but in practice that has proved next to impossible....
what do you think of Tamaaz Khan's statement above - that at the end of the day any modern system will be subject to the interpretation of a normal man (i.e. not the prophet)
SufiSoul
Member
The First Cabinet: The first cabinet of Pakistan, was sworn in on 15th August, which included: Liaquat Ali Khan (Prime Minister, also in charge of two ministries: Foreign Affairs & Commonwealth Relations, and Defense); I. I. Chundrigar (Commerce, Industries, and Works); Ghulam Mohammad (Finance); Abdur Rab Nishtar (Communications); Ghazanfar Ali Khan (Food, Agriculture, and Health); Jogendra Nath Mandal (Law and Labour); Fazlur Rahman (Interior, Information, and Education). Quaid-e-Azam also requested many competent British technocrats to stay: 3 out of the 4 governors were British - Sir Frederick Bourne (Governor, East Bengal), Sir Francis Mudie (Governor, West Punjab), and Sir George Cunningham (Governor, N.W.F.P.). Sir Ghulam Hussain Hidayatullah (Governor, Sindh) was the only native governor, while Balochistan did not have a governor as it was a Governor-General's province. All chiefs of the armed forces were British too: General Sir Frank Messervey (Royal Pakistan Army), Air Vice-Marshal Perry-Keane (Royal Pakistan Air Force), and Admiral Jefford (Royal Pakistan Navy). The financial advisor to the Governor-General, Sir Archibald Rowland, was also a British........
Although there were many muslim scholars and Ulema in Pakistan but no one could find place in first cabinet.WHY???
NAWABS,KHAWANS,SARDARS,BRITISH TECHNOCRATES WERE FIND positions but no religious leader were found able to get place in the first cabinite.......
WAS their any criteria or election for the central cabinet????
If not than proper share was needed for almost all the Pakistanis representatives.....
No khan,nawab,sardar joined the cabinet through election but were "choosed" for it.....
That corner stone of NAWABS,SARDARS,KHANS proved till date and the PAKISTAN IS GRIPPED by the sons,daughters of these and one other is allowed to join the govt/cabinet/assemblies.....
DID THEIR NO QUESTION ARISES OVER THE CREDIBILITY OF LEADERS AT THAT TIME PAKISTAN????OR
This was all delibrate acts by them which leads PAKISTAN into current divisions among people.........
Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,
The idea that Islam died with Muhammad (SAW) is a fallacy.
(1) Muhammad (SAW) was a Prophet.
(2) Prophets (AS, SAW) were sent by ALLAH ALMIGHTY to;
(a) show us a way of life
(b) show us practical example of a way of life
(c) establish standard(s)
(d) establish a standard of going about any matter/issue/problem of life
(i) Prophets (AS, SAW) were sent by ALLAH ALMIGHTY to tell us, what ALLAH ALMIGHTY wants from us
(ii) Why would ALLAH ALMIGHTY send Prophets to show us way of life, to teach us way of life, if HE didn't intend us to follow it ?
(iii) It is mentioned in the Quran, ALLAH ALMIGHTY chose Islam as a way of life for human beings
(3) He (SAW) lived that life as a mortal human being among us
(4) He (SAW) lead by example, through struggle, though making effort
(5) He (SAW) was not alone in this struggle
(a) There were 2.2 million ordinary human beings, who lived Islam with him (SAW). Who showed that Islami Nizam is the best possible system of life
(b) Those Muslims spread Islam
(c) They conquered other nations
(d) People in those nations willingly converted to Islam
(e) These people want to be Muslims, even today
(f) They will not let go Islam. They will not accept letting go of Islam
(6) This same! struggle is within each and every! citizen of Pakistan, in-fact within ALL Muslims of this world, in-fact ALL! people living in this world
(7) Prophets are sent to set the standard
(8) ALL! human beings, especially those who accept this way of life, are to follow in the footsteps of the example set by Muhammad (SAW)
Muhammad (SAW) was the last! Prophet that will ever come. ALL! Muslims are to follow his (SAW) example, follow in his (SAW) footsteps.
(9) You cannot say, I'm a Muslim, but adhere to lifestyle, culture, values, heritage of Christians, Jews, etc etc
tamaazkhan is an imposter. At best, he's trying to test our knowledge, our fervor, our loyalty to ALLAH ALMIGHTY.
KHAN are the Muslims/people, loyal! to Islam, who have been engaged in war by the biggest tyrant this planet has seen to-date, the biggest tyrant of this era.
How can 'tamaazkhan' claim to be one of them when he goes against everything they stand for ? I doubt he is one of them.
I think the law makers and rulers right after the establishment of Pakistan failed to implement true islamic laws...maybe they weren't clear that which laws should nd shouldn't be there to run a newly build country...there is nothing wrong i see if Pakistan was made in the name of Islam...wrong was there when they didn't put into practise this slogan of "Pakistan ka matlab kiya lailaha illallah"
SufiSoul Sahab
Your observation is right. Brother those nawabs, khawans, sardars were UNIONISTS and we are still in the grips of the same through their children.
SufiSoul
Member
RhyMe,
I dont think it was difficult task at that time...
BUT why NAWABS,KHANS,SARDARS should implement "ISLAMI NIZAM" and
Their was no religious leader at that time in the govt..
Am i right.....????
TODAY why,makhdooms,nawabs,Gilanis,bhutos would like to implement ISLAMI NIZAM and piut their childrens future in danger,to rule in the future.........
SufiSoul
Member
haris,
I think that its enogh to accept QURAN&SUNNAH supremacy as system of the state..
The above poster accept it..
This is no more a problem now cuz the poster dont have in depth knowledge of QURAN&SUNNAH demands..
When khulafa implemented the QURAN&SUNNAH than why it should not be implemented now..
KHULAFA DID use the QURAN&SUNNAH knowledge to implement in hijaz......
further i think would detrack the thread so refrain from.......
@SufiSoul
was Jinnah a NAWAB,KHAN,SARDAR?
SufiSoul
Member
RhyMe,
The question is of his choices......
Just go through the above cabinet names and you will find more than 50% khans,nawabs and other 50& were british technocrates......
What do you think this should not result the same which is going on in Pakistan...????
MORE important is the thread's topic,
WHY ISLAM IS USED as bench mark???
Who used this?????
@*RhyMe*
Jinnah was non of them but he was among influential people of British India from the time he was doing politics for United India...
still couldn't Jinnah,being the most influential person at that time,chose better people or better laws for running this country?
Assalam-o-Alaikum-Warahmat-ULLAH ALL,
@yahya87: You ought to meet people who lived, as well as struggled for Pakistan side by side with Mr. Jinnah.
They struggled for Islami Nizam.
SufiSoul
Member
RhyMe,
HOW when only SC is independent and waiting to implement the decisions made by him...
HOW election commission should be given independence first,than ISI intervention should be stopped,Than provincial and cetral govt intervention should be stopped..
After all this we will be able to send a representative the same we are voted...
Now due to this intervention we vote for a white person but BACK is decided as the winner.....
So what yuou think of.......
shriq
Member
Sufisoul,
The demagogues have seen the success of Islamic slogans, hence they tend to select this guise. It is on us (the buddhoo awam) to analyse the tricks by them, and decide wisely.
I see the success of these slogans in foreseeable future. Allah knows better!
SufiSoul
Member
haris,
yar i think that we should not be allowed to make us fool any more on the slogan of Islami Nizam.....
Yes only geuine ISLAMIC MOVEMENT should be helped with and joined.......
SufiSoul
Member
shriq,
Agreed 100%
If Jinnah was struggling for Islami Nizam then why didnt he supported Khilafat movement while most Muslims of India were supporting that movement????
ISI Intervention can only be stopped once you have a free judiciary and loyal, honest politicians. Unfortunately we are still waiting for the later!
@SufiSoul
What benchmark other than islam,according to you, should have been used then by muslims of the Subcontinent at that time?
Mr. Mohammad Ali Jinnah consolidated and used the best available Muslim intelligentsia of the time.
Pakistanis, who are sincere to Pakistan, should be thankful to those Nawabs, Jageerdars, Sardars, and Jageerdars who contributed their services to face the Leaders of Indian National Congress and British Rulers.
Those Jageerdars, Nawabs, Sardars and Khans, all played very well innings under the captaincy of the Qauid.
SufiSoul
Member
RhyMe,
Their is no proof of wars between muslims of India and hindu..This all hatred was started after division..
Bfore both the nationalities were living like brothers in united India.OR
Give me any proof except some petty cases,between muslims and hindus...
If ISLAMI NIZAM was not the motive than what was the motive behind this struggle?????
JS.. I agree with you (until the death of Lyaqat ali khan)
SufiSoul
Member
When looking into the political careeer of the first cabinate their is no such background except they were having some land and farmers...
Their was no such wide spread popularity of these leaders,So to bridge the GAP they were needed a SLOGAN to get a wide spread popularity on the MYTH of Hindu Muslim difference and Pakistan ka matlab kiyaa....
NOW Jageerdars should be happy to get a separate country solely at their disposal which was definitly not possible in united India.....
SO they get it all and ruling their childes till date our souls in this country and still having LANDS and FARMERS...
Who were the ultimate beneficiaries???????
Come on Sufisoul now... dont tell me all the history of Hindu Prejudice and discrimination against muslims was flawed...there must be some truth to it...Do you even consider an intellectual like Iqbal and his poetry on injustices on muslims also untrue?...muslims and hindus were certainly not living like brothers...if you look into todays hindustan,you would see how much rights muslims are given there even being in large number,you see in gujrat what happened with them,how much paticipation muslims have there in politics? India being a secular country,how much of the secularism is followed there? so if todays india is not fair with muslims how can u say muslims were living as brothers with hindus in subcontinent hundreds years ago?
SufiSoul
Member
RhyMe,
I am still stick to it that all the hatred is GENERATED ONE after separation...
Their is no such proof of "worth noting" between Hindus and Muslims bfore separation...
Thats why i am asking you to search for any proof.may be i have missed some event from history........
Another thing which are considered here is that All India Congress started making their proposal of constitution of India in 1940 and after few years these jagirdars find out that Congress would propose Land reforms and other things which could be a threat to feudalism so they decided to support Pakistan movement to protect feudalism in exchange for supporting division of India....
Another thing which are considered here is that All India Congress started making their proposal of constitution of India in 1940 and after few years these jagirdars find out that Congress would propose Land reforms and other things which could be a threat to feudalism so they decided to support Pakistan movement to protect feudalism in exchange for supporting division of India....
SufiSoul
Member
I think JAGEERDAR IS the name of of a psychy..
Wether bfore separation or after separation..wether Jageerdar of 1900 or 2000..
It never changes in its real which is to go with own personal interests always not the Nations Interests.......
Mir kia sada hain beemar huy jis k sabab
Osi attar k.............................
SufiSoul
Member
yahya,
Good Point to be noted abt Jageedars.....
achtung
Member
quaide azam ney musalmamanoo ko unn kay haqooq dilwaney kay liye pakistan ka naara lagaya. laikin molvion ney iss pakistan mein hawase iqtidar ki khatir musalmanoo ki jidojahad ko hamesha hijack karney ki koshish ki, jiskay nateejay mein mulk hamesha khalifshar mei mubtala raha.
quaide azam ney hamesha jamhuriat ki baat ki, unho ney kabhi khilafat ki baat nahee ki.
quade azam ney hameesha musalmanoo ki baat ki, unhook ney kabhi islami nizam ki baat nahee ki.
pakistan ki jidojahad ka maqsad sirif aur sirif musalmanoo ki muashi tarraqi ki khatir unko behtar moaqey fraham karma tha.
quaide azam sirif hindustan kay pissay hue musalmanoo ki baat kartey thay kionkeh wo unn ki behtri chahtey thay.
gv
Member
@achtung
spot on
@achtung
Completely agree with you especially on the point of Musalmaan and islami Nizam...
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