72 thoughts on “Islamabad Tonight – 13 May 2010

  1. I rarely make any comments on any program though I joined pkpolitics during its inception. I strongly suggest to forum members to watch this program. You do not have to agree with the opinions by the general. However, the facts presented during the program are extremely useful for those who are attached to Pakistan.

    Regards to all.

  2. One of the best. It deserves to be a special historical record. One can differ on cetain opinion of the General, but something full of facts from start to end.

  3. One should also commend the General for speaking straight truth from time of coup plotters meeting to controversial role of Mush as US-CIA ally to current military operations in tribal areas and its fallout, as soldiers have their reservations about this fight.

  4. Very good show, this is not our war so better to get out whilst we can, if we don’t attack the Taliban they won’t attack us in our cities.

  5. “Bulk of this is retaliation”. They you have it ladies and gentleman what most of us moderates have been saying many times but the liberal fascist’s and western slaves in our midst until they don’t get blood spilled they cannot sit still.

  6. کی میرے قتل کے بعد اس نے جفا سے توبہ

    ہے اس زود ا پشیمان کا پشیمان ہونا

    Pakistan is at this point bcaz of these Jihado Genrals. After enjoying all the goods they all want to end like Faisla Shahzad. Instead of defending his deeds he started defending Talibanization … utter disappointment. How can they fight Jihadis when they themselves are islamic extermists. I wonder their guns were shaking when they killed Bugti, during operation in east Pakistan and Karachi. After all they all were muslims too.

    “We, the 4/5 Genrals, decided that if Nawaz Sharif dismissed 2nd Army chief we will take over”

    Who gave you this dman right. They all should be trialed under artcile 6. Gen Aziz, Shahid Aziz, Rashid Quereshi and ofcourse their boss Musharaaf.

  7. @niazmand

    “It deserves to be a special historical record”

    Are you kiding me. It needs to be a court record. Based on this confession on national television all who got together before Musharaaf left for SL in early Oct ’99 should be hanged. But instead what happen our judicary gave them 3 years to their unconstitutional coup.

  8. most important thing he said was about media… i am dead sure that our media is doing propaganda against islam and they are doing that in very organised fashion…

    not only this but it also seems that people are hired to keep an eye on the popular blogs as well… one of the instance of this kind of events can be seen here

    http://pkpolitics.com/category/media/meray-mutabiq/

    where some paid people divert the attention of the viewers towards gosssips and bakwaas

  9. mya said:
    most important thing he said was about media… i am dead sure that our media is doing propaganda against islam and they are doing that in very organised fashion…
    where some paid people divert the attention of the viewers towards gosssips and bakwaas

    Yes and you can easily tell who those people are.Few days ago the comments of Time and Saleembutt are the good example.

  10. Best programme in the history of TV shows.It very clearly reveals the actual facts of so called war on terror and their real motive.

  11. Bloody Generals , they never speak their mind or do anything positive while in power but after retirement, patriotism is the last resort of these scoundrels.
    Starting with Mush, we need to hang a few.

  12. If Mushraf will be hanged,this will give nation a good example for future generals??now this general is taliking all nonsense?he was with Mushraf too?

  13. The general is a brave person and I take my hat off to him. Others to should come forward and tell the nation how they sold us out.

    But despite all the despondency presented the answer lies in getting rid of corruption. That is a the ONLY way forward. If we get rid of corruption we will not need any aid from anyone. Publish the 8000 names on that NRO list and start one by one. All to stand in front of courts. Either guilty or innocent.

  14. Best point, Allah SWT has promised being “Raaziq” of all and we as muslims of Pakistan have forgotten that basic point.

  15. ہماری ہمیشہ سے بد قسمتی رہی ہے کہ عوام کو تعلیم اور بنیادی ضرو ر یات
    سے محروم رکھا گیا
    تعلیم خواص کے لیے مخصوص رکھی اور ملک کی بھاگ ڈور اور قسمت کے
    مالک یہی خواص کرتے رہے اور شاید کرتے ہی رہیں گے
    رہی گیئی کسر ہمارے فوجی جنرل اور ان کی حب الوطنی نے پوری کر دی
    ان کی ہمیشہ سے کوشسش رہی کہ اس عوام کو جاہل رکھا جاۓ تا کہ ان کا
    اور سیاست دانوں اور افسر شاہی کا کوئی احتساب نا کیا جا سکے
    اس ملک کی حالت تب تک ایسے ہی اور شاید اس سے بھی بد تر رہے
    گی جب تک تعلیم صحت پانی اور انصاف کو ان بھوکے ننگے اور لاچار
    لوگوں کے لیے عام نہیں کر دیا جاتا
    ورنہ کبھی کوئی طلعت پھر وہاں جاۓ گا اور ان کی جہالت اور غربت
    کو ٹی وی پر دیکھا کر ان کے دکھوں کا مداوا کرنے کی نا کام کوشش کرے
    گا

  16. @ molabuksh

    mya said:
    most important thing he said was about media… i am dead sure that our media is doing propaganda against islam and they are doing that in very organised fashion…
    where some paid people divert the attention of the viewers towards gosssips and bakwaas

    Yes and you can easily tell who those people are.Few days ago the comments of Time and Saleembutt are the good example.

    ابھی انکے کلیجے میں ٹھنڈ نہیں پڑی. کچھ اور ناموں کا اضافہ فرمائیں

    🙂 🙂

  17. Love this guy Nadeem Malik, he is a class of his own. He make people speak up their mind. Not like many pseudo intellectual anchors who invite guests but try to overshadow their presence.

    Excellent interview. There are many other important people with knowledge of what happened in Kargil, October 12, 1999 and after 9/11. They must also be invited and tell the whole truth so the nation should be informed how our history of destruction and intrigue was crafted by some filthy characters.

  18. twin_cities said:
    Love this guy Nadeem Malik, he is a class of his own. He make people speak up their mind. Not like many pseudo intellectual anchors who invite guests but try to overshadow their presence.

    Excellent interview. There are many other important people with knowledge of what happened in Kargil, October 12, 1999 and after 9/11. They must also be invited and tell the whole truth so the nation should be informed how our history of destruction and intrigue was crafted by some filthy characters.

    Your comments exactly explain my mind so I would not say any thing except at most dangerous and crucial time in Pakistan history Hamid Mir on Geo was yesterday discussing T/20 semi final.

  19. One of the best show some one can imagine to watch.I will suggest every body to see this programme again and again.An eye opener exposed real faces of some of the people in our military.

  20. Mirza Aslam Baig and Gen Gul Hameed say that Pakistan military has changed its direction from America then why all this going on in Pakistan especially handing over Pakistani women and children to America.

  21. sipahi said:
    Best point, Allah SWT has promised being “Raaziq” of all and we as muslims of Pakistan have forgotten that basic point.

    Not Muslims of Pakistan my friend but ruling elite of Pakistan.

  22. Gen Shahid Aziz interview is enough to understand that what is going on against Pakistan in the name of war against terrorism.There is a huge onslaught by Western media and governments against our country.

  23. Gen. (Retarded) Shahid Aziz Sahab! Surprise, surprise one more ‘borne again’! greater surprise ‘borne again’ without dying!

    I just wonder how many such generals are there – Malik should have, but didn’t, – how much wealth this one has accumulated? Why hasn’t he grown his beard now, now that the ‘horrible’ ‘anti-beard’ General Musharraf is not in power – how many bearded generals were there in our army between 1947 untill General ‘Momin’ Zia (gone to hell since!) created this ‘mullah brigades’ to swap Pakistani Soldiers with Pakistani nationalism for the foolish concept ‘soldiers of Islam’.

  24. @time said:
    @niazmand

    “It deserves to be a special historical record”

    There would be no harm if someone knocks the door of the Supreme Court with this interview tape and ask them to call all of them named by General Shahid Aziz, like General Mahmood, Gen Ahsaan, Gen Muhammad Aziz and Gen Rashid Qureshi, ask them to testify under oath, and at least for once in the history of this nation we can get the real culprit.

  25. To,

    Fasih Ahmed said:

    @time said:is the same guy who said coupled of days ago that Islam teaches violence.Please do not listen what he or she says.

  26. We do not need to be agreed with Gen but showed us the real picture what is going on now at this moment.As for taking him to the court for his act is concern I will like to ask if he is the only one need to be tried?

  27. I give General Shahid Aziz credit to make confession in front of the nation.How many guys out there ever admit their mistakes…..so far he is the only one.

  28. General has given a very clear indication in hidden words that the solution of all this mess is bloody revolution. great interview

  29. time said:
    کی میرے قتل کے بعد اس نے جفا سے توبہ

    ہے اس زود ا پشیمان کا پشیمان ہونا

    I do not care what you say a person who used nasty language against our beloved religion sholud not be on this forum.

  30. nonaminapupa said:
    General has given a very clear indication in hidden words that the solution of all this mess is bloody revolution. great interview

    You are right the situation developing in the country is taking Pakistan to the ultimate.

  31. @sianibili

    “I give General Shahid Aziz credit to make confession in front of the nation.How many guys out there ever admit their mistakes…..so far he is the only one.”

    It seems like this is the first retired genral interview you have ever seen. Every Genral after retirement has same tone and confessions. Please watch Gen. Aslam Beg, Hamid Gul, Asad Durani, Brig Imtiaz. Every damn Genral who comes on TV after 10 years of retirement tries to undo their past. That’s their futile attempt to lessen the guilt that they are carrying for years of dis-service.

    That’s why Salman Taseer very rightly said I give a damn about these genrals statements. After retirement they all remember constitution, Pakistan and Islam but when they are in service their only loyalty is to COAS.

  32. @jiwaypakistan

    My friend Islam is my religion too. I humbly apologize if I hurt your or anyone’s feelings but there are some harsh realities that we have to cope with.

    Religions teach violence and Islam is no exception. All the ghazwaat that Prophet himself fought how ‘d historian classify them, they won’t call it wars? Hazrat Omar was most accomplished ruler because of countless victories in war after war. What were the crusades in Europe. Local economy and political disuputes were not the inspiring factor it was religion. Even in today’s world what is driving militants from all around the globe to Waziristan not their local economic issues or political disputes but religious fervor.

    Like others I can sugar coat this too but in my view we can afford to put lipstick on the pig anymore.

  33. time said:

    You are Muslim I doubt it.All the wars Prophet(PBUH) and Hazrat Umer fought were impose on them.Hazrat Umer used to say that may there be a mountain between Kuffars and Muslims so Muslims never have to fight,and how dare you are to have negative thoughts in your dirty mind abour Hazrat Mohammad (PBUH).It is a duty of every Muslim on this forum to condemn this man and the management should ban this unethical man from this forum.Go and get some wisdom.You are giving sugar coat by saying few words about other religions too.Do not try to play smart get lost from here.

  34. jiwaypakistan said:
    time said:

    You are Muslim I doubt it.All the wars Prophet(PBUH) and Hazrat Umer fought were impose on them.Hazrat Umer used to say that may there be a mountain between Kuffars and Muslims so Muslims never have to fight,and how dare you are to have negative thoughts in your dirty mind abour Hazrat Mohammad (PBUH).It is a duty of every Muslim on this forum to condemn this man and the management should ban this unethical man from this forum.Go and get some wisdom.You are giving sugar coat by saying few words about other religions too.Do not try to play smart get lost from here.

    I told you it is very easy to tell who the planted people are on this forum.Every body be careful and I agree with jiwaypakistan we all should condemn him it is our religious duty.

  35. A great interview. It takes courage to admit mistakes and seek forgiveness. After a long time have I seen (to my relief) someone seeking Gods refuge, as opposed to running to the west.

  36. the general should join Imran Khan and run in election…and hamid gul should do the same. this is how we can change the country.

  37. General aziz views are very much “insider’s views. And they are anologous to waht IK has been saying so far.

  38. @jiwaypakistan

    Why are you just demanding me to be banned? Why don’t you also issue fitwa to get me killed? After all in the name of peace and harmony that’s what we have been doing.

    I can’t say if anyone is planted or paid by west to write here but I am sure this site is turning into cyber jihad factory. We are brewing Faisal Shahzads here. I won’t be surprised if investigations reveal that he used to blog here frequently.

    If someone like me points out the chaos that we are creating in the name of religion he is convinently labelled as infidel. My friend I don’t need your muslim certificate. My religion is between me and my God. You derive your violent jihadi inspirations from religion I will stick to my non-violent notions that requires condeming violent teachings viz jihad. I know Bawa will come up with peaceful means of Jihad – pursuing education, struggles to meet ends etc that nonone can disagree with. I am not refferingto those. My direct reference is Jihad factories established in Waziristan through religious madrassas. They don’t derive inspiration from sports columns or TV serials. They derive from religious books and references.

  39. @time

    I understand what you are trying to say and I respect your opinion however I beg to disagree. Religion indeed does play a part in almost every conflict but blaming everything on religion is definitely wrong. Almost all the wars of the last century including the two world wars of the last century for example had nothing to do with religion, they were all because of economic, political, idealogical and nationalist motives.

    The recent ‘Jihad and Terrorism’ episode as well couldn’t be farther from being religous and if you look at it closely, you will see that religion has simply been used by each side as a tool to enhance their respective agenda. It all started back in 1979 when Soviets invaded Afghanistan and that invasion was not because of religion, nor was religion any factor in the Americans’ forwarding their support to Afghan freedom struggle nor in General Zia’s willingness to throw Pakistan into the mess. They all had their own reasons for doing what they did and religion was none of them but yes, drums of Jihad were beaten by the latter for achieving their purpose.

    Then the 9/11 happened which was again mere a reaction to America’s blind sponsorship of Israel ( I am assuming the 9/11 story is true as it is told ) which in other words means it was an absolutely political matter. Then both the illegal invasions started and religion has again been used to achieve political/personal ( whatever you want to call it ) goals. Its more like a selling skill, wrap your message in color of religion and it becomes more sell-able for the masses. Its easier to convice someone by telling him that God wants him to blow himself up than telling him You want him to. Got my point ?

  40. Great Programme. It would be a real blessing if some good people come forward, show honestly, and tell the nation whole truth, nothing but truth.
    I respect this General, maybe he was unable to gather that courage in service to resist Mush-Bush, but appeared to be sharing facts in a candid and honest manner, at least his expression shows he wants to speak truth.

    Why not other Generals and some senior Politicians and old Jugdges come forward and speak TRUTH.

  41. time said:
    @jiwaypakistan

    Why are you just demanding me to be banned? Why don’t you also issue fitwa to get me killed? After all in the name of peace and harmony that’s what we have been doing.

    I can’t say if anyone is planted or paid by west to write here but I am sure this site is turning into cyber jihad factory. We are brewing Faisal Shahzads here. I won’t be surprised if investigations reveal that he used to blog here frequently.

    How you already have decided that Faisal Shehzad is responsible when we are still waiting for 9/11 independent investigations.

  42. @tahirmalik

    We need to come out of state of denial. O$ama himself released a tape taking responsibility of 911 (pls watch Saleem Safi’s Jirga on this subject). Faisal Shahzad beside all the forensic evidence his keys in car his finger prints on car and above all his confessions … and you are waiting for “independent inquiry” .. all I can say

    دہ اور دل ان کو جو نہ دے مج کو زبان اور

  43. @Yousafzai

    I do not disagree with any word you wrote. But I ‘d still like to clarify couple of things.

    I never said religion is the root of every evil. I read some where for Freud the focal point of world was around sex, for Marx it was economics and for Prophet Mohammad (pbuh) it was religion. I think it can be a good catchy statement but it is far from reality. Not every human action can be traced to sex, economy or religion. Despite the immense importance of all three there are many other things that can influence our decisions.

    As you rightly pointed out religion was not among the root causes of two world wars perhaps it was more tied to economic and political aspirations of few. But in my view Israel’s creation was on religious grounds and that very dispute has religious roots beside political as you pointed out. We the muslims of subcontinent stand with Palestinians even though most of the Arabs stand with India on Kashmir (political dispute of muslims of subcontinent), I believe it is for religious reasons. When muslims from around the globe are gathering in Waziristan I don’t know how anyone can take religion out of this conflict.

    I agree political and economic motives are packaged around religious philosphies for broader appeal. I have problem if religion provides someone inspiration to kill others for one reason or another. I never had a problem with preachers (tubleghes) or missionaries of any religion as long as they are peaceful. As a matter of fact I was very impressed by their commitment.

    But if any group use violent means to achieve their political motives using varying kind of philosphies like nationalist in case of LTTE or MQM, economic like Maoists or communists, or religious like all kind of Talibans and Lashkars …. I have every right to express my concern and discomfort.

  44. An excsllent programme. I am so happy that Pakistan Army had such brilliant generals who had th heart to have difference of opinion from the dictator.
    Allah may save Pakistan from the clutches of America. Ameen

  45. time said:
    @tahirmalik

    We need to come out of state of denial. O$ama himself released a tape taking responsibility of 911 (pls watch Saleem Safi’s Jirga on this subject). Faisal Shahzad beside all the forensic evidence his keys in car his finger prints on car and above all his confessions … and you are waiting for “independent inquiry” .. all I can say

    دہ اور دل ان کو جو نہ دے مج کو زبان او

    It is proven that Osama tape was fake.Didn,t you see Osama with Brizniski in the back ground at the start of the show he was darling of Americans at that time because he was fighting against Soviets then.After 9/11 every thing was destroyed but a brief case was fall down from the plain with all the documents about terrorists we have read that myth.I will not say any thing about you this time but tell me one thing how a American president turn into maniac American presidents are no Muslims who teach them terrorism and what about Isreali,s recently they killed one of the Hammas leader in Dubai travelling on fake British passports why you and your western masters are quite on it because they do not consider it terrorism because they killed a Muslim and it is their common motive.Don,t you have time to go through the details of Dubai terrorism,Vietnam,Korea,Iraq and Afghanistan.You are giving reply to almost every body writing on this forum against America and you want to tell us that you are doing it for free you are being paid for selling your consious.

  46. @tahirmalik

    “You are giving reply to almost every body writing on this forum against America and you want to tell us that you are doing it for free you are being paid for selling your consious.”

    I wish those who pay, if someone pays, also realize this and pay me something. If I can do such a good job w/o being paid I am sure I can do much better if I am paid. BTW if you work at CIA and had to pay to someone to blog how much ‘d you pay 1000$/yr, 10, 000$/yr or 100,000$/yr I am curious what ‘d be the range? I haven’t heard anyone who is being paid for blogging.

    Back to your new allegations that I defend American or Jewish terrorism. Let me clarify in very plain language, I don’t. When Mosad killed Hamas leader I was among the few bloggers who closely followed that story and condemned it loudest. Not because it was Israeli killing Palestinian but because it was a political murder conducted by spy agency. I didn’t treat it any different than missing persons in Pakistan thanks to ISI. Hammas leader probably was a terrorist like some percentage of missing persons in Pakistan but if state institutions take this route it can’t be anything but state terrorism and I do condemn it in no ambigious terms.

    I agree US’s involvement in Iraq is invasion and state terrorism but in Afghanistan its different. In my view they were attacked and had the security council mandate to retaliate.

    I am glad I am not the only one beral who is being labelled as paid agent:

    http://www.dawn.com/wps/wcm/connect/dawn-content-library/dawn/the-newspaper/columnists/19-nadeem-f-paracha-the-sinking-middleground-650-hh-02

  47. @tahirmalik

    I didn’t answer your questions as if you were asking to explain theory of relativity. All you cyber jihadis have same mentality and are hopeless cases.

  48. time said:
    @tahirmalik

    I didn’t answer your questions as if you were asking to explain theory of relativity. All you cyber jihadis have same mentality and are hopeless cases.

    You called us cyber Jihadi,s ok…………and you are international terrorists just like your masters America Israel England and India.

  49. @time
    “That’s why Salman Taseer very rightly said I give a damn about these genrals statements. After retirement they all remember constitution, Pakistan and Islam but when they are in service their only loyalty is to COAS.”

    So the best personality you could come up with to counter this is Salman Taseer? Amazing!

    BTW: When you say “After retirement they all remember constitution, Pakistan and Islam”, are you not admitting the General IS talking “constitution, Pakistan and Islam”? And still you choose to disagree (there by taking a stance AGAINST “constitution, Pakistan and Islam”) and curse him?

    Wow!

    Thanks for exposing yourself so plainly 😉

    Oh, and I didn’t know you were against the release of Missing Persons as well!

  50. @ Time

    Who gives a toss about the Security Council its just a tool in the hands of Western Powers to use against Muslim countries.

  51. @time
    Just to keep things together, I am going to summarize what liberal fascists like you stand for/against:

    — you are against release of any missing persons.
    — you are also against “fair” trials, rule of law, and FOR Guantanomo like places.
    — you are fans of guys like John Yoo, Dershovitz, John Ashcroft, Daniel Pipes, Stephen Schwartz, and the like. Bet you even vote for Bush and Obama.
    — you are against Sikh Freedom Struggle
    — you are against Kashmir freedom fighters.
    — you are for torture.
    — you support ISI, MI, CIA, FBI, etc. and their nabbing, torturing, and killing people
    — you love drone strikes
    — you hate “constitution, Pakistan and Islam”
    — you also love Salman Taseer

    Did I miss anything?

  52. @nota

    — you are against release of any missing persons

    I am unless we have a mechanism to make sure those are released will not re-join jihadi outfits. There are numerous instances when they have rejoined militants after release.

    — you are also against “fair” trials, rule of law, and FOR Guantanomo like places

    I am not but I believe we do not have judicial system in place to offer fair trial. The established judicial system in place require law enforcement machinery to provide evidence/witnesses against accused. When they aredealing with insurgents it’s not possible to provide evidences/witness and the result is Judicary is forced to release those and then they re-join insurgencies. This is not just our local issue. There is no reliable framework to trial insurgents anywhere be it India, Srilanka, Palestine, US.

    — you are fans of guys like John Yoo, Dershovitz, John Ashcroft, Daniel Pipes, Stephen Schwartz, and the like. Bet you even vote for Bush and Obama.

    I do not even know few of these guys and I don’t know what they stand for. As far as Bush and Obama is concerned, I can’t vote for both. I am a left leaning Democrat and voted accordingy.

    — you are against Sikh Freedom Struggle

    I do not support violent means for political goals

    — you are against Kashmir freedom fighters

    Even though my roots are from Kashmir but I will reiterate I do not support violent means for political goals

    — you are for torture

    I don’t but I understand when law enforcement officials have to do it to extract valueable information that they need to save lives of innocent civilians.

    — you support ISI, MI, CIA, FBI, etc. and their nabbing, torturing, and killing people

    I don’t but I understand when states use these kind of agencies for dirty business. There is a reason these agencies are called secret services and their actions are not publically debated. BTW your guru Hameed Gul used to head ISI and it was the dream organization of religious in 1980’s.

    — you love drone strikes

    I don’t especially collateral demage caused by them. But I do support its effectiveness in targetting militant leaders and understand that collateral demage caused by them is minimum possible as oppose to any related technology specially artillery fire or aerial bombing.

    — you hate “constitution, Pakistan and Islam”

    That’s outrageous allegation. I forcefully deny it.

    — you also love Salman Taseer

    Salman Taseer is one of few educated faces in PPP and is highly accomplished business enterpreneur. I think because of this PMLN leaning media targets him. They want some oe like Jhangir Badar to lead PPP in Punjab. Salman Taseer is by no means my first choice within PPP ideally it should be Atizaz Ehsan.

  53. nota said:
    nota said:
    پاکستان بھر سے ڈھونڈھ کر ٹائم جیسا ننگ وطن اور ننگ دین اس فورم پر چھوڑا گیا ہے اس کو کفا کی وکالت کا کام دیا گیا ہے جہاں تک میں سمجھا ہوں یہ شخص مرزائی ہے کیوں کہ اس کے خیالات بالکل مرزائیوں جیسے ہیں جہاد کی مخالفت کرنا اپنے آقاوں جن میں بھارت بھی شامل ہے کی حمایت میں لکھنا کیوں کہ سہ ان کے مائی باب ہیں ان کو فنڈز وہیں سے ملتے ہیں آئند اس کی ہر بکواس کا منہ توڑ جواب دیا جاے بحیژیت مسلمان یہ ہم سب کا فرض ہے چند دن پہلے اس نے یہاں تک لکھا ہے کہ اسلام تشدد کی تعلیم دیتا کیا یہ گستاخی رسول نہیں اور ایسی بات کوئی غیر مسلم یا مرزائی ہی کر سکتاہے

  54. sherepunjab said:
    nota said:
    aftab said:

    پاکستان بھر سے ڈھونڈھ کر ٹائم جیسا ننگ وطن اور ننگ دین اس فورم پر چھوڑا گیا ہے اس کو کفا کی وکالت کا کام دیا گیا ہے جہاں تک میں سمجھا ہوں یہ شخص مرزائی ہے کیوں کہ اس کے خیالات بالکل مرزائیوں جیسے ہیں جہاد کی مخالفت کرنا اپنے آقاوں جن میں بھارت بھی شامل ہے کی حمایت میں لکھنا کیوں کہ سہ ان کے مائی باب ہیں ان کو فنڈز وہیں سے ملتے ہیں آئند اس کی ہر بکواس کا منہ توڑ جواب دیا جاے بحیژیت مسلمان یہ ہم سب کا فرض ہے چند دن پہلے اس نے یہاں تک لکھا ہے کہ اسلام تشدد کی تعلیم دیتا کیا یہ گستاخی رسول نہیں اور ایسی بات کوئی غیر مسلم یا مرزائی ہی کر سکتاہے

  55. At about 28 minutes, the General makes a confession/revelation about intelligence agencies that everyone seems to have missed or not paid attention to it that it deserved:

    “Fauj mein jo formal soch bachar hay us mein yay cheezain nahiN aateeN kay radicalize ker daiN, Jihad kara deiN, filani jagah bomb phata deiN, filanay terrorist ko support karaiN. Yay baat under-discussion nahi aati”

    In other words, the General admits that Intelligence agencies DO radicalize people, DO start Jihads, DO CARRY OUT BOMBINGS, DO support certain terrorists….

  56. @time
    My latest responses are between square brackets ([ ] and in bold)

    time said:
    @nota

    — you are against release of any missing persons

    I am unless we have a mechanism to make sure those are released will not re-join jihadi outfits. There are numerous instances when they have rejoined militants after release.

    [this “make sure those are released will not re-join jihadi outfits” arguments is a cop out and you ARE again confirming my statement to be the truth]

    — you are also against “fair” trials, rule of law, and FOR Guantanomo like places

    I am not but I believe we do not have judicial system in place to offer fair trial. The established judicial system in place require law enforcement machinery to provide evidence/witnesses against accused. When they aredealing with insurgents it’s not possible to provide evidences/witness and the result is Judicary is forced to release those and then they re-join insurgencies. This is not just our local issue. There is no reliable framework to trial insurgents anywhere be it India, Srilanka, Palestine, US.

    [Ah, so like Zardari & Co you say an effective “judicial system” is not in place so you argue that gives you the right to do away with what little we have and ignore the rule of law and the constitution and just put the people in jail/disappear them, evidence be damned. Once again you confirm my statement to be true!]

    — you are fans of guys like John Yoo, Dershovitz, John Ashcroft, Daniel Pipes, Stephen Schwartz, and the like. Bet you even vote for Bush and Obama.

    I do not even know few of these guys and I don’t know what they stand for. As far as Bush and Obama is concerned, I can’t vote for both. I am a left leaning Democrat and voted accordingy.

    [Shame on you for NOT knowing these names and yet feeling qualified to argue the point. Briefly, they all share your views exactly in the point above (so once again you confirm my statement to be true). And another cop-out in “I can’t vote for both” because “I am a left leaning Democrat”. Well dear, if you ARE a left-leaning democrat (with right leaning beliefs like supporting Guantanomo, imprisonment without trial, support for War of terror, etc.), you must have voted DEMOCRAT Obama — You had NO choice in that matter. Tell me how would a “left-leaning democrat” vote when the only names on the ballot were “McCain” and “Obama”?]

    — you are against Sikh Freedom Struggle

    I do not support violent means for political goals

    [Once again you confirm my statement to be true!]

    — you are against Kashmir freedom fighters

    Even though my roots are from Kashmir but I will reiterate I do not support violent means for political goals

    [Once again you confirm my statement to be true!]

    — you are for torture

    I don’t but I understand when law enforcement officials have to do it to extract valueable information that they need to save lives of innocent civilians.

    [So you are saying “I don’t but I DO!” Now that is taking a stand on an issue. Thanks once again for confirming my statement to be true!]

    — you support ISI, MI, CIA, FBI, etc. and their nabbing, torturing, and killing people

    I don’t but I understand when states use these kind of agencies for dirty business. There is a reason these agencies are called secret services and their actions are not publically debated. BTW your guru Hameed Gul used to head ISI and it was the dream organization of religious in 1980’s.

    [Once again that “I don’t but I DO!” gutless reply. Again that is taking some stand on an issue. Thanks once again for confirming my statement to be true!]

    — you love drone strikes

    I don’t especially collateral demage caused by them. But I do support its effectiveness in targetting militant leaders and understand that collateral demage caused by them is minimum possible as oppose to any related technology specially artillery fire or aerial bombing.

    [So from your mouth again we have confirmation that you support drone strikes even if they are causing “collateral damage” You also like their “effectiveness” but then your earlier statement belies that; if they are so effective, how come we have so much collateral damage? As for their ‘effectiveness”, that lie is belied by facts on the ground: Even by best estimates, One out of three killed by drones is a civilian. And elsewhere we are told US Killed 700 Civilians in Pakistan Drone Strikes in 2009 while getting only “five confirmed kills of real militant leaders, and a handful of unconfirmed claims that usually haven’t panned out.” You call this “effective/efficient”? Yet another statement of min confirmed to be the truth.]

    — you hate “constitution, Pakistan and Islam”

    That’s outrageous allegation. I forcefully deny it.

    [Why deny the obvious? Don’t you say it is OK to put people in jail with out trial, kill them without trial, support foreign military/drone strikes on my soil, like Zardari call Kashmir freedom fighters terrorists, etc? Is that not against constitution of Pakistan and teachings of Islam? Your “constitutional” position is that “Law of the land do not provide enough tools to trial insurgents”. And did I not RIGHTLY interpret your statement above:

    BTW: When you say “After retirement they all remember constitution, Pakistan and Islam”, are you not admitting the General IS talking “constitution, Pakistan and Islam”? And still you choose to disagree (there by taking a stance AGAINST “constitution, Pakistan and Islam”) and curse him?

    It is plain as anything so stop with the fake “outrage” and “forceful denial”. The truth is right on this page — and once again confirming the truth of my statement]

    — you also love Salman Taseer

    Salman Taseer is one of few educated faces in PPP and is highly accomplished business enterpreneur. I think because of this PMLN leaning media targets him. They want some oe like Jhangir Badar to lead PPP in Punjab. Salman Taseer is by no means my first choice within PPP ideally it should be Atizaz Ehsan.
    [So another confirmation from you about the truth of my statement.

    Funny that in you rebuttal you proved each and every accusation of mine against yourself was true. If you were trying to say i was wrong, well my dear you failed MISERABLY! In your defense, you confessed to every charge! ]

  57. Confirms 100% what I and many others have stated before how ISI is involved in all this terrorism through its taliban assets while rest of army is doing drama operations to fool people.

  58. @nota

    You support killing people in the name of religion and I oppose that. Based on this sharp contrast you have the nerves to to label me anti-Pakistan, anti-constitution and anti-Islam. All I can say

    دے اور دل ان کو جو نہ دے مجھ کو زبان اور

  59. time said:
    بندہ تمہاری طرح کا بے شرم ضمیر فروش اور ڈھیٹ ہو تو پھر ستے خیراں

  60. All Gens when in the Army are friends of USA. When they come out in civil ,they actually get out of the well, realizing the realities and then speak sense. The same is the case with our Current Generals who are doing more on the word of do more.

  61. All Gens when in the Army are friends of USA. When they come out in civil ,they actually get out of the well, realizing the realities and then speak sense. The same is the case with our Current Generals who are doing more on the word of do more from USA.

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